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Comments

  • DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 723
    edited May 10

    WillG said:

    Donkeys said:

    Blinken has said that he opposes the forced relocation of Palestinians from Gaza. He said this to the Egyptian foreign minister, but there are only two crossings from Gaza to Egypt and the Israelis have shut them both. They are forcing people not south to Sinai in Egypt, but north. More than 100,000 have already fled eastern Rafah to the north in the last few days. I still reckon the plan is to throw survivors out on ships (probably paid for by the US), but we shall see. Certainly Blinken is mentioning forced relocation and AFAIAA this is new.

    Bibi is gearing up for a second Nakba. It isn't genocide but it is definitely ethnic cleansing.
    Wasn't the original Naqba when the Palestinians "ethnically cleansed" themselves from the region, to allow the invading Arab armies to exterminate all of the Jews?

    That wasn't a genocide either
    With 15k Palestinians killed, ethnically cleansing themselves must have been a risky business. A lot of trip hazards I expect.
    And yet they still didn't learn the lesson to not try to exterminate all of the Jews

    And they still haven't. Will they ever?
    In Melanie Phillips's your world, can a Palestinian walk along the street in Palestine without his head bowed and NOT be part of an effort to "exterminate all the Jews"?

    Meanwhile in the real world, the EU has condemned the attack on UN premises in East Jerusalem and said that the arsonists must be held to account. 👍 EU.

    Let's see whether the US, Britain, France, Russia, China, or Germany follow suit. A fascist mob has burnt down a UN building on territory that the Israeli regime occupies - indeed, territory that the regime says it has "annexed". And not just any old UN building, but a building specifically used for supplying relief to refugees. Some of the mob were carrying guns, and we're lucky nobody was killed.

    What has the Israeli regime got to say about this?

    What are the implications for the British Consulate General in Jerusalem? If that gets burnt down too, will David Cameron go all Frank Spencer about it? Maybe he can phone the EU and they can remind him of the concept of rules-based international order.



  • TazTaz Posts: 14,385
    boulay said:

    Taz said:
    I would love to see a reboot of “The trip” but with Joey Barton and Lawrence Fox travelling around together winding each other up into more and more nutty positions.
    In terms of road trip style nuttiness it is hard to beat this gem

    Calum, Fran and Dangerous Danan, in which Paul Danan traveled from Texas to Los Angeles on America's U.S. Route 66 with Calum Best and Fran Cosgrave.

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    Taz said:
    I suspect his lawyer will argue that it was more of a general insult word used by the uneducated classes, as opposed to a specific accusation of certain behaviour.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,655
    TimS said:

    boulay said:

    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    On Eurovision, I think our 2015 entry by Electro Velvet was underappreciated.

    FPT:

    Can’t the BBC just speak to people with a record of success at songwriting, and then find an established artist who doesn’t take themselves so seriously to perform it?

    I always thought that Sophie Ellis-Bextor would be a great choice, as she’s still active but her hits were a while ago, and she’s not really known in most of Europe - but then one of her songs blew up massively on a TV show, and now she’s off to tour America! Who else do we have, who’s had hits but isn’t really famous, and has a sense of humour?
    Sophie Ellis-Bextor always had a big fanbase in Russia and I think she was fairly big in France too.

    The closest I can think of that fits your criteria is Shampoo: "Uh ok, we're in trouble..." But they're probably way past it now.
    She also didn’t write Murder on the Dance floor, it was written by the guy from the Brand New Radicals who did “you only get what you give” and they were going to release MOTD themselves but it ended up being passed on to her so even if she did front it she would need a great songwriter.

    Maybe a supergroup of Elton John, Ed Sheeran, Brian May, Ringo Starr and Paul MacCartney would be amusing but chances are they would still lose to a crazy trans death metal opera song sung in Sami language.

    Still, France’s is worse than ours.
    One of the reassuring certainties of Eurovision is that the French entry will always be roughly as bad as the UK one.
    All the 5 major countries supporting it regularly underperform, at least in the modern era.

    The secret is simply to enjoy it as a piece of fun.

    The Ukranian diaspora will make for a strong showing in the public vote. I don't fancy Israel to win though top 5 may be possible, albeit not a value bet.

    As well as the jury vote remember that the points allocated by the public votes are grossly disproportionate, with San Marino having the same weight as Germany. In last night's semifinal I think it was a worldwide popular vote.

  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,361
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    There’s an opportunity for the Tories medium term here

    “Not to nitpick but @Keir_Starmer's Small Boats Command seems to be essentially identical to the existing Small Boats Operational Command, which launched last year with the same people doing the same thing... gov.uk/government/new…

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1788839285266792857?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    If Rwanda starts to work and deter boats and send people to Ireland - as is possible - is starmer really going to cancel it after the election? He will surely have to as he is now so committed to doing so

    Imagine he does - cancels an effective policy - and then the boats return to present levels or even increase

    Labour could self destruct in months

    Yes he is relying on the flights not reducing the boats. If the policy even looks like starting to work saying you'd scrap it and put Sniffer of the Yard on the case is going to be a net negative.
    If, of course, flights do not reduce boats then he's ok
    Thing is, what they should be comparing is numbers with Rwanda vs hypothetical numbers without Rwanda. Rather than numbers this year vs last year. It's quite possible absolute numbers rise this summer compared with 2023 when there was an Albania-deal based reduction, but are still lower due to deterrent effect. But Labour would be able to say Rwanda had no effect. Arguing numbers are lower vs a hypothetical alternate reality is exactly the same challenge as faces remainers arguing there's been an economic hit from Brexit.

    I'm glad I'm not in Starmer's shoes though. I object to the scheme on humanitarian grounds because it's us abrogating our responsibilities under the UN refugee convention while not opening any safe and legal routes. But as a politician I would know that sort of argument doesn't work with many voters.
    The promise of the Rwanda policy is that it will stop the boats. Not, reduce the number of boats compared to doing nothing. Stop them.

    People might accept that any policy will take time to take effect, so, in the short term they'd accept a reduction as moving in the right direction. But, ultimately, as long as any boats are coming at all, the policy will not be seen as successful.

    If the boats were to stop, then you'd expect that to have a major impact on the government's fortunes. Is there a reason why they haven't sent a flight to Rwanda yet? I thought they changed the law a couple of weeks ago now.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,041
    TimS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @Savanta_UK
    🚨NEW Holyrood Constituency VI for
    @TheScotsman


    📈First time Labour have tied the SNP in a Holyrood constituency VI in Savanta polling

    🎗️SNP 35% (-2)
    🌹LAB 35% (+2)
    🌳CON 18% (=)
    🔶LD 8% (+2)
    ⬜️Other 5% (=)

    1,080 Scottish adults, 3-8 May

    (change from 6-11 Oct '23)

    SLD surge!
    I wonder if the Lib Dems might be looking at taking back a seat in the Borders.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    edited May 10
    Canadian Conservatives are currently forecast to win two-thirds of the seats according to the latest polls. The Liberals would be reduced to 64 out of 338 seats.

    https://338canada.com/federal.htm
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,064

    TimS said:

    Survation
    NEW: Westminster Voting Intention.
    LAB 44 (-)
    CON 24 (-2)
    LD 10 (+1)
    GRN 7 (+4)
    RFM 8 (-2)
    SNP 2 (-1)
    OTH 5 (-)F/w 9th - 10th May. Changes vs. 29th April 2024.

    That's very good news for the LLGers. The bloc is up 5, which is close to being beyond MoE. LLG 61 RefCon 32.

    I think the pattern that we'd expected after the locals - Greens and Lib Dems up, Reform down - is starting to show itself in polling. Several now with Ref declines, and a few with LD increases (Greens more patchy).
    Yes Reform decline is looking a reality, LDs getting a 'performance' bump as are Greens
    Stabilisation over the next couple of weeks to a new baseline imo which is something like 43 24 10 10/11 6 SNP 2 or 3 others 3 to 5 Lab, Con, Ref, LD, Green
    Wikipedia shows me 6 polls done entirely since the local elections. Reform UK’s change in each of those is small, a percentage point here, a percentage point there. 5 show falls, and 1 an increase. That is not statistically significant. I am not convinced at the claim that Reform has declined.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,137

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Quick Betting Post on Eurovision: With Gaza front and centre atm geopolitics will probably dominate the voting (as it did when Ukraine won in 22). Where will the geopolitical vote go this time? Easy on the pro-Israeli side. To Israel. They're there in the final. Palestine and the Palestinians, otoh, are not represented, meaning their support needs to unite around some other country, which is not happening - we'd have heard if such a plan was being hatched.

    On Saturday night we are therefore looking at a consolidated pro-Israeli vote vs nothing on the other side - since you can't vote against Israel remember. It's a dynamic that steers to an Israeli victory - not in Gaza (no winners there) but in the Eurovision Song Contest. Last I checked they (Israel) were available at 5 on the exchange. DYOR etc but I reckon that's value.

