Dropping big ideas suddenly in an election campaign does have a precedent. See Theresa May's splendid success following this approach.
Mr Dancer, Theresa May’s bombshell idea at least had the virtue of trying to answer a well defined problem. I’m not sure what problem Sunak thinks he’s identified that this policy solves.
It actually was a good policy for funding Social Care.
I defended it on here at the time.
Yup, I didn’t think it was a bad way of solving that issue. This National Service policy is cuckoo.
In a Tory q&a about today's policy - they don't rule out arresting people if they don't take up national service. They talk about the commission exploring an "appropriate incentives regime".
Earlier this week - don't arrest criminals. By the weekend - arrest what will be tens of thousands of teenagers protesting about national service.
I see Rishi has really got under the skin of his opponents with his National Service policy.
Perhaps they doth protest too much.
It's not just his opponents though, this time.
I have a plan! And here's the back of a fag packet that I wrote it on.
For all sorts of reasons encouraging civic duty is to be lauded. We are possibly on the cusp of WW3 so mobilising a reservist army might make sense.
But this is just knee jerk backs against the wall stuff. Rishi " what can we do next?" Dowden "reintroduce conscription!". Jenrick "strafe the boats". Braverman "execute socialist traitors, and anyone else I don't like". It's all just performative nonsense.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
But not positively.
If he took a televised dump on Downing Street that took would elicit a talking point, but not in a good way.
The good thing is we don’t actually have to spend all morning debating “good idea”/“bad idea”. There will be polling. Within days. Anyone who thinks this is a vote-winning idea is free to adjust their betting position accordingly.
I think this is analogous to climate change mitigation. Everyone is broadly supportive, but when it's you or your family paying the costs, it suddenly feels like the imposition of an authoritarian regime.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
The idea with this is that (a) it shocks and captures attention (b) it is disproportionately and unreasonably attacked and, then, (c) the Tories can spend days politely pointing out it's nowhere near as "bad" as people said it was, thus making them look as cool as cucumbers and their opponents look ridiculous, and not on top of the detail, whilst it dominates multiple newscycles for days.
This policy will have been focus grouped and tested to death first, and those people don't all sit up in troll farms overnight.
The Dementia Tax says hi, again
Wasn't focus grouped. Theresa May didn't talk to or confide in anyone.
We only found that out afterwards. Very likely to be true of Rishi too. I think he has gone rogue and the calling of the election was a "f*** you" to his party for wanting rid of him
From the Sunday Shipman,
Some of those summoned, knowing an election was on the cards, were delighted the prime minister had finally decided to consult senior elected politicians, many of whom think their political touch is defter than Sunak’s. Here was the “kitchen cabinet” off which to bounce ideas they had long suggested he set up.
Then Sunak said: “I have been to see the King. This is my decision. I’ll explain it to you and then, when we go next door, I’ll call on you to speak and I want you to back me.”
Far from a consultation exercise, this was a private rubber-stamping of a decision already made...
An email I just received from someone centre ground, 70 years old, a Daily Telegraph reader as it happens:
'I have been hearing as well about the tories' plans for young people and some form of compulsory national service. With the Rwandan scheme as well I have to say both are ridiculous and not thought out and a disgrace, Thoroughly nasty and I sincerely hope the General Election sees the back of them. And I do not see them in power in my remaining life time. Quite the most disagreeable government and party in power I have ever seen.'
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
Agreed. I think it's because of the quote @Heathener posted from Callaghan yesterday, to the effect that this is a once-in-a-generation change election.
I think people have written off the Tories and therefore see something like this through the prism of 'everything this government does is useless'.
This is a poor idea, but doesn't merit this level of opprobrium imo
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It's Ian Dunt.
The fact he's so angry tells you he's worried that on some level it might work.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It's Ian Dunt.
The fact he's so angry tells you he's worried that on some level it might work.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It's Ian Dunt.
The fact he's so angry tells you he's worried that on some level it might work.
I mean, all of this needs supervision. And training.
And neither supervision nor training is something our Government will be prepared to pay for.
Pure kneejerk dog whistling. A policy that could never be implemented.
Hence perfect for this dishonest, stale, backward looking Government.
As I posted last night, this proposal is gift week for Tory spivs. We would need to manage these compulsory volunteers. Ensure they turn up. Find them something to do. And that is Good News if you a Tory.
The party handed out £107m contracts without tender to companies founded days earlier by Tories. No questions asked and in many cases no usable PPE supplied.
The National Service scheme will hand out literal billions in management fees. All disappearing into the right people’s pockets as this corrupt party once again finds a way to line the pockets of its friends and patrons with our money.
People will set up all sorts of volunteering opportunities. If you “donate” some extra money, Tarquin and Araminta will be able to do their volunteering by playing a sponsored polo match.
I see Rishi has really got under the skin of his opponents with his National Service policy.
