Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
Did he capitalise it though?
There are plenty of small 'c' folk on the centre left, so I have zero problem with that. And it flags the road towards what looks like the makings of a solid, dependable Labour offer to the electorate.
And incrementality is literally how progressivism, as per Progress magazine, defines itself in Britain - as with liberal the meaning of it does not resemble the US understanding.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
On the EU, I wonder if the core Eurozone integrating more tightly politically may ironically make it easier to join. At that point there will likely be recognition of core and non-core EU members, and we would join in the understanding of being part of the non-core.
But more realistically we'll sign follow the Swiss in signing a range of deals over time that align us more closely and reduce trade barriers without fully embracing the single market.
The chance of that (an inner and an outer grouping) happening is long past. The Euro has ensured it is not practical because it forces all its members to be part of he inner core. I agree that the Swiss model is the most likely now although I would prefer the EFTA/EEA route.
As I understand it, Denmark has an opt-out of joining the Euro (and therefore is non-core for any Eurozone integration) and Sweden found a loophole against joining the Euro through not applying to join ERM II (which is voluntary, but a prerequisite for the Euro).
So of the various criteria for the Euro, the UK would fail on at least:
- Joining ERM II (the Swedish loophole) - Budget deficit above 3% of GDP - Debt to GDP above 60% - Potentially due to high inflation as well
So the Euro is an empty threat. But two other small countries are probably not significant enough to count as a non-core grouping rather than us being viewed as the awkward ones again, so a EFTA/EEA-type deal would be ideal.
Especially as migration has gone up since we left - "freedom of movement" is less scary when it makes absolutely no difference to the number of people coming here, but stops UK citizens from being able to move where they want.
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
I ask you seriously if you have ever even visisted the States? I suspect you haven't. If you think our cultural values are more aligned to those of the US than Europe then you are visiting with your sensitivity switched off. I've now worked there maybe fifty times and every time I go I'm more surprised how foreign a place that largely speaks English can feel. I can hardly think of a European country that feels more foreign.
The anger amongst Remainers is likely to go through the roof as immigration rockets and not a peep from the right wing press who essentially drove the leave vote by their relentless anti EU nationals campaign .
Brexit couldn’t even deliver the apparent one thing many Leavers had wanted or were told they wanted as in lower net-migration!
Millions lost their freedom of movement rights , many dreams were shattered and for what .
Not a single Leave promise has been met.
Angry remainers. Are they like Anna Soubry?
You're completely right that Brexit has been a shitshow, but there wasn't ever a unified approach to what it should or could be. I voted to leave, but I'm damned sure very few people even considered the factors that made me do so.
As a remainer I don't think you have anybody to be angry at. The Brexit voters aren't a something. They've dispersed and gone their own separate ways.
My anger is aimed not at Leavers but those especially in the right wing press who waged a relentless campaign against EU nationals .
Ah you mean those that objected to the racist policy you advocate of preferring white christian immigration over brown people.....hands you your bnp application form
Free movement is a pillar of the single market. The aim is prosperity through economic integration, and economic integration isn't fully viable without free movement because we don't live in fucking feudal times any more. It's nothing at all to do with skin colour or religion, and if you're airbrushing the existence of non-white and non-Christian people out of European identity, then the racist is you.
Free movement is about fucking over the poor people on minimum wage for the benefit of business who like their infinite labour pool. But then you are a lefty so you like to keep people poor so you can pretend you are on their side
So, you've moved off the racial arguments and now it's I'm a "lefty", who wants to "fuck over poor people"?
I don't know what kind of acute episode you're having. Have you skipped your tablets?
He does the night shift on Radio Broadmoor.
Do fuck off the point was precisely accurate....farooq wants to skew immigration to white christians from the eu. If I said that you would be shouting racist from the rooftops....you like fom and agree with that so you have a go at me.
I am quite happy with immigration of people who benefit the country and are net contributors on the other hand and dont care if they are brown, yellow, white, black, green with yellow spots. I object however to immigration that keeps the poor on minimum wage while raising rents and puts ever more pressure on public services while not providing enough tax to make up for it.
That is not racist it is rational
You're talking about green people with yellow spots, you don't get to play the "rational" card sorry.
I'm sorry this hasn't worked out for you, but as explained, the idea of free movement isn't about racial or religious characteristics, and I would really like you to stop and think about what you're saying. Do you think everybody on here who is reading this and who is from this country or an EU country, do you think they are all white Christians? Because you're argument, apart from being wrong on its own merits, is erasing all those other people.
Again, it's wrong because free movement isn't predicated on anything other than membership of a single market. We have the same thing within countries too: I am free to move from Aberdeenshire to Cornwall if I choose. That isn't racist against someone from Mozambique who has to apply for permission to live in Truro. Your argument invites the conclusion that every country is racist for having internal free movement and restricted immigration. That's a silly conclusion and so you should wind your accusations in.
Only one person lost the argument. Have a nice night
Well, let me turn this around.
