The publisher of the Daily Mail has agreed to buy the Daily and Sunday Telegraph for £500m.
The Daily Mail and General Trust (DMGT) said it had entered a period of discussion with RedBird IMI, which is a joint venture between the United Arab Emirates and the US private equity firm RedBird Capital Partners.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
Another bonus: Barack Obama, so we have the last five Presidents in the list.
The well-connected always find a way of avoiding things they don’t want to do.
Barack Obama was too young to be drafted.
Yeah yeah I got that one wrong! Mea culpa.
Two of our Prime Ministers were of the right age to have served but did not. Harold Wilson was crunching important numbers in Whitehall, and Mrs Thatcher was a chemistry student. Chemists were in high demand during the war for analysing aviation fuel and explosives that the Luftwaffe carelessly scattered across the English countryside.
This was unlike the First World War when scientists and key workers rushed to the front. Even in the second war it was necessary for women to replace men in factories and farms, and for draftees to be sent down the mines because so many experienced miners were in uniform.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
Glasman: Labour will leave the ECHR in the end as judges - "a bunch of arrogant, unaccountable, useless people who protect Albanian drug dealers from getting deported" - won't take the hint from Mahmood"
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
Where will RefUK pivot if immigration is sidelined as a core issue?
It’s often cynically said that politicians actually don’t want significant issues to be fixed, because they prefer to be able to campaign against them indefinitely.
If the government does actually fix the small boats problem in the next few years, it takes the sting out of a lot of Reform rhetoric on the subject.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
Where will RefUK pivot if immigration is sidelined as a core issue?
It’s often said that politicians actually don’t want significant issues to be fixed, because they prefer to be able to campaign against them indefinitely.
If the government does actually fix the small boats problem in the next few years, it takes the sting out of a lot of Reform rhetoric on the subject.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Hardly a chasm of a difference. And since when can you judge people by house prices? - as in London, those folks in the South East own expensive properties because they've been on the local rising property ladder for a long time; not because they have massive salaries and bought their £half million house for cash.
A pretty big 12% difference and that is in the supposedly least posh of the 3 Surrey towns mentioned.
Education and wealth don't necessarily correlate, though, given that pensioners are sitting on much of the wealth with a very low graduate percentage, whereas education level increases sigificantly for the young, many of whom are in rented accommodation carrying student debt and many not in higher paid jobs.
Oh no not another trip to Washington for European leaders .
Enough with this nauseating begging .
The alternative is Ukrainian defeat. If the last voice Trump heard was a Russian one, he's anti-Ukraine, so a trip to the Oval Office Gin Palace it is.
This seems different and Trump seems determined that it’s this plan or the US walks .
The Europeans including Starmer should have been well aware this was a likely outcome, certainly since the "suit" incident in the Oval Office.
Were the Saudi Royal Family all wearing suits in the Oval Office?
Starmer has apparently said he does not intend joining the European delegation going to the White House
Of course it's budget week, but also he won't stand up to Trump and despite saying he would, he hasn't spoken to Trump about the BBC
If true it’s Shameful. Britain the weedy kid behind the bully’s skirts. If the UK sells out on this laughable peace plan, Starmer should go down in infamy. Utterly pathetic.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Hardly a chasm of a difference. And since when can you judge people by house prices? - as in London, those folks in the South East own expensive properties because they've been on the local rising property ladder for a long time; not because they have massive salaries and bought their £half million house for cash.
A pretty big 12% difference and that is in the supposedly least posh of the 3 Surrey towns mentioned.
Education and wealth don't necessarily correlate, though, given that pensioners are sitting on much of the wealth with a very low graduate percentage, whereas education level increases sigificantly for the young, many of whom are in rented accommodation carrying student debt and many not in higher paid jobs.
Well obviously they largely do, hence Surrey has more graduates than the UK average, more with higher earnings than the UK average and higher house prices than the UK average.
Yes you might get a few teachers or vicars who are educated but not wealthy or higher earners but Surrey is mainly full of educated lawyers, bankers, accountants, business executives, IT professionals, doctors and surgeons etc all with lots of degrees and qualifications, high earnings and expensive houses and fancy cars.
The young graduates in rented homes are also in Manchester, Birmingham, Cardiff, Liverpool, inner London etc not leafy Surrey
The leaked poll and the comments around it are looking in the wrong place. This has almost nothing to do with an individual leadership but to do with two key strategic positions:
What would be the USPs for having a Tory government
and
Are alternatives available to a Tory vote.
As to USPs the problem is simple: Tory voters sympathetic to Reform will vote Reform Tory voters unsympathetic to Reform will not vote for Toryreformlite, but for NOTA, LDs, Lab, PC, SNP.
So whoever is the leader they need to answer these:
Why are Tories better than Reform Where do Tories credibly stand on asylum and inward migration Explain how 14 years of Tory rule got us to where we are Outline the next 2, 5, 10 year strategy on the big questions (economy, defence, Europe, health, spending, welfare, debt, deficit) Can Tories display competence and statesmanship.
The market is for a "What works" conservatism. They need to reject the period at least from 2015 to 2024, when things obviously weren't working, or least make people forget about it.
The Tories need a Disraeli I guess.
They had one, Boris
Had being the operative word.
Boris was popular once and good for a while. He got Brexit done and steered us through Covid adroitly.
But that ship has sailed. He had to go when he did. The Tories need someone new.
Had Boris not been removed in 2022, Reform would not now be ahead in the polls and a now Sunak led Tories would likely now have a big poll lead over the Starmer Labour government. Rishi destroyed his political career and maybe his party too because he couldn't wait his turn and wasn't cunning enough politically to realise that Tory MPs rather than the voters who elected Boris PM removing Boris would be a gift to Farage
ROFLMAO
All the 'it would be fine if Boris had not been removed' beliefs seem to be founded on the idea that it was some inexplicable event which had no build up or reasoning to it.
Now, the manner in which he was replaced, with Truss then Sunak in short order, and how they then acted, means I can believe they might not have lost as badly in 2024 had he not been replaced, but the way it is presented it is as though 2019 Boris would have been the one up for re-election, not the Boris who did such a bad job that his own MPs forced him out. Mistake or not they didn't do that willy nilly. And if they had not done it, why on earth would Boris suddenly have gotten a grip when it was his personal failings as a leader which kept causing them problems?
plus its human nature, when deep in a hole, to imagine up fantastical solutions to your predicament - the return of Johnson for the Tories fulfils the same sort of wet dream as Burnham dropping into number ten does for Labour's soft left. Johnson was a disaster as PM - both for the country and his party - and would be so again, if by some miracle he did return, as would the 'bonnie' prince have been, judging from every assessment of his character, had he returned over the water to take either the Scottish or British crown.
