Foxy as Britain was a net payer into EU funds regional aid as you put it was simply the EU giving Britain some of the funds it had already paid them back
The Good News is that now we have left the EU we have largely stopped this kind of communism. Instead of the inefficiency of paying money to Brussels who then distribute it to the areas we left poor, we simply don't pay the money to Brussels, and don't pay it to the regions either.
Huzzah!
So much you neglect to mention such as those eu funds had to be matched like for like and were generally spent on shite no one in the regions wanted or benefitted that much from...take cornwal where I come from....we got the eden project....a lot of money went to london architects, german manufacturers...what did cornish people actually get a few min wage jobs and even more traffic chaos.
Quite right. People voted for less money. Fewer roads. A reduction in jobs.
Cornwall got no more roads what it got was more cars....I think local jobs amounted to 400 or so min wage jobs on a seasonal basis...hardly a good advert for 80 odd million funding might get our moneys worth for cornwall after a 100 years or so I guess on a 9£ an hour basis.
There were many things you could do with 80 mill that would have benefitted actual cornish people more than the eden project. Even though I think the eden project was a wonderful thing in and of itself....dont try and show it as a net benefit to cornish people was my point. I suspect most eu projects that got funding are similar
The Eden Project, it seems to me, is a classic of the idea of creating an attraction without tying it in to the local area in anyway. It's as if it was dropped from space....
The Millenium Dome in London was similar. It was a complete accident (and one bitterly fought against by Mandelson et el) that it turned into a brilliantly successful concert venue.
In yet more “the world is better that it’s even been” news, MIT have awarded their annual $100k innovation award to a small-scale water purification device, which runs at low pressures and from a solar panel. It’s smaller, cheaper, and easier to maintain than current reverse-osmosis desalination technology.
Boris Johnson absolutely has to resign for just how lame and pathetic his "parties" are.
He's not supposed to be the straightlaced guy he's supposed to be this notoriously hedonistic and flamboyant party animal that has flouted the rules. Six months of civil servant and Police investigations trawling through two years of events and all we have to show for it is singing Happy Birthday around a cake?
That's disappointing. We get more drama and entertainment from @leon in any single random evening than that.
There will be Alanis Morisette levels of irony, if the first person to resign from all this triviality is Sir Keir - not because he did anything particularly bad, but because he attacked every minor indiscretion of his opponent while failing to be whiter than white himself.
Not really Alanis-level, as it would actually be ironic...!
Boris Johnson absolutely has to resign for just how lame and pathetic his "parties" are.
He's not supposed to be the straightlaced guy he's supposed to be this notoriously hedonistic and flamboyant party animal that has flouted the rules. Six months of civil servant and Police investigations trawling through two years of events and all we have to show for it is singing Happy Birthday around a cake?
That's disappointing. We get more drama and entertainment from @leon in any single random evening than that.
This was actually mentioned at the time. Boris is, apparently, NOT a party animal. As you would expect with a 57 year old man with young kids and a fairly pressurised job
He just wants to chill out with a glass of vino. He doesn’t want to do this stuff. It’s Carrie who is the party goer. And this is not some misogynist cherchez La femme - she’s in her 30s and highly social and extrovert by all accounts. It would be odd if she hated socialising
So It makes sense Boris hasn’t been fined a billion times.
Same goes for Starmer. He’s nearly 60. I very much doubt he wants to dance the night away during lockdowns
I do not wish to speculate about the MP being investigated for alleged sexual offences.
But am I the only one a touch troubled by the order to stay away from Parliament during the investigation?
If there is a concern about interference with witnesses or evidence, that is one thing. But in the absence of that, is this really acceptable? First, it risks identifying the person or putting others under unfair suspicion. Second, why should someone who has not even been charged be prevented from doing a key part of their job? A person is innocent until proven guilty. Keeping someone away even when not charged is implying that they are somehow in the wrong and when they do come back, assuming no charge, that will hang round them.
I realise there are other considerations. But lots of people remain free while investigations carry on and we do not expect them to stop working and be shunned by society.
I do worry that we are in danger of denuding the very precious idea of "innocence until proven guilty" of any real meaning and creating a whole new set of unfairnesses. It is precisely because sexual offence allegations are so serious that we should be wary of a "judgment first, trial later" approach.
Or am I alone in worrying about this?
Would you be similarly troubled if it were, say, a teacher ?
I agree that it's not a simple issue, but the procedures in teaching for suspending on full pay, without prejudice to any criminal proceedings, are pretty well understood.
If it's a baseless accusation, then there's no real way for the accused not to be harmed by it, and there ought to be some way of recognising that and providing recompense. But allowing someone in a fiduciary position - which obviously includes MPs - to continue as though they hadn't been arrested in connection with such a charge, is simply unrealistic.
And unless the MP is publicly identified, then there is a potential safeguarding problem with (eg) vulnerable constituents.
Also, while not having legal/HR training, I understand that one of the first things to do the moment that allegations are raised (at a much lower level of seriousness) is to ensure that the parties involved don't meet each other at work.
Given that the allegations are over a period of time, is it not possible/probable that people working at the HoC are involved in the investigation?
I would gently suggest your posts are hardly conducive to a less confrontational society
That has absolutely nothing to do with my post
I would suggest it has a great deal to do with the constant theme of your posts
Big G lay off. I post left-of-centre and sometimes alternative views. You don't have to agree with them but of course they are going to 'seem' abrasive to someone of a right wing persuasion.
Is this a new even more alarming trend? That the Conservatives are getting so rattled that they now want to clamp down on free speech? On all views contrary to their increasingly Nasty Party? Certainly that would seem to be Priti Patel's wish.