Perhaps they doth protest too much.
It's not just his opponents though, this time.
I have a plan! And here's the back of a fag packet that I wrote it on.
For all sorts of reasons encouraging civic duty is to be lauded. We are possibly on the cusp of WW3 so mobilising a reservist army might make sense.
But this is just knee jerk backs against the wall stuff. Rishi " what can we do next?" Dowden "reintroduce conscription!". Jenrick "strafe the boats". Braverman "execute socialist traitors, and anyone else I don't like". It's all just performative nonsense.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
But not positively.
If he took a televised dump on Downing Street that took would elicit a talking point, but not in a good way.
Heathener takes an Internet dump on here every morning. Strangely, though, she doesn't have much success in eliciting talking points.
This policy will have been focus grouped and tested to death first, and those people don't all sit up in troll farms overnight.
The Dementia Tax says hi, again
Wasn't focus grouped. Theresa May didn't talk to or confide in anyone.
We only found that out afterwards. Very likely to be true of Rishi too. I think he has gone rogue and the calling of the election was a "f*** you" to his party for wanting rid of him
From the Sunday Shipman,
Some of those summoned, knowing an election was on the cards, were delighted the prime minister had finally decided to consult senior elected politicians, many of whom think their political touch is defter than Sunak’s. Here was the “kitchen cabinet” off which to bounce ideas they had long suggested he set up.
Then Sunak said: “I have been to see the King. This is my decision. I’ll explain it to you and then, when we go next door, I’ll call on you to speak and I want you to back me.”
Far from a consultation exercise, this was a private rubber-stamping of a decision already made...
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Community volunteering already exists. There are various programmes. Those could be expanded. It isn’t until 2029 anyway and it is never going to happen. The Tories will be sub 200 MPs in 6 weeks.
I see Rishi has really got under the skin of his opponents with his National Service policy.
Perhaps they doth protest too much.
It's not just his opponents though, this time.
I have a plan! And here's the back of a fag packet that I wrote it on.
For all sorts of reasons encouraging civic duty is to be lauded. We are possibly on the cusp of WW3 so mobilising a reservist army might make sense.
But this is just knee jerk backs against the wall stuff. Rishi " what can we do next?" Dowden "reintroduce conscription!". Jenrick "strafe the boats". Braverman "execute socialist traitors, and anyone else I don't like". It's all just performative nonsense.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
But not positively.
If he took a televised dump on Downing Street that took would elicit a talking point, but not in a good way.
You just know something would go wrong as well, probably he couldn't get the flush to work.
The idea with this is that (a) it shocks and captures attention (b) it is disproportionately and unreasonably attacked and, then, (c) the Tories can spend days politely pointing out it's nowhere near as "bad" as people said it was, thus making them look as cool as cucumbers and their opponents look ridiculous, and not on top of the detail, whilst it dominates multiple newscycles for days.
That'll do them nicely.
It's like you announce the new signature dish of your restaurant is turd risotto, then spend days pointing out it's actually turd, mushroom and lentil risotto. This makes the restaurant critics look really silly and gets customers queueing round the block.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
They’d rather be in Ibiza
There were nearly 4 months between me finishing A-levels and starting university.
Few can afford spending that long in Ibiza.
There are some that cannot afford not working for 5 weeks.
And yet five weeks earlier they could whilst in full-time compulsory education?
I'd expect this to be funded, even though the details aren't there yet.
Your last sentence, in a nutshell, is why this won't work in the way you hope it will.
Labour are being painfully, painfully careful to pepper every interaction with voters with caution over what we can afford.
Because the economy will dominate everything this election.
The Tories throw an utterly uncosted policy into the mix and gift Labour another few points on relative economic competence, nay relative competence at all.
What will stick after this idea sinks from the headlines is that there is only one serious party of government on offer. The other has morphed into a protest movement to bring back the past.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
Everyone is saying "WTF is that idiot doing. This is by some stretch the dumbest fucking idea in Christendom"
All Labour has to say is "We don't think this is a good idea"
And the public agree with them
No, you're campaigning for Labour and see it as your duty to attack anything the Conservatives say, do or think for the next 6 weeks.
There's absolutely nothing they could say, do or think that you'd give them credit for. At all.
Pot, meet kettle.
Discuss colour swatches for a few moments.
I don't think it's any secret that I'm a Conservative supporter and I'm going to be both campaigning and voting for them.
I said I wouldn’t respond to anything you post over this campaign but I will just point out that I’m not campaigning for Labour or any other party. Yes I will vote Labour this time but I don’t think they’re anywhere near perfect. Just less imperfect than the current lot.
I think it’s really good to be able to keep some impartiality, especially when betting and when influencing others to bet. None of us achieve that, of course, but it’s good to be able to take a step back from time to time. You may be right that simply commanding the agenda today has been good for the Conservative cause. I personally doubt that and I think they’re going to lose more support from this, but we will see as the opinion polls roll out.
