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Is this the strategy Sunak should follow to win the election? – politicalbetting.com

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  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    How about a No Leavers rule for this thread so we can have a nice elevated conversation?

    What about lapsed leavers?
    Luke 15:7 applies.
    Yeah but I don't want to look out for a full moon and boil hay. We've moved on a bit.
  • carnforth said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Reading the PVV piece, I was struck by their energy polices: to wit, more coal and natural gas.

    In the old days, the Netherlands was a big producer of natural gas; the Groningen field was one of the largest in Europe and back in the early 1970s, it exported gas to its neighbours. (And, indeed, the phrase "The Dutch Disease" was coined to describe what happened to a developed economy that became too dependent on primary energy exports.)

    Natural gas production has fallen a long way since then, and now accounts for around a third of Dutch consumption.

    Now, I have no problems with more oil & gas exploration. The Netherlands is a fairly small place, however, and that makes it unlikely that there are significant quantities of easily exploitable, undiscovered, oil & gas.

    Discouraging the use of renewables (which is explicit VVD policy), therefore, basically means greater reliance on... Russia and the Middle East.

    Whatever your views on global warming, this does not seem to be an optimal strategy for Dutch consumers.

    There is also the issue that onshore gas can make your house fall down:

    https://www.dutchnews.nl/2021/06/between-rubble-and-rebirth-overschild-residents-greet-unequal-rebuild-with-frustration/

    So they are having to close productive gas fields for reasons other than cost and climate change. Hooray for offshore, I suppose.
    You're welcome ;)
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    I wouldn't, he might not like to be reminded Charles I was a better husband.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,586
    carnforth said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Reading the PVV piece, I was struck by their energy polices: to wit, more coal and natural gas.

    In the old days, the Netherlands was a big producer of natural gas; the Groningen field was one of the largest in Europe and back in the early 1970s, it exported gas to its neighbours. (And, indeed, the phrase "The Dutch Disease" was coined to describe what happened to a developed economy that became too dependent on primary energy exports.)

    Natural gas production has fallen a long way since then, and now accounts for around a third of Dutch consumption.

    Now, I have no problems with more oil & gas exploration. The Netherlands is a fairly small place, however, and that makes it unlikely that there are significant quantities of easily exploitable, undiscovered, oil & gas.

    Discouraging the use of renewables (which is explicit VVD policy), therefore, basically means greater reliance on... Russia and the Middle East.

    Whatever your views on global warming, this does not seem to be an optimal strategy for Dutch consumers.

    There is also the issue that onshore gas can make your house fall down:

    https://www.dutchnews.nl/2021/06/between-rubble-and-rebirth-overschild-residents-greet-unequal-rebuild-with-frustration/

    So they are having to close productive gas fields for reasons other than cost and climate change. Hooray for offshore, I suppose.
    Fracking hell that looks bad!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    Taz said:

    An FA Council member who wrote on social media that "Adolf Hitler would be proud of Benjamin Netanyahu" has resigned.

    In his letter to FA chair Debbie Hewitt, Haq added: "Recent events have left me bereft of energy and hope. I have felt overwhelmed at how this has transpired

    Typical self pitying statement. It’s all about him. He’s the victim in his own eyes. The anti semite is the one suffering.
    They decided that, if they get crap for not lighting up their stadium for the Jews, then they’re not going to be lighting it up for anyone.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,488
    kle4 said:

    Taz said:

    An FA Council member who wrote on social media that "Adolf Hitler would be proud of Benjamin Netanyahu" has resigned.

    In his letter to FA chair Debbie Hewitt, Haq added: "Recent events have left me bereft of energy and hope. I have felt overwhelmed at how this has transpired

    Typical self pitying statement. It’s all about him. He’s the victim in his own eyes. The anti semite is the one suffering.
    Well, they regard being anti-semitic as plain common sense, so of course they are just astonished at getting criticised for it (those that are not calling the criticism a conspiracy by jews who control the media or something, with no self awareness).

    Think of all those 'anti-racists' appalled and outraged at being called racist. Which as we know cannot be true because they are anti-racist, dontchaknow.
    "I'm tired" is a thing activists say a lot recently. "Tired of explaining my point of view and people not agreeing with me" appears to be the actual diagnosis.
  • DougSeal said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    This is like shooting rats in a barrel. Brexit led to the strongest opponent to Putin leaving the EU, making the EU's response weaker. Your insistence that, despite inventing the Single Market and being behind EU expansion, we had "no influence" is another remarkable exercise in self-delusion in the face of, well, actual evidence.

    As I have repeatedly said, often in words of one syllable, the UK had a great deal of influence over the EU's policy in eastern Europe and our absence from the bloc assisted its wet lettuce response. Even if I'm wrong, Iraq shows we have always been perfectly capable of breaking ranks. Brexit was, and continues to be, a geopolitical shitshow for the EU and UK defended only by the hard of thinking.

    Nevertheless, congratulations on persuading most of the country and yourselves this fuckup was a great idea and continuing with that delusion as opinion polls continue to show the scales falling from the eyes of most.
    Nope. Wrong again. Inside the EU we could have done nothing to force or persuade the other members to be more aggressive towards Russia. Our influence has always been massively overstated by the EU fanatics lie yourself. Outside the EU our response was rapid and welcomed by Ukraine whilst the rest of the EU dithered and obfuscated.

