Skip to content

The Burnham surge – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 13,175
edited April 28 in General
The Burnham surge – politicalbetting.com

Yesterday we saw some signficant moves on the next Prime Minister market, with Andy Burnham usurping second place from Ed Miliband and potentally usurping first place from Angela Rayner. Whilst Andy Burnham isn’t an MP I don’t understand the immediate logic of him being in second place.

Read the full story here

«1345

Comments

  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475
    edited April 28
    First to say:

    Anyone but Burnham.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,601
    YouGov / Sky / Times voting intention

    RefUK 26%(-1),
    CON 19%(+2),
    LAB 18%(+2),
    GRN 15%(-2)
    LDEM 13%(-1),


    https://x.com/SamCoatesSky/status/2048999726536692165
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,439
    Third, like Labour if its very lucky
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,439
    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,930

    YouGov / Sky / Times voting intention

    RefUK 26%(-1),
    CON 19%(+2),
    LAB 18%(+2),
    GRN 15%(-2)
    LDEM 13%(-1),


    https://x.com/SamCoatesSky/status/2048999726536692165

    Good morning, everyone.

    The Lib Dems seem determined to be behind whoever the Main Parties are instead of becoming one.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 66,624
    He's a wally.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,601
    ydoethur said:

    Burnham would?

    He's dun sum inane stuff in the past.

    But Starmer shall never vanquished be until Burnham shall come against him...

    Ahem.

    Starmer shall never vanquished be until Great Burnham wood to high Dunsinane Hill Shall come against him.

    https://www.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2026/02/09/by-the-pricking-of-my-thumbs-something-wicked-this-way-comes-2/
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,504

    ydoethur said:

    Burnham would?

    He's dun sum inane stuff in the past.

    But Starmer shall never vanquished be until Burnham shall come against him...

    Ahem.

    Starmer shall never vanquished be until Great Burnham wood to high Dunsinane Hill Shall come against him.

    https://www.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2026/02/09/by-the-pricking-of-my-thumbs-something-wicked-this-way-comes-2/
    Does this make Peter Mandelson Lady Macbeth, and Olly Robbins Hecate?
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475

    He's a wally.

    Starmer or Burnham?

    Or both?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    I agree with TSE, while Burnham is not an MP he is ineligible to stand as Labour leader, so all the polls showing he is by far the most popular Labour candidate to replace the PM mean little. As do those Labour MPs offering their seats for Burnham as Starmer will continue to use the NEC to block Burnham from the approved Labour parliamentary candidates list before the next general election as he did before Gorton and Denton.

    It is a rather pathetic sight from Starmer, that he will put his own ego first before the good of his own party and arguably the country, to ensure the most popular candidate for the leadership can't even get back into parliament but he is protecting his own job. Compare the attitude of William Hague, who not only allowed Michael Portillo to contest the 1999 Kensington and Chelsea by election but actively supported him even though he knew Portillo would be a leadership rival as soon as he was elected. Hague even then made Portillo his Shadow Chancellor after he won the seat as he wanted his best people from the party on the green benches
  • eekeek Posts: 33,923
    IanB2 said:

    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.

    It's incredibly hard to unseat a Labour leader who doesn't want to go.

    Which wouldn't so bad if it wasn't for the fact SKS and this Government has been truly, truly dire and beyond useless.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,326

    YouGov / Sky / Times voting intention

    RefUK 26%(-1),
    CON 19%(+2),
    LAB 18%(+2),
    GRN 15%(-2)
    LDEM 13%(-1),


    https://x.com/SamCoatesSky/status/2048999726536692165

    So all that drama last week produced a small increase in the Labour vote share !

  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475
    If Starmer doesn't want Burnham to replace him, then he should announce his resignation a week on Friday.

    Just one of many reasons why he should do so.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925

    YouGov / Sky / Times voting intention

    RefUK 26%(-1),
    CON 19%(+2),
    LAB 18%(+2),
    GRN 15%(-2)
    LDEM 13%(-1),


    https://x.com/SamCoatesSky/status/2048999726536692165

    Some encouragement for Kemi and Starmer there as the Tories and Labour make gains from Reform, the Greens and LDs just over a week before the local and devolved elections. Even more so for Kemi as the Conservatives keep second place ahead of Labour and close the gap with first placed Reform by 3%
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,601
    IanB2 said:

    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.

    But even if Starmer goes in May, it's close to impossible for Burnham to become an MP to partake in the leadership contest.

    Starmer controls the NEC and they set the timetable.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 27,958
    nico67 said:

    YouGov / Sky / Times voting intention

    RefUK 26%(-1),
    CON 19%(+2),
    LAB 18%(+2),
    GRN 15%(-2)
    LDEM 13%(-1),


    https://x.com/SamCoatesSky/status/2048999726536692165

    So all that drama last week produced a small increase in the Labour vote share !

    Weather a bit better, people that tad happier - establishment parties +4 rebel alliance -3
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475
    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,601
    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,326

    IanB2 said:

    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.

    But even if Starmer goes in May, it's close to impossible for Burnham to become an MP to partake in the leadership contest.

    Starmer controls the NEC and they set the timetable.
    Burnham supporters seem unable to face this reality . There’s this deluded expectation that everyone will hang on waiting for Burnham to overcome a series of obstacles before moving against Starmer .

  • TazTaz Posts: 28,200

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    What about all the other means tested add one pensioners get though ?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,601

    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.