No part of the United States has - over the last 40 years - seen greater amounts of immigration (both from inside the US and from around the world) as the Bay Area.
Yet it is hard to rationally conclude that has driven down the price of software engineers. Indeed, the Bay Area is - without a doubt - the most expensive place to hire engineers in the world.
Now, it may be that there's a massively important difference between skilled and unskilled labour. But it certainly does not seem to be the automatic case that allowing people to migrate results in terrible pressure on wage rates.
That would be the bay area where they have a load of homeless people shitting in the street
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
I barely have time to have lunch.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
I ask you seriously if you have ever even visisted the States? I suspect you haven't. If you think our cultural values are more aligned to those of the US than Europe then you are visiting with your sensitivity switched off. I've now worked there maybe fifty times and every time I go I'm more surprised how foreign a place that largely speaks English can feel. I can hardly think of a European country that feels more foreign.
It is quite obvious that we are culturally European when we visit America.
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
I ask you seriously if you have ever even visisted the States? I suspect you haven't. If you think our cultural values are more aligned to those of the US than Europe then you are visiting with your sensitivity switched off. I've now worked there maybe fifty times and every time I go I'm more surprised how foreign a place that largely speaks English can feel. I can hardly think of a European country that feels more foreign.
Yes, I have. And whilst its modus operandi is very different to ours we still import all our cultural trendy BS from there and the fact it's different in the UK is precisely why it doesn't work here.
I'm not saying we're the same; I am saying we draw our contemporary cultural inspirations from there, and usually without realising it.
Isn't Geneva supposed to be very beautiful, in its location, and vista ?
I've heard this from friends many times, but never unfortunately visited, myself.
When the sun is out, absolutely.
Very little to do in Geneva itself at the weekend though.
My overriding memory of Geneva is heading out of the hotel in the morning at about 7.30/8am and various woman propositioning me in the street by lifting their skirts, showing their 'front bottoms' and asking 'Do you want?'.
That and wig shops. So many wig shops.
Are you sure this wasn't a dream?
Very sadly, it wasn't. The wig shops too - I took photo's of those.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
WHat does 'mandate work from home' mean?. Even though I think WFH is brilliant and certainly the future, madating it is as daft as banning it.
Mandating to employers you don’t have a say your workers can WFH or not, WFH is the default under legal right (that means law?)
The anger amongst Remainers is likely to go through the roof as immigration rockets and not a peep from the right wing press who essentially drove the leave vote by their relentless anti EU nationals campaign .
Brexit couldn’t even deliver the apparent one thing many Leavers had wanted or were told they wanted as in lower net-migration!
Millions lost their freedom of movement rights , many dreams were shattered and for what .
Not a single Leave promise has been met.
Angry remainers. Are they like Anna Soubry?
You're completely right that Brexit has been a shitshow, but there wasn't ever a unified approach to what it should or could be. I voted to leave, but I'm damned sure very few people even considered the factors that made me do so.
As a remainer I don't think you have anybody to be angry at. The Brexit voters aren't a something. They've dispersed and gone their own separate ways.
My anger is aimed not at Leavers but those especially in the right wing press who waged a relentless campaign against EU nationals .
Ah you mean those that objected to the racist policy you advocate of preferring white christian immigration over brown people.....hands you your bnp application form
Free movement is a pillar of the single market. The aim is prosperity through economic integration, and economic integration isn't fully viable without free movement because we don't live in fucking feudal times any more. It's nothing at all to do with skin colour or religion, and if you're airbrushing the existence of non-white and non-Christian people out of European identity, then the racist is you.
Free movement is about fucking over the poor people on minimum wage for the benefit of business who like their infinite labour pool. But then you are a lefty so you like to keep people poor so you can pretend you are on their side
I always have a slight problem with that logic. Because if it is true, then allowing people from poorer parts of the UK to work in London, is fucking over the people who reside in London by pushing down their wages.
Unless, we're saying that although allowing Scousers to work in London is net negative to Londoners, it's worth it because we're all British?
Scousers are british, we have a british governement. The point of a governement is to do the best for the people they represent. I suspect allowing scousers being allowed to move to london to take up jobs is a lot less impactful that letting all of europe to move to london to take up jobs when it comes to lifting them out of minimum wage
But, do you think allowing Scousers to work in London is generally good for the economic wealth of the country? Or bad?
Because "oh, there are more Europeans than Scousers" is a bit of a cop out.
On the other hand, it's OK to play the nationality card, obviously. There's nothing wrong with saying "we're looking to optimize the wealth of al Brits, rather than the wealth of all Europeans".
UK citizens are what the governement are meant to look after. Are there issues when they change regions sure....but the point is they are uk citizens and should be looked after. This is the whole point the uk governement is meant to do the best for those that live in the uk.
I don't have a problem with immigration as long as the following is followed. They should be net contributors and services such as doctors, dentists,housing, schools are all expanded to meet the extra demand. As long as that occurs I dont think it matters if we have 100k, 1million or 10 million.