    I am eternally grateful that we were not in the EU when things went wrong with both Covid and Ukraine because in both cases their response was dire at best.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    Sandpit said:

    Taz said:

    An FA Council member who wrote on social media that "Adolf Hitler would be proud of Benjamin Netanyahu" has resigned.

    In his letter to FA chair Debbie Hewitt, Haq added: "Recent events have left me bereft of energy and hope. I have felt overwhelmed at how this has transpired

    Typical self pitying statement. It’s all about him. He’s the victim in his own eyes. The anti semite is the one suffering.
    They decided that, if they get crap for not lighting up their stadium for the Jews, then they’re not going to be lighting it up for anyone.
    Which is actually a positive outcome generally, if unfortunate it took a desire not to do it in this case for whatever reason, to get that outcome.

    We'll see though, I bet they change the policy quietly down the line.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,170
    We already knew that the more educated someone was the more likely they were to vote Remain, which is pretty much the same as what this study is saying.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    carnforth said:

    kle4 said:

    Taz said:

    An FA Council member who wrote on social media that "Adolf Hitler would be proud of Benjamin Netanyahu" has resigned.

    In his letter to FA chair Debbie Hewitt, Haq added: "Recent events have left me bereft of energy and hope. I have felt overwhelmed at how this has transpired

    Typical self pitying statement. It’s all about him. He’s the victim in his own eyes. The anti semite is the one suffering.
    Well, they regard being anti-semitic as plain common sense, so of course they are just astonished at getting criticised for it (those that are not calling the criticism a conspiracy by jews who control the media or something, with no self awareness).

    Think of all those 'anti-racists' appalled and outraged at being called racist. Which as we know cannot be true because they are anti-racist, dontchaknow.
    "I'm tired" is a thing activists say a lot recently. "Tired of explaining my point of view and people not agreeing with me" appears to be the actual diagnosis.
    My favourite situation is when people are supposed to listen in order to educate themselves, but activists who then claim its not their responsibility to educate you (normal people of a group not doing so is a ok though).
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
  • Omnium said:

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    He didn't choose his name. although he could have chosen a different Regnal name. I think he did well in staying Charles despite the unfortunate fate of Charles I.

    Charles III reign has been really quite good so far. Far better than expected given his unfortunate wife, and his sometimes unfortunate opinions. He's not getting everything right, but he's doing well. (PS I'm happy to accept any and all OBEs - If they're good enough for TBT, they're good enough for me)
    We'd been told for decades that Prince Charles would call himself King George VII so it would be interesting to know who talked him out of it, and why.
  • rcs1000 said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    The UK has been great.

    But the scary thing is not "the EU", it is the election - and potential election - of politicians across the world who are openly hostile to Ukraine and sympathetic to Russia.

    And we need to make sure that we do everything in our power to support Ukraine at this time.
    Absolutely. I don't think the range of 'pro-Putin' leaders is large enugh yet to have much infuence on EU policy and hopefully never will. But I do worry about what happens if Le Pen wins in France and a few more countries move in that direction. The recent Polish election was a welcome move against that trend.

    I am interested in why it seems that so many voters in these countries are willing to put Ukraine (and there own security) at risk when such politicians really get no leverage in the UK. (Farage will never get elected to Parliament let alone lead a party in the House). Not least in some of the countries that suffered so badly under Soviet rule.

    I start from the basic principle there is no fundemental difference between a Brit and a Dutchman or Hungarian so what is it that drives them to elect these pro-Russian leaders?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,926
    carnforth said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Reading the PVV piece, I was struck by their energy polices: to wit, more coal and natural gas.

    In the old days, the Netherlands was a big producer of natural gas; the Groningen field was one of the largest in Europe and back in the early 1970s, it exported gas to its neighbours. (And, indeed, the phrase "The Dutch Disease" was coined to describe what happened to a developed economy that became too dependent on primary energy exports.)

    Natural gas production has fallen a long way since then, and now accounts for around a third of Dutch consumption.

    Now, I have no problems with more oil & gas exploration. The Netherlands is a fairly small place, however, and that makes it unlikely that there are significant quantities of easily exploitable, undiscovered, oil & gas.

    Discouraging the use of renewables (which is explicit VVD policy), therefore, basically means greater reliance on... Russia and the Middle East.

    Whatever your views on global warming, this does not seem to be an optimal strategy for Dutch consumers.

    There is also the issue that onshore gas can make your house fall down:

    https://www.dutchnews.nl/2021/06/between-rubble-and-rebirth-overschild-residents-greet-unequal-rebuild-with-frustration/

    So they are having to close productive gas fields for reasons other than cost and climate change. Hooray for offshore, I suppose.
    Offshore is great, and we should be thankful for people prepared to work long hours away from their families in difficult and often dangerous conditions.

    But it is also expensive.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    How about a No Leavers rule for this thread so we can have a nice elevated conversation?

