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A reminder, people with class do not talk about class – politicalbetting.com

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  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    If the SNP won most seats and Labour held the balance of power in third with Reform second on seats then an SNP government with Labour support is possible. The LDs and Greens in Scotland would certainly support the SNP over Reform
  • I mentioned Sir Gordon Richards earlier in the week, with a picture of the dog sat by his grave

    I've since learnt two things related to him that I find at least mildly interesting..

    First, during his post-riding training career, the best horse he trained was called Reform!

    Reform must have been one of the best three year olds ever to not win a Classic. He wasn't even entered into any of them because he was such an unimpressive looking yearling. In fact, the breeders decided not to send him to the yearling sales because they thought that it would be bad for their reputation

    He won eleven of his fourteen career races. Late in his three year old season, he beat the Derby winner in the Champion Stakes

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reform_(horse)

    Second, I've realised that I have one degree of separation from Sir Gordon. For about a decade, from 1990 until his death in 2000 my parents employed an old boy called Bert Woodage as their gardener and dog walker

    He was a stable jockey for Richards when he trained in Ogbourne Maizey (where we lived when Peter Makin trained there, and is on my mail route now Emma Lavelle trains there). In 1960 he was one of I think five of the staff done for a big doping scandal, and he was banned from working in racing for life

    Does anyone remember Polygamy winning The Oaks?

    The one Classic winner that Reform sired
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    Foxy said:

    CatMan said:

    Ever since my forebears left the banks of the Danube for Wales in 1000BC we haven't been able to understand the British class system.

    Given that they travelled through Switzerland France and England en route you might question their judgement…
    They settled in England until you Anglo Saxons sent them packing to Wales around 700 BC.
    Think you're about 1400 years out there
    We were latecomers.
    There is no England, only occupied Wales.
    They've been preparing patiently for 1500 years, but I won't take my eye off them.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,216
    Have we noted this one?



    Tom Harwood
    @tomhfh
    ·
    9h
    NEW: Ashfield Labour Councillor Cathy Mason has defected to the Reform Party.

    There are now no longer any Labour Party representatives left on the Ashfield District Council.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,648
    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I think they are wise (apart from the mayoral bit), but 12 months is a ridiculous timetable I think. It should have been 2 years, so hold elections this year for a shortened term. Then the only thing people could complain about is the actual reorganisations, and trust me people get over any feeling they have about that very quickly.

    I don't think the Reform issue has anything to do with it though, they just happen to be strong in many areas which are still two tier.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,216
    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,534
    I've been reading Kemi's proposal on immigration reform, extending time to reach ILR and lengthening the gap between ILR and citizenship as well as ensuring that anyone who is granted ILR and then citizenship is a net contributor. It sounds very similar to something someone wrote here. Even the details sound the same...
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 53,587
    Looks like the DOGE staffer is going to be uncancelled.

    https://x.com/philipwegmann/status/1887950305545044407

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    MaxPB said:

    I've been reading Kemi's proposal on immigration reform, extending time to reach ILR and lengthening the gap between ILR and citizenship as well as ensuring that anyone who is granted ILR and then citizenship is a net contributor. It sounds very similar to something someone wrote here. Even the details sound the same...

    Definitely a coincidence.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,941
    Nigelb said:

    pigeon said:

    For those who the Musk is just going after politically easy targets:

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1887723221610283458

    American weapons programs need to be completely redone.

    The current strategy is to build a small number of weapons at a high price to fight yesterday’s war.

    Unless there are immediate and dramatic changes made, America will lose the next war very badly.

    Elon is right. Although there is a word for countries that put their faith in sheer quantities of cheap, rugged kit – we call them Russia.
    I'm assuming that Musk is more interested in drones than basic infantry cannon fodder. Putin can afford to fight to the last Kalmyk; even allowing for the cult following and the autocratic tendencies, Trump would find it harder work to justify forcing every man between the ages of 18 and 50 in Idaho to pick up a rusty rifle, and try to defeat a smaller but smarter opponent using weight of numbers in a series of mass casualty attacks.
    If the US is to mass produce drones for military purposes, then it needs an entirely new supply chain independent of China.

    The large majority of the electric motors, batteries, and electronic components required are produced there and nowhere else in anywhere near sufficient quantities.

    That would probably be a good idea for IS manufacturing, but it's beyond the scope of US defence manufacturers and outside the expertise the DOD.
    Actually, the US DoD has considerable experience of demanding levels of onshoring for components.

    They have specified and funded such procurement many times over the years.

    For some programs this goes down to raw material level.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



    There will be representation as the existing councillors will continue, but if we can have Euro elections in 2019, why shouldn't these go ahead?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,091

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



    We have an odd situation at work. Head of department has stood down and we are apparently looking for an interim head until we appoint a permanent one. Now timescale is given. An almost impossible job to achieve anything other than tread water. But surely council elections being cancelled also saves money AND leaves councillors in place? So not a terrible thing.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,408
    MattW said:

    I'm inventing a dish

    I'm going to use entire leeks, hollowed out and stuffed with other food. Probably chicken and bacon in a fresh herb, cheese and cream sauce

    I'm going to call it the Whole Leek Wrap

    Leeks are fantastic.

