politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Cameron versus Corbyn – the first Ipsos MORI comparison sin
Comments
-
Sean_F said:
Mark Clarke has not proved to be popular.MP_SE said:Truly shocking stuff if any of the following turns out to be true:
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/09/24/exclusive-claims-about-ex-tory-candidate-mark-clarke-embroiled-in-suicide-bullying-allegations/
Is this sort of behaviour common among the more active elements of the Tories?Sean_F said:
Mark Clarke has not proved to be popular.MP_SE said:Truly shocking stuff if any of the following turns out to be true:
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/09/24/exclusive-claims-about-ex-tory-candidate-mark-clarke-embroiled-in-suicide-bullying-allegations/
Is this sort of behaviour common among the more active elements of the Tories?
I met him once but never had any direct dealings with him. At the time he was known for being a bit of a ladies man.Sean_F said:
Mark Clarke has not proved to be popular.MP_SE said:Truly shocking stuff if any of the following turns out to be true:
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/09/24/exclusive-claims-about-ex-tory-candidate-mark-clarke-embroiled-in-suicide-bullying-allegations/
Is this sort of behaviour common among the more active elements of the Tories?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1068756/Future-Tatler-Tory-candidate-doubt-party-expresses-grave-concerns-fit-MP.html
There were (and prob still are) several unpleasant people in CWF when I was a very young activist who I did have dealings with who I wouldn't care to ever meet again.0 -
Answer: no. They learn the bad stuff from kippers.MP_SE said:Truly shocking stuff if any of the following turns out to be true:
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/09/24/exclusive-claims-about-ex-tory-candidate-mark-clarke-embroiled-in-suicide-bullying-allegations/
Is this sort of behaviour common among the more active elements of the Tories?
0 -
Whoever would have thought the British public would react in this way to Labour making an anti-capitalist, terrorist apologist, class warrior its leader? This is a huge surprise.0
-
For balance, we look forward to their "The Assassination of Alex Salmond"..... I'm sure all SNP voters would be tuning in.Theuniondivvie said:Calling all reactionaries.
BBC R4 has just broadcast Hilary Mantel's 'The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher'. You don't even have to listen to it, the very fact that it exists and the BBC has broadcast it will give that warm, familiar feeling of outrage!0 -
The Dutch Somalis were rumoured to have had benefit fraud allegations. Many families moved to Bristol. Is it still correct that 80% are unemployed?JEO said:Migrants in Sweden facing disillusionment:
http://www.voanews.com/content/migrants-find-disappointment-frustration-in-sweden/2973768.html
Here's an interview with one Syrian migrant, who is upset because his housing is a full 30 minutes away from a supermarket:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHNh-d9INiI
Of course, when many Dutch Somalis found the Netherlands was not the land of opportunity they hoped for, they waited until they got passports and moved to London. It was a similar case for the mother of the Charlie Hebdo attackers, who moved to the UK for the "more Islamic environment".
0 -
SO, so pessimistic. Wait until the public discover that he's "authentic" - the "craft ale" of the Labour movement. Then it'll all change.SouthamObserver said:Whoever would have thought the British public would react in this way to Labour making an anti-capitalist, terrorist apologist, class warrior its leader? This is a huge surprise.
0 -
Not having much luck...or else God is sending them a missive of his disquiet.SimonStClare said:Blimey, the Hajj pilgrimage stampede death toll has reached 717 a further 863 people injured.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34346449
They’re not having much luck this year what with this and the crane that collapsed.0 -
All very well complaining but you have to ask why the traditional centre left has folded and it's not unique to this country.SouthamObserver said:Whoever would have thought the British public would react in this way to Labour making an anti-capitalist, terrorist apologist, class warrior its leader? This is a huge surprise.
0 -
Casino_Royale said:
Balti pizza. It's a multi-culti thing, innit?MarqueeMark said:
It would make GEs less predictable and magnify swing effects in terms of seats.Jonathan said:
I specifically said a dozen marginals, all in play.MarqueeMark said:
Terrible idea.Casino_Royale said:
All in play. All really having to win the vote. All representing a true slice of urban and suburban issues....Sean_F said:
I don't know if you saw that very interesting report I linked to from Lewis Baston yesterday.TheScreamingEagles said:
And with other pollsters the Tories are going up by even more.surbiton said:
It is still puzzling...why is the Labour support slowly going up ?TheScreamingEagles said:
You have to offset those criticisms Jezbollah has received with the praise he's received from Gerry Adams, Argentina and Hamas.SimonStClare said:
Perhaps the barrage of hostility and words of warnings heaped on Corbyn by a former Labour leader, several Labour MPs, Labour Grandees and Labour leaning journalists was also a contributing factor?surbiton said:
Even Foot didn't receive the barrage of hostility Corbyn has received. I am sure the Mirror and the Guardian were on Foot's side.Scott_P said:@NCPoliticsUK: Ipsos MORI/Evening Standard:
Oh...