    What about lapsed leavers?
    Ah well yes, like you, "there is more joy" ...
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Black Friday is the day after Thanksgiving - tons of adverts for "Black Friday sales" on the TV!
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    edited November 2023
    The BBC News showed Tory members discussing migration .One total arsehole said his idea of Brexit was sticking a cork in the Channel Tunnel , the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    One of the group at least said he was concerned at leaving the ECHR which stopped me from throwing a projectile at the tv .
  • Foss said:

    Omnium said:

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    He didn't choose his name. although he could have chosen a different Regnal name. I think he did well in staying Charles despite the unfortunate fate of Charles I.

    Charles III reign has been really quite good so far. Far better than expected given his unfortunate wife, and his sometimes unfortunate opinions. He's not getting everything right, but he's doing well. (PS I'm happy to accept any and all OBEs - If they're good enough for TBT, they're good enough for me)
    Charles has been lucky that expectations were so low. It's William that's going to have issues with delivery.
    "Delivery"? What is that?

    Heads on a block? New castle building? Harrying of the North? Chevauchée in France?

    What?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,457
    edited November 2023
    Appears to be kicking off in Dublin due to rumours that the knifeman was an Algerian illegal immigrant (not saying it was, just that angry mobs have gathered due to social media saying this).

    The problem when the police / authorities make these really vague statements it allows all sorts of rumours to swirl and also the media ensure that when eye witnesses are interviewed they make sure things like race isn't mentioned, but I think that now makes people jump to conclusions.
  • rcs1000 said:

    carnforth said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Reading the PVV piece, I was struck by their energy polices: to wit, more coal and natural gas.

    In the old days, the Netherlands was a big producer of natural gas; the Groningen field was one of the largest in Europe and back in the early 1970s, it exported gas to its neighbours. (And, indeed, the phrase "The Dutch Disease" was coined to describe what happened to a developed economy that became too dependent on primary energy exports.)

    Natural gas production has fallen a long way since then, and now accounts for around a third of Dutch consumption.

    Now, I have no problems with more oil & gas exploration. The Netherlands is a fairly small place, however, and that makes it unlikely that there are significant quantities of easily exploitable, undiscovered, oil & gas.

    Discouraging the use of renewables (which is explicit VVD policy), therefore, basically means greater reliance on... Russia and the Middle East.

    Whatever your views on global warming, this does not seem to be an optimal strategy for Dutch consumers.

    There is also the issue that onshore gas can make your house fall down:

    https://www.dutchnews.nl/2021/06/between-rubble-and-rebirth-overschild-residents-greet-unequal-rebuild-with-frustration/

    So they are having to close productive gas fields for reasons other than cost and climate change. Hooray for offshore, I suppose.
    Offshore is great, and we should be thankful for people prepared to work long hours away from their families in difficult and often dangerous conditions.

    But it is also expensive.
    Indeed. Not certain yet but as I await the upmanning for the next well (Deep water West of Shetlands on the largest Semi-sub in the world) my Christmas is starting to look increasingly dodgy.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,599
    edited November 2023
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
    Underlying problem is Brexit was a coalition of at least three different and contradictory paths for the country, none of which are close to having enough support to sustain a government on their own. Inevitable that it was going to end in disappointment with the government implementing it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    Foss said:

    Omnium said:

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    He didn't choose his name. although he could have chosen a different Regnal name. I think he did well in staying Charles despite the unfortunate fate of Charles I.

    Charles III reign has been really quite good so far. Far better than expected given his unfortunate wife, and his sometimes unfortunate opinions. He's not getting everything right, but he's doing well. (PS I'm happy to accept any and all OBEs - If they're good enough for TBT, they're good enough for me)
    Charles has been lucky that expectations were so low. It's William that's going to have issues with delivery.
    "Delivery"? What is that?

    Heads on a block? New castle building? Harrying of the North? Chevauchée in France?

    What?
    I feel like Chevauchée needs a proper colourful anglo-saxon equivalent word, given its target.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
    The Red Wall are now beginning to grate on me .
  • Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
  • .
    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    As soon as someone decides it is and then thus it becomes as such.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    Omnium said:

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    He didn't choose his name. although he could have chosen a different Regnal name. I think he did well in staying Charles despite the unfortunate fate of Charles I.

    Charles III reign has been really quite good so far. Far better than expected given his unfortunate wife, and his sometimes unfortunate opinions. He's not getting everything right, but he's doing well. (PS I'm happy to accept any and all OBEs - If they're good enough for TBT, they're good enough for me)
    You need to join a South Korean girlband - and I just can't see it somehow.
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    nico679 said:

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
    The Red Wall are now beginning to grate on me .
    Hard cheese?
  • nico679 said:

    The BBC News showed Tory members discussing migration .One total arsehole said his idea of Brexit was sticking a cork in the Channel Tunnel

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MNZALcCzSg
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    So white fridays we pay full price but on black friday people get discounts? That's outrageous!

    Brown (and other) fridays just don't get a look in.

    Gammon friday sounds pretty tasty though.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    edited November 2023

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
    Another American tradition.

    If we are going to have a UK Thanksgiving surely it should be on the 13th of April every year if we are going to celebrate the massacre of Indians.
  • Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
    Very true. Let's see what they make of Starmer's Labour government. Whether they're disappointed again depends on why they're voting for him.
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Black Friday is the day after Thanksgiving - tons of adverts for "Black Friday sales" on the TV!
    I know it is probably cutting off my nose to spite my face but I make a point of refusing to buy anything at all on 'Black Friday' and also try to avoid buying from anyone doing the interminable Black Friday fortnight leading up to the benighted day.