    I use them for all sorts of things as a milder alternative to onions.

    OGGIE !! OGGIE !! OGGIE !!

    https://youtu.be/O-EKY7z_jeE?t=14
    I was watching a Japanese cookery/travel programme lately and they kept referring to 'leeks' as "Welsh Onions".
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



    We have an odd situation at work. Head of department has stood down and we are apparently looking for an interim head until we appoint a permanent one. Now timescale is given. An almost impossible job to achieve anything other than tread water. But surely council elections being cancelled also saves money AND leaves councillors in place? So not a terrible thing.
    Elections can cost a fair amount more than people expect in larger councils, but it's chump change to the government, they could have covered the cost of 'new' elections in 2 years whilst planned ones went ahead easily.

    I'm not even furious about the delays, if they can get turnaround the changes that quickly, but I don't think the risk or headache was needed.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613
    edited February 7
    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    For the moment the Conservatives remain ahead but more narrowly. If those numbers translated to voteshares though Poilevre would have lost an unlosaeble election to Carney because of Trump.

    The AfD are still trailing in Germany too so the Trump nationalist wave is not exactly producing a tsunami elsewhere in the western world for populist right parties with elections this year. In Australia too it is neck and neck between Labor and the Coalition and One Nation are the uber Trumpites there and still well behind
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,491

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 25,220
    edited February 7

    Have we noted this one?

    Tom Harwood
    @tomhfh
    ·
    9h
    NEW: Ashfield Labour Councillor Cathy Mason has defected to the Reform Party.

    There are now no longer any Labour Party representatives left on the Ashfield District Council.

    Yes - on the previous thread.

    WRT the County Election, my expectation is that the Ashfield Independents will hold the line nearly completely, unless Zadrozny goes down badly at trial.

    It is County seats, and they currently have 10 from 10.

    There is one with a 0.2% majority (over a Tory), one with about 17%, and all the others are afaics 30% or more, and they have up to 70% of the vote in one or two. They are very well dug in.

    They are as well dug in at District level - iirc 32 seats from 35.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,408
    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I remember the FTPA messing up the Scottish Parliament elections back in 2016(?) or so. As I remember the media coverage at the time - it wasn't a biggie.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 25,220
    edited February 7

    Nigelb said:

    pigeon said:

    For those who the Musk is just going after politically easy targets:

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1887723221610283458

    American weapons programs need to be completely redone.

    The current strategy is to build a small number of weapons at a high price to fight yesterday’s war.

    Unless there are immediate and dramatic changes made, America will lose the next war very badly.

    Elon is right. Although there is a word for countries that put their faith in sheer quantities of cheap, rugged kit – we call them Russia.
    I'm assuming that Musk is more interested in drones than basic infantry cannon fodder. Putin can afford to fight to the last Kalmyk; even allowing for the cult following and the autocratic tendencies, Trump would find it harder work to justify forcing every man between the ages of 18 and 50 in Idaho to pick up a rusty rifle, and try to defeat a smaller but smarter opponent using weight of numbers in a series of mass casualty attacks.
    If the US is to mass produce drones for military purposes, then it needs an entirely new supply chain independent of China.

    The large majority of the electric motors, batteries, and electronic components required are produced there and nowhere else in anywhere near sufficient quantities.

    That would probably be a good idea for IS manufacturing, but it's beyond the scope of US defence manufacturers and outside the expertise the DOD.
    Actually, the US DoD has considerable experience of demanding levels of onshoring for components.

    They have specified and funded such procurement many times over the years.

    For some programs this goes down to raw material level.
    The US Govt or public bodies still have Government owned armouries eg Picatinny.

    Has Elon noticed?
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,408

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



    We have an odd situation at work. Head of department has stood down and we are apparently looking for an interim head until we appoint a permanent one. Now timescale is given. An almost impossible job to achieve anything other than tread water. But surely council elections being cancelled also saves money AND leaves councillors in place? So not a terrible thing.
    You are Donald Trump, and I claim my five pounds.

    Saving taxpayers money, and the incumbent stays in power. #winning
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    Be interesting to track the number of by-elections in areas with cancelled elections. I imagine most councillors who planned to stand down would stick it out, but some might have plans which make that difficult, and others might also distrust the planned timescale and don't fancy being sucked in to a 6 year term.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,607
    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,528
    @Foxy
    Told you. As usual no shot on target by United in the first half. We need Garnacho on to give some sort of threat. That should be obvious.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    The three do often go together. But not always, so think optimistically!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169
    edited February 7
    DavidL said:

    @Foxy
    Told you. As usual no shot on target by United in the first half. We need Garnacho on to give some sort of threat. That should be obvious.

    Bilal El Khannous made that goal. He has a massive career ahead of him.

    I have topped up on MU. My team just can't manage two decent halves of play.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    Albeit in Scotland Swinney is also pretty centrist dad and on present polls will almost certainly stay FM.