    I posted this last night.

    Anyhoo I will give you all a PB exclusive. A reliable source tells me Kemi is safe from a vote of no confidence if the locals/devolved elections are worse than feared, if there is one, she'll lose, but there's no appetite for one.

    What will trigger a VONC is if she tries and spins bad results as an excellent performance.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 32,342
    I do love the idea that Keith thinks he is in control of the Labour party. There are multiple open plots against you luv, and once those coalesce you are gone.

    If MPs want the King of the North then they will not be stopped by the NEC as the King will be being ousted at the same time.

    Whilst Burnham is the obvious candidate, you have to remember the obvious rule in politics which is that the assassin never wins the crown. Labour's problem is that their 3 leading contenders are mad, dodgy and ineligible. But the pressure on Keith is now so massive that a way will be found to get past all of these because the status quo is untenable.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,244

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    My voters welfare good, your voters welfare bad. Sigh.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,326
    Maybe Kemi will move to a quadruple lock !

    Every politician knows the triple lock is unaffordable. Instead of some sanity prevailing with a cross party decision to move to a double lock we just get more doubling down .
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 27,958

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Of course it is not much money to live on. Hardly any of the critics suggest it is. The issues are:

    It is non means tested so goes to not just those living on it but pensioners generally, the richest generational cohort there has ever been and one that is forecast for the first time in generations to be richer than its children and grandchildren at the same stage of life.

    The ever increasing share of GDP is simply mathematically unsustainable, at some point all tax would have to be spent on supporting the triple lock, then further down the line the whole economy would have to be spent on it, then we would have to borrow to support it. Of course the economy and/or the triple lock will break before we reach those points, but it is not sensible to bind future governments into an ever increasing share of GDP for any policy.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,930

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Well, she's wrong. The triple lock is difficult to defend morally and impossible to defend numerically.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,923
    Taz said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    What about all the other means tested add one pensioners get though ?
    If you are on the full pension - you don't qualify for anything else. To get pension credit you need to either not receive the full state pension (be born after 1951 and have less than 35 years of stamp) or be on the old basic state pension (i.e. born before 1951 or 1953 if female).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    edited April 28

    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.

    Labour are also set to lose MSPs, the SNP may also even lose some MSPs on the latest polls, the biggest gainers in Holyrood as in Wales and England since the last set of these devolved and local elections in 2021 and 2022 will be Reform that is why
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475

    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.

    I posted this last night.

    Anyhoo I will give you all a PB exclusive. A reliable source tells me Kemi is safe from a vote of no confidence if the locals/devolved elections are worse than feared, if there is one, she'll lose, but there's no appetite for one.

    What will trigger a VONC is if she tries and spins bad results as an excellent performance.
    I remember her deluded celebration last year, turning up at the only place in the country where the Tories had won something.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,880
    nico67 said:

    IanB2 said:

    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.

    But even if Starmer goes in May, it's close to impossible for Burnham to become an MP to partake in the leadership contest.

    Starmer controls the NEC and they set the timetable.
    Burnham supporters seem unable to face this reality . There’s this deluded expectation that everyone will hang on waiting for Burnham to overcome a series of obstacles before moving against Starmer .

    But also that Burnham can nab the job before AN Other from the next generation emerges.

    I've gone on about Andy = Northern Boris before. Another parallel is that it's hard to shake the impression that they were going to keep saying 'I wannabe the leader', no matter how boring or damaging that was, until they were indulged.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,244
    In Ukraine lack of cards news the oil refinery and loading terminal at Tuapse in Russia is on fire again.

    I wonder whether the King will speak in support of Ukraine when he addresses Congress later?
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,880
    nico67 said:

    Maybe Kemi will move to a quadruple lock !

    Every politician knows the triple lock is unaffordable. Instead of some sanity prevailing with a cross party decision to move to a double lock we just get more doubling down .

    Even harder to do with five parties than three. The temptation to be the one being good to pensioners when nobody else is would be immense.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,272

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    In one way she is correct but she's missed the actuarial point.

    The first pensions were set actuarially at just beyond life expectancy. So it would provide an income to those who lived beyond working age. As life expectancy increased there was little move to increase pension age to match. So as life expectancy increases you get the situation where you are on a pension for longer than your working life. Bad economics.

    So since people never vote to be poorer, stop giving them the money in the first place and move pension age. Or tax pensioners to match the contributions they should have made actuarially but didn't.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925

    nico67 said:

    IanB2 said:

    On topic, to back Burnham you have to believe that Starmer will be sticking around for a while. Which isn't as incredible as it might currently seem.

    But even if Starmer goes in May, it's close to impossible for Burnham to become an MP to partake in the leadership contest.

    Starmer controls the NEC and they set the timetable.
    Burnham supporters seem unable to face this reality . There’s this deluded expectation that everyone will hang on waiting for Burnham to overcome a series of obstacles before moving against Starmer .

    But also that Burnham can nab the job before AN Other from the next generation emerges.

    I've gone on about Andy = Northern Boris before. Another parallel is that it's hard to shake the impression that they were going to keep saying 'I wannabe the leader', no matter how boring or damaging that was, until they were indulged.
    Boris only got the job of Tory leader and PM after 9 years of the Tories in power, not just 2 years. He then won a general election majority but suggests the likes of Streeting may get the job before Burnham
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,475
    HYUFD said:

    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.