    Since I am usually in full Christmas shopping mode at this point it is actually a nice rest from thinking about what to buy people. A day off.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    .

    Appears to be kicking off in Dublin due to rumours that the knifeman was an Algerian illegal immigrant (not saying it was, just that angry mobs have gathered due to social media saying this).

    The problem when the police / authorities make these really vague statements it allows all sorts of rumours to swirl and also the media ensure that when eye witnesses are interviewed they make sure things like race isn't mentioned, but I think that now makes people jump to conclusions.

    There were stories of disruption in Dublin yesterday, after a murderer was found to have been convicted of violence elsewhere. I was thinking this was the same story, then I see that there’s a serious knife attack in Dublin today.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,488
    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    rcs1000 said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    The UK has been great.

    But the scary thing is not "the EU", it is the election - and potential election - of politicians across the world who are openly hostile to Ukraine and sympathetic to Russia.

    And we need to make sure that we do everything in our power to support Ukraine at this time.
    Absolutely. I don't think the range of 'pro-Putin' leaders is large enugh yet to have much infuence on EU policy and hopefully never will. But I do worry about what happens if Le Pen wins in France and a few more countries move in that direction. The recent Polish election was a welcome move against that trend.

    I am interested in why it seems that so many voters in these countries are willing to put Ukraine (and there own security) at risk when such politicians really get no leverage in the UK. (Farage will never get elected to Parliament let alone lead a party in the House). Not least in some of the countries that suffered so badly under Soviet rule.

    I start from the basic principle there is no fundemental difference between a Brit and a Dutchman or Hungarian so what is it that drives them to elect these pro-Russian leaders?
    I wonder if longer term attitudes to Russia are different, so we are coming from a more Russia-sceptic starting point. Britain has been at loggerheads with Russia, except for a few short interludes, for nigh on 200 years. We fought them in Crimea, spent decades trying to counter their influence during the great game, gave support to the White Russians after the revolution, and were a prime actor in the cold war particularly in espionage. More recently we have been the favoured spot for Russian dissidents (two of which were subject to high profile poisonings on UK soil) and as Russia has declined from its once superpower status and America turns its attention to China, it finds itself facing the UK as its closest near-peer geopolitical foe.

    All that I think means our experience is very different from Germany, Italy and Benelux which long had more friendly relationships with Russia, or from France which stayed a little aloof from the cold war. It's not quite the blood-stained enmity that characterises Poland or the Baltic States, but it's a very long and vicious rivalry. So I don't think Russia appeasement is in the national DNA.
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
    Another American tradition.

    If we are going to have a UK Thanksgiving surely it should be on the 13th of April ever year if we are going to celebrate the massacre of Indians.
    Oooo. I can't bring myself to like that one but admire the cutting nature of the comment.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720
    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    10k more left than arrived, of course. So net emigration. But not as big as the net emigration of British citizens: 84k
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586

    Appears to be kicking off in Dublin due to rumours that the knifeman was an Algerian illegal immigrant (not saying it was, just that angry mobs have gathered due to social media saying this).

    The problem when the police / authorities make these really vague statements it allows all sorts of rumours to swirl and also the media ensure that when eye witnesses are interviewed they make sure things like race isn't mentioned, but I think that now makes people jump to conclusions.

    It is a bit of an impossible situation - expecting the police to deny every stupid theory out there….

    “No, it wasn’t Trans Woke Illegal Alien AIs. Or Plant Men from Barsoom…..”
  • I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
    Another American tradition.

    If we are going to have a UK Thanksgiving surely it should be on the 13th of April ever year if we are going to celebrate the massacre of Indians.
    Oooo. I can't bring myself to like that one but admire the cutting nature of the comment.
    You can see why my sense of humour gets me into trouble.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    nico679 said:

    The BBC News showed Tory members discussing migration .One total arsehole said his idea of Brexit was sticking a cork in the Channel Tunnel , the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    One of the group at least said he was concerned at leaving the ECHR which stopped me from throwing a projectile at the tv .

    Those 'vox pops' features are best avoided imo.
  • TimS said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    The UK has been great.

    But the scary thing is not "the EU", it is the election - and potential election - of politicians across the world who are openly hostile to Ukraine and sympathetic to Russia.

    And we need to make sure that we do everything in our power to support Ukraine at this time.
    Absolutely. I don't think the range of 'pro-Putin' leaders is large enugh yet to have much infuence on EU policy and hopefully never will. But I do worry about what happens if Le Pen wins in France and a few more countries move in that direction. The recent Polish election was a welcome move against that trend.

    I am interested in why it seems that so many voters in these countries are willing to put Ukraine (and there own security) at risk when such politicians really get no leverage in the UK. (Farage will never get elected to Parliament let alone lead a party in the House). Not least in some of the countries that suffered so badly under Soviet rule.