    Israel is now into 3.6 (or 5/2) on Betfair, 3/1 in a place with the books. Squeaky bum time for those who laid Israel at 66/1 or more just yesterday. Is this an over-correction though? Even if there is. as you suggest, a pro-Israeli plot amongst the public in every country in Eurovision-land, remember there is the jury vote too.
    66 yesterday? Very sorry I missed that!
    Even now the money is still piling on Israel. 5/2 with the books is fast disappearing and Betfair is already shorter.

    ETA my mole on the Betfair forum reckons the Italian televote numbers were leaked, and gave 40 per cent to Israel, which is massive.
    So my 5 looks ok then - unless compared with the 66 yesterday. I thought I was giving a good tip but looks like I was too late with it.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,822
    Andy_JS said:

    Canadian Conservatives are currently forecast to win two-thirds of the seats according to the latest polls. The Liberals would be reduced to 64 out of 338 seats.

    https://338canada.com/federal.htm

    Gives the Tories some hope for 2038.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,899
    Sandpit said:

    Taz said:
    I suspect his lawyer will argue that it was more of a general insult word used by the uneducated classes, as opposed to a specific accusation of certain behaviour.
    If the term was "bike nonce" rather than "nonce" then he should be ok, although IANA juror. Can they both lose?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    Donkeys said:

    WillG said:

    Donkeys said:

    Blinken has said that he opposes the forced relocation of Palestinians from Gaza. He said this to the Egyptian foreign minister, but there are only two crossings from Gaza to Egypt and the Israelis have shut them both. They are forcing people not south to Sinai in Egypt, but north. More than 100,000 have already fled eastern Rafah to the north in the last few days. I still reckon the plan is to throw survivors out on ships (probably paid for by the US), but we shall see. Certainly Blinken is mentioning forced relocation and AFAIAA this is new.

    Bibi is gearing up for a second Nakba. It isn't genocide but it is definitely ethnic cleansing.
    Wasn't the original Naqba when the Palestinians "ethnically cleansed" themselves from the region, to allow the invading Arab armies to exterminate all of the Jews?

    That wasn't a genocide either
    With 15k Palestinians killed, ethnically cleansing themselves must have been a risky business. A lot of trip hazards I expect.
    And yet they still didn't learn the lesson to not try to exterminate all of the Jews

    And they still haven't. Will they ever?
    In Melanie Phillips's your world, can a Palestinian walk along the street in Palestine without his head bowed and NOT be part of an effort to "exterminate all the Jews"?

    Meanwhile in the real world, the EU has condemned the attack on UN premises in East Jerusalem and said that the arsonists must be held to account. 👍 EU.

    Let's see whether the US, Britain, France, Russia, China, or Germany follow suit. A fascist mob has burnt down a UN building on territory that the Israeli regime occupies - indeed, territory that the regime says it has "annexed". And not just any old UN building, but a building specifically used for supplying relief to refugees. Some of the mob were carrying guns, and we're lucky nobody was killed.

    What has the Israeli regime got to say about this?

    What are the implications for the British Consulate General in Jerusalem? If that gets burnt down too, will David Cameron go all Frank Spencer about it? Maybe he can phone the EU and they can remind him of the concept of rules-based international order.
    If a train were to crash in East Palestine, should it be the primary responsibility of:

    A. Israel
    B. Hamas
    C. Hezbollah
    D. USA
    E. UK
    F. NGOs
    G. Arab nations
    H. Iran
    J. Someone else

    To deal with the fallout?

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    In view of the EHRC retaining its A status, shouldn't the affiliation of large public institutions to Stonewall be just a bit, well, *embarrassing*?

    https://x.com/runthinkwrite/status/1788833368815112287?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    "Apple apologises for crushing musical instruments and books in 'tone-deaf' iPad Pro advert

    The advert - shared online by Apple chief executive Tim Cook - came under fire, with actor Hugh Grant saying it showed the "destruction of the human experience. Courtesy of Silicon Valley"."

    https://news.sky.com/story/apple-apologises-for-crushing-musical-instruments-and-books-in-tone-deaf-ipad-pro-advert-13132706
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,962
    Sandpit said:

    Donkeys said:

    WillG said:

    Donkeys said:

    Blinken has said that he opposes the forced relocation of Palestinians from Gaza. He said this to the Egyptian foreign minister, but there are only two crossings from Gaza to Egypt and the Israelis have shut them both. They are forcing people not south to Sinai in Egypt, but north. More than 100,000 have already fled eastern Rafah to the north in the last few days. I still reckon the plan is to throw survivors out on ships (probably paid for by the US), but we shall see. Certainly Blinken is mentioning forced relocation and AFAIAA this is new.

    Bibi is gearing up for a second Nakba. It isn't genocide but it is definitely ethnic cleansing.
    Wasn't the original Naqba when the Palestinians "ethnically cleansed" themselves from the region, to allow the invading Arab armies to exterminate all of the Jews?

    That wasn't a genocide either
    With 15k Palestinians killed, ethnically cleansing themselves must have been a risky business. A lot of trip hazards I expect.
    And yet they still didn't learn the lesson to not try to exterminate all of the Jews

    And they still haven't. Will they ever?
    In Melanie Phillips's your world, can a Palestinian walk along the street in Palestine without his head bowed and NOT be part of an effort to "exterminate all the Jews"?

    Meanwhile in the real world, the EU has condemned the attack on UN premises in East Jerusalem and said that the arsonists must be held to account. 👍 EU.

    Let's see whether the US, Britain, France, Russia, China, or Germany follow suit. A fascist mob has burnt down a UN building on territory that the Israeli regime occupies - indeed, territory that the regime says it has "annexed". And not just any old UN building, but a building specifically used for supplying relief to refugees. Some of the mob were carrying guns, and we're lucky nobody was killed.

    What has the Israeli regime got to say about this?

    What are the implications for the British Consulate General in Jerusalem? If that gets burnt down too, will David Cameron go all Frank Spencer about it? Maybe he can phone the EU and they can remind him of the concept of rules-based international order.
    If a train were to crash in East Palestine, should it be the primary responsibility of:

    A. Israel
    B. Hamas
    C. Hezbollah
    D. USA
    E. UK
    F. NGOs
    G. Arab nations
    H. Iran
    J. Someone else

    To deal with the fallout?

    Israel has wisely sorted that out by making sure Palestinians are so impoverished so as to put railways beyond their wildest dreams.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,268

    Wankers.

    Just Stop Oil says two protesters in their 80s have broken the glass around the Magna Carta at the British Library.

    The climate activist group said Reverend Dr Sue Parfitt, 82, and Judy Bruce, an 85-year-old retired biology teacher, entered the library and smashed the glass enclosure around the historic document.

    According to Just Stop Oil, the pair then glued themselves to the enclosure holding a sign which read "the government is breaking the law", and could be heard saying: "Is the government above the law?"

    https://news.sky.com/story/just-stop-oil-protesters-in-their-80s-target-magna-carta-13132732

    well yes, but if HMG dont police these twats and fine them or jail them theyll keep on going.

    Nah

    They use rubbish adhesive. I’d give them a coating with the good stuff, and an addendum to the plaque, naming them as part of the exhibit. Then go for a French lunch - 4hrs and eleven courses.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,268

    Leon said:

    The irony of these wanky old twats attacking, as a “protest”, one of the key documents that gives them that right to protest. It’s probably lost on them

    Though on the other side there are those wanky old twats who revere Magna Carta that gives folk the right to protest yet want these protestors shot.

    Key takeaway: there are a load of wanky old twats about.
    I would make their protest a permanent part of the exhibition.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    Phil said:

    MattW said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PickardJE
    Nadhim Zahawi’s lawyer is at risk of facing sanctions for attempting to restrict a critic of the former chancellor with intimidatory warnings.

    first time a solicitor has been referred to a tribunal over an alleged ‘Slapp’ — a strategic lawsuit against public participation

    What a disgrace.

    A hard working lawyer is persecuted for doing their job, that is the road to fascism.

    First they came for the lawyers and I said nothing...
    Good morning all.

    Makes a nice change from "first all the lawyers came for me".

    (See the Ghost of George Carman and the nearest blonde or Carter-F*ck passim.)
    Carter Ruck have fucked up big style.

    https://www.rollonfriday.com/news-content/carter-ruck-mucks-kevin-spacey-case
    "The deadline for the Defence was mistakenly missed, and we heard nothing further from the Claimant (including any notice of their default judgment application) until we received the Order from the Court”.

    Alternatively phrased: “Please judge, we are smol bean uwu lawyers & the mean claimant didn’t tell us we were forfeiting the case.”

    Not surprised the judge was unimpressed, but I guess they had to try.