Fom however removed our ability to limit it to those who are net contributors
The treasury figures show that EU nationals were net contributors ! Indeed they are better for the treasury than UK citizens according to the figures ! This tends to be because they are younger and healthier . The full fact figures show they contributed £1.34 for every £ 1.00 in state assistance .
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
I barely have time to have lunch.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
You mean role playing with chains and whips?
Or maybe you havn’t got the hang of working from home malarkey. You are not supposed to do work, no one else is doing work at home, instead you’ve got to do… it a lot more, like everyone else is.
The anger amongst Remainers is likely to go through the roof as immigration rockets and not a peep from the right wing press who essentially drove the leave vote by their relentless anti EU nationals campaign .
Brexit couldn’t even deliver the apparent one thing many Leavers had wanted or were told they wanted as in lower net-migration!
Millions lost their freedom of movement rights , many dreams were shattered and for what .
Not a single Leave promise has been met.
Angry remainers. Are they like Anna Soubry?
You're completely right that Brexit has been a shitshow, but there wasn't ever a unified approach to what it should or could be. I voted to leave, but I'm damned sure very few people even considered the factors that made me do so.
As a remainer I don't think you have anybody to be angry at. The Brexit voters aren't a something. They've dispersed and gone their own separate ways.
My anger is aimed not at Leavers but those especially in the right wing press who waged a relentless campaign against EU nationals .
Ah you mean those that objected to the racist policy you advocate of preferring white christian immigration over brown people.....hands you your bnp application form
Free movement is a pillar of the single market. The aim is prosperity through economic integration, and economic integration isn't fully viable without free movement because we don't live in fucking feudal times any more. It's nothing at all to do with skin colour or religion, and if you're airbrushing the existence of non-white and non-Christian people out of European identity, then the racist is you.
Free movement is about fucking over the poor people on minimum wage for the benefit of business who like their infinite labour pool. But then you are a lefty so you like to keep people poor so you can pretend you are on their side
I always have a slight problem with that logic. Because if it is true, then allowing people from poorer parts of the UK to work in London, is fucking over the people who reside in London by pushing down their wages.
Unless, we're saying that although allowing Scousers to work in London is net negative to Londoners, it's worth it because we're all British?
Scousers are british, we have a british governement. The point of a governement is to do the best for the people they represent. I suspect allowing scousers being allowed to move to london to take up jobs is a lot less impactful that letting all of europe to move to london to take up jobs when it comes to lifting them out of minimum wage
But, do you think allowing Scousers to work in London is generally good for the economic wealth of the country? Or bad?
Because "oh, there are more Europeans than Scousers" is a bit of a cop out.
On the other hand, it's OK to play the nationality card, obviously. There's nothing wrong with saying "we're looking to optimize the wealth of al Brits, rather than the wealth of all Europeans".
UK citizens are what the governement are meant to look after. Are there issues when they change regions sure....but the point is they are uk citizens and should be looked after. This is the whole point the uk governement is meant to do the best for those that live in the uk.
I don't have a problem with immigration as long as the following is followed. They should be net contributors and services such as doctors, dentists,housing, schools are all expanded to meet the extra demand. As long as that occurs I dont think it matters if we have 100k, 1million or 10 million.
Fom however removed our ability to limit it to those who are net contributors
The treasury figures show that EU nationals were net contributors ! Indeed they are better for the treasury than UK citizens according to the figures ! This tends to be because they are younger and healthier . The full fact figures show they contributed £1.34 for every £ 1.00 in state assistance .
The treasury figures though are total bollocks because all they take into account is gdp. They do not take into account the pressure on rents and public services at all. GDP can rise and still the poorer half get a shittier life despite that. This is the issue....people who think fom good were the people benefitting they didn't see an issue....people seeing ever rising rents and degraded public services due to population outstripping increases in housing , doctors, hospitals and schooling voted to go fuck off to the fom
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
I barely have time to have lunch.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
You mean role playing with chains and whips?
Or maybe you havn’t got the hang of working from home malarkey. You are not supposed to do work, no one else is doing work at home, instead you’ve got to do… it a lot more, like everyone else is.
When you are on a Teams call you can only be seen from the waist up.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
I barely have time to have lunch.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
You mean role playing with chains and whips?
Or maybe you havn’t got the hang of working from home malarkey. You are not supposed to do work, no one else is doing work at home, instead you’ve got to do… it a lot more, like everyone else is.
The anger amongst Remainers is likely to go through the roof as immigration rockets and not a peep from the right wing press who essentially drove the leave vote by their relentless anti EU nationals campaign .
Brexit couldn’t even deliver the apparent one thing many Leavers had wanted or were told they wanted as in lower net-migration!
Millions lost their freedom of movement rights , many dreams were shattered and for what .
Not a single Leave promise has been met.
Angry remainers. Are they like Anna Soubry?
You're completely right that Brexit has been a shitshow, but there wasn't ever a unified approach to what it should or could be. I voted to leave, but I'm damned sure very few people even considered the factors that made me do so.
