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Starmer extends his approval lead over Sunak – politicalbetting.com

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  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    malcolmg said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Why do politicians keep being asked about penises?

    Can't we mature the debate a bit?

    Because politicians keep saying that women have them.
    They keep being ASKED if they do, Ed Davey didn't bring it up.

    How would you field this question? How would you feel if you were a trans person who really felt they were a woman with the way they are talked about? Why can't we have a more mature conversation and look at this with some kindness and sympathy.
    Davey (and Starmer) knows he’s going to be asked the question, and has known for years that he’ll be asked the question.

    Yet he still doesn’t have anything close to a coherent answer on the subject.

    If and when he has a straight answer, the line of questioning would stop.
    I’ve some sympathy for them. It’s a hideously divisive and thorny topic. But then it’s their own mad woke identity politics that have led them here so that sympathy is limited
    The Gender Recognition Act of 2004 (and many countries have similar) provides a legal route for someone to change their gender without being compelled to have surgery. No country that has introduced this social reform has ever reversed it and no mainstream political party in the UK (inc the Conservatives) is proposing to repeal it here. So what I conclude is that these 'gotcha' questions about women and penises etc seek to provoke and confuse rather than enlighten.
    My point was more political. The question will now always be asked - you can’t wish it away - and a clever politician needs a ready answer that doesn’t sound insane to 70% of voters

    I’d go with “no, a woman can’t have a penis. That’s a trans woman”. But I thank allah I am not a politician in this case
    I’d go on the offensive. “You think this is such a fucking gotcha don’t you. Are you actually interested in the answer or are you just being oh so edgy? Ask me sensible questions about policy on trans rights and I’ll happily answer, but don’t give me all this shit. And don’t go protesting that you’re just voicing “real concerns”, you’re not. You’re trying for a gotcha”.

    Or something along those lines. It’s the embarrassed faffing around the topic that looks so silly.
    Or just tell the truth
    The truth is weaponised though. The reality is - and I appreciate this may seem wishywashy, more nuanced.

    I could answer that a pre-op trans woman with
    a penis is, as far as most daily activities in society and how she should be treated by the public, a woman. People may disagree, but it’s how we’ve actually treated trans people for decades.

    I could also answer that someone with a plonker is obviously a biological man. That’s also true.

    It’s like asking “is someone with facial stubble an adult?”. The right answer is it really depends on context.

    But good luck to anyone stupid enough to try to make this sort of argument on This Morning. You’ll by hated by everyone on all sides.

    And with that I’m heading into the lounge to carpe diem.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    The US news networks are going to be in heaven with De Santis entering the race tomorrow. And of course the debates will be tuned into like never before with the likely onstage fireworks . Pass the popcorn.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,760
    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    edited May 2023

    Leon said:

    x

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Cummings v Milne is an interesting parallel debate
    Not really. Cummings is super intelligent and wins elections and referendums. I’ve seen no evidence for Milne being even smart and he certainly never won any elections

    Milne is a classic posho public school Marxist. The Winchester version of bouji grammar school Corbyn
    And a lot of people who lost a referendum think that Cummings is super evil, while not having much at all to say about the man who wrote Corbyn's Salisbury response
    There you go again.

    Both Seumas Milne and Dom Cummings are absolute shits of the highest order.

    The taxpayers have paid out substantial money because of the latter's bullying.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/13/special-adviser-sacked-by-dominic-cummings-to-receive-payoff
    Yes but Milne is a Marxist traitor. This stuff isn’t hard

    Milne supports Islamists and cheered on 9/11. He got jihadists in to write for the guardian. He thinks Stalin is cool

    Cummings might be an arrogant dick and even a bully but if you can’t see the crucial political difference between the two of them then there’s no hope for you
    It seems to be a more interesting parallel than you gave it credit for
    Btw I’ve been meaning to ask. Did you hear any Breton spoken on your recent hols?

    I’m reading a book about old pagan Europe and it’s talking about Celtic languages and I’ve realised I’ve never heard Breton spoken in real life

    I’ve heard every other extant Celtic tongue. Welsh, Irish, Gallic - but not Breton

    Wiki claims a lot of speakers but I wonder
    I'm sure I did hear it in a few of the bar/tabac/betting shops I stopped in for refreshments

    One in particular, in Guingamp where I had a few beers watching the end of (I think) Arsenal beating Newcastle. I was stood at the bar and didn't understand or recognise anything that more than half of the locals were speaking. I usually do somewhat better than that with French

    I became more popular there with a few "yecʼhed mat" shouts
    Obliged for the very useful Breton lesson - yecʼhed mat back at ye!

    AND must say I find your formulation "I was stood at the bar" as interesting.

    Sounds like something a West Virginia hillbilly could say. And maybe a few other localities in USA but not many.

    NOT that I ever heard one actually heard any American actually say it, that way. I like it.

    EDIT - though sadly I HAVE been stood UP at the bar . . .
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172

    LOL.

    Turns out Boris Johnson's lawyers are Oakeshott & Oakeshott, well known for their discretion and not screwing people over.

    It's not a surname which inspires much confidence.
    Bit like Farage and Farage.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,956
    UPDATE: Privileges Committee say they will take this new evidence into account when they decide whether or not Boris Johnson misled MPs. It is unlikely to help his case.

    Full statement here…




    https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1661076303108251649
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    ..
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,433
    In other news:

    Today I reached 10,000 km (6,200 miles) run since I took up running at the end of 2016.

    I'm feeling quite proud of that.

    If you add it onto the distance of walks on my website, then I'm only 130 miles from having walked or run around the circumference of the Earth's equator...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    edited May 2023

    Can a biological woman have a penis? No. Can a trans woman have a penis? Yes.

    Can we move on now please?

    Personally, the point at which I would recognise a trans woman as a woman (and vice versa) would be upon gender reassignment surgery following a medical diagnosis. And I believe this is the point at which the law should recognise the change of gender too. When someone has taken that very profound step, it is unkind and impolite to continue to call them by their birth gender.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,268

    Can a biological woman have a penis? No. Can a trans woman have a penis? Yes.

    Can we move on now please?