    Labour are also set to lose MSPs, the SNP may also even lose some MSPs on the latest polls, the biggest gainers in Holyrood as in Wales and England since the last set of these devolved and local elections in 2021 and 2022 will be Reform that is why
    Labour looks set to finish second in Scotland, albeit with fewer MSPs than last time.

    Considering the shellacking we'll receive elsewhere, that will be our best result.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 28,799

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    The full rate of new State Pension is £241.30 a week
    https://www.google.com/search?q=how+much+is+the+maximum+state+pension+uk

    That's quite a lot for doing nothing
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,696
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Burnham would?

    He's dun sum inane stuff in the past.

    But Starmer shall never vanquished be until Burnham shall come against him...

    Ahem.

    Starmer shall never vanquished be until Great Burnham wood to high Dunsinane Hill Shall come against him.

    https://www.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2026/02/09/by-the-pricking-of-my-thumbs-something-wicked-this-way-comes-2/
    Does this make Peter Mandelson Lady Macbeth, and Olly Robbins Hecate?
    By the pricking of my thumbs, something Mancunian this way comes.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 20,989
    FPT…
    Pro_Rata said:

    Sandpit said:

    kle4 said:

    AnneJGP said:

    Who is leaking this and why????




    Kevin Schofield
    @KevinASchofield

    Absolutely crackers


    Quote Politics UK @PolitlcsUK
    ·
    2h
    🚨 NEW: Rachel Reeves is considering banning landlords from raising rent on private homes for a year due to the Iran War

    [@guardian]

    Will interest rate rises be banned to protect home buyers as well?
    I think that question is for Trump's new Fed chair who is being tested for nomination by congress at the moment.

    Sunday Times business says he thinks only the left hand side of inflation figure counts (so 2% rather than 2.3%) and his gut is that real inflation is 2.3% not whatever this week's figure is. 2% is the figure at which is target - so time to slash interest rates. And Don Locco wants this guy nominated.

    Arrange your financial affairs as you see fit.

    Trump is desperate for that slash, he even dropped the criminal case against the outgoing Chair once it became clear he wouldn't be going anywhere so long as the case was pursued, due to a Senator holding things up.

    Still, he can probably try again once he gets his guy confirmed.
    American has fallen.

    The lights are going out.

    Will we see it again in our lifetimes?

    Indeed so.

    Here’s House minority leader Hakeem Jeffries calling for “Maximum warfare, all of the time” against his political opponents, and then doubling down yesterday after the events of the weekend.

    https://x.com/nrcc/status/2048848755466653971

    And here’s Jimmy KImmel, on late night TV last Thursday, saying “Mrs Trump, you have the glow of an expectant widow”.

    https://x.com/libbyemmons/status/2048452196417655243
    That’s some pathetic snowflake whataboutery from Trump supporters.
    As noted in the X comments, the Jeffries comment relates specifically to the redistricting battle, as made very clear by the clip. No case to answer.

    Kimmel is out of order here, though.
    It’s a poor taste joke. I feel for Melania, she’s been thrust into the public eye through no fault of her own and has to put up with a bad joke being made about her. I can only hope that the $28 million she earned from the film “Melania”, which hasn’t even grossed $17 million making the whole thing look like a massive bribe from Amazon, helps get her through this difficult time.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,377

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,696
    Politics in microcosm.

    "The experience stunned Ms. Ross-Mahé, who previously supported President Trump... “I didn’t think these things existed,” she said of the immigration facilities she was held in.

    “I thought when we arrested them, we would treat them properly. It really shocked me.”

    https://x.com/anna_bahr/status/2048865561707196446

    "We"...
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,439
    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,377
    Server fallen over? Getting 503 responses.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,504
    Nigelb said:

    Politics in microcosm.

    "The experience stunned Ms. Ross-Mahé, who previously supported President Trump... “I didn’t think these things existed,” she said of the immigration facilities she was held in.

    “I thought when we arrested them, we would treat them properly. It really shocked me.”

    https://x.com/anna_bahr/status/2048865561707196446

    "We"...

    'I have voted for the face eating leopards. Why is this leopard eating my face?'
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,377
    Apropos of nothing in America, it is ironic that MAGA fans fed on a diet of anti-Democrat conspiracy theories about pizzas and emails and laptops are now questioning whether the weekend's assassination attempt was staged, either to depose the President (JD Vance was rescued first) or to justify Trump's new White House ballroom as a safe venue.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925

    HYUFD said:

    One thing that doesn't appear to be getting commented on is the projection that the Tories are set to lose two thirds of their seats at Holyrood.

    That's a proper drubbing.

    Another one for Kemi fans to please explain.

    Labour are also set to lose MSPs, the SNP may also even lose some MSPs on the latest polls, the biggest gainers in Holyrood as in Wales and England since the last set of these devolved and local elections in 2021 and 2022 will be Reform that is why
    Labour looks set to finish second in Scotland, albeit with fewer MSPs than last time.

    Considering the shellacking we'll receive elsewhere, that will be our best result.
    Labour are neck and neck with Reform for second in Scotland. Labour will still likely be first in London which will be their best result
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,272
    edited April 28
    Nigelb said:

    Politics in microcosm.

    "The experience stunned Ms. Ross-Mahé, who previously supported President Trump... “I didn’t think these things existed,” she said of the immigration facilities she was held in.