As a remainer I don't think you have anybody to be angry at. The Brexit voters aren't a something. They've dispersed and gone their own separate ways.
My anger is aimed not at Leavers but those especially in the right wing press who waged a relentless campaign against EU nationals .
Ah you mean those that objected to the racist policy you advocate of preferring white christian immigration over brown people.....hands you your bnp application form
Free movement is a pillar of the single market. The aim is prosperity through economic integration, and economic integration isn't fully viable without free movement because we don't live in fucking feudal times any more. It's nothing at all to do with skin colour or religion, and if you're airbrushing the existence of non-white and non-Christian people out of European identity, then the racist is you.
Free movement is about fucking over the poor people on minimum wage for the benefit of business who like their infinite labour pool. But then you are a lefty so you like to keep people poor so you can pretend you are on their side
I always have a slight problem with that logic. Because if it is true, then allowing people from poorer parts of the UK to work in London, is fucking over the people who reside in London by pushing down their wages.
Unless, we're saying that although allowing Scousers to work in London is net negative to Londoners, it's worth it because we're all British?
Scousers are british, we have a british governement. The point of a governement is to do the best for the people they represent. I suspect allowing scousers being allowed to move to london to take up jobs is a lot less impactful that letting all of europe to move to london to take up jobs when it comes to lifting them out of minimum wage
But, do you think allowing Scousers to work in London is generally good for the economic wealth of the country? Or bad?
Because "oh, there are more Europeans than Scousers" is a bit of a cop out.
On the other hand, it's OK to play the nationality card, obviously. There's nothing wrong with saying "we're looking to optimize the wealth of al Brits, rather than the wealth of all Europeans".
UK citizens are what the governement are meant to look after. Are there issues when they change regions sure....but the point is they are uk citizens and should be looked after. This is the whole point the uk governement is meant to do the best for those that live in the uk.
I don't have a problem with immigration as long as the following is followed. They should be net contributors and services such as doctors, dentists,housing, schools are all expanded to meet the extra demand. As long as that occurs I dont think it matters if we have 100k, 1million or 10 million.
Fom however removed our ability to limit it to those who are net contributors
The treasury figures show that EU nationals were net contributors ! Indeed they are better for the treasury than UK citizens according to the figures ! This tends to be because they are younger and healthier . The full fact figures show they contributed £1.34 for every £ 1.00 in state assistance .
The treasury figures though are total bollocks because all they take into account is gdp. They do not take into account the pressure on rents and public services at all. GDP can rise and still the poorer half get a shittier life despite that. This is the issue....people who think fom good were the people benefitting they didn't see an issue....people seeing ever rising rents and degraded public services due to population outstripping increases in housing , doctors, hospitals and schooling voted to go fuck off to the fom
Stop blaming immigrants for the governments lack of investment in housing , services etc . Unless you’ve been living on Mars since Brexit and after covid net migration has gone up not down ! So your anti FOM tirade doesn’t make sense . I’m giving you the facts available . EU nationals when we had FOM paid more in tax than they took out. Instead of having a go at Remainers perhaps you should channel your irritation at the useless Tory government who having fxcked up the last 13 years and whose next desperate move is finding the latest scapegoat in the “ boat people “.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
On the EU, I wonder if the core Eurozone integrating more tightly politically may ironically make it easier to join. At that point there will likely be recognition of core and non-core EU members, and we would join in the understanding of being part of the non-core.
But more realistically we'll sign follow the Swiss in signing a range of deals over time that align us more closely and reduce trade barriers without fully embracing the single market.
The UK is far too important for too many EU countries for there not to be deals.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
She used to get up, breakfast, bring me a cuppa, shower, get dressed, make up, take a bus to the embankment, and suddenly she got the WFH habit, I wake up and she’s still in bed with me. 🤗
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
I barely have time to have lunch.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
You mean role playing with chains and whips?
Or maybe you havn’t got the hang of working from home malarkey. You are not supposed to do work, no one else is doing work at home, instead you’ve got to do… it a lot more, like everyone else is.
When you are on a Teams call you can only be seen from the waist up.
The anger amongst Remainers is likely to go through the roof as immigration rockets and not a peep from the right wing press who essentially drove the leave vote by their relentless anti EU nationals campaign .
Brexit couldn’t even deliver the apparent one thing many Leavers had wanted or were told they wanted as in lower net-migration!
Millions lost their freedom of movement rights , many dreams were shattered and for what .
Not a single Leave promise has been met.
Angry remainers. Are they like Anna Soubry?
You're completely right that Brexit has been a shitshow, but there wasn't ever a unified approach to what it should or could be. I voted to leave, but I'm damned sure very few people even considered the factors that made me do so.
As a remainer I don't think you have anybody to be angry at. The Brexit voters aren't a something. They've dispersed and gone their own separate ways.
My anger is aimed not at Leavers but those especially in the right wing press who waged a relentless campaign against EU nationals .
