The majority of voters support changing the voting system – politicalbetting.com

carnforth said:

Andy_JS said:

Daily Mail being patriotic as usual.

"Escape from Keir's Britain with the experts' definitive emigration guide: The best places for sunshine, big houses, high wages, no crime and top-notch healthcare - plus the hotspot with NO income tax"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-13604631/Escape-Keirs-Britain-experts-emigration-guide-houses-wages-health-care-income-tax-haven.html

"For the first time since the 70s a self-proclaimed socialist is in charge"

Pretty sure Blair claimed to be a socialist.

Damn certain Brown did.

DavidL said:

They are going to make us watch another 30 minutes, aren't they?

Well, you tried....

Andy_JS said:

Daily Mail being patriotic as usual.

"Escape from Keir's Britain with the experts' definitive emigration guide: The best places for sunshine, big houses, high wages, no crime and top-notch healthcare - plus the hotspot with NO income tax"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-13604631/Escape-Keirs-Britain-experts-emigration-guide-houses-wages-health-care-income-tax-haven.html

Not that reprobate SeanT in the travel pages again?

Sunil_Prasannan said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

Indeed, all SNPers are north of there.

Not the case, Campbeltown on Kintyre says hello

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

And also running header in The Times.

Rather than try ad hominem you could try addressing the issue.

This is Starmer's first mistake. And possibly a very telling one.

The guy has a history of junking his pledges as soon as he's past the winning post.

Casino_Royale said:

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

And also running header in The Times.

Rather than try ad hominem you could try addressing the issue.

This is Starmer's first mistake. And possibly a very telling one.

The guy has a history of junking his pledges as soon as he's past the winning post.

Pissed the bed on wedding night. No honeymoon for you Keir

If they’re legitimate refugees of course the PM should help them. What is wrong with people.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

That's an insult to Scotland.

Tweedledee said:

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

Well quite, and who seriously calls himself a bean-seller? "Look guys, there's a bloviating arsehat from the UK right wing press, let's take the piss".

Serious occupation that, and sometimes dangerous.

WildernessPt2 said:

Casino_Royale said:

Cicero said:

Casino_Royale said:

I think this is Starmer's first bad move: more or less made it his first priority on day *one*. And it's currently leading The Times.

He's telegraphed that it's open season, now, and that means that every extra boat crossing over the Summer can be pinned on him now.

Could it be that when he doesn't have anyone to tediously tactically triangulate against he just makes some very bad decisions?

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/labour-keir-starmer-latest-news-cabinet-prime-minister-htcvhbs20

Rwanda was not a workable policy, it was a political gimmick and quite an expensive one at that. The right wing press may be trying to put the boot in, but I suspect Starmer will not leave that flank open for long

It's certainly going to create more 'work' if its immediate abolition now leads to a flood of people crossing the channel. The sensible thing to do would have been to keep it up and until he had an alternative, and equally firm, plan in place.

My guess is SKS will now do a lot of instinctively left-wing things now he's safely in office because the bloke ain't exactly a deep thinker.

Maggie had a plan... She defeated the most devious of devious the NMU with a plan...

Also, she passed an immigration act in her first term that quashed the problem and killed off the NF for good.

Oh, that we had a politician with her abilities today.

This is how Tory staffers were geeing themselves up during the campaign.

"Twice a day the unmistakable voice of Elvis Presley echoed around the open plan office at Tory campaign headquarters. For three minutes mid-morning and again in the late afternoon, 150 staff stopped to listen to the recording of A Little Less Conversation. Music possesses a unique power to inspire, motivate and energise a campaign according to political strategists. The campaign team chose the Elvis number from a shortlist drawn up by senior staff. While some party apparatchiks saw it as absurd, one ultra-loyal aide said: 'Most of us looked forward to hearing it. The song fired us up in the face of a never-ending sea of bad news from the pollsters.'"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13605549/why-rishi-sunak-called-july-general-election.html

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

The SNP'S total collapse in the Central Belt is even more impressive than the Tory catastrophe in the West Country.

South of Perth I think, although the Kintyre peninsula probably counts even if no one lives there.

spudgfsh said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

Argyll, Bute and South Lochaber goes a lot further south than Stirling...

Ta.

DM_Andy said:

rcs1000 said:

DM_Andy said:

FrankBooth said:

Online voting.............

Anyone who suggests that we should do online voting should listen to anyone who's an expert in computer systems, 100% of them would say it's a bad idea.

