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Environmentalism, feminism, liberalism, and socialism are the favourite ideologies of Brits

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  • Andy_JS said:

    "Moment explosion blows up terraced house roof in Ilford"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9VmmBM_x84

    A line from the Standard report: The [London Fire] Brigade's drone team were also deployed to the incident, offering the Incident Commander an aerial view of the scene.
    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/ilford-fire-house-explosion-ley-street-b1199244.html
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457
    One for Leon's current obsession.
    ?

    A Chinese national has been arrested and faces federal charges for flying a drone over Vandenberg Space Force Base.

    Yinpiao Zhou, 39 "was arrested today at San Francisco International Airport prior to boarding a China-bound flight," -Department of Justice press releas

    https://x.com/ColbyBadhwar/status/1866597719936270502
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,009
    Andy_JS said:

    stodge said:

    Afternoon all :)

    On topic, the problem is everyone has their own subjective interpretation and definition of all the “isms” listed. We could waste 100,000 posts trying to define liberalism, socialism, conservatism, centrism and environmentalism and be no nearer any kind of truth.

    Afternoon? You must be somewhere exotic.
    Kia Ora from Aotearoa, my friend.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457
    I get the whole free speech argument, but I have some sympathy with teach...

    An Iowa middle school teacher has banned words like “Ohio,” “brain rot,” and “meow.” Students risk detention if caught using internet lingo, and reports claim at least ten kids have been punished already.

    FIRE is on the case to protect students' non-disruptive speech.

    https://x.com/TheFIREorg/status/1866556198167757122
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    edited December 2024
    Good morning everyone.

    Early start today.
  • MattW said:

    Good morning everyone.

    Early start today.

    Or late finish for others...
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    Nigelb said:

    I get the whole free speech argument, but I have some sympathy with teach...

    An Iowa middle school teacher has banned words like “Ohio,” “brain rot,” and “meow.” Students risk detention if caught using internet lingo, and reports claim at least ten kids have been punished already.

    FIRE is on the case to protect students' non-disruptive speech.

    https://x.com/TheFIREorg/status/1866556198167757122

    Ohio?

    (OK, it sounds a bit like Miaow, but even so. What is it in the heads of Iowans - which also sounds like Miaow - that "Ohio" is problematic?

    Is Ohio to Iowa what London is to everywhere else?)
  • Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 722

    geoffw said:

    On my calculations Assad could buy up all the homes of Russia's 3rd and 4th largest cities, Novosibirsk and Yekatarinburg (total pop 3.2 million) with his supposed loot from Syria

    Truly, the most miserable session of retail therapy ever...
    One day my son, all of this will be yours....
  • Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 722
    if Labour promote Socialism, Conservatives Capitalism, it seems Reform are keen on Sommeism.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,450
    edited December 2024
    Penddu2 said:

    if Labour promote Socialism, Conservatives Capitalism, it seems Reform are keen on Sommeism.

    They are Sommeliers. Because all they do is w(h)ine. 😃
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457
    Ex-defense minister attempted suicide at detention facility
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=388186

    Police raid presidential office, police headquarters in martial law probe
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=388185
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,923
    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    AnthonyT said:

    When I see Feminism I think Germaine Greer or Naomi Wolf, who are a bit chippy and have a men problem.

    I wouldn't rate it as a positive, but it's certainly an ideology you're expected to endorse. I expect it gets virtually all women and a good chunk of liberal men.

    Naomi Wolf is a waste of space.
    She will forever be in my heart for the radio interview regarding her book Outrages, in which she wrote movingly about all the people executed in the UK for their sexuality, due to court records containing the phrase "death recorded".

    During the radio interview, a historian (I forget whom) pointed out to her that the phrase didn't mean they'd been executed. It simple meant they had died.
    It was Matthew Sweet, and apparently it did not even mean the person died.

    "I don't think you're right about this," Sweet replied, before detailing the term "death recorded" in fact meant that judges had abstained from handing down a death sentence.

    "I don't think any of the executions you've identified here actually happened," he said.

    In one particular case, he pointed out a 14-year-old boy had been discharged and not executed as she had detailed.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-50153743

    Absolutely hilarious situation. How does someone still have an academic or literary career after that?