    I start from the basic principle there is no fundemental difference between a Brit and a Dutchman or Hungarian so what is it that drives them to elect these pro-Russian leaders?
    I wonder if longer term attitudes to Russia are different, so we are coming from a more Russia-sceptic starting point. Britain has been at loggerheads with Russia, except for a few short interludes, for nigh on 200 years. We fought them in Crimea, spent decades trying to counter their influence during the great game, gave support to the White Russians after the revolution, and were a prime actor in the cold war particularly in espionage. More recently we have been the favoured spot for Russian dissidents (two of which were subject to high profile poisonings on UK soil) and as Russia has declined from its once superpower status and America turns its attention to China, it finds itself facing the UK as its closest near-peer geopolitical foe.

    All that I think means our experience is very different from Germany, Italy and Benelux which long had more friendly relationships with Russia, or from France which stayed a little aloof from the cold war. It's not quite the blood-stained enmity that characterises Poland or the Baltic States, but it's a very long and vicious rivalry. So I don't think Russia appeasement is in the national DNA.
    And yet France has a very similar history to ourselves as far as Russia goes with the exception of the slightly warmer Cold War. I wonder if you are right in your wider thesis and that might be sufficient to lose the election for Le Pen?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,457
    edited November 2023

    Appears to be kicking off in Dublin due to rumours that the knifeman was an Algerian illegal immigrant (not saying it was, just that angry mobs have gathered due to social media saying this).

    The problem when the police / authorities make these really vague statements it allows all sorts of rumours to swirl and also the media ensure that when eye witnesses are interviewed they make sure things like race isn't mentioned, but I think that now makes people jump to conclusions.

    It is a bit of an impossible situation - expecting the police to deny every stupid theory out there….

    “No, it wasn’t Trans Woke Illegal Alien AIs. Or Plant Men from Barsoom…..”
    No, its not that. They know the situation instead you get this coded language of we have assessed it isn't terrorism then there is description of the individual is lacking any characteristics, media are super careful on eye witnesses again being incredibly vague or making strange statements like the BBC have a woman saying "the man" did this and that, the public brought him down, us Irish aren't savages, and then no more questions.

    And then people jump to a conclusion. Which doesn't mean the situation is what the mob believe, but rather say it is black gang stabbing, you get told them off the bat, so people jump to the very worst of conclusions.

    It breeds conspiracy.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    More are leaving than coming. Britain isn’t nasty but is let down by idiot politicians and some people who are imbeciles and shouldn’t be allowed to vote .
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    edited November 2023

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    And Halloween has already come seen and conquered.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,170
    edited November 2023
    Interesting how people were reading into the House of Commons "shouted out" phrase/word whatever suited them. Because one of the words that MPs love to shout out all the time (for some reason) is "oh!" and obviously if someone did that just after the first alleged swear word, it would have sounded, in combination, very similar to the other alleged phrase. That's very likely what happened imo.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,488
    edited November 2023
    TimS said:

    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    10k more left than arrived, of course. So net emigration. But not as big as the net emigration of British citizens: 84k
    Right, but we had a huge number in the past, so churn is to be expected.

    If I had asked you in June 2016 how many EU nationals would qualify, and would want to come to a hard brexit Britain in a year, would you have guessed as many as 129000?

    Admittedly, some may be qualifying with returnee settled or pre-settled status, but still....

    Would be interesting to know where the British Citizens are going...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting how people were reading into the House of Commons "shouted out" phrase/word whatever suited them. Because one of the words that MPs love to shout out all the time (for some reason) is "oh!" and obviously if someone did that just after the first alleged swear word, it would have sounded, in combination, very similar to the other alleged phrase. That's very likely what happened imo.

    Just get a lipreader on the case.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    nico679 said:

    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    More are leaving than coming. Britain isn’t nasty but is let down by idiot politicians and some people who are imbeciles and shouldn’t be allowed to vote .
    You said they weren’t coming any more. They are.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    Taz said:

    nico679 said:

    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    More are leaving than coming. Britain isn’t nasty but is let down by idiot politicians and some people who are imbeciles and shouldn’t be allowed to vote .
    You said they weren’t coming any more. They are.
    Jeez I think most understood the point I was making .
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    rcs1000 said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    The UK has been great.

    But the scary thing is not "the EU", it is the election - and potential election - of politicians across the world who are openly hostile to Ukraine and sympathetic to Russia.

    And we need to make sure that we do everything in our power to support Ukraine at this time.
    Absolutely. I don't think the range of 'pro-Putin' leaders is large enugh yet to have much infuence on EU policy and hopefully never will. But I do worry about what happens if Le Pen wins in France and a few more countries move in that direction. The recent Polish election was a welcome move against that trend.

    I am interested in why it seems that so many voters in these countries are willing to put Ukraine (and there own security) at risk when such politicians really get no leverage in the UK. (Farage will never get elected to Parliament let alone lead a party in the House). Not least in some of the countries that suffered so badly under Soviet rule.

    I start from the basic principle there is no fundemental difference between a Brit and a Dutchman or Hungarian so what is it that drives them to elect these pro-Russian leaders?
    A lot of people unable to see the bigger picture - Boris and Leon of this parish both come to mind - were extremely pro-Putin when it didn’t really matter. Since it has mattered, such fools have been very quick to try and cover their tracks.
  • .

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
    Another American tradition.

    If we are going to have a UK Thanksgiving surely it should be on the 13th of April every year if we are going to celebrate the massacre of Indians.
    Nah, 29th May to celebrate the restoration of the monarchy.
  • Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    TimS said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Of course the Tories will go for the moron vote. They’ll fill their heads with any old shite they can think of to get that cross in the box. Obvs immigration. Culture war bollocks. Backsliding on Brexit.

