Given the Conservatives won a landslide victory in 2019 and Labour has a clear lead in the polls it would be astonishing if 2019 Conservative voters were not more likely to switch to Labour than the reverse
Yes. That was very much my first reaction to the header. What's more, they are switching in precisely the numbers to give that lead. Not revelatory really.
12% of CURRENT (IE. not 2019) Conservative voters would definitely or "probably in the future" consider switching to Labour. The figure in the opposite direction is 9%. 54% of CURRENT Conservatives would never vote Labour, 65% of CURRENT Labour would never vote Conservative.
So in terms of current VI, the Lab vote still looks a tad more solid than the Conservative one.
Maybe it is just that Labour supporters have more hate in their hearts for those that disagree with them than Conservatives do?
I am a new poster but I understood on this site people are not supposed to doxx others, I wonder if it only applies to people they agree with politically.
No. You are not supposed to dox anyone, of whatever political persuasion.
A sock puppet is defined as a person whose actions are controlled by another.[1] It is a reference to the manipulation of a simple hand puppet made from a sock, and is often used to refer to alternative online identities or user accounts used for purposes of deception.... One reason for sockpuppeting is to circumvent a block, ban, or other form of sanction imposed on the person's original account
If using the C word he is well deserving of being banned.
Interesting seeing the Australian perspective on the view of the PM for the new High Commissioner and the priority in the U.K. relationship:
London: Stephen Smith’s phone call last year with his old Labor mate, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, was straight to the point. Albanese needed him to take up Australia’s oldest diplomatic posting as the 26th high commissioner to London.
“He gave me a one word brief,” Smith, whose voice is somewhat scratchy as he recovers from a nasty bout of COVID, said in London this week. “Security.”
"Ahead of the launch, Mr Sunak said: "The safety of women and girls is paramount.. ..."
While the large majority of victims in Rotherham were girls, there were around a hundred or more boys who were victims. It's important people don't forget that, otherwise they'll be looking at a situation with one eye closed.
This is a very valid complaint. It seems that for many in politics and the media abused boys and young men are not as worthy of our sympathy or the state's protection.
It exasperates me that whenever domestic abuse or coercive control is discussed then it is inferred that only women are victims, as though the men who experience it are in some way pathetic folk who should be ignored.
And, worse, if anyone dares to bring up that men are also victims of it, they get shouted down as not caring about the women who are victims.
Given the Conservatives won a landslide victory in 2019 and Labour has a clear lead in the polls it would be astonishing if 2019 Conservative voters were not more likely to switch to Labour than the reverse
Yes. That was very much my first reaction to the header. What's more, they are switching in precisely the numbers to give that lead. Not revelatory really.
12% of CURRENT (IE. not 2019) Conservative voters would definitely or "probably in the future" consider switching to Labour. The figure in the opposite direction is 9%. 54% of CURRENT Conservatives would never vote Labour, 65% of CURRENT Labour would never vote Conservative.
So in terms of current VI, the Lab vote still looks a tad more solid than the Conservative one.
Maybe it is just that Labour supporters have more hate in their hearts for those that disagree with them than Conservatives do?
Outing yourself as a staunch lab supporter.
While you, not for the first time, out yourself as the most stupid person on this site.
Unlike you, Malcolm, I am a moderate. I generally vote for the party that can deliver moderate and reasonably effective government. Also unlike you I would never support a party that had someone of questionable morals/for a party that has a leader who was described by his QC as a "bully and a sex pest" or a party that is happy to welcome someone who was suspended from another party for racism/antisemitism.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Interesting seeing the Australian perspective on the view of the PM for the new High Commissioner and the priority in the U.K. relationship:
London: Stephen Smith’s phone call last year with his old Labor mate, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, was straight to the point. Albanese needed him to take up Australia’s oldest diplomatic posting as the 26th high commissioner to London.
“He gave me a one word brief,” Smith, whose voice is somewhat scratchy as he recovers from a nasty bout of COVID, said in London this week. “Security.”
As Malcolm has arrived to lower the intellectual tone of the debate, I will wish everyone adieu and do some work (that roughly translates to goodbye Malcolm)
Given the Conservatives won a landslide victory in 2019 and Labour has a clear lead in the polls it would be astonishing if 2019 Conservative voters were not more likely to switch to Labour than the reverse
Yes. That was very much my first reaction to the header. What's more, they are switching in precisely the numbers to give that lead. Not revelatory really.
12% of CURRENT (IE. not 2019) Conservative voters would definitely or "probably in the future" consider switching to Labour. The figure in the opposite direction is 9%. 54% of CURRENT Conservatives would never vote Labour, 65% of CURRENT Labour would never vote Conservative.
So in terms of current VI, the Lab vote still looks a tad more solid than the Conservative one.
Maybe it is just that Labour supporters have more hate in their hearts for those that disagree with them than Conservatives do?
Outing yourself as a staunch lab supporter.
While you, not for the first time, out yourself as the most stupid person on this site.
Unlike you, Malcolm, I am a moderate. I generally vote for the party that can deliver moderate and reasonably effective government. Also unlike you I would never support a party that had someone of questionable morals/for a party that has a leader who was described by his QC as a "bully and a sex pest" or a party that is happy to welcome someone who was suspended from another party for racism/antisemitism.
You are a sad angry git , to be pitied. I doubt even a mother could love such a bitter twisted little runt. Jog on loser.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
Protecting the vulnerable children would involve something like:
Recognising fear of being labelled racist was an issue in a significant but minority proportion of cases Massive increase in funding for social care Massive pay rises for social workers Professionalisation of social workers Significant increase in funding for police Modernisation of police and recognition of its institutional failures Significant increase in funding for courts
Government response looks more like:
Recognising fear of being labelled racist was an issue Underfunding social workers, police and courts Refusing to recognise the institutional failures of police, blaming it on a few bad apples instead
Interesting to note that the conspiracy theory that there was organised child abuse, covered up by social services, police, civil service and politicians turned out to be true.