Trust me in marginals like Warrington South the Tories will be reminding the voters that Corbyn is the Sinn Fein endorsed leader and his past comments on the IRA.
Which is a long-winded way of saying that Corbyn will go down badly in marginal.
That's the classic way town/city seats are gerrymandered into the blue column under FPTP. Draw a thin pizza slice protruding into the countryside to rope in just enough Tory voters from safe rural areas to outvote those who live in the city.
Interesting that you want to keep Labour's little inner-city fiefdoms. How well does that work out for their occupants?
Could be interesting. You've mainly got me thinking about what toppings I'd want on my Birmingham pizza though.0 -
These things come in threes - TSE had better behave himself tonight...MarqueeMark said:
Not having much luck...or else God is sending them a missive of his disquiet.SimonStClare said:Blimey, the Hajj pilgrimage stampede death toll has reached 717 a further 863 people injured.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34346449
They’re not having much luck this year what with this and the crane that collapsed.0 -
That would not be comparable, though. There was a very nearly successful attempt to murder Margaret Thatcher and many of her colleagues, and some of those whose lives have been forever blighted are still alive and suffering from it. It is tasteless beyond belief to make entertainment from it.MarqueeMark said:
For balance, we look forward to their "The Assassination of Alex Salmond"..... I'm sure all SNP voters would be tuning in.Theuniondivvie said:Calling all reactionaries.
BBC R4 has just broadcast Hilary Mantel's 'The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher'. You don't even have to listen to it, the very fact that it exists and the BBC has broadcast it will give that warm, familiar feeling of outrage!
Still, after seeing Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell take up the two most senior opposition positions, I suppose we shouldn't be surprised by anything.0 -
He's travelled all the way from Syria and is now complaining at a 30 minute trip to the supermarket. Amazing!perdix said:
The Dutch Somalis were rumoured to have had benefit fraud allegations. Many families moved to Bristol. Is it still correct that 80% are unemployed?JEO said:Migrants in Sweden facing disillusionment:
http://www.voanews.com/content/migrants-find-disappointment-frustration-in-sweden/2973768.html
Here's an interview with one Syrian migrant, who is upset because his housing is a full 30 minutes away from a supermarket:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHNh-d9INiI
Of course, when many Dutch Somalis found the Netherlands was not the land of opportunity they hoped for, they waited until they got passports and moved to London. It was a similar case for the mother of the Charlie Hebdo attackers, who moved to the UK for the "more Islamic environment".
0 -
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Reading that table is like watching a Final Destination film - you can see all the elements of catastrophe in place, ready to batter the protagonist in a grisly way, even while he remains blissfully unaware of the fate that awaits him. It induces a cringe of anticipation as what is to come is made clear. The simple facts are well beyond any margin of error – the hard left, readers will be shocked to learn, is disastrously out of step even with the wider electorate and even existing and potential Labour voters.