    Personally, the point at which I would recognise a trans woman as a woman (and vice versa) would be upon gender reassignment surgery following a medical diagnosis. And I believe this is the point at which the law should recognise the change of gender too. When someone has taken that very profound step, it is unkind and impolite to continue to call them by their birth gender.
    Does it not still depend on the context? The integrity of elite women's sport depends on it being a category based on biology, regardless of any medical procedures someone has undertaken.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,972

    In other news:

    Today I reached 10,000 km (6,200 miles) run since I took up running at the end of 2016.

    I'm feeling quite proud of that.

    If you add it onto the distance of walks on my website, then I'm only 130 miles from having walked or run around the circumference of the Earth's equator...

    Chapeau, Sir. Genuinely impressive.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807

    Can a biological woman have a penis? No. Can a trans woman have a penis? Yes.

    Can we move on now please?

    Personally, the point at which I would recognise a trans woman as a woman (and vice versa) would be upon gender reassignment surgery following a medical diagnosis. And I believe this is the point at which the law should recognise the change of gender too. When someone has taken that very profound step, it is unkind and impolite to continue to call them by their birth gender.
    Does it not still depend on the context? The integrity of elite women's sport depends on it being a category based on biology, regardless of any medical procedures someone has undertaken.
    Yes. I would not allow male to female transsexuals to compete as women in any women's sporting events.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    Dura_Ace said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
    Alcohol on flights is pretty awful.
    Unless you're a complete dipso.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632
    Farooq said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Why do politicians keep being asked about penises?

    Can't we mature the debate a bit?

    Because politicians keep saying that women have them.
    They keep being ASKED if they do, Ed Davey didn't bring it up.

    How would you field this question? How would you feel if you were a trans person who really felt they were a woman with the way they are talked about? Why can't we have a more mature conversation and look at this with some kindness and sympathy.
    Davey (and Starmer) knows he’s going to be asked the question, and has known for years that he’ll be asked the question.

    Yet he still doesn’t have anything close to a coherent answer on the subject.

    If and when he has a straight answer, the line of questioning would stop.
    I’ve some sympathy for them. It’s a hideously divisive and thorny topic. But then it’s their own mad woke identity politics that have led them here so that sympathy is limited
    The Gender Recognition Act of 2004 (and many countries have similar) provides a legal route for someone to change their gender without being compelled to have surgery. No country that has introduced this social reform has ever reversed it and no mainstream political party in the UK (inc the Conservatives) is proposing to repeal it here. So what I conclude is that these 'gotcha' questions about women and penises etc seek to provoke and confuse rather than enlighten.
    Interestingly, I've never heard anyone ask whether a man can have a uterus. It always seems to be the other way around.
    Yes the popular 'debate' is mainly about M to F transition for reasons both understandable and less so. Although there was that fuss about the NHS referring to 'people with a cervix' rather than 'women' on materials for cervical cancer screening.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    x

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Cummings v Milne is an interesting parallel debate
    Not really. Cummings is super intelligent and wins elections and referendums. I’ve seen no evidence for Milne being even smart and he certainly never won any elections

    Milne is a classic posho public school Marxist. The Winchester version of bouji grammar school Corbyn
    And a lot of people who lost a referendum think that Cummings is super evil, while not having much at all to say about the man who wrote Corbyn's Salisbury response
    There you go again.

    Both Seumas Milne and Dom Cummings are absolute shits of the highest order.

    The taxpayers have paid out substantial money because of the latter's bullying.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/13/special-adviser-sacked-by-dominic-cummings-to-receive-payoff
    Yes but Milne is a Marxist traitor. This stuff isn’t hard

    Milne supports Islamists and cheered on 9/11. He got jihadists in to write for the guardian. He thinks Stalin is cool

    Cummings might be an arrogant dick and even a bully but if you can’t see the crucial political difference between the two of them then there’s no hope for you
    It seems to be a more interesting parallel than you gave it credit for
    Btw I’ve been meaning to ask. Did you hear any Breton spoken on your recent hols?

    I’m reading a book about old pagan Europe and it’s talking about Celtic languages and I’ve realised I’ve never heard Breton spoken in real life

    I’ve heard every other extant Celtic tongue. Welsh, Irish, Gallic - but not Breton

    Wiki claims a lot of speakers but I wonder
    I'm sure I did hear it in a few of the bar/tabac/betting shops I stopped in for refreshments

    One in particular, in Guingamp where I had a few beers watching the end of (I think) Arsenal beating Newcastle. I was stood at the bar and didn't understand or recognise anything that more than half of the locals were speaking. I usually do somewhat better than that with French

    I became more popular there with a few "yecʼhed mat" shouts
    Good to hear. Wiki claims 200,000 speakers which is a LOT - but down from 1m 50 years ago

    I love hearing rare languages. I heard Siwi in Siwa. Just 20,000 speakers in the world. Marvellous

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siwi_language
    Have you ever considered advancing yourself, by attending Berber college?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    ...
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    edited May 2023
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
    Alcohol on flights is pretty awful.
    Unless you're a complete dipso.
    *sips gin on flight*

    What???

    Getting fucked up on flights is a gas. Especially on the good stuff in biz and beyond

    Haven’t you already said you don’t particularly like booze? Similarly the teetotal @Dura_Ace
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,980
    Has anyone on Corbyn/Starmer's 2017-19 election team admitted yet that they were campaigning for the end of Ukraine?

    Or do they ludicrously claim (like Palmer a trois) that Corbyn and Milne wouldn't have ended support for Ukraine?
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
    Alcohol on flights is pretty awful.
    Unless you're a complete dipso.
    It’s free (well, paid for). Therefore good.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”

    My heart bleeds! What a bunch of arxeholes.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    x

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Cummings v Milne is an interesting parallel debate
    Not really. Cummings is super intelligent and wins elections and referendums. I’ve seen no evidence for Milne being even smart and he certainly never won any elections

    Milne is a classic posho public school Marxist. The Winchester version of bouji grammar school Corbyn
    And a lot of people who lost a referendum think that Cummings is super evil, while not having much at all to say about the man who wrote Corbyn's Salisbury response
    There you go again.

    Both Seumas Milne and Dom Cummings are absolute shits of the highest order.