    I think she was completely doolally about the 2019 GE exit poll if my memory is correct.
    It’s worse than that, because that was based on her DPhil thesis. And not only did she and her publisher refuse to make changes, but Oxford University failed to withdraw her doctorate, as is standard in such cases.

    That left all three of them with a very considerable credibility gap.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457
    Photos of Birmingham DHL fire suggest device could have downed plane
    Images consistent with fire from magnesium-based device, suspected to be part of Russian sabotage plot
    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/dec/10/photos-of-birmingham-dhl-fire-suggest-device-could-have-downed-plane
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117
    Nigelb said:

    One for Leon's current obsession.
    ?

    A Chinese national has been arrested and faces federal charges for flying a drone over Vandenberg Space Force Base.

    Yinpiao Zhou, 39 "was arrested today at San Francisco International Airport prior to boarding a China-bound flight," -Department of Justice press releas

    https://x.com/ColbyBadhwar/status/1866597719936270502

    Ah, so at least one of them was the Chinese playing games.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117
    Nigelb said:

    Photos of Birmingham DHL fire suggest device could have downed plane
    Images consistent with fire from magnesium-based device, suspected to be part of Russian sabotage plot
    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/dec/10/photos-of-birmingham-dhl-fire-suggest-device-could-have-downed-plane

    That would have been a bad day for the crew, if the fire had happened in the air.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,923
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    One for Leon's current obsession.
    ?

    A Chinese national has been arrested and faces federal charges for flying a drone over Vandenberg Space Force Base.

    Yinpiao Zhou, 39 "was arrested today at San Francisco International Airport prior to boarding a China-bound flight," -Department of Justice press releas

    https://x.com/ColbyBadhwar/status/1866597719936270502

    Ah, so at least one of them was the Chinese playing games.
    Whcih one? Leon, Eadric or Byronic?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    edited December 2024
    Your public service context for the day.

    The full text of the Telegrunt article about middle class women who are obsessed with fairy porn. You wondered why most of the laydees weren't posting on PB. Now you know.

    https://archive.is/20241210190844/https://www.telegraph.co.uk/books/authors/fairy-porn-a-court-of-thorns-and-roses/

    I first learned about romantasy – imagine what Lord of the Rings’ Aragorn and Arwen, in full velvet and gossamer, might get up to in a quiet moment in Rivendell – about five years ago. My most high-powered friend sent me a copy of A Court of Thorns and Roses (ACOTAR), saying she started reading it as a bit of a joke, before getting hooked. She had been put on to it by a contact who worked in the stats team at Amazon and was watching these novels ‘about sexy fairies’ quietly shoot up the charts. What once felt extremely niche is now truly mainstream. Indeed, three out of the top 10 Spotify 2024 audiobooks are by Maas.

    This is a cross between Fanfic and Cosmopolitan. IMO it all started when Legolas got his Abba Blonde hairdo. I have not gone so far down the rabbit hole as to detect whether The Throbbit is mentioned.

    Incoming conspiracy theories from the Dreck Bros leading Reform UK Real Soon Now ...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,923
    Either Staffs Police have very different standards of investigation and care form mine, or BBC subeditors really need a crash course in grammar and punctuation:

    The force commended her "high standard of investigation and care", after a man was seriously injured in a car crash and acknowledged her bravery after she chased a suspect with two zombie knives and a knuckle duster before detaining him.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg7r05zlx97o
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,307
    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    I get the whole free speech argument, but I have some sympathy with teach...

    An Iowa middle school teacher has banned words like “Ohio,” “brain rot,” and “meow.” Students risk detention if caught using internet lingo, and reports claim at least ten kids have been punished already.

    FIRE is on the case to protect students' non-disruptive speech.

    https://x.com/TheFIREorg/status/1866556198167757122

    Ohio?

    (OK, it sounds a bit like Miaow, but even so. What is it in the heads of Iowans - which also sounds like Miaow - that "Ohio" is problematic?

    Is Ohio to Iowa what London is to everywhere else?)
    It's current slang for weird, a shortened version of "only in Ohio".



  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,923
    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    I get the whole free speech argument, but I have some sympathy with teach...

    An Iowa middle school teacher has banned words like “Ohio,” “brain rot,” and “meow.” Students risk detention if caught using internet lingo, and reports claim at least ten kids have been punished already.