    “I thought when we arrested them, we would treat them properly. It really shocked me.”

    https://x.com/anna_bahr/status/2048865561707196446

    "We"...

    She was in dispute with her partner's family about an inheritance. Wonder who called ICE (or NICE as Trump wants to call them.)

    She then found herself in a dispute with one of her late husband’s sons, who allegedly cut off water, electricity and internet at her home.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/14/marie-therese-billy-ice-arrest-us-france
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,569
    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
    But why should those of us who save for our own future bail out those who expect to survive on the largesse of others?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,887
    https://x.com/Steven_Swinford/status/2049018650716176865

    The YouGov MRP survey found that Nigel Farage’s party will win the largest share of the vote in 11 out of 13 of the region’s council areas when voters go to the polls next month

    The survey indicates that Reform could win control of councils including Walsall, Newcastle-under-Lyme and Solihull, which are due to elect all their councillors on May 7

    There is better news for Labour in Birmingham, with YouGov suggesting that Sir Keir Starmer’s party could hold on with the largest share of the vote.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 5,448
    Being PM is a lot more challenging than being a mayor, even of Manchester. Even if it could be wangled Mr Burnham might find himself above his level of competence.

    Good morning, everybody.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,485
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this countries in
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this country in ways that go beyond the fact that the wrong side won and implemented the result poorly.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,197
    viewcode said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    The full rate of new State Pension is £241.30 a week
    https://www.google.com/search?q=how+much+is+the+maximum+state+pension+uk

    That's quite a lot for doing nothing
    Good morning

    My 86 year old wife stayed at home raising our 3 children and has a state pension of £115 per week
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,287

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Brilliant news! This means the state pension will be £60k per year when I retire. Thanks Kemi!
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 9,628
    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The main parties can squeeze those centrist voters though to beat Reform and the Greens
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,504
    Battlebus said:

    Nigelb said:

    Politics in microcosm.

    "The experience stunned Ms. Ross-Mahé, who previously supported President Trump... “I didn’t think these things existed,” she said of the immigration facilities she was held in.

    “I thought when we arrested them, we would treat them properly. It really shocked me.”

    https://x.com/anna_bahr/status/2048865561707196446

    "We"...

    She was in dispute with her partner's family about an inheritance. Wonder who called ICE (or NICE as Trump wants to call them.)

    She then found herself in a dispute with one of her late husband’s sons, who allegedly cut off water, electricity and internet at her home.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/14/marie-therese-billy-ice-arrest-us-france
    They sound a truly charming family all around.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    edited April 28
    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
    But why should those of us who save for our own future bail out those who expect to survive on the largesse of others?
    Private workplace pension mass enrollment only came in recently and those only on state pension paid in national insurance all their working lives. We also support those on universal credit, some of whom have never worked unlike most state pensioners
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,504
    geoffw said:

    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall

    There are quite a lot of Hoares out there.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,749
    If the party really want Burnham it will be Burnham. A way will be found. Starmer doesn't have the political authority to block it again.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,147

    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this countries in
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this country in ways that go beyond the fact that the wrong side won and implemented the result poorly.
    I'd be surprised if this younger, educated, pro EU group Freedman describes is going to vote Lib Dem en masse when they saddled them with their student debt situation.
    Not that Labour can do anything meaningful about that given the state of public finances. Which leaves the unlikely promises of the Greens.


  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 20,989
    algarkirk said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    The state pension system is beyond the wheelbarrow stage and, in my experience works reasonably well in admin terms.

    What doesn't work is the current debate. Very wealthy pensioners don't need it at all, the massive middling sort - most people - need it because they have legitimately planned around it. £12,500 (£25K for couples) off an income of £1m is not much. Take it off £30-70K and it's a lot.

    For those with nothing else, except benefit top up and other exemptions, it is still close to proper poverty.

    Step one should be to tax (including NI as tax) pensioners by the same system as workers. A fundamental rule should be that working never attracts higher tax rates than not working. And this should apply to benefits junkies too.

    If someone’s only income is benefits and then you tax those benefits, then the money is just going around in a small circle. What’s the point of that?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 27,958
    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
    But why should those of us who save for our own future bail out those who expect to survive on the largesse of others?
    £10k a year isnt largesse.

    If people don't have £10k a year to live in, however they get there, deserved or undeserved, then crime will rise, you will see more people homeless in city centres and the country will be a less pleasant place to live for all.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    kinabalu said:

    If the party really want Burnham it will be Burnham. A way will be found. Starmer doesn't have the political authority to block it again.

    While he controls the NEC he does
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,504
    Vanilla having a funny five minutes at the moment but it's finally let me quote.
    kinabalu said:

    If the party really want Burnham it will be Burnham. A way will be found. Starmer doesn't have the political authority to block it again.

    The voters still do. It is very difficult to see a seat that an MP could vacate that would guarantee a Burnham win at this moment. He could find himself in the mess Patrick Gordon Walker was in in 1964, with this important difference - he has to get into Parliament *before* he can stand as party leader.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    geoffw said:

    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall

    Almost certainly the same Charles, I think the comment was he made our King Charles look rather common by comparison
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,451
    FPT x2

    FPT

    Dopermean said:

    Crikey.

    From the Chairman of the Tory Party

    Foreign donations are illegal. Politicians who funnel and hide unlawful money should face the full force of the law.

    The police must investigate Reform UK’s spokesman for Financial Affairs Robert Jenrick. The Conservative Party has also reported Mr Jenrick to the Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards, given the apparent serious breach of House of Commons rules.