    The nationalist surge is from Alba there not just Reform
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,775

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    I hadn’t realised the stodgy, douce politics of 1930s Scotland were so influential.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,775

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    We’re a bawhair away from ‘what was so bad about Hitler anyway’.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,408
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    Albeit in Scotland Swinney is also pretty centrist dad and on present polls will almost certainly stay FM.

    The nationalist surge is from Alba there not just Reform
    Even being generous to them - Alba are nothing. At best a faint blip on a chart. And busy in-fighting as they self-destruct.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613
    edited February 7

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    We’re a bawhair away from ‘what was so bad about Hitler anyway’.
    Trump has many faults but being anti Jewish isn't one of them. He is very pro Israel and opened Mar a Lago and his golf clubs to Jews at a time many WASP clubs wouldn't
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,491
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    That's quite an interesting thought.

    Having listened to a couple of 40 minute interviews with Reform Millionaires in the last 48 hours, they are parading themselves along the catwalk as the biggest "Thatcherite".

    I wonder how that will play with the great unwashed?

    (I suspect they are relying on the great Reform unwashed not paying any attention because they are fulminating about Muslims.)
    The disconnect between the leadership of Reform and the voters on everything apart from being beastly to foreigners, must become problematic at some point.

    Hopefully before rather than after the GE.

    There was an interesting shouty question from Richard Tice about the Local Elections on Wednesday, really amping up his blood pressure about a one year delay (DICTATORSHIP !!!). He was very cross about having an extra year to roll out his campaign infra in about half of the areas. I wonder if he thinks they have reached their peak?

    Dictators, not democracies, cancel elections, and 5.5 million voters in southern England are being denied the right to pass judgment on the performance of their councillors over the past four years—interestingly, in areas where Reform UK is expected to do rather well. In cancelling these elections, the Secretary of State has admitted that she does not know what will replace them, and it seems there is a serious risk, as previously mentioned, of areas not being ready in 12 months’ time.
    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2025-02-05a.766.0#g791.1

    (He's been asking written questions about numbers of staff dedicated to FOI departments, so he's about to have another tantrum on that. There was a huge fluff off recently when they did not answer one of his FOI requests due to it being over the £500 to answer limit, but he went off on a - perhaps deliberate - misleading media wibbling campaign about falsely alleged suppression of information. All he had to do was pay the extra £100 himself out of his 10s of millions, but for him it's all about posturing.)
    I don't like cancelling elections, even if they may only be for a year before the new structures.

    Not that I think the new local government plans wise.
    I am totally against cancelling elections.

    So what if they are only there for a year? That's a year of representation.

    And who is to say that actually a "year" turns into "two years" in order to sort it all out with new structures.



    There will be representation as the existing councillors will continue, but if we can have Euro elections in 2019, why shouldn't these go ahead?
    It's an interesting situation here in Warks where the Tory county council, who have just burned £16M on a botched roundabout (https://kenilworth.nub.news/news/local-news/letting-slip-ps16m-extra-spend-on-a46-stoneleigh-junction-serious-mistake-deputy-leader-apologises-251853?fbclid=IwY2xjawITJ25leHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHWq54S6xQ_FS5vv5x-aV8YJ5Re5oYVxK2fbipp6FhS5mSsbX0LNnR3ClTA_aem_rz_or30jCMkDdj3yqIwORw) have been stymied by the Labour government in their overweening ambition to take over the second-tier councils, none of which are Tory controlled.

    In 2023 Tory Warwick District and Tory Stratford District failed in their bid to unite in a defensive manoeuvre against the ambitions of the county. Meanwhile the previous Tory West Midlands mayor was keen to have rural Warks join his bailiwick but the new Labour incumbent is decidedly lukewarm, for equal and opposite reasons.

    None of the above has anything to do with the efficient management of a local authority.
  • glwglw Posts: 10,169
    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    I saw a post about the DOGE network admin being appointed to the DOE CIO role, and someone in the comments was exasperatedly complaining that they were in the second year of obtaining their clearance (probably Q so a laborious process).

    Ruling by fiat is going to end up with people dead. I've no doubt about that.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,683
    DavidL said:

    @Foxy
    Told you. As usual no shot on target by United in the first half. We need Garnacho on to give some sort of threat. That should be obvious.

    Me Mam and I have lost patience and are watching Shetland.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,161
    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,909
    DavidL said:

    Cookie said:

    TimS said:

    Good evening from my holiday cottage at the far North Western tip of Assynt.



    From the hill here I can see Lewis, the whole of Assynt and its inselbergs, the coast of Wester Ross and all the way to Skye.

    Magnificent.
    You have been very lucky with the weather. The night sky will be brilliant.
    Venus is particularly bright in the south west sky just now.

    This is what happens when I have been staying in Edinburgh all week and get home on a Friday night.
    Jupiter and Mars visible all night - if it's clear.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,105
    A problem with Starmer claiming to have a working class background is that he seems to have abandoned all its attributes as his life has progressed.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,648
    glw said:

    Ruling by fiat is going to end up with people dead. I've no doubt about that.

    Nobody has any doubt about that.

    The only doubt is whether it will make any difference
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,528
    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    @Foxy
    Told you. As usual no shot on target by United in the first half. We need Garnacho on to give some sort of threat. That should be obvious.