For the Corbynites, as for the ill-fated film characters, of course, these fears are nonsense and those who raise them are to be dismissed. No doubt YouGov, the New Statesman, Peter Kellner and the 10,000 people polled will now be added to the list of typical-Tory-bourgeois-capitalist-Murdoch-military-industrial-neocon-lizards who are deceiving everyone to try to stop the glorious revolution.0 -
Seems logical, doesn't it? Corbyn's ratings are reasonable given the media barrage - people slightly prefer him to latter-day EdM and see him as far more in touch than Cameron, and 47% for "clear vision" isn't bad after a couple of weeks in the job. Self-effacing as he is, he'll be slightly surprised that 41% think he's got lots of personality.Casino_Royale said:
It looks like left-right polarisation to me.TheScreamingEagles said:
I have this theory that Corbyn will cause a Kipper to Con boost.Scott_P said:@NCPoliticsUK: Ipsos MORI/Evening Standard:
CON 39 (+2)
LAB 34 (+3)
LIB 8 (-2)
UKIP 7 (-2)
GRN 4 (-4)
SNP 5 (=)
19th-22nd
N=1,255
https://t.co/hmMOCPJQW5
Concur with your remark that people move where they're happy - I used to live in upper High Wycombe surrounded by bankers and hunters, and fled to Holloway. When kids are being naughty here we tell them about Tory voters, but they don't really believe they exist.0 -
It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.0
-
The net leader ratings are firstly a measure of support within Labour voters. They should be solidly behind you when you are first elected.NickPalmer said:
Seems logical, doesn't it? Corbyn's ratings are reasonable given the media barrage - people slightly prefer him to latter-day EdM and see him as far more in touch than Cameron, and 47% for "clear vision" isn't bad after a couple of weeks in the job. Self-effacing as he is, he'll be slightly surprised that 41% think he's got lots of personality.Casino_Royale said:
It looks like left-right polarisation to me.TheScreamingEagles said:
I have this theory that Corbyn will cause a Kipper to Con boost.Scott_P said:@NCPoliticsUK: Ipsos MORI/Evening Standard:
CON 39 (+2)
LAB 34 (+3)
LIB 8 (-2)
UKIP 7 (-2)
GRN 4 (-4)
SNP 5 (=)
19th-22nd
N=1,255
https://t.co/hmMOCPJQW5
Concur with your remark that people move where they're happy - I used to live in upper High Wycombe surrounded by bankers and hunters, and fled to Holloway. When kids are being naughty here we tell them about Tory voters, but they don't really believe they exist.
>> Corbyn clearly can't today.
An alternative to a good score is to have some reach outside your party.
>> Corbyn clearly doesn't yet have the ability to fish in the Tory or Lib Dem pool.
The only thing surprising about these figures is that people are surprised about these figures.0 -
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html0 -
Nick, that's more spinning than my washing machine does on the Corbyn cycle. The ratings are appalling.NickPalmer said:
Corbyn's ratings are reasonable given the media barrage - people slightly prefer him to latter-day EdM and see him as far more in touch than Cameron, and 47% for "clear vision" isn't bad after a couple of weeks in the job. Self-effacing as he is, he'll be slightly surprised that 41% think he's got lots of personality.
Sub Foot.
And Cameron hasn't exactly had the best publicity in the last few days either.0 -
Ha!!!!!!!
They've actually managed to find a leader MORE unelectable than Michael Foot.0 -
Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".0
-
Alas, it does seem that VW aren't the only ones fitting "defeat devices" to their products.0
-
The_Apocalypse said:
It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
Fun With Straw Clutching.
0 -
Luvvie winter more like, at least for another decade.Casino_Royale said:Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".
0 -
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html0 -
I don't see how I'm straw clutching. Explain please.MarkHopkins said:The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
Fun With Straw Clutching.
0 -
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html0 -
That explains a lot.NickPalmer said:
Seems logical, doesn't it? Corbyn's ratings are reasonable given the media barrage - people slightly prefer him to latter-day EdM and see him as far more in touch than Cameron, and 47% for "clear vision" isn't bad after a couple of weeks in the job. Self-effacing as he is, he'll be slightly surprised that 41% think he's got lots of personality.Casino_Royale said:
It looks like left-right polarisation to me.TheScreamingEagles said:
I have this theory that Corbyn will cause a Kipper to Con boost.Scott_P said:@NCPoliticsUK: Ipsos MORI/Evening Standard:
CON 39 (+2)
LAB 34 (+3)
LIB 8 (-2)
UKIP 7 (-2)
GRN 4 (-4)
SNP 5 (=)
19th-22nd
N=1,255
https://t.co/hmMOCPJQW5
Concur with your remark that people move where they're happy - I used to live in upper High Wycombe surrounded by bankers and hunters, and fled to Holloway. When kids are being naughty here we tell them about Tory voters, but they don't really believe they exist.0 -
Foot - minus five.GIN1138 said:Ha!!!!!!!
They've actually managed to find a leader MORE unelectable than Michael Foot.
I guess that means Corbyn has no toes? This little piggy will NOT be going to market....0 -
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
0 -
I think Nick is trying to convince himself as much as anyone else.Pulpstar said:
Nick, that's more spinning than my washing machine does on the Corbyn cycle. The ratings are appalling.NickPalmer said:
Corbyn's ratings are reasonable given the media barrage - people slightly prefer him to latter-day EdM and see him as far more in touch than Cameron, and 47% for "clear vision" isn't bad after a couple of weeks in the job. Self-effacing as he is, he'll be slightly surprised that 41% think he's got lots of personality.
Sub Foot.
And Cameron hasn't exactly had the best publicity in the last few days either.