It was just not the conspiracy that the conspiracy theorists wanted.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
My Kindle (*) is wonderful. Since we have less shelf space now, it allows me to get all the cheap thrillers that I want to read once or twice on it, and not taking space on my shelves. It's good to get series on it (halfway through the Expanse and Cadfael), and most of all, now my eyesight's going a little, I can bump up the font size and read without glasses.
Also, it allows me to read Tom Knox or S.K. Tremaine without anyone having to know. The equivalent of a brown-paper wrapping around it...
If you do a lot of reading, and the stuff doesn't have diagrams, then they're wonderful. I carry one when I go for a long run and need to get public transport back, as its relatively light, and there's always something on it I'd want to read, depending on my mood.
Given the Conservatives won a landslide victory in 2019 and Labour has a clear lead in the polls it would be astonishing if 2019 Conservative voters were not more likely to switch to Labour than the reverse
Yes. That was very much my first reaction to the header. What's more, they are switching in precisely the numbers to give that lead. Not revelatory really.
12% of CURRENT (IE. not 2019) Conservative voters would definitely or "probably in the future" consider switching to Labour. The figure in the opposite direction is 9%. 54% of CURRENT Conservatives would never vote Labour, 65% of CURRENT Labour would never vote Conservative.
So in terms of current VI, the Lab vote still looks a tad more solid than the Conservative one.
Maybe it is just that Labour supporters have more hate in their hearts for those that disagree with them than Conservatives do?
I'm very unlikely to vote either Conservative or Labour at the next election, though it's at least possible I would vote Labour, while I'd say I would never vote Conservative.
I really don't think that this is motivated by hatred of Tories. I recognise that I have some fundamental differences of belief to most Tories, and I find this disappointing and frustrating, but I don't hate Tories for this.
The polling result is most likely a function of the fact that the Tories are currently in government, and have been so for now than a decade, and so are actively doing things to annoy people that Labour haven't had the opportunity to do for some time.
That's interesting. I'd say I agree with you more often than not.
Maybe it's just a branding thing?
So much of what repels people from the Tories is the behaviour of the individuals within it.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
The hatred towards the Conservatives is continuing unabated. If you doubt this, go out into the streets and listen.
I've never known anything like it. A seachange has occurred. They are going to get hammered at the next General Election.
Rinse and repeat.
It’s absolutely fine to have this view.
But you state it day after day. No evidence, no data to support it. Just a statement of opinion.
You may well be right (personally I suspect a hung Parliament with a labour government).
But it’s dull and repetitive to just start every thread with the same statement.
I feel the same when someone posts something Tory supportive and the famous five -Felix Casino Carlotta Driver and Sandpit-press the 'like' button. It's like there's a PB Tory 'whip' that's being organised in the background.
It can be the most fatuous post on the board but the 'likes from the cheerleaders are like clockwork. In fact so predictable is a felix 'like' that I worry for his well being if he misses one.
Who even wastes time looking at who has liked what?
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Didn’t a survey on EV’s show that in the American South people habitually drove 100 miles or more on flimsy excuses? Or something like that!
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
It's one of the puzzling things about this country and something that I find quite hard to deal with at times. When you visit a country where they are more welcoming towards children it is such a massive relief.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
Yes, it's because we're a misanthropic and socially uneasy lot who don't like other people very much - we find it much easier to project our emotions onto animals, than to our fellow man, and anthropomorphise them.
It's why the RSPCA was set up decades before the NSPCC, why caning was still allowed into the 1990s and why care home abuse (still) goes on today with a shrug.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Oh that is a shame. The c-word can be so descriptive. I didn't realise it was proscribed.
It's bad for advertisers. Loads of them refuse to run ads on sites which allow it.
Which is ironic if you've ever met people who work in advertising.
I have a friend called @Royalhorseartillery who is desperate to join this board and talk about how people are slowly starting to see through Starmer, and reconsider Sunak.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
It's one of the puzzling things about this country and something that I find quite hard to deal with at times. When you visit a country where they are more welcoming towards children it is such a massive relief.
So we know whether the levels of abuse are less, the same, or higher, in the countries that are supposedly more welcoming towards children? What do equivalent stats say?
How bad are Oxford University’s spinout policies? https://sifted.eu/articles/oxford-university-spinout-policies/ ...It had the lowest founder satisfaction rate in Europe, according to a 2022 survey of spinouts, and, despite creating the most startups of any university in the UK, research shows it lags behind its closest rival when it comes to producing big companies...
...Beauhurst’s data suggests that Oxford initially takes 24.3% equity on average, while Cambridge takes 12.6%. Macfarlane says high early dilution makes Oxford’s companies less attractive to investors later on...
Also a serious issue since it stymies tech led growth.
The hatred towards the Conservatives is continuing unabated. If you doubt this, go out into the streets and listen.
I've never known anything like it. A seachange has occurred. They are going to get hammered at the next General Election.
Rinse and repeat.
It’s absolutely fine to have this view.
But you state it day after day. No evidence, no data to support it. Just a statement of opinion.
You may well be right (personally I suspect a hung Parliament with a labour government).
But it’s dull and repetitive to just start every thread with the same statement.
I feel the same when someone posts something Tory supportive and the famous five -Felix Casino Carlotta Driver and Sandpit-press the 'like' button. It's like there's a PB Tory 'whip' that's being organised in the background.
It can be the most fatuous post on the board but the 'likes from the cheerleaders are like clockwork. In fact so predictable is a felix 'like' that I worry for his well being if he misses one.
Who even wastes time looking at who has liked what?
Roger, because he gets none.
Maybe he needs to work on improving his own ratio then...
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
We all have different priorities and humanity has had a malign effect on everything else on the planet. Unsurprising that some people want to do what they can to try to rectify that. After centuries of experience the corrupt and the greedy and the downright evil are still rising to the top, no lessons ever really learned.
Different priorities is not justification for turning a blind-eye to child abuse.
