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Starmer is eminently beatable – politicalbetting.com

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  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237
    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,279
    Kyrgios just used the F word on court. Surely a code violation?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    I can't see any reasons to back Hunt.

    Personally, I like him but no-one else seems to agree - he's unpopular with the Tory base and, it seems, target voters in both the north and south.

    There’s something inwardly devious about him that people pick up on. Gove has a similar issue.

    It’s not necessarily fair. Johnson for example managed not to project this, despite being an entirely self-serving c**t (although once you did see this in Johnson it was impossible not to see it ever again).
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571
    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Some Abe blackening as a distraction. An ‘unfortunate’ coincidence at the very least.



    https://twitter.com/davide_melia/status/1545430542241304577?s=21&t=9vNMjuk1t_3uyJlRF4XaUQ

    If that is right it is unbelievably vile
    Abe’s record of WWII apologetics was not a happy one.
    Mods here get twitchy over condoning political assassination. So I would like to condemn wholeheartedly home made gun man. Really naughty.
    I made no such suggestion, and would not do such a thing.

    Note that the S Korean president condemned the assassination in the strongest possible terms - and Korea had, and has far stronger feelings on the issue than do I, and with good reason.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,279
    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I would in places like Hay-on-Wye, Scilly Isles, Holy Island, etc.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,164
    Andy_JS said:

    Kyrgios just used the F word on court. Surely a code violation?

    In front of Prince George as well (bet he's loving it!).
  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,080
    edited July 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    kle4 said:

    Some Abe blackening as a distraction. An ‘unfortunate’ coincidence at the very least.



    https://twitter.com/davide_melia/status/1545430542241304577?s=21&t=9vNMjuk1t_3uyJlRF4XaUQ

    I guess he was just a fan of the Hong Kong movie 'Men Behind the Sun'?
    Agree. That looks a false claim to link 731 "Refers to Unit 731".

    Not seen it but it seems to be a horrible exploitation movie celebrating unit 731 so what's the difference?
    Intention, or not.

    We're used here to abuse created on the basis of fabricated associations (on all wings of politics), and silly insistence on removal of alleged association that does not exist (see Johnnie Peacock).

    Neither is useful, imo.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,089
    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    Cash I don't carry, and cards I wouldn't leave anywhere - mainly because they are more dangerous skimmed and left with you than stolen.

    Bags and laptops I wouldn't leave in any European City.

    But anyone can come to Cambridge and nick my laptop while I go for a pee. (That said, I wouldn't fancy their chances against the fearsome cafe ladies who know me and my gear.)
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    Neil O’Brien - Mr “Level Up” - has just come out for Badenoch, which is strange, as her public statements suggest she wants to radically down-size the state.

    She already has a number of northern MPs in support.

    Something odd going on here.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 39,748
    tlg86 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Kyrgios just used the F word on court. Surely a code violation?

    In front of Prince George as well (bet he's loving it!).
    ‘Great grandpa is back!’
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    MattW said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    kle4 said:

    Some Abe blackening as a distraction. An ‘unfortunate’ coincidence at the very least.



    https://twitter.com/davide_melia/status/1545430542241304577?s=21&t=9vNMjuk1t_3uyJlRF4XaUQ

    I guess he was just a fan of the Hong Kong movie 'Men Behind the Sun'?
    Agree. That looks a false claim to link 731 "Refers to Unit 731".

    Not seen it but it seems to be a horrible exploitation movie celebrating unit 731 so what's the difference?
    Intention or not.
    Irrelevant. Liking a celebration of a thing is the same thing as liking the thing
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,393

    All the criticisms of Rishi are entirely accurate, even if they are made by sore losers like Rees-Mogg and Goldsmith.

    The man’s a menace.

    I just watched the Tugendhat interview.
    A bit clunky, but he’s totally sound.

    The sound of snoring from anyone unfortunate enough to watch the Tug-End interview.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Nigelb said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Some Abe blackening as a distraction. An ‘unfortunate’ coincidence at the very least.



    https://twitter.com/davide_melia/status/1545430542241304577?s=21&t=9vNMjuk1t_3uyJlRF4XaUQ

    If that is right it is unbelievably vile
    Abe’s record of WWII apologetics was not a happy one.
    Mods here get twitchy over condoning political assassination. So I would like to condemn wholeheartedly home made gun man. Really naughty.
    I made no such suggestion, and would not do such a thing.

    Note that the S Korean president condemned the assassination in the strongest possible terms - and Korea had, and has far stronger feelings on the issue than do I, and with good reason.
    I meant me not you.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    All the criticisms of Rishi are entirely accurate, even if they are made by sore losers like Rees-Mogg and Goldsmith.

