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It’s the economy, stupid – politicalbetting.com

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  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,269
    edited August 5
    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I'm not sure I agree with this. I think Starmer is relatively left wing - certainly compared with Blair - albeit with a strong law and order bent. I am not surprised the hedge fund capitalist types who have held roost in the Conservative Party in the past couple of decades don't like the new government.

    I do however think there is a seriousness and general competence in the new government that went missing in the Conservatives after the Brexit vote.
    It's early days, but I think those are the early signs.

    I find it interesting that this government's reaction to the riots feels much more based in legal threats that previous governments'. It feels very strongly; "We will get all the rioters and treat them to due process."

    There certainly appears to be zero attempt to cool the fervour by addressing the rioters' arguments. Which may be a good thing in the short and long term.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 11,972

    On topic: It's not just the stupid economy. For example, the issue of abortion is enormous in the US, now that regulation has been returned to the voters in the different states, from the court.

    And, here's a puzzle that Matt Ridley was unable to solve in "The Rational Optimist".
    He was discussing whether being richer makes you happier, and mentions this exception to his argument that it does: "Moreover, surprisingly, American women have become less happy in recent decades despite getting richer." (p. 27)
    (The book was published in 2010.)

    As far as I can tell, Ridley has no explanation of that exception, other than perhaps that Americans are weird.

    I have an explanation for that exception, but should warn you that it is politically incorrect.

    For most people once income/wealth is at a reasonably secure and comfortable level (for most countries, cultures and times that would be a pretty high level, but not for the UK or USA of now) getting richer still has very little power to make people happier as opposed to having more stuff.

    In materially comfortable circumstances happiness is much more linked to health, family, friendships, world view, mental disposition, and other things on which no price can possibly be put. No possible price can be put on most of the things that are important to me at this moment, having as I do for now that basic security and comfort.

    Interestingly more people seem to spotting this, hence the problem of so many workers going part time, retiring, leaving the work place, four day week and all that.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,269

    Andy_JS said:

    WillG said:

    I think it is about time we regulated Twitter in the UK:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-08-05/uk-says-musk-s-civil-war-is-inevitable-post-is-unjustified?leadSource=reddit_wall

    The mindset should be that websites are either publishers or platforms. If they are publishers, they are liable for speech on them. If they are platforms they should be regulated for neutrality.

    One person's neutrality is another person's partisanship.
    Musk is very far from any kind of neutrality, these days, endorsing Trump, and almost willing the UK into Aner6can-style polarisation, and chaos.

    Ban people like Lawrence Fox and Tommy Robinson, and regulate.
    Musk has been like this for quite a few years; he's just made it more visible now.

    I'm intrigued about what the driver, or drivers, for his behaviour is. Is it ego, financial, or political; or a combination?

    It's fairly obvious from his utterances that he wants women to be baby-breeding machines, which fits in well with the GOP's current agenda.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,112
    edited August 5
    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I think it needs a reframe for the contemporary world. Eg I consider myself a socialist but I wouldn't be arguing for the return of Clause 4. Perhaps somebody with a great brain and a suitably elevated set of core principles could write a 2024 equivalent of that famous Anthony Crosland book from 1956.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,496
    kinabalu said:

    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I think it needs a reframe for the contemporary world. Eg I consider myself a socialist but I wouldn't be arguing for the return of Clause 4. Perhaps somebody with a great brain and a suitably elevated set of core principles could write a 2024 equivalent of that famous Anthony Crosland book from 1956.
    You mean a book to explain how you can reconcile calling yourself a socialist while holding Thatcherite beliefs.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,006
    Leon said:

    It’s time to officially despair


    Labour are going to

    Bankrupt the economy
    Cancel all investment
    Give 3000% pay rises to all public sector workers
    Destroy the English education system
    Fail entirely on the boats
    Fail entirely on migration
    Bring in more hate speech legislation and online blah and infinite surveillance and all the rest
    Force us all to use pronouns
    Build ugly houses exactly where they are not needed
    Raise taxes on anyone who dares to work
    Actually torture people who start companies
    Do it all while sneering at us for being horrible British people


    Fuck this. Time to go, lads

    Why the fuck did you vote for it, then?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,112

    kinabalu said:

    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I think it needs a reframe for the contemporary world. Eg I consider myself a socialist but I wouldn't be arguing for the return of Clause 4. Perhaps somebody with a great brain and a suitably elevated set of core principles could write a 2024 equivalent of that famous Anthony Crosland book from 1956.
    You mean a book to explain how you can reconcile calling yourself a socialist while holding Thatcherite beliefs.
    No way I'd be reading that.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,454

    Leon said:

    It’s time to officially despair


    Labour are going to

    Bankrupt the economy
    Cancel all investment
    Give 3000% pay rises to all public sector workers
    Destroy the English education system
    Fail entirely on the boats
    Fail entirely on migration
    Bring in more hate speech legislation and online blah and infinite surveillance and all the rest
    Force us all to use pronouns
    Build ugly houses exactly where they are not needed
    Raise taxes on anyone who dares to work
    Actually torture people who start companies
    Do it all while sneering at us for being horrible British people


    Fuck this. Time to go, lads

    Why the fuck did you vote for it, then?
    Leon is a contrarian. He is entitled to vote for who he likes, even if the rationale behind that vote is to piss off a particular cohort.
  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Posts: 1,251

    Andy_JS said:

    WillG said:

    I think it is about time we regulated Twitter in the UK:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-08-05/uk-says-musk-s-civil-war-is-inevitable-post-is-unjustified?leadSource=reddit_wall

    The mindset should be that websites are either publishers or platforms. If they are publishers, they are liable for speech on them. If they are platforms they should be regulated for neutrality.

    One person's neutrality is another person's partisanship.
    Musk is very far from any kind of neutrality, these days, endorsing Trump, and almost willing the UK into Aner6can-style polarisation, and chaos.

    Ban people like Lawrence Fox and Tommy Robinson, and regulate.
    Musk has been like this for quite a few years; he's just made it more visible now.

    I'm intrigued about what the driver, or drivers, for his behaviour is. Is it ego, financial, or political; or a combination?

    It's fairly obvious from his utterances that he wants women to be baby-breeding machines, which fits in well with the GOP's current agenda.
    Isn't a lot of his behaviour rooted in having a trans-daughter, who he has now disowned?
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,625
    kinabalu said:

    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I think it needs a reframe for the contemporary world. Eg I consider myself a socialist but I wouldn't be arguing for the return of Clause 4. Perhaps somebody with a great brain and a suitably elevated set of core principles could write a 2024 equivalent of that famous Anthony Crosland book from 1956.
    I used to describe myself as a "socialist" in the form of being a "democratic socialist". There isn't exactly a handbook which states the boundaries are of any of these descriptions. And even Labour voting working class socialists are often the hardest of right wing hard liners on law & order etc.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,498
    Sandpit said:

    So who had “kayak cross” as a potential British medal?

    Fond memories of its a knockout?
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 2,970

    Leon said:

    It’s time to officially despair


    Labour are going to

    Bankrupt the economy
    Cancel all investment
    Give 3000% pay rises to all public sector workers
    Destroy the English education system
    Fail entirely on the boats
    Fail entirely on migration
    Bring in more hate speech legislation and online blah and infinite surveillance and all the rest
    Force us all to use pronouns
    Build ugly houses exactly where they are not needed
    Raise taxes on anyone who dares to work
    Actually torture people who start companies
    Do it all while sneering at us for being horrible British people


    Fuck this. Time to go, lads

    Why the fuck did you vote for it, then?
    Only a month has passed since the election and the media are already bored. A guy who works as a professional tourist wouldn't know this, but getting stuff done is hard and takes a lot longer than 25 working days.
    I didn't vote for them, but calling Chicken Licken on this government so soon is ridiculous (and also explains why a government led by columnists like Johnson and Gove made such an utter Horlicks of things).
    It is so stupid it basically calls into question anything you say about any thing. So take a couple of Valium and go write up another article on the toilet habits of Turks or whatever while nursing an agreeable red.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,454

    kinabalu said:

    stodge said:

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Having taken legal advice.

    Anybody who seeks to glorify, excuse/condone etc the current riots will be banned from PB.

    Anybody who posts locations of upcoming disorder will meet a similar fate.

    These are in the first of a series of steps we are taking to protect PB.

    Why do you need legal advice?

    Stepping on twats comments is what comment moderators are for. OGH’s site, OGH’s rules.
    I was a little concerned by some of the comments in legal circles that said there is potentially a strict liability offence when it comes to this topic even if the person is posting in good faith.
    Usual heavy Labour authoritarianism

    nothing new
    Do you ever take lunch or a comfort break? The tedious posts appear relentless.
    Im here regularly to depress you about the state of the idiots you have elected.

    Even better since I'm one of the older posters it's deja vu all over again. I have a huge amount of recyclable material from the dying days of the last Labour government and all dates forwards.

    Amazingly I can target the same prats who screwed it up the last time - Cooper, Miliband Reeves while also having fun with the Likes of Lammy a man who couldnt spell IQ.