    Bilal El Khannous made that goal. He has a massive career ahead of him.

    I have topped up on MU. My team just can't manage two decent halves of play.
    We can’t manage 1 at OT. Better away. Suits the 3-4-3 better I think.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,342
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    If the SNP won most seats and Labour held the balance of power in third with Reform second on seats then an SNP government with Labour support is possible. The LDs and Greens in Scotland would certainly support the SNP over Reform
    You don’t know much about Scottish politics, do you?
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,816
    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169

    A problem with Starmer claiming to have a working class background is that he seems to have abandoned all its attributes as his life has progressed.

    Its just not credible, Starmer has never looked, dressed or spoken like he was working class. His parents were an artisan petit bourgeoisie and a nurse. It's a solid middle class B in the SE stakes.

    Nothing wrong with upward class mobility, just be honest about wanting the same opportunities for others.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,491
    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    Is it the runoff from Franz Josef Glacier? So named for its resemblance to his grey mutton-chop whiskers than a compliment to the Hapsburg Empire.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,538
    edited February 7
    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
  • Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169
    edited February 7
    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    The river at Greymouth?

    Wet and lots of sand flies is how I remember it. Near the famous Pancake rocks?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,648
    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I think it's a different massive racist?
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,491

    Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.

    And a rare example of Labour nepotism that failed.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,408
    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I've lost track. 'DOGE Teen'? 'Fired'? I barely look at the news now as it's just wall-to-wall Trump/Musk (bit of Farage). Once in a rare while Gaza or Ukraine (though only in relation to what Trump might have said about them).

    Luckily for the media there's nothing much happening in, say, Sudan or the DRC. Back to 'What has Donald said in the past five minutes?!?!??!!'

    And apparently no news at all from most of Asia or South America. Phew! What kind of condiment does Trump like with his fries? Trump! News!...
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,342
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    Albeit in Scotland Swinney is also pretty centrist dad and on present polls will almost certainly stay FM.

    The nationalist surge is from Alba there not just Reform
    Alba are imploding. They may not even exist in 2026.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,528

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    Albeit in Scotland Swinney is also pretty centrist dad and on present polls will almost certainly stay FM.

    The nationalist surge is from Alba there not just Reform
    Alba are imploding. They may not even exist in 2026.
    Surely they were buried with Alex Salmond?
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,816
    HYUFD said:

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    We’re a bawhair away from ‘what was so bad about Hitler anyway’.
    Trump has many faults but being anti Jewish isn't one of them. He is very pro Israel and opened Mar a Lago and his golf clubs to Jews at a time many WASP clubs wouldn't
    Yet he keeps saying anti-semitic shit.


  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,105
    Foxy said:

    A problem with Starmer claiming to have a working class background is that he seems to have abandoned all its attributes as his life has progressed.

    Its just not credible, Starmer has never looked, dressed or spoken like he was working class. His parents were an artisan petit bourgeoisie and a nurse. It's a solid middle class B in the SE stakes.

    Nothing wrong with upward class mobility, just be honest about wanting the same opportunities for others.
    Indeed.

    Plus it should be remembered that there is a class structure within the working class.

    The well paid, home owning skilled working class do not think of themselves as being the same as struggling, council house low skilled people let alone 'criminal class' or 'underclass' as per this advert from a theatre group in Starmer's constituency:

    In fact, it’s a phrase that many cultural organisations, from theatre companies to cultural centres to arts consultancies, now use. There is even an anacronym, “WBCU”, or “WBCU-C”, for “workers who identify as working, benefit, criminal, underclass backgrounds”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/may/26/job-ads-aimed-at-the-benefits-class-may-be-well-meant-but-smack-of-contempt
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,569

    Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.

    I recall there was also a class aspect to an attack on Bentleys in that Crewe by-election. The same Crewe where Bentleys are built...
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,816
    Scott_xP said:

    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I think it's a different massive racist?
    Had a look at the thread, and his father is apparently CEO of a company that sells kid's snacks with lead in them.

    Lesser Evil’s better-for-you kids snacks have ‘concerning’ amounts of lead: Consumer Reports

    https://www.fooddive.com/news/lesser-evils-better-you-kids-snacks-have-concerning-amounts-lead/718093/
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,105

    Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.

    That was also the byelection when Labour advocated the hereditary principle was enough reason to vote for their candidate.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613
    ohnotnow said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    The new MRP poll shows how much of a threat Reform are to Labour:

    https://x.com/marwandata/status/1887872745100185763

    Reform UK would gain 147 seats off Labour and 19 off the Conservatives.

    The most astonishing thing is Lab's predicted near wipe out in Wales only retaining the 4 Cardiff seats and Blaenau Gwent

    I'll believe it when I see it and not before.

    Though Wales was the last holdout of UKIP.
    I can believe it to an extent. Lab had a fairly bad GE in Wales losing 4% percentage points but gaining seats due to Con-Ref swing

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Wales

    Memories of Thatcher mean the Valleys won't vote Conservative, but Labour have been running the Senedd for 25 years now and it's hard to see what has got better. Reform are also clear second in many of these seats now
    If you are from a working class mining family that still hates Thatcher but can't stand Ed Miliband's opposition to coal mines then Reform are a viable option. Trump and Le Pen won plenty of coal miner and sons of coal miners votes
    The mines are ancient history. Poverty isn't.