    The taxpayers have paid out substantial money because of the latter's bullying.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/13/special-adviser-sacked-by-dominic-cummings-to-receive-payoff
    Yes but Milne is a Marxist traitor. This stuff isn’t hard

    Milne supports Islamists and cheered on 9/11. He got jihadists in to write for the guardian. He thinks Stalin is cool

    Cummings might be an arrogant dick and even a bully but if you can’t see the crucial political difference between the two of them then there’s no hope for you
    It seems to be a more interesting parallel than you gave it credit for
    Btw I’ve been meaning to ask. Did you hear any Breton spoken on your recent hols?

    I’m reading a book about old pagan Europe and it’s talking about Celtic languages and I’ve realised I’ve never heard Breton spoken in real life

    I’ve heard every other extant Celtic tongue. Welsh, Irish, Gallic - but not Breton

    Wiki claims a lot of speakers but I wonder
    I'm sure I did hear it in a few of the bar/tabac/betting shops I stopped in for refreshments

    One in particular, in Guingamp where I had a few beers watching the end of (I think) Arsenal beating Newcastle. I was stood at the bar and didn't understand or recognise anything that more than half of the locals were speaking. I usually do somewhat better than that with French

    I became more popular there with a few "yecʼhed mat" shouts
    Good to hear. Wiki claims 200,000 speakers which is a LOT - but down from 1m 50 years ago

    I love hearing rare languages. I heard Siwi in Siwa. Just 20,000 speakers in the world. Marvellous

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siwi_language
    Have you ever considered advancing yourself, by attending Berber college?
    Addendum - excerpt from wiki page

    The basic word order of Siwi is subject-verb-object,[27] as in:

    akúḅḅi la yušas náčču i támẓa
    boy not he. gave. her food to ogress
    'The boy didn't give food to the ogress.'
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805
    edited May 2023

    UPDATE: Privileges Committee say they will take this new evidence into account when they decide whether or not Boris Johnson misled MPs. It is unlikely to help his case.

    Full statement here…




    https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1661076303108251649

    So, no decision for another six months at least?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    TimS said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
    Alcohol on flights is pretty awful.
    Unless you're a complete dipso.
    It’s free (well, paid for). Therefore good.
    I love the tingle of that second glass of champagne in business class on a long haul flight to a warm sunny part of asia (ok, Bangkok) in the middle of a British winter

    That, for me, is a genuine moment of pure happiness. You are escaping the cold. The Veuve Cliquot sparkles in the mouth. You look at your little bag of presents. The plane banks over the Alps and the sun awaits. Have another gulp. Aaaaaaaand RELAX
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,143

    UPDATE: Privileges Committee say they will take this new evidence into account when they decide whether or not Boris Johnson misled MPs. It is unlikely to help his case.

    Full statement here…




    https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1661076303108251649

    So, no decision for another six months at least?
    Keep kicking it back til the GE. Then fair chance he is no longer an MP. If he is then say he has a fresh mandate and who are they to disagree with the voters so lets all move on.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,760
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”

    You can tell that's actually something a gammony tory said because it involves a 40 year old cultural reference.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    x

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Cummings v Milne is an interesting parallel debate
    Not really. Cummings is super intelligent and wins elections and referendums. I’ve seen no evidence for Milne being even smart and he certainly never won any elections

    Milne is a classic posho public school Marxist. The Winchester version of bouji grammar school Corbyn
    And a lot of people who lost a referendum think that Cummings is super evil, while not having much at all to say about the man who wrote Corbyn's Salisbury response
    There you go again.

    Both Seumas Milne and Dom Cummings are absolute shits of the highest order.

    The taxpayers have paid out substantial money because of the latter's bullying.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/13/special-adviser-sacked-by-dominic-cummings-to-receive-payoff
    Yes but Milne is a Marxist traitor. This stuff isn’t hard

    Milne supports Islamists and cheered on 9/11. He got jihadists in to write for the guardian. He thinks Stalin is cool

    Cummings might be an arrogant dick and even a bully but if you can’t see the crucial political difference between the two of them then there’s no hope for you
    It seems to be a more interesting parallel than you gave it credit for
    Btw I’ve been meaning to ask. Did you hear any Breton spoken on your recent hols?

    I’m reading a book about old pagan Europe and it’s talking about Celtic languages and I’ve realised I’ve never heard Breton spoken in real life

    I’ve heard every other extant Celtic tongue. Welsh, Irish, Gallic - but not Breton

    Wiki claims a lot of speakers but I wonder
    I'm sure I did hear it in a few of the bar/tabac/betting shops I stopped in for refreshments

    One in particular, in Guingamp where I had a few beers watching the end of (I think) Arsenal beating Newcastle. I was stood at the bar and didn't understand or recognise anything that more than half of the locals were speaking. I usually do somewhat better than that with French

    I became more popular there with a few "yecʼhed mat" shouts
    Good to hear. Wiki claims 200,000 speakers which is a LOT - but down from 1m 50 years ago

    I love hearing rare languages. I heard Siwi in Siwa. Just 20,000 speakers in the world. Marvellous

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siwi_language
    Have you ever considered advancing yourself, by attending Berber college?
    Addendum - excerpt from wiki page

    The basic word order of Siwi is subject-verb-object,[27] as in:

    akúḅḅi la yušas náčču i támẓa
    boy not he. gave. her food to ogress
    'The boy didn't give food to the ogress.'
    I saw three hungry ogresses menacing infant boys while I was there. A useful phrase
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    Abstain. Alcohol is vile and you'll probably be unwell.
    Alcohol on flights is pretty awful.
    Unless you're a complete dipso.
    It’s free (well, paid for). Therefore good.
    I love the tingle of that second glass of champagne in business class on a long haul flight to a warm sunny part of asia (ok, Bangkok) in the middle of a British winter

    That, for me, is a genuine moment of pure happiness. You are escaping the cold. The Veuve Cliquot sparkles in the mouth. You look at your little bag of presents. The plane banks over the Alps and the sun awaits. Have another gulp. Aaaaaaaand RELAX
    Yep. And a window seat on the southern route avoiding Russia and Ukraine so may go over the Himalayas.