    The man’s a menace.

    I just watched the Tugendhat interview.
    A bit clunky, but he’s totally sound.

    The sound of snoring from anyone unfortunate enough to watch the Tug-End interview.
    And yet he still has more charisma than Keir Starmer.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    Leon said:

    Home thoughts from the near abroad

    I’ve recently noticed EU politicians - eg Ursula Von D L - using the phrase “European Dream”, in direct contrast to “American Dream”

    Sitting here in Rose, Montenegro, i am certainly looking at the European Dream. A handsome historic Venetian village by the Adriatic. Lots of people enjoying their sunny Sunday, eating, drinking, swimming, sunbathing. Big family groups,. Boating and paddleboarding. Almost no obesity, because the food is good and wholesome (if basic) and everyone walks the walkable old towns and villages

    Pretty much zero crime. No guns. Decent local wine

    I honestly doubt if there are many humans enjoying life more than Montenegrins right here right now, in their unpretentious but beautiful country. This despite them having a GDP per capita of just $25k

    The EU is on to something with this “European Dream” thing. Tho, ironically, Montenegro is not in the EU

    The dream of the EU was always a good one. The reality was not always up to it, but that's ok so long as they work at it, and not get complacent.

  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    Home thoughts from the near abroad

    I’ve recently noticed EU politicians - eg Ursula Von D L - using the phrase “European Dream”, in direct contrast to “American Dream”

    Sitting here in Rose, Montenegro, i am certainly looking at the European Dream. A handsome historic Venetian village by the Adriatic. Lots of people enjoying their sunny Sunday, eating, drinking, swimming, sunbathing. Big family groups,. Boating and paddleboarding. Almost no obesity, because the food is good and wholesome (if basic) and everyone walks the walkable old towns and villages

    Pretty much zero crime. No guns. Decent local wine

    I honestly doubt if there are many humans enjoying life more than Montenegrins right here right now, in their unpretentious but beautiful country. This despite them having a GDP per capita of just $25k

    The EU is on to something with this “European Dream” thing. Tho, ironically, Montenegro is not in the EU

    The dream of the EU was always a good one. The reality was not always up to it, but that's ok so long as they work at it, and not get complacent.
    How’s the British dream going?

  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,080
    edited July 2022
    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    Cash I don't carry, and cards I wouldn't leave anywhere - mainly because they are more dangerous skimmed and left with you than stolen.

    Bags and laptops I wouldn't leave in any European City.

    But anyone can come to Cambridge and nick my laptop while I go for a pee. (That said, I wouldn't fancy their chances against the fearsome cafe ladies who know me and my gear.)
    Hmmm. I *never* do *anything* like that.

    More domestically, I have the first year's crop on my Black Butte blackberry bush, within 7-8m of the drive entrance.

    About 4 of the 6 blackberries have vanished.

    Should I blame pigeons or pedestrians walking by?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    Home thoughts from the near abroad

    I’ve recently noticed EU politicians - eg Ursula Von D L - using the phrase “European Dream”, in direct contrast to “American Dream”

    Sitting here in Rose, Montenegro, i am certainly looking at the European Dream. A handsome historic Venetian village by the Adriatic. Lots of people enjoying their sunny Sunday, eating, drinking, swimming, sunbathing. Big family groups,. Boating and paddleboarding. Almost no obesity, because the food is good and wholesome (if basic) and everyone walks the walkable old towns and villages

    Pretty much zero crime. No guns. Decent local wine

    I honestly doubt if there are many humans enjoying life more than Montenegrins right here right now, in their unpretentious but beautiful country. This despite them having a GDP per capita of just $25k

    The EU is on to something with this “European Dream” thing. Tho, ironically, Montenegro is not in the EU

    The dream of the EU was always a good one. The reality was not always up to it, but that's ok so long as they work at it, and not get complacent.
    How’s the British dream going?

    Could be better. Why, were you under the impression my point was knocking the EU? It wasn't.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Walker, what do you mean, something strange with support for Badenoch?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,913
    Still calling it for Djokovic - two sets to one now.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,913
    Kyrgios ranting and raving!
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    I'm never entirely sure why Kyrgios doesn't just go off and do something else that he actually likes and enjoys instead.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,393

    All the criticisms of Rishi are entirely accurate, even if they are made by sore losers like Rees-Mogg and Goldsmith.

    The man’s a menace.

    I just watched the Tugendhat interview.
    A bit clunky, but he’s totally sound.

    The sound of snoring from anyone unfortunate enough to watch the Tug-End interview.
    And yet he still has more charisma than Keir Starmer.