No-one rushed to the defence of Boris when he was duffed up in the Covid report this week. Unless there is something in the Sunday papers, this week probably marked the end for any hope of returning to power.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
Another bonus: Barack Obama, so we have the last five Presidents in the list.
The well-connected always find a way of avoiding things they don’t want to do.
Barack Obama was too young to be drafted.
Yeah yeah I got that one wrong! Mea culpa.
Two of our Prime Ministers were of the right age to have served but did not. Harold Wilson was crunching important numbers in Whitehall, and Mrs Thatcher was a chemistry student. Chemists were in high demand during the war for analysing aviation fuel and explosives that the Luftwaffe carelessly scattered across the English countryside.
This was unlike the First World War when scientists and key workers rushed to the front. Even in the second war it was necessary for women to replace men in factories and farms, and for draftees to be sent down the mines because so many experienced miners were in uniform.
Unlike America, we had no draft for Vietnam.
My father-in-law killed three men in Vietnam. Backpacking wasn't for him.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Cooper stands no chance.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Yes, the mainline towns in that area have a lot of London commuters. Woking, Fleet, Farnborough, Basingstoke, even down as far as Winchester, Southampton, Andover, Salisbury for the occasional trip into Town. The railway line is a big selling point for those towns and cities.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Name one
You could argue China, which is the rising global superpower on whom Russia depends. The big fear I have for Europe is that China will see its own interest being in supporting Russian belligerence on the eastern flank of the continent. And the longer Europe fails to call China out on its support for war against Ukraine the more likely that is to happen.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Cooper stands no chance.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Most of Guildford is posh compared to the rest of the UK, hence why the LDs won it and the Tories before that usually won it and why it has never had a Labour MP and is not forecast to have a Reform MP even now
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Hardly a chasm of a difference. And since when can you judge people by house prices? - as in London, those folks in the South East own expensive properties because they've been on the local rising property ladder for a long time; not because they have massive salaries and bought their £half million house for cash.
Compare house prices in strongly LD areas with house prices in places where the LDs do indifferently. That's the difference. Also the percentage with higher qualifications between those types of seats.
LD is posh English voting for those who don't work in commerce.
A major news story that will not get the coverage it deserves:
Over 300 schoolchildren and 12 teachers have been abducted by gunmen from St. Mary’s School, a Catholic institution in north-central Nigeria’s Niger state. This updates an earlier count of 215 schoolchildren. The students are male and female, ranging in age from 10 to 18. Their kidnapping happened four days after 25 schoolchildren were seized in similar circumstances in neighboring Kebbi state. Nobody yet claimed responsibility.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
There are two pieces of evidence that counter this poll. The first is the recent moreincommon poll that showed the Tories are much less hated than either Labour or Reform. They are slowly losing their toxic brand. This will not win them new voters but will stop them losing voters. The second is the data from byelections. The Tories won 2 council seats yesterday both in the North and in strong Tory areas.
Data shows that voters switch between the right parties and the left parties but rarely between left and right. There has been a switch of about 10% of the electorate from left to right. There is no evidence they are going back. In the same way that the left may tactically vote the right can also tactically vote to get rid of Labour/ SNP / PC or potentially the Lib Dems.
Most of the recent MRP polls have the SNP taking back West Dumfries and Galloway from the Tories next May. The Stranraer by election this week must put this assumption in doubt.
In summary while many of the Tories in the South East are in trouble in areas such as Trafford they may well be on the way to taking seats back from Labour.
Fair points, except for the lazy assumption that Tory + Reform = Right. That recently released analysis of Reform's support indicates that a good slice of its support isn't "right wing" at all, and while it's true that it's been stolen from Labour, those folks aren't up for switching to the Tories and certainly aren't looking for Thatcherism redux.
Reform is socially right and the Tories economically right(ish) - the "ish" being because they talk it without really doing it.
Reform's Stateism is another reason I won't vote for them.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Name one
Saudi Arabia and Turkey are far more present threats than Russia in terms of a danger to UK citizens. Saudi Arabia for its fomenting of radical Islam in mosques, Turkey for its sponsorship of The Muslim Brotherhood - which even Saudi Arabia has banned. If you don't think they are more dangerous than Russia, do a mental exercise of attributing their activities to Russia, and think what you'd say about that.
And China is clearly the greater long term threat. Spying - both traditional and hi-tech, intimidation, Chinese police stations, the super embassy, corporate espionage, naval build-up. The only reason we see them as 'less' of a threat - in fact the only reason we see any of these countries as less of a threat, is because currently we acquiesce with most of their wishes.
I am not saying that Russia isn't a threat, or doesn't want to destabilise our country. I just think a 'Russia enquiry' would be a very easy way for politicians to grandstand whilst trousering money from everyone else. Let's investigate all foreign influence properly, including Russian, and see what's under the rock.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
Even posh places need a lot of not-posh people to function, and they have to live somewhere and deserve a decent life- don't they?
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Well you have rather proved my point. It is quicker from Woking and during rush hour the trains are every few minutes.
It is 19 minutes from Woking to London, 10 minutes quicker is certainly not enough for Woking to have a house price £200k higher than Harlow's
Unless someone had existing ties to Harlow or surrounding area, very few people would choose Harlow over Woking. Neither are at all posh, Woking is posher.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Well you have rather proved my point. It is quicker from Woking and during rush hour the trains are every few minutes.
It is 19 minutes from Woking to London, 10 minutes quicker is certainly not enough for Woking to have a house price £200k higher than Harlow's
Unless someone had existing ties to Harlow or surrounding area, very few people would choose Harlow over Woking. Neither are at all posh, Woking is posher.