    Shame they don’t have the upstairs on 747s anymore though.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Dura_Ace said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”

    You can tell that's actually something a gammony tory said because it involves a 40 year old cultural reference.
    The blob is expanding at the sort of exponential rate seen in pandemics. Like a new variant of woke. The Omicron of woke.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807

    UPDATE: Privileges Committee say they will take this new evidence into account when they decide whether or not Boris Johnson misled MPs. It is unlikely to help his case.

    Full statement here…




    https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1661076303108251649

    Rishi still shitting himself about Boris then.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,987
    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    Politico.com - 55 Things You Need to Know About Tim Scott

    The senator from South Carolina has a personal story that confounds easy political categories.

    #27 - In 2008, [Scott] ran for and won a seat [as a Republican] in the South Carolina state house, and he also took his grandfather to vote. His grandfather couldn’t read the ballot, so he pointed to the name —Barack Obama. As he drove him home, he looked over at his grandfather, who had tears rolling down his face. “Timmy, the miracle isn’t whether he wins or not. The miracle is that he is on the ballot!” his grandfather said. “Timmy, for more than half of my life, I wasn’t allowed to vote.”

    https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/05/22/tim-scott-55-things-you-need-to-know-00097711
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    Incredible American court judgment


    BREAKING: 4th Circuit upholds Thomas Jefferson High School admissions policy, 2-1, holding that it does not unconstitutionally discriminate against Asians and Asian-Americans. King (Clinton) writes, Heytens (Biden) joins, Rushing (Trump) dissents.

    https://twitter.com/joshgerstein/status/1661014602090708993?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    Read the deets. It’s ok to discriminate against Asians as long as you don’t explicitly say that’s your intention and it’s just a by product of your racialist admissions policy

  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,987
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    x

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Cummings v Milne is an interesting parallel debate
    Not really. Cummings is super intelligent and wins elections and referendums. I’ve seen no evidence for Milne being even smart and he certainly never won any elections

    Milne is a classic posho public school Marxist. The Winchester version of bouji grammar school Corbyn
    And a lot of people who lost a referendum think that Cummings is super evil, while not having much at all to say about the man who wrote Corbyn's Salisbury response
    There you go again.

    Both Seumas Milne and Dom Cummings are absolute shits of the highest order.

    The taxpayers have paid out substantial money because of the latter's bullying.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/13/special-adviser-sacked-by-dominic-cummings-to-receive-payoff
    Yes but Milne is a Marxist traitor. This stuff isn’t hard

    Milne supports Islamists and cheered on 9/11. He got jihadists in to write for the guardian. He thinks Stalin is cool

    Cummings might be an arrogant dick and even a bully but if you can’t see the crucial political difference between the two of them then there’s no hope for you
    It seems to be a more interesting parallel than you gave it credit for
    Btw I’ve been meaning to ask. Did you hear any Breton spoken on your recent hols?

    I’m reading a book about old pagan Europe and it’s talking about Celtic languages and I’ve realised I’ve never heard Breton spoken in real life

    I’ve heard every other extant Celtic tongue. Welsh, Irish, Gallic - but not Breton

    Wiki claims a lot of speakers but I wonder
    I'm sure I did hear it in a few of the bar/tabac/betting shops I stopped in for refreshments

    One in particular, in Guingamp where I had a few beers watching the end of (I think) Arsenal beating Newcastle. I was stood at the bar and didn't understand or recognise anything that more than half of the locals were speaking. I usually do somewhat better than that with French

    I became more popular there with a few "yecʼhed mat" shouts
    Good to hear. Wiki claims 200,000 speakers which is a LOT - but down from 1m 50 years ago

    I love hearing rare languages. I heard Siwi in Siwa. Just 20,000 speakers in the world. Marvellous

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siwi_language
    If you haven't watched todays language/AI keynote from Microsoft - might be of interest.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Question:

    I am on my way to Heathrow. I just left a work do, with wine. I’ll arrive and go into the lounge, where there will be free drinks. Then the plane, where they’ll serve free drinks. All being well I arrive in Singapore tomorrow at 6pm just in time for the “gala event” at our conference with free drinks.

    Do I:

    A. Treat this as some 24 hour stag-like bender and just drink and eat my way through it,
    B. Abstain in the lounge and go straight to sleep on the plane?

    Decisions decisions

    FFS. Life is short. This sounds fun

    Drink

    Haven’t the last 3 years taught us that if nothing else? Carpe diem
    Carpe Beer.

    Seize the Pint.
    Carpe Cervisia

    Surely?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082

    Can a biological woman have a penis? No. Can a trans woman have a penis? Yes.

    Can we move on now please?

    What about Woke Trans Illegal Immigrant Alien AIs?

    Asking for a flint knapper.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @PaulBrandITV

    Boris Johnson’s most loyal supporters in the Commons are relatively quiet tonight both in the media and on Twitter. A sign perhaps of how much his political stock has fallen since last autumn, when a comeback looked like a serious possibility.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    That’s a great movie. Loved it
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    That’s a great movie. Loved it
    It’s between that and everything everywhere all at once. (Or both).
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    That’s a great movie. Loved it
    It’s between that and everything everywhere all at once. (Or both).
    Also a great movie. Indeed better

    Save one for the flight home?

  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,066
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,141
    Farooq said:

    I like how quickly we got from Boris and Corbyn to Hitler and Stalin.
    I can only assume that the final part of this mapping document is from Swinson to Pol Pot, but I haven't looked into it.

    Swinson to Göring.

    I can be next Führer.

    Oh no you can’t.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    That’s a great movie. Loved it
    It’s between that and everything everywhere all at once. (Or both).
    Also a great movie. Indeed better

    Save one for the flight home?

    I think EEAAO outbound, TBOI return, with time to (re)read the most relaxing and intellectually undemanding yet utterly compelling book in history in between, A Year In Provence.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    CatMan said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
    Afraid not, I’m still on the tarmac at LHR.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    edited May 2023

    Farooq said:

    I like how quickly we got from Boris and Corbyn to Hitler and Stalin.
    I can only assume that the final part of this mapping document is from Swinson to Pol Pot, but I haven't looked into it.

    Swinson to Göring.

    I can be next Führer.

    Oh no you can’t.
    Looking back, Swinson had some of the Sunak or Ed Miliband about her. Bright eyed, a bit naive, great ambition but just didn’t really cut it.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,066
    TimS said:

    CatMan said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
    Afraid not, I’m still on the tarmac at LHR.
    Ah whoops. Think I might have found you now.