    It would be a race to the bottom with those two plus Davey.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Flare, maybe he enjoys being a shouty fellow?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    Home thoughts from the near abroad

    I’ve recently noticed EU politicians - eg Ursula Von D L - using the phrase “European Dream”, in direct contrast to “American Dream”

    Sitting here in Rose, Montenegro, i am certainly looking at the European Dream. A handsome historic Venetian village by the Adriatic. Lots of people enjoying their sunny Sunday, eating, drinking, swimming, sunbathing. Big family groups,. Boating and paddleboarding. Almost no obesity, because the food is good and wholesome (if basic) and everyone walks the walkable old towns and villages

    Pretty much zero crime. No guns. Decent local wine

    I honestly doubt if there are many humans enjoying life more than Montenegrins right here right now, in their unpretentious but beautiful country. This despite them having a GDP per capita of just $25k

    The EU is on to something with this “European Dream” thing. Tho, ironically, Montenegro is not in the EU

    The dream of the EU was always a good one. The reality was not always up to it, but that's ok so long as they work at it, and not get complacent.
    How’s the British dream going?

    Could be better. Why, were you under the impression my point was knocking the EU? It wasn't.
    You’re right, I posted too soon.

    I’m quite interested in what the British dream actually consists of.

    I think, unlike the American and European versions, it involves being a rentier, which if true explains a lot of problems about the UK.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Neil O’Brien - Mr “Level Up” - has just come out for Badenoch, which is strange, as her public statements suggest she wants to radically down-size the state.

    She already has a number of northern MPs in support.

    Something odd going on here.

    You're assuming

    a) she means what she says

    b) even if she does, people will act rationally in their support.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,080
    edited July 2022

    tlg86 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Kyrgios just used the F word on court. Surely a code violation?

    In front of Prince George as well (bet he's loving it!).
    ‘Great grandpa is back!’
    Is that not just his shtick?

    The Nastase of our times?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Kyrgios ranting and raving!

    Djokovic is the more likable of the two by far.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,787

    Neil O’Brien - Mr “Level Up” - has just come out for Badenoch, which is strange, as her public statements suggest she wants to radically down-size the state.

    She already has a number of northern MPs in support.

    Something odd going on here.

    Badenoch could potentially consolidate support from the ERG wing after Braverman drops out, and the Mayite wing. She's got a stronger chance of making it into the final 2 than most of the others.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623

    Mr. Flare, maybe he enjoys being a shouty fellow?

    Seems to be the only explanation, really. The tennis is just a good excuse for him to rant and rave to an audience.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Kyrgios is clearly the new John Mcenroe
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    Mr. Walker, what do you mean, something strange with support for Badenoch?

    Personally I think she’s undercooked.
    But logically if you believe the government needs to spend more on the North, why would you support someone who wants to spend less on everyone?

    (Unless you think she can appeal to northern seats).
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392
    HYUFD said:

    Kyrgios is clearly the new John Mcenroe

    No, he's a dick even when he isn't raging against calls.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    Cracking tennis.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Walker, ah, I've spotted the flaw in your reasoning.

    You're attempting to view the Conservative leadership election through a lens of logic.

    Last time, they elected Boris Johnson. If logic played a significant role, this event could not have transpired.
  • Neil O’Brien - Mr “Level Up” - has just come out for Badenoch, which is strange, as her public statements suggest she wants to radically down-size the state.

    She already has a number of northern MPs in support.

    Something odd going on here.

    Badenoch could potentially consolidate support from the ERG wing after Braverman drops out, and the Mayite wing. She's got a stronger chance of making it into the final 2 than most of the others.
    Badenoch's support is mostly from MPs elected in 2017 and 2019. Potentially new MPs backing someone they see as a future leader (even if too soon this time)
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    Home thoughts from the near abroad

    I’ve recently noticed EU politicians - eg Ursula Von D L - using the phrase “European Dream”, in direct contrast to “American Dream”

    Sitting here in Rose, Montenegro, i am certainly looking at the European Dream. A handsome historic Venetian village by the Adriatic. Lots of people enjoying their sunny Sunday, eating, drinking, swimming, sunbathing. Big family groups,. Boating and paddleboarding. Almost no obesity, because the food is good and wholesome (if basic) and everyone walks the walkable old towns and villages

    Pretty much zero crime. No guns. Decent local wine

    I honestly doubt if there are many humans enjoying life more than Montenegrins right here right now, in their unpretentious but beautiful country. This despite them having a GDP per capita of just $25k

    The EU is on to something with this “European Dream” thing. Tho, ironically, Montenegro is not in the EU

    The dream of the EU was always a good one. The reality was not always up to it, but that's ok so long as they work at it, and not get complacent.