If you work in London you can buy a house in Harlow on an average London salary far quicker and have a much bigger house than you could get in Woking for only slightly longer journey time to London. Harlow has never claimed to be posh or beautiful but it is affordable and has some green spaces too
I don’t think so. He’s just narrating a difficult childhood. It may be that he draws the wrong conclusion from it but he’s clear what are facts and what is opinion (eg the switch to “I don’t think there was much chat around the table”)
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Name one
Saudi Arabia and Turkey are far more present threats than Russia in terms of a danger to UK citizens. Saudi Arabia for its fomenting of radical Islam in mosques, Turkey for its sponsorship of The Muslim Brotherhood - which even Saudi Arabia has banned. If you don't think they are more dangerous than Russia, do a mental exercise of attributing their activities to Russia, and think what you'd say about that.
And China is clearly the greater long term threat. Spying - both traditional and hi-tech, intimidation, Chinese police stations, the super embassy, corporate espionage, naval build-up. The only reason we see them as 'less' of a threat - in fact the only reason we see any of these countries as less of a threat, is because currently we acquiesce with most of their wishes.
I am not saying that Russia isn't a threat, or doesn't want to destabilise our country. I just think a 'Russia enquiry' would be a very easy way for politicians to grandstand whilst trousering money from everyone else. Let's investigate all foreign influence properly, including Russian, and see what's under the rock.
Two problems.
1) No mention of Iran 2) No suggestion that Russia and China are linked
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
Even posh places need a lot of not-posh people to function, and they have to live somewhere and deserve a decent life- don't they?
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
Does anyone actually deny that? Not sure.
In terms of place to live there is a broad consensus that we should build more homes "somewhere", the issue is there is an even broader consensus that "somewhere"="somewhere but not here".
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
Even posh places need a lot of not-posh people to function, and they have to live somewhere and deserve a decent life- don't they?
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
Buckingham Palace even has a few butlers and chefs and security staff so is not a fully posh Palace really?
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Even Sheerwater has an average house price of £454,655, still higher than the £424,515 average for the whole of the county here in Essex
Well that is nonsense because the price is determined by it being close to Woking station which has a fast train to London. I could buy a castle in Scotland.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Well you have rather proved my point. It is quicker from Woking and during rush hour the trains are every few minutes.
It is 19 minutes from Woking to London, 10 minutes quicker is certainly not enough for Woking to have a house price £200k higher than Harlow's
Unless someone had existing ties to Harlow or surrounding area, very few people would choose Harlow over Woking. Neither are at all posh, Woking is posher.
If you work in London you can buy a house in Harlow on an average London salary far quicker and have a much bigger house than you could get in Woking for only slightly longer journey time to London. Harlow has never claimed to be posh or beautiful but it is affordable and has some green spaces too
Apologies meant to add in "ignoring affordability".
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Where is NPXMP when you need him?
I've got a (distant..... child of a cousin) relative in Guildford. She sounds posh!
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
I am in favour of a very specific investigation into the grooming gangs, because whilst all of our policing seems a bit crap, the collusion and cover up on the part of the state was a phenomenon peculiar to grooming gangs. It would be absurd to suggest that the issue of foreign influence over our politics was limited to Russia. In fact, as Russia has become more and more of a pariah state, its ability to wield influence has undoubtedly weakened. It is the influence of those we treat as allies (even if that is just a fond wish on our part) that really changes policy and weakens security.
A major news story that will not get the coverage it deserves:
Over 300 schoolchildren and 12 teachers have been abducted by gunmen from St. Mary’s School, a Catholic institution in north-central Nigeria’s Niger state. This updates an earlier count of 215 schoolchildren. The students are male and female, ranging in age from 10 to 18. Their kidnapping happened four days after 25 schoolchildren were seized in similar circumstances in neighboring Kebbi state. Nobody yet claimed responsibility.
This was a couple of days ago iirc. One problem is that kidnap as terrorism or civil war has now been joined by mass kidnap for ransom. As well as being a tragedy in its own right, it shows the limited attention span of America if everything needs to flow through President Trump who just a few days ago was threatening armed intervention.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Most of Guildford is posh compared to the rest of the UK, hence why the LDs won it and the Tories before that usually won it and why it has never had a Labour MP and is not forecast to have a Reform MP even now
Honestly people really have a deluded view of places in Surrey. Just because Surrey has a higher percentage of rich people does not mean most people are posh. Most of Guildford is not posh. If you are not on the High St or in a village outside of the town it is indistinguishable from any other town. Big ex council estates, big new estates, Victorian terraces near the centre. Some poor estates, some modern estates with a mix of semis and small detached houses, industrial estates, All the normal stuff.
We are not all driving land rovers, with springer spaniels and a 12 bore.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
I knew a few people who 'dodged' National Serviced by signing up for three years. The rate of pay for even a short-term regular was far better than for National Servicemen
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
I am in favour of a very specific investigation into the grooming gangs, because whilst all of our policing seems a bit crap, the collusion and cover up on the part of the state was a phenomenon peculiar to grooming gangs. It would be absurd to suggest that the issue of foreign influence over our politics was limited to Russia. In fact, as Russia has become more and more of a pariah state, its ability to wield influence has undoubtedly weakened. It is the influence of those we treat as allies (even if that is just a fond wish on our part) that really changes policy and weakens security.
A similar policy of ignoring large scale, obvious crime extends to the building industry - I can walk down the road, see sites operating illegally.
Obvious from the street.
Simple to raid them, with inspectors on hand to find all the other shit that’s gong on - cash in hand for a start, stolen materials next…. Arresting the ring leaders, detain the illegal workers, seize the cash - kills the project.
Word would rapidly go out - a few BBC documentaries? - that employing illegal builders gets you a half done house and lost money.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
Even posh places need a lot of not-posh people to function, and they have to live somewhere and deserve a decent life- don't they?
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
Buckingham Palace even has a few butlers and chefs and security staff so is not a fully posh Palace really?
Well that's interesting because I know one of the royals bodyguards and you have just said they are not posh, yet guess where he lives. Yes that is right Surrey. He even lives in one of the poher parts (in a flat).
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Name one
Saudi Arabia and Turkey are far more present threats than Russia in terms of a danger to UK citizens. Saudi Arabia for its fomenting of radical Islam in mosques, Turkey for its sponsorship of The Muslim Brotherhood - which even Saudi Arabia has banned. If you don't think they are more dangerous than Russia, do a mental exercise of attributing their activities to Russia, and think what you'd say about that.