    Missed paperwork deadlines wasting oodles of money reminds me of the Suburban Samurai at the Good Law Project.

    That was one of his more creative ways of losing a case.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,899

    In view of the EHRC retaining its A status, shouldn't the affiliation of large public institutions to Stonewall be just a bit, well, *embarrassing*?

    https://x.com/runthinkwrite/status/1788833368815112287?

    Older PBers will remember when EHRC was the epitome of woke nonsense.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957

    Leon said:

    The irony of these wanky old twats attacking, as a “protest”, one of the key documents that gives them that right to protest. It’s probably lost on them

    Though on the other side there are those wanky old twats who revere Magna Carta that gives folk the right to protest yet want these protestors shot.

    Key takeaway: there are a load of wanky old twats about.
    I would make their protest a permanent part of the exhibition.
    When the BBC (I think it was) ran a competition some years back on what summed up England most they started off by including hunting but then, in a sop to lily-livered liberal leftist war-mongers turned bunny hugging first we bomb them now we love them types, felt they had to append "and anti-hunting protests" to it.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,744
    boulay said:

    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    On Eurovision, I think our 2015 entry by Electro Velvet was underappreciated.

    FPT:

    Can’t the BBC just speak to people with a record of success at songwriting, and then find an established artist who doesn’t take themselves so seriously to perform it?

    I always thought that Sophie Ellis-Bextor would be a great choice, as she’s still active but her hits were a while ago, and she’s not really known in most of Europe - but then one of her songs blew up massively on a TV show, and now she’s off to tour America! Who else do we have, who’s had hits but isn’t really famous, and has a sense of humour?
    Sophie Ellis-Bextor always had a big fanbase in Russia and I think she was fairly big in France too.

    The closest I can think of that fits your criteria is Shampoo: "Uh ok, we're in trouble..." But they're probably way past it now.
    She also didn’t write Murder on the Dance floor, it was written by the guy from the Brand New Radicals who did “you only get what you give” and they were going to release MOTD themselves but it ended up being passed on to her so even if she did front it she would need a great songwriter.

    Maybe a supergroup of Elton John, Ed Sheeran, Brian May, Ringo Starr and Paul MacCartney would be amusing but chances are they would still lose to a crazy trans death metal opera song sung in Sami language.

    Still, France’s is worse than ours.
    We look at the whole thing back-to-front, partly because the BBC refuses to take it seriously and partly because it still thinks that the formula from 1982 is the right one.

    In reality, it's an election, and should be treated as such. Who cares what some Beeb exec thinks; it's capturing the attention and imagination of the likes of Mrs Dobski in Romania that matters. Being everyone's meh-good sixth-favourite is no good. You need first preferences. Marmite is better than vanilla.

    Also, it's very much not just about the song. It's a performance. Start with the concept staging - see Heroes. Bring in a production team from the West End. You don't need a big name any more than a theatre does: people don't go to see Wicked or Hamilton or Phantom or whatever because of who's playing the roles; they go because of the experience. Create an experience.

    And then get the focus groups. Work out what goes down well in Albania, Azerbaijan and Austria, and tweak things to hit the market.

    If this all sounds a bit formulaic, yes. The right formula works.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    edited May 10
    Dura_Ace said:

    Leon said:

    There’s an opportunity for the Tories medium term here

    “Not to nitpick but @Keir_Starmer's Small Boats Command seems to be essentially identical to the existing Small Boats Operational Command, which launched last year with the same people doing the same thing... gov.uk/government/new…

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1788839285266792857?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    If Rwanda starts to work and deter boats and send people to Ireland - as is possible - is starmer really going to cancel it after the election? He will surely have to as he is now so committed to doing so

    Imagine he does - cancels an effective policy - and then the boats return to present levels or even increase

    Labour could self destruct in months

    Yes he is relying on the flights not reducing the boats. If the policy even looks like starting to work saying you'd scrap it and put Sniffer of the Yard on the case is going to be a net negative.
    If, of course, flights do not reduce boats then he's ok
    Why would he scrap it in the event that it works? Just because he said he fucking wouldn't?
    Great new profile pic. I'm sure it explains how love is all you need, etc but perhaps the site should be aware that it is illegal to fly (is a profile pic flying?) any flag which makes reference to a proscribed organisation under the Terraced (house) Act.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,913
    Lib Dems to win more seats than the Conservatives 5 to 1 ?????????????
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    On Eurovision ain't no way Israel is winning. No national jury wants to face the ire of their domestic protesters.
  • DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 723
    Sam Rose, director of planning for the UNRWA:

    "No aid has come into Gaza now since Sunday. No aid, no fuel, no supplies, nothing. And we really are now down to our last reserves. We have a few more days of flour that we can provide. But everything else will start to shut down very soon without fuel, without water."

    WTF is David Cameron doing? Follow the lead of more civilised countries and give Israel's ambassador and other officials at the Israeli embassy in London 30 minutes to clear their desks and then escort them to Heathrow.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    .

    Leon said:

    The irony of these wanky old twats attacking, as a “protest”, one of the key documents that gives them that right to protest. It’s probably lost on them

    Though on the other side there are those wanky old twats who revere Magna Carta that gives folk the right to protest yet want these protestors shot.

    Key takeaway: there are a load of wanky old twats about.
    I would make their protest a permanent part of the exhibition.
    You'd need to freeze dry and plastinate them.
    Might be popular.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300

    Leon said:


    as

    Donkeys said:

    Leon said:

    Oooh. Bit of noom. Deep in tangled woods I can hear the noonday bells of the shrine of Monte Sant Angelo across the garganian valley. A shrine so old (with possible prehistoric antecedents) it INSPIRED mont st michel

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctuary_of_Monte_Sant'Angelo

    Are you doing the Michael Line?
    I believe I am. Across gargano?
    Are you visiting San Giovanni Rotundo - home of the stigmatist saint?
    Padre pio! Maybe at the end of my journey
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    edited May 10
    Ten minute rule bill speech to gain attention for Graduated Driving Licences by Kim Leadbetter MP for Batley and Spen, who won the ByElection in 2021 over the Conservative *just*, because a decent chunk of the Labour vote went to George Gallowazzock.

    Very interesting, supported by a lot of organisations including RAC Foundation and groups such as RoadPeace and Forget-me-not Families.

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    Given that stats show deaths / seriously injuries of young male drivers up to the age of 24 are 4x the overall average it should imo be a far longer timescale of 3 years or 21st birthday, which could be shortened by passing an advanced driving test.

    And my question would be why there should be an age at which drink driving suddenly becomes permitted?

    Worth a listen.

    https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/1eba475e-0630-469e-a643-0103ed8e1c14?in=17:43:43
  • megasaurmegasaur Posts: 586
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    The irony of these wanky old twats attacking, as a “protest”, one of the key documents that gives them that right to protest. It’s probably lost on them

    Though on the other side there are those wanky old twats who revere Magna Carta that gives folk the right to protest yet want these protestors shot.

    Key takeaway: there are a load of wanky old twats about.
    I would make their protest a permanent part of the exhibition.
    When the BBC (I think it was) ran a competition some years back on what summed up England most they started off by including hunting but then, in a sop to lily-livered liberal leftist war-mongers turned bunny hugging first we bomb them now we love them types, felt they had to append "and anti-hunting protests" to it.
    Fine sight of the Beaufort exercising in the park this morning
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368

    Death penalty for anybody who tries to ruin the original Magna Carta.

    Sit down Suella!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368

    Cookie said:

    Wankers.

    Just Stop Oil says two protesters in their 80s have broken the glass around the Magna Carta at the British Library.

    The climate activist group said Reverend Dr Sue Parfitt, 82, and Judy Bruce, an 85-year-old retired biology teacher, entered the library and smashed the glass enclosure around the historic document.

    According to Just Stop Oil, the pair then glued themselves to the enclosure holding a sign which read "the government is breaking the law", and could be heard saying: "Is the government above the law?"

    https://news.sky.com/story/just-stop-oil-protesters-in-their-80s-target-magna-carta-13132732

    One of them is a reverend. Not massively surprising. Do the CofE employ anyone who isn't an imbecile?
    They sound a bit old for prison.
    Our jails are old, stick them in an old prison.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163

    TimS said:

    IanB2 said:

    Europe still has cuckoos. Reminds me of my childhood. Where did English cuckoos go,?

    I can often hear a cuckoo at my vineyard in Rosie Duffield land, so they're not completely gone. But I agree hearing them generally is a bit of a rarity. I think they only really enjoy properly deep countryside.

    Singing one of the two most famous cuckoo-related madrigals next week in my choir's next concert. Not Sumer is icumen in, but the Chant des Oyseaulx by Janequin, which is one of the most fiendishly difficult pieces to perform because of the speed of French bird noise words that make the whole thing like a tongue-twister. The easiest bit is the several bars of us just intoning "CouCou".
    In contrast, I see that you are performing 4'33' by John Cage.
    Not Rossini's Cat Duet?