On Kindles: I have an old (maybe first generation, not sure) Kindle with a physical keyboard and late last year the ability to browse and buy online directly using it was removed. So that is one black mark against it.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
It's one of the puzzling things about this country and something that I find quite hard to deal with at times. When you visit a country where they are more welcoming towards children it is such a massive relief.
So we know whether the levels of abuse are less, the same, or higher, in the countries that are supposedly more welcoming towards children? What do equivalent stats say?
It's an interesting question. I'm not aware of any comparable stats series or whether I'd have much faith in them if they existed. But one can easily think of countries in the "global south" where rights and protections for children are far lower than here but at the same time children are far more welcomed at social occasions or in restaurants. One thing I have noticed is that older people in this country are frequently very intolerant of children, and I wonder whether this reflects our nuclear families where many older people have very limited contact with their own grandchildren, let alone any other children. But it is definitely a cultural thing too. When my parents spend time with us and our kids they seem to enjoy it but always talk about being exhausted afterwards and I always get the sense it is a bit of a chore for them. Whereas my south Asian parents in law always seem energised by the children, and the childrens' actual or perceived needs (frequently food related) are their main focus. And they are in their mid-80s, about ten years older than my folks, so have every right to be exhausted.
How bad are Oxford University’s spinout policies? https://sifted.eu/articles/oxford-university-spinout-policies/ ...It had the lowest founder satisfaction rate in Europe, according to a 2022 survey of spinouts, and, despite creating the most startups of any university in the UK, research shows it lags behind its closest rival when it comes to producing big companies...
...Beauhurst’s data suggests that Oxford initially takes 24.3% equity on average, while Cambridge takes 12.6%. Macfarlane says high early dilution makes Oxford’s companies less attractive to investors later on...
Also a serious issue since it stymies tech led growth.
Some strange bits:
founders from Oxford tend to be at a disadvantage to peers at Cambridge because there are fewer local early-stage investment funds.
Last time I checked O & C were about 80 miles apart.
"The AI disaster is already here, and we don’t care For decades we’ve been teaching ourselves to submit to technology that is destroying civilisation" (£)
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
I have a friend called @Royalhorseartillery who is desperate to join this board and talk about how people are slowly starting to see through Starmer, and reconsider Sunak.
How bad are Oxford University’s spinout policies? https://sifted.eu/articles/oxford-university-spinout-policies/ ...It had the lowest founder satisfaction rate in Europe, according to a 2022 survey of spinouts, and, despite creating the most startups of any university in the UK, research shows it lags behind its closest rival when it comes to producing big companies...
...Beauhurst’s data suggests that Oxford initially takes 24.3% equity on average, while Cambridge takes 12.6%. Macfarlane says high early dilution makes Oxford’s companies less attractive to investors later on...
Also a serious issue since it stymies tech led growth.
Some strange bits:
founders from Oxford tend to be at a disadvantage to peers at Cambridge because there are fewer local early-stage investment funds.
Last time I checked O & C were about 80 miles apart.
That distance is far more than enough in rather parochial Britain.
I have a friend called @Royalhorseartillery who is desperate to join this board and talk about how people are slowly starting to see through Starmer, and reconsider Sunak.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
It's one of the puzzling things about this country and something that I find quite hard to deal with at times. When you visit a country where they are more welcoming towards children it is such a massive relief.
Once in France, where I spotted an obviously lost toddler in a crowd, I started to go over to help, but nearly died in the stampede.
I would never in a million years have voted for a Johnson/Truss Conservatives- might vote for a Sunak led one but that depends on him keeping the nutters in place. I live in a pretty safe Labour seat in any case - with a decent MP - so we’ll see nearer the time. I expect I’ll be worse off under a Labour government but some of that will be down to fixing current iniquities - what worries me is there aren’t enough “rich” to remotely pay for all that Labour have promised - so there will be tears before bedtime.
I didn't vote Conservative in the last two GEs. I might well return at the next one. The idea of a Labour majority is pretty worrying for me. I think Starmer is a solid human being and will probably be a good PM, but it is the rest of them that concern me. Particularly the fact that they have a hatred for anyone that lives outside their urban view of the world and they seem to be only interested in promoting the vested interests of the bloated and inefficient public sector.
Good luck with PM Suella after the post election putsch.
I have a friend called @Royalhorseartillery who is desperate to join this board and talk about how people are slowly starting to see through Starmer, and reconsider Sunak.
I would never in a million years have voted for a Johnson/Truss Conservatives- might vote for a Sunak led one but that depends on him keeping the nutters in place. I live in a pretty safe Labour seat in any case - with a decent MP - so we’ll see nearer the time. I expect I’ll be worse off under a Labour government but some of that will be down to fixing current iniquities - what worries me is there aren’t enough “rich” to remotely pay for all that Labour have promised - so there will be tears before bedtime.
I didn't vote Conservative in the last two GEs. I might well return at the next one. The idea of a Labour majority is pretty worrying for me. I think Starmer is a solid human being and will probably be a good PM, but it is the rest of them that concern me. Particularly the fact that they have a hatred for anyone that lives outside their urban view of the world and they seem to be only interested in promoting the vested interests of the bloated and inefficient public sector.
Good luck with PM Suella after the post election putsch.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
Why do you think it might be?
Might it be completely false? Where do you all live? People on the whole of all sectors and backgrounds are massively pro children and put vast amounts of impressive effort into them. The tiny minority who don't are execrated.
Some may feel a good deal of this effort is ill directed and not brilliantly informed, but it is rarely badly intended.
BTW I suspect that people give more to animal than children's charities because (a) funding special children needs is seen as a state obligation and (b) the big children's charities act as a bunch of campaigning whingers about the wickedness of government instead of helping people.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Oh that is a shame. The c-word can be so descriptive. I didn't realise it was proscribed.
There are far more imaginative ways to insult someone, as PB proves daily.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Oh that is a shame. The c-word can be so descriptive. I didn't realise it was proscribed.
There are far more imaginative ways to insult someone, as PB proves daily.
I understand @malcolmg runs training courses on it.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
You think everyone in LA owns a car. V naive.