    Doing this sort of thing keeps me off the booze (well that's my excuse anyway)
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    Leon said:

    That’s a great movie. Loved it

    It's a horrible movie
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    That’s a great movie. Loved it
    It’s between that and everything everywhere all at once. (Or both).
    Also a great movie. Indeed better

    Save one for the flight home?

    I think EEAAO outbound, TBOI return, with time to (re)read the most relaxing and intellectually undemanding yet utterly compelling book in history in between, A Year In Provence.
    Good call. They are both excellent yet so very different. Worth savouring. If you did both in one flight you might not appreciate the second
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    Jesus Christ shoot this child
  • eekeek Posts: 28,585
    TimS said:

    CatMan said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
    Afraid not, I’m still on the tarmac at LHR.
    so it's flight BA15 on G-ZBKF a Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,888

    If the police are no longer investigating burglaries do we expect them to continue investigating lockdown offences?

    Well when it involved Boris Johnson they didn't last time out. 4 out of the 5 parties Johnson attended, his attendance was ignored by the Met. so probably not.

    Durham on the other hand did give Starmer a good going over so perhaps the anomaly is regional.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    eek said:

    TimS said:

    CatMan said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
    Afraid not, I’m still on the tarmac at LHR.
    so it's flight BA15 on G-ZBKF a Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner
    Yep. Designed to keep travellers fresh in flight, which means I can drink more with no ill effects.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,709
    Leon said:

    Jesus Christ shoot this child

    I think he tended to heal the sick rather than shoot them,
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,213
    More fascinating vandalism going on in Russia today. Might Putin’s authority actually be teetering a bit?

    https://twitter.com/gerashchenko_en/status/1661100901094793223?s=46
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    edited May 2023
    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,682
    Chris said:

    I live but a mile away from Ely so surprised to see it all over the news today.

    What I find odd is the issue of the police chase. Why would someone be chased by a police van? Some kind of sadistic game? If you have the polic following you, why wouldn't you stop. It's ridiculous to blame them for causing a crash. But then why deny it if you are the police?

    Someone being chased by police, because cops think they're breaking the law (the chased, not the cops) MAY stop. But often they will not, because they are trying to evade apprehension and/or arrest.

    With teenagers being perhaps even more likely to flee than adults.

    Back in my own misspent youth, guys would drive around late at night thus attracting attention of local cops. Who in our very small town, were just as bored as a rule as the kids.

    One favorite way of evading the long arm of the law, was to head up a local hill with the fuzz in pursuit, then duck into a handy driveway and kill the lights. Then watch Barney Fife whiz by obvious to what had happened. Cops never did seem to catch on.

    As for police statement re: this tragic incident in Wales, seems to me that it is VERY carefully worded, thus NOT exactly a full denial.
    The part about no police vehicles being on Snowden Road at the time of the crash probably doesn't mean very much, considering that if the boys followed the most direct route from Frank Road (where the CCTV footage came from) the police van wouldn't have been able to follow them on to Snowden Road because it would have been prevented by a barrier just before the junction.
    I’m no expert but the police don’t normally do pursuit in vans.
    It seems likely that the youths thought they were being chased, even if they weren’t.
    My wife feels guilty every time she sees the police, and she’s done nothing wrong…
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,972
    TimS said:

    eek said:

    TimS said:

    CatMan said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I apologise for being incredibly sad, but this you?

    https://www.flightradar24.com/BAW11/3068d6fb
    Afraid not, I’m still on the tarmac at LHR.
    so it's flight BA15 on G-ZBKF a Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner
    Yep. Designed to keep travellers fresh in flight, which means I can drink more with no ill effects.
    Enjoy. Yes, the new 787 and A350 have a much better atmosphere, and a lower cabin altitude (nearer 5,000’ than the 7,000’ in older planes). It does make quite the difference in how one feels at the other end.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805

    Chris said:

    I live but a mile away from Ely so surprised to see it all over the news today.

    What I find odd is the issue of the police chase. Why would someone be chased by a police van? Some kind of sadistic game? If you have the polic following you, why wouldn't you stop. It's ridiculous to blame them for causing a crash. But then why deny it if you are the police?

    Someone being chased by police, because cops think they're breaking the law (the chased, not the cops) MAY stop. But often they will not, because they are trying to evade apprehension and/or arrest.

    With teenagers being perhaps even more likely to flee than adults.

    Back in my own misspent youth, guys would drive around late at night thus attracting attention of local cops. Who in our very small town, were just as bored as a rule as the kids.

    One favorite way of evading the long arm of the law, was to head up a local hill with the fuzz in pursuit, then duck into a handy driveway and kill the lights. Then watch Barney Fife whiz by obvious to what had happened. Cops never did seem to catch on.

    As for police statement re: this tragic incident in Wales, seems to me that it is VERY carefully worded, thus NOT exactly a full denial.
    The part about no police vehicles being on Snowden Road at the time of the crash probably doesn't mean very much, considering that if the boys followed the most direct route from Frank Road (where the CCTV footage came from) the police van wouldn't have been able to follow them on to Snowden Road because it would have been prevented by a barrier just before the junction.
    I’m no expert but the police don’t normally do pursuit in vans.
    It seems likely that the youths thought they were being chased, even if they weren’t.
    My wife feels guilty every time she sees the police, and she’s done nothing wrong…
    ...so she tells you.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,030
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    That said: SMALL COUGHING ANNOYING CHILD BEHIND ME: shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down

    One of my friends was stuck on a flight with a small annoying coughing child just last week. Woke up this morning at 5am unable to breath.

    Time for a third champagne!
    Eeek. This kid is the worst

    His mother either ignores him or shouts at him (and then he ignores her)

    My inner Caligula emerges
    I face the opposite demographic on my plane. I’ve realised it’s the Sydney flight, via Singapore. The clientele in club world is therefore boomer couples returning from visiting their London based kids / going out to visit their Sydney based kids. It’s very much not a business flight. Think I’m the only person in a suit, and possibly one of the youngest in the cabin.
    I prefer yours. Sounds tranquil and they’re so old they will leave the champagne to you
    Indeed my neighbour, a venerable Sheila of mature years, just turned hers down. Saving herself for the good old 19 crimes back home.