Ah you mean those that objected to the racist policy you advocate of preferring white christian immigration over brown people.....hands you your bnp application form
Free movement is a pillar of the single market. The aim is prosperity through economic integration, and economic integration isn't fully viable without free movement because we don't live in fucking feudal times any more. It's nothing at all to do with skin colour or religion, and if you're airbrushing the existence of non-white and non-Christian people out of European identity, then the racist is you.
Free movement is about fucking over the poor people on minimum wage for the benefit of business who like their infinite labour pool. But then you are a lefty so you like to keep people poor so you can pretend you are on their side
So, you've moved off the racial arguments and now it's I'm a "lefty", who wants to "fuck over poor people"?
I don't know what kind of acute episode you're having. Have you skipped your tablets?
He does the night shift on Radio Broadmoor.
Do fuck off the point was precisely accurate....farooq wants to skew immigration to white christians from the eu. If I said that you would be shouting racist from the rooftops....you like fom and agree with that so you have a go at me.
I am quite happy with immigration of people who benefit the country and are net contributors on the other hand and dont care if they are brown, yellow, white, black, green with yellow spots. I object however to immigration that keeps the poor on minimum wage while raising rents and puts ever more pressure on public services while not providing enough tax to make up for it.
That is not racist it is rational
You're talking about green people with yellow spots, you don't get to play the "rational" card sorry.
I'm sorry this hasn't worked out for you, but as explained, the idea of free movement isn't about racial or religious characteristics, and I would really like you to stop and think about what you're saying. Do you think everybody on here who is reading this and who is from this country or an EU country, do you think they are all white Christians? Because you're argument, apart from being wrong on its own merits, is erasing all those other people.
Again, it's wrong because free movement isn't predicated on anything other than membership of a single market. We have the same thing within countries too: I am free to move from Aberdeenshire to Cornwall if I choose. That isn't racist against someone from Mozambique who has to apply for permission to live in Truro. Your argument invites the conclusion that every country is racist for having internal free movement and restricted immigration. That's a silly conclusion and so you should wind your accusations in.
Only one person lost the argument. Have a nice night
Well, let me turn this around.
No part of the United States has - over the last 40 years - seen greater amounts of immigration (both from inside the US and from around the world) as the Bay Area.
Yet it is hard to rationally conclude that has driven down the price of software engineers. Indeed, the Bay Area is - without a doubt - the most expensive place to hire engineers in the world.
Now, it may be that there's a massively important difference between skilled and unskilled labour. But it certainly does not seem to be the automatic case that allowing people to migrate results in terrible pressure on wage rates.
That would be the bay area where they have a load of homeless people shitting in the street
Yes. That's the one.
I'm not sure the homeless heroin addicts are caused by software engineers, but I'll do some research if you like.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
Starmer calls himself a Conservative - BJO please explain Starmer will mandate WFH if he gets in (I don’t mind, I get more sex out of that little wheeze) Dyson attacks Sunak’s focus on science Modi wants the British Crown Jewels back in India.
Couple of questions. Is South Africa arming Putin? And what’s the Australian PwC crisis - is the Labor government about to fall?
I WFH, and I don't get extra sex.
This is genuinely one thing where I hope SKS fans do explain.
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
I ask you seriously if you have ever even visisted the States? I suspect you haven't. If you think our cultural values are more aligned to those of the US than Europe then you are visiting with your sensitivity switched off. I've now worked there maybe fifty times and every time I go I'm more surprised how foreign a place that largely speaks English can feel. I can hardly think of a European country that feels more foreign.
Well I have lived and worked extensively in both the US and Europe and definitely feel our cultural values are more closely aligned with the US than with Europe. I don't actually think that matters one way or another but it is certainly my experience.
Edit:
Though I should add of course that you hve in the past claimed to feel more European than British so you are hardly in a position to judge on whether Britain is culturally closer to the US or Europe.
Buyer's remorse. I would vote Rejoin in a heartbeat.
That just shows you're impulsive and don't think things through.
Er, I've had SEVEN years to think it through!
And, you were hysterical about it at the time, as you are about Rejoin and Starmer now, and also your republicanism: where you keep posting the same (decidedly weak) points endlessly, again and again.
Conclusion: you don't think things through.
You clearly didn't . Obviously not entirely stupid but you believed in Brexit. The biggest crock of shit that has ever been inflicted on a relatively sophisticated electorate. And, of course, it wasn't in any way influenced by Russian social media manipulation. Well, according to the now very believable "Russian Report" lol.
I believed in terminating our full membership of the European Union and negotiating a new one, yes. It wasn't working as a political model for us and never would have.
And I absolutely stand by that as the right decision.
You keep trying to convince yourself old chap. It was the dumbest decision this country has taken in a century at least. EU membership was not perfect, but it was not a disaster either. The benefits outweighed the disbenefits. Leaving it has not benefited one ordinary person one iota. It was pointless. Stupid. However we now have to live with that idiocy and move on. Rejoin is not an option IMHO.