    FIRE is on the case to protect students' non-disruptive speech.

    https://x.com/TheFIREorg/status/1866556198167757122

    Ohio?

    (OK, it sounds a bit like Miaow, but even so. What is it in the heads of Iowans - which also sounds like Miaow - that "Ohio" is problematic?

    Is Ohio to Iowa what London is to everywhere else?)
    It's current slang for weird, a shortened version of "only in Ohio".
    Is it an ad Vance on previous abuse?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,307
    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    I get the whole free speech argument, but I have some sympathy with teach...

    An Iowa middle school teacher has banned words like “Ohio,” “brain rot,” and “meow.” Students risk detention if caught using internet lingo, and reports claim at least ten kids have been punished already.

    FIRE is on the case to protect students' non-disruptive speech.

    https://x.com/TheFIREorg/status/1866556198167757122

    Ohio?

    (OK, it sounds a bit like Miaow, but even so. What is it in the heads of Iowans - which also sounds like Miaow - that "Ohio" is problematic?

    Is Ohio to Iowa what London is to everywhere else?)
    It's current slang for weird, a shortened version of "only in Ohio".
    Is it an ad Vance on previous abuse?
    The kids are right.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,779
    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,975
    And after Sir Hopeless's big reset too.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    edited December 2024
    On a very serious note indeed, a segment from yesterday's Ukraine the Latest podcast, about Russia's organised programme of abduction and Russification of Ukrainian children - which is now up to at least 20,000 children. Putin has personal involvement.

    The programme is now shown to be a close parallel to the programme run by the Third Reich to abduct and Germanise children from Poland during WW2.

    The systematic nature of it moves the crime up from "Crime Against Humanity" to "Component of Genocide" under the Geneva Conventions, according to the projects submitting evidence to the ICC.

    One to keep talking about.

    https://youtu.be/vHx1l7mSxWw?t=1730
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117
    edited December 2024
    Chris said:

    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
    Sports are the same. There’s only one Mo Salah and one Lewis Hamilton, which is why they get eight-figure salaries.

    If you’re looking for 10,000 people of average skill level at kicking balls or driving cars, on the other hand, you’ll find the price is a lot lower.
  • Good morning, everyone.

    Mr Sandpit, how do you think the new Ferrari drivers will compare in 2025?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117
    MattW said:

    On a very serious note indeed, a segment from yesterday's Ukraine the Latest podcast, about Russia's organised programme of abduction and Russification of Ukrainian children - which is now up to at least 20,000 children. Putin has personal involvement.

    The programme is now shown to be a close parallel to the programme run by the Third Reich to abduct and Germanise children from Poland during WW2.

    The systematic nature of it moves the crime up from "Crime Against Humanity" to "Component of Genocide" under the Geneva Conventions, according to the projects submitting evidence to the ICC.

    One to keep talking about.

    https://youtu.be/vHx1l7mSxWw?t=1730

    This has been happening since the first days of the war, and the numbers are likely unreported by an order of magnitude.

    The only conflict of recent times from which there appear to be no orphans, and absolutely a serious war crime.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,131
    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    My solution is to use technology to reduce the number of workers required *and* pay them more *and* increase productivity.

    But that’s crazy talk, I suppose.
    What's your technology solution to reducing the number of people who empty your bins?
    Robots to pickup the council wheelie bins are in prototype already. Creating robots that can pick up and load the colour coded recycling bins would not be an impossible task either. Certainly compared to robots that can pick raspberries without damaging them.
    I was thinking the same thing.

    In LA, the trucks go down the street, and giant mechanical arms pick up the wheelie bins and deposit their contents.

    There's nothing impossible - on a five to ten year horizon - about having the refuse trucks be entirely automated.
    ...and ten minutes later somebody hacks them and we have automated killer trucks with giant mechanical arms roaming Los Angeles, picking people up and crushing them in their robot jaws.

    What's the first rule of doing things? If what you do can result in a murderbot, then don't do that. 😃
    You mean something like this ?


  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117

    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr Sandpit, how do you think the new Ferrari drivers will compare in 2025?