    Welsh Labour has been in power for a very long time, during which improvements in the lives of its core support have been limited at best. Much of this can be and has been pinned on the Tories at Westminster, but they're now out of power and patience with their Labour replacements is in exceedingly short supply.

    If Reform can avoid self-combustion for long enough then it ought to do well in the Senedd elections. If that, in turn, forces Labour and Plaid into coalition then the argument that they're all the same, which was previously deployed very effectively in different circumstances in Scotland ("Tweedledum, Tweedledee and the Tweedledems" was how Alex Salmond once put it) gets fresh legs.

    The Tories, meanwhile, are liable to be relegated to minor party status and forgotten.
    There are still some working coal mines today, even in Wales

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm.

    Reform's dream scenario is for a Labour and Plaid government in Wales and an SNP and Labour government in Scotland next year followed by a Labour and LD government across the UK at the next GE (if they can't win a majority next time).

    They could then really squeeze the white working class vote as the main opposition in every part of the UK and still remain fresher and newer than the Tories still recovering in opposition after 14 years in government UK wide for middle class Leave voters.

    If Farage wins the white working class vote and the middle class Leave vote he can then win a majority UK wide (provided we don't switch to PR) and become largest party in Wales and probably become the main opposition to the SNP in Scotland too
    There’s no way there will be an SNP / Labour government in Scotland, due to deep seated mutual hatred. A Labour / Reform government would be more likely, or even a a Labour / Conservative government.
    A LabCon coalition in Edinburgh or London would be the last redoubt of Centrism-Dadism. Après nous le déluge. The previous iteration eventually concluded with WW2.
    Albeit in Scotland Swinney is also pretty centrist dad and on present polls will almost certainly stay FM.

    The nationalist surge is from Alba there not just Reform
    Even being generous to them - Alba are nothing. At best a faint blip on a chart. And busy in-fighting as they self-destruct.
    Alba are on 7% in the latest Holyrood poll

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_Scottish_Parliament_election
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,569
    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,449

    Foxy said:

    A problem with Starmer claiming to have a working class background is that he seems to have abandoned all its attributes as his life has progressed.

    Its just not credible, Starmer has never looked, dressed or spoken like he was working class. His parents were an artisan petit bourgeoisie and a nurse. It's a solid middle class B in the SE stakes.

    Nothing wrong with upward class mobility, just be honest about wanting the same opportunities for others.
    Indeed.

    Plus it should be remembered that there is a class structure within the working class.

    The well paid, home owning skilled working class do not think of themselves as being the same as struggling, council house low skilled people let alone 'criminal class' or 'underclass' as per this advert from a theatre group in Starmer's constituency:

    In fact, it’s a phrase that many cultural organisations, from theatre companies to cultural centres to arts consultancies, now use. There is even an anacronym, “WBCU”, or “WBCU-C”, for “workers who identify as working, benefit, criminal, underclass backgrounds”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/may/26/job-ads-aimed-at-the-benefits-class-may-be-well-meant-but-smack-of-contempt
    One of the things Starmer is quietly disliked for is that he comes across as genuinely having the interests of the technical middle classes, who often share some of the football, pint and pop tastes of the working classes of yore, rather than sharing the upwardly middle class hobbies that perhaps his peers feel more becoming to a very senior lawyer.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,569
    Hell of a clearance off the line by Leicester there...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,613
    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,491

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
    I was in Hokitika seven years ago. Seems like yesterday, but so does A Hard Day's Night.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,434
    Scott_xP said:

    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I think it's a different massive racist?
    They all blur into one after a while. We should number them. ☹️
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,895
    edited February 7
    Labour to open talks on slavery reparations
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying-slavery-reparations/

    I am sure we were told that really it was Starmer just playing 4d chess with Commonwealth leaders and it would all be forgotten and nothing more would be ever heard of this ever again.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,941

    Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.

    Wasn’t the highlight of that attacking the Conservative candidate for either having a Bentley or being the kind of person who would own a Bentley?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,909
    kamski said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    We’re a bawhair away from ‘what was so bad about Hitler anyway’.
    Trump has many faults but being anti Jewish isn't one of them. He is very pro Israel and opened Mar a Lago and his golf clubs to Jews at a time many WASP clubs wouldn't
    Yet he keeps saying anti-semitic shit.


    "Deport the Palestinians" is anti-semitic?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169
    edited February 7

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
    I was in Hokitika seven years ago. Seems like yesterday, but so does A Hard Day's Night.
    I was last there in 1990.

    I remember asking at a hotel about the menu, and they told me to order quickly as the kitchen was closing soon. It was 18:45...
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,528
    dixiedean said:

    DavidL said:

    @Foxy
    Told you. As usual no shot on target by United in the first half. We need Garnacho on to give some sort of threat. That should be obvious.