    Parliament, the public and the Conservative Party all appear to have been deceived. While Robert Jenrick has been kicked out of the Conservative Party and is now Nigel Farage’s right hand man, this represents serious malpractice in a leadership contest.


    https://x.com/kevinhollinrake/status/2048752802923503792

    Based on this story.

    Police assess evidence on £40,000 donation to Robert Jenrick’s campaign

    Exclusive: Some donations to 2024 Tory leadership campaign allegedly originated from US businessman in breach of electoral rules


    Police are assessing evidence about donations to Robert Jenrick’s campaign to become Conservative leader in 2024 after a referral from the elections watchdog, the Guardian can reveal.

    The information was passed on by the Electoral Commission, which the Guardian understands has been investigating allegations that almost £40,000 of donations to Jenrick’s leadership campaign before he defected to Reform UK, were from a foreign source in breach of electoral rules.

    The Met said: “On Tuesday, 6 January we received a referral from the Electoral Commission concerning donations connected to a leadership campaign. This referral is under review and until it has been completed, we’re not in a position to comment further.”

    The Electoral Commission confirmed that it had sent evidence about a leadership campaign to the Met after conducting its own investigation, with its inquiries now paused while the police review the material. The exact scope of the review is unclear and the police have not confirmed whether it relates to any specific individual. They could decide to open an investigation or take no further action.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/apr/27/police-assess-claim-robert-jenrick-accepted-donation-from-foreign-donor

    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

    Heh.
    I think he'll be okay.

    A spokesman for Jenrick said: “The suggestion that Robert knowingly accepted impermissible donations is an untrue, politically motivated smear, put about years later by the Conservatives, despite the fact that Mr Ullman was introduced to Robert by a Tory MP, and had his donations’ permissibility checked by the party.
    Blue on blue suicide pact?
    More like shitting the bed.
    Since Badenoch became leader, there seems to have been a tightening up in the donations department. Came across a couple of instances via the work.
    Nothing to do with the reality that no one wants to donate to the Tories anymore?
    They returned (very rapidly) large donations, on a couple of occasions, that failed compliance.
    Somehow autocorrect autocorrected "kicking and screaming" to "very rapidly" in your post.

    https://www.ft.com/content/a5337386-6e29-4a6e-9d0e-8d58597fb23e
    Unlike the Lib Dem then. Still profiting from the proceeds of crime (and relying on a technicality to not return the money to the victims. Who are probably dead now having suffered penury in their old age)
    If he’d read the story, he’d know that the Berenberg donation was returned in 2 working days, by the Conservative donations compliance people. It took 2 days because of the legal notifications required. Then they notified the electoral commission.

    This was of interest, because it suggests that the Conservatives have actually hired some professionals.

    Unlike the due diligence of other parties.
    And if @StillWaters knew the law, they would know that returning it to the alleged victims was not an option for the Conservatives. The law (Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act 2000 section 56(2) to be precise) is clear that, on receiving an impermissible donation, the party must return it to the donor within 30 days. Paying the money to anyone else is classed as accepting the donation.
    Yes, you would have returned it to court appointed administrators who would have paid it out to the victims.

    How do you guys sleep at night?

    The law does not give parties that option. The money must go back to the donor, not someone else regardless of how deserving you think that someone is. And I don't know why you think "I"" would have returned it to anyone. I am not the Conservative party, nor do I speak for them. I am simply pointing out the law.
    No, you are frantically defending (goodness knows why) the LibDems immoral decision to retain a donation from a fraudster who pillaged the life saving of large numbers of pensioners

    The money would have been returned to Michael Brown’s company. (The “donor”). That company wa under the control of court appointed administrators. Their job was to liquidate the assets and to return them to the creditors.

    I think there was a bank loan (hsbc maybe) as well, so possibly not all of the money would have gone to the pensioners but in any event it would have gone to the victims of Brown’s fraud.

    Step aside from the technicalities. The LibDems benefited from a large donation from a convicted fraudster at a time when he had robbed his clients blind. How is that morally justifiable?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,887
    https://x.com/Steven_Swinford/status/2049030847035003090

    Confirmed:

    Sir Keir Starmer ***will*** impose a three-line whip on Labour MPs to oppose the motion referring him to the privileges committee for misleading the Commons, as we first reported at the weekend
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,377
    geoffw said:

    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall

    It is a shame Charles left (or was hounded off the site, depending on your point of view). Regardless of political opinions he was one of PB's great namedroppers. If anyone was in the news:-

    Charles: my great-uncle knew his second cousin twice removed.
    @MarqueeMark: my wife knows him.
    @Roger: never mind that, he directed this 1970s soft drink advert.
    @Cyclefree: look how he lied in the great widget scandal.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,569
    HYUFD said:

    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
    But why should those of us who save for our own future bail out those who expect to survive on the largesse of others?
    Private workplace pension mass enrollment only came in recently and those only on state pension paid in national insurance all their working lives. We also support those on universal credit, some of whom have never worked unlike most state pensioners
    But it doesn't follow from that that the pensions should keep rising indefinitely and at a faster rate than wages?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 66,624

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Well, it is - you probably need £30k+ coming in a year for a comfortable retirement- but that's not the point.