    I think Charles will win qualifying over the season, but Lewis will quickly work out how to get the points on Sundays and overhaul him by mid-season. They’ll both win races though, and a title shot for the team is definitely on after the improvements of ‘24.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,779
    edited December 2024
    Sandpit said:

    Chris said:

    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
    Sports are the same. There’s only one Mo Salah and one Lewis Hamilton, which is why they get eight-figure salaries.
    I did put "best" in quotation marks for a reason.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457
    Remember the beginning of the war, when some posters regarded the suggestion that Russia deliberately targeted hospitals as incredible propaganda ?

    This sort of thing is pretty well a daily report now.

    Death toll from Dec. 10 Russian ballistic missile attack on private health clinic in Zaporizhzhya, Ukraine, rises to six. Five-year-old girl among the dead. Rescue work still going on, people feared still trapped under rubble...
    https://x.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1866731329162801570
  • Penddu2 said:

    if Labour promote Socialism, Conservatives Capitalism, it seems Reform are keen on Sommeism.

    They want 20,000 British people to walk very slowly towards enemy machine guns in No Man's Land whilst negotiating a muddy quagmire?

    Well, it's a brave electoral strategy, I'll give them that.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,615
    Sandpit said:

    Chris said:

    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
    Sports are the same. There’s only one Mo Salah and one Lewis Hamilton, which is why they get eight-figure salaries.

    If you’re looking for 10,000 people of average skill level at kicking balls or driving cars, on the other hand, you’ll find the price is a lot lower.
    Sports are very different IMO. If sportsmen have an 'off' two or three years, then their careers very rapidly fade, as do their earnings. Hamilton and Salah are not really exceptions, as they (especially Hamilton) are a brand as well as sportsmen.

    Executives are very different. Results of business decisions can take years to show through, and even when they fail, executives often move on to other well-paid executive jobs.

    If you fail in a sport, you are found out quickly. If you fail as an executive, you can hide the failure.
  • Sandpit said:

    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr Sandpit, how do you think the new Ferrari drivers will compare in 2025?

    I think Charles will win qualifying over the season, but Lewis will quickly work out how to get the points on Sundays and overhaul him by mid-season. They’ll both win races though, and a title shot for the team is definitely on after the improvements of ‘24.
    Interesting.

    I suspect Leclerc will win overall by a reasonable margin. Hamilton's had some moments (Las Vegas and Abu Dhabi this year, Zandvoort in 2022) when he's been great but mostly in the new regulation era he's not seemed quite as fast. That might be a Mercedes factor, but I don't think, all else being equal, George Russell should be able to match Hamilton.

    My guess is Leclerc has the whip hand this year but come 2026 and new regulations that may swing the other way.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,545
    edited December 2024

    Sandpit said:

    Chris said:

    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
    Sports are the same. There’s only one Mo Salah and one Lewis Hamilton, which is why they get eight-figure salaries.

    If you’re looking for 10,000 people of average skill level at kicking balls or driving cars, on the other hand, you’ll find the price is a lot lower.
    Sports are very different IMO. If sportsmen have an 'off' two or three years, then their careers very rapidly fade, as do their earnings. Hamilton and Salah are not really exceptions, as they (especially Hamilton) are a brand as well as sportsmen.

    Executives are very different. Results of business decisions can take years to show through, and even when they fail, executives often move on to other well-paid executive jobs.

    If you fail in a sport, you are found out quickly. If you fail as an executive, you can hide the failure.
    Far less failing upwards in sport....although Robbie Savage is certainly one example.....
  • Nigelb said:

    Remember the beginning of the war, when some posters regarded the suggestion that Russia deliberately targeted hospitals as incredible propaganda ?

    This sort of thing is pretty well a daily report now.

    Death toll from Dec. 10 Russian ballistic missile attack on private health clinic in Zaporizhzhya, Ukraine, rises to six. Five-year-old girl among the dead. Rescue work still going on, people feared still trapped under rubble...
    https://x.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1866731329162801570

    Hospitals, power generation, water treatment plants, food supply... all the current wars of invasion target civilian infrastructure as well as civilians.
  • A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457

    Sandpit said:

    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr Sandpit, how do you think the new Ferrari drivers will compare in 2025?