    I am now on champagne no.1, pondering movies


    Only in Club? A pity. :smiley:
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,268
    TimS said:

    More fascinating vandalism going on in Russia today. Might Putin’s authority actually be teetering a bit?

    https://twitter.com/gerashchenko_en/status/1661100901094793223?s=46

    Clearly it was done by Putin supporters who blame Lenin for the current problems with Ukraine, as per Putin’s rambling speeches on the subject.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805
    Rachel Johnson: 'All the rules were followed whenever I went to Chequers' [during lockdown]

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1661093720651907096?s=20
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330
    edited May 2023

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,069
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”

    Odd metaphor. Are right wing Tories in this case Pac Man, with the ghosts being the blob, or the ghosts, with the blob being Pac Man, or the power pills or fruit, with the blob being Pac Man? The one which seems to fit best is the ghosts, but that isn't a terribly flattering light to paint yourself in.

    I do have some sympathy with the sentiment. It must be very hard to be an MP who the civil service dislike politically.
    But Boris has it coming. There are thousands of people who broke the rules during lockdown - the idiotic, illiberal rules he was responsible for - who haven't been indulgently let off the hook. He has only himself to blame.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,704

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Agree with this. Boris is the most unsuitable person to have been PM in living memory. But would have been dwarfed by the sheer WTAF of Corbyn becoming PM.

    But what does it matter. Corbyn wasn't PM, wasn't ever going to PM, despite the crank-foaming never got near becoming PM.

    Boris on the other hand? There's an awful lot of very angry people out there who still rage about what Boris did to their lives during Covid. Their own mental hell. Marriages broken. Parents lost remotely. Whilst he said "what rules" and carried on being a "selfish libertine".

    There are very few people who will refuse to vote Labour because Corbyn was once leader. An awful lot who already are refusing to vote Conservative because Boris was PM. Labour wanted to move on from Jezbollah so badly that he's been excommunicated. The Tories want Boris back so badly that he has his own fanclub (Tories for Democracy thingy) and now CrankCom (NatC conference).
    Some valid points here

    However on lockdown never forget that Starmer and Labour wanted MORE lockdown - and would have had us trapped at home until about June 2022 (with all the extra debt)
    I keep hearing this "naah but Starmer wanted more lockdown" thing. Boris kept fucking up unlockdown - the idiocy over Christmas 2020 being a prime example.

    The only person making the decision was Boris. The only person passing the legislation was Boris. Not Starmer. Lockdown drove me mildly mad and did much worse to other people. But the alternative was the script of the film Contagion. Lockdown isn't the problem - that fucker brazenly ignoring it, and stuffing billions into Tory pockets in exchange for no PPE which killed medics is the problem.

    What does Starmer have to do with it?
    Well said. Locking down late in exponential growth prolonged the lockdown.
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    NEW Conservative right wing MPs are gloomy tonight with Suella Braverman’s future in the balance and Boris Johnson being reported to the police.
    One blames the Whitehall ‘blob’ saying: “We are like being gobbled up like we are in Pac Man.”

    You can tell that's actually something a gammony tory said because it involves a 40 year old cultural reference.
    Some people like to claim that computer games inspire violence, but if Pac-Man had affected us 80s kids, we'd have grown up and ended up walking around in dark rooms, munching pills and listening to repetitive electronic music.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,585
    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    It's almost like they need to find a way to get water companies to actual spend some money on new (replacement) infrastructure.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”
  • Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,585

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    The problem is that it's the surrounding infrastructure that needs to be built. Case in point for the last set of houses in the new estate to be built the power lines to the estate need to be improved - cue major project as the roads across town (fully built up) are dug up to allow the new cables to be laid.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    You go and have a swim in the shite, mate.

    Developers aren't paying for the sewerage. Why should the public do so? Private water companies sure don't.
  • Jonathan said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:



    Farooq said:

    "But Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Boris was so obviously unacceptable!"
    "Yes, but Corbyn was so obviously unacceptable!"

    [continues until the heat death of the universe]

    I get that lefties and Remainers hate Boris but, really, Corbyn is in a different and higher league of unacceptability

    Corbyn is an unashamed traitor. An IRA supporting, Hamas-hugging, anti semitic commie traitor

    Boris is a charismatic reprobate and a selfish libertine. Boris has personal flaws. Corbyn’s flaws are way more dangerous and ideological even if he is probably the “nicer” gent in some ways
    Agree with this. Boris is the most unsuitable person to have been PM in living memory. But would have been dwarfed by the sheer WTAF of Corbyn becoming PM.

    But what does it matter. Corbyn wasn't PM, wasn't ever going to PM, despite the crank-foaming never got near becoming PM.

    Boris on the other hand? There's an awful lot of very angry people out there who still rage about what Boris did to their lives during Covid. Their own mental hell. Marriages broken. Parents lost remotely. Whilst he said "what rules" and carried on being a "selfish libertine".

    There are very few people who will refuse to vote Labour because Corbyn was once leader. An awful lot who already are refusing to vote Conservative because Boris was PM. Labour wanted to move on from Jezbollah so badly that he's been excommunicated. The Tories want Boris back so badly that he has his own fanclub (Tories for Democracy thingy) and now CrankCom (NatC conference).
    Some valid points here

    However on lockdown never forget that Starmer and Labour wanted MORE lockdown - and would have had us trapped at home until about June 2022 (with all the extra debt)
    I keep hearing this "naah but Starmer wanted more lockdown" thing. Boris kept fucking up unlockdown - the idiocy over Christmas 2020 being a prime example.

    The only person making the decision was Boris. The only person passing the legislation was Boris. Not Starmer. Lockdown drove me mildly mad and did much worse to other people. But the alternative was the script of the film Contagion. Lockdown isn't the problem - that fucker brazenly ignoring it, and stuffing billions into Tory pockets in exchange for no PPE which killed medics is the problem.

    What does Starmer have to do with it?
    Well said. Locking down late in exponential growth prolonged the lockdown.
    What a load of nonsense. The virus was there and had exponential growth and the potential for it either way. Locking down early doesn't lighten the lockdown, as the virus is still there when you come out of it. As SAGE said pre-lockdown I.