I don't agree with everything you say but I do think you get unwarranted stick on here. VPNgate, for example. It has more than a whiff of misogyny in my opinion.
I salute your indefatigability!
To be fair, she also gives out unwarranted stick. I see little behaviour towards her that she does not give out herself.
About three months ago I realised that the only way for a female to exist on here, in my opinion, is to fight.
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place.
You might ask, why do I bother? Well it's because politics really interests me and I like betting on it, and offering betting tips on it.
I wish I could be a lot more gentle, which is what I'm like in real life, but I would be mowed down on here I'm afraid.
No need to reply to this please. It's a point of view. You may not agree with it but it won't change (in this instance) how I feel.
It really is not necessary to fight to survive on here. I have been here for quite some time and have not felt it necessary to get into personal fights with others. And, frankly, personal disputes are to my mind exceedingly tedious - along with most sport, FI and the culinary uses of pineapple in Italian cuisine. But it is very easy to scroll past these outpourings.
I think Eleanor Roosevelt summed it up best:
Great Minds Discuss Ideas. Average Minds Discuss Events. Small Minds Discuss People.
A quote which has always seemed both pompous and snobbish. Perhaps unfairly ?
I think it's a great quote, but perhaps because I don't think having a small mind (occasionally) is terrible. Having a good old gossip can be quite therapeutic.
JJ, who is mostly it seems to me a decent person, claimed yesterday that homophobia and racism were far reduced yesterday. He cited examples of footballers and others harassed in the past for being gay and that now the situation is much better.
Well, yesterday's leading trend on twitter in the whole world was the hashtag 'we are all idrissa' in support of 's PSGSenegalese star Idrissa Gueye who refused to wear a shirt carrying the rainbow symbol.
Homosexuality is illegal in Senegal and in Qatar, who own PSG.
Two compatriots of Gueye who play in Britain tweeted in support of him.
I am afraid I see little or nothing in this country at the moment to damp down the culture wars and hatred being, I believe, deliberately now fanned into flame by Boris Johnson's appeal to a certain kind of red wall demographic.
It's godawful.
Thanks for the compliment, but I'm not sure those comments were made - at least not yesterday, and as far as I can remember.
I would gently suggest your posts are hardly conducive to a less confrontational society
That has absolutely nothing to do with my post
I would suggest it has a great deal to do with the constant theme of your posts
Big G lay off. I post left-of-centre and sometimes alternative views. You don't have to agree with them but of course they are going to 'seem' abrasive to someone of a right wing persuasion.
Is this a new even more alarming trend? That the Conservatives are getting so rattled that they now want to clamp down on free speech? On all views contrary to their increasingly Nasty Party? Certainly that would seem to be Priti Patel's wish.
I don't agree with everything you say but I do think you get unwarranted stick on here. VPNgate, for example. It has more than a whiff of misogyny in my opinion.
I salute your indefatigability!
To be fair, she also gives out unwarranted stick. I see little behaviour towards her that she does not give out herself.
About three months ago I realised that the only way for a female to exist on here, in my opinion, is to fight.
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place.
You might ask, why do I bother? Well it's because politics really interests me and I like betting on it, and offering betting tips on it.
I wish I could be a lot more gentle, which is what I'm like in real life, but I would be mowed down on here I'm afraid.
No need to reply to this please. It's a point of view. You may not agree with it but it won't change (in this instance) how I feel.
It really is not necessary to fight to survive on here. I have been here for quite some time and have not felt it necessary to get into personal fights with others. And, frankly, personal disputes are to my mind exceedingly tedious - along with most sport, FI and the culinary uses of pineapple in Italian cuisine. But it is very easy to scroll past these outpourings.
I think Eleanor Roosevelt summed it up best:
Great Minds Discuss Ideas. Average Minds Discuss Events. Small Minds Discuss People.
A quote which has always seemed both pompous and snobbish. Perhaps unfairly ?
The first group are the entrepreneurs The second group are the business leaders The third group are the politicians and journalists.
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Julian Fellowes is a crashing snob
You can tell a lot by the names people give their offspring. Fellowes's son is Peregrine Charles Morant Kitchener-Fellowes. (Thanks, Wikipedia).
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
48% of Conservative voters have plans to celebrate the Jubilee (eg street parties, beacon lighting, attending the Buckingham Palace concert etc) but only 28% of Labour voters have plans
I suspect that is a somewhat twisted statistic. The demographic of the average conservative is weighted toward rural areas , particularly rural villages where they are more likely to have such events. There is loads going on in my village. TBH, I am quite surprised it is only 48% of Tories.
The question only relates to actually doing an event ie having a stretch party, going to a beacon lighting or concert etc. It does not include merely watching the concert and parade on TV.
There are plenty of cities and suburbs that will also offer such events but we know Tories and to a lesser extent LDs are far more monarchist than Labour supporters so the figures are no surprise
Are LDs more monarchist than Lab? Genuine question as I have no idea. I think a lot of people don't feel strongly one way or the other and are happy to have a good party. I know that is my position. In principle I guess I am a Republican but I have no great desire to get rid of the monarchy as it stands. Most royal events I ignore, but I did take part in the silver jubilee celebrations (on the winning team of a pram race pub crawl) and happy to take part in any party for any excuse.
Yes.
86% of Tory voters want to keep the monarchy as do 62% of Liberal Democrats.
However only 43% of Labour voters want to keep the royal family
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place."
is more true than is comfortable. We should probably all rein in the testosterone a bit.
It's positively decorous compared to other online communities in which I participate. (Cars, motorbikes, football)
The OM forum is particularly vibrant where sincerely intended death threats are not unknown.