    I think Charles will win qualifying over the season, but Lewis will quickly work out how to get the points on Sundays and overhaul him by mid-season. They’ll both win races though, and a title shot for the team is definitely on after the improvements of ‘24.
    Interesting.

    I suspect Leclerc will win overall by a reasonable margin. Hamilton's had some moments (Las Vegas and Abu Dhabi this year, Zandvoort in 2022) when he's been great but mostly in the new regulation era he's not seemed quite as fast. That might be a Mercedes factor, but I don't think, all else being equal, George Russell should be able to match Hamilton.

    My guess is Leclerc has the whip hand this year but come 2026 and new regulations that may swing the other way.
    We'll see.
    It's hard to tell whether he's lost any speed, of whether it's just the car.

    All teams should have more predictable vehicles next year, as they continue learning how to deal with a format which has created more unpredictability than most.
    It's not impossible that next year's Ferrari is more to his liking. Not certain enough to bet on.

    Also Russell is a very quick qualifier. Hamilton is the only top driver he's gone head to head with, and that in an inconsistent car, so we don't know yet exactly how he compares with Verstappen, Leclerc and Norris.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,999
    HYUFD said:

    Reform UK is building a winning team to change British politics forever.

    https://x.com/Nigel_Farage/status/1866462615930871998

    When is the first electoral opportunity?

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1866462907199840292

    The first step is the English County Council elections on May 1st 2025. Britain Needs Reform.
    https://x.com/Nigel_Farage/status/1866475659003826450

    Have you taken the step? Congratulations!
  • Penddu2 said:

    if Labour promote Socialism, Conservatives Capitalism, it seems Reform are keen on Sommeism.

    They want 20,000 British people to walk very slowly towards enemy machine guns in No Man's Land whilst negotiating a muddy quagmire?

    Well, it's a brave electoral strategy, I'll give them that.
    Sell it as an opportunity for Woke Youth to find out what they're made of, and it's a winner.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,131

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    Tony Buzbee, what a belting name that is.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,545
    edited December 2024
    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    Unless the prison guards mysteriously take a day off, the cctv stops working and he slips and he end up falling, catching his neck in his bedding, leading to a terrible fatal strangulation....but something like that would never happen.
  • Sandpit said:

    Chris said:

    Pagan2 said:

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    Yes, we often tend to think of woke as a recent phenomenon, but its roots go back to 1960s radicalism. These laws will need to be unpicked by a future government.
    I can't wait for you Reformers to turn the clock back to 1900.

    maxh said:

    Those under 49 need a good dose of "socialism" - especially losing their jobs - to get an understanding of what it actually delivers.

    The good news is that we’re not having socialism.
    The dubious equal pay claims bankrupting councils and businesses are something worse.
    You think that's what's bankrupting councils?!
    It certainly doesn't help. The law is absurd.

    https://www.itv.com/news/2024-12-09/birmingham-council-set-to-pay-out-over-250m-in-equal-pay-claim-sources-say

    Birmingham Council is poised to pay out hundreds of millions of pounds to women workers including teaching assistants, carers, caterers and cleaners in order to finally settle the thousands of equal pay claims that have pushed the local authority to the brink of bankruptcy.
    Have you never heard of the Equal Pay Act 1970? A nice easy way to educate yourself is to watch the excellent film Made in Dagenham.
    A law that should be repealed.

    Nobody should be stopping any woman, or anyone else, from applying for or getting a higher paid job. That doesn't justify people keeping the job they've got and then demanding more money for it.
    What are you on about you plumb? The Equal Pay Act ensures women get paid the same as men for a similarly skilled job. The Ford example was women doing skilled work sewing car seat covers were paid labourers wages. That wasn't right.
    Women should be paid the same as men for the same job, not "similar".

    If a skilled job has plenty of supply of people willing to do the job, then its wages should be lower. That's supply and demand, not discrimination.

    If women want a "similar" job's wages, they should apply for that similar job. If they don't get it because they're women, then that's discrimination - not paying a totally different job less.
    A skilled job should be paid a skilled workers wage irrespective of gender. Same goes for the council context.