While it's not everyone (we're a one car* family), the paucity of public transport makes it a necessity for work for the vast majority of households.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Oh that is a shame. The c-word can be so descriptive. I didn't realise it was proscribed.
There are far more imaginative ways to insult someone, as PB proves daily.
I understand @malcolmg runs training courses on it.
"Barr's Malcolm-Bru. Made in Scotland from turnips!"
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
This is my first and only account. I was inspired by @CorrectHorseBattery3’s posts to start posting myself. I hope they will be allowed back one day
Oh, was CHB banned? What for?
Called someone a c-word. He could easily ask for Robert to unban him, if he was so inclined as I've also been banned for that.
Oh that is a shame. The c-word can be so descriptive. I didn't realise it was proscribed.
There are far more imaginative ways to insult someone, as PB proves daily.
In any case the parking lots in LA are much bigger than the parking lots in random Wal-Marts in the south. Which forces more activity. Which has a health benefit.
Quite remarkable that Pence thinks he is a viable contender for leadership of a party whose supporters were wanting to lynch him just a couple of years ago.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
You think everyone in LA owns a car. V naive.
While it's not everyone (we're a one car* family), the paucity of public transport makes it a necessity for work for the vast majority of households.
* Apparently our car is actually a truck.
"Hey, Max, a guy gets on the MTA here in L.A. and dies. Think anybody will notice?"
In any case the parking lots in LA are much bigger than the parking lots in random Wal-Marts in the south. Which forces more activity. Which has a health benefit.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
I feel for you
an Asian PM and and Asian home secretary so you cant cry racist.
You must be gutted.
Laughable. This is a policy written in crayon to stoke racism. BTW "Asian" is itself racist when you are claiming that a Hindu PM and an Indian-heritage HS are the same as people of Pakistani origin.
Can't be racist? You ever heard Indians and Pakistanis going at each other? This is someone from one heritage branding people of a different heritage to all be perverts. It is *inherently racist.
Growing up in Rochdale in the 1980s, "paki" what white person shorthand for all the Asians in the town. Despite the reality that we had sizable communities from India. Kashmir. Bangladesh. And yes Pakistan. Branding anyone with brown skin as a unitary group - "Asian" in your case - is as ignorant as my Gran calling the Indian family next door "the Pakis"
It is 2023. Really sad to read that level of ignorance is live and well. Then again we know this - that policy is aimed square at them.
Ive sat in rooms with hindus sikhs and buddhists and what they say about the muslims would have me put in jail if I said it.
And thats the point, you and your pastey faced cohorts run around yelling racism when there is no equal application of the law and all that counts is which group meets your virtue signalling twaddle this week.
So having experienced Asian on Asian racism yourself - as I have - why have you said that the HS can't be racist towards a different Asian heritage?
You mention equal application of the law. Growing up in Rochdale the local monster was Cyril Smith. Who got away with it. In more recent times the monsters have been Pakistani heritage. Who got away with it.
If inbuilt racism is the reason why we don't apply the law equally, why do we keep having appalling cases where mass offenders eventually get caught? If racism is why the Pakistani heritage gang members took so long to get caught, was it also racism that the same system ignored Smith?
Not the smartest thing you have ever posted.
It was plain that there was a very great reluctance on the part of the authorities to deal with the concerns raised by Ann Cryer and Sarah Champion due to its being “ a cultural matter.”
But overall, I’ve reached the conclusion that too many people in authority really are unbothered by child abuse, unless it’s done to their own children.
It's very sad, Britons are far more interested in animals than children.
Have you ever stopped to ponder why that might be?
It's one of the puzzling things about this country and something that I find quite hard to deal with at times. When you visit a country where they are more welcoming towards children it is such a massive relief.
Once in France, where I spotted an obviously lost toddler in a crowd, I started to go over to help, but nearly died in the stampede.
Whereas, in the UK, people would, for a whole number of reasons, often be wary to intervene directly. Maybe they’ll watch from a distance to see if anything untoward happens, but they are worried about trying to do the right thing and ending up in some sort of trouble.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Gun violence is probably statistically insignificant compared to the effects of poor diet, healthcare, etc.
I’m a bit disappointed to only have one blue plaque on my route, but it’s quite a good one
Taught at my old school in Salisbury (sadly before my time). Seems he had a dimmish view of the essential nature of schoolboys, assuming he got it from studying his pupils at close hand!
I’m a bit disappointed to only have one blue plaque on my route, but it’s quite a good one
I must visit Salisbury some time. One of my favourite documentary presenters Jonathan Meades grew up there.
Its lovely. I went to school there and its the kind of place you just want to get out of while you are at school and then 30 years later you want to live in.
I’m a bit disappointed to only have one blue plaque on my route, but it’s quite a good one
I must visit Salisbury some time. One of my favourite documentary presenters Jonathan Meades grew up there.
While I’m sure he has one in Salisbury too from his time at Bishops Wordsworth, this one is in Marlborough where his father was science master at the grammar school
Russian Wagner warlord Prigozhin claims his forces are in “legal” control of Bakhmut after planting flag atop ruins of city hall. Ukraine leaders deny the claim and say they maintain control in Bakhmut. But it's clear some of the center has been captured. https://mobile.twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/1642852858709016576
Full marks for the satiric use of 'legal', though.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
The police have for decades ignored the white on white killing of a prominent UK novelist.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Gun violence is probably statistically insignificant compared to the effects of poor diet, healthcare, etc.
And opioids. A lot of the early deaths are in small towns and rural America - towards the South, Appalachia etc
However I don't quite trust this map. As you say it shows higher life expectancy in so many places - big cities especially - it simply doesn't square with the other data. I suspect a statistical glitch, an incoherence, in the way deaths are being recorded geographically.
As a long-time lurker, it is sad that this site is having abuse flung both ways these days. Nobody seems willing to get on or concede any ground anymore, what a shame.
"long-time lurker" lol! You joined a fortnight ago and have had 60 posts since then.
Anyone might think you used to post here under another name....
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
The police have for decades ignored the white on white killing of a prominent UK novelist.