    All lockdown does is temporarily reduce cases, then you remove lockdown the virus is still there again, so if you are controlling it via lockdowns you inevitably end up locked down again.

    The virus was all over Europe. No densely populated country in Europe locked down 'early' and had a shorter lockdown as a result, in fact the UK came out of the final lockdown while far too late actually much earlier than any other nation that locked down.

    Or can you think of any densely populated nation in Europe that went into lockdown sooner like you wanted and lifted their final lockdown before the UK did?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,585
    Via Guido

    **Statement on behalf of Rt Hon Boris Johnson MP**
    **for immediate use, attributable to his office**

    The assertion by the Cabinet Office that there have been further Covid rule breaches is totally untrue.

    Lawyers have examined the events in question and advised that they were lawful.

    No contact was made with Mr Johnson before these incorrect allegations were made both to the police and to the Privileges Committee. This is both bizarre and unacceptable.

    For whatever political purpose, it is plain that a last ditch attempt is being made to lengthen the Privileges Committee investigation as it was coming to a conclusion and to undermine Mr Johnson.

    Mr Johnson’s lawyers have tonight written to the police forces involved to explain in detail why the Cabinet Office is entirely wrong in its assertions.

    The events in question were all within the rules either because they were held outdoors or came within another lawful exception. They include regular meetings with civil servants and advisers.

    It appears some within government have decided to make unfounded suggestions both to the police and to the Privileges Committee.

    Many will conclude that this has all the hallmarks of yet another politically motivated stitch up.

    -- So Bozo won't admit to be wrong even when lawyers know things are as dodgy as f***
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 22,355
    edited May 2023
    eek said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    The problem is that it's the surrounding infrastructure that needs to be built. Case in point for the last set of houses in the new estate to be built the power lines to the estate need to be improved - cue major project as the roads across town (fully built up) are dug up to allow the new cables to be laid.
    So if infrastructure is needed, then get it done.

    If the roads need to be worked on, get it done.

    Deal with it and life goes on, not the end of the world.

    Its not possible to have a growing population and new houses built only where it won't inconvenience anyone, that's impossible.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
    Er, that 5%'s overall. Not in specific areas. Which is the question here.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,112
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    Go on! Join Reform! You know you want to :lol:
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,709
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    So Sunak's not all bad news and rubbish judgement?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    eek said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    It's almost like they need to find a way to get water companies to actual spend some money on new (replacement) infrastructure.
    But new water infrastructure is also strongly discouraged by EU waterways directives. Encouraging us to conserve water (like public advertising advising to take shorter showers) rather than actually build new infrastructure is EU policy. Ask Malmesbury, who has some experience in public administration, how hard it is even to make an empty gravel pit into a new reservoir. The direction of travel is very anti-human, and it is an immense blessing that we have left - though it is becoming abundantly clear that our political class has not.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,744


    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms.

    New water board marketing slogan?
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352

    Rachel Johnson: 'All the rules were followed whenever I went to Chequers' [during lockdown]

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1661093720651907096?s=20

    I'd be disappointed if this story was merely more of the same.

    I want big orgies with ai_list celebrities, or be_list would be fine. Hell, even a single ce_list representative would do.
  • Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
    Er, that 5%'s overall. Not in specific areas. Which is the question here.
    No its not the question. There are no areas where there is no need for infrastructure work.

    The excuses about infrastructure to excuse NIMBYism are just that, an excuse.

    If a young couple and their two children all live in one crowded room in one of the adults own parents home because that is all the can find to live in, then does their shit magically not stick or need to be flushed? Do the kids magically not need to go to school?

    If that young family suddenly have a house of their own near to their parents home, then the demands at the local school, or for sewerage etc, are not significantly altered at all. But their quality of life is.

    If you want to start deporting people to get rid of effluence and children from schools etc, then make that case. But if you want people to live in this country, they need a home first, and we need to deal with any externalities after - not use externalities as an excuse to have people live in squalor without a home of their own.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @christopherhope
    How on earth will Rishi Sunak respond to this challenge?
    It is a huge test of the PM’a authority and also backbench support for Boris Johnson over the next 48 hours.

    @sturdyAlex
    I seem to recall Pac-Man was the good guy which makes them fruits and ghosts.

    By the way, @christopherhope's feed is HILARIOUS. It's one hysterical mass of Johnson apologia. Including a defence by his sister and one by his spokesperson, presented as if they are mic drop scoops.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,032
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    So Sunak's not all bad news and rubbish judgement?
    Sunak could threaten them with a good ole
    election.
  • Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    You go and have a swim in the shite, mate.

    Developers aren't paying for the sewerage. Why should the public do so? Private water companies sure don't.
    Why should the public pay for it? If its a matter of public interest, then the public should, because that's what our taxes are to pay for. If its not, then the bill needs to go to whoever it belongs to.

    But its not about the number of houses. Houses don't create shit, people do. 12 people living in one home generate the same amount of shit as 4 people living in 3 homes.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    So Sunak's not all bad news and rubbish judgement?
    Sunak could threaten them with a good ole
    election.
    Pretty sad when pulling a grenade on himself and his shitty Government is his only option.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,471

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
    Er, that 5%'s overall. Not in specific areas. Which is the question here.
    No its not the question. There are no areas where there is no need for infrastructure work.

    The excuses about infrastructure to excuse NIMBYism are just that, an excuse.

    If a young couple and their two children all live in one crowded room in one of the adults own parents home because that is all the can find to live in, then does their shit magically not stick or need to be flushed? Do the kids magically not need to go to school?

    If that young family suddenly have a house of their own near to their parents home, then the demands at the local school, or for sewerage etc, are not significantly altered at all. But their quality of life is.

    If you want to start deporting people to get rid of effluence and children from schools etc, then make that case. But if you want people to live in this country, they need a home first, and we need to deal with any externalities after - not use externalities as an excuse to have people live in squalor without a home of their own.
    Hi Barty. Nice to see you back.
    Or have we just not been on at the same time for a while?
  • eek said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    The problem is that it's the surrounding infrastructure that needs to be built. Case in point for the last set of houses in the new estate to be built the power lines to the estate need to be improved - cue major project as the roads across town (fully built up) are dug up to allow the new cables to be laid.
    So if infrastructure is needed, then get it done.