    PBers who wouldn't get out of bed for less than £100k a year demanding public sector workers collect their rubbish for peanuts is one of the conundrums of our post Brexit Britain.
    A job should be paid as much as is required to recruit enough people to fill it no more and no less
    Except of course for "executive" jobs where it must be paid enough to recruit the "best" person in the world.
    Sports are the same. There’s only one Mo Salah and one Lewis Hamilton, which is why they get eight-figure salaries.

    If you’re looking for 10,000 people of average skill level at kicking balls or driving cars, on the other hand, you’ll find the price is a lot lower.
    Sports are very different IMO. If sportsmen have an 'off' two or three years, then their careers very rapidly fade, as do their earnings. Hamilton and Salah are not really exceptions, as they (especially Hamilton) are a brand as well as sportsmen.

    Executives are very different. Results of business decisions can take years to show through, and even when they fail, executives often move on to other well-paid executive jobs.

    If you fail in a sport, you are found out quickly. If you fail as an executive, you can hide the failure.
    That delayed feedback is something humans struggle to compute and go to quite hefty efforts to overlook. Hence the "cut investment, take the savings as profit, happy days" model of business. Suspect that's the category error that financemen in politics (Rishi S, say) make.

    The other thing about executive pay is that it sometimes seems like the best model is "executives ask themselves how much the owners of the business should pay them". I mean, I'm lovely and not that money-driven, but I know what answer I would give in that situation.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,307
    Nigelb said:

    Remember the beginning of the war, when some posters regarded the suggestion that Russia deliberately targeted hospitals as incredible propaganda ?

    This sort of thing is pretty well a daily report now.

    Death toll from Dec. 10 Russian ballistic missile attack on private health clinic in Zaporizhzhya, Ukraine, rises to six. Five-year-old girl among the dead. Rescue work still going on, people feared still trapped under rubble...
    https://x.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1866731329162801570

    Isn't it just a case that the Russian missiles are not very accurate, and that they don't care what they hit? The point is random terror, which seems a strange way to treat a people that they claim are Russians really.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,131
    Looks like further discontent in the public sector as the offer of an inflation busting pay award for the Nurses has been described as "offensive".

    Labour have already shown their strategy in negotiations with the public sector on pay and conditions is to throw in the towel at the first opportunity so expect a further capitulation which is then hailed as a success by the relevant minister.

    https://news.sky.com/story/unions-hint-at-public-sector-industrial-action-over-offensive-2-8-pay-rise-recommendation-13271028
  • NEW THREAD

  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,572
    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    Which is bizarre as actors are always happy to tell us how to behave or vote so I guessed they were truly people to look up to. Shattered dreams, just before Christmas too.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,131
    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    All of these years all of these conspiracy theories and these "blinds" on gossip sites like CDAN and AGC.

    Could alot of it be true.

    Meanwhile we fixate on a chubby, failed fruit and veg businessman for a few coarse comments off screen.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14167967/New-Covent-Garden-fruit-veg-sellers-no-time-Gregg-Wallace-went-bust-owing-lots-cash.html
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117

    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    Unless the prison guards mysteriously take a day off, the cctv stops working and he slips and he end up falling, catching his neck in his bedding, leading to a terrible fatal strangulation....but something like that would never happen.
    Not too sure they get away with that one again, at least not under Trump’s FBI and DOJ picks.
  • Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    Remember the beginning of the war, when some posters regarded the suggestion that Russia deliberately targeted hospitals as incredible propaganda ?

    This sort of thing is pretty well a daily report now.

    Death toll from Dec. 10 Russian ballistic missile attack on private health clinic in Zaporizhzhya, Ukraine, rises to six. Five-year-old girl among the dead. Rescue work still going on, people feared still trapped under rubble...
    https://x.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1866731329162801570

    Isn't it just a case that the Russian missiles are not very accurate, and that they don't care what they hit? The point is random terror, which seems a strange way to treat a people that they claim are Russians really.
    Sort of like the German V bomb raids on Lowestoft, which were only discovered after the war was over?
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,624
    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    On a very serious note indeed, a segment from yesterday's Ukraine the Latest podcast, about Russia's organised programme of abduction and Russification of Ukrainian children - which is now up to at least 20,000 children. Putin has personal involvement.

    The programme is now shown to be a close parallel to the programme run by the Third Reich to abduct and Germanise children from Poland during WW2.