The hatred towards the Conservatives is continuing unabated. If you doubt this, go out into the streets and listen.
I've never known anything like it. A seachange has occurred. They are going to get hammered at the next General Election.
Rinse and repeat.
It’s absolutely fine to have this view.
But you state it day after day. No evidence, no data to support it. Just a statement of opinion.
You may well be right (personally I suspect a hung Parliament with a labour government).
But it’s dull and repetitive to just start every thread with the same statement.
I feel the same when someone posts something Tory supportive and the famous five -Felix Casino Carlotta Driver and Sandpit-press the 'like' button. It's like there's a PB Tory 'whip' that's being organised in the background.
It can be the most fatuous post on the board but the 'likes from the cheerleaders are like clockwork. In fact so predictable is a felix 'like' that I worry for his well being if he misses one.
Who even wastes time looking at who has liked what?
Roger does. He 'likes' stalking me. Pretty sad really.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
That's how the cities have been redesigned. They often used to be walkable, but much of it was demolished for car parking lots and motorways. Now often baked into the zoning rules.
As predicted. Pretty sure this waltz has gone on in the lead up to most recent Scottish elections (though not usually this far out): SCons suggest tactical voting coalition, SLab state they wouldn’t touch it with a shitty stick, SCons moan on about being the only party who’ll protect the Union.
All very predictable - I wonder how many seats stay SNP as a result.
Russian Wagner warlord Prigozhin claims his forces are in “legal” control of Bakhmut after planting flag atop ruins of city hall. Ukraine leaders deny the claim and say they maintain control in Bakhmut. But it's clear some of the center has been captured. https://mobile.twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/1642852858709016576
Full marks for the satiric use of 'legal', though.
Is any of Bakhmut actually left standing, at all ? The degree of damage there to property seems to be up there and perhaps exceeding Grozny, Aleppo. Total flattening from every video from both sides. Can't be anyone left living there surely ?
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
The police have for decades ignored the white on white killing of a prominent UK novelist.
I don't want to spend the day arguing about grooming gangs, the subject is literally too bleak, disturbing and depressing, and it's a lovely spring day - yay - and I'm sitting in Gail's having a flat white staring at a happy world. So here are my final points all at once
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
Given the Conservatives won a landslide victory in 2019 and Labour has a clear lead in the polls it would be astonishing if 2019 Conservative voters were not more likely to switch to Labour than the reverse
Yes. That was very much my first reaction to the header. What's more, they are switching in precisely the numbers to give that lead. Not revelatory really.
12% of CURRENT (IE. not 2019) Conservative voters would definitely or "probably in the future" consider switching to Labour. The figure in the opposite direction is 9%. 54% of CURRENT Conservatives would never vote Labour, 65% of CURRENT Labour would never vote Conservative.
So in terms of current VI, the Lab vote still looks a tad more solid than the Conservative one.
Maybe it is just that Labour supporters have more hate in their hearts for those that disagree with them than Conservatives do?
Outing yourself as a staunch lab supporter.
While you, not for the first time, out yourself as the most stupid person on this site.
Unlike you, Malcolm, I am a moderate. I generally vote for the party that can deliver moderate and reasonably effective government. Also unlike you I would never support a party that had someone of questionable morals/for a party that has a leader who was described by his QC as a "bully and a sex pest" or a party that is happy to welcome someone who was suspended from another party for racism/antisemitism.
You are a sad angry git , to be pitied. I doubt even a mother could love such a bitter twisted little runt. Jog on loser.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Gun violence is probably statistically insignificant compared to the effects of poor diet, healthcare, etc.
And opioids. A lot of the early deaths are in small towns and rural America - towards the South, Appalachia etc
However I don't quite trust this map. As you say it shows higher life expectancy in so many places - big cities especially - it simply doesn't square with the other data. I suspect a statistical glitch, an incoherence, in the way deaths are being recorded geographically.
The numbers for Los Angeles County are correct - it really does exceed 80 years.
It is worth remembering that gun deaths, in the general scheme of things, are negligible. And LA (and other big cities) also tend to have lower rates of opioid addiction than the rural hinterland, and have excellent resources for treatment.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
The police have for decades ignored the white on white killing of a prominent UK novelist.
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Activity levels. Cities force you to walk more.
Not sure you have ever been to a US city in that case. Most of those I have visited with the exception of New York seem to actively discourage walking. Indeed the idea of walking anywhere in Los Angeles would be met with incredulity. Bear in mind this is the country that has drive through everything. Including drive through combined liquor and gun stores.
That's how the cities have been redesigned. They often used to be walkable, but much of it was demolished for car parking lots and motorways. Now often baked into the zoning rules.
Russian Wagner warlord Prigozhin claims his forces are in “legal” control of Bakhmut after planting flag atop ruins of city hall. Ukraine leaders deny the claim and say they maintain control in Bakhmut. But it's clear some of the center has been captured. https://mobile.twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/1642852858709016576
Full marks for the satiric use of 'legal', though.
Is any of Bakhmut actually left standing, at all ? The degree of damage there to property seems to be up there and perhaps exceeding Grozny, Aleppo. Total flattening from every video from both sides. Can't be anyone left living there surely ?
A big reason must be that its geographically and population wise quite small to be such a major battle point compared to the normal larger cities that play this role
That map puzzles me. Sure, the Deep South having low life expectancy is what you would expect, but given the amount of gun violence in America’s cities it’s a bit startling to see most of them have higher life expectancy.
Doubly so given that’s where most of the population live, so if anything you would expect American life expectancy to skew higher, masking a decline for certain groups and areas.
What’s the nuance?
Gun violence is probably statistically insignificant compared to the effects of poor diet, healthcare, etc.
And opioids. A lot of the early deaths are in small towns and rural America - towards the South, Appalachia etc
However I don't quite trust this map. As you say it shows higher life expectancy in so many places - big cities especially - it simply doesn't square with the other data. I suspect a statistical glitch, an incoherence, in the way deaths are being recorded geographically.