    The point is it's unaffordable and should be considered a basic minimum and supplemented by workplace or personal pensions.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,377

    https://x.com/Steven_Swinford/status/2049030847035003090

    Confirmed:

    Sir Keir Starmer ***will*** impose a three-line whip on Labour MPs to oppose the motion referring him to the privileges committee for misleading the Commons, as we first reported at the weekend

    Stop digging!
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,147

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    The growing generational inequality was first identified by David "2 brains" Willets well over a decade ago.
    Is he a Russian troll?
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 9,628
    HYUFD said:

    geoffw said:

    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall

    Almost certainly the same Charles, I think the comment was he made our King Charles look rather common by comparison
    Though he did admit to being on the cadet side of the family, so a slight touch of commonness after all

  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,451
    HYUFD said:

    I agree with TSE, while Burnham is not an MP he is ineligible to stand as Labour leader, so all the polls showing he is by far the most popular Labour candidate to replace the PM mean little. As do those Labour MPs offering their seats for Burnham as Starmer will continue to use the NEC to block Burnham from the approved Labour parliamentary candidates list before the next general election as he did before Gorton and Denton.

    It is a rather pathetic sight from Starmer, that he will put his own ego first before the good of his own party and arguably the country, to ensure the most popular candidate for the leadership can't even get back into parliament but he is protecting his own job. Compare the attitude of William Hague, who not only allowed Michael Portillo to contest the 1999 Kensington and Chelsea by election but actively supported him even though he knew Portillo would be a leadership rival as soon as he was elected. Hague even then made Portillo his Shadow Chancellor after he won the seat as he wanted his best people from the party on the green benches

    Aren’t the NEC elections soon?
  • Just completely embarrassing from Starmer. He’s lost all of my respect now.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,200

    https://x.com/Steven_Swinford/status/2049018650716176865

    The YouGov MRP survey found that Nigel Farage’s party will win the largest share of the vote in 11 out of 13 of the region’s council areas when voters go to the polls next month

    The survey indicates that Reform could win control of councils including Walsall, Newcastle-under-Lyme and Solihull, which are due to elect all their councillors on May 7

    There is better news for Labour in Birmingham, with YouGov suggesting that Sir Keir Starmer’s party could hold on with the largest share of the vote.

    I’d be amazed if Reform took Solihull or did well anywhere there bar The Wood
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,439

    algarkirk said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    The state pension system is beyond the wheelbarrow stage and, in my experience works reasonably well in admin terms.

    What doesn't work is the current debate. Very wealthy pensioners don't need it at all, the massive middling sort - most people - need it because they have legitimately planned around it. £12,500 (£25K for couples) off an income of £1m is not much. Take it off £30-70K and it's a lot.

    For those with nothing else, except benefit top up and other exemptions, it is still close to proper poverty.

    Step one should be to tax (including NI as tax) pensioners by the same system as workers. A fundamental rule should be that working never attracts higher tax rates than not working. And this should apply to benefits junkies too.

    If someone’s only income is benefits and then you tax those benefits, then the money is just going around in a small circle. What’s the point of that?
    Isn't the entire economy just money going round in circles?
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 4,478
    Dopermean said:

    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this countries in
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this country in ways that go beyond the fact that the wrong side won and implemented the result poorly.
    I'd be surprised if this younger, educated, pro EU group Freedman describes is going to vote Lib Dem en masse when they saddled them with their student debt situation.
    Not that Labour can do anything meaningful about that given the state of public finances. Which leaves the unlikely promises of the Greens.


    The polling evidence suggests that the events of 16 years ago have been rather blotted out by the events of 10 years ago... The rude health of Lib Dem student associations also suggests the current generation have certainly come back to the Lib Dems.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,521
    algarkirk said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    The state pension system is beyond the wheelbarrow stage and, in my experience works reasonably well in admin terms.

    What doesn't work is the current debate. Very wealthy pensioners don't need it at all, the massive middling sort - most people - need it because they have legitimately planned around it. £12,500 (£25K for couples) off an income of £1m is not much. Take it off £30-70K and it's a lot.

    For those with nothing else, except benefit top up and other exemptions, it is still close to proper poverty.

    Step one should be to tax (including NI as tax) pensioners by the same system as workers. A fundamental rule should be that working never attracts higher tax rates than not working. And this should apply to benefits junkies too.

    For those with nothing else, except benefit top up and other exemptions, it is still close to proper poverty.

    As it should be.

    People should be incentivised to work, save, invest and pay tax.

    An absence of poor pensioners would indicate that the economic balance of the country was wrong.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Well, it is - you probably need £30k+ coming in a year for a comfortable retirement- but that's not the point.

    The point is it's unaffordable and should be considered a basic minimum and supplemented by workplace or personal pensions.
    It should be means tested, many now retired were never in a workplace pension and have no private personal pension either
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,147
    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    If you only have a triple locked state pension and no private pension then Kemi is right, a triple locked state pension is still a lower annual income now than the full time minimum wage, hence the triple lock should be means tested not scrapped
    But why should those of us who save for our own future bail out those who expect to survive on the largesse of others?
    Private workplace pension mass enrollment only came in recently and those only on state pension paid in national insurance all their working lives. We also support those on universal credit, some of whom have never worked unlike most state pensioners
    But it doesn't follow from that that the pensions should keep rising indefinitely and at a faster rate than wages?
    Exactly, and NI isn't a pension pot. State pensions are paid out of current receipts, people retiring now were paying lower pensions in real terms to the previous generation of pensioners and there were more of them for each pensioner.
    If pensioners want the triple lock to continue then pensioners will have to pay more in tax.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 20,989
    IanB2 said:

    algarkirk said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    The state pension system is beyond the wheelbarrow stage and, in my experience works reasonably well in admin terms.