    The systematic nature of it moves the crime up from "Crime Against Humanity" to "Component of Genocide" under the Geneva Conventions, according to the projects submitting evidence to the ICC.

    One to keep talking about.

    https://youtu.be/vHx1l7mSxWw?t=1730

    This has been happening since the first days of the war, and the numbers are likely unreported by an order of magnitude.

    The only conflict of recent times from which there appear to be no orphans, and absolutely a serious war crime.
    Unfortunately, Trump doesn’t care about Ukraine or about war crimes.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,624
    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    That seems like a non sequitur.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Allegedly...

    "Bashar al-Assad illegally transferred $135 billion to Russia."

    https://x.com/WarMonitor3/status/1866566102689497572

    If true, how would he do that? Through international banking?

    If true that would make Assad the 6th richest man in the world, even if in exile now.

    Looks like he has managed to do rather better out of his regime collapsing than Saddam, Ceaucescu and Gaddafi did.

    Not only not being executed or killed like them but also taking vast sums with him to maintain himself and his family
    His family has had a lot of time to pocket the money - except the country wasn't as asset rich as others - so I doubt the figures are accurate.

    That isn't to say he will be destitute but I suspect he will have $x0m to $xbn rather than $x0bn....
    I wonder what Putin will be charging him as a pay for the war / rescue Russia fee?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,117
    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    A lawyer representing several alleged victims of Sean "Diddy" Combs says the potential number of civil legal cases against the musician "is probably in the 300 range".

    Tony Buzbee told the BBC his team had received about 3,000 calls since he held a news conference calling for clients in October.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8ewld21p14o

    It does rather sound like half of Hollywood is about to come crashing down.
    All of these years all of these conspiracy theories and these "blinds" on gossip sites like CDAN and AGC.

    Could alot of it be true.

    Meanwhile we fixate on a chubby, failed fruit and veg businessman for a few coarse comments off screen.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14167967/New-Covent-Garden-fruit-veg-sellers-no-time-Gregg-Wallace-went-bust-owing-lots-cash.html
    A scary amount of the ‘blind’ stuff has turned out to be true over the years.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,077
    edited December 2024
    kle4 said:

    I recommend Nigel start with some really obscure councils, where only small numbers are needed, like the Isles of Scilly, to get some unusual headlines even if Reform underperform expectations elsewhere.

    Seems they tend to go with independents and not party labels, but that used to be the case for the City of London Corporation, and Labour are now represented there alongside your local independent type groupings, so things can change.

    The corporation will be holding its election in March 2025 apparently, so clearly must be watched closely for a Reform surge.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_the_Isles_of_Scilly
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_of_London_Corporation

    There are certain logical places, but I see no indication that they are capable of even running a bath.

    Farage jumping into the pocket of every millionaire he can find is not the same as running a competent political operation. Has anyone told the backers that the Local Election spending limit for the regulated period is £960 per candidate *, plus 8p per local government elector in the ward registered to vote. That makes it about 65k plus about 50k for the whole of Notts.

    I think they may turn out to be fissiparous, as his previous vehicles.

    * Not quite sure about multi-seat wards.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,457

    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Interesting that there are an apparent twice as many fascists among the young than in the above 65s. It is a relief that fascism is such a low percentage across all parties, even the Reform voters, though their populist nationalism might be described as fascism-lite.

    Quite a few Commies amongst the 18-24.

    One of Foxjr2's housemates is a communist.
    That's the age group for whom communism is an attractive theoretical concept rather than a horrific reality afflicting huge populations of the world.
    Sure but it doesn't bode well.
    No, I quite agree. I can explain but I can't approve.
    Even when communism existed, we were relatively equivocal in this country about its awfulness. I remember going to the museum of communism in Prague in the 90s, which pulled no punches about how evil and how useless the system was, and thinking how we just wouldn't be that direct in Britain. Communism always retained a bit of a cachet even during the worst years of it globally.
    I think it's simpler than romanticism.

    If young people feel no stake in society, even when they study and work hard, then expect a proportion to radicalise.

    People who feel failed by capitalism will look elsewhere for change.
    There is also, especially in America, the feeling that the new billionaire classes are not playing by the unwritten rules.
    Just wait a couple of years, and see what they’re feeling by then.
This discussion has been closed.