Thank you to @maxh for picking up on that Callaghan quote from yesterday. As you say, Callaghan’s point was that when the country is in a once in a generation sea-change, nothing you say or do will make a difference.
I see Rishi has really got under the skin of his opponents with his National Service policy.
Perhaps they doth protest too much.
It's not just his opponents though, this time.
I have a plan! And here's the back of a fag packet that I wrote it on.
For all sorts of reasons encouraging civic duty is to be lauded. We are possibly on the cusp of WW3 so mobilising a reservist army might make sense.
But this is just knee jerk backs against the wall stuff. Rishi " what can we do next?" Dowden "reintroduce conscription!". Jenrick "strafe the boats". Braverman "execute socialist traitors, and anyone else I don't like". It's all just performative nonsense.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
But not positively.
If he took a televised dump on Downing Street that took would elicit a talking point, but not in a good way.
Heathener takes an Internet dump on here every morning. Strangely, though, she doesn't have much success in eliciting talking points.
Except derision.
For impact it has to be visual. If a poster used their one per 24 hour photo as an illustration I suspect it would get our attention and a ban.
Trying to be objective on the political implications of the policy or a moment:
- On one hand, it will be popular with the Boomer Tory/Reform voting contingent. I can imagine an uptick in Tory support from this contingent, which is their core vote now.
- On the other hand, young people (including Millennials in their 30s and 40s with kids under 18) will hate this policy. It is stupid and the compulsory nature could drive higher turnout against the Tories in a tactical voting kind of way: hold your nose and vote for who is the best opposition in your area.
I'm not sure which effect will be greater. But it comes across as desperate in any case.
If it's only unpopular with people who'd never vote for you in the first place, it's arguably good politics.
Many of those millennials do, or did, vote Tory before. I have. Writing them off as forever lost, and making that a self fulfulling prophecy, is the opposite of good politics.
It's also an amazing way to signal "We don't care about anyone young enough to have grandkids affected by the policy". Utter idiocy. I can see it being popular with a certain type of baby boomer, like the various red-faced sunlounger posters on here, but in the country? Can't see it going down as well as he thinks. If it was part of a coherent narrative it might work. But what narrative is there other than "I'm bloody desperate and I have no sane ideas?".
How else do we defend the nation against Putin and Xi?
Nukes. We have nukes.
How is the meat grinder working out for Ukraine and Russia?
When we're already under replacement levels, is sending our nation's youth off to die in some foreign war really a good idea?
It won't be a foreign war, you ridiculous cretin
Is Ukraine "a foreign war"? Maybe to you, because you are dim. I've been there, it is part of Europe, and they are at war, and it is absolutely not foreign
Poland understands this; we will too, in time
You're the one who keeps banging on about immigrants. Sending an entire generation off to die more or less ensures the British way of life gets wiped out within a generation anyway.
So the best bet for Britain is to pull up the drawbridge, and promise mutually assured destruction to anyone threatening our country.
Or do you reckon British youth are really going to be prepared to pick up a rifle and fight and die if Putin pushes on into Slovakia?
Britain won't go to war until it's existential. And by the time it's existential for us, it's time to roll out Trident, not a bunch of spotty faced teens with army surplus SA-80s.
If you think we will 'roll out Trident' to protect us from invasion (or threaten a state that intends to invade us) you've misunderstood the use of Trident totally.
They might well have been brought up on Commando comics and airfix models but it doesn't mean that they wanted to be conscripted.
All children to spend 4 weekends a year building an Airfix Spitfire and painting it.
I actually bought an Airfix Gloster Meteor the other day.
Fucking terrible kit even though it's a 2016 tooling, throw it in the bin. Quality is hit or miss on them. Fine if you've got a hit, but you probably haven't.
The idea with this is that (a) it shocks and captures attention (b) it is disproportionately and unreasonably attacked and, then, (c) the Tories can spend days politely pointing out it's nowhere near as "bad" as people said it was, thus making them look as cool as cucumbers and their opponents look ridiculous, and not on top of the detail, whilst it dominates multiple newscycles for days.
That'll do them nicely.
I thought the most interesting thing about the policy announcement was in words.
Starmer likes to talk about becoming PM, and Labour forming the next government, as acts of service. He wants to create the idea that his motivation is selfless, that he aims to become a servant of the people, rather than their master. And he hopes this will create a contrast with the Tories who are more obviously only in it for personal aggrandisement.
The word "service", however, it's now most associated with the Tory plan to bring back National Service. Forget whether it's a good policy or not, Starmer cannot now talk in positive terms about his desire to become PM as a selfless act of service, without it triggering associations with Tory policy.