    They'll fix your cuckoos for you.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    megasaur said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    The irony of these wanky old twats attacking, as a “protest”, one of the key documents that gives them that right to protest. It’s probably lost on them

    Though on the other side there are those wanky old twats who revere Magna Carta that gives folk the right to protest yet want these protestors shot.

    Key takeaway: there are a load of wanky old twats about.
    I would make their protest a permanent part of the exhibition.
    When the BBC (I think it was) ran a competition some years back on what summed up England most they started off by including hunting but then, in a sop to lily-livered liberal leftist war-mongers turned bunny hugging first we bomb them now we love them types, felt they had to append "and anti-hunting protests" to it.
    Fine sight of the Beaufort exercising in the park this morning
    Doesn't time fly...
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,361

    Wankers.

    Just Stop Oil says two protesters in their 80s have broken the glass around the Magna Carta at the British Library.

    The climate activist group said Reverend Dr Sue Parfitt, 82, and Judy Bruce, an 85-year-old retired biology teacher, entered the library and smashed the glass enclosure around the historic document.

    According to Just Stop Oil, the pair then glued themselves to the enclosure holding a sign which read "the government is breaking the law", and could be heard saying: "Is the government above the law?"

    https://news.sky.com/story/just-stop-oil-protesters-in-their-80s-target-magna-carta-13132732

    well yes, but if HMG dont police these twats and fine them or jail them theyll keep on going.

    Nah

    They use rubbish adhesive. I’d give them a coating with the good stuff, and an addendum to the plaque, naming them as part of the exhibit. Then go for a French lunch - 4hrs and eleven courses.
    I thought the standard operating procedure involved generous quantities of tea and coffee?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,913
    Leon said:

    There’s an opportunity for the Tories medium term here

    “Not to nitpick but @Keir_Starmer's Small Boats Command seems to be essentially identical to the existing Small Boats Operational Command, which launched last year with the same people doing the same thing... gov.uk/government/new…

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1788839285266792857?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    If Rwanda starts to work and deter boats and send people to Ireland - as is possible - is starmer really going to cancel it after the election? He will surely have to as he is now so committed to doing so

    Imagine he does - cancels an effective policy - and then the boats return to present levels or even increase

    Labour could self destruct in months

    That depends totally on which Tory MPs are left after the election and who they choose as leader. Do you have any faith that Tory members (if given a vote) will choose a non-loony?
  • megasaurmegasaur Posts: 586
    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    edited May 10
    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    Was he not human? Ah! An archangel. Yes

    Various theories say he is a Norse god repurposed - that makes sense to me. The lombards built this shrine - they’re a bit norsey

    Why is it always hills? Nearer to heaven?

    One of the best is st Michael’s at Brentor in Devon. An easy noom factor 5 or 6. Spooky and peculiar with Dartmoor looming beyond

    Look at it. Oof. Britain really is good for noom


  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,899
    MattW said:

    Ten minute rule bill speech to gain attention for Graduated Driving Licences by Kim Leadbetter MP for Batley and Spen, who won the ByElection in 2021 over the Conservative *just*, because a decent chunk of the Labour vote went to George Gallowazzock.

    Very interesting, supported by a lot of organisations including RAC Foundation and groups such as RoadPeace and Forget-me-not Families.

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    Given that stats show deaths / seriously injuries of young male drivers up to the age of 24 are 4x the overall average it should imo be a far longer timescale of 3 years or 21st birthday, which could be shortened by passing an advanced driving test.

    And my question would be why there should be an age at which drink driving suddenly becomes permitted?

    Worth a listen.

    https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/1eba475e-0630-469e-a643-0103ed8e1c14?in=17:43:43

    It sounds more like a 20th Century brainstorming session rather than a serious proposal.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    MattW said:

    TimS said:

    IanB2 said:

    Europe still has cuckoos. Reminds me of my childhood. Where did English cuckoos go,?

    I can often hear a cuckoo at my vineyard in Rosie Duffield land, so they're not completely gone. But I agree hearing them generally is a bit of a rarity. I think they only really enjoy properly deep countryside.

    Singing one of the two most famous cuckoo-related madrigals next week in my choir's next concert. Not Sumer is icumen in, but the Chant des Oyseaulx by Janequin, which is one of the most fiendishly difficult pieces to perform because of the speed of French bird noise words that make the whole thing like a tongue-twister. The easiest bit is the several bars of us just intoning "CouCou".
    In contrast, I see that you are performing 4'33' by John Cage.
    Not Rossini's Cat Duet?

    They'll fix your cuckoos for you.
    Hah.

    Kiri Te Kanawa and Norma Burrows doing the Cat Duet. They look like Hinge & Bracket !
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNyR6rsGDyg

    And the real Hinge & Bracket doing the same piece:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9Qd8AzjrPg
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,833
    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    Its a shopping chain isn't it?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    SUDDEN THEORY ALERT

    Early monks of almost any stripe were famous for seeking out wild and desolate spots, supposedly for the privation and austerity thereby afforded. No supermarkets and pleasant bubble tea cafes

    But what if in fact they were looking for NOOM?

    The sense of the sacred in place. That would explain to this day why so many abbeys and priories have a ton of noom (if you’re in the right country - not France). It’s not that the monks brought the noom and imposed it. The noom was already there, they were looking for it, like oil prospectors in Texas. And the best monks struck good noom, producing a bonanza of noom - a so called noomanza - a gusher - the holy buildings that followed merely added to the noom

    I cite Tintern as proof of Noom Theory 7. Even if you took tintern abbey away that valley has an extraordinary rich vein of noom running through the hills. Thar be noom, thar she nooms!!! Monks of the 12th century were known for saying this

    I possibly need a beer
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,786
    edited May 10
    Seeing as we now routinely play 'where am I?', let's go for a bleeding obvious one.

    My room is on the 23rd floor and a rollercoaster goes straight passed my window.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    Jesus tittyfucking Christ on a cracker this shrine BETTER BE WORTH IT, as it is on top of the tallest bloody hill in Il Bel Paese
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163

    MattW said:

    Ten minute rule bill speech to gain attention for Graduated Driving Licences by Kim Leadbetter MP for Batley and Spen, who won the ByElection in 2021 over the Conservative *just*, because a decent chunk of the Labour vote went to George Gallowazzock.

    Very interesting, supported by a lot of organisations including RAC Foundation and groups such as RoadPeace and Forget-me-not Families.

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    Given that stats show deaths / seriously injuries of young male drivers up to the age of 24 are 4x the overall average it should imo be a far longer timescale of 3 years or 21st birthday, which could be shortened by passing an advanced driving test.

    And my question would be why there should be an age at which drink driving suddenly becomes permitted?

    Worth a listen.

    https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/1eba475e-0630-469e-a643-0103ed8e1c14?in=17:43:43

    It sounds more like a 20th Century brainstorming session rather than a serious proposal.
    Yep. That's a normal purpose of 10 Minute Rule Bills aiui.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,930

    Alexa, I've been searching all morning for PoliticalBetting.com but I keep winding up on some travel blog. What am I doing wrong?

    Expecting discussion of political betting on PoliticalBetting.com? You must be new here.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,696

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    Roger said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    It would be a mistake for Sunak to go around trying to re-frame it like that.

    "It's not that bad."

    Indeed, "UK officially out of recession" just reminds people that we were, at least notionally, in a recession. I'd forgotten.
    People have short memories. Give it 6 months and an interest rate cut and things will look different. Starmer hasnt said anything much in terms of how he'd do things better.

    I was in Aberdeen yesterday and the property guys were sounding bullish. Oil and gas is on the up. So if the mood starts to turn so will the polls.
    Aberdeen is probably the worst place in the country to extrapolate wider trends from. It usually goes in the opposite direction to the rest of the UK due to the impact of oil pricing.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    edited May 10
    I'm doing well for trivia today.

    Is that a man having a poop in Chagall's "Over the Town"?

    https://twitter.com/kardyology/status/1788868057261031792
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,833

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    Roger said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    A member of our family was discussing their situation with a consultant recently. The consultant said that they had now got their waiting lists down to what they had before Covid. Which was 18 months.

    On the criminal court side of things we are not doing nearly as well as that.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    kjh said:

    Seeing as we now routinely play 'where am I?', let's go for a bleeding obvious one.

    My room is on the 23rd floor and a rollercoaster goes straight passed my window.

    Vegas?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    Leon said:

    SUDDEN THEORY ALERT

    Early monks of almost any stripe were famous for seeking out wild and desolate spots, supposedly for the privation and austerity thereby afforded.