And China is clearly the greater long term threat. Spying - both traditional and hi-tech, intimidation, Chinese police stations, the super embassy, corporate espionage, naval build-up. The only reason we see them as 'less' of a threat - in fact the only reason we see any of these countries as less of a threat, is because currently we acquiesce with most of their wishes.
I am not saying that Russia isn't a threat, or doesn't want to destabilise our country. I just think a 'Russia enquiry' would be a very easy way for politicians to grandstand whilst trousering money from everyone else. Let's investigate all foreign influence properly, including Russian, and see what's under the rock.
Two problems.
1) No mention of Iran 2) No suggestion that Russia and China are linked
Those are not 'problems' thank you.
Of course Russia and China are linked. That supports my argument, not the opposing argument. China taking the opposing side on a proxy war with the West is another reason why it is silly to exclude it from any investigation - it's investigating the henchman not the mastermind.
Iran is undoubtedly a security threat, and a horrible regime. However I do see it as less of a present threat on the streets of the UK, because its Shia form of Islam is practised by a small minority of UK muslims, and is traditionally despised by Sunni muslims. I believe most islamic terrorism in the UK is wahhabist, salafist - whatever you want to call it - an extreme form of Sunni Islam.
Ai:
The number of Shia Muslims in the UK is estimated to be around 5% of the total Muslim population, which corresponds to approximately 200,000 individuals.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
Indeed. Possibly surprising to some, but Bob Dylan signed up for the draft and remained eligible throughout the Vietnam War. He was never called up.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
I knew a few people who 'dodged' National Serviced by signing up for three years. The rate of pay for even a short-term regular was far better than for National Servicemen
You could also more easily choose your arm of service, and (with some luck) your regiment/corps/speciality. The RN took very few NS, relatively speaking, for instance, so if you wanted life on the briny ... And if you wanted to fly, you had a much better chance that way in the Raff than as a a conscript. A friend of mine, a keen glider pilot, did NS - he spent 2 years as a storesman on one of those East Anglian bases where the snow from the east used to pile in drifts on the boots of the a/cmen paraded in the morning.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
I knew a few people who 'dodged' National Serviced by signing up for three years. The rate of pay for even a short-term regular was far better than for National Servicemen
You could also more easily choose your arm of service, and (with some luck) your regiment/corps/speciality. The RN took very few NS, relatively speaking, for instance, so if you wanted life on the briny ... And if you wanted to fly, you had a much better chance that way in the Raff than as a a conscript. A friend of mine, a keen glider pilot, did NS - he spent 2 years as a storesman on one of those East Anglian bases where the snow from the east used to pile in drifts on the boots of the a/cmen paraded in the morning.
The gent who's funeral I went to last week was one of the last in National Service sent abroad. He was born in 1936, and was sent to Malaya. My own dad was younger and went to University to become an architect, so was timed out.
For him, it formed his style for life - things like polished boots, neat and tidy, decently groomed, active in walking in the Peak District, in his case very self-disciplined to the extent that no one could even remember him ever raising his voice.
When I was growing up in the 1970s he still had things in his closet like an army box kite.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
I knew a few people who 'dodged' National Serviced by signing up for three years. The rate of pay for even a short-term regular was far better than for National Servicemen
You could also more easily choose your arm of service, and (with some luck) your regiment/corps/speciality. The RN took very few NS, relatively speaking, for instance, so if you wanted life on the briny ... And if you wanted to fly, you had a much better chance that way in the Raff than as a a conscript. A friend of mine, a keen glider pilot, did NS - he spent 2 years as a storesman on one of those East Anglian bases where the snow from the east used to pile in drifts on the boots of the a/cmen paraded in the morning.
Yes; I knew people who did three years in the Navy. And those East Anglian bases sound like the ones where a friend, when on guard duty, used to patrol the perimeter in winter 'armed' with a pickaxe handle.
Emphasises what a damn silly idea Sunak's 'promotion' of National Services was. Yes, I know people who look back on their time fondly, but not only is time a healer, but it's equipped with rose-tinted glasses.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
I am in favour of a very specific investigation into the grooming gangs, because whilst all of our policing seems a bit crap, the collusion and cover up on the part of the state was a phenomenon peculiar to grooming gangs. It would be absurd to suggest that the issue of foreign influence over our politics was limited to Russia. In fact, as Russia has become more and more of a pariah state, its ability to wield influence has undoubtedly weakened. It is the influence of those we treat as allies (even if that is just a fond wish on our part) that really changes policy and weakens security.
On child sex abuse, we have had this debate. We have had local inquiries already, and although the government eventually caved to a national inquiry, it rapidly fell apart over the precise scope. Targeting White girls in care is not the same as targeting Asian girls from different communities, for example. Trafficking girls around the country is not the same as local sugar daddies. There might have been a case for some sort of meta-review of all the local reports, but all we have achieved is to delay action.
On foreign influence, we have support of pressure groups by direct or disguised subsidy, online trolling (even on pb), cyberattacks as weapon or for ransom, sabotage, potential sabotage as electronic infrastructure is controlled from abroad, control of diaspora communities, influence on academia (every minor language course is probably subsidised by the relevant government) and so on. Look at the row over the Chinese Embassy. What is the point of worrying it will be used for espionage? All embassies are used for espionage. The real issues are its position and size.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Most of Guildford is posh compared to the rest of the UK, hence why the LDs won it and the Tories before that usually won it and why it has never had a Labour MP and is not forecast to have a Reform MP even now
Honestly people really have a deluded view of places in Surrey. Just because Surrey has a higher percentage of rich people does not mean most people are posh. Most of Guildford is not posh. If you are not on the High St or in a village outside of the town it is indistinguishable from any other town. Big ex council estates, big new estates, Victorian terraces near the centre. Some poor estates, some modern estates with a mix of semis and small detached houses, industrial estates, All the normal stuff.
We are not all driving land rovers, with springer spaniels and a 12 bore.
Well I live in Surrey and I am posh. I speak the King's English and only use rude words when the occasion demands it. Although I only drive an old Ford several peoole I know have Range or Land Rovers. A couple of them shoot if only mainly clays. And we have seperate cutlery for fish, although we seem to be down to three fish knives. We don't have a spaniel but we do have a pure bred tabby cat. Most of the neighbours are posh too and the nearesr council estate is over a mile away.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
I am in favour of a very specific investigation into the grooming gangs, because whilst all of our policing seems a bit crap, the collusion and cover up on the part of the state was a phenomenon peculiar to grooming gangs. It would be absurd to suggest that the issue of foreign influence over our politics was limited to Russia. In fact, as Russia has become more and more of a pariah state, its ability to wield influence has undoubtedly weakened. It is the influence of those we treat as allies (even if that is just a fond wish on our part) that really changes policy and weakens security.