0 -
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
0 -
I love this excuse that Corbyn's dismal ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.0
-
Labour's night must be very dark. There is a lot of whistling going on....The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Won't keep the monsters away though.0 -
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
0 -
Good evening, comrades.
Worth a note of caution. Polling can, just occasionally, be wrong.
That said, it's bloody dire for the Chairman. I'm not sure the Vindictive Vegan's policy on open warfare with meat-eaters will help, though.0 -
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
-
? Tell that to someone dead set on voting Labour. I probably won't even vote Labour under Corbyn, I just simply share a different view re his impact on Labours electoral prospects if he's still there by 2020.MarqueeMark said:
Labour's night must be very dark. There is a lot of whistling going on....The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Won't keep the monsters away though.0 -
Cognitive dissonance – tis all the media’s fault and nothing to do with 30 years of baggage.Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...0 -
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html0 -
All that the press have done in relation to Jeremy Corbyn is to tell people about his views, which are very well-known in Westminster and indeed are no secret - it's not as though he tries to hide them. It's only a barrage of negative publicity in the sense that until recently most people knew nothing about him, but now they are beginning to do so. There's further to go on that, of course.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's dismal ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
The European referendum poll from the other day asked people where they got their news from. The biggest source, by far, was BBC TV News, which 60%+ citing it as a source. All the newspaper together only got about 30%. Given the BBC so obviously leans to the left, I don't think the Labour Party has any grounds to complain about the media.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
Great - Labour to ban the bacon butty. I know they it took it hard about Ed and THAT picture, but that is carrying a grudge....Casino_Royale said:
The Sun will have great fun telling White Van Man about Labour's latest wheeze. We'll get to recycle all those pork gags from about three days ago....0 -
The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
It is like stormy weather on a fishing boat for Labour, it is there and a known factor. The predominant broadcast media (the BBC) is broadly seen as more sympathetic than the print media to the left, and the centre right doesn't get a free ride from the press either (Cameron revelations). Labour seems to have Twitter onside more than the Conservatives even for the new media, and Facebook just depends on one's personal friendslist - so will reflect the country as a whole in the round.
But it'll all be a factor at the 2020 election, so Labour had better deal with it.0 -
Go for it.MarqueeMark said:
For balance, we look forward to their "The Assassination of Alex Salmond"..... I'm sure all SNP voters would be tuning in.Theuniondivvie said:Calling all reactionaries.
BBC R4 has just broadcast Hilary Mantel's 'The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher'. You don't even have to listen to it, the very fact that it exists and the BBC has broadcast it will give that warm, familiar feeling of outrage!
I'm sure you can tear yourself away from the the big Holywood blockbuster you're doubtless gestating.0 -
Or that the problem was that he back-tracked from his views and compromised his principles under pressure from the Red Tories in the Shadow Cabinet.antifrank said:
At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's dismal ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
In fact we'll probably get all three excuses simultaneously.0 -
Some time in 2023 perhaps ?antifrank said:
At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's dismal ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
Or will the realisation hit after the exit polls close in 2020 ?0 -
Lol - I guess you mean:The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/11887975/The-end-of-the-Labour-Party-might-be-closer-than-any-of-us-really-believed.html0 -
Corbyn has nothing to worry about - he will outlast VW
That will not happen until after Comrade Corbyn has been deposed and the lefties are busy expressing their undying loyalty to the new leader by rubbishing the previous one.antifrank said:At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.
0 -
On reflection, based on current polling,I can say we are.....
https://youtube.com/watch?v=ROKXlvYMKQc0 -
I think I do on this subjects. The Tory party is also prone to electing duds as leaders. Politics in general is lacking 'talent' as in people who can improve Britain as opposed to further the aims of the Tory party. They aren't always the same thing....MarqueeMark said:
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...0 -
That's not good. VW aren't going bust, any time soon.Beverley_C said:Corbyn has nothing to worry about - he will outlast VW
That will not happen until after Comrade Corbyn has been deposed and the lefties are busy expressing their undying loyalty to the new leader by rubbishing the previous one.antifrank said:At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.
0 -
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
0 -
You're quite right. I'm sure we'll hear "Corbynism wasn't tried and found wanting. It was never tried."Richard_Nabavi said:
Or that the problem was that he back-tracked from his views and compromised his principles under pressure from the Red Tories in the Shadow Cabinet.antifrank said:
At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's dismal ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
In fact we'll probably get all three excuses simultaneously.0 -
Is it bad luck? There is plenty of previous.SimonStClare said:Blimey, the Hajj pilgrimage stampede death toll has reached 717 a further 863 people injured.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34346449
They’re not having much luck this year what with this and the crane that collapsed.0 -
Apocalypse......Come on... that is pure sixth form stuff0
-
The Conservatives have Osborne, Javid, Hammond, May - they might not be everyone's cup of tea but they'll all tonk Corbyn on the PM question.The_Apocalypse said:
I think I do on this subjects. The Tory party is also prone to electing duds as leaders. Politics in general is lacking 'talent' as in people who can improve Britain as opposed to further the aims of the Tory party. They aren't always the same thing....MarqueeMark said:
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...