I respectfully disagree: the flexibility required to accommodate a permanent settlement with the UK inside the EU wasn't there, together with a track record of creeping federalisation, so the only honest position was to Leave if you no longer had confidence in the organisation.
Of course, it would have been better to have negotiated this inside, and then gently moved to it, or an outer-tier membership system, but that wasn't on the table - so the break it was.
Creeping is the right word for the federalism. Or a ratchet that only turns once a decade.
Even if you thought the end game was bad, you ran from a large slug into moving traffic, you chopped off your feet to avoid the distant ratchet pull.
The threat (if threat it ever was) of EU federalism is a straw man . It is only believed in by arch-federalists and arch-Europhobes. The EU, for all its faults, is a system built on compromise. That compromise system would never have allowed proper federalism with us or without us. The EU will continue to be a glorified trading block of sovereign nations for centuries. The hilarious thing is that it is simply too bureaucratic to force through federalism.
There is no other trading block in the world - glorified or otherwise - that has the ability to impose laws unrelated to trade on its members.
There is no other trading block in the world that has the full panolply of governmental institutions which rule their members.
The idea that the EU is just a trading bloc is completely gaga.
Note the word "glorified" Richard. The vast majority of the laws are trading regulations for the smooth running of trade, most of which UK firms will continue to adhere to as well you know. The only people who are gaga are those like the ERG who try and paint the EU as something that it isn't, wasn't and will never be.
This is simply unture. The majority of laws inside the EU are not trading regulations - not by a million miles. Only about 21% of EU law actually relates to trade either directly or indirectly. That is according to the EEA agreement and also includes Agricultural law even in areas not directly related to trade. So the amount of EU law directly related to trade is less than that.
Most is to do with alignment, which is essentially about trade directly or indirectly. There have been social aspects, which we once had an opt out on, but our democratically elected government decided to sign up. The hysteria over EU law is, well, just hysteria. The fact that we have chosen to not get rid of the laws show that they were not really detrimental to the average UK citizen. Brexit was pointless
Again just about every part of that answer from you is factually wrong.
And particularly on your last point. Not getting rid of the laws in a 'bonfire' does not indicate that the laws are not detrimental, just that we need to do all of this in a measured way. The argument is not that we should not get rid of the laws but that they are so interwoven into our legal system that we need to unravel them properly rather than trying to just cut through them.
Dude's whole wikipedia entry is, er, fascinating. From an OBE for military work in Afghanistan, to a right-wing political book with foreword by Lembit Opik, and all sorts of stuff in between:
What I want to know about Rishi and his bonfire of the EU regulations is this: was he lying when he first proposed it, or did someone (a civil servant presumably) have explain to him what a terrible idea it was and he backtracked? The answer will put Brexit and the quiddity of its proponents into two entirely different lights, neither of which is particularly flattering.
How on earth has the Conservative Party allowed itself to get to a place where net migration is about to surge to a historic high of 700,000 - 1 million while the Labour Party berates it for "losing control".
Buyer's remorse. I would vote Rejoin in a heartbeat.
That just shows you're impulsive and don't think things through.
Er, I've had SEVEN years to think it through!
And, you were hysterical about it at the time, as you are about Rejoin and Starmer now, and also your republicanism: where you keep posting the same (decidedly weak) points endlessly, again and again.
Conclusion: you don't think things through.
You have managed to tell half of PB individually how stupid they are tonight together with a collection of their other personal flaws.
Only if they deserve it.
None of them deserved being insulted.
I give as good as I get. If I am rude it's when the arguments are stupid on top where I have little respect for them.
It's entirely open for people to debate the issues alone, and to make intelligent points on top, and plenty who vehemently disagree with me manage to do so, who I also respect.
I disagree. Just my opinion but I think you give far worse than you get. We all get into heated debates. I have had several that have gone too far, but you seem to get angry all the time and far too quickly or insult people unnecessarily. Just because you disagree with someone doesn't mean they are stupid and need insulting and what you think is a stupid argument is not seen to be by many others. Tonight seemed very unpleasant. I would have debated the points with you, but decided against because I didn't want one of those types of discussions which is a shame.
Sorry, I disagree. Many of the posts here these days are repetitive, banal, tedious, supercilious and silly - and they bore me silly. And there are several repeat offenders who think they're far smarter than they actually are - it's embarrassing.
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
It probably will be easy- hardly anyone is being convinced out of their 2016-Remainy views, the youth are not leaping for joy at their global British freedoms, and Brexit remains predominantly the project of a specific generation. It's tactless to point out that the Brexit generation are now going to that place where there are no referendums, but it's also true.
But it will only be easy when the time comes. What it definitely won't be is quick.
Well, we shall see. Crudely put, if you're relying on the deaths of old farts to do the heavy lifting then you're discounting the fact that a lot of middle-aged people are morphing into a fresh supply old farts at the same time. This explains the enduring popularity of garden centre cafes, tartan tins of shortbread biscuits and the Conservative Party.