And where did you learn that stat?

Online.

And you trust it?

I learned that online but I used that information to understand why it's a bad idea. There needs to be an audit trail so we can trust the results but that audit trail cannot scale so we can have anonymity. It is easy to attack the pen and paper system we have now but it gets very difficult to get into the tens of votes, it isn't much more difficult to attack an electronic voting system and you can basically make the result anything you want.

Estonia has managed online voting well enough, but they already had an electronic voting setup (voting machines in polling booths), and have a nationwide PKI that works with their smart ID cards. About half the population chooses to use it.

It seems to be fairly robust - the code is open source and is regularly audited, and provides for end-to-end verifiability of votes with the hashes made public. The counting process is also verifiable (I believe there's some controversy about whether that's entirely true with the data that's routinely made public, but the full audit log is stored and would be available if there were any doubt).

It's a good fit for Estonia, but it would be incredibly expensive to replicate it in the UK with 50x the population and doesn't even have a canonical list of citizens, let alone a robust PKI with crytpographic smartcards in regular use by the population.

It'd probably be doable, but you'd be talking about several billion to do it properly, possibly into the low teens of billions.

Casino_Royale said:

pigeon said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

As if keeping the previous Government would've made any difference to that. There is nothing that can be done to deter these people from boarding their dinghies that's violent or ruthless enough to be acceptable to the electorate of a Western democracy.

Not stopping them, not under current rules, but I think crossing numbers were far lower than they would have otherwise been.

We will shortly find out.

Well, crossings have been at record highs under the Conservatives Rwanda policy, so if its a deterrent it isn't a very good one.

Let's see what the graph looks like later in the year.

Nothing your party can do about it now, nor Farage.

spudgfsh said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

Argyll, Bute and South Lochaber goes a lot further south than Stirling...

Almost shaking hands with the TUV in fact

Casino_Royale said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

And ?

People voted for it.

Oh, indeed. And I repeatedly tried to warn them.

I won't be shy of pointing that out as it all unfurls.

Labour 412 seats
Tories 121 seats

I know how many seats the parties got Sunil, and that's not the "point" you think you're making.

Tories DOWN 244 seats.

Yeah, I know.

Quoting the election results is going to be totally fucking tedious if that's your response to every political issue at debate over the next 5 years.

Lowest Tory share of the vote since God knows when...

OnboardG1 said:

On Topic, I have no idea why we don't make it easier to vote. Making the election day a bank holiday is a really good idea. Motivation will always be an issue but I don't understand why we think the middle of the working week is a great time to do a democracy.

It's the day before payday.
So punters less likely to be drunk and aggy.

OnboardG1 said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

The SNP'S total collapse in the Central Belt is even more impressive than the Tory catastrophe in the West Country.

South of Perth I think, although the Kintyre peninsula probably counts even if no one lives there.

The Perth constituency, which includes Kinross, goes well south of Perth.

ydoethur said:

dixiedean said:

OnboardG1 said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

The SNP'S total collapse in the Central Belt is even more impressive than the Tory catastrophe in the West Country.

South of Perth I think, although the Kintyre peninsula probably counts even if no one lives there.

Has Paul MacCartney moved out?

He's fled, taken Wings from the place.

I thought Wings was in Bath.

Did anyone even try to score in that 15 minutes? Both teams look knackered.

Andy_JS said:

This is how Tory staffers were geeing themselves up during the campaign.

"Twice a day the unmistakable voice of Elvis Presley echoed around the open plan office at Tory campaign headquarters. For three minutes mid-morning and again in the late afternoon, 150 staff stopped to listen to the recording of A Little Less Conversation. Music possesses a unique power to inspire, motivate and energise a campaign according to political strategists. The campaign team chose the Elvis number from a shortlist drawn up by senior staff. While some party apparatchiks saw it as absurd, one ultra-loyal aide said: 'Most of us looked forward to hearing it. The song fired us up in the face of a never-ending sea of bad news from the pollsters.'"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13605549/why-rishi-sunak-called-july-general-election.html

Now they’re just playing heartbreak hotel on loop

Chris said:

Casino_Royale said:

MisterBedfordshire said:

Casino_Royale said:

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

And also running header in The Times.

Rather than try ad hominem you could try addressing the issue.

This is Starmer's first mistake. And possibly a very telling one.

The guy has a history of junking his pledges as soon as he's past the winning post.

I think ditching Rwanda was one of his pledges.