Only 43% of firm Labour voters thinking Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne is utterly shocking. 57% will be washing their hair in May 2020.0 -
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.0 -
You've just made that upCasino_Royale said:Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".
0 -
There must be massive logistical problems in managing a couple of million people who all want to get to one small area in a very limited timeframe.ReggieCide said:
Is it bad luck? There is plenty of previous.SimonStClare said:Blimey, the Hajj pilgrimage stampede death toll has reached 717 a further 863 people injured.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34346449
They’re not having much luck this year what with this and the crane that collapsed.0 -
I don't know why there has been such an overreaction to my mentioning of the press as a factor. I'm not a Corbynite, nor am I blaming the press, nor due I suffer from cognitive dissonance.
Not really - certain headlines deliberately depict Corbyh negatively - it's hardly a neutral expression of Corbyn's views. And that story about Corbyn giving an IRA bloke £45 seems to be on thin ground.Richard_Nabavi said:
All that the press have done in relation to Jeremy Corbyn is to tell people about his views, which are very well-known in Westminster and indeed are no secret - it's not as though he tries to hide them. It's only a barrage of negative publicity in the sense that until recently most people knew nothing about him, but now they are beginning to do so. There's further to go on that, of course.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
I overall agree although tbh I don't think Twitter really matters.Pulpstar said:The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
It is like stormy weather on a fishing boat for Labour, it is there and a known factor. The predominant broadcast media (the BBC) is broadly seen as more sympathetic than the print media to the left, and the centre right doesn't get a free ride from the press either (Cameron revelations). Labour seems to have Twitter onside more than the Conservatives even for the new media, and Facebook just depends on one's personal friendslist - so will reflect the country as a whole in the round.
But it'll all be a factor at the 2020 election, so Labour had better deal with it.0 -
Tony Blackburn?MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
0 -
Jacob Rees-Mogg. A true Man of the People.ReggieCide said:
Tony Blackburn?MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
0 -
quite?The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
That's on his role as chancellor though, not as a potential PM.RobD said:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.
0 -
Plus a decent reserve team (Jeremy Hunt etc). Of course there's Boris as well, but I think he's unlikely.Pulpstar said:The Conservatives have Osborne, Javid, Hammond, May - they might not be everyone's cup of tea but they'll all tonk Corbyn on the PM question.
There's also one name which never gets mentioned and as far as I know is not offered by any bookie, but should be. And I'm not talking about some obscure backbencher, either.0 -
Listening to the lawyer bonanza that seems to be starting up, I have my doubts.watford30 said:
That's not good. VW aren't going bust, any time soon.Beverley_C said:Corbyn has nothing to worry about - he will outlast VW
That will not happen until after Comrade Corbyn has been deposed and the lefties are busy expressing their undying loyalty to the new leader by rubbishing the previous one.antifrank said:At some point we'll get the catastrophe flip when the Corbynites stop blaming the press and decide that the problem is that Jeremy Corbyn was a wholly inadequate presenter of the right and proper views that he held.
0 -
Shame you can't say that about the poll showing less than half your supporters think Corbyn would be a good PM.The_Apocalypse said:
That's on his role as chancellor though, not as a potential PM.RobD said:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.
0 -
She's moved on from the sixth formrichardDodd said:Apocalypse......Come on... that is pure sixth form stuff
0 -
Osborne certainly isn't tonking Corbyn on the PM question atm http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2015/09/19/comres-poll-finds-corbyn-with-near-identical-ratings-as-osborne/ All the others would (well Hammond is a bit of a walk in the dark). Given how great Osborne is supposed to be and the lack of negative press he's gotten those MORI ratings are quite shocking tbh.Pulpstar said:
The Conservatives have Osborne, Javid, Hammond, May - they might not be everyone's cup of tea but they'll all tonk Corbyn on the PM question.The_Apocalypse said:
I think I do on this subjects. The Tory party is also prone to electing duds as leaders. Politics in general is lacking 'talent' as in people who can improve Britain as opposed to further the aims of the Tory party. They aren't always the same thing....MarqueeMark said:
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...