It is clear that @NickPalmer has not, say, gone on Twitter and talked about trans issues for 40 seconds. Nor has he ventured onto a UK weather forum and vocally hoped for a mild spell of weather during winter
The internet is designed to create loud and bitter rancour over any issue, the same way an Ibizan disco is meant to be loud. I come on here for blissful tranquility and agreeable chat
Lol, you've been on netweather too?!
Its a bit weird how many on PB also frequent netweather, but then obsessives gonna obsess...
Weirdly, I am *genuinely* interested in weather and climate - probably because it affects my mood so much
(I am a mildie)
You are no true mildie- you said you voted coldie once. Ideological meteorological purity is all that matters.
I’m launching a new movement to call for compromise between the Coldies and the Mildies. Why can’t you all be more constructive?
I’m thinking of naming it the Wets…
Damn
I should have called it a new Front not a movement. My mind must be clouded this morning.
Don’t be surprised though by pressure from the bar-stards in the party
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
I would gently suggest your posts are hardly conducive to a less confrontational society
I try not to criticise other posters, especially your mild-mannered self, and urge the same policy on you. Almost none of us know each other personally and we could all be saints, axe murderers or rival incarnations of GPT-4 software. I think that the sharp criticisms sometimes adopted by posters as varied as Heathener and Josiah Jessop are in some ways less of a wind-up than a steady flow of little digs at the other side of an argument.
If we are all axe murderers there would be carnage.
I think I have told this story before but I asked one of our workman how stuff was progressing. I was carrying an axe at the time. He commented it was going well but added he always says that to customers carrying an axe.
I once walked around the Isle of Arran. At the end of one day, I went into a hotel and asked them if I could camp in their grounds, if I purchased a meal with them. They said I could camp on the foreshore, where some travellers were parked.
So I went up the travellers, introduced myself, had a chat, and asked if they would mind me pitching up. They said it was fine, so I put my tent up on the other side of the clearing. The ground was too hard for me to push my pegs in, so I went to ask a gypsy if I could borrow a hammer. He returned with the largest axe you could imagine, and I proceeded to use the back of it to knock my pegs in. When I returned it, he said something like: "We'll be having no trouble from you tonight, will we?"
There is an irony if Boris does only receive one FPN against all the odds, then Starmer and Rayner resign over Durham
Additional irony is that the Tory press would then have brought down an unpopular Labour leader who is just not cutting through in the seats they need to win in order to save Big Dog from only one FPN over a cake.
Never underestimate Lab's ability to screw up a leadership election but there's a chance someone more attractive to the voters will be in place by October.
And a final irony. If by some weird alignment of the planets Johnson does actually have to resign then the inventor and master of Cakeism would have been brought down by a... cake.
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Julian Fellowes is a crashing snob
You can tell a lot by the names people give their offspring. Fellowes's son is Peregrine Charles Morant Kitchener-Fellowes. (Thanks, Wikipedia).
To be fair, Perry is the Fellowes family name, while Morant is a Kitchener family name. (His reasons for double-barrelling with his wife’s maiden name, Kitchener, were roundly mocked at the time)
(((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges · 6m I wish I'd known getting a load of people together in my back garden for a BYOB, wine and food event was within the rules, just so long as you could claim it was for work purposes. I'd have had you all round, and written a couple of words on it...
Anushka Asthana @AnushkaAsthana · 22m Sources tell me Sue Gray will aim to publish her report shortly- but that could be a week or more as they will need to know from the police that they can go ahead, then she’ll finalise her report
On the face of it that’s a huge surprise . If you were a conspiracy theorist you’d think the Met decided to give him a FPN for the least serious offense which is easier for no 10 to brush away and then decided not to act on more serious offenses as that could effectively have finished his premiership .
Reflecting on the almost stabbing earlier. Was really impressed with potential stabee. When the girlfriend got between them and gave him the space to get up, he could have done some serious damage. He was eight inches taller, about six stone heavier, twice as fit and 100 times more sober. But he didn't. Just kept repeating. "It wasn't me. I didn't do that. You've got the wrong blerk mate. Go home before you regret it." Even as stabby bloke threatened him, his family and his mates. Not sure I could have been that cool in the circumstances.
Why does that impress you...to my mind kick the fucker into the middle of next week and one less idiot in the world. You know stabby guy is going to do it again and next time may well kill someone.
Fuck it: why bother with courts or justice, you just get your boot in.
The guy was trying to stab him in this case. I have no problem if he defends himself and an idiot happens to end up bleeding out. Its not like he was not guilty
That's not what you said.
If someone is attacked and defends themselves, then one should have a very wide degree of latitude. But that's not what you said.
You specifically said "kick the fucker into the middle of next week and one less idiot in the world". You argued for killing the guy, whether it was needed to defend oneself or not.
Don't try and weasel word your way out of your original statement.
Who was weaselling...guy got all stabby...guy dies absolutely no loss. No bones about that whatsoever. The courts wont punish him and he will just do it again so take him off the streets before he succeeds
What about guy's family?
What about the family of the person he finally manages to succeed in stabbing? You really think this is likely to be a one off incident?
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Rather unfair. We went to see Downton last night and very much enjoyed it. Fellowes is an excellent scriptwriter, director and actor.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
Dishy Rishi must be pissed. He gets done for having a glass of water while singing happy birthday to the boss, while everybody else spends half the time rat arsed....but now equally guilty as them.
On the face of it that’s a huge surprise . If you were a conspiracy theorist you’d think the Met decided to give him a FPN for the least serious offense which is easier for no 10 to brush away and then decided not to act on more serious offenses as that could effectively have finished his premiership .