    I possibly need a beer

    Do you have a theory of Anchorites?
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677

    Alexa, I've been searching all morning for PoliticalBetting.com but I keep winding up on some travel blog. What am I doing wrong?

    Not knowing how to work uBlock Origin sufficiently well to hide the holiday photos of boring old drunkards.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    edited May 10
    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    SUDDEN THEORY ALERT

    Early monks of almost any stripe were famous for seeking out wild and desolate spots, supposedly for the privation and austerity thereby afforded.

    I possibly need a beer

    Do you have a theory of Anchorites?
    No. Hermits yes. I have actually met a real hermit

    On Mount Athos - the semi independent ecclesiastical republic of northern Greece, where all females are forbidden even including hens. They have an official hen disperser who shoos them out of the country. True story

    ANYWAY my Theory of Hermits which I have just conceived is that they are the gold panners of noom. The individuals who seek tiny nuggets of noom in the rivers of being, tiny flickers of noom in the grey sands of time

    Abbeys and priories are more like gold mine companies. Seeking the same precious resource but on an almost industrial scale

    That makes the Catholic Church Exxon or Shell
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,833
    Tres said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    Roger said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    It would be a mistake for Sunak to go around trying to re-frame it like that.

    "It's not that bad."

    Indeed, "UK officially out of recession" just reminds people that we were, at least notionally, in a recession. I'd forgotten.
    People have short memories. Give it 6 months and an interest rate cut and things will look different. Starmer hasnt said anything much in terms of how he'd do things better.

    I was in Aberdeen yesterday and the property guys were sounding bullish. Oil and gas is on the up. So if the mood starts to turn so will the polls.
    Aberdeen is probably the worst place in the country to extrapolate wider trends from. It usually goes in the opposite direction to the rest of the UK due to the impact of oil pricing.
    And on the up in Aberdeen has to be kept in perspective. They have edged ahead of downtown Rafah right enough but only recently.

    Union Street is almost completely unrecognisable from 10 years ago. Its bordering on tragic.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    Donkeys said:

    Sam Rose, director of planning for the UNRWA:

    "No aid has come into Gaza now since Sunday. No aid, no fuel, no supplies, nothing. And we really are now down to our last reserves. We have a few more days of flour that we can provide. But everything else will start to shut down very soon without fuel, without water."

    WTF is David Cameron doing? Follow the lead of more civilised countries and give Israel's ambassador and other officials at the Israeli embassy in London 30 minutes to clear their desks and then escort them to Heathrow.

    He is certainly doing more than the naive virtue signalling post above.

    Maybe trying to find a solution?

    Maybe putting pressure on the terrorists in Hamas to release the innocent hostages they took in October?

  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    edited May 10
    Dura_Ace said:

    Alexa, I've been searching all morning for PoliticalBetting.com but I keep winding up on some travel blog. What am I doing wrong?

    Not knowing how to work uBlock Origin sufficiently well to hide the holiday photos of boring old drunkards.
    Do tell us some more about your 189 fucking megadecibel cans on your fucking lol 1200CC Kawasaki HELL BIKE which you fucking thrape around Lancashire using BX39473??ww-juice at 800 fucking mph like the total mad anarchist and Hamas supporter you are so you can get to your fucking epic bungalow in time to watch Keeping Up Appearances
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,833
    Mortimer said:

    Donkeys said:

    Sam Rose, director of planning for the UNRWA:

    "No aid has come into Gaza now since Sunday. No aid, no fuel, no supplies, nothing. And we really are now down to our last reserves. We have a few more days of flour that we can provide. But everything else will start to shut down very soon without fuel, without water."

    WTF is David Cameron doing? Follow the lead of more civilised countries and give Israel's ambassador and other officials at the Israeli embassy in London 30 minutes to clear their desks and then escort them to Heathrow.

    He is certainly doing more than the naive virtue signalling post above.

    Maybe trying to find a solution?

    Maybe putting pressure on the terrorists in Hamas to release the innocent hostages they took in October?

    Whilst i agree with this there does come a point where it is incumbent on us to say "enough" to Israel and we are somewhat past that point. When the US President in an election year is threatening to cut off their bomb supply something more than quiet diplomacy is clearly required.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    I enjoyed and respected the titanic act of imagination required to think that DC was "trying to find a solution" to Hamas vs Eretz Yisrael.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    Leon said:

    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    SUDDEN THEORY ALERT

    Early monks of almost any stripe were famous for seeking out wild and desolate spots, supposedly for the privation and austerity thereby afforded.

    I possibly need a beer

    Do you have a theory of Anchorites?
    No. Hermits yes. I have actually met a real hermit

    On Mount Athos - the semi independent ecclesiastical republic of northern Greece, where all females are forbidden even including hens. They have an official hen disperser who shoos them out of the country. True story

    ANYWAY my Theory of Hermits which I have just conceived is that they are the gold panners of noom. The individuals who seek tiny nuggets of noom in the rivers of being, tiny flickers of noom in the grey sands of time

    Abbeys and priories are more like gold mine companies. Seeking the same precious resource but on an almost industrial scale

    That makes the Catholic Church Exxon or Shell
    There are people in the UK who embrace the lifestyle.

    eg Indy piece from 2008: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/british-hermits-the-growing-lure-of-the-solitary-life-859656.html
  • PoodleInASlipstreamPoodleInASlipstream Posts: 252
    edited May 10
    MattW said:

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    The devil is going to be in the detail here. This is similar to the system used for motorcycles - you can start riding at 16, but there are notable restrictions until 21 or 24, depending on how you go about it - and it is near universally unpopular.

    The restrictions need to be carefully calibrated or you end up making things less safe. The EU, who designed our bike licensing system, completely ballsed it up. Right now we restrict 16 year olds to 50cc machines that are death traps on today's roads. 17 year olds (or anyone riding on a CBT) are banned from motorways, forcing them onto badly lit, poorly maintained, twisty back roads, where the chance of an accident is far higher than on a motorway.

    And it can distort the vehicle market quite seriously. 50cc bikes and scooters are rapidly dying because they're so useless an e-bike makes more sense. 125cc machines command far higher prices than they should due to so many riders being restricted to that engine size.

    Graduated licencing is worth debating, but the the motorcycle experience suggests the restrictions need to be very simple, ie, no more then a 100bph engine before you're 24, or they risk producing unforeseen effects.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    GET IN

    I’ve walked for literally dozens of minutes to achieve this. From Mont St Michel on the pearly coast of Normandy - to the sunburnt hills of the gargano by the shimmering Adriatic. Possibly two hours or more of endless endless walking - endless walking and hiking and straining, moments of grace and moments of pain, all the spectrum of the pilgrim’s life, with a tiny bit of driving and flying. And now. I am crowned by god

    @BlancheLivermore I have outdone the


  • PJHPJH Posts: 645
    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    St Gabriel and St Raphael (and the other one - Uriel?) wave from On High
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,082
    DavidL said:

    Tres said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    Roger said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    It would be a mistake for Sunak to go around trying to re-frame it like that.

    "It's not that bad."

    Indeed, "UK officially out of recession" just reminds people that we were, at least notionally, in a recession. I'd forgotten.
    People have short memories. Give it 6 months and an interest rate cut and things will look different. Starmer hasnt said anything much in terms of how he'd do things better.

    I was in Aberdeen yesterday and the property guys were sounding bullish. Oil and gas is on the up. So if the mood starts to turn so will the polls.
    Aberdeen is probably the worst place in the country to extrapolate wider trends from. It usually goes in the opposite direction to the rest of the UK due to the impact of oil pricing.
    And on the up in Aberdeen has to be kept in perspective. They have edged ahead of downtown Rafah right enough but only recently.

    Union Street is almost completely unrecognisable from 10 years ago. Its bordering on tragic.
    I went there for a RSS Conference a few years ago. It was worse than previous locations Manchester, Belfast, Cardiff, Glasgow, Exeter and Sheffield.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    edited May 10
    PJH said:

    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    St Gabriel and St Raphael (and the other one - Uriel?) wave from On High
    Aren’t there some sainted animals as well? Without googling I have a vague memory of dark age/medieval popes variously canonising or excommunicating certain horses or dogs etc
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,962
    edited May 10
    The government might be breaking the law but JSO ain’t breaking that glass. The Suffragettes wouldn’t have messed around with a wobbly chisel, 4 sticks of Nobel’s best for them.

    https://x.com/barneyfarmer/status/1788922343043052017?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434

    Dave returns to government and the economy becomes the fastest growing economy in the G7.

    Coincidence?

    I think not.

    His presence in the private sector was holding it back?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,268

    Wankers.

    Just Stop Oil says two protesters in their 80s have broken the glass around the Magna Carta at the British Library.

    The climate activist group said Reverend Dr Sue Parfitt, 82, and Judy Bruce, an 85-year-old retired biology teacher, entered the library and smashed the glass enclosure around the historic document.