    Me Mam and I have lost patience and are watching Shetland.
    So it was you that was putting them off 1-1 now
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,909
    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I think it's a different massive racist?
    Had a look at the thread, and his father is apparently CEO of a company that sells kid's snacks with lead in them.

    Lesser Evil’s better-for-you kids snacks have ‘concerning’ amounts of lead: Consumer Reports

    https://www.fooddive.com/news/lesser-evils-better-you-kids-snacks-have-concerning-amounts-lead/718093/
    Plumbing new depths...
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,528

    Labour to open talks on slavery reparations
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying-slavery-reparations/

    I am sure we were told that really it was Starmer just playing 4d chess with Commonwealth leaders and it would all be forgotten and nothing more would be ever heard of this ever again.

    Is there some part of we have no f****** money left that they are not getting?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,895
    edited February 7

    Long ago, when I was a more regular contributor to this site, I was involved in the Crewe and Nantwich by-election. During this contest the Labour Party organised two (as it turned out, public school) boys to pursue the Conservative candidate dressed up in top hats to ridicule his background. It was one of the highlights of the campaign. Everyone, from all walks of life and political persuasion hated it.

    Just stay away. It will never work and it should never work.

    Wasn’t the highlight of that attacking the Conservative candidate for either having a Bentley or being the kind of person who would own a Bentley?
    Genius IQ level move in Crewe. My other memory of that by-election was the media inability to pronounce Nantwich correctly. Nobody in Nantwich pronounces it Nann-wittt-ch.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,559

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    O/T I couldn't really care less whether Toolmakerson is middle class or working class (whatever either of those ridiculous labels mean). What I do care about is that he and his hopeless CoE are fucking up the economy because they do not understand the first thing about business. You can be from any background to understand business, and also from any background to be totally clueless, such as Keir From HR and Rachel From Customer Complaints.

    Is "Keir From HR" one that you yourself have coined, Nigel?
    I think it was sort of coined by one of his colleagues. Someone I assume who might not be asked to explain by BJO.
    Ah ok. I've not come across it.

    Anyway, question for you. Why have you become so irritated by his voice? You never used to be. What's going on there?
    I have been on a journey, shall I say. I was never a natural supporter of Labour, but as a believer in democracy I realise that we have to have exchanges of power, and the Tories, particularly under Johnson, had become terrible. I believe that Sunak was beginning to turn things around but it was too late.

    I was therefore relieved that Mr Thicky was out and to begin with I thought Starmer, who had a reasonably impressive backstory (albeit largely within the featherbedded public sector), would probably make a good PM. He has turned out to be shit. When the real test has come it is evident he is at best mediocre. Therefore his voice has become more and more boring, nasally and irritating, but most annoying of all is his complete lack of humility; an arrogance that is normally assumed by people such as yourself to be an uniquely Tory trait.
    Ok, thanks. That sounds sincere although I think you're being too harsh and too hasty. Anyway, we'll get another vote in 2029 and if I'm wrong and he doesn't turn out to be ok, perhaps better than ok, it'll just be the one term rather than two or three. Which will be a shame because somebody, anybody, needs a decade to have a significant and lasting positive impact on the country. You can trash things quickly (Johnson, Truss) but the opposite takes time.
    He has no plan and no clue. He is like Johnson without the bonhomie and charisma. An empty suit. And as for Rachel From Customer Complaints, the second most important office of state ffs. She is so shit she needed to lie on her CV. When you think about the gravity of what she is in charge of it is really shocking that we have to have someone so below mediocre in such a position. If it turns around it will be sheer luck. It is said that a chief executive's future is defined by his/her first few months in post. Keir From HR has been found out. He is shit and his CoE is even worse.
    Keir from HR does not really work. The trouble is, it looks like it is supposed to rhyme, but it doesn't.
    He’s more like Keir from Compliance anyway.
    His version of "complying"? Well, he's a politician.


  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,123
    Driver said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    O/T I couldn't really care less whether Toolmakerson is middle class or working class (whatever either of those ridiculous labels mean). What I do care about is that he and his hopeless CoE are fucking up the economy because they do not understand the first thing about business. You can be from any background to understand business, and also from any background to be totally clueless, such as Keir From HR and Rachel From Customer Complaints.

    Is "Keir From HR" one that you yourself have coined, Nigel?
    I think it was sort of coined by one of his colleagues. Someone I assume who might not be asked to explain by BJO.
    Ah ok. I've not come across it.

    Anyway, question for you. Why have you become so irritated by his voice? You never used to be. What's going on there?
    I have been on a journey, shall I say. I was never a natural supporter of Labour, but as a believer in democracy I realise that we have to have exchanges of power, and the Tories, particularly under Johnson, had become terrible. I believe that Sunak was beginning to turn things around but it was too late.