Expect an eye-catching Tory policy, one to rile up the journalists on twitter, that will somehow appropriate the word mission. Pretty soon Starmer will have to rewrite his entire campaigning phrasebook.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
Everyone is saying "WTF is that idiot doing. This is by some stretch the dumbest fucking idea in Christendom"
All Labour has to say is "We don't think this is a good idea"
And the public agree with them
No, you're campaigning for Labour and see it as your duty to attack anything the Conservatives say, do or think for the next 6 weeks.
There's absolutely nothing they could say, do or think that you'd give them credit for. At all.
Pot, meet kettle.
Discuss colour swatches for a few moments.
I don't think it's any secret that I'm a Conservative supporter and I'm going to be both campaigning and voting for them.
And that is an admirable thing as that is what you believe in. Truly. Politics needs people who go out and participate.
But supporting your team is not the same as your team definitely being the best. Set aside your personal position and look at things dispassionately.
Its been a terrible campaign so far. Of an election imposed on the cabinet without consultation and a party not remotely ready to fight it. With gift after gift handed to the media to make Sunak and the party look like idiots.
And now this.
"Only the Tories have a Plan" / cf "Bring back National Service paid for but gutting levelling up".
The best liked comments on the Mail article say - with evidence - that its Fucking Mental. You think Labour have 3k+ moles planting likes? These are your voters. And even they think its mental. Because it IS mental.
So I understand. Mental or not, its your team and you support them to the last. I entirely respect that. But we don't need the pretence of "hey everyone, isn't this a splendid idea?" Because you are better than that.
And the big policy for the day-three campaign relaunch is… national service? Which the Defence Secretary dismissed as “nonsense” only in January?
There has been much ink spilled, since the advent of New Labour, about the decline of Cabinet government. But it’s hard to think of a clearer example of the very opposite, government by bunker, than we have seen in the past year. The headline conference policies, like the election, were cooked up secretly in Downing Street – and like they election, they were botch jobs.
Now the same thing is playing out again. What would be the consequences if an 18-year-old refused national service? We can hardly send them to prison, not whilst ministers are having to extend early release programmes. Even if Conservative candidates support national service in principle, they need and deserve answers to those questions, and a fully worked-out policy.
Because how long will it be before this, too, implodes? Before people realise that only five per cent of 18-year-olds could even do the military component, and not a single one in a combat role (even if they wanted to), or that it’s funded by scrapping the levelling up money.
Maybe it will peel a couple of percentage points off Reform UK’s. But as I have written elsewhere, in the medium term Reform’s prospects aren’t amazing.
The long-term challenge for the Party is going to be regaining the trust of all those generations (broadly, the under-50s) who have abandoned the party over its failures on issues such as housing, childcare, and the cost of living. Some of those voters may well recall the promise to conscript them, or their children, long after the immediate threat of Reform UK has faded.
Nostalgia for a lost golden era of British politics is usually unhelpful, even where it is not misinformed. But it is increasingly clear that the withering of the Party as an institution has reached the point where it is self-destructive.
You searching the Internet for comments by anonymous Internet users that confirm what you already want to believe proves nothing.
This policy will have been focus grouped and tested to death first, and those people don't all sit up in troll farms overnight.
Henry Hill, Deputy Editor of ConservativeHome is an anonymous Internet user?
Incidentally, I read that "lets ban computers" is part of Sunak's Bold Action strategy.
Apparently, The Plan includes dropping in things from very left field with zero notice. That just happen to dogwhistle the remaining 12 people who will vote Tory.
Lets consider what other Bold Action policies we can look forward to over the next few weeks:
Chain-gangs for the so-called disabled The Birch in our schools and a ban on sex education Solve the prison crisis by walling off places like Middlesbrough and turning them into a gulag. A flat tax Raise the voting threshold to Additional Rate taxpayers only
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
They’d rather be in Ibiza
There were nearly 4 months between me finishing A-levels and starting university.
Few can afford spending that long in Ibiza.
There are some that cannot afford not working for 5 weeks.
And yet five weeks earlier they could whilst in full-time compulsory education?
I'd expect this to be funded, even though the details aren't there yet.
Your last sentence, in a nutshell, is why this won't work in the way you hope it will.
Labour are being painfully, painfully careful to pepper every interaction with voters with caution over what we can afford.
Because the economy will dominate everything this election.
The Tories throw an utterly uncosted policy into the mix and gift Labour another few points on relative economic competence, nay relative competence at all.
What will stick after this idea sinks from the headlines is that there is only one serious party of government on offer. The other has morphed into a protest movement to bring back the past.
It's paid for by scrapping one of the levelling-up funds that was created to replace the regional development funding that came from the EU.
