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Fewer than half of Tory voters want Sunak to keep Braverman as Home Secretary – politicalbetting.com
Fewer than half of Tory voters want Sunak to keep Braverman as Home Secretary – politicalbetting.com
Do you think Rishi Sunak should keep Suella Braverman as Home Secretary or should he sack her?Should keep: 22% (Con 2019 voters: 48%)Should sack: 49% (Con 2019 voters: 31%)Don't know: 29% (Con 2019 voters: 21%)https://t.co/6LLAUBp6ck pic.twitter.com/E7xegIsJNr
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Where did I get my sense of timing?
Did Suella Braverman not call this entirely wrong, in that the Pro-Palestine Anti-Israel demo was the more peaceful of the two?
Proportionally, more of the defend-the-cenotaph mob were up for a fight. But there were hardly any of them. In absolute numbers, there were far more violent anti-Israels than anti-anti-Israels.
The numbers speak for themselves. The 49% of 2019 Tory voters who want to keep her is more than double the 22% who don't. If you were to split the DKs equally (and I suspect if they were forced to choose, they would go more with keeping her than sacking her but that's an assumption), then nearly two-thirds of 2019 Tory voters want to keep her.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67390514
At least they had their eye on that well known, rightwing troublemaker, Leon.
'One live feed from a police helicopter was powerful enough to show a man sitting in a pub window and how much he had left in his drink.'
NEW: Reshuffle latest — the Whitehall comms grid for tomorrow is very, very empty.
“No 10: Redacted”
“TBC”
👀
The Rwanda policy from the start has been just smoke and mirrors .
Those anti-semitic actions that occurred are despicable & I look forward to the perpetrators being prosecuted to the full extent of the law. The black bloc types that launched fireworks at police at the end of the day will no doubt find their collars being felt in due course.
But the Met themselves do seem pretty clear about which group they had the most trouble with.
Which is why the Conservatives are in so much trouble. The centrist candid friends have largely given up for now.
Is that an oxymoron?
For a start, most of the 126 were on the grounds of "to prevent a breach of the peace" i.e. it was proactive measures by the Police. If you wanted to apply the same standard - which I know you don't - the Police equally should have been arresting those with Hamas headbands, flags equating Israel with the Nazis etc but they didn't.
Which leads onto the second point. The reason the Police arrested the football thugs was because Plod felt so comfortable due to the very small number of them. The Police obviously didn't have the same 'confidence' when it came to those committing arrestable offences on the pro-Palestine march. Some of those whom they have identified may be arrested later but it is clear the Police turned a blind eye - at the time - to some of the slogans carried. Even the bBC admitted that (although hidden away in its reporting) that the Police were not apprehending people proactively.
So comparing the two sets of figures and saying they are like for like is misleading.
Well, yes. If you ignore - mainly deliberately - the actions of one group, then it is very easy to say yopu only had trouble with one side.
The near victim of this and those who witnessed it may disagree. Funnily enough, no Plod in this picture.
https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1723410151472812306
"I don't know, what is the secr-" "Timing"
"Sunak won't sack Braverman until Monday if he has any sense; if he sacked her tomorrow and the Remembrance ceremony is disrupted she'll be telling everyone she is vindicated."
https://twitter.com/PeterTatchell/status/1723441409410158949
I hope this particular shithead gets what he deserves too.
So far, I have been impressed - generally - by both Biden and Starmer on this. While in both cases, there have been obvious political considerations, they seem sincere in their views.
However, the longer this conflict goes on, dominates the headlines and the protests etc on western streets continue, the greater is going to be the political strains especially if the intensity of feeling stays the same.
I'd argue that is more of an issue for the left than the right given the latter doesn't rely so much on the pro-Palestinian vote nor the student political types who like to go on marches.
If I was Biden or Starmer I would want this to end quickly *
* Yes, everyone does but...
Can Suella prescribe the Labour Party as a terrorist organisation?
Both sides should have been confronted equally, in the same way and under the same principles. But if you think that allowing demonstrators to compare Israel's actions with Nazis or what is happening in Gaza with Auschwitz are not incidents where the Police should have taken action immediately, then I do not know what to say,
As for the sh1thead - and all shi1theads on all sides - they should get what they deserve. My fear is they won't. The crew from Blackburn who went through North West London shouting 'rape Jewish wives, rape their daughters' got arrested but not charged, Plod wants to be seen to be doing something but - as is too common unfortunately - will eventually let things slide when the noise dies down for fear of impacting 'community relations'.