Beyond that, the longer the UK is out of the EU, the more we diverge and the greater the likelihood that voters will think that going back again is all too much like hard work. People are going to need to be actively persuaded if a volte face on Brexit is to be achieved.
Which is why Ukrainian accession is key. Imagine if a victorious Zelenskyy openly requests Britain to rejoin during his Nobel peace prize speech.
If the EU is such a bad idea, Eurosceptics should advise the Ukrainians to NOT join!
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
Though the examples you give are in fact for the few not the many. "We" mostly don't adopt this stuff. We are as likely to watch Gardener's World and knit ourselves a Coronation mug as adopt veganism, Wokery and anti-patriotism.
True, but the "opinion formers" and "agenda setters" very much do.
Their Europhilia, such as it is, is a very introverted and English one based on demonstrating their cultural sophistication over the plebs and fundamental deep-seated embarrassment in actually being English.
The economics, either which way, really have nothing to do with it.
Scotland seems to me a lot more Europhilic than England. I'm not sure to what extent this alters your argument because honestly I don't even know what you're trying to say really. I think you're trying to set up Europhilia and patriotism as opposites but you must know that this isn't true. In fact it's quite a strong current in Scottish politics. The likes of Lesley Riddoch are emblematic here: she is often found tying Scottish nationalism into Europeanism, and that kind of approach has adherents at the highest level. The former FM was often found advocating that approach and making deliberate and sometimes controversial approaches to other figures -- cultural and political -- from EU countries. I'm not sure to what extent England is different, but until your most recent post, it was far from clear you were talking about England only.
Scotland was more Eurosceptic than England in the 1975 referendum.
Fine, but it's not now. The point stands, though. You seem to be missing an important (an influential) current within Remain circles of not just perceiving Europe in a political and cultural context, but actively mining it. What you initially said about "all their cultural cues from the USA" is disproved by knowledge of this current. If you want to claim that such a current wasn't present in the 70s then you'd still be wrong but it might need evidence from different areas.
You asserting that it's not disproved is not the same as you actually disproving it.
My point is bang on, and well you know it.
Go read some of Lesley Riddoch's writing. Tie that in with some of Nicola Sturgeon's speeches and actions since the EURef. You'll see a distinct Euro-oriented way of thinking. It's not just plain as day, it's explicitly self-described as such. And between them they have a small army of people very heavily invested in Remainia. You made a stupidly sweeping statement that only required one counterexample and I've offered you two. You can row back your statement to something less idiotically strident if you like. Here's a tip for you: try not to speak in absolutes and you won't be shot down so easily.
As it happens I don't even think a milder statement would be true but I wouldn't have bothered arguing the toss. But when you said "Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA" you were basically pulling your arse out and asking for it to be spanked.
How on earth has the Conservative Party allowed itself to get to a place where net migration is about to surge to a historic high of 700,000 - 1 million while the Labour Party berates it for "losing control".
About 18 months ago there was a weird period where the number of vacancies far outstripped the number of people willing to take work. This was caused by various factors: boomers retiring, reluctance to work post-Covid, etc. So there were lots of lots of vacancies chasing people
To our East and South there are millions of refugees and migrants moving from Africa and Eurasia and we look rather nice to them. And no matter what party you vote for, we don't know how to handle it nor prevent it other than let them in and hope. So now there are lots and lots of people chasing vacancies
So there y'go. Simple supply and demand. When you find a party that has realistic plans on how to handle this, shout out because I'm sure we'd all like to know.
I think we will move closer to the Single Market over time but this will not involve full membership.
Just finished an international conference (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsouJoc5-P8), where I was asked by three different EU nationals whether Britain would rejoin. I said I couldn't see it in the next 5 years, maybe the following Parliament, "but would you want us?" They all looked a bit taken back and said things like "Hmm, I see what you mean" and "Only if you were keen, not just to create trouble again".
Hence the fact that, even if popular support can be found to reopen the whole can of worms again, going back to the EU must necessarily be a long-term project. A stable 2:1 majority in favour needs to be established amongst public opinion, and that's with an assumption that we're going to give up the pound and adopt the euro to boot. That's not going to be easy.
Too right.
You can be sure I'd do everything in my power to sabotage the fuck out of it if we went back in.
When will the Eurocrats realise we want a different and limited political model?
All the public will care about is “am I and my family better off”. They’ll conclude “no”. Therefore, we’ll go back on - either EEA or full EU with Ukraine (as someone has said)
We are a European nation - and we can’t escape the current reality.
We are and we aren't.
Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA - not continental Europe - because if we did European style Christian Democracy/Social Democracy would be a thing, and we'd be far less ultra-individualist and more socially conservative about language, heritage, migration, and tradition, just like they are.
We are a bit of both, but neither, and they want to force us into a box.
That's the problem.
you truly are cracked if you think that
How so?