The numbers for Los Angeles County are correct - it really does exceed 80 years.
It is worth remembering that gun deaths, in the general scheme of things, are negligible. And LA (and other big cities) also tend to have lower rates of opioid addiction than the rural hinterland, and have excellent resources for treatment.
If that is the case - in most of the big American cities people are dying over 80- like the UK - then to reach an average life expectancy of 76 and falling, deaths in rural and Deep South America must be horrifically young. People in their 60s. And lots of child mortality. And young adult deaths from violence.
In his data spread, JB Murdoch noted this:
"One in 25 American five-year-olds today will not make it to their 40th birthday.
No parent should ever have to bury their child, but on average across the US one set of parents from every kindergarten class most likely will."
"But the vast majority of sexual abuse cases do not involved those of ethnic minorities and so I am all for clamping down on any kind of case, but if we are going to be serious we have to be honest about what the overlook is."
No shit, Sherlock, that's how minorities and majorities work. Wonder if he knows the per-capita rates and won't say, or doesn't know.
I don't want to spend the day arguing about grooming gangs, the subject is literally too bleak, disturbing and depressing, and it's a lovely spring day - yay - and I'm sitting in Gail's having a flat white staring at a happy world. So here are my final points all at once
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
And now I shall revert to kinder concepts
There may well have been issues around hesitancy of the police to act on information they were given.
But surely if you ascribe something in the culture to the reason for abuse of any kind but in this instance sexual abuse then you must ascribe it across the board.
If there are:
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by Pakistani men; 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by men of Kent; and 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by left handed Wolves supporters
and you think that there is something about the culture that contributed to these cases then you must surely look at each cultural/national/ethnic group engaged in this and make a pronouncement.
AFAICS people have only done this for one ethnic grouping - taxi drivers.
Morning all! I agree with @Heathener - the public mood is mutinous. And the latest Tory obscenity is the attack on British men of Pakistani heritage.
Yes, we have a few examples of Pakistani "grooming gangs" which the authorities ignored. But she's basically just given all the white men who do this the green light to not be suspected.
They *can't* be a nonce. They have white skin. Just like Jimmy Saville . This is crayon politics aimed at genuinely ignorant people who have had this weaponised by certain newspapers as a stick to beat anyone with funny skin. Or anyone who actually has a faith unlike the ignorant white racist.
Before anyone says I am being exclusionary, I am not. Some heinous acts have been carried out by British men of Pakistani heritage. As well as by white men of non-Pakistani heritage. Personally I think we should go after criminals - hard to do when the government have gutted the justice system.
It's got nothing to do with the cultural provenance of the perpetrators; it's all about the social class of the victims. If they had been beasting girls from Roedean instead of chavs from care homes they would have been locked up and the key thrown away at the first sniff.
The tories want to make it a racial issue because that appeals to their feebleminded gammony members.
I think too that Braverman and Sunak are not comfortable describing Asian grooming gangs, and want to emphasise the Muslim nature of them. It plays well to the Hindutva tendencies of many British Indians.
Yes, there were callers of Indian Sub-Continent heritage calling Nick Ferrari to make a big deal of the specific geographical heritage origin of the grooming gangs. Ferrari of course was lapping it up.
It's a handy little dog whistle for the Conservatives today, a multi pronged attack on the forces of wokery. It encompasses Labour is weak on "foreigners" (the wrong kind of "foreigners") Labour is weak on nonces and Labour is weak on criminals. After 26 years of weak Labour governments perhaps Suella and Richie Rich are onto something.
For what it's worth the Government do have a point on the failures of Northern Labour Councils.
The idea that seeing these grooming gangs as Muslim grooming gangs is a dog whistle and racist is precisely how they got away with it for so long.
That these crimes were ignored purely because the police were scared to be called racist is a pale imitation of the truth. Class prejudice and misogyny were also in the mix and at least as influential. The basic problem was the victims were not taken seriously. And who were they? They were white disadvantaged girls. Only if a person sees the issue mainly as an opportunity to score culture war points (eg Braverman) will they choose to focus on the 'political correctness' angle and ignore the other 2 factors.
So you think if there were organised gangs of white taxi drivers and kebab shop workers obviously raping and abusing tens of thousands of black girls across the country, the police and councils would have turned a blind eye for decades, out of misogyny and class prejudice?
History strongly suggests that children who are victims of sexual abuse are largely ignored whoever the perpetrators are. Clearly, Asian grooming gangs were also helped by political correctness - and the greater number of those using it as an excuse in order to avoid doing their jobs - but that's just one more layer to a situation in which victims are generally derided, despised and disbelieved.
I don't want to spend the day arguing about grooming gangs, the subject is literally too bleak, disturbing and depressing, and it's a lovely spring day - yay - and I'm sitting in Gail's having a flat white staring at a happy world. So here are my final points all at once
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
And now I shall revert to kinder concepts
There may well have been issues around hesitancy of the police to act on information they were given.
But surely if you ascribe something in the culture to the reason for abuse of any kind but in this instance sexual abuse then you must ascribe it across the board.
If there are:
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by Pakistani men; 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by men of Kent; and 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by left handed Wolves supporters
and you think that there is something about the culture that contributed to these cases then you must surely look at each cultural/national/ethnic group engaged in this and make a pronouncement.
AFAICS people have only done this for one ethnic grouping - taxi drivers.
Or have I missed something.
You may have missed something. Like this statement from one of the major prosecutors in these actual cases, a Muslim man:
"A senior prosecutor ended years of official denials over a pattern of race-linked sex crimes yesterday when he publicly acknowledged that the grooming and sexual exploitation of white girls by group offenders was “a particular problem in Asian communities”.
As two men were convicted of raping or assaulting four drunken young women in North West England, the region’s Chief Crown Prosecutor said it should not pass unnoticed “that the perpetrators were Asian and the victims were not”.
Nazir Afzal suggested that “cultural baggage and the status of women among some men in these communities contributes to their disrespect for the rights of women.