On child sex abuse, we have had this debate. We have had local inquiries already, and although the government eventually caved to a national inquiry, it rapidly fell apart over the precise scope. Targeting White girls in care is not the same as targeting Asian girls from different communities, for example. Trafficking girls around the country is not the same as local sugar daddies. There might have been a case for some sort of meta-review of all the local reports, but all we have achieved is to delay action.
On foreign influence, we have support of pressure groups by direct or disguised subsidy, online trolling (even on pb), cyberattacks as weapon or for ransom, sabotage, potential sabotage as electronic infrastructure is controlled from abroad, control of diaspora communities, influence on academia (every minor language course is probably subsidised by the relevant government) and so on. Look at the row over the Chinese Embassy. What is the point of worrying it will be used for espionage? All embassies are used for espionage. The real issues are its position and size.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
Unless you know what the label 'liberal' refers to, among it's multitude of meanings, is is just a 'boo' or 'hooray' word. Ditto 'woke'.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Posh people don't make up the majority of any significant town or city in the UK. Does that mean we don't have any posh towns?
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
Even posh places need a lot of not-posh people to function, and they have to live somewhere and deserve a decent life- don't they?
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
Buckingham Palace even has a few butlers and chefs and security staff so is not a fully posh Palace really?
Well that's interesting because I know one of the royals bodyguards and you have just said they are not posh, yet guess where he lives. Yes that is right Surrey. He even lives in one of the poher parts (in a flat).
Is it his flat or provided with the job?
Royal bodyguards would tend to be the upper stream current or ex-policemen, who may have been in the security industry - which can be well-paid. One of my tenants was repeatedly harassed by a security chap who went to Afghanistan for months at a time, then would come home and get bored and complain to the Council about alleged dog barking problems. A fair amount of money, but also a nasty bully. He is now in a very pleasant double garage 4 bed detached modern cul-de-sac in a different area.
OTOH I know a couple who were both multi-decade Royal Household staff who lived above the Royal Mews, then in a tall terraced house at St James' Palace. She is now working for one of our more pleasant multimillionaire popstars; he is still in the Royal Household. The Royal Household is quite silo-ing.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
I've lived in either Woking Borough, Guildford Borough or Surrey Heath (Camberley) for 50 odd years since I was 9. Only other places being Manchester and East Sussex and also London up until I was 9. I have campaigned in all 3 extensively and have lived in run down areas as well as posh areas in that time, so I know them all very well. You do get some tosh posted here by people who haven't a clue and have very odd views on Surrey. There are obviously many worse places to live,but it isn't Utopia.
I have driven through Haslemere many times, particularly on the way to Goodwood. I have never stopped, but it does look nice.
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
To be fair,dodging the draft is quite a bit different from not serving.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
I recall someone tried to say that Col. Oliver North dodged the draft.
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
I knew a few people who 'dodged' National Serviced by signing up for three years. The rate of pay for even a short-term regular was far better than for National Servicemen
You could also more easily choose your arm of service, and (with some luck) your regiment/corps/speciality. The RN took very few NS, relatively speaking, for instance, so if you wanted life on the briny ... And if you wanted to fly, you had a much better chance that way in the Raff than as a a conscript. A friend of mine, a keen glider pilot, did NS - he spent 2 years as a storesman on one of those East Anglian bases where the snow from the east used to pile in drifts on the boots of the a/cmen paraded in the morning.
The gent who's funeral I went to last week was one of the last in National Service sent abroad. He was born in 1936, and was sent to Malaya. My own dad was younger and went to University to become an architect, so was timed out.
For him, it formed his style for life - things like polished boots, neat and tidy, decently groomed, active in walking in the Peak District, in his case very self-disciplined to the extent that no one could even remember him ever raising his voice.
When I was growing up in the 1970s he still had things in his closet like an army box kite.
Though his son did have one story he told me of an incident when on holiday in France en famille, of him pounding on the steering wheel of his Austin Princess shouting "Come on you bugger! Come on!", as he was trying to overtake something else, uphill, towing a caravan.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
Lets look at it differently perhaps.
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
No idea but that is not the point of the discussion with hyufd. The point is whether it is 5, 10, 15% they do not make up the vast majority of people who live in the Guildford constituency by definition of being only 5- 20% Most of the Guildford constituency is not posh however you define it.
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
Most of Guildford is posh compared to the rest of the UK, hence why the LDs won it and the Tories before that usually won it and why it has never had a Labour MP and is not forecast to have a Reform MP even now
Honestly people really have a deluded view of places in Surrey. Just because Surrey has a higher percentage of rich people does not mean most people are posh. Most of Guildford is not posh. If you are not on the High St or in a village outside of the town it is indistinguishable from any other town. Big ex council estates, big new estates, Victorian terraces near the centre. Some poor estates, some modern estates with a mix of semis and small detached houses, industrial estates, All the normal stuff.
We are not all driving land rovers, with springer spaniels and a 12 bore.
But indicators exist. Not everyone in Workington or Maryport races whippets or gets on the bus with a ferret down their trousers, though some do. But in Guildford a small terraced house will sell for £400,000 which in Maryport or Workington would be quite hard to give away free.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
Godalming still has a Wetherspoons though. (As does Windsor, a prime site opposite the Castle)
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Cooper stands no chance.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
I recognise the depiction of Guildford from my time as a resident of Merrow Park, although that outer suburb/village was quite strongly LD. Park Barn is where I worked, and it is definitely not posh.
The Cotswolds however are not universally 'naice'. Try spending a Saturday night in Gloucester, or even Cheltenham, if you wish to be disabused of the notion.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Cooper stands no chance.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
The above didn't harm SKS's chances
Or May. Or Thatcher. Or Wilson. Or Eden. Or Churchill.
Well, actually, that's not quite true. It did quite a lot of harm to Churchill. It just didn't matter in the end.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
How do we know Trump isn't a Communist?
Cosying up to the former KGB-man Putin Always wears a red tie (Republican colour!) Admirer of China's Xi and N. Korea's Kim
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Wide or deep? There is a fine line between investigating everything and investigating nothing.