    I was therefore relieved that Mr Thicky was out and to begin with I thought Starmer, who had a reasonably impressive backstory (albeit largely within the featherbedded public sector), would probably make a good PM. He has turned out to be shit. When the real test has come it is evident he is at best mediocre. Therefore his voice has become more and more boring, nasally and irritating, but most annoying of all is his complete lack of humility; an arrogance that is normally assumed by people such as yourself to be an uniquely Tory trait.
    Ok, thanks. That sounds sincere although I think you're being too harsh and too hasty. Anyway, we'll get another vote in 2029 and if I'm wrong and he doesn't turn out to be ok, perhaps better than ok, it'll just be the one term rather than two or three. Which will be a shame because somebody, anybody, needs a decade to have a significant and lasting positive impact on the country. You can trash things quickly (Johnson, Truss) but the opposite takes time.
    He has no plan and no clue. He is like Johnson without the bonhomie and charisma. An empty suit. And as for Rachel From Customer Complaints, the second most important office of state ffs. She is so shit she needed to lie on her CV. When you think about the gravity of what she is in charge of it is really shocking that we have to have someone so below mediocre in such a position. If it turns around it will be sheer luck. It is said that a chief executive's future is defined by his/her first few months in post. Keir From HR has been found out. He is shit and his CoE is even worse.
    Keir from HR does not really work. The trouble is, it looks like it is supposed to rhyme, but it doesn't.
    He’s more like Keir from Compliance anyway.
    His version of "complying"? Well, he's a politician.


    Donald Trump is the ultimate Pointy Haired Boss (which makes Scott Adams support from him a tad odd).
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,161
    Thanks for the guesses on the photo.

    Hokitika Gorge indeed - a couple of days ago.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446
    DavidL said:

    Labour to open talks on slavery reparations
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying-slavery-reparations/

    I am sure we were told that really it was Starmer just playing 4d chess with Commonwealth leaders and it would all be forgotten and nothing more would be ever heard of this ever again.

    Is there some part of we have no f****** money left that they are not getting?
    Even if we did it'd be the wrong policy, and would gain us zero goodwill.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,066
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
    The voting intention is in fact Con 40% to Liberal 34%. Most polling still points to a big Conservative lead.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,161
    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
    I was in Hokitika seven years ago. Seems like yesterday, but so does A Hard Day's Night.
    I was last there in 1990.

    I remember asking at a hotel about the menu, and they told me to order quickly as the kitchen was closing soon. It was 18:45...
    Yes that’s not unusual even now in the more rural places. Mrs Stodge and I are in a village called Gladstone, named after the great Liberal PM who was once a Tory, the anti-Truss if you prefer.

    Generally the food in NZ is fine - not of course to the standards of our many travellers, gourmands and bon viveurs but decent enough. I’ve become addicted to creamy mushrooms on toast and oddly enough one of the best examples is in Mitre 10, their equivalent of B&Q.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,066
    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Labour to open talks on slavery reparations
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying-slavery-reparations/

    I am sure we were told that really it was Starmer just playing 4d chess with Commonwealth leaders and it would all be forgotten and nothing more would be ever heard of this ever again.

    Is there some part of we have no f****** money left that they are not getting?
    Even if we did it'd be the wrong policy, and would gain us zero goodwill.
    The Reform campaigning points write themselves.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,880
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
    The voting intention is in fact Con 40% to Liberal 34%. Most polling still points to a big Conservative lead.
    So more than a hairhare's breadth

  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,816

    kamski said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well, it seems as though racism is now thoroughly embedded at the very top of the USA.

    Expect homophobia and misogyny to take a similar route.

    We’re a bawhair away from ‘what was so bad about Hitler anyway’.
    Trump has many faults but being anti Jewish isn't one of them. He is very pro Israel and opened Mar a Lago and his golf clubs to Jews at a time many WASP clubs wouldn't
    Yet he keeps saying anti-semitic shit.


    "Deport the Palestinians" is anti-semitic?
    No. Well, technically yes.

    But I mean things like telling American Jews that Netanyahu is "your prime minister"

    Reportedly saying "I've got black accountants at Trump Castle and Trump Plaza. Black guys counting my money! I hate it. The only kind of people I want counting my money are short guys that wear yarmulkes every day."

    Or the ad he ran against Clinton, saying she was being controlled by George Soros, Janet L. Yellen and Lloyd Blankfein and “global special interests.”

    There's quite a bit of this kind of stuff.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,569
    Man U go through with an offside goal.

    No VAR.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169
    stodge said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
    I was in Hokitika seven years ago. Seems like yesterday, but so does A Hard Day's Night.
    I was last there in 1990.

    I remember asking at a hotel about the menu, and they told me to order quickly as the kitchen was closing soon. It was 18:45...
    Yes that’s not unusual even now in the more rural places. Mrs Stodge and I are in a village called Gladstone, named after the great Liberal PM who was once a Tory, the anti-Truss if you prefer.

    Generally the food in NZ is fine - not of course to the standards of our many travellers, gourmands and bon viveurs but decent enough. I’ve become addicted to creamy mushrooms on toast and oddly enough one of the best examples is in Mitre 10, their equivalent of B&Q.
    I remember eating out there being good value and decent food. Most restaurants were unlicensed but BYO generally with minimal charge for corkage.