    Wait til you hear about the gulf between Britain in the fever dream of campaign videos and Britain of the Ladbrokes and PDSA highstreets.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,913

    Still calling it for Djokovic - two sets to one now.

    Told you ;)
  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,080

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    My south facing piano nobile Camden flat, with its floor to ceiling windows, can easily be 10C hotter than the temp outside, in hot sunny weather

    So it could be 52C. With no aircon

    Think I’ll be spending the weekend in Sainsburys

    Sorry to sound like a stalker but from memory you live in a modern block with full-walled (or close) windows.

    Doesn’t it get BLOODY hot, and why isn’t here aircon?

    I see from US travel twitter that one of the main bitches about Europe (not England per se) is the lack of ubiquitous aircon.
    No I live in a Grade II listed late Georgian terrace (converted) which is very handsome to look at but it impossible to keep cool. Maybe not allowed aircon because of the listing
    Oh now I get the piano nobile reference.
    I thought you were just talking yourself up.

    In my experience those Georgian terraces are nice and cool in the basement flat, but less so upstairs.
    They did tend to be jerry-built by speculators.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,008

    Neil O’Brien - Mr “Level Up” - has just come out for Badenoch, which is strange, as her public statements suggest she wants to radically down-size the state.

    She already has a number of northern MPs in support.

    Something odd going on here.

    Badenoch is currently only one MP behind Truss and Hunt.

    If she gets 2 more MPs then she's in 3rd place.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Royale, may not come to this, but if Sunak thinks he has sufficient support to choose his opponent, I wonder who he would go for.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,008
    tlg86 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Kyrgios just used the F word on court. Surely a code violation?

    In front of Prince George as well (bet he's loving it!).
    Yes, your highness, your highness.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,008

    Mr. Royale, may not come to this, but if Sunak thinks he has sufficient support to choose his opponent, I wonder who he would go for.

    Probably Hunt, as he'd beat him.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,089
    MattW said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    Cash I don't carry, and cards I wouldn't leave anywhere - mainly because they are more dangerous skimmed and left with you than stolen.

    Bags and laptops I wouldn't leave in any European City.

    But anyone can come to Cambridge and nick my laptop while I go for a pee. (That said, I wouldn't fancy their chances against the fearsome cafe ladies who know me and my gear.)
    Hmmm. I *never* do *anything* like that.

    More domestically, I have the first year's crop on my Black Butte blackberry bush, within 7-8m of the drive entrance.

    About 4 of the 6 blackberries have vanished.

    Should I blame pigeons or pedestrians walking by?
    You definitely can't leave Blackberries unattended.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,138
    mwadams said:

    MattW said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    Cash I don't carry, and cards I wouldn't leave anywhere - mainly because they are more dangerous skimmed and left with you than stolen.

    Bags and laptops I wouldn't leave in any European City.

    But anyone can come to Cambridge and nick my laptop while I go for a pee. (That said, I wouldn't fancy their chances against the fearsome cafe ladies who know me and my gear.)
    Hmmm. I *never* do *anything* like that.

    More domestically, I have the first year's crop on my Black Butte blackberry bush, within 7-8m of the drive entrance.

    About 4 of the 6 blackberries have vanished.

    Should I blame pigeons or pedestrians walking by?
    You definitely can't leave Blackberries unattended.
    Pigeons and/or blackbirds - been eating our redcurrants.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    I just watched Shapps on Ridge.

    I very much like how he says he wants the UK to be the biggest economy in Europe by 2050.

    As a liberal-social democrat with gaullist tendencies, I approve.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Cicero said:

    Possibly Starmer is beatable, but wading through the UK newpapers this afternoon I see nothing in any of the Tory contenders that he has to fear. More to the point, whoever the next Conservative leader ends up being, they are going to face constant and vicious sniping from their own side. After two years of the Tories taking chunks out each other I think the electorate will loathe them beyond all reason. I am wondering it we might not see a Tory vote share even below 1997. Labour and increasingly the Lib Dems are massively better organised and a couple more good by elections and strong locals next spring could put a lot of pressure on a divided and disorganized Conservative organisation attempting to defend a fairly dire record in government.