I am in favour of a very specific investigation into the grooming gangs, because whilst all of our policing seems a bit crap, the collusion and cover up on the part of the state was a phenomenon peculiar to grooming gangs. It would be absurd to suggest that the issue of foreign influence over our politics was limited to Russia. In fact, as Russia has become more and more of a pariah state, its ability to wield influence has undoubtedly weakened. It is the influence of those we treat as allies (even if that is just a fond wish on our part) that really changes policy and weakens security.
On child sex abuse, we have had this debate. We have had local inquiries already, and although the government eventually caved to a national inquiry, it rapidly fell apart over the precise scope. Targeting White girls in care is not the same as targeting Asian girls from different communities, for example. Trafficking girls around the country is not the same as local sugar daddies. There might have been a case for some sort of meta-review of all the local reports, but all we have achieved is to delay action.
On foreign influence, we have support of pressure groups by direct or disguised subsidy, online trolling (even on pb), cyberattacks as weapon or for ransom, sabotage, potential sabotage as electronic infrastructure is controlled from abroad, control of diaspora communities, influence on academia (every minor language course is probably subsidised by the relevant government) and so on. Look at the row over the Chinese Embassy. What is the point of worrying it will be used for espionage? All embassies are used for espionage. The real issues are its position and size.
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
Godalming still has a Wetherspoons though. (As does Windsor, a prime site opposite the Castle)
So not only does Andrew get stripped of his home and titles, but now he can't even easily get along to Sir Tim Martin's Thursday night curry club. Has the poor chap not suffered enough?
10. George W. Bush 9. Rudy Giuliani 8. Mitt Romney 7. Ted Nugent 6. Bruce Springsteen 5. Newt Gingrich 4. Bill Clinton 3. Muhammad Ali 2. Dick Cheney 1. John Wayne Bonus: Donald Trump Bonus: Joe Biden
Another bonus: Barack Obama, so we have the last five Presidents in the list.
The well-connected always find a way of avoiding things they don’t want to do.
Nothing to avoid. Mr Obama was born in 1961, so would not have been of age in the era of conscription.
Ah yes. So he didn’t serve, but it was voluntary when he turned adult.
Some front for Nathan Gill to have tweeted this knowing what he was doing. Lefties do seem to be implying all of his party members are equally crooked though
Ex-MP Jared O'Mara charged with seven counts of fraud, you have to delve deep to find out what party he belonged to. Could you imagine if he had been UKIP, it would have been front page news implying all party members are equally crooked. Oh BBC 🙄
They’re desperate for some shit to stick to Farage. It’s politics. All part of the game.
Theres loads of Pro-Putin remarks by Farage on the record.
Gill and Farage are birds of a feather.
Are you seriously claiming Farage is on the same level as the convicted Nathan Gill ?
I can't remember who it was, probably not Farage, but someone from UKIP/ Brexit was making remarkably similar pro- Russian, anti- Ukraine speeches contemporaneously to those made by Gill in the European Parliament. Uncanny!
If only I could remember who that was.
As long as they did it without taking money, or making sure they lost the receipts, they will be fine, I'm sure. Certainly from a criminal point of view.
"Saying similar things to Gill without even being paid for it" probably shouldn't be a political defence, but that depends on how teflon any such figure is, if they even exist.
Nathan Gill appeared to be incredibly thick too. Someone more sophisticated, if they existed, would more likely than not have covered their tracks.
In terms of the war chest Russia has available to indulge in covert activity, Nathan Gill massively undersold himself.
It would be quite evasive to call for an investigation into the influence of Russian money on UK politics whilst politely ignoring the vast hoovering of money from other states. China and India being two that spring to mind immediately, but also Israel, the Saudis, the Qataris, and many more. US money is also a big issue, though I think it's more private sector - corporations and billionaire 'philanthropists'.
Would you actually oppose an investigation into Russian money and its influence on UK politics?
I would oppose the investigation's terms being so narrowly defined. Russia is a billigerent state, but it lags behind others in the security threat to the UK stakes.
Name one
China
China is the one spending money Saudi and similar giving money to loony radicals is another Russia is a current threat. Fading in the long term - economics, demographics and the transition away from fossil fuels will see to them in the next 20 or so years. Which is why they are dangerous now. India is an odd one - less hostile, but spending more and more money on influence.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
Unless you know what the label 'liberal' refers to, among it's multitude of meanings, is is just a 'boo' or 'hooray' word. Ditto 'woke'.
Absolutely. Rather than a magnifying glass on the victim of the label, it is far better to look through it the other way at the party applying the label.
In the case of Welby, they tend to be labels applied for political reasons - or from the USA based on political issues which are viewed through religious spectacles since Jerry Falwell and co were looking for their levers into politics in the 1970s.
Over here, the CofE is tied into political narratives in a way that applied to very few other organisations, to the extent that stories about it are very rarely to do with religion.
One other organisation where that applies more than previously is the National Trust.
I spotted another one the other day that surprised me, but I have forgotten which one it was. I'll keep an eye out.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
How do we know Trump isn't a Communist?
Cosying up to the former KGB-man Putin Always wears a red tie (Republican colour!) Admirer of China's Xi and N. Korea's Kim
Most Communists outside of Communist countries actually believe, passionately, in Communism.
Trump believes passionately in self-gratification.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
Where will RefUK pivot if immigration is sidelined as a core issue?
I don't think it will be. While net flows might become zero or even negative, much of Reform's support object to immigrants who have been here for years and even if born here as second or third generation.
Once folk have got so het up it is hard to cool them off.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
How do we know Trump isn't a Communist?
Cosying up to the former KGB-man Putin Always wears a red tie (Republican colour!) Admirer of China's Xi and N. Korea's Kim
He doesn't always wear a red tie. He also has an absolutely vile, lurid yellow/gold tie, which I assume Melania gave him one Xmas as some kind of sick joke.
Well she’s turning out to be quite the revelation as HS.
Shows just how useless Yvette was in the role.
I'm no fan of Yvette Cooper but let us wait and see what Shabana Mahmood achieves rather than wants. Crucially, however, there will be a direct comparison between the two when it comes to the succession race. ETA we should also bear in mind that sounding Reform-lite with nothing to show might not appeal to the Labour Party.