    According to Just Stop Oil, the pair then glued themselves to the enclosure holding a sign which read "the government is breaking the law", and could be heard saying: "Is the government above the law?"

    https://news.sky.com/story/just-stop-oil-protesters-in-their-80s-target-magna-carta-13132732

    well yes, but if HMG dont police these twats and fine them or jail them theyll keep on going.

    Nah

    They use rubbish adhesive. I’d give them a coating with the good stuff, and an addendum to the plaque, naming them as part of the exhibit. Then go for a French lunch - 4hrs and eleven courses.
    I thought the standard operating procedure involved generous quantities of tea and coffee?
    1) apply glue
    2) apply tea/coffee
    3) laugh
  • PJHPJH Posts: 645
    Leon said:

    PJH said:

    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    St Gabriel and St Raphael (and the other one - Uriel?) wave from On High
    Aren’t there some sainted animals as well? Without googling I have a vague memory of dark age/medieval popes variously canonising or excommunicating certain horses or dogs etc
    I'm not quite Catholic enough to know but certainly some of the Popes were bonkers enough. Like you I vaguely recall something about an animal (horse?) being excommunicated but I'm not sure how it could ever have taken its vows of Confirmation in the first place.

    After posting I also thought that it was amusing that the heavenly Gang of Four showed the way for the earthly SDP, in that nobody can remember who the 4th one was!
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    SUDDEN THEORY ALERT

    Early monks of almost any stripe were famous for seeking out wild and desolate spots, supposedly for the privation and austerity thereby afforded.

    I possibly need a beer

    Do you have a theory of Anchorites?
    No. Hermits yes. I have actually met a real hermit

    On Mount Athos - the semi independent ecclesiastical republic of northern Greece, where all females are forbidden even including hens. They have an official hen disperser who shoos them out of the country. True story

    ANYWAY my Theory of Hermits which I have just conceived is that they are the gold panners of noom. The individuals who seek tiny nuggets of noom in the rivers of being, tiny flickers of noom in the grey sands of time

    Abbeys and priories are more like gold mine companies. Seeking the same precious resource but on an almost industrial scale

    That makes the Catholic Church Exxon or Shell
    There are people in the UK who embrace the lifestyle.

    eg Indy piece from 2008: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/british-hermits-the-growing-lure-of-the-solitary-life-859656.html
    eg Indy piece from 2008: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/british-hermits-the-growing-lure-of-the-solitary-life-859656.html

    There was a lady who's writings I used to read - a Lavinia Byrne type character who had gone in a different direction and was living quietly in a village being a contemplative and offering support / advice freely in a "wise woman" type of role. But I can't recall her name; it was in the 1990s.

    Separately, I'm about to commission an icon of St Oda for a relation who is a Counsellor for her 60th birthday, and interested in exploring contemplative spirituality as she is heading towards retirement. The "recluse in the woods offering advice" to people who come and ask is part of St Oda's legend.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434

    The government might be breaking the law but JSO ain’t breaking that glass. The Suffragettes wouldn’t have messed around with a wobbly chisel, 4 sticks of Nobel’s best for them.

    https://x.com/barneyfarmer/status/1788922343043052017?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Even social justice warriors have fallen victim to Sunak's dismal decline.
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,916
    Leon said:

    GET IN

    I’ve walked for literally dozens of minutes to achieve this. From Mont St Michel on the pearly coast of Normandy - to the sunburnt hills of the gargano by the shimmering Adriatic. Possibly two hours or more of endless endless walking - endless walking and hiking and straining, moments of grace and moments of pain, all the spectrum of the pilgrim’s life, with a tiny bit of driving and flying. And now. I am crowned by god

    @BlancheLivermore I have outdone the


    Well done you!

    You almost walked up two small hills, and you're already reaping the spiritual benefit

    Keep it up old boy
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,962
    edited May 10
    viewcode said:

    DavidL said:

    Tres said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    It would be a mistake for Sunak to go around trying to re-frame it like that.

    "It's not that bad."

    Indeed, "UK officially out of recession" just reminds people that we were, at least notionally, in a recession. I'd forgotten.
    People have short memories. Give it 6 months and an interest rate cut and things will look different. Starmer hasnt said anything much in terms of how he'd do things better.

    I was in Aberdeen yesterday and the property guys were sounding bullish. Oil and gas is on the up. So if the mood starts to turn so will the polls.
    Aberdeen is probably the worst place in the country to extrapolate wider trends from. It usually goes in the opposite direction to the rest of the UK due to the impact of oil pricing.
    And on the up in Aberdeen has to be kept in perspective. They have edged ahead of downtown Rafah right enough but only recently.

    Union Street is almost completely unrecognisable from 10 years ago. Its bordering on tragic.
    I went there for a RSS Conference a few years ago. It was worse than previous locations Manchester, Belfast, Cardiff, Glasgow, Exeter and Sheffield.


    Still got one of the best pubs around, relatively untainted by hipsters or ‘craft’.

    Pint of guinness and softie with grated cheddar & raw onion, no messing.






  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    edited May 10

    MattW said:

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    The devil is going to be in the detail here. This is similar to the system used for motorcycles - you can start riding at 16, but there are notable restrictions until 21 or 24, depending on how you go about it - and it is near universally unpopular.

    The restrictions need to be carefully calibrated or you end up making things less safe. The EU, who designed our bike licensing system, completely ballsed it up. Right now we restrict 16 year olds to 50cc machines that are death traps on today's roads. 17 year olds (or anyone riding on a CBT) are banned from motorways, forcing them onto badly lit, poorly maintained, twisty back roads, where the chance of an accident is far higher than on a motorway.

    And it can distort the vehicle market quite seriously. 50cc bikes and scooters are rapidly dying because they're so useless an e-bike makes more sense. 125cc machines command far higher prices than they should due to so many riders being restricted to that engine size.

    Graduated licencing is worth debating, but the the motorcycle experience suggests the restrictions need to be very simple, ie, no more then a 100bph engine before you're 24, or they risk producing unforeseen effects.
    That's wise comment imo - which is why I think a measure to relax restrictions earlier in return for improved driving are potentially a good option.

    Interesting to hear that view on the motorcycle system - I have generally heard riders saying how beneficial the more rigorous training has been, and that something similar would be beneficial for drivers of vehicles with more than two wheels.

    I have a good day everyone - I have things to do and the sun is shining.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,822
    Leon said:

    kjh said:

    Seeing as we now routinely play 'where am I?', let's go for a bleeding obvious one.

    My room is on the 23rd floor and a rollercoaster goes straight passed my window.

    Vegas?
    New York.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300
    I walked and walked and WALKED the entire pilgrim trail, seasons of blight and horror, seasons of hunger and pain, a lifetime of experiences
    both divine and disastrous, and I did all of that for well over eighty minutes, and i did it for THIS???

    Jesus tittyfucking Christ in a croissant, it’s a shithole


  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,839
    Leon said:

    I walked and walked and WALKED the entire pilgrim trail, seasons of blight and horror, seasons of hunger and pain, a lifetime of experiences
    both divine and disastrous, and I did all of that for well over eighty minutes, and i did it for THIS???

    Jesus tittyfucking Christ in a croissant, it’s a shithole


    One piece of litter and you are complaining. Well. Some people obviously have high standards.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,839

    Sorry, no dog for scale


    Very nice. Does the mill go round on the post as well as round in the obvious way? I can't see a ring in the grass etc.

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,899
    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,300

    Leon said:

    GET IN

    I’ve walked for literally dozens of minutes to achieve this. From Mont St Michel on the pearly coast of Normandy - to the sunburnt hills of the gargano by the shimmering Adriatic. Possibly two hours or more of endless endless walking - endless walking and hiking and straining, moments of grace and moments of pain, all the spectrum of the pilgrim’s life, with a tiny bit of driving and flying. And now. I am crowned by god

    @BlancheLivermore I have outdone the


    Well done you!

    You almost walked up two small hills, and you're already reaping the spiritual benefit

    Keep it up old boy
    I sense you mock. I had to skip my THIRD cappuccino this morning so I could do this insane pilgrimage

    Also this is better than stupid old Santiago. What have they got? Saint James in an old Tesco bag or something?

    Pfff!

    The archangel Michael actually LIVED here. Says outside. The “archangel Michael took up his residence here in a cave in the second half of the 5th century”. Must have been a shock for the neighbours. Probably not great for property prices? Or is it like having a Waitrose within 5 minutes?

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,268
    a
    Carnyx said:

    Sorry, no dog for scale


    Very nice. Does the mill go round on the post as well as round in the obvious way? I can't see a ring in the grass etc.

    Should do. Used to - and I can’t imagine not turning into the wind, even with bare sails.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,839
    edited May 10

    viewcode said:

    DavidL said:

    Tres said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Roger said:

    Taz said:
    It looks like there will be pro-Gaza activists standing against them, I posted an article about one standing against veteran Labour MP Steve McCabe at the next election.