We adopt "Not my King" from "Not my President", the trans wars virtually word for word, and BLM took about 72 hours to get from Minnesota to Manchester. Our religions of veganism, Wokery, and Year Zero anti-patriotism are also very similar.
All of this stuff leaves most Europeans completely cold. The only thing that's broadly similar is concern about climate change.
I'd say my cultural views are far more European than those of some of the UTOA Remainers.
I ask you seriously if you have ever even visisted the States? I suspect you haven't. If you think our cultural values are more aligned to those of the US than Europe then you are visiting with your sensitivity switched off. I've now worked there maybe fifty times and every time I go I'm more surprised how foreign a place that largely speaks English can feel. I can hardly think of a European country that feels more foreign.
Well I have lived and worked extensively in both the US and Europe and definitely feel our cultural values are more closely aligned with the US than with Europe. I don't actually think that matters one way or another but it is certainly my experience.
Edit:
Though I should add of course that you hve in the past claimed to feel more European than British so you are hardly in a position to judge on whether Britain is culturally closer to the US or Europe.
The other thing about this is that Europe and the US are both really big and diverse, and the cultural difference from the UK is wildly different depending where you are. I think this is pretty obvious for Europe but until I went to a few different parts of the US I wouldn't have guessed how different the different parts of it would feel.
Comments
There are plenty of small 'c' folk on the centre left, so I have zero problem with that. And it flags the road towards what looks like the makings of a solid, dependable Labour offer to the electorate.
And incrementality is literally how progressivism, as per Progress magazine, defines itself in Britain - as with liberal the meaning of it does not resemble the US understanding.
She calls the afternoon romps a necessary screen break.
So of the various criteria for the Euro, the UK would fail on at least:
- Joining ERM II (the Swedish loophole)
- Budget deficit above 3% of GDP
- Debt to GDP above 60%
- Potentially due to high inflation as well
So the Euro is an empty threat. But two other small countries are probably not significant enough to count as a non-core grouping rather than us being viewed as the awkward ones again, so a EFTA/EEA-type deal would be ideal.
Especially as migration has gone up since we left - "freedom of movement" is less scary when it makes absolutely no difference to the number of people coming here, but stops UK citizens from being able to move where they want.
I'm like a galley slave at my desk from 6am to 6pm!
Good night all
I'm not saying we're the same; I am saying we draw our contemporary cultural inspirations from there, and usually without realising it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=545DSd0hV3M
Or maybe you havn’t got the hang of working from home malarkey. You are not supposed to do work, no one else is doing work at home, instead you’ve got to do… it a lot more, like everyone else is.
I'm not sure the homeless heroin addicts are caused by software engineers, but I'll do some research if you like.
https://twitter.com/pinguhatesyou/status/1657044223491727367/photo/2
https://www.advocate.com/love-and-sex/2018/8/30/27-lesbian-sex-tips-porn-wont-teach-you#rebelltitem1
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1769005/rishi-sunak-no-confidence-letters-1922-committee-brexit
"Labour party plans ‘right to switch off’ for out-of-hours workers"
https://www.ft.com/content/85771e1e-97fc-4b86-bd4f-37a10721d37e
What is it that David Cameron said?
Edit:
Though I should add of course that you hve in the past claimed to feel more European than British so you are hardly in a position to judge on whether Britain is culturally closer to the US or Europe.
And particularly on your last point. Not getting rid of the laws in a 'bonfire' does not indicate that the laws are not detrimental, just that we need to do all of this in a measured way. The argument is not that we should not get rid of the laws but that they are so interwoven into our legal system that we need to unravel them properly rather than trying to just cut through them.
I blame the fifteen years spent in the Lib Dems, obviously... 😆
Edit: Divorced one person 2007, married another 2006?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Bolton_(British_politician)
@GoodwinMJ
How on earth has the Conservative Party allowed itself to get to a place where net migration is about to surge to a historic high of 700,000 - 1 million while the Labour Party berates it for "losing control".
https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1657138982134730752
You made a stupidly sweeping statement that only required one counterexample and I've offered you two. You can row back your statement to something less idiotically strident if you like. Here's a tip for you: try not to speak in absolutes and you won't be shot down so easily.
As it happens I don't even think a milder statement would be true but I wouldn't have bothered arguing the toss. But when you said "Even the Remainest of Remainers take all their cultural cues from the USA" you were basically pulling your arse out and asking for it to be spanked.
- About 18 months ago there was a weird period where the number of vacancies far outstripped the number of people willing to take work. This was caused by various factors: boomers retiring, reluctance to work post-Covid, etc. So there were lots of lots of vacancies chasing people
- To our East and South there are millions of refugees and migrants moving from Africa and Eurasia and we look rather nice to them. And no matter what party you vote for, we don't know how to handle it nor prevent it other than let them in and hope. So now there are lots and lots of people chasing vacancies
So there y'go. Simple supply and demand. When you find a party that has realistic plans on how to handle this, shout out because I'm sure we'd all like to know.https://9to5google.com/2023/05/11/google-bard-european-union/