What he does about the problem is the key issue.

Immigrants coming by small boats illegally are jumping the queue and therefore an abomination in the eyes of the British as you will discover if you try jumping a queue.

He could have ditched it *once* his alternative was in place, to keep crossing numbers under control.

He might prove to have as shit political instincts as Sunak did.

If Starmer raised the dead some people would complain he was taking business away from undertakers.

And seriously aggravating the pensions situation!

Andy_JS said:

Daily Mail being patriotic as usual.

"Escape from Keir's Britain with the experts' definitive emigration guide: The best places for sunshine, big houses, high wages, no crime and top-notch healthcare - plus the hotspot with NO income tax"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-13604631/Escape-Keirs-Britain-experts-emigration-guide-houses-wages-health-care-income-tax-haven.html

All the houses they vacate can be seized by the state and given to asylum seekers.

Kane has done absolutely nothing in this game apart from 1 decent bit of defending but do you now have to keep him on for the Pens?

I see the previous spoutings of the newly elected independents are being analysed by the press and they seem a tad Paisleyite, and not just the NI one.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Am I right in thinking the SNP don't have any MPs south of Stirling?

That's an insult to Scotland.

Chris said:

Casino_Royale said:

MisterBedfordshire said:

Casino_Royale said:

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

And also running header in The Times.

Rather than try ad hominem you could try addressing the issue.

This is Starmer's first mistake. And possibly a very telling one.

The guy has a history of junking his pledges as soon as he's past the winning post.

I think ditching Rwanda was one of his pledges.

What he does about the problem is the key issue.

Immigrants coming by small boats illegally are jumping the queue and therefore an abomination in the eyes of the British as you will discover if you try jumping a queue.

He could have ditched it *once* his alternative was in place, to keep crossing numbers under control.

He might prove to have as shit political instincts as Sunak did.

If Starmer raised the dead some people would complain he was taking business away from undertakers.

It will take morons like you about 3 years to accept that he's incapable of doing anything but walking on water.

To the rest of us, with braincells, we will be pointing out his errors and making criticism as soon as it's warranted in our role as opposition. Because that's how leaders are held to account.

And he's done a real silly one. On Day One.

Casino_Royale said:

MisterBedfordshire said:

Casino_Royale said:

Gardenwalker said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Calm down, dear. It’s the Telegraph.

And also running header in The Times.

Rather than try ad hominem you could try addressing the issue.

This is Starmer's first mistake. And possibly a very telling one.

The guy has a history of junking his pledges as soon as he's past the winning post.

I think ditching Rwanda was one of his pledges.

What he does about the problem is the key issue.

Immigrants coming by small boats illegally are jumping the queue and therefore an abomination in the eyes of the British as you will discover if you try jumping a queue.

He could have ditched it *once* his alternative was in place, to keep crossing numbers under control.

He might prove to have as shit political instincts as Sunak did.

That's possible.

I think they might be trying something else: saying what they are going to do, doing it, and then communicating that they have done it.

It may have short-term negative consequences, but I think it is the only way to build up trust. And the impact is minimal to start with.

ETA: I'm not saying they won't make a mess of it though.

Given we are now a multi party system rather than a 2 party system then a move to PR does have some merit.

The US does have electronic voting of course but not online

Penalties

OMG penalties again

HYUFD said:

Penalties

Surely watching the football is penalty enough.

HYUFD said:

Given we are now a multi party system rather than a 2 party system then a move to PR does have some merit.

The US does have electronic voting of course but not online

So does India, you have to turn up at the polling station to cast your vote.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

OMG penalties again

We'll be fine.

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿
X

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Even by the standards of the Telegraph and Casino surely a spoof?

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿
X

BOO!

Roger said:

Casino_Royale said:

And here they come..


"Amir, 23, a bean-seller from Kurdistan, said migrants had given Sir Keir a nickname that roughly translates as a man who works for refugees or workers.

He said: “We are calling him ‘Party Krekaran’ because we have heard that this guy is really helpful to the refugees.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/07/05/migrants-set-to-make-crossing-soon-possible-labour/

Even by the standards of the Telegraph and Casino surely a spoof?

It does smack of "we totally made this up and paid the bean seller for his services."

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿
X🇨🇭

BOO

FOUR!

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿
X 🇨🇭 🇨🇭 🇨🇭

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿
X 🇨🇭 🇨🇭 🇨🇭

WIN!!

England through

It's coming home.