    Labour are definitely changing their tone from being avowedly pro-Israel to a more nuanced position. However I doubt it will be enough for some.

    I did raise this as an issue when the conflict arose and the view was it would not really cost labour due to how few seats had a large Muslim element. However it won't only be Muslims who vote for these candidates.
    It's not only Muslims. It looks unfair. Abbott has quite a back story and could quickly develop a following. If a grouping stand against every Labour 'Friend of Israel' It could be quite significant. What are Labour 'Friends of Israel' for anyway? Just freeloaders or something else? Why not 'Friends'of somewhere where they might do some good?
    We could end up with a whole load of unexpected Tory holds, or even a random gain or two, if the “friends of the proscribed terrorist organisation” put up a load of candidates. How awesome!
    The UK economy is buggered, we have a housing crisis, unsustainable (legal) immigration, lack of infrastructure, schools (literally) falling apart, NHS wait times getting worse and worse, trapped leaseholders getting screwed by property developers, water companies pumping raw sewerage everywhere *and* by the looks of things getting bailed out for doing so.

    I really, really, really do not want GE 2024 to be defined by anyone's stance on the Israel/Palestine issue - something which the UK can do precisely nothing about.

    The country needs fixing. It does not need politicians grandstanding on foreign affairs they have absolutely eff all control over.
    + whooping cough
    The same UK economy, that despite all the official doomsters, grew 0.6 % in the last three months? That economy? The NHS is slowly recovering from Covid, as are other health systems round the world. Some schools have issues in their buildings, many do not. Water companies has become an issue partly due to better monitoring and reporting - we now know about the problems.

    Life isn't all rosy in the UK, far from it, but its not as bad as some like to paint it.
    It would be a mistake for Sunak to go around trying to re-frame it like that.

    "It's not that bad."

    Indeed, "UK officially out of recession" just reminds people that we were, at least notionally, in a recession. I'd forgotten.
    People have short memories. Give it 6 months and an interest rate cut and things will look different. Starmer hasnt said anything much in terms of how he'd do things better.

    I was in Aberdeen yesterday and the property guys were sounding bullish. Oil and gas is on the up. So if the mood starts to turn so will the polls.
    Aberdeen is probably the worst place in the country to extrapolate wider trends from. It usually goes in the opposite direction to the rest of the UK due to the impact of oil pricing.
    And on the up in Aberdeen has to be kept in perspective. They have edged ahead of downtown Rafah right enough but only recently.

    Union Street is almost completely unrecognisable from 10 years ago. Its bordering on tragic.
    I went there for a RSS Conference a few years ago. It was worse than previous locations Manchester, Belfast, Cardiff, Glasgow, Exeter and Sheffield.

    Still got one of the best pubs around, relatively untainted by hipsters or ‘craft’.

    Pint of guinness and softie with grated cheddar & raw onion, no messing.








    Ooh. Aww. Were there mutton pies?

    While on the old pub front, did you see this feelgood story for Friday pm:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/10/beloved-cardiff-pub-demolished-in-2012-reopens-after-brick-by-brick-rebuild-on-new-site

    Had a great day out at St Fagans Museum - or rather Sain Ffagan Amgueddfa Werin Cymru - many, many years ago. Ought to go back especially now.

    Edit: dunno what happened to formatting, looks OK on editing
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,268
    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    I walked and walked and WALKED the entire pilgrim trail, seasons of blight and horror, seasons of hunger and pain, a lifetime of experiences
    both divine and disastrous, and I did all of that for well over eighty minutes, and i did it for THIS???

    Jesus tittyfucking Christ in a croissant, it’s a shithole


    One piece of litter and you are complaining. Well. Some people obviously have high standards.
    It looks exactly like the back streets of lots of small towns in picturesque places.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,163
    Leon said:

    I walked and walked and WALKED the entire pilgrim trail, seasons of blight and horror, seasons of hunger and pain, a lifetime of experiences
    both divine and disastrous, and I did all of that for well over eighty minutes, and i did it for THIS???

    Jesus tittyfucking Christ in a croissant, it’s a shithole


    Finding the extraordinary in the ordinary is one of the things you are supposed to learn :wink: .
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,652
    PJH said:

    Leon said:

    PJH said:

    megasaur said:

    Leon said:

    Nearly at Monte sant angelo, the shrine of st Michael since about forever. Ok 490AD

    It stares down this lovely wild valley to the whispering desolations of the Adriatic

    Noom factor 2.3


    St Michael is quite interesting for being the only non human saint. And for scooping the pool when it comes to churches on the top of hills
    St Gabriel and St Raphael (and the other one - Uriel?) wave from On High
    Aren’t there some sainted animals as well? Without googling I have a vague memory of dark age/medieval popes variously canonising or excommunicating certain horses or dogs etc
    I'm not quite Catholic enough to know but certainly some of the Popes were bonkers enough. Like you I vaguely recall something about an animal (horse?) being excommunicated but I'm not sure how it could ever have taken its vows of Confirmation in the first place.

    After posting I also thought that it was amusing that the heavenly Gang of Four showed the way for the earthly SDP, in that nobody can remember who the 4th one was!
    That era was less about the Vatican and more about local episcopal authorities. When animals were excommunicated, scholars reckon a few things were happening. One is that it was to assuage guilt about wiping out pests - which seems unnecessary to me. More plausible is that the bishops were, shall we say, "reminding" local communities about their authority and the potential consequences of dissent. Finally, there is a suggestion that animal trials were a humanitarian substitute for witch trials.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,370

    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862

    It's going to be fun as the incident seems to be the press conference where when the Israel contestant was asked "Why should you be allowed to appear?" the EBU said unfair question and Joost said - seems perfectly reasonable to ask and should be answered..

    Worth remembering that Greta Thunberg is part of the people outside protesting about Israel's participation...
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,592
    eek said:

    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862

    It's going to be fun as the incident seems to be the press conference where when the Israel contestant was asked "Why should you be allowed to appear?" the EBU said unfair question and Joost said - seems perfectly reasonable to ask and should be answered..

    Worth remembering that Greta Thunberg is part of the people outside protesting about Israel's participation...
    Has Greta ever protested about Russia's illegal invasion, mass-murder and imperialist expansion in Ukraine?
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,587
    edited May 10
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    GET IN

    I’ve walked for literally dozens of minutes to achieve this. From Mont St Michel on the pearly coast of Normandy - to the sunburnt hills of the gargano by the shimmering Adriatic. Possibly two hours or more of endless endless walking - endless walking and hiking and straining, moments of grace and moments of pain, all the spectrum of the pilgrim’s life, with a tiny bit of driving and flying. And now. I am crowned by god

    @BlancheLivermore I have outdone the


    Well done you!

    You almost walked up two small hills, and you're already reaping the spiritual benefit

    Keep it up old boy
    I sense you mock. I had to skip my THIRD cappuccino this morning so I could do this insane pilgrimage

    Also this is better than stupid old Santiago. What have they got? Saint James in an old Tesco bag or something?

    Pfff!

    The archangel Michael actually LIVED here. Says outside. The “archangel Michael took up his residence here in a cave in the second half of the 5th century”. Must have been a shock for the neighbours. Probably not great for property prices? Or is it like having a Waitrose within 5 minutes?

    M&S for St Michael, shirley?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,962
    Carnyx said:

    Ooh. Aww. Were there mutton pies?

    While on the old pub front, did you see this feelgood story for Friday pm:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/10/beloved-cardiff-pub-demolished-in-2012-reopens-after-brick-by-brick-rebuild-on-new-site

    Had a great day out at St Fagans Museum - or rather Sain Ffagan Amgueddfa Werin Cymru - many, many years ago. Ought to go back especially now.

    Edit: dunno what happened to formatting, looks OK on editing

    My fault I think but couldn’t see anything amiss either when I checked.

    That looks a good one, the lavs are spectacular.
    Some disquiet that what’s generally accepted to be the best pub in Glasgow, The Laurieston, has been sold. They’d be mad to change its 1950s charm but who can tell nowadays. Great mutton pies & peas
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,592
    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862

    It's going to be fun as the incident seems to be the press conference where when the Israel contestant was asked "Why should you be allowed to appear?" the EBU said unfair question and Joost said - seems perfectly reasonable to ask and should be answered..

    Worth remembering that Greta Thunberg is part of the people outside protesting about Israel's participation...
    Has Greta ever protested about Russia's illegal invasion, mass-murder and imperialist expansion in Ukraine?
    Yep, even been to Kyiv to support the Ukranian regime.

    https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/06/29/7409150/
    Cool. Good on her.
  • DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 723

    eek said:

    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862

    It's going to be fun as the incident seems to be the press conference where when the Israel contestant was asked "Why should you be allowed to appear?" the EBU said unfair question and Joost said - seems perfectly reasonable to ask and should be answered..