So they'll be paying southern management consultants to organise the slave labour of northern teenagers with the money that should have paid for improved northern infrastructure. Now we just have to see whether the northern oldsters will vote for it.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
I don't think "outrage" is an appropriate term to use. There is resignation from some Conservatives of "is this the best we can come up with?" And when your target audience like Lozza Fox view it with contemptuous ridicule, it might just be a miss.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
They’d rather be in Ibiza
There were nearly 4 months between me finishing A-levels and starting university.
Few can afford spending that long in Ibiza.
There are some that cannot afford not working for 5 weeks.
And yet five weeks earlier they could whilst in full-time compulsory education?
I'd expect this to be funded, even though the details aren't there yet.
Your last sentence, in a nutshell, is why this won't work in the way you hope it will.
Labour are being painfully, painfully careful to pepper every interaction with voters with caution over what we can afford.
Because the economy will dominate everything this election.
The Tories throw an utterly uncosted policy into the mix and gift Labour another few points on relative economic competence, nay relative competence at all.
What will stick after this idea sinks from the headlines is that there is only one serious party of government on offer. The other has morphed into a protest movement to bring back the past.
The Tories don't need to cost in the same way Labour do.
Just like the Tories don't need to prove they care about national security.
They might well have been brought up on Commando comics and airfix models but it doesn't mean that they wanted to be conscripted.
All children to spend 4 weekends a year building an Airfix Spitfire and painting it.
I actually bought an Airfix Gloster Meteor the other day.
Fucking terrible kit even though it's a 2016 tooling, throw it in the bin. Quality is hit or miss on them. Fine if you've got a hit, but you probably haven't.
Conscription ended nearly 70 years ago, and if the UK's military capability has been run down, it is mostly the result of recent, massively damaging policies enacted by.,.. checks notes... The Tory party.
It is true that the Tories have cut defence spending too low, but the bulk of the cuts that have done the harm occured before their recent period of power.
UK defence spending was about 4% in 1990. Basically double where it is today. Even when Labour came to power in 1997 we were still spending nearly 3%. It has been up and down between about 2.0-2.5% through the last couple of decades. It's that whole "peace dividend" and "swords into ploughshares" after the Berlin Wall came down that has screwed us, it was a strategic mistake by Labour and Conservative governments, and was mirrored in almost all European countries. Even with UK military action in Iraq and Afghanistan only modest increases in spending occurred. Almost every European government in the last 30 or so years has been trying to do defence on the cheap.
Times leader today Rishi Sunak’s rain-spattered announcement of a July general election was drearily befitting of a government more than 20 points behind in the polls. The spoils that await the victor include a near-record NHS waiting list, an education system still reeling from Covid and an economy producing anaemic growth. But Sunak was right to call the election, even if he ends up falling short. Britain has been drifting for eight years, since the Brexit vote that unleashed demons within the Tory party and hobbled the economy.
And, yet, everyone is talking about him and the Conservatives today, and not Labour, and it will force the latter to respond.
That'll do him nicely.
Everyone is saying "WTF is that idiot doing. This is by some stretch the dumbest fucking idea in Christendom"
All Labour has to say is "We don't think this is a good idea"
And the public agree with them
No, you're campaigning for Labour and see it as your duty to attack anything the Conservatives say, do or think for the next 6 weeks.
There's absolutely nothing they could say, do or think that you'd give them credit for. At all.
Pot, meet kettle.
Discuss colour swatches for a few moments.
I don't think it's any secret that I'm a Conservative supporter and I'm going to be both campaigning and voting for them.
And that is an admirable thing as that is what you believe in. Truly. Politics needs people who go out and participate.
But supporting your team is not the same as your team definitely being the best. Set aside your personal position and look at things dispassionately.
Its been a terrible campaign so far. Of an election imposed on the cabinet without consultation and a party not remotely ready to fight it. With gift after gift handed to the media to make Sunak and the party look like idiots.
And now this.
"Only the Tories have a Plan" / cf "Bring back National Service paid for but gutting levelling up".
The best liked comments on the Mail article say - with evidence - that its Fucking Mental. You think Labour have 3k+ moles planting likes? These are your voters. And even they think its mental. Because it IS mental.
So I understand. Mental or not, its your team and you support them to the last. I entirely respect that. But we don't need the pretence of "hey everyone, isn't this a splendid idea?" Because you are better than that.
The Conservatives have won elections after awful campaigns before, so it would be folly to write them off even after the first chaotic week, but this does feel different, something of the clueless advising the hopeless. However that has inherent dangers for the rest of us. Spewing out mad cap scheme after mad cap scheme at some stage might elicit something like Brexit ( maybe capital sentencing) . Something the voter feels they might like now and would vote for and later regret that choice when it is seen to have gone horribly wrong in years to come.
I mean, all of this needs supervision. And training.
And neither supervision nor training is something our Government will be prepared to pay for.
Pure kneejerk dog whistling. A policy that could never be implemented.