    If the roads need to be worked on, get it done.

    Deal with it and life goes on, not the end of the world.

    Its not possible to have a growing population and new houses built only where it won't inconvenience anyone, that's impossible.
    There are at least 10 substantial new developments around Loughborough and surrounding villages that are in the construction phase now. No expansion of schools, doctors, dentist. No shops being included, no cafes, no pub. Just houses. I'm not sure this is sustainable.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    So Sunak's not all bad news and rubbish judgement?
    Who’d have thought that organising a conference with an agenda that directly undermined the government to which they ostensibly owed loyalty would provoke a counter-reaction?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,112

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
    Bottoms up! :lol:
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    🔥
    Senior Tory source tells me: “There is now an open witch hunt against right wingers in the Conservative Party.
    “The leadership of the party must shut this down immediately.
    “Active conversations are underway among MPs about how to respond to this and nothing is off the table.”

    So Sunak's not all bad news and rubbish judgement?
    Who’d have thought that organising a conference with an agenda that directly undermined the government to which they ostensibly owed loyalty would provoke a counter-reaction?
    Um, really? Public espousal of Conservatism is undermining the Conservative Government?
  • eek said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    What a crock of shit.

    If you only want houses built in places where there's a surplus of empty schools, roads and other infrastructure then that's absolutely nowhere so not building anything near anyone. Totally bananas.

    Infrastructure might not exist where houses are built. Oh well, get the infrastructure dealt with then, wherever it ends up being needed.
    The problem is that it's the surrounding infrastructure that needs to be built. Case in point for the last set of houses in the new estate to be built the power lines to the estate need to be improved - cue major project as the roads across town (fully built up) are dug up to allow the new cables to be laid.
    So if infrastructure is needed, then get it done.

    If the roads need to be worked on, get it done.

    Deal with it and life goes on, not the end of the world.

    Its not possible to have a growing population and new houses built only where it won't inconvenience anyone, that's impossible.
    There are at least 10 substantial new developments around Loughborough and surrounding villages that are in the construction phase now. No expansion of schools, doctors, dentist. No shops being included, no cafes, no pub. Just houses. I'm not sure this is sustainable.
    Hopefully those 10 substantial new developments are followed up with 20 more. Then we might start making serious progress at reversing our housing shortage.

    And shops will open up wherever there's new demand, and so should anything else. It shouldn't be micromanaged or planned with developments, it should happen organically.

    I live in a substantial new development, in an area surrounded by other substantial new developments. I do my shopping in supermarkets that didn't exist two years ago, but unsurprisingly have been built as the shopping chains want to place themselves in easy access to where their customers live.

    There are no shops on my estate, but there are shops I can drive to, so problem solved. New or old housing, I've never lived on an estate with a supermarket within the estate come to think of it.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,888

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Why do politicians keep being asked about penises?

    Can't we mature the debate a bit?

    Because politicians keep saying that women have them.
    They keep being ASKED if they do, Ed Davey didn't bring it up.

    How would you field this question? How would you feel if you were a trans person who really felt they were a woman with the way they are talked about? Why can't we have a more mature conversation and look at this with some kindness and sympathy.
    Davey (and Starmer) knows he’s going to be asked the question, and has known for years that he’ll be asked the question.

    Yet he still doesn’t have anything close to a coherent answer on the subject.

    If and when he has a straight answer, the line of questioning would stop.
    I’ve some sympathy for them. It’s a hideously divisive and thorny topic. But then it’s their own mad woke identity politics that have led them here so that sympathy is limited
    It's not really, though, is it?

    Women don't have penises.
    Sir Ed Davey assured me on Nick Ferrari's show that they do. So who do I believe you or Ed Davey? A Knight of the Realm or some herbert who posts on PB.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @GuidoFawkes
    One Rishi source echoing Boris allies blaming out of control civil service "chucking shit" at anyone they can. Tories seem enfeebled by blob insurrection.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 22,355
    edited May 2023
    dixiedean said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    It has been reported in The Times that 160,000 proposed new homes have now been banned, because the quango 'Natural England' has insisted that they would add phosphates to Rivers. Their ban is an enforcement of a 2018 ECJ ruling (yes, from when we'd supposedly already left).

    The story in The Times is paywalled: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natural-england-blamed-for-blocking-new-homes-ztfl3b9qv

    But the House Building Federation have a previous story (from March, when it was only 120,000 homes they were blocking) on their website, with more detail. Including the fact that all existing housing stock (25 million or so) accounts for only 5% of the issue, so these new properties would have a negligible impact.
    https://www.hbf.co.uk/news/nutrient-neutrality-lichfields-report-unblocking-homebuilding/

    This is the kind of shit we left the EU to sort it - their burdensome, wrong-headed regulation is real, it is pertinent to important issues, and it does hold us back.

    "shit" is precisely the issue here. If the infrastructure for sewerage is not there, then no point in building houses. Schools, roads, too ... and promises from developers are worthless.
    Shit doesn't come from houses, it comes from bottoms. The bottoms are already here - giving them houses to live in will not result in higher levels of it. As stated in the article, the issue that has lead to the Natural England ban is one where the entire housing stock contributes but 5%.
    Er, that 5%'s overall. Not in specific areas. Which is the question here.
    No its not the question. There are no areas where there is no need for infrastructure work.

    The excuses about infrastructure to excuse NIMBYism are just that, an excuse.

    If a young couple and their two children all live in one crowded room in one of the adults own parents home because that is all the can find to live in, then does their shit magically not stick or need to be flushed? Do the kids magically not need to go to school?

    If that young family suddenly have a house of their own near to their parents home, then the demands at the local school, or for sewerage etc, are not significantly altered at all. But their quality of life is.

    If you want to start deporting people to get rid of effluence and children from schools etc, then make that case. But if you want people to live in this country, they need a home first, and we need to deal with any externalities after - not use externalities as an excuse to have people live in squalor without a home of their own.
    Hi Barty. Nice to see you back.
    Or have we just not been on at the same time for a while?
    Hi thanks for that. I've not been on much at all for the last few months. Real life has just been too busy.
This discussion has been closed.