    The calculation is with the votes of clever, selfish amoral bastards who are happy to fuck the country as long as they think they’ll make (more) money from it and the morons who’ll be seduced by the bollocks the client media churn out - along with a few million, often southern but not exclusively, useful fucking idiots who aren’t especially rich or stupid and get shafted along with the rest of us but actually seem to believe the Tory shite despite the stark evidence of the last 13 years - will be just enough to win.

    And sadly, they might be right. It worked for Trump once, and may well do again.

    Did I see someone earlier saying they’ve sneaked through a massive increase in the cap on election spending? If so, there you go. Prepare for an avalanche of utter, utter shite to corral the mouth breathers. They’ll simply use massive funding from shady billionaires to attempt to lie their way to victory. Just like they did with Brexit.

    Ignoring the fact that Remain spent 45% more than Leave in the Brexit campaign. And that is even after ignoring all the additional Government spending promoting Remain that was not included in the calculations.

    So we were a bunch of Thickos who spent less money and STILL managed to beat you.

    No wonder you feel shit.
    Yea, but no-one knows how much Vlad spent on his campaign. He must have thought it well worth it, and it was a damn sight cheaper than invading another country.
    Funny when it actually led to the UK being a stronger opponent to Putin than the EU. Who could possibly have seen that coming.

    Next.
    The UK has been great.

    But the scary thing is not "the EU", it is the election - and potential election - of politicians across the world who are openly hostile to Ukraine and sympathetic to Russia.

    And we need to make sure that we do everything in our power to support Ukraine at this time.
    Absolutely. I don't think the range of 'pro-Putin' leaders is large enugh yet to have much infuence on EU policy and hopefully never will. But I do worry about what happens if Le Pen wins in France and a few more countries move in that direction. The recent Polish election was a welcome move against that trend.

    I am interested in why it seems that so many voters in these countries are willing to put Ukraine (and there own security) at risk when such politicians really get no leverage in the UK. (Farage will never get elected to Parliament let alone lead a party in the House). Not least in some of the countries that suffered so badly under Soviet rule.

    I start from the basic principle there is no fundemental difference between a Brit and a Dutchman or Hungarian so what is it that drives them to elect these pro-Russian leaders?
    I wonder if longer term attitudes to Russia are different, so we are coming from a more Russia-sceptic starting point. Britain has been at loggerheads with Russia, except for a few short interludes, for nigh on 200 years. We fought them in Crimea, spent decades trying to counter their influence during the great game, gave support to the White Russians after the revolution, and were a prime actor in the cold war particularly in espionage. More recently we have been the favoured spot for Russian dissidents (two of which were subject to high profile poisonings on UK soil) and as Russia has declined from its once superpower status and America turns its attention to China, it finds itself facing the UK as its closest near-peer geopolitical foe.

    All that I think means our experience is very different from Germany, Italy and Benelux which long had more friendly relationships with Russia, or from France which stayed a little aloof from the cold war. It's not quite the blood-stained enmity that characterises Poland or the Baltic States, but it's a very long and vicious rivalry. So I don't think Russia appeasement is in the national DNA.
    And yet France has a very similar history to ourselves as far as Russia goes with the exception of the slightly warmer Cold War. I wonder if you are right in your wider thesis and that might be sufficient to lose the election for Le Pen?
    I hope so. Though as with other things she seems to have become (or pretended to become) less Russophile recently.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    edited November 2023
    First world problems. The Telegraph is concerned that 16 and 17-year-olds with a spare £29,000 might miss out on exploiting a soon-to-close tax loophole.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/banking/savings-accounts/isa-loophole-children-chancellor-to-close-how-cash-in-now/ (£££)
  • Omnium said:

    Three sources familiar with the duchy’s expenditure confirmed the estate was using revenues collected from dead citizens to refurbish its profitable property portfolio, making considerable savings for the estate. One said duchy insiders regarded the bona vacantia expenditure, which has until now not been publicly disclosed, as akin to “free money” and a “slush fund”

    and people still think we should keep the monarchy...
    We should remind him what happened to the first King Charles.
    He didn't choose his name. although he could have chosen a different Regnal name. I think he did well in staying Charles despite the unfortunate fate of Charles I.

    Charles III reign has been really quite good so far. Far better than expected given his unfortunate wife, and his sometimes unfortunate opinions. He's not getting everything right, but he's doing well. (PS I'm happy to accept any and all OBEs - If they're good enough for TBT, they're good enough for me)
    We'd been told for decades that Prince Charles would call himself King George VII so it would be interesting to know who talked him out of it, and why.
    No, there was speculation by the usual 'expert' Royal watchers that he'd do that, but Charles himself had been saying since the 90s that he'd be Charles III.
  • First world problems. The Telegraph is concerned that 16 and 17-year-olds with a spare £29,000 might miss out on exploiting a soon-to-close tax loophole.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/banking/savings-accounts/isa-loophole-children-chancellor-to-close-how-cash-in-now/ (£££)

    The Telegraph self awareness is up there with This Morning spin and win a years heating bills.
  • Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965

    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
    Black Friday.

    Blue Monday.