Hence perfect for this dishonest, stale, backward looking Government.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Army would oppose this. Last thing it needs is a bunch of reluctant recruits.
Military service will be voluntary. The reluctant ones will be doing the compulsory alternative service, like in the NHS. So you should say: I think the NHS would oppose this. Last thing it needs is a bunch of reluctant recruits.
The idea with this is that (a) it shocks and captures attention (b) it is disproportionately and unreasonably attacked and, then, (c) the Tories can spend days politely pointing out it's nowhere near as "bad" as people said it was, thus making them look as cool as cucumbers and their opponents look ridiculous, and not on top of the detail, whilst it dominates multiple newscycles for days.
That'll do them nicely.
The shitposting tactic, and not in the tiny mint sense.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
The idea with this is that (a) it shocks and captures attention (b) it is disproportionately and unreasonably attacked and, then, (c) the Tories can spend days politely pointing out it's nowhere near as "bad" as people said it was, thus making them look as cool as cucumbers and their opponents look ridiculous, and not on top of the detail, whilst it dominates multiple newscycles for days.
That'll do them nicely.
The shitposting tactic, and not in the tiny mint sense.
Labour fall for shitposting every time. People are reacting like Pavlovian dogs to the words "National Service" to give prominence to a couple of anodyne policies about military skills training and what will probably turn out to be a watered-down version of the Duke of Edinburgh awards.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Are you on the list for one of the 190 vacancies HY? If not put your name forward.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Well, if so, then they will be out of government indefinitely. I think, btw, you may be right, but the patience of the voters for this juvenile and irresponsible politics is not limitless, so I think you'd better find your Cameron analogue quicker than last time.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Well, if so, then they will be out of government indefinitely. I think, btw, you may be right, but the patience of the voters for this juvenile and irresponsible politics is not limitless, so I think you'd better find your Cameron analogue quicker than last time.
In theory, they ought to be somewhere in the Conservative ecosystem already- SPADing or preparing to stand in a hopeless seat. Like Dave was in the Major years.
But whilst there are right wing voices in touch with the reality of Britain in the mid 2020s (look for Yimbies) they aren't touching the Conservative party with a bargepole.
The most significant thing Boris did was his following out of Conservative centrists, so that Sunak and Hunt are seen as wets. It looks like being a long road back.
Unemployment is down since 2010 though as is inflation
Also real wages.
To get growth in real wages there needs to be productivity increases.
Which is something the UK - and pretty much all the developed world - has struggled with for the last twenty years.
One of the various reasons being an increase in the proportion of jobs in lower skilled and consequently lower paid sectors - baristas get paid less than barristers.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Well, if so, then they will be out of government indefinitely. I think, btw, you may be right, but the patience of the voters for this juvenile and irresponsible politics is not limitless, so I think you'd better find your Cameron analogue quicker than last time.
In theory, they ought to be somewhere in the Conservative ecosystem already- SPADing or preparing to stand in a hopeless seat. Like Dave was in the Major years.
But whilst there are right wing voices in touch with the reality of Britain in the mid 2020s (look for Yimbies) they aren't touching the Conservative party with a bargepole.
The most significant thing Boris did was his following out of Conservative centrists, so that Sunak and Hunt are seen as wets. It looks like being a long road back.
Yet it was your 'Conservative centrists' who tripled university tuition fees at the same time as introducing triple lock pensions.
While since the 'throwing out of the Conservative centrists' university tuition fees have been frozen and full employment achieved.
And as I've mentioned previously there has likely never been a time with better opportunities to be young, northern and working class than what we have now.
The situation is much more complex than any standard, London focussed, political spectrum viewpoint.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Well, if so, then they will be out of government indefinitely. I think, btw, you may be right, but the patience of the voters for this juvenile and irresponsible politics is not limitless, so I think you'd better find your Cameron analogue quicker than last time.
Depends largely how a Labour government performs on the economy. Many though Thatcher an unelectable rightwinger when she became Tory leader in 1975 but strikes and inflation and an unproductive economy saw her defeat the Labour government and win a Conservative victory in 1979
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Are you on the list for one of the 190 vacancies HY? If not put your name forward.
No and not on the approved candidates list either so I can't
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Are you on the list for one of the 190 vacancies HY? If not put your name forward.
No and not on the approved candidates list either so I can't
Bloody hell HY. What do you have to do to get on the approved candidate list? Try Wales. there can't have been much due diligence when selecting Jamie Wallace or Rob Roberts.
If it's too late for you this time in England, put your name down for the Vale of Glamorgan in 2029. Cairns is going to get creamed in 5 weeks time.
Indeed. Most would simply spend 5 weeks doing that in the summer holidays after their A-levels.
Not a big deal.