“Exploitation happens in every community but these cases demonstrate that group grooming is a particular problem in Asian communities. I will not turn a blind eye to crimes in any community,” he said."
I don't want to spend the day arguing about grooming gangs, the subject is literally too bleak, disturbing and depressing, and it's a lovely spring day - yay - and I'm sitting in Gail's having a flat white staring at a happy world. So here are my final points all at once
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
And now I shall revert to kinder concepts
Cover-up is common to pretty well every instance of child abuse, and far from confined to social services - Saville; Smith; various churches; residential schools of various kinds, etc.
If the government are serious about addressing the problem, rather than issuing soundbites, then they will devote significant resources to doing so. I'm open to being surprised, but looking at their record, I'm sceptical.
I really can't be arsed to argue with PB on this topic, not today. Partly because there is a class of PB-er who simply will not deal with the reality in front of them, and will seek ANY alternative explanation. It's like being a Darwinian in a forum of creationists. So I hereby resign from this debate, for now
I don't want to spend the day arguing about grooming gangs, the subject is literally too bleak, disturbing and depressing, and it's a lovely spring day - yay - and I'm sitting in Gail's having a flat white staring at a happy world. So here are my final points all at once
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
And now I shall revert to kinder concepts
There may well have been issues around hesitancy of the police to act on information they were given.
But surely if you ascribe something in the culture to the reason for abuse of any kind but in this instance sexual abuse then you must ascribe it across the board.
If there are:
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by Pakistani men; 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by men of Kent; and 1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by left handed Wolves supporters
and you think that there is something about the culture that contributed to these cases then you must surely look at each cultural/national/ethnic group engaged in this and make a pronouncement.
AFAICS people have only done this for one ethnic grouping - taxi drivers.
Or have I missed something.
You may have missed something. Like this statement from one of the major prosecutors in these actual cases, a Muslim man:
"A senior prosecutor ended years of official denials over a pattern of race-linked sex crimes yesterday when he publicly acknowledged that the grooming and sexual exploitation of white girls by group offenders was “a particular problem in Asian communities”.
As two men were convicted of raping or assaulting four drunken young women in North West England, the region’s Chief Crown Prosecutor said it should not pass unnoticed “that the perpetrators were Asian and the victims were not”.
Nazir Afzal suggested that “cultural baggage and the status of women among some men in these communities contributes to their disrespect for the rights of women.
“Exploitation happens in every community but these cases demonstrate that group grooming is a particular problem in Asian communities. I will not turn a blind eye to crimes in any community,” he said."
Yes it looks as though the Asian community has a problem with sex crimes. As does the indigenous white community. As do many other communities.
It's a bit of a man bites dog thing for the indigenous population, however.
The key issue is let's imagine that the occurrence of this is 1/1000 for the Asian community (itself of course as was discussed today a broad spectrum of people with brown skin), and 1/756 for the indigenous population. Are you prepared to say, and do you have the data science to confirm that the discrepancy is down to ethnic factors.
If indeed there is a discrepancy. Is there? @carnforth evidently thinks there is and there may well be but I have no idea.
Comments
London: Stephen Smith’s phone call last year with his old Labor mate, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, was straight to the point. Albanese needed him to take up Australia’s oldest diplomatic posting as the 26th high commissioner to London.
“He gave me a one word brief,” Smith, whose voice is somewhat scratchy as he recovers from a nasty bout of COVID, said in London this week. “Security.”
https://amp.smh.com.au/world/europe/a-one-word-brief-albanese-s-to-the-point-call-with-our-top-man-in-london-20230331-p5cwzd.html
“Republic” gets a brief mention, in passing.
Unlike you, Malcolm, I am a moderate. I generally vote for the party that can deliver moderate and reasonably effective government. Also unlike you I would never support a party that had someone of questionable morals/for a party that has a leader who was described by his QC as a "bully and a sex pest" or a party that is happy to welcome someone who was suspended from another party for racism/antisemitism.
Have a nice day everyone
It was just not the conspiracy that the conspiracy theorists wanted.
Also, it allows me to read Tom Knox or S.K. Tremaine without anyone having to know. The equivalent of a brown-paper wrapping around it...
If you do a lot of reading, and the stuff doesn't have diagrams, then they're wonderful. I carry one when I go for a long run and need to get public transport back, as its relatively light, and there's always something on it I'd want to read, depending on my mood.
But I fear that the Amazon book's subscription service is a little bit evil.
https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/ian-rankin-appalled-at-amazon-over-e-book-returns-policy-which-he-claims-deprives-authors-of-royalties-3639452
(*) Paperwhite, I think.
Get CHB to email him at that address
Maybe it's just a branding thing?
So much of what repels people from the Tories is the behaviour of the individuals within it.
Phew, stopped just in time!
It's why the RSPCA was set up decades before the NSPCC, why caning was still allowed into the 1990s and why care home abuse (still) goes on today with a shrug.
Any ideas how I get in touch with the eds?
How bad are Oxford University’s spinout policies?
https://sifted.eu/articles/oxford-university-spinout-policies/
...It had the lowest founder satisfaction rate in Europe, according to a 2022 survey of spinouts, and, despite creating the most startups of any university in the UK, research shows it lags behind its closest rival when it comes to producing big companies...
...Beauhurst’s data suggests that Oxford initially takes 24.3% equity on average, while Cambridge takes 12.6%. Macfarlane says high early dilution makes Oxford’s companies less attractive to investors later on...
Also a serious issue since it stymies tech led growth.
One thing I have noticed is that older people in this country are frequently very intolerant of children, and I wonder whether this reflects our nuclear families where many older people have very limited contact with their own grandchildren, let alone any other children.
But it is definitely a cultural thing too. When my parents spend time with us and our kids they seem to enjoy it but always talk about being exhausted afterwards and I always get the sense it is a bit of a chore for them. Whereas my south Asian parents in law always seem energised by the children, and the childrens' actual or perceived needs (frequently food related) are their main focus. And they are in their mid-80s, about ten years older than my folks, so have every right to be exhausted.
founders from Oxford tend to be at a disadvantage to peers at Cambridge because there are fewer local early-stage investment funds.