    He has everything to fear from everyone because he has nothing to offer except prosecution skills which work when the opposition has done something wrong, and ideally you haven’t.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited July 2022

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Really....I don't generally like going for drinks with dodgy second hand car salesmen types. He is sort that is going to take that opportunity to hard sell you a car, double glazing, crypto, an MLM opportunity ....
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Really....I don't generally like going for drinks with dodgy second hand car salesmen types. He is going to hard sell you a car, double glazing, crypto ....
    I said consider…
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,138
    @Farooq - we were complaining about Edinburgh at Arts Festival time the other day. Surprised to find that HMG have anticipated this issue and are doing what they can to knee it in the goolies:

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/10/post-brexit-visa-rules-a-disaster-for-arts-says-edinburgh-festival-director
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,957

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Really....I don't generally like going for drinks with dodgy second hand car salesmen types. He is sort that is going to take that opportunity to hard sell you a car, double glazing, crypto, an MLM opportunity ....
    I joked the other day that if Shapps wasn't an MP/cabinet minister he'd be on Twitter promotings NFTs guaranteed to turn a profit.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,138

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Really....I don't generally like going for drinks with dodgy second hand car salesmen types. He is going to hard sell you a car, double glazing, crypto ....
    I said consider…
    He'd probably give you the wrong business card for the persona de la nuit - at which you would promptly wonder WTF!, abandon your drink and buy yourself a fresh one at the bar.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Really....I don't generally like going for drinks with dodgy second hand car salesmen types. He is sort that is going to take that opportunity to hard sell you a car, double glazing, crypto, an MLM opportunity ....
    I joked the other day that if Shapps wasn't an MP/cabinet minister he'd be on Twitter promotings NFTs guaranteed to turn a profit.
    Are we sure Mr Green isn't?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    IshmaelZ said:

    Cicero said:

    Possibly Starmer is beatable, but wading through the UK newpapers this afternoon I see nothing in any of the Tory contenders that he has to fear. More to the point, whoever the next Conservative leader ends up being, they are going to face constant and vicious sniping from their own side. After two years of the Tories taking chunks out each other I think the electorate will loathe them beyond all reason. I am wondering it we might not see a Tory vote share even below 1997. Labour and increasingly the Lib Dems are massively better organised and a couple more good by elections and strong locals next spring could put a lot of pressure on a divided and disorganized Conservative organisation attempting to defend a fairly dire record in government.

    He has everything to fear from everyone because he has nothing to offer except prosecution skills which work when the opposition has done something wrong, and ideally you haven’t.
    I think we’ve seen enough of Keir to know that his strength is administration and his weakness is retail politics.

    If he must insist on being PM he needs charismatics and visionaries right underneath him.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    You can do that in Sweden, Cyprus, and most of Scotland.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    My south facing piano nobile Camden flat, with its floor to ceiling windows, can easily be 10C hotter than the temp outside, in hot sunny weather

    So it could be 52C. With no aircon

    Think I’ll be spending the weekend in Sainsburys

    Sorry to sound like a stalker but from memory you live in a modern block with full-walled (or close) windows.

    Doesn’t it get BLOODY hot, and why isn’t here aircon?

    I see from US travel twitter that one of the main bitches about Europe (not England per se) is the lack of ubiquitous aircon.
    No I live in a Grade II listed late Georgian terrace (converted) which is very handsome to look at but it impossible to keep cool. Maybe not allowed aircon because of the listing
    Oh now I get the piano nobile reference.
    I thought you were just talking yourself up.

    In my experience those Georgian terraces are nice and cool in the basement flat, but less so upstairs.
    They did tend to be jerry-built by speculators.
    Jerry-built Georgian. Quite literally. VG
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    Carnyx said:

    @Farooq - we were complaining about Edinburgh at Arts Festival time the other day. Surprised to find that HMG have anticipated this issue and are doing what they can to knee it in the goolies:

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/10/post-brexit-visa-rules-a-disaster-for-arts-says-edinburgh-festival-director

    I wasn't complaining about it, more saying that I find the stress and bother of finding accommodation during August to not be worth the bother. When I lived in Edinburgh, I found the ability to hop on a bus and go see all this good stuff to be brilliant.

    No surprise that HMG are cocking things up though. Blinded by ideology.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 2,179

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Since that is what many people said about Boris I would say it is probably a negative qualification.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Pant’s out.

    And Kholi, and Sharma.

    31/3 chasing 216. :D
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    All of a sudden Hunt has 12 nominations, and Suella DeVille is in last place?

    Thoughts and prayers for Mogg.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812
    Cicero said:

    Shapps also looks, possibly alongside Mordaunt, the only person you’d consider having a drink with.

    If that’s important.

    Since that is what many people said about Boris I would say it is probably a negative qualification.
    He also said he didn’t see why the Boris regime had to end, “unlike colleagues”.