I find the outrage of the likes of Ian Dunt to be bizarre. People simply have not read the detail. It’s not going to be like ‘Get Some In’. In a way it’s similar to the big society.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
It isn’t outrage. It’s more mockery. That ridiculous unworkable ideas get pulled out of thin air and promoted because someone in CCHQ thinks it will play well with the Bufton-Tuftons. Thick of it politics in plain sight. We’re talking about a scheme that would need to accommodate 750k kids a year! I’m sure each police station is going to love 500 stroppy teenagers wandering around the control room and photocopying their arse.
Mockery, bafflement and sadness.
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Sunak and Hunt are the centre ground in today's Tory party. If they lose the party will shift further to the right
Well, if so, then they will be out of government indefinitely. I think, btw, you may be right, but the patience of the voters for this juvenile and irresponsible politics is not limitless, so I think you'd better find your Cameron analogue quicker than last time.
In theory, they ought to be somewhere in the Conservative ecosystem already- SPADing or preparing to stand in a hopeless seat. Like Dave was in the Major years.
But whilst there are right wing voices in touch with the reality of Britain in the mid 2020s (look for Yimbies) they aren't touching the Conservative party with a bargepole.
The most significant thing Boris did was his following out of Conservative centrists, so that Sunak and Hunt are seen as wets. It looks like being a long road back.
Yet it was your 'Conservative centrists' who tripled university tuition fees at the same time as introducing triple lock pensions.
While since the 'throwing out of the Conservative centrists' university tuition fees have been frozen and full employment achieved.
And as I've mentioned previously there has likely never been a time with better opportunities to be young, northern and working class than what we have now.
The situation is much more complex than any standard, London focussed, political spectrum viewpoint.
Have you been watching Sunak's Party Political Broadcasts again?
I don't believe being young in 2024 United Kingdom is an easy ask at all. I have two very well qualified sons who are living on scraps rather than living the dream. If you want them to use their engineering degree and journalism masters (distinction) from the prestigious Cardiff School of Journalism to drive vans for Amazon, yes the World (or rather CF and SA postcodes) is their oyster.
Comments
By the weekend - arrest what will be tens of thousands of teenagers protesting about national service.
Commanding the agenda that day doesn’t de facto make it a good day for you.
It can just make you look and sound like a fool.
If he took a televised dump on Downing Street that took would elicit a talking point, but not in a good way.
Few can afford spending that long in Ibiza.
Discuss colour swatches for a few moments.
There are lessons here for the left.
As I say, I do not agree with it or support it. It should be truly voluntary. But the outrage about is odd.
That'll do them nicely.
Some of those summoned, knowing an election was on the cards, were delighted the prime minister had finally decided to consult senior elected politicians, many of whom think their political touch is defter than Sunak’s. Here was the “kitchen cabinet” off which to bounce ideas they had long suggested he set up.
Then Sunak said: “I have been to see the King. This is my decision. I’ll explain it to you and then, when we go next door, I’ll call on you to speak and I want you to back me.”
Far from a consultation exercise, this was a private rubber-stamping of a decision already made...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cbe26cf8-5aee-4fc2-bcd3-e281242ca8ce?shareToken=98ba26be919fb5bdd598fc8d85496b4c
'I have been hearing as well about the tories' plans for young people and some form of compulsory national service. With the Rwandan scheme as well I have to say both are ridiculous and not thought out and a disgrace, Thoroughly nasty and I sincerely hope the General Election sees the back of them. And I do not see them in power in my remaining life time.
Quite the most disagreeable government and party in power I have ever seen.'
I'd expect this to be funded, even though the details aren't there yet.
I think people have written off the Tories and therefore see something like this through the prism of 'everything this government does is useless'.
This is a poor idea, but doesn't merit this level of opprobrium imo
The fact he's so angry tells you he's worried that on some level it might work.
The cost is anticipated to be 2.5 billion . That could have helped to reduce those waiting lists .
Except derision.
Not least the farmers, who were up at 5am.
Growth since 2010 is negligible
https://x.com/asentance/status/1794628743698522349?s=61
Everyone thinks its - to quote Peter Mannion MP's reaction to "lets abolish computers" on The Thick of It - Fucking Mental
Everyone is talking about it alright. How do you think that helps the Tories?
Bafflement - Why? Its ridiculous, will lose more votes than it wins, and completely impossible to implement
Sadness - What has happened to the Conservative party - it just seems so out of touch. Hopefully they get a Starmer type up next, to be a lot quieter, play to the centre ground, and just wait for the (Labour) government to make mistakes.
Many students work at weekends .
NEW THREAD
Labour are being painfully, painfully careful to pepper every interaction with voters with caution over what we can afford.
Because the economy will dominate everything this election.
The Tories throw an utterly uncosted policy into the mix and gift Labour another few points on relative economic competence, nay relative competence at all.
What will stick after this idea sinks from the headlines is that there is only one serious party of government on offer. The other has morphed into a protest movement to bring back the past.