    What doesn't work is the current debate. Very wealthy pensioners don't need it at all, the massive middling sort - most people - need it because they have legitimately planned around it. £12,500 (£25K for couples) off an income of £1m is not much. Take it off £30-70K and it's a lot.

    For those with nothing else, except benefit top up and other exemptions, it is still close to proper poverty.

    Step one should be to tax (including NI as tax) pensioners by the same system as workers. A fundamental rule should be that working never attracts higher tax rates than not working. And this should apply to benefits junkies too.

    If someone’s only income is benefits and then you tax those benefits, then the money is just going around in a small circle. What’s the point of that?
    Isn't the entire economy just money going round in circles?
    But much bigger circles.
  • isamisam Posts: 44,230
    Couldn’t see their Granny’s what?

    It is a stunt. And it is different to liar Johnson situation. A stunt because the trick here is to watch Labour MPs clambering to block an enquiry. And different because Johnson was ignoring the rules of lockdown when others couldn’t see their granny’s.

    https://x.com/karlturnermp/status/2049024278327128505?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 81,143

    Just completely embarrassing from Starmer. He’s lost all of my respect now.

    He knows Burnham would highly likely do a better job than him, he can not bear to see that. The office of PM has turned him into Boris Johnson without the charisma.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,147
    edited April 28
    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Well, it is - you probably need £30k+ coming in a year for a comfortable retirement- but that's not the point.

    The point is it's unaffordable and should be considered a basic minimum and supplemented by workplace or personal pensions.
    It should be means tested, many now retired were never in a workplace pension and have no private personal pension either
    Traditional Conservative calls for state support for short-sighted financially profligate over-65s
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    ydoethur said:

    Vanilla having a funny five minutes at the moment but it's finally let me quote.

    kinabalu said:

    If the party really want Burnham it will be Burnham. A way will be found. Starmer doesn't have the political authority to block it again.

    The voters still do. It is very difficult to see a seat that an MP could vacate that would guarantee a Burnham win at this moment. He could find himself in the mess Patrick Gordon Walker was in in 1964, with this important difference - he has to get into Parliament *before* he can stand as party leader.
    All the polls give Burnham the highest net favourable rating of any politician in the nation, it isn't the voters who are the problem it is Starmer and the NEC who continue to block him being an approved Labour parliamentary candidate
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,244

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    I still believe pensioner-hate was seeded by Russian trolls. It worked. It's now mainstream. One chap recently suggested ditching the triple lock and making pensioners survive on NMW, which would of course double the pension.

    Anyway, I'm getting towards the age where I shall be a millionaire pensioner. Does the government send a cheque or a wheelbarrow-load of doubloons?
    I'm sure Russian trolls have been playing the extremes of both sides of the pensions debate. Encouraging and deepening division is what they do. That doesn't mean there isn't an issue with pensioners being shielded from the effects of Britain's declining wealth for nearly two decades.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    Dopermean said:

    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this countries in
    IanB2 said:

    Freedman's latest, based on polling he's collaborated on, is worth a read if you subscribe; because it's subscription content I'll summarise:

    They categorised voters by the parties they were willing to consider voting for, identifying a 'progressive' group of 35% who'd only vote for Labour/LD/Green/SNP, a 'right' group of 33% who'd only vote Tory/Reform, and a centre or 'swing' group of 28% who could contemplate voting across the spectrum.

    Their key finding is that the demographics and views of this centre group, far from being near median as you might expect, are significantly different from the other two groups. These swing voters are considerably younger, more educated, higher earning, less white, and more urban, and they have less antipathy to a whole stack of things from big business to AI to politicians than those with fixed left or right voting intentions. Only on Brexit are their views closer to the 'middle'.

    His suggests this underlines how both Labour & Tory are trapped between the edge parties, which aren't competing for centre voters and can advocate simpler, more radical ideas, and those centre voters who would be repelled by the Tories aping Reform or Labour turning socialist. He sees that Labour has only a few issues with strong appeal to both its camp and a good slice of the centre, being the NHS and closer EU ties. He suggests the Tories have the greater problem, both because Reform's hold on right-voters is currently stronger than the Greens' on the left (maybe the locals will change that?) and because there are few policies with strong appeal both to its camp and the centre; the traditional/potential one of sound economic management/low tax etc isn't available because the Tories' copybook is still seen as badly tarnished. For the LibDems, who traditionally appealed to centre voters, their support is now even more firmly 'progressive' than is Labour's.

    Adding to his thinking, one could surmise that the Brexit referendum and aftermath divided most people into two camps, with Leavers now identifying 'right' and Remainers now identifying 'progressive', and whose political self-identities are now fixed in ways that extend much wider than the European question, and who are increasingly tempted by more 'pure' policies from their camp. With relatively fewer genuine swing voters, tending to be those younger (hence less polarised by the debates of a decade back) and relatively more secure from the economic travails of our age. The LibDems, being the most pro-Remain party, are now rooted on the progressive side of the divide and no longer seen as a party in the middle.