    He said it in a cheery way, though.
  • JonWCJonWC Posts: 285
    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    You can do that in Sweden, Cyprus, and most of Scotland.
    No, you can’t

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,138
    edited July 2022
    Farooq said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
    Yes, but that self-evidently makes you a hard man, with whom nane daur meddle. Swimming off Aberdeen and the Broch FFS.
  • JonWCJonWC Posts: 285
    Farooq said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
    Yes sunglasses, shoes and mobile phone on the beach here an hour ago. Nobody nicked them.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,913
    Carnyx said:

    Farooq said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
    Yes, but that self-evidently makes you a hard man, with whom nane daur meddle. Swimming off Aberdeen and the Broch FFS.
    I've been to both Don and Dee estuaries - but never in the sea :lol:
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237
    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Again, not true
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,760
    DavidL said:

    My housemate who rarely engages politically caught a bit of Starmer being interviewed on the news and she immediately picked up on his lack of charisma in the way he speaks, his tendency to repeat himself and the lack of substance in what he actually said

    She is someone who regularly votes Green or LD and so not completely against left of centre candidates.

    But she was less than impressed by the way he comes across on screen.

    If you can't persuade people to listen to you because of the way you present yourself through the media, they are never going to bother to hear what you have to say.

    Setting aside the lack of policy clarity, it is this presentational issue that will continue to hamper Starmer.

    He seems very conscious that most news media will only use a few seconds of the interview so he repeats his key point again and again. When you get a longer play it just looks positively weird. Same words again and again.

    Edit, see how badly that reads?
    Like EdM and his “get round the table and negotiate” interview?

    For your viewing delight:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wCem9EZb-YA
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237
    JonWC said:

    Farooq said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
    Yes sunglasses, shoes and mobile phone on the beach here an hour ago. Nobody nicked them.
    This is not a beach
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,787

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    You can do that in Sweden, Cyprus, and most of Scotland.
    You mean the uninhabited parts?
  • JonWCJonWC Posts: 285
    Leon said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Again, not true
    I'm glad you are omniscient as well as apparently omnipresent.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237
    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Again, not true
    I'm glad you are omniscient as well as apparently omnipresent.

    I know Devon really well, i was born there
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    You can do that in Sweden, Cyprus, and most of Scotland.
    No, you can’t

    You can do it anywhere - it's just what probability there is for you to come back to it still there...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    O phuck
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    Farooq said:

    JonWC said:

    Leon said:

    mwadams said:

    Leon said:

    This is how little crime there is in Montenegro

    Big bustling (excellent) seafood restaurant in a pretty seaside village. Hundreds of people nearby

    The group next to me - late 20s, jolly - have all, in sequence, stood up and walked away. Temporarily leaving behind 2 phones, a purse, several bags, sunglasses, car keys

    Incredible. Was Britain once like this?


    I regularly do that in places that aren't London. Maybe I'm a trusting fool.
    In the UK?!

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in the UK. Maybe I am a jaded Londoner. They also left purses behind - with cash and cards

    I wouldn’t do that anywhere in western Europe except perhaps REALLY rural spots, and Switzerland

    The only other countries I’ve seen behaviour like this in super busy places is Singapore and Japan
    I've done similar many times in East Devon. Never a problem.
    Aberdeenshire beaches. Any time I go in the sea I leave my stuff on the beach unguarded. Never a problem.
    As long as Donald doesn't fancy some new underwear
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237
    Let me sketch again what I witnessed in Rose, Montenegro

    It’s a sizeable, very pretty seaside village, with one large resort hotel, several smaller hotels, a little marina, water sports, half a dozen bustling bars and restaurants. I imagine in winter it is deeply quiet but on a summer Sunday it was rammed with tourists, with people parked all the way up the hill behind

    The beaches were crowded but I wasn’t on a beach, I was 20 metres away in a big well-known seafood restaurant which was also rammed with lunchers and drinkers, mainly Montenegrin/Croatian/Serb tourists but I heard some Germans, French etc

    The table next to me was hosting a crowd of people in their late 20s. One by one they got up to head off, mostly to go swimming (I saw them). They were gone 40 minutes at least (by that time I had to go myself, so they might have been gone for much longer), they left behind everything, quite casually: phones, bags, purses, money, sunnies, everything (as the picture shows)

    I do not believe you would do this in a big pub in a crowded holiday village anywhere in the UK, nor anywhere I know in the rest of Western Europe, with the POSSIBLE exception of Switzerland. No one leaves behind their phone in a big bustling bar for 40 minutes (minimum). It is not a thing

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited July 2022
    Convenient it only comes out after Macron re-election...