+++dit dit dit+++dit dit dit+++dit dit dit+++dit dit dit+++
THERE IS NO NEWS
And of course the former outnumbered the latter by about 1000 to 1. Literally: 300,000 v 300
I can’t work it out. Is it because you don’t want to appear racist? Surely not. Is it because - for some reason - you honestly don’t believe it? Again that’s hard to credit
So what is it? Is it some political fear of vindicating Suella Braverman? If so, that is pathetic. This is way bigger than party politics
The police don’t usually arrest people at a demo unless they believe they have absolutely no choice: It’s an enormous pain, takes away precious officers handling the arrest who could be managing the demo & keeping everyone else safe & put individual officers at risk. Plus it risks aggravating the crowd & making things worse.
What actually happens is records are kept, photos are taken, witnesses are noted & people get arrested after the fact if they’ve made arrestable actions that weren’t deemed worth arresting them for at the time. See, by way of evidence for this policy, the list of “do you know this person?” images on the Met twitter feed right now, mostly pro-palestinian marchers of one kind or another. I imagine they’ll get what’s coming to them.
The primary concern of the police at an event like this is /keeping the peace/. Arresting everyone who commits a crime on the day itself doesn’t even enter into the calculation: It would be a spectacularly stupid approach to policing a large demo.
I can’t work it out. Is it because you are a racist Islamophobe? Surely not. Is it because - for some reason - you honestly believe it? Again that’s hard to credit that you regard people who are asking for a ceasefire to protect innocent civilians including thousands of children as a menace.
It's really hard to understand. I'm genuinely puzzled.
Is Hunt immovable, that’s the question. Given the proximity of the autumn statement I assume so.
"Huh?"
"Gove will tear us apart...."
I did some demonstration training with CAAT a few years back, so probably a little out of date now.
Not the actions of someone expecting to lose their job in the next few days.
https://x.com/KevinASchofield/status/1723731454721421656?s=20
dude, as just a casual but frequent follower of this forum, i come on here to get views on *shock*... POLITICAL BETTING. every single thread is hijacked by you trying to create division. if you're so angry about pro palestinian marches, go and join tommy robinson or whatever his name and march against it, or go and spread your bile on breitbart or guido or whatever echo chamber cares about your ramblings, rather than attacking, in my opinion, incredibly balanced members of what is a fruitful place to discuss politics generally. you're hijacking a useful and thoughtful forum of discussion because you clearly have some unresolved issues and (i can only assume) dont have a real life friendship group to debate with.
the funniest thing if im not even pro palestinian. i abhor the escalatory marches in the wake of an appalling terrorist attack and wish they weren't happening because it WILL increase antisemtism in our beautiful city. the irony is that you cant see your ridiculous/fake hyperbole will also lead to even more hate crimes to the 'other side' ... ie peace loving muslims and 'woke lefties'. good on you bro
a few days ago didnt you say 'im bored of israel-gaza now?' absolutely appalling.
god forbid you werent around in 1942 when they started publishing articles on the holocaust.
luckily you would have had no influence then either
Would that it were just "people who are asking for a ceasefire to protect innocent civilians including thousands of children" but that's quite blatantly not the agenda of some. This is what people are complaining about and rightly say is menacing. Those who don't see it's a problem are in denial and will damage their own cause by letting things go that taint any movement that's supposedly about 'peace'.
Here's James O'Brien enlightening us. It's an anti Jewish conspiracy theory apparently, what a surprise.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JdFw-EU2GM
I don’t even agree with the marches: I think they are frightening and antisemitic and wrong. Marauding the families of war dead is beneath contempt: it reminds me of the protest planned by Anjem Choudary, a terrorist, in 2010. He wanted to march 500 fake coffins through Wootton Bassett to mock fallen British soldiers. It is obvious Jewish people need protecting. But why is it this artless, self-promoting mediocrity who has to do it? Haven’t they suffered enough?
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/these-marches-should-have-been-a-dream-for-the-tories-then-braverman-stepped-up-gcz9hzwfw
"The police don’t usually arrest people at a demo unless they believe they have absolutely no choice: It’s an enormous pain, takes away precious officers handling the arrest who could be managing the demo & keeping everyone else safe & put individual officers at risk. Plus it risks aggravating the crowd & making things worse." - no, the Police will not arrest at the time if they think it causes too much aggro but will quite happily arrest if they think the consequences are manageable. WHich is why the Police arrested the Yobs because ir was manageable to do so.
It is clear the Police handled the two demonstrations in different ways - they arrested the yobs (which is right) but let protestors with hateful symbols have them on full display without any attempt to even chide them or ask them to take them down, Hence, together with the polling out today, why it now looks like Bravermann is safe.