    Worth remembering that Greta Thunberg is part of the people outside protesting about Israel's participation...
    Has Greta ever protested about Russia's illegal invasion, mass-murder and imperialist expansion in Ukraine?
    How many of the resistance fighters in the Warsaw Ghetto in 1943 had ever protested about the genocide against the Armenians? You don't get this humanitarian thing, do you? And Greta Thunberg is a known super-wally anyway.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    edited May 10

    Carnyx said:

    Ooh. Aww. Were there mutton pies?

    While on the old pub front, did you see this feelgood story for Friday pm:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/10/beloved-cardiff-pub-demolished-in-2012-reopens-after-brick-by-brick-rebuild-on-new-site

    Had a great day out at St Fagans Museum - or rather Sain Ffagan Amgueddfa Werin Cymru - many, many years ago. Ought to go back especially now.

    Edit: dunno what happened to formatting, looks OK on editing

    My fault I think but couldn’t see anything amiss either when I checked.

    That looks a good one, the lavs are spectacular.
    Some disquiet that what’s generally accepted to be the best pub in Glasgow, The Laurieston, has been sold. They’d be mad to change its 1950s charm but who can tell nowadays. Great mutton pies & peas
    I did wonder what you were doing at a Royal Stats Soc conference (although that may be your natural habitat, for all I know!). Made more sense when I realised the quote was from Viewcode.

    Of course, it could have been a conference on Radio Security Service, Really Simple Syndication or the Royal Stuart Society
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    edited May 10
    Carnyx said:

    Sorry, no dog for scale


    Very nice. Does the mill go round on the post as well as round in the obvious way? I can't see a ring in the grass etc.

    Looks quite planted, but who knows.

    This one, where my Gran lived most of her life (in the village - not the windmill!) works fully, including rotation.

    ETA: On windmills, I used to live within walking distance of the one in York which is of course of a different type (tower mill). Quite incongruous, stuck as it is right in the middle of a housing estate!
  • MattW said:

    Interesting to hear that view on the motorcycle system - I have generally heard riders saying how beneficial the more rigorous training has been, and that something similar would be beneficial for drivers of vehicles with more than two wheels.

    It's definitely an improvement on the previous very lacklustre system, we don't want to be in the position of some US states, for example, where you can just jump on a 1000cc bike with little or no training and kill yourself. Their fatality rates are horrendous. But the present UK system is rather going too far in the opposite direction, it's onerous enough, and expensive enough, to discourage people from getting into biking. Sales of motorcycles and scooters are declining, and when I was chatting to a local dealer last year he reckoned the average age of buyers is in the 50s now.

    I've mentioned this before, I think, but it bears repeating. If you're 16 and taking up biking progressively getting rid of all the restrictions currently takes 5 years and a minimum of *eight* tests. That's gross overkill, and the government has acknowledged it is not ideal and needs to change.

    Mind you, if the government is looking for a way to reduce the number of cars on the road motorcycle licensing is a fabulous blue-pint on how to do it under the cloak of improving driving standards...

  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,064

    WillG said:

    Donkeys said:

    Blinken has said that he opposes the forced relocation of Palestinians from Gaza. He said this to the Egyptian foreign minister, but there are only two crossings from Gaza to Egypt and the Israelis have shut them both. They are forcing people not south to Sinai in Egypt, but north. More than 100,000 have already fled eastern Rafah to the north in the last few days. I still reckon the plan is to throw survivors out on ships (probably paid for by the US), but we shall see. Certainly Blinken is mentioning forced relocation and AFAIAA this is new.

    Bibi is gearing up for a second Nakba. It isn't genocide but it is definitely ethnic cleansing.
    Wasn't the original Naqba when the Palestinians "ethnically cleansed" themselves from the region, to allow the invading Arab armies to exterminate all of the Jews?

    That wasn't a genocide either
    With 15k Palestinians killed, ethnically cleansing themselves must have been a risky business. A lot of trip hazards I expect.
    And yet they still didn't learn the lesson to not try to exterminate all of the Jews

    And they still haven't. Will they ever?
    The Palestinians are not trying to exterminate all of the Jews. Hamas are, or may be. You cannot punish an ethnic group for the actions of some of its members. Most Palestinians want to be able to live their lives, have enough to eat, earn a wage, have a say in their society, the normal stuff.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,064
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    boulay said:

    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    On Eurovision, I think our 2015 entry by Electro Velvet was underappreciated.

    FPT:

    Can’t the BBC just speak to people with a record of success at songwriting, and then find an established artist who doesn’t take themselves so seriously to perform it?

    I always thought that Sophie Ellis-Bextor would be a great choice, as she’s still active but her hits were a while ago, and she’s not really known in most of Europe - but then one of her songs blew up massively on a TV show, and now she’s off to tour America! Who else do we have, who’s had hits but isn’t really famous, and has a sense of humour?
    Sophie Ellis-Bextor always had a big fanbase in Russia and I think she was fairly big in France too.

    The closest I can think of that fits your criteria is Shampoo: "Uh ok, we're in trouble..." But they're probably way past it now.
    She also didn’t write Murder on the Dance floor, it was written by the guy from the Brand New Radicals who did “you only get what you give” and they were going to release MOTD themselves but it ended up being passed on to her so even if she did front it she would need a great songwriter.

    Maybe a supergroup of Elton John, Ed Sheeran, Brian May, Ringo Starr and Paul MacCartney would be amusing but chances are they would still lose to a crazy trans death metal opera song sung in Sami language.

    Still, France’s is worse than ours.
    One of the reassuring certainties of Eurovision is that the French entry will always be roughly as bad as the UK one.
    All the 5 major countries supporting it regularly underperform, at least in the modern era.

    The secret is simply to enjoy it as a piece of fun.

    The Ukranian diaspora will make for a strong showing in the public vote. I don't fancy Israel to win though top 5 may be possible, albeit not a value bet.

    As well as the jury vote remember that the points allocated by the public votes are grossly disproportionate, with San Marino having the same weight as Germany. In last night's semifinal I think it was a worldwide popular vote.

    San Marino imported a failed Spanish Eurovision contender to be their entry. They were pretty good.

    The Armenian entry is growing on me. Could do well from regional bloc voting.
  • PhilPhil Posts: 2,316

    MattW said:

    Ideas raised for discussion include restrictions on no. of passengers, driving in the dark, power of vehicle and a zero drink limit for inexperienced / young drivers. All to open up debate.

    I'm interested that the length of time suggested is very short at 6 months, whilst in NI restrictions already apply for 12 months. Building a wide coalition to get the idea in the door, I'd say.

    The devil is going to be in the detail here. This is similar to the system used for motorcycles - you can start riding at 16, but there are notable restrictions until 21 or 24, depending on how you go about it - and it is near universally unpopular.

    The restrictions need to be carefully calibrated or you end up making things less safe. The EU, who designed our bike licensing system, completely ballsed it up. Right now we restrict 16 year olds to 50cc machines that are death traps on today's roads. 17 year olds (or anyone riding on a CBT) are banned from motorways, forcing them onto badly lit, poorly maintained, twisty back roads, where the chance of an accident is far higher than on a motorway.

    And it can distort the vehicle market quite seriously. 50cc bikes and scooters are rapidly dying because they're so useless an e-bike makes more sense. 125cc machines command far higher prices than they should due to so many riders being restricted to that engine size.

    Graduated licencing is worth debating, but the the motorcycle experience suggests the restrictions need to be very simple, ie, no more then a 100bph engine before you're 24, or they risk producing unforeseen effects.
    Sounds like the kind of thing which could have been a Brexit benefit if we had a government that was actually capable of governing instead of spending all their time on culture war bullshit.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,064
    Donkeys said:

    eek said:

    Eurovision: The Netherlands' entry Joost Klein stopped from rehearsing over 'incident'
    https://news.sky.com/story/eurovision-the-netherlands-entry-joost-klein-stopped-from-rehearsing-over-incident-13132862

    It's going to be fun as the incident seems to be the press conference where when the Israel contestant was asked "Why should you be allowed to appear?" the EBU said unfair question and Joost said - seems perfectly reasonable to ask and should be answered..

    Worth remembering that Greta Thunberg is part of the people outside protesting about Israel's participation...
    Has Greta ever protested about Russia's illegal invasion, mass-murder and imperialist expansion in Ukraine?
    How many of the resistance fighters in the Warsaw Ghetto in 1943 had ever protested about the genocide against the Armenians? You don't get this humanitarian thing, do you? And Greta Thunberg is a known super-wally anyway.
    Also, Greta has protested at length against Russia’s actions, e.g. https://youtu.be/dORzbNTiNVs
This discussion has been closed.