It has surprised me to be honest and frankly Starmer and Rayner may well have made an error of judgment that could end their careers
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place."
is more true than is comfortable. We should probably all rein in the testosterone a bit.
It's positively decorous compared to other online communities in which I participate. (Cars, motorbikes, football)
The OM forum is particularly vibrant where sincerely intended death threats are not unknown.
It is clear that @NickPalmer has not, say, gone on Twitter and talked about trans issues for 40 seconds. Nor has he ventured onto a UK weather forum and vocally hoped for a mild spell of weather during winter
The internet is designed to create loud and bitter rancour over any issue, the same way an Ibizan disco is meant to be loud. I come on here for blissful tranquility and agreeable chat
Lol, you've been on netweather too?!
Its a bit weird how many on PB also frequent netweather, but then obsessives gonna obsess...
Weirdly, I am *genuinely* interested in weather and climate - probably because it affects my mood so much
(I am a mildie)
You are no true mildie- you said you voted coldie once. Ideological meteorological purity is all that matters.
I’m launching a new movement to call for compromise between the Coldies and the Mildies. Why can’t you all be more constructive?
I’m thinking of naming it the Wets…
Damn
I should have called it a new Front not a movement. My mind must be clouded this morning.
I would gently suggest your posts are hardly conducive to a less confrontational society
That has absolutely nothing to do with my post
I would suggest it has a great deal to do with the constant theme of your posts
Big G lay off. I post left-of-centre and sometimes alternative views. You don't have to agree with them but of course they are going to 'seem' abrasive to someone of a right wing persuasion.
Is this a new even more alarming trend? That the Conservatives are getting so rattled that they now want to clamp down on free speech? On all views contrary to their increasingly Nasty Party? Certainly that would seem to be Priti Patel's wish.
I don't agree with everything you say but I do think you get unwarranted stick on here. VPNgate, for example. It has more than a whiff of misogyny in my opinion.
I salute your indefatigability!
To be fair, she also gives out unwarranted stick. I see little behaviour towards her that she does not give out herself.
About three months ago I realised that the only way for a female to exist on here, in my opinion, is to fight.
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place.
You might ask, why do I bother? Well it's because politics really interests me and I like betting on it, and offering betting tips on it.
I wish I could be a lot more gentle, which is what I'm like in real life, but I would be mowed down on here I'm afraid.
No need to reply to this please. It's a point of view. You may not agree with it but it won't change (in this instance) how I feel.
It really is not necessary to fight to survive on here. I have been here for quite some time and have not felt it necessary to get into personal fights with others. And, frankly, personal disputes are to my mind exceedingly tedious - along with most sport, FI and the culinary uses of pineapple in Italian cuisine. But it is very easy to scroll past these outpourings.
I think Eleanor Roosevelt summed it up best:
Great Minds Discuss Ideas. Average Minds Discuss Events. Small Minds Discuss People.
A quote which has always seemed both pompous and snobbish. Perhaps unfairly ?
I'd agree with the quote that there's something more important about discussing ideas, rather than people, but it's the sense that people only ever discuss one or the other which jars.
And then the whole purpose of discussing ideas would be to apply those ideas to influence events, it being events that affect people.
How well can you discuss ideas if you've never discussed events and people?
We shouldn't forget that Johnson lied in Commons though.
What exactly did he say in parliament?
Given the inconsistency of the law (especially if Starmer gets away with the Durham event), might it have been reasonable for Johnson to have assumed he had not broken the law when he said it?
Foxy as Britain was a net payer into EU funds regional aid as you put it was simply the EU giving Britain some of the funds it had already paid them back
The Good News is that now we have left the EU we have largely stopped this kind of communism. Instead of the inefficiency of paying money to Brussels who then distribute it to the areas we left poor, we simply don't pay the money to Brussels, and don't pay it to the regions either.
Huzzah!
So much you neglect to mention such as those eu funds had to be matched like for like and were generally spent on shite no one in the regions wanted or benefitted that much from...take cornwal where I come from....we got the eden project....a lot of money went to london architects, german manufacturers...what did cornish people actually get a few min wage jobs and even more traffic chaos.
I'm sorry to get all technical, but there were hundreds of different types of EU "aid", and only some of them involved a requirement for matching funding from Central government. (And, of course - and this used to make me gag - you could usually get the requirement for matching removed if you were prepared to plaster your project with posters with the EU flag on.)
This is why much of the Highlands is plastered with huge "funded by the EU" signs. Was a bit annoying given the UK was a net contributor.
I don't really know why UK Gov doesn't do the same for everything else in Scotland, given the fiscal transfer. Should've done the Queensferry crossing, the A9 dualling, the A96, CalMac...
Not as big a contributor as Scotland is to the UK and gets next to F all back for it
Hmm, when a lot of the Highland roads were upgraded from single track, maybe Scotland was a net contributor?
Always thought it was a bit mad that Scotland went for independence just as the oil ran out, and the balance inverted. Wait for wind!
Foxy as Britain was a net payer into EU funds regional aid as you put it was simply the EU giving Britain some of the funds it had already paid them back
The Good News is that now we have left the EU we have largely stopped this kind of communism. Instead of the inefficiency of paying money to Brussels who then distribute it to the areas we left poor, we simply don't pay the money to Brussels, and don't pay it to the regions either.
Huzzah!
So much you neglect to mention such as those eu funds had to be matched like for like and were generally spent on shite no one in the regions wanted or benefitted that much from...take cornwal where I come from....we got the eden project....a lot of money went to london architects, german manufacturers...what did cornish people actually get a few min wage jobs and even more traffic chaos.