    We need a colour for each day of the week.
  • Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This is pointless shoot the messenger analysis. What was the message Leave voters were trying to send and why?

    Making some effort to understand that and then for politicians to respond to it would be a damn sight more useful. One day someone might actually get round to it.

    Instead we get "oh they're all thickos" followed by "hooray!" when they vote the Tories out. And then they'll be ignored again.

    Although you could say Leave voters (esp in the red wall) are being the very opposite of ignored. They got their Referendum via Nigel Farage, their Brexit via Boris Johnson, and now Keir Starmer has to a large extent based his political project on winning them over.
    And they don't seem overly chuffed with what they've chosen in each case.
    Underlying problem is Brexit was a coalition of at least three different and contradictory paths for the country, none of which are close to having enough support to sustain a government on their own. Inevitable that it was going to end in disappointment with the government implementing it.
    And that was either very clever (you don't get anywhere near 52% without it) or very stupid (it meant the ensuing shambles was inevitable).

    One of the groups I have least time for is the cadre of civilised leavers who made common cause with Farage and then got upset when remainers couldn't save them from a harder Brexit than they wanted.

    You dance with the one who bring ya, as our American friends say.
  • Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
    Black Friday.

    Blue Monday.

    We need a colour for each day of the week.
    Ruby Tuesday.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
    Black Friday.

    Blue Monday.

    We need a colour for each day of the week.
    The problem with Black Friday to UK ears, aside from the cultural importation of it all, is it sounds like the date of a financial crash.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We don’t need another bank holiday. Usually just a waste of a day off. I’d rather we got rid of all of them except maybe Christmas and Boxing Day, and just increased the minimum number of annual paid leave days businesses have to give their staff.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
    Black Friday.

    Blue Monday.

    We need a colour for each day of the week.
    Ruby Tuesday.
    Chilled on Sunday
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    TimS said:

    Sandpit said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    How long before “Black Friday” is racist?
    Already is.

    “BUT WHEN IS WHITE FRIDAY?”



    https://twitter.com/mnrrntt/status/1200122137178181633
    I want an Asian Friday!
    Black Friday.

    Blue Monday.

    We need a colour for each day of the week.
    The problem with Black Friday to UK ears, aside from the cultural importation of it all, is it sounds like the date of a financial crash.
    It's actually a plot by John Major loyalists to erase Black Wednesday.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965
    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We don’t need another bank holiday. Usually just a waste of a day off. I’d rather we got rid of all of them except maybe Christmas and Boxing Day, and just increased the minimum number of annual paid leave days businesses have to give their staff.
    Where I work we have that flexibility. As long as you have something useful to do, you can work Christmas Day and have another day off in the summer.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    edited November 2023
    nico679 said:

    Taz said:

    nico679 said:

    carnforth said:

    nico679 said:

    the fxcking imbecile should be reminded that EU nationals aren’t coming anymore.

    129000 EU citizens chose Nasty Brexit Britain as their new home in 2022.

    Feel free to explain to them how imbecilic they are.
    More are leaving than coming. Britain isn’t nasty but is let down by idiot politicians and some people who are imbeciles and shouldn’t be allowed to vote .
    You said they weren’t coming any more. They are.
    Jeez I think most understood the point I was making .
    The responses you are getting clearly shows how poorly you made your point.

    Never mind. It’s been a long day. You posted nonsense for likes. Try FBPE twitter.
  • TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We don’t need another bank holiday. Usually just a waste of a day off. I’d rather we got rid of all of them except maybe Christmas and Boxing Day, and just increased the minimum number of annual paid leave days businesses have to give their staff.
    Where I work we have that flexibility. As long as you have something useful to do, you can work Christmas Day and have another day off in the summer.
    What happens the other 330 days a year when there is time spare to post on pb?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,586

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We'll need something to give thanks for first, shirley?
  • Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We'll need something to give thanks for first, shirley?
    That the UK is awesome, so many Johnny Foreigners want to live here and the fact that Scotland, London, and the UK are ruled by non whites, hurrah for tolerance and diversity.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We don’t need another bank holiday. Usually just a waste of a day off. I’d rather we got rid of all of them except maybe Christmas and Boxing Day, and just increased the minimum number of annual paid leave days businesses have to give their staff.
    Where I work we have that flexibility. As long as you have something useful to do, you can work Christmas Day and have another day off in the summer.
    On a related topic I seem to have cocked up my timesheet last year because when I got my distribution details this week they’d deducted 3.5 hours for “unpaid leave”.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,586

    First world problems. The Telegraph is concerned that 16 and 17-year-olds with a spare £29,000 might miss out on exploiting a soon-to-close tax loophole.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/banking/savings-accounts/isa-loophole-children-chancellor-to-close-how-cash-in-now/ (£££)

    First decile problems.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We'll need something to give thanks for first, shirley?
    Attenborough day?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,457
    edited November 2023
    The Bristol Airport bus shelter is getting brutally mocked on the tw@tters, so much so its trending.

    All publicity is good publicity and all that.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    The Bristol Airport bus shelter is getting brutally mocked on the tw@tters, so much so its trending.

    All publicity is good publicity and all that.