Cooper stands no chance.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
The above didn't harm SKS's chances
That was 2020 after Bozo beat Corbyn which rather reduced the options.
It was SKS against Lisa Nandy and Rebecca Long-Bailey. And those other 2 now fall into the who? category..
The problem for the Tories is that apart from their own diehards -14 seats worth-they have no allies. Faced with Farage or Badenoch civilised folk might as well go to the pub.
Labour by contrast have a cornucopia of choice. Labour.... Lib Dem ....Zacks mob....Gaza indy's.....whichever is in the best position to defeat the fascists and I have no doubt that they'll come out in force
The dog that continues not to bark is the LDs. In 100 seats they are safely either first or contending to win, in the rest SFAICS no movement that matters. The only centrists who have not trashed their reputation, they could and should be the obvious refuge but they are not. In a sense this is more mysterious than why the Tories look as if they may go out of business, and I can't see a non-circular explanation.
The LDs are now the party of posh home counties Remainers, the leftwingers who backed Charles Kennedy now vote Green or Labour and Leavers won't vote for them either
You are right, it is, but remember the vast majority of the voters in these constituencies aren't posh. Guildford, Woking, Camberley, etc town centres aren't posh and these are the areas they pile up the majority of votes. Even posh villages, like I live in, still have a council housing, flats above shops etc and these villages still vote primarily Tory. We analyse the boxes when they are opened. The villages all around me voted Tory. Our village was neck and neck, but Guildford town was LD and by far the biggest block of votes.
Guildford town centre may not be Cotswolds naice but it is significantly better than average. A castle, water, decent range of independent shops, fewer vape, bookies, charities and vacant lots than the vast majority of similar sized English towns.
It is, but I'm sorry that analysis is not correct. You are just looking at the High St. Nobody lives there. They live around it. Park Barn is a huge ex council estate. Most of the other houses in the town are old small terraces. Once you move out further you get to housing estates of flats, semis, and small detached houses. There are only a handful of big houses in Guildford itself and many of those are multiple occupancy flats eh York Rd. Outside of Guildford you get the posh villages. We expect to win the town. Victory is achieved my squeezing the villages. Not to winning them but minimising the loss.
Woking is even more so. People have an odd view of Surrey. Sheerwater in Woking or Old Dean in Camberley are not just not posh they are very unposh.
I used to frequent Camberley quite a bit so I know you're correct. However, when I visited Haslemere (the very centre of it) even the charity shops were above my touch. My first few visits they did have a Wetherspoon's but that was sold off & became a much posher restaurant. After that it was salad bowl & roll in my hotel room (and even they had to come from Waitrose).
Godalming still has a Wetherspoons though. (As does Windsor, a prime site opposite the Castle)
Pah, even da North Ilford Ghetto has a 'Spoons = the New Fairop Oak, near Fairlop tube!
The Ilford South Massive have The Great Spoon, and The Eva Hart.
OT - Have we found out which of the communist Bishops faked this poll?
Who are you asking? If you are asking a Trumpist all of them are communist.
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
How do we know Trump isn't a Communist?
Cosying up to the former KGB-man Putin Always wears a red tie (Republican colour!) Admirer of China's Xi and N. Korea's Kim
He might be one now, having praised the new Mayor of New York.
The Mayor is a Communist. We know that because Karoline Leavitt * told us.
* I qui like her new nickname "Taco Belle" over "Propaganda Barbie".
Comments
Mail to buy Telegraph:
The publisher of the Daily Mail has agreed to buy the Daily and Sunday Telegraph for £500m.
The Daily Mail and General Trust (DMGT) said it had entered a period of discussion with RedBird IMI, which is a joint venture between the United Arab Emirates and the US private equity firm RedBird Capital Partners.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2eg1w0n81o
This was unlike the First World War when scientists and key workers rushed to the front. Even in the second war it was necessary for women to replace men in factories and farms, and for draftees to be sent down the mines because so many experienced miners were in uniform.
Unlike America, we had no draft for Vietnam.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/sheerwater.html
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/essex.html
How many people in the UK do you consider "posh"? If it is 5-10% I'll go along with your interpretation. If it is 15%+ then I'll stick with mine.
Day 237 of the Malmesbury UnDictatorship
Reporter - “Some say you’ve interfered in the judiciary”
M - “Nonsense. I haven’t fired a single judge. Appointed thousands and raised their pay.”
Reporter - “But some say your appointments are an attack. Just with week, Judge Jefferies…”
M - “Wrote a brilliant biography of his ancestor, you know”
Reporter “… ruled that *not* impaling a senior manager in the national rail company for causing 37 deaths would violate his rights under the EHCR.”
M - “What can I say? You want me to fire a judge for his opinions? That would be judicial interference.”
If the government does actually fix the small boats problem in the next few years, it takes the sting out of a lot of Reform rhetoric on the subject.
I tend to determine that a place is not posh when I see sofas on the front lawn, and burnt out cars on the street.
Yes you might get a few teachers or vicars who are educated but not wealthy or higher earners but Surrey is mainly full of educated lawyers, bankers, accountants, business executives, IT professionals, doctors and surgeons etc all with lots of degrees and qualifications, high earnings and expensive houses and fancy cars.
The young graduates in rented homes are also in Manchester, Birmingham, Cardiff, Liverpool, inner London etc not leafy Surrey
Backpacking wasn't for him.
Fundamentally un-warm politician, always seems to be hectoring. Just not up to it.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/harlow.html
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/basildon.html
In addition the vast majority of those 'posh' people don't actually live in Guildford itself. They live in the surrounding villages. I have literally delivered just about all of Guildford. I can only think of a handful of big houses in the centre that haven't been converted to flats.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9wUiSlZPkQ
https://x.com/afneil/status/1992170576442491260
A major news story that will not get the coverage it deserves:
Over 300 schoolchildren and 12 teachers have been abducted by gunmen from St. Mary’s School, a Catholic institution in north-central Nigeria’s Niger state.
This updates an earlier count of 215 schoolchildren.
The students are male and female, ranging in age from 10 to 18.
Their kidnapping happened four days after 25 schoolchildren were seized in similar circumstances in neighboring Kebbi state.
Nobody yet claimed responsibility.
Reform's Stateism is another reason I won't vote for them.
You can just not be called up, and therefore not serve, but if you take active steps to avoid it then that's quite another matter.