I'm sorry to get all technical, but there were hundreds of different types of EU "aid", and only some of them involved a requirement for matching funding from Central government. (And, of course - and this used to make me gag - you could usually get the requirement for matching removed if you were prepared to plaster your project with posters with the EU flag on.)
This is why much of the Highlands is plastered with huge "funded by the EU" signs. Was a bit annoying given the UK was a net contributor.
I don't really know why UK Gov doesn't do the same for everything else in Scotland, given the fiscal transfer. Should've done the Queensferry crossing, the A9 dualling, the A96, CalMac...
Not as big a contributor as Scotland is to the UK and gets next to F all back for it
Hmm, when a lot of the Highland roads were upgraded from single track, maybe Scotland was a net contributor?
Always thought it was a bit mad that Scotland went for independence just as the oil ran out, and the balance inverted. Wait for wind!
I drove to Gairloch yesterday for the first time this year. Most of the last five miles are single track, the rest having been improved with the assistance of EU funding. I assumed the last five miles would remain single track after Brexit, but was pleased to see that Highland Council are doubling a section of the road at the moment.
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Rather unfair. We went to see Downton last night and very much enjoyed it. Fellowes is an excellent scriptwriter, director and actor.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
I fear Roger suffers a little from inverted snobbery. Hence his fondness for Hartlepool.
I can’t see how Starmer gets a FPN now given booze and food doesn’t seem to be an issue for the Met.
If that doesn’t turn it into a social event then curry and beer certainly shouldn’t .
My money has always been on the plod fudge Starmer case and say potential minor breach, which at the time might have had an officer remind those in attendance of the laws, no further action.
Developed by this bloke. A despised humanities grad, no doubt.
So completely unbiased then given the Jean Monnet chair?
Given we have been aiming there for a few years now, there are two main possibilities:
1 Its a unicorn 2 It is perfectly achievable but the government are shit at negotiating
3 the EU is acting my in bad faith
No, they have not misled us, in fact they have consistently told us what types of deals are on the table. Not agreeing to something you said no to at the start is not acting in bad faith at all. Trying to persuade someone who repeatedly says no to suddenly say yes without offering anything else in return is unicorn chasing.
On the face of it that’s a huge surprise . If you were a conspiracy theorist you’d think the Met decided to give him a FPN for the least serious offense which is easier for no 10 to brush away and then decided not to act on more serious offenses as that could effectively have finished his premiership .
Alternatively, they wanted to give cover to Durham Police to not fine Starmer...
Dishy Rishi must be pissed. He gets done for having a glass of water while singing happy birthday to the boss, while everybody else spends half the time rat arsed....but now equally guilty as them.
Then he should have gone to court. No one had to accept a FPN.
We shouldn't forget that Johnson lied in Commons though.
What exactly did he say in parliament?
Given the inconsistency of the law (especially if Starmer gets away with the Durham event), might it have been reasonable for Johnson to have assumed he had not broken the law when he said it?
There is an enquiry into the accusations Boris lied and it will be interesting to see their conclusions
JJ, who is mostly it seems to me a decent person, claimed yesterday that homophobia and racism were far reduced yesterday. He cited examples of footballers and others harassed in the past for being gay and that now the situation is much better.
Well, yesterday's leading trend on twitter in the whole world was the hashtag 'we are all idrissa' in support of 's PSGSenegalese star Idrissa Gueye who refused to wear a shirt carrying the rainbow symbol.
Homosexuality is illegal in Senegal and in Qatar, who own PSG.
Two compatriots of Gueye who play in Britain tweeted in support of him.
I am afraid I see little or nothing in this country at the moment to damp down the culture wars and hatred being, I believe, deliberately now fanned into flame by Boris Johnson's appeal to a certain kind of red wall demographic.
It's godawful.
Thanks for the compliment, but I'm not sure those comments were made - at least not yesterday, and as far as I can remember.
Hmmm...
So a chap from Senegal isn't especially LGBTQ+
Two players who are from Senegal appear to support him in this.
This rather brings us to the issue of adaption to the host culture when in a country, or the old Political correctness idea of "separate but equal cultures" - yes, some apparent people got up on their hind legs and used that phrase. While discussing equality....
I went to university in 90s. Violent homophobia was present. Because of the source of it, the President of Gay Society actively suppressed (or tried to suppress) reporting of attacks.
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Rather unfair. We went to see Downton last night and very much enjoyed it. Fellowes is an excellent scriptwriter, director and actor.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
I fear Roger suffers a little from inverted snobbery. Hence his fondness for Hartlepool.
Yes, Roger is all for the classless society as long as it does not include oiks who voted for Boris and Leave from the likes of Hartlepool and working class Le Pen voters in his adopted nation
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Rather unfair. We went to see Downton last night and very much enjoyed it. Fellowes is an excellent scriptwriter, director and actor.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
I fear Roger suffers a little from inverted snobbery. Hence his fondness for Hartlepool.
Yes, Roger is all for the classless society as long as it does not include oiks who voted Leave from the likes of Hartlepool and working class Le Pen voters in his adopted nation
A question for all you Brits in Britain. How many of you are participating in Platinum Jubilee events? And how many of you are going to avoid them or even go abroad on holiday? I am curious to know!
I've posted something along these lines before. In my neck of the woods - post-industrial West Yorks, the flat eastern bit of the county - there is a noticeable lack of interest in these big national, often Royalty-related, events. No-one seems to give a damn. No street parties, no big events. Nothing.
I do remember ever so slightly having a party at my nursery for Charles and Di's wedding. And I'm told I was conceived after my parents had been at a Silver Jubilee bash in '77. So perhaps it wasn't always thus.