Only 43% of firm Labour voters thinking Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne is utterly shocking. 57% will be washing their hair in May 2020.0 -
We'd get them queueing or buying tickets in advanceJosiasJessop said:
There must be massive logistical problems in managing a couple of million people who all want to get to one small area in a very limited timeframe.ReggieCide said:
Is it bad luck? There is plenty of previous.SimonStClare said:Blimey, the Hajj pilgrimage stampede death toll has reached 717 a further 863 people injured.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34346449
They’re not having much luck this year what with this and the crane that collapsed.0 -
Um. No, I haven't. Pick up a copy of the Evening Standard or read this:ReggieCide said:
You've just made that upCasino_Royale said:Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".
"All the same, she calls the advent of new Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn the “English Spring”.
“It’s the English version and it’s greatly to be welcomed."
http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/vanessa-redgrave-before-i-didn-t-care-at-all-now-i-find-myself-thinking-what-a-miracle-everything-is-a2954866.html
I will accept your apology now.0 -
Actually, no I can't. Got a great producer attached to a project today.....Theuniondivvie said:
Go for it.MarqueeMark said:
For balance, we look forward to their "The Assassination of Alex Salmond"..... I'm sure all SNP voters would be tuning in.Theuniondivvie said:Calling all reactionaries.
BBC R4 has just broadcast Hilary Mantel's 'The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher'. You don't even have to listen to it, the very fact that it exists and the BBC has broadcast it will give that warm, familiar feeling of outrage!
I'm sure you can tear yourself away from the the big Holywood blockbuster you're doubtless gestating.0 -
One of them has been eating babies and murdreing disabled people faster than the Nazis for the last five years. For Corbyn to be on par with that is quite an achievement.The_Apocalypse said:
Osborne certainly isn't tonking Corbyn on the PM question atm http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2015/09/19/comres-poll-finds-corbyn-with-near-identical-ratings-as-osborne/ All the others would (well Hammond is a bit of a walk in the dark). Given how great Osborne is supposed to be and the lack of negative press he's gotten those MORI ratings are quite shocking tbh.Pulpstar said:
The Conservatives have Osborne, Javid, Hammond, May - they might not be everyone's cup of tea but they'll all tonk Corbyn on the PM question.The_Apocalypse said:
I think I do on this subjects. The Tory party is also prone to electing duds as leaders. Politics in general is lacking 'talent' as in people who can improve Britain as opposed to further the aims of the Tory party. They aren't always the same thing....MarqueeMark said:
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...
Only 43% of firm Labour voters thinking Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne is utterly shocking. 57% will be washing their hair in May 2020.0 -
George Osborne is roughly as popular as Gordon Brown.0
-
My supporters? I've said several times I'm not a Corbynite is anyone who doesn't think Tory majority nailed on considered a die hard Corbynite on here or something?RobD said:
Shame you can't say that about the poll showing less than half your supporters think Corbyn would be a good PM.The_Apocalypse said:
That's on his role as chancellor though, not as a potential PM.RobD said:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.
0 -
It really is cracking entertainment.MarqueeMark said:
Great - Labour to ban the bacon butty. I know they it took it hard about Ed and THAT picture, but that is carrying a grudge....Casino_Royale said:
The Sun will have great fun telling White Van Man about Labour's latest wheeze. We'll get to recycle all those pork gags from about three days ago....0 -
Sorry, I thought you were a Labour supporter. The poll showed that while a majority of Corbyn supporters thought he'd make a good PM, there isn't a majority of Labour voters with the same opinion.The_Apocalypse said:
My supporters? I've said several times I'm not a Corbynite is anyone who doesn't think Tory majority nailed on considered a die hard Corbynite on here or something?RobD said:
Shame you can't say that about the poll showing less than half your supporters think Corbyn would be a good PM.The_Apocalypse said:
That's on his role as chancellor though, not as a potential PM.RobD said:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.0 -
I didn't really mean it, it was my way of expressing incredulityCasino_Royale said:
Um. No, I haven't. Pick up a copy of the Evening Standard or read this:ReggieCide said:
You've just made that upCasino_Royale said:Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".
"All the same, she calls the advent of new Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn the “English Spring”.
“It’s the English version and it’s greatly to be welcomed."
http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/vanessa-redgrave-before-i-didn-t-care-at-all-now-i-find-myself-thinking-what-a-miracle-everything-is-a2954866.html
I will accept your apology now.0 -
Mr. Royale, Vanessa Redgrave's a moron.