Last time I checked O & C were about 80 miles apart.
"The AI disaster is already here, and we don’t care
For decades we’ve been teaching ourselves to submit to technology that is destroying civilisation" (£)
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/03/the-ai-disaster-is-already-here-and-we-dont-care/
Some may feel a good deal of this effort is ill directed and not brilliantly informed, but it is rarely badly intended.
BTW I suspect that people give more to animal than children's charities because (a) funding special children needs is seen as a state obligation and (b) the big children's charities act as a bunch of campaigning whingers about the wickedness of government instead of helping people.
* Apparently our car is actually a truck.
... for example.
Inside the bitter GOP ‘undercard’ rivalry between Mike Pence and Nikki Haley
Pence staffers are complaining privately about media coverage of another, second-tier contender.
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/04/03/pence-haley-feud-trump-00090038
Russian Wagner warlord Prigozhin claims his forces are in “legal” control of Bakhmut after planting flag atop ruins of city hall. Ukraine leaders deny the claim and say they maintain control in Bakhmut. But it's clear some of the center has been captured.
https://mobile.twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/1642852858709016576
Full marks for the satiric use of 'legal', though.
I have been banned from a couple of forums in my time, a Dr Who one and a cult TV one.
Why bother begging to get back ?
Especially if you only are going to get banned again for the same thing.
Haven't they?
However I don't quite trust this map. As you say it shows higher life expectancy in so many places - big cities especially - it simply doesn't square with the other data. I suspect a statistical glitch, an incoherence, in the way deaths are being recorded geographically.
https://twitter.com/FridaGhitis/status/1642549167619702784
*"If I'm re-elected."
Edit: a PBer entirely unconnected to the events described got there before me.
Exclusive: More than a dozen women raise concerns about different men – with one woman alleging she was raped at staff party
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/apr/03/revealed-new-claims-of-sexual-misconduct-and-toxic-culture-at-cbi
Appreciate it is not always right
The degree of damage there to property seems to be up there and perhaps exceeding Grozny, Aleppo.
Total flattening from every video from both sides.
Can't be anyone left living there surely ?
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2006/jun/10/fiction.williamgolding
1. The BAME status of Sunak and Braverman allows them to address this issue head on in a way no white politician would dare. Good for them. It has to be done
2. They are putting Labour in an awkward position. The entire country knows that race/ethnicity/political correctness played a big part in this, yet Labour's instincts will be to deny it: see the Guardian's repellent doublethink today, still trying to disguise the truth
3. Remember one of these first people to tell us this was happening? Nick Griffin. How did the Establishment react? They arrested.... Nick Griffin... for stirring up racial hatred. So, again, denying that race is a major aspect is dumb, and there have been many attempts at a cover-up, that was just one
And now I shall revert to kinder concepts
It is worth remembering that gun deaths, in the general scheme of things, are negligible. And LA (and other big cities) also tend to have lower rates of opioid addiction than the rural hinterland, and have excellent resources for treatment.
https://cebr.com/reports/more-than-200-billion-has-been-written-off-the-value-of-the-uks-commercial-real-estate-in-the-past-nine-months-how-does-this-affect-an-already-struggling-economy/
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2006/jun/10/fiction.williamgolding
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2006/jun/10/fiction.williamgolding
Edit: @FrankBooth beats me to it!
In his data spread, JB Murdoch noted this:
"One in 25 American five-year-olds today will not make it to their 40th birthday.
No parent should ever have to bury their child, but on average across the US one set of parents from every kindergarten class most likely will."
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1641799722418556931
"But the vast majority of sexual abuse cases do not involved those of ethnic minorities and so I am all for clamping down on any kind of case, but if we are going to be serious we have to be honest about what the overlook is."
No shit, Sherlock, that's how minorities and majorities work. Wonder if he knows the per-capita rates and won't say, or doesn't know.
But surely if you ascribe something in the culture to the reason for abuse of any kind but in this instance sexual abuse then you must ascribe it across the board.
If there are:
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by Pakistani men;
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by men of Kent; and
1,000 cases of x-type of abuse perpetrated by left handed Wolves supporters
and you think that there is something about the culture that contributed to these cases then you must surely look at each cultural/national/ethnic group engaged in this and make a pronouncement.
AFAICS people have only done this for one ethnic grouping - taxi drivers.
Or have I missed something.
"A senior prosecutor ended years of official denials over a pattern of race-linked sex crimes yesterday when he publicly acknowledged that the grooming and sexual exploitation of white girls by group offenders was “a particular problem in Asian communities”.
As two men were convicted of raping or assaulting four drunken young women in North West England, the region’s Chief Crown Prosecutor said it should not pass unnoticed “that the perpetrators were Asian and the victims were not”.
Nazir Afzal suggested that “cultural baggage and the status of women among some men in these communities contributes to their disrespect for the rights of women.
“Exploitation happens in every community but these cases demonstrate that group grooming is a particular problem in Asian communities. I will not turn a blind eye to crimes in any community,” he said."
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a75d16b1-a15f-4c0a-af84-7308447feb31
If the government are serious about addressing the problem, rather than issuing soundbites, then they will devote significant resources to doing so.
I'm open to being surprised, but looking at their record, I'm sceptical.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/apr/02/rishi-sunak-says-grooming-gang-crackdown-will-defy-political-correctness
...Only 11% of child sexual abuse cases end with a charge, down from 32% seven years ago, according to official figures, while court delays have grown far worse, leading to some victims waiting years for justice...
It's a bit of a man bites dog thing for the indigenous population, however.
The key issue is let's imagine that the occurrence of this is 1/1000 for the Asian community (itself of course as was discussed today a broad spectrum of people with brown skin), and 1/756 for the indigenous population. Are you prepared to say, and do you have the data science to confirm that the discrepancy is down to ethnic factors.
If indeed there is a discrepancy. Is there? @carnforth evidently thinks there is and there may well be but I have no idea.