It's not that there's a burning republicanism here, and people certainly have great affection for Lizzy, I think it's just a general sense that all the Royal pageantry stuff, that traditional view of Britain, England, it represents is just so remote from people's lives and experience here.
I imagine that the tiny villages in rural, southern England, the Home Counties and the like, will pay more attention. The world that I think of as a Radio 4 land, where I imagine people play cricket and keep horses and read the Telegraph and work in the city and publishing and are architects and senior civil servants (no doubt a stereotype in itself) just feels a million miles away from how people live in Knottingley, Featherstone, Pontefract and Castleford.
I suspect it'll be more keenly observed in the western, hillier, more rural parts of W. Yorks.
I thought the 75th Anniversary of VE Day would be more celebrated in these parts but that was a damp squib too. But we were just emerging from lockdown 1 and everyone was still very jittery.
I wanted to see something on the big screen the other day so went to see Downton (something or other). My taste in cinema is eclectic and I watch a lot from around the world. But on reflection I don't think I've watched such ill judged tripe for a long time. It wasn't the storyline or even the acting-though wading through that guff must have been a challenge- it was the underlying assumptions the story made.
It was a trip through the sensibiliies of Julian Fellowes and it wasn't a nice place to be. To him it was a wonderous place where there was order and everyone knew their position in it. It was a story of class and snobbishness that far from being reviled was worshipped. It wasn't a case of being historically accurate either. The sub plot of the leading actor's gay liason with the under-butler in the film within the film was simply ridiculous.
I understand the alienation Heathener is talking about and she has a point. The sooner this class ridden nonsense is scrubbed from our consciousness the sooner the country might regain some of it's harmony and dignity. Whoever rids us of the Bullingdon Boys and the 'Fellowes' mentality that put them there the sooner the country might forget the bruising last few years and become a half decent place to be in again.
Rather unfair. We went to see Downton last night and very much enjoyed it. Fellowes is an excellent scriptwriter, director and actor.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
I fear Roger suffers a little from inverted snobbery. Hence his fondness for Hartlepool.
Yes, Roger is all for the classless society as long as it does not include oiks who voted Leave from the likes of Hartlepool and working class Le Pen voters in his adopted nation
Or people that dispute the right of people in his industry to use their influence to pressure women
So for 5 other events that Bozo was at, others have been fined and he wasn't.
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
There has to be legal reasons why the MET have issued FPNs and to whom
Definitely reasons. Whether or not they are all based on legality is another question.
Then you are challenging the Met Police and suggesting they acted inappropriately
That is allowed, you know. You don't have to delve deep to find instances where the Met Police have acted inappropriately. I'm sure @Cyclefree can furnish you with a story or two
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
I can’t see how Starmer gets a FPN now given booze and food doesn’t seem to be an issue for the Met.
If that doesn’t turn it into a social event then curry and beer certainly shouldn’t .
Let's not forget that over a hundred FPNs have been issued by the Met. To say they don't care about booze and food is ridiculous.
The concensus in the media is that Starmer has put himself into an unnecessary perilous position
There is no such consensus. Maybe in the media you read...
You are wrong Farooq. You don’t need media to tell you what you can deduce yourself. ABBA nite to celebrate Cummings going - nothing to see here, move along now. Beer whilst working in a hotel late on a Friday night, Labour loses its entire leadership mid term and is thrown into chaos! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I would gently suggest your posts are hardly conducive to a less confrontational society
That has absolutely nothing to do with my post
I would suggest it has a great deal to do with the constant theme of your posts
Big G lay off. I post left-of-centre and sometimes alternative views. You don't have to agree with them but of course they are going to 'seem' abrasive to someone of a right wing persuasion.
Is this a new even more alarming trend? That the Conservatives are getting so rattled that they now want to clamp down on free speech? On all views contrary to their increasingly Nasty Party? Certainly that would seem to be Priti Patel's wish.
I don't agree with everything you say but I do think you get unwarranted stick on here. VPNgate, for example. It has more than a whiff of misogyny in my opinion.
I salute your indefatigability!
To be fair, she also gives out unwarranted stick. I see little behaviour towards her that she does not give out herself.
About three months ago I realised that the only way for a female to exist on here, in my opinion, is to fight.
I think it's really sad but this is a mostly male and often aggressive bear pit of a place.
You might ask, why do I bother? Well it's because politics really interests me and I like betting on it, and offering betting tips on it.
I wish I could be a lot more gentle, which is what I'm like in real life, but I would be mowed down on here I'm afraid.
No need to reply to this please. It's a point of view. You may not agree with it but it won't change (in this instance) how I feel.
It really is not necessary to fight to survive on here. I have been here for quite some time and have not felt it necessary to get into personal fights with others. And, frankly, personal disputes are to my mind exceedingly tedious - along with most sport, FI and the culinary uses of pineapple in Italian cuisine. But it is very easy to scroll past these outpourings.
I think Eleanor Roosevelt summed it up best:
Great Minds Discuss Ideas. Average Minds Discuss Events. Small Minds Discuss People.
A quote which has always seemed both pompous and snobbish. Perhaps unfairly ?
she left off the last line, politicians waffle shit they have no idea about
I can’t see how Starmer gets a FPN now given booze and food doesn’t seem to be an issue for the Met.
If that doesn’t turn it into a social event then curry and beer certainly shouldn’t .
Let's not forget that over a hundred FPNs have been issued by the Met. To say they don't care about booze and food is ridiculous.
The concensus in the media is that Starmer has put himself into an unnecessary perilous position
There is no such consensus. Maybe in the media you read...