The most obvious points are that:
1) We're a democracy
2) The Arab Spring worked almost nowhere (maybe Tunisia)
Still, if I could get more publicity when my next book comes out by saying something daft to get media coverage, I might well [though I'd prefer something witty and insightful].0 -
A lot of that is internet stuff. It's certainly not in most of the mainstream press especially The Sun etc.RobD said:
One of them has been eating babies and murdreing disabled people faster than the Nazis for the last five years. For Corbyn to be on par with that is quite an achievement.The_Apocalypse said:
Osborne certainly isn't tonking Corbyn on the PM question atm http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2015/09/19/comres-poll-finds-corbyn-with-near-identical-ratings-as-osborne/ All the others would (well Hammond is a bit of a walk in the dark). Given how great Osborne is supposed to be and the lack of negative press he's gotten those MORI ratings are quite shocking tbh.Pulpstar said:
The Conservatives have Osborne, Javid, Hammond, May - they might not be everyone's cup of tea but they'll all tonk Corbyn on the PM question.The_Apocalypse said:
I think I do on this subjects. The Tory party is also prone to electing duds as leaders. Politics in general is lacking 'talent' as in people who can improve Britain as opposed to further the aims of the Tory party. They aren't always the same thing....MarqueeMark said:
With due respect, you don't know much about the workings of the Tory party. We will pick somebody who will gt the job done.... There's plenty of talent to choose from.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree. There is no one who really rivals Osborne in terms of networking and having a base within the party, and his biggest rival and arguably someone who would definitely beat Corbyh - Boris - is looking less and less likely to win the Tory leadership as time goes on.MarqueeMark said:
Not really. If Osborne isn't streets ahead of Corbyn - then we'll elect someone else who will be.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
And I am one of the selectorate...
Only 43% of firm Labour voters thinking Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne is utterly shocking. 57% will be washing their hair in May 2020.
0 -
I know that!RobD said:
Sorry, I thought you were a Labour supporter. The poll showed that while a majority of Corbyn supporters thought he'd make a good PM, there isn't a majority of Labour voters with the same opinion.The_Apocalypse said:
My supporters? I've said several times I'm not a Corbynite is anyone who doesn't think Tory majority nailed on considered a die hard Corbynite on here or something?RobD said:
Shame you can't say that about the poll showing less than half your supporters think Corbyn would be a good PM.The_Apocalypse said:
That's on his role as chancellor though, not as a potential PM.RobD said:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/22/how-did-george-osborne-failure-become-peoples-favouriteThe_Apocalypse said:
I don't dispute that - but if it's a contest between terrible vs terrible then it makes it a contest of who is the least bad.RobD said:
Will that change the fact that less than half your own supporters don't think he'd be good. Hard to imagine Corbyn changing his ways significantly enough to shift these figures. Of course, if the great purge goes ahead, then it's anyone's guess.The_Apocalypse said:
Yes and as I said before it doesn't tell us the amount of DKs or figures for the reverse question.RobD said:
It tells us less than half of Labour voters think Corbyn would be a better PM than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:
I recall that poll, however most polls previously - including one by MORI, show them pretty much neck and neck. That question also doesn't tell us much - just percentage figures from certain groups. It doesn't tell us don't knows, Osborne's own favourbility figures, or even how many people think Osborne would be a better PM than Corbyn.RobD said:
The numbers don't look great. Even amongst Labour supporters a majority don't say Corbyn would be better than Osborne.The_Apocalypse said:It's not that surprising Corbyn has scored a negative figure. Besides being a divisive figure, he has faced a barrage load of negative publicity - so his figures were hardly going to be great. Interesting though that VI isn't that bad for Labour and hasn't been in any non ComRes poll for the most part. What matters however is not how Corbyn compares with Cameron, but with Osborne.
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2015/09/the-huge-shock-coming-down-the-track-for-the-corbynites.html
Net approval +19. Not exactly terrible for our heir-to-a-baronetcy.0 -
So I wasn't accusing you of being a Corbyn supporter.The_Apocalypse said:
I know that!RobD said:
Sorry, I thought you were a Labour supporter. The poll showed that while a majority of Corbyn supporters thought he'd make a good PM, there isn't a majority of Labour voters with the same opinion.0 -
The BBC has hardly been pro Corbyn! Leaning to the left doesn't mean supporting Corbyh - I'm a leftie and I disagree with him on most things.JEO said:
The European referendum poll from the other day asked people where they got their news from. The biggest source, by far, was BBC TV News, which 60%+ citing it as a source. All the newspaper together only got about 30%. Given the BBC so obviously leans to the left, I don't think the Labour Party has any grounds to complain about the media.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't think they are the only cause, but they certainly part of it. The other part is as I said previously Corbyn is quite a divisive figure looking at his views on everything from the monarchy to immigration. Then again I forgot that the press aren't to be factored in as an influence when they do things Tories approve of...Richard_Nabavi said:I love this excuse that Corbyn's ratings are caused by the 'barrage of negative publicity' about him, as though it were a temporary and accidental setback which (a) is nothing to do with the fact that there's a hell of a lot to be negative about, and (b) is somehow not going to apply or have any effect in the future.