    They detail the extensive help Uber got from leaders such as Emmanuel Macron and ex-EU commissioner Neelie Kroes.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62057321
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,001
    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    They may even not get a choice
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited July 2022
    Leon said:

    Let me sketch again what I witnessed in Rose, Montenegro

    It’s a sizeable, very pretty seaside village, with one large resort hotel, several smaller hotels, a little marina, water sports, half a dozen bustling bars and restaurants. I imagine in winter it is deeply quiet but on a summer Sunday it was rammed with tourists, with people parked all the way up the hill behind

    The beaches were crowded but I wasn’t on a beach, I was 20 metres away in a big well-known seafood restaurant which was also rammed with lunchers and drinkers, mainly Montenegrin/Croatian/Serb tourists but I heard some Germans, French etc

    The table next to me was hosting a crowd of people in their late 20s. One by one they got up to head off, mostly to go swimming (I saw them). They were gone 40 minutes at least (by that time I had to go myself, so they might have been gone for much longer), they left behind everything, quite casually: phones, bags, purses, money, sunnies, everything (as the picture shows)

    I do not believe you would do this in a big pub in a crowded holiday village anywhere in the UK, nor anywhere I know in the rest of Western Europe, with the POSSIBLE exception of Switzerland. No one leaves behind their phone in a big bustling bar for 40 minutes (minimum). It is not a thing

    Perhaps they are "some bodies" and nicking their stuff might not end well....I have certainly experienced this in latin America where petty theft is often omnipresent, but people know who not to steal from because you end paying for it with your life.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    edited July 2022
    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    However a Sunday Times poll today had Sunak, Mordaunt and Tugendhat polling equal best in the redwall seats of the Tory leadership contenders in terms of net approval.

    Even though Starmer polls better than all the Tory contenders now in the redwall with Boris gone

    https://twitter.com/thom_brooks/status/1546148929229692930?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    They may even not get a choice
    That would be even worse. And fatal for the conservatives in my view. John Redwood is rarely if ever a passionate man, but speaking on radio this morning, the contempt he had for Sunak was palpable.

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,767

    Convenient it only comes out after Macron re-election...

    They detail the extensive help Uber got from leaders such as Emmanuel Macron and ex-EU commissioner Neelie Kroes.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62057321

    I think most people - in the US, the UK or France - are pretty glad that old school restrictive practice taxi laws were changed. It's dramatically lowered the cost of transportation, and increased its avalability.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Men's title for novax, women's off to Moscow lol
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,001
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    They may even not get a choice
    That would be even worse. And fatal for the conservatives in my view. John Redwood is rarely if ever a passionate man, but speaking on radio this morning, the contempt he had for Sunak was palpable.

    It is unlikely but the new leader will herald a very different cabinet and not appointed as cronies as evidenced by the dreadful Dorries and JRM
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    They may even not get a choice
    That would be even worse. And fatal for the conservatives in my view. John Redwood is rarely if ever a passionate man, but speaking on radio this morning, the contempt he had for Sunak was palpable.

    More I think about it the more pathetic Are you ready for rishi sounds, like an arch query addressed to a little darlin' in a whorehouse, and the funnier the All my mates is poshboiz clip. Twat.

    #PB4TOMT
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,232
    Leon said:

    Let me sketch again what I witnessed in Rose, Montenegro

    It’s a sizeable, very pretty seaside village, with one large resort hotel, several smaller hotels, a little marina, water sports, half a dozen bustling bars and restaurants. I imagine in winter it is deeply quiet but on a summer Sunday it was rammed with tourists, with people parked all the way up the hill behind

    The beaches were crowded but I wasn’t on a beach, I was 20 metres away in a big well-known seafood restaurant which was also rammed with lunchers and drinkers, mainly Montenegrin/Croatian/Serb tourists but I heard some Germans, French etc

    The table next to me was hosting a crowd of people in their late 20s. One by one they got up to head off, mostly to go swimming (I saw them). They were gone 40 minutes at least (by that time I had to go myself, so they might have been gone for much longer), they left behind everything, quite casually: phones, bags, purses, money, sunnies, everything (as the picture shows)

    I do not believe you would do this in a big pub in a crowded holiday village anywhere in the UK, nor anywhere I know in the rest of Western Europe, with the POSSIBLE exception of Switzerland. No one leaves behind their phone in a big bustling bar for 40 minutes (minimum). It is not a thing

    I knew a guy who had his back nicked in a London pub a few years back. He had his flat keys in it and possibly something with his address on it, so the whole changing-the-locks thing had to ensue. But who does this sort of theft? Chancers? I suspect it's more likely to be criminal gangs doing a sweep.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,001
    HYUFD said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    However a Sunday Times poll today had Sunak, Mordaunt and Tugendhat polling equal best in the redwall seats of the Tory leadership contenders in terms of net approval.