You are wrong Farooq. You don’t need media to tell you what you can deduce yourself. ABBA nite to celebrate Cummings going - nothing to see here, move along now. Beer whilst working in a hotel late on a Friday night, Labour loses its entire leadership mid term and is thrown into chaos! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Cressida Dick wasn't one of those present at No 10, ws she?
So for 5 other events that Bozo was at, others have been fined and he wasn't.
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
There has to be legal reasons why the MET have issued FPNs and to whom
Definitely reasons. Whether or not they are all based on legality is another question.
Then you are challenging the Met Police and suggesting they acted inappropriately
That is allowed, you know. You don't have to delve deep to find instances where the Met Police have acted inappropriately. I'm sure @Cyclefree can furnish you with a story or two
Or ask someone with a deep sun tan and a moderately expensive car.
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
So for 5 other events that Bozo was at, others have been fined and he wasn't.
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
There has to be legal reasons why the MET have issued FPNs and to whom
Definitely reasons. Whether or not they are all based on legality is another question.
Then you are challenging the Met Police and suggesting they acted inappropriately
That is allowed, you know. You don't have to delve deep to find instances where the Met Police have acted inappropriately. I'm sure @Cyclefree can furnish you with a story or two
Of course accusations can be made about the MET but on something as important as this I do expect them to have followed the law accurately
Developed by this bloke. A despised humanities grad, no doubt.
So completely unbiased then given the Jean Monnet chair?
Given we have been aiming there for a few years now, there are two main possibilities:
1 Its a unicorn 2 It is perfectly achievable but the government are shit at negotiating
3 the EU is acting my in bad faith
No, they have not misled us, in fact they have consistently told us what types of deals are on the table. Not agreeing to something you said no to at the start is not acting in bad faith at all. Trying to persuade someone who repeatedly says no to suddenly say yes without offering anything else in return is unicorn chasing.
The current deal envisages a joint committee implementing a risk based approach to UK-NI trade. They have not cooperated.
It also envisages a trusted trader scheme which they have refused to implement.
We shouldn't forget that Johnson lied in Commons though.
What exactly did he say in parliament?
Given the inconsistency of the law (especially if Starmer gets away with the Durham event), might it have been reasonable for Johnson to have assumed he had not broken the law when he said it?
There is an enquiry into the accusations Boris lied and it will be interesting to see their conclusions
As the police have cleared him of illegal partying there is no way he has misled parliament. Except not appreciating ambushed by a cake between meetings was actually a party, but, well…
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
Its a stretch to say that over 100 FPNs mean that booze and nibbles have been ruled ok. I am coming to believe that Johnson was not that far from the truth when he said he had thought everything complied with the rules. It seems likely that he wasn't at many of these events.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
Both were equally egregious in the eyes of most I suspect so he would be on a sticky wicket
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
I wonder how many junior staff have had two or three fines and they, or their Union rep, ar3e seriously pissed off about it. Unless someone else paid the fines.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
Nonsense. We will all be in lockdown again after the jubilee celebrations to prevent this spread of monkey pox.
So for 5 other events that Bozo was at, others have been fined and he wasn't.
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
There has to be legal reasons why the MET have issued FPNs and to whom
Definitely reasons. Whether or not they are all based on legality is another question.
Then you are challenging the Met Police and suggesting they acted inappropriately
That is allowed, you know. You don't have to delve deep to find instances where the Met Police have acted inappropriately. I'm sure @Cyclefree can furnish you with a story or two
Of course accusations can be made about the MET but on something as important as this I do expect them to have followed the law accurately
"Something as important as this"? Rape and murder are more important than "this", and, well, the Met's record is not something I would lean too heavily on if I were you.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
Both were equally egregious in the eyes of most I suspect so he would be on a sticky wicket
I wonder how many junior staff have had two or three fines and they, or their Union rep, ar3e seriously pissed off about it. Unless someone else paid the fines.
A knock on could be some embarssing revenge 'briefings'
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
Would Jaffar Cakes been allowed?
Which, as we know from the VAT legislation, are actually biscuits.
Whether you like it or not, the UK is a country in which the wealthy and well connected do operate to a different set of rules to everyone else. I am surprised anyone is surprised by this. But if the Johnsons were legally able to have a party in their flat during lockdown, then millions of the rest of us made a lot of sacrifices back then that we did not need to.
Politically, Johnson's position as Tory leader and PM is now cemented until the general election. His ownership of the Conservative party will get stronger. I am not so sure, though, that anything will change in the country. The majority that now believe he is a lying grifter will continue to think it and the cost of living crisis will dominate.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
Nonsense. We will all be in lockdown again after the jubilee celebrations to prevent this spread of monkey pox.
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
Presumably, if anything, it’s the appearance of Carrie, not cake?
Or maybe it’s just Boris’s lawyer got him to write the wrong thing on that questionnaire.
How in the world did Boris get a fine for the birthday gathering, but not for the other events. The birthday one appeared really borderline, especially compared to some of the organised "work" events.
Because the law in question is an absolute farce.
Yep.
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
If only Boris had had a birthday biryani, he'd be fine....or not fined, as the case may be.
Would Jaffar Cakes been allowed?
Which, as we know from the VAT legislation, are actually biscuits.
Layer cake confusion, madeira.
No legally they are cakes (hence their VAT exemption).
So for 5 other events that Bozo was at, others have been fined and he wasn't.
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
There has to be legal reasons why the MET have issued FPNs and to whom
Definitely reasons. Whether or not they are all based on legality is another question.