    So cheer up 5 years of this and not a Rishi helicopter joke in sight.
    It is somewhat bizarre that the more partisan labour supporters here, after relentlessly bashing Tory govts seem a little miffed when Tory supporters do it when the boot is on the other foot.

    what would they expect ?
    The interesting thing is many of the current generation or regurgitation of anti-Labour posters didn't fall over themselves to defend the last Conservative Government. At least @HYUFD and a few others died in the ditch with Sunak and Hunt.

    Some of the anti-Labour posters seem to have no other aganda than to be anti-Labour (they aren't pro-Conservative or pro-LD or even pro-Reform) just completely anti-Labour. Even if the new Government implemented Conservative policies, they'd probably be criticised.
    A propos from Conservative Home:


    Do you miss us yet?

    That might be a little presumptuous, a month after our party went down to its worst defeat in 300-odd years. But in the 32 days in which Keir Starmer has occupied Number 10, Labour have proved even more abysmal than I expected. My hopes of a Tory victory in 2029 have risen precipitously.

    A tad over-optimistic? We do not yet know who our next leader will be. We still have three months of blame-shifting and name-calling to go. We remain hated and will be for a very long time. Starmer (well, Sue Gray) has that 170-seat (ish) majority to play with. Labour have five years to ban, build, and bully. If they so wished, they have a perfect opportunity to finish us off for good.

    But come on. After one month under socialism, can anyone, except the most delusional Rest is Politics groupie, say that this government looks impressive? One doesn’t have to think the dying days of the Rishi Sunak Führerbunker were edifying to think life under Starmer is already worse


    https://conservativehome.com/2024/08/05/do-you-miss-us-yet/
    They would say that, wouldn't they?

    Have we had "socialism" since July 5th? I hadn't noticed - indeed it's interesting to see Conservative voters have warmed to Starmer as Labour and LD voters have cooled. One might almost argue the Conservatives are still in power - just the names and faces have changed.

    I suspect Starmer and Reeves don't "do" socialism. They probably don't know what it means - I'm not sure many do.
    I think it needs a reframe for the contemporary world. Eg I consider myself a socialist but I wouldn't be arguing for the return of Clause 4. Perhaps somebody with a great brain and a suitably elevated set of core principles could write a 2024 equivalent of that famous Anthony Crosland book from 1956.
    You mean a book to explain how you can reconcile calling yourself a socialist while holding Thatcherite beliefs.
    I liked the sequel, William Glenn 's seminal work, Confessions of a Trumpian Remainer.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,891
    edited August 5

    Andy_JS said:

    WillG said:

    I think it is about time we regulated Twitter in the UK:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-08-05/uk-says-musk-s-civil-war-is-inevitable-post-is-unjustified?leadSource=reddit_wall

    The mindset should be that websites are either publishers or platforms. If they are publishers, they are liable for speech on them. If they are platforms they should be regulated for neutrality.

    One person's neutrality is another person's partisanship.
    Musk is very far from any kind of neutrality, these days, endorsing Trump, and almost willing the UK into Aner6can-style polarisation, and chaos.

    Ban people like Lawrence Fox and Tommy Robinson, and regulate.
    Musk has been like this for quite a few years; he's just made it more visible now.

    I'm intrigued about what the driver, or drivers, for his behaviour is. Is it ego, financial, or political; or a combination?

    It's fairly obvious from his utterances that he wants women to be baby-breeding machines, which fits in well with the GOP's current agenda.
    He was seen as relatively cool and admirable by many people until the last few years. Yes that is mostly down to him being more open about his politics, but he could have been super rich, powerful, and well liked without going down the route he has. He's still popular with plenty of people, but not as broadly as he used to be.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,269

    Andy_JS said:

    WillG said:

    I think it is about time we regulated Twitter in the UK:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-08-05/uk-says-musk-s-civil-war-is-inevitable-post-is-unjustified?leadSource=reddit_wall

    The mindset should be that websites are either publishers or platforms. If they are publishers, they are liable for speech on them. If they are platforms they should be regulated for neutrality.

    One person's neutrality is another person's partisanship.
    Musk is very far from any kind of neutrality, these days, endorsing Trump, and almost willing the UK into Aner6can-style polarisation, and chaos.

    Ban people like Lawrence Fox and Tommy Robinson, and regulate.
    Musk has been like this for quite a few years; he's just made it more visible now.

    I'm intrigued about what the driver, or drivers, for his behaviour is. Is it ego, financial, or political; or a combination?

    It's fairly obvious from his utterances that he wants women to be baby-breeding machines, which fits in well with the GOP's current agenda.
    Isn't a lot of his behaviour rooted in having a trans-daughter, who he has now disowned?
    No.
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