    Best meal there was my first anniversary at The Sign of the Takahe, a magnificent Victorian mock Scottish Baronial hall up in the port hills of Christchurch
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,538
    stodge said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all from a damp West Coast of Aotearoa :)

    POLYGAMY was arguably a lucky winner of the Oaks given the tack problems Willie Carson had on DIBIDALE.

    I’m sure @Leon will know where this is.


    That's Hokitika Gorge - was there fairly recently. DM me if you want any hiking, camping or DoC hut advice.
    LOL - the other side of the planet and one of our number was there "fairly recently".

    Small planet - or a ridiculously well-travelled group here?
    I was in Hokitika seven years ago. Seems like yesterday, but so does A Hard Day's Night.
    I was last there in 1990.

    I remember asking at a hotel about the menu, and they told me to order quickly as the kitchen was closing soon. It was 18:45...
    Yes that’s not unusual even now in the more rural places. Mrs Stodge and I are in a village called Gladstone, named after the great Liberal PM who was once a Tory, the anti-Truss if you prefer.

    Generally the food in NZ is fine - not of course to the standards of our many travellers, gourmands and bon viveurs but decent enough. I’ve become addicted to creamy mushrooms on toast and oddly enough one of the best examples is in Mitre 10, their equivalent of B&Q.
    The pies are extraordinary. Though they do always taste good after 5 days tramping across waist-deep rivers, glaciers and through that incredibly spiky grass.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,940

    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    kamski said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @jasonleopold.bsky.social‬

    🚨BIG SCOOP: Musk’s DOGE Teen Was Fired By Cybersecurity Firm for Leaking Company Secrets

    Edward Coristine posted online that he had retained access to the firm’s servers. Now he has access to sensitive government information.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jasonleopold.bsky.social/post/3lhmeek6bjs2o

    Is that the massive racist or a different one?
    I think it's a different massive racist?
    Had a look at the thread, and his father is apparently CEO of a company that sells kid's snacks with lead in them.

    Lesser Evil’s better-for-you kids snacks have ‘concerning’ amounts of lead: Consumer Reports

    https://www.fooddive.com/news/lesser-evils-better-you-kids-snacks-have-concerning-amounts-lead/718093/
    Plumbing new depths...
    They did say Americans were looking for a strong leader.
  • Man U go through with an offside goal.

    No VAR.

    About the only way they can win a game nowadays..😏
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,169

    Man U go through with an offside goal.

    No VAR.

    Yep. Leicester simply cannot play for 90 minutes. That's why we are going down.

    Its frustrating because at times we look competent.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,648
    @jimsciutto

    Breaking: A federal judge has ordered the Trump administration to immediately halt its plans to put thousands of USAID employees on administrative leave tonight.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,559
    Foxy said:

    Man U go through with an offside goal.

    No VAR.

    Yep. Leicester simply cannot play for 90 minutes. That's why we are going down.

    Its frustrating because at times we look competent.
    Leicester did their job. The linesman didn't.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,683
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
    The voting intention is in fact Con 40% to Liberal 34%. Most polling still points to a big Conservative lead.
    Yes. 8% for the NDP was the giveaway.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,973
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
    The voting intention is in fact Con 40% to Liberal 34%. Most polling still points to a big Conservative lead.
    ... but once Carney becomes leader the Liberals will be edging ahead.

    Justin's played a blinder.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 97,446

    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Trump accidentally screwing over a Conservative who was nailed on to win?

    🇨🇦#Canada, poll:

    Who is the most qualified leader to negotiate with Mr. Trump and his administration?

    Carney (LPC): 40 %
    Poilievre (CPC): 26 %
    Freeland (LPC): 13 %

    Nanos Research, 03/02/25

    https://nitter.poast.org/ElectsWorld/status/1887866032095629603#m

    There is a Canadian poll out today from Pallas which has a Carney led Liberals tied with Poilievre's Conservatives on 37% each
    with the NDP on just 8%

    https://files.constantcontact.com/f737aa99901/481ac616-abe0-4f16-808f-12b7e595ac25.pdf
    Pierre must be super pissed, years of work undone.
    The voting intention is in fact Con 40% to Liberal 34%. Most polling still points to a big Conservative lead.
    ... but once Carney becomes leader the Liberals will be edging ahead.

    Justin's played a blinder.
    Feels like it would be a rare occurence of swapping out the Leader actually working, and would suggest it really was Trudeau wearing out his welcome which was the biggest problem.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,973
    edited February 7
    Foxy said:

    Man U go through with an offside goal.

    No VAR.

    Yep. Leicester simply cannot play for 90 minutes. That's why we are going down.

    Its frustrating because at times we look competent.
    United in that first half would have made a team from St Mary Mead WI look competent tbf.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 53,587
    Labour to open talks on reparations. “Caribbean sources said they were keen for Lord Hermer to be involved.”

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying-slavery-reparations/
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,216
    Scott_xP said:

    @jimsciutto

    Breaking: A federal judge has ordered the Trump administration to immediately halt its plans to put thousands of USAID employees on administrative leave tonight.

    Will be ignored.

    What is the judge going to do?

    This is the test now. The test of the times.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,502
    Just like people who really do have high IQs keep it to themselves?
This discussion has been closed.