    Even though Starmer polls better than all the Tory contenders now in the redwall with Boris gone

    https://twitter.com/thom_brooks/status/1546148929229692930?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA
    Do you ever have a view independent from your choice of polls

  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,237

    Leon said:

    Let me sketch again what I witnessed in Rose, Montenegro

    It’s a sizeable, very pretty seaside village, with one large resort hotel, several smaller hotels, a little marina, water sports, half a dozen bustling bars and restaurants. I imagine in winter it is deeply quiet but on a summer Sunday it was rammed with tourists, with people parked all the way up the hill behind

    The beaches were crowded but I wasn’t on a beach, I was 20 metres away in a big well-known seafood restaurant which was also rammed with lunchers and drinkers, mainly Montenegrin/Croatian/Serb tourists but I heard some Germans, French etc

    The table next to me was hosting a crowd of people in their late 20s. One by one they got up to head off, mostly to go swimming (I saw them). They were gone 40 minutes at least (by that time I had to go myself, so they might have been gone for much longer), they left behind everything, quite casually: phones, bags, purses, money, sunnies, everything (as the picture shows)

    I do not believe you would do this in a big pub in a crowded holiday village anywhere in the UK, nor anywhere I know in the rest of Western Europe, with the POSSIBLE exception of Switzerland. No one leaves behind their phone in a big bustling bar for 40 minutes (minimum). It is not a thing

    Perhaps they are "some bodies" and nicking their stuff might not end well....

    I considered that, but they didn’t look like rich kids. More like neo-hippies and surf dudes

    I think Montenegro is simply a high trust, homogenous society. I’ve noticed people don’t lock houses or cars, either

    A quick google says there IS some crime - drugs, people trafficking - generally linked with Italy - but more minor crimes are notably rare - a few pickpockets in Kotor etc. Must be nice to feel that safe day-to-day
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,089
    Leon said:

    Let me sketch again what I witnessed in Rose, Montenegro

    It’s a sizeable, very pretty seaside village, with one large resort hotel, several smaller hotels, a little marina, water sports, half a dozen bustling bars and restaurants. I imagine in winter it is deeply quiet but on a summer Sunday it was rammed with tourists, with people parked all the way up the hill behind

    The beaches were crowded but I wasn’t on a beach, I was 20 metres away in a big well-known seafood restaurant which was also rammed with lunchers and drinkers, mainly Montenegrin/Croatian/Serb tourists but I heard some Germans, French etc

    The table next to me was hosting a crowd of people in their late 20s. One by one they got up to head off, mostly to go swimming (I saw them). They were gone 40 minutes at least (by that time I had to go myself, so they might have been gone for much longer), they left behind everything, quite casually: phones, bags, purses, money, sunnies, everything (as the picture shows)

    I do not believe you would do this in a big pub in a crowded holiday village anywhere in the UK, nor anywhere I know in the rest of Western Europe, with the POSSIBLE exception of Switzerland. No one leaves behind their phone in a big bustling bar for 40 minutes (minimum). It is not a thing

    No - I agree with that scenario completely.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,279
    "Exclusive: The anti-Rishi ‘mucky memo’ setting alight Tory WhatsApp groups

    The 424-word salvo, included below, accuses former chancellor of 'arrogance, indolence, ignorance' and is an attempt to avoid a coronation"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/07/10/exclusive-anti-rishi-mucky-memo-setting-alight-tory-whatsapp/
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    HYUFD said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    However a Sunday Times poll today had Sunak, Mordaunt and Tugendhat polling equal best in the redwall seats of the Tory leadership contenders in terms of net approval.

    Even though Starmer polls better than all the Tory contenders now in the redwall with Boris gone

    https://twitter.com/thom_brooks/status/1546148929229692930?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA
    Many elections are more about person than policy. The next one will be very different, I think. IF the tories go into the next election with a manifesto designed by Davos, they will get obliterated.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709

    HYUFD said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tom Tugendhat leaps to third place in Tory MPs endorsements behind Sunak and Mordaunt after Karen
    Bradley's backing

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1546162976104878081?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA

    I think this is starting to shape up very, very badly for the conservatives.

    The members are going to get a choice of tweedle dum or tweedle dee from the left of the party. Sunak plus one.

    However a Sunday Times poll today had Sunak, Mordaunt and Tugendhat polling equal best in the redwall seats of the Tory leadership contenders in terms of net approval.

    Even though Starmer polls better than all the Tory contenders now in the redwall with Boris gone

    https://twitter.com/thom_brooks/status/1546148929229692930?s=20&t=6s-mAMl327v6ChyfYsFZWA
    Do you ever have a view independent from your choice of polls

    Half the point of this site is polls
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