0 -
@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the race). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).0 -
I meant 'I know that' in relation to what the poll says. I'm on my phone so it's difficult to highlight stuff in bold to make things more clear.RobD said:
So I wasn't accusing you of being a Corbyn supporter.The_Apocalypse said:
I know that!RobD said:
Sorry, I thought you were a Labour supporter. The poll showed that while a majority of Corbyn supporters thought he'd make a good PM, there isn't a majority of Labour voters with the same opinion.0 -
I'm of the opinion that our illustrious chancellor shouldn't go for leader, and instead let a young'un have a shot.HurstLlama said:@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the contest). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).0 -
I presume we must assume the 37% who think Corbyn 'patriotic' are either living in a parallel universe or (more likely) don't actually know who he is.0
-
Yes, but in your reply to me you seemed to suggest I thought you were a Corbyn supporter. I never said that, nor did I imply it.The_Apocalypse said:
I meant 'I know that' in relation to what the poll says. I'm on my phone so it's difficult to highlight stuff in bold to make things more clear.RobD said:
So I wasn't accusing you of being a Corbyn supporter.The_Apocalypse said:
I know that!RobD said:
Sorry, I thought you were a Labour supporter. The poll showed that while a majority of Corbyn supporters thought he'd make a good PM, there isn't a majority of Labour voters with the same opinion.
0 -
Liz Truss and Javid youngsters! In all seriousness I think Javid will only bid for the leadership if Osborbe doesn't and Truss doesn't appear to have that much of a base.HurstLlama said:@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the contest). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).0 -
Exactly the type of people who feel most disillusioned from politics.The_Apocalypse said:
Liz Truss and Javid youngstersHurstLlama said:@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the contest). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).
0 -
I agree Mr D.. If Osborne does not go for the top job then he may go down in history as a passable chancellor (which is probably more than he deserves). If he tries I think he will fail. Not least because on previous form we are due a re-recession towards the end of this parliament which will knock the shine off of any record he may have created. He also has somewhat less leadership ability than my cat and I think most of the Conservative selectorate will know that..RobD said:
I'm of the opinion that our illustrious chancellor shouldn't go for leader, and instead let a young'un have a shot.HurstLlama said:@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the contest). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).0 -
Asylum applications per 1000 population:
5.6 Sweden
3.6 Germany
0.5 UK
Despite popular belief most people do not want to come to the UK.0 -
Rich millionaire ex-bankers, that is.RobD said:
Exactly the type of people who feel most disillusioned from politics.The_Apocalypse said:
Liz Truss and Javid youngstersHurstLlama said:@Apocalypse
Why do you concentrate on Osborne as being the next Conservative leader? Have a look at the alternatives - forget Boris and May they are the past - look at some of the youngsters coming through the pack. My money remains on the contest being between Liz Truss and Sajid Javid (assuming neither of them blow up in the stables between now and the contest). Justine Greening ought to have made the start but she has been so thoroughly house trained by the DfID I very much doubt she will get a look in (much to Morris Dancer's disappointment I am sure).
0 -
Fair enough!ReggieCide said:
I didn't really mean it, it was my way of expressing incredulityCasino_Royale said:
Um. No, I haven't. Pick up a copy of the Evening Standard or read this:ReggieCide said:
You've just made that upCasino_Royale said:Interview with Vanessa Redgrave in the Evening Standard this evening. She describes the election of Corbyn as the "English Spring".
"All the same, she calls the advent of new Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn the “English Spring”.
“It’s the English version and it’s greatly to be welcomed."
http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/vanessa-redgrave-before-i-didn-t-care-at-all-now-i-find-myself-thinking-what-a-miracle-everything-is-a2954866.html
I will accept your apology now.0 -
Or what the word means.runnymede said:I presume we must assume the 37% who think Corbyn 'patriotic' are either living in a parallel universe or (more likely) don't actually know who he is.
0