Perhaps reconsider it as posher towns rather than expecting most people in a town to be posh, if it is a posh town.
And China is clearly the greater long term threat. Spying - both traditional and hi-tech, intimidation, Chinese police stations, the super embassy, corporate espionage, naval build-up. The only reason we see them as 'less' of a threat - in fact the only reason we see any of these countries as less of a threat, is because currently we acquiesce with most of their wishes.
I am not saying that Russia isn't a threat, or doesn't want to destabilise our country. I just think a 'Russia enquiry' would be a very easy way for politicians to grandstand whilst trousering money from everyone else. Let's investigate all foreign influence properly, including Russian, and see what's under the rock.
Denial of that leads to an awful lot of our current problems as a nation.
Shilling for Russia is the answer.
https://x.com/lembitopik/status/1991499316012413134
Zelensky should be reminded when you’re losing a war, you don’t set the peace terms, you merely accept them
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk-politics/2025/10/has-kemi-badenoch-actually-read-terry-pratchett
1) No mention of Iran
2) No suggestion that Russia and China are linked
In terms of place to live there is a broad consensus that we should build more homes "somewhere", the issue is there is an even broader consensus that "somewhere"="somewhere but not here".
Which he kinda did.
But most people would argue that volunteering for the Marines instead and fighting in Vietnam was not really draft dodging.
We are not all driving land rovers, with springer spaniels and a 12 bore.
Obvious from the street.
Simple to raid them, with inspectors on hand to find all the other shit that’s gong on - cash in hand for a start, stolen materials next…. Arresting the ring leaders, detain the illegal workers, seize the cash - kills the project.
Word would rapidly go out - a few BBC documentaries? - that employing illegal builders gets you a half done house and lost money.
Of course Russia and China are linked. That supports my argument, not the opposing argument. China taking the opposing side on a proxy war with the West is another reason why it is silly to exclude it from any investigation - it's investigating the henchman not the mastermind.
Iran is undoubtedly a security threat, and a horrible regime. However I do see it as less of a present threat on the streets of the UK, because its Shia form of Islam is practised by a small minority of UK muslims, and is traditionally despised by Sunni muslims. I believe most islamic terrorism in the UK is wahhabist, salafist - whatever you want to call it - an extreme form of Sunni Islam.
Ai:
Possibly surprising to some, but Bob Dylan signed up for the draft and remained eligible throughout the Vietnam War. He was never called up.
https://www.itv.com/news/2025-11-22/daily-mail-owner-strikes-500-million-deal-to-buy-telegraph-titles
Aninteresting framing over the last several years, especially revealing as to what causes brandings of "woke", and how the claim is a broad allegation actually based on a very narrow set of criteria has been Justin Welby.
Welby had an evangelical conversion at Cambridge University, and formed at Holy Trinity Brompton, within the Charismatic Evangelical tradition of the Church of England.
Yes he still received that label, and sources like the Telegraph have branded him liberal.
For him, it formed his style for life - things like polished boots, neat and tidy, decently groomed, active in walking in the Peak District, in his case very self-disciplined to the extent that no one could even remember him ever raising his voice.
When I was growing up in the 1970s he still had things in his closet like an army box kite.
And those East Anglian bases sound like the ones where a friend, when on guard duty, used to patrol the perimeter in winter 'armed' with a pickaxe handle.
Emphasises what a damn silly idea Sunak's 'promotion' of National Services was. Yes, I know people who look back on their time fondly, but not only is time a healer, but it's equipped with rose-tinted glasses.
On foreign influence, we have support of pressure groups by direct or disguised subsidy, online trolling (even on pb), cyberattacks as weapon or for ransom, sabotage, potential sabotage as electronic infrastructure is controlled from abroad, control of diaspora communities, influence on academia (every minor language course is probably subsidised by the relevant government) and so on. Look at the row over the Chinese Embassy. What is the point of worrying it will be used for espionage? All embassies are used for espionage. The real issues are its position and size.
Let's put the Chinese Embassy in Guildford.
Royal bodyguards would tend to be the upper stream current or ex-policemen, who may have been in the security industry - which can be well-paid. One of my tenants was repeatedly harassed by a security chap who went to Afghanistan for months at a time, then would come home and get bored and complain to the Council about alleged dog barking problems. A fair amount of money, but also a nasty bully. He is now in a very pleasant double garage 4 bed detached modern cul-de-sac in a different area.
OTOH I know a couple who were both multi-decade Royal Household staff who lived above the Royal Mews, then in a tall terraced house at St James' Palace. She is now working for one of our more pleasant multimillionaire popstars; he is still in the Royal Household. The Royal Household is quite silo-ing.
I have driven through Haslemere many times, particularly on the way to Goodwood. I have never stopped, but it does look nice.
The Cotswolds however are not universally 'naice'. Try spending a Saturday night in Gloucester, or even Cheltenham, if you wish to be disabused of the notion.
Well, actually, that's not quite true. It did quite a lot of harm to Churchill. It just didn't matter in the end.
Cosying up to the former KGB-man Putin
Always wears a red tie (Republican colour!)
Admirer of China's Xi and N. Korea's Kim
Saudi and similar giving money to loony radicals is another
Russia is a current threat. Fading in the long term - economics, demographics and the transition away from fossil fuels will see to them in the next 20 or so years. Which is why they are dangerous now.
India is an odd one - less hostile, but spending more and more money on influence.
In the case of Welby, they tend to be labels applied for political reasons - or from the USA based on political issues which are viewed through religious spectacles since Jerry Falwell and co were looking for their levers into politics in the 1970s.
Over here, the CofE is tied into political narratives in a way that applied to very few other organisations, to the extent that stories about it are very rarely to do with religion.
One other organisation where that applies more than previously is the National Trust.
I spotted another one the other day that surprised me, but I have forgotten which one it was. I'll keep an eye out.
Trump believes passionately in self-gratification.
Once folk have got so het up it is hard to cool them off.
It was SKS against Lisa Nandy and Rebecca Long-Bailey. And those other 2 now fall into the who? category..
The Ilford South Massive have The Great Spoon, and The Eva Hart.
Georgia governor race in 2026 to set her up as the heir to MAGA in 2028/2032?
The Mayor is a Communist. We know that because Karoline Leavitt * told us.
* I qui like her new nickname "Taco Belle" over "Propaganda Barbie".