Who is a particular idiot is Matt Twist who is now going back to "community relations' being damaged. I thought we got rid of that garbage when it was realised the Police were using it not to arrest grooming gangs at the height of their actions. Obviously not. Also what is quite noticeable is the Met doesn't seem to be getting a huge amount of support from other Police forces - make of that what you will.
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There is of course a fourth alternative. You are anti Semitic. And that is possibly the solution, because you simply can’t admit that. Hence the lack of an answer
@PolitlcsUK
🚨 NEW: Suella Braverman is considering resigning on Wednesday if the Supreme Court deems the Rwanda policy unlawful so she can escape the backlash
No 10 has a "low expectation of success" - Home Office drawing up contingencies
Richi needs to sack her tomorrow
Offensive signs and chants can be dealt with later, without tying up police resources on the day.
Just operational efficiency.
The vast majority were upset for the innocents who are dying in their thousands and just want a ceasefire.
Personally I would like to see a ceasing of the bombing and more focus on destroying the tunnels and the pumps and fans that maintain them - not a total ceasefire that Hamas would disregard anyway. It means taking a risk with the hostages but that is war.
So I’ve “hijacked” a thread about the Gaza/israel confrontation by… discussing the Gaza/israel confrontation?
Other than that, good point
Whether or not she's fully aware of its baggage is an interesting question.
The hooligans would have turned up at the Cenotaph anyway. It's laughable that they were there in response to what she said. Everyone knew it from the moment the protesters said they would be marching on Armistice day that **** and some thugs itching for a fight would be there.
She has drawn attention to the Jew hatred that other politicians have been afraid to discuss for fear of inflaming tensions. Take a perfectly moderate Jew like Stephen Pollard who's reaction to her Times column was 'At last.' Will she be replaced by someone who'll be as prepared to call out antisemitism?
That said she shows no sign of thinking about the impact her words have, seems far more keen on headlines than substance and is in her element among Tory grassroots not as a government minister.
Having now witnessed it in action, the police found it easier to address the football hooligans because they were such a tiny number. However the police also showed prudence there - they didn’t overdo the arrests (even when one was justified) when it was obvious that doing nothing would keep things calmer
I came away with increased respect for the Plod, as I have said
It's notable that Peter Tatchell turned up with a placard denouncing Israel and Hamas. You'd have thought that would be the perfect message for peace. After all, any peace worth the name won't happen until the latter is gone, and the former change their policies. But he was removed by the misnomered 'Stop the War Coalition' - one of the big organisers because it would 'cause trouble'.
No one's saying it's everyone. But there is a rotten element to this movement that needs excising, because they are out to spread fear and hatred. It was true long before October 7th - but is much more urgent now given its impact. They should be treated in the same way as thugs and racists on the right and told to do one.
Half jokingly, I have suggested that, if the NYT wants to defeat Trump, they should endorse him. That newspaper, and the US "mainstream" media generally, are so distrusted by much of the public that their attacks often help him.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/labour-set-to-do-better-than-blairs-1997-landslide-at-next-election-poll-says-f7ghfb6bs
https://twitter.com/PolitlcsUK/status/1723674479400759330?t=vE-FO1ik7_T1tsN2D7jeWw&s=19
Can Sunak regain any authority in his party?
Sack Braverman and he risks a damaging split with the blue bluekipper entryists, back her and he looks like a puppet. He has lost control of events entirely and things only get worse from here.
However this is only your sixth comment. So perhaps you will improve - or never be heard from again
That Suella Braverman is making a statement after such a long pause would rather suggest that, at least for now, the Home Secretary is keeping her job
@jessphillips
The Prime Minister is happy to pick sloganeering and electioneering over the safety and security of the UK. The man is a spineless and pathetic. The nation cannot wait to get rid.
You’re a Russian bot with a new technique. Calling it
Some of the other results look unlikely; Labour gain Winchester looks pretty implausible. I guess one of the problems at the moment is that there's no way for an MRP to take account of the "how many bajillion Focus leaflets are going through letterboxes" factor.
Fun fact: the poll was carried out by Survation on behalf of the UK Spirits Alliance. Basically it shows the Conservatives don't have a ghost of a chance.
Braverman is so transparently trying to get returned to the backbenches so she can campaign for the post-election leadership contest, that I'd not be surprised if she turns up roaring drunk to the Home Office on Monday morning, punches a security guard, and takes a dump on the Permanent Secretary's desk. Even then, Sunak will probably claim that, whilst he'd have phrased it differently, she was making a broadly valid point. You read it here first.
I still suspect she'll be sacked. Sunak insists on dotting the i's and crossing the t's.