I think it’s really good to be able to keep some impartiality, especially when betting and when influencing others to bet. None of us achieve that, of course, but it’s good to be able to take a step back from time to time. You may be right that simply commanding the agenda today has been good for the Conservative cause. I personally doubt that and I think they’re going to lose more support from this, but we will see as the opinion polls roll out.
Thank you to @maxh for picking up on that Callaghan quote from yesterday. As you say, Callaghan’s point was that when the country is in a once in a generation sea-change, nothing you say or do will make a difference.
This is the one you want.
https://modelingmadness.com/review/allies/gb/cleavermeteor.htm
Don't get the F1 kit because it has F3 wings. Tamiya used a Meteor in a museum to design the kit and it had the wrong wings on it.
You also want these because the tyres aren't bulged on kit wheels.
https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/RS48-0266?result-token=Zksyu
If it were true Labour has no policies, you have just illustrated how such a tactic is ******' genius.
Starmer likes to talk about becoming PM, and Labour forming the next government, as acts of service. He wants to create the idea that his motivation is selfless, that he aims to become a servant of the people, rather than their master. And he hopes this will create a contrast with the Tories who are more obviously only in it for personal aggrandisement.
The word "service", however, it's now most associated with the Tory plan to bring back National Service. Forget whether it's a good policy or not, Starmer cannot now talk in positive terms about his desire to become PM as a selfless act of service, without it triggering associations with Tory policy.
Expect an eye-catching Tory policy, one to rile up the journalists on twitter, that will somehow appropriate the word mission. Pretty soon Starmer will have to rewrite his entire campaigning phrasebook.
But supporting your team is not the same as your team definitely being the best. Set aside your personal position and look at things dispassionately.
Its been a terrible campaign so far. Of an election imposed on the cabinet without consultation and a party not remotely ready to fight it. With gift after gift handed to the media to make Sunak and the party look like idiots.
And now this.
"Only the Tories have a Plan" / cf "Bring back National Service paid for but gutting levelling up".
The best liked comments on the Mail article say - with evidence - that its Fucking Mental. You think Labour have 3k+ moles planting likes? These are your voters. And even they think its mental. Because it IS mental.
So I understand. Mental or not, its your team and you support them to the last. I entirely respect that. But we don't need the pretence of "hey everyone, isn't this a splendid idea?" Because you are better than that.
Apparently, The Plan includes dropping in things from very left field with zero notice. That just happen to dogwhistle the remaining 12 people who will vote Tory.
Lets consider what other Bold Action policies we can look forward to over the next few weeks:
Chain-gangs for the so-called disabled
The Birch in our schools and a ban on sex education
Solve the prison crisis by walling off places like Middlesbrough and turning them into a gulag.
A flat tax
Raise the voting threshold to Additional Rate taxpayers only
So they'll be paying southern management consultants to organise the slave labour of northern teenagers with the money that should have paid for improved northern infrastructure. Now we just have to see whether the northern oldsters will vote for it.
Just like the Tories don't need to prove they care about national security.
UK defence spending was about 4% in 1990. Basically double where it is today. Even when Labour came to power in 1997 we were still spending nearly 3%. It has been up and down between about 2.0-2.5% through the last couple of decades. It's that whole "peace dividend" and "swords into ploughshares" after the Berlin Wall came down that has screwed us, it was a strategic mistake by Labour and Conservative governments, and was mirrored in almost all European countries. Even with UK military action in Iraq and Afghanistan only modest increases in spending occurred. Almost every European government in the last 30 or so years has been trying to do defence on the cheap.
i need to walk the dogs.
But whilst there are right wing voices in touch with the reality of Britain in the mid 2020s (look for Yimbies) they aren't touching the Conservative party with a bargepole.
The most significant thing Boris did was his following out of Conservative centrists, so that Sunak and Hunt are seen as wets. It looks like being a long road back.
Which is something the UK - and pretty much all the developed world - has struggled with for the last twenty years.
One of the various reasons being an increase in the proportion of jobs in lower skilled and consequently lower paid sectors - baristas get paid less than barristers.
While since the 'throwing out of the Conservative centrists' university tuition fees have been frozen and full employment achieved.
And as I've mentioned previously there has likely never been a time with better opportunities to be young, northern and working class than what we have now.
The situation is much more complex than any standard, London focussed, political spectrum viewpoint.
Worth using my daily quota on
If it's too late for you this time in England, put your name down for the Vale of Glamorgan in 2029. Cairns is going to get creamed in 5 weeks time.
I don't believe being young in 2024 United Kingdom is an easy ask at all. I have two very well qualified sons who are living on scraps rather than living the dream. If you want them to use their engineering degree and journalism masters (distinction) from the prestigious Cardiff School of Journalism to drive vans for Amazon, yes the World (or rather CF and SA postcodes) is their oyster.