Then you are challenging the Met Police and suggesting they acted inappropriately
That is allowed, you know. You don't have to delve deep to find instances where the Met Police have acted inappropriately. I'm sure @Cyclefree can furnish you with a story or two
Of course accusations can be made about the MET but on something as important as this I do expect them to have followed the law accurately
"Something as important as this"? Rape and murder are more important than "this", and, well, the Met's record is not something I would lean too heavily on if I were you.
The Met are primarily political police to keep BigG happy, rather than Londoners safe?
Comments
The Millenium Dome in London was similar. It was a complete accident (and one bitterly fought against by Mandelson et el) that it turned into a brilliantly successful concert venue.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/k7wdwv/this-portable-solar-powered-device-purifies-seawater-on-demand
He just wants to chill out with a glass of vino. He doesn’t want to do this stuff. It’s Carrie who is the party goer. And this is not some misogynist cherchez La femme - she’s in her 30s and highly social and extrovert by all accounts. It would be odd if she hated socialising
So It makes sense Boris hasn’t been fined a billion times.
Same goes for Starmer. He’s nearly 60. I very much doubt he wants to dance the night away during lockdowns
Given that the allegations are over a period of time, is it not possible/probable that people working at the HoC are involved in the investigation?
The second group are the business leaders
The third group are the politicians and journalists.
86% of Tory voters want to keep the monarchy as do 62% of Liberal Democrats.
However only 43% of Labour voters want to keep the royal family
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/05/21/young-britons-are-turning-their-backs-monarchy
chortLOLe.
Expect betting on Boris exit will now support post GE24
Top Tip - if you think your approach has no risk, go back and jolly well find one.
So I went up the travellers, introduced myself, had a chat, and asked if they would mind me pitching up. They said it was fine, so I put my tent up on the other side of the clearing. The ground was too hard for me to push my pegs in, so I went to ask a gypsy if I could borrow a hammer. He returned with the largest axe you could imagine, and I proceeded to use the back of it to knock my pegs in. When I returned it, he said something like: "We'll be having no trouble from you tonight, will we?"
Never underestimate Lab's ability to screw up a leadership election but there's a chance someone more attractive to the voters will be in place by October.
And a final irony. If by some weird alignment of the planets Johnson does actually have to resign then the inventor and master of Cakeism would have been brought down by a... cake.
@DPJHodges
·
6m
I wish I'd known getting a load of people together in my back garden for a BYOB, wine and food event was within the rules, just so long as you could claim it was for work purposes. I'd have had you all round, and written a couple of words on it...
https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1527242581003980800
1 Its a unicorn
2 It is perfectly achievable but the government are shit at negotiating
Plays full back for QPR.
[Pause] He doesn't
The Sweeney. RIP Dennis Waterman.
On the face of it that’s a huge surprise . If you were a conspiracy theorist you’d think the Met decided to give him a FPN for the least serious offense which is easier for no 10 to brush away and then decided not to act on more serious offenses as that could effectively have finished his premiership .
One can only guess that the plod in their infinite wisdom have taken the view that the appearance of a cake transformed the event from work meeting to social event.
Whereas the appearance of shed loads of booze and nibbles did not transform the other events from work to social.
Fecking mental.
Private Eye will have a field day.
All the staff were portrayed well. The only characters who weren't were the wife of a Marquis in a legal battle with the Dowager Countess over a French villa he left her and a female new money actress from the East End who treated the staff poorly before connecting with them again as she needed to adapt to the age of the talkies and remembered her roots.
Given homosexuality was illegal at the time even the discreet manoeuvres between the butler and leading man actor were not inaccurate
One rule for them, another for the rest of us.
If that doesn’t turn it into a social event then curry and beer certainly shouldn’t .
And then the whole purpose of discussing ideas would be to apply those ideas to influence events, it being events that affect people.
How well can you discuss ideas if you've never discussed events and people?
Given the inconsistency of the law (especially if Starmer gets away with the Durham event), might it have been reasonable for Johnson to have assumed he had not broken the law when he said it?
@JohnJCrace
Turns out parties were legal after all
===
Time to return all those fines for student parties me thinks.
It's an absolute disgrace. But totally unsurprising.
So a chap from Senegal isn't especially LGBTQ+
Two players who are from Senegal appear to support him in this.
This rather brings us to the issue of adaption to the host culture when in a country, or the old Political correctness idea of "separate but equal cultures" - yes, some apparent people got up on their hind legs and used that phrase. While discussing equality....
I went to university in 90s. Violent homophobia was present. Because of the source of it, the President of Gay Society actively suppressed (or tried to suppress) reporting of attacks.
Evil bloody stuff. Grrrrr.
You know, they might even throw a party tonight.
And another one in a few weeks when Starmer and Rayner resigns.
Nobody will follow any lockdown crap again - a bonus positive
I expect the public to be thoroughly pissed off, fed up and want to move on to dealing with COL like now
I also fully expect Boris, if SKS is fined' to have the brass neck to brazenly suggest that his minor dalliance with cake is much less serious than Starmers Korma and Beer, the disgraceful large dog that he is
It also envisages a trusted trader scheme which they have refused to implement.
Might actually be worse for Johnson in long run to be seen to have got away with rules not applying to him that did apply to the rest of us.
This won't be a popular view.
Rape and murder are more important than "this", and, well, the Met's record is not something I would lean too heavily on if I were you.
Layer cake confusion, madeira.
Politically, Johnson's position as Tory leader and PM is now cemented until the general election. His ownership of the Conservative party will get stronger. I am not so sure, though, that anything will change in the country. The majority that now believe he is a lying grifter will continue to think it and the cost of living crisis will dominate.
Or maybe it’s just Boris’s lawyer got him to write the wrong thing on that questionnaire.