    It is absolutely iconic / symptomatic.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    We don’t need another bank holiday. Usually just a waste of a day off. I’d rather we got rid of all of them except maybe Christmas and Boxing Day, and just increased the minimum number of annual paid leave days businesses have to give their staff.
    Where I work we have that flexibility. As long as you have something useful to do, you can work Christmas Day and have another day off in the summer.
    What happens the other 330 days a year when there is time spare to post on pb?
    I always maintain that I work 24/7.

    24 minutes an hour, 7 hours a day.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,794

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    Not just you, Black Friday is a result of Thanksgiving, so it is inevitable.
    I might shoot myself.
    Another American tradition.

    If we are going to have a UK Thanksgiving surely it should be on the 13th of April every year if we are going to celebrate the massacre of Indians.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jallianwala_Bagh_massacre
  • This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/
  • TimS said:

    The Bristol Airport bus shelter is getting brutally mocked on the tw@tters, so much so its trending.

    All publicity is good publicity and all that.

    It is absolutely iconic / symptomatic.
    Forget La Sagrada Familia, the Blue Mosque, Angkor Wat...
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800
    Evening all :)

    24 hours on from the Dutch election and there still seems to be a sense of shock and "bewildersment" over what happened. The PVV got by far its best ever result with 23.5% of the vote and 37 seats.

    To this observer, the VVD leader Yesilgoz made the cardinal error of conceding she could work with the PVV which effectively legitimised voting for the PVV as they could be part or indeed lead the Government. Omtzigt's NSC, having been on course to win 30 seats a few weeks ago, ended up with 20, again, I think, due to equivocating on working with the PVV.

    Tindemanns and the Green-Labour Bloc had a decent night and could lead a Government consisting of themselves, the VVD and NSC plus perhaps D66 and the CDA (the lattre two having taken big losses). All the minor parties lost ground as 106 of the 150 seats went to the main four groups.

    A PPV-VVD-NSC coalition would also enjoy a majority in the House of Representatives so the question for both the VVD and NSC is whether they would rather be junior partners in a PVV Government or equals in a Green-Labour Government.
  • This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/

    Yeah but rugger is for poshos...
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965

    This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/

    Voters are more interested in League in the Red Wall.
  • Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.

    Foxy said:

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    When my family moved back from America we held thanksgiving each year, at least until we all went our seperate ways.

    It's a lovely celebration. Family and friends, eating and drinking, a bit like Christmas without the materialism and consumerism.
    Don't care.

    We are not American.
    If we get another bank holiday out of it then I am all in favour of a UK Thanksgiving.
    Then you should support one to celebrate the Restoration annually.
  • This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/

    Yeah but rugger is for poshos...
    It has always amused my friends that normally I am a very calm non sweary person but that always changed when I watch rugby union match involving England.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,457
    edited November 2023

    This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/

    Yeah but rugger is for poshos...
    It has always amused my friends that normally I am a very calm non sweary person but that always changed when I watch rugby union match involving England.
    Well the way they play, kick kick kick kick kick...give the massive battering ram in the centre one touch a game....more kicking....no arm tackles....it could drive even a good Muslim boy like yourself to drink.
  • My word, I agree with Just Stop Oil in this instance.

    Just Stop Oil disrupt St Paul's Thanksgiving service with silent protest in front of hundreds of worshippers

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1727692288799707541
  • This should be an easy win for Starmer.

    The BBC’s hopes of retaining the Six Nations have suffered a further blow after the Government refused calls to protect it from the threat of pay-TV.

    Ministers are also set to ignore those to have played in and broadcast the iconic competition, who want it added to the so-called ‘Crown Jewels’ list of sporting events that cannot be hidden behind a paywall.

    The calls came after the BBC’s outgoing director of sport, Barbara Slater, warned it faced a fight to retain the Six Nations and her counterpart at joint rights holder ITV, Niall Sloane, said fears the competition could be lost from terrestrial television were “well-founded”.

    That followed the news, first revealed by Telegraph Sport, that the tournament could be sold alongside a new world league, increasing the chances of it not remaining entirely free-to-air.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/11/23/bbc-six-nations-government-defies-pay-tv-crown-jewells/

    Yeah but rugger is for poshos...
    It has always amused my friends that normally I am a very calm non sweary person but that always changed when I watch rugby union match involving England.
    Well the way they play, kick kick kick kick kick...give the massive battering ram in the centre one touch a game....more kicking....no arm tackles....it could drive even a good Muslim boy like yourself to drink.
    I once shouted 'truck and fucking trailer' so loud people 15 street away heard it.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,457
    edited November 2023

    My word, I agree with Just Stop Oil in this instance.

    Just Stop Oil disrupt St Paul's Thanksgiving service with silent protest in front of hundreds of worshippers

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1727692288799707541

    Can we not just section these people? They have clearly lost their minds.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,095

    I've noticed a tiny amount of Thanksgiving creep into the UK today, this year.

    Anyone else noticed this?

    Please tell me we're not going to be colonised by that as well.

    It makes perfect sense to stuff yourself before the season of abstinence and fasting that is Advent…
  • My word, I agree with Just Stop Oil in this instance.

    Just Stop Oil disrupt St Paul's Thanksgiving service with silent protest in front of hundreds of worshippers

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1727692288799707541

    Can we not just section these people? They have clearly lost their minds.
    Christians? Sure.
This discussion has been closed.