    He concludes, all three traditional parties are finding it hard "to appeal to a centre bloc who aren’t looking for populism, aren’t so economically insecure, and aren’t seeking to blow everything up or “roll the dice”. It’s a group that seems to have been forgotten in the rush to focus on the median voter that dominates both left and right blocs."

    The Brexit referendum fucked up this country in ways that go beyond the fact that the wrong side won and implemented the result poorly.
    I'd be surprised if this younger, educated, pro EU group Freedman describes is going to vote Lib Dem en masse when they saddled them with their student debt situation.
    Not that Labour can do anything meaningful about that given the state of public finances. Which leaves the unlikely promises of the Greens.


    Unlikely given they are more pro business and fiscally conservative than the average voter and earn more according to Freedman
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,521
    eek said:

    Taz said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    What about all the other means tested add one pensioners get though ?
    If you are on the full pension - you don't qualify for anything else. To get pension credit you need to either not receive the full state pension (be born after 1951 and have less than 35 years of stamp) or be on the old basic state pension (i.e. born before 1951 or 1953 if female).
    It should be remembered that you can receive national insurance credits for pension eligibility purposes if not working.

    National Insurance (NI) credits fill gaps in your record when you are not paying contributions, protecting your State Pension entitlement. You receive them for periods of illness, unemployment, approved training, or caring duties. These credits ensure you maintain a qualifying year toward the full state pension.

    Key Reasons You Receive National Insurance Credits

    Illness or Disability: Credits are awarded if you receive Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) or Incapacity Benefit.

    Unemployment: Credits are awarded while you are registered for Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA) or looking for work.

    Caring Responsibilities: You can receive credits if you receive Carer's Allowance, or Child Benefit for a child under 12.

    Parenting/Family: Credits are awarded to parents or kinship carers of children under 12.

    Approved Training: Attending approved training courses can earn you credits.

    Jury Service: You are eligible for credits while serving on a jury.

    Armed Forces: Partners of armed forces members who accompany them on overseas postings.

    Self-Employment: If your profits are low (between £7,105 and £12,570), you may receive credits to protect your pension, according to TaxAid.


    Apart from being a university student it seems hard NOT to get the national insurance credit.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,451
    HYUFD said:

    geoffw said:

    Anyone remember @Charles (not the king)? There was a Charles Hoare commenting on BP's quarterly results on the Today programme this morning. Same bloke? Possibly not - Charles's area of expertise was health sector related as I recall

    Almost certainly the same Charles, I think the comment was he made our King Charles look rather common by comparison
    Nah I think it was Charles HALL from Peel Hunt on the radio
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,244
    Battlebus said:

    Nigelb said:

    Politics in microcosm.

    "The experience stunned Ms. Ross-Mahé, who previously supported President Trump... “I didn’t think these things existed,” she said of the immigration facilities she was held in.

    “I thought when we arrested them, we would treat them properly. It really shocked me.”

    https://x.com/anna_bahr/status/2048865561707196446

    "We"...

    She was in dispute with her partner's family about an inheritance. Wonder who called ICE (or NICE as Trump wants to call them.)

    She then found herself in a dispute with one of her late husband’s sons, who allegedly cut off water, electricity and internet at her home.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/14/marie-therese-billy-ice-arrest-us-france
    I would guess that the Stasi were used to settle a lot of personal disputes too.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 26,274
    edited April 28
    Deleted - duplicate
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    Dopermean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Kemi Badenoch: Triple lock pension is actually very little money for many to live on

    In an exclusive interview, the Conservative leader defends the triple lock as essential for pensioners - and dismisses rival Farage's commitment as 'just words'


    https://inews.co.uk/news/kemi-badenoch-triple-lock-pension-is-actually-very-little-money-for-many-to-live-on-4383783

    Well, it is - you probably need £30k+ coming in a year for a comfortable retirement- but that's not the point.

    The point is it's unaffordable and should be considered a basic minimum and supplemented by workplace or personal pensions.
    It should be means tested, many now retired were never in a workplace pension and have no private personal pension either
    Traditional Conservative calls for state support for short-sighted financially profligate over-65s
    Traditional One Nation Tory yes, if I was Alan B'Stard who wanted those only on state pension to starve I would now be in Reform. If you were on a low income and had no workplace private pension enrollment you would expect your National Insurance contributions to fund a decent state pension which they should do. Farage did float ending the triple lock but Jenrick has backtracked on that
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,749
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    If the party really want Burnham it will be Burnham. A way will be found. Starmer doesn't have the political authority to block it again.

    While he controls the NEC he does
    That's likely to change soon though.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,887
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,743
    The optics of Labour MPs voting to drag elderly military veterans back through the courts yesterday while being whipped to vote against Keir Starmer being investigated by the Parliamentary Priviledges Committee today are politically toxic! I also saw reports yesterday that Al Carns the Labour Veterans Minister would conveniently miss this important vote, if he did what a bloody dereliction of duty towards those he is supposed to serving and protecting in his Government post after everything they have been through already!

    Johnny Mercer as Veterans Minister in the last Conservative government fought tooth and nail for the plight of veterans at the risk of his own Ministeral career where as this Labour Minister remains not only invisible but missing in action when it matters!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,925
    Pulpstar said:

    Just completely embarrassing from Starmer. He’s lost all of my respect now.

    He knows Burnham would highly likely do a better job than him, he can not bear to see that. The office of PM has turned him into Boris Johnson without the charisma.
    More like Theresa May without the competence
This discussion has been closed.