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No seat is safe: Tory by-election defences – politicalbetting.com

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  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    Farooq said:

    Additional: it's a group effort, not mine. @FrancisUrquhart has said the "good job that England bat deep" line more times than England have runs today
    No mention of bat deep from me this test, because they most definitely don't with this lineup.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,871
    Farooq said:

    Additional: it's a group effort, not mine. @FrancisUrquhart has said the "good job that England bat deep" line more times than England have runs today
    Missing one row below though, I feel.

    "Cricket? Never heard of it"
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    edited July 2023
    Highest successful Test match run-chases at Lord's
    West Indies 344-1 v England 1984
    England 282-3 v New Zealand 2004
    England 279-5 v New Zealand 2022
    England 218-3 v New Zealand 1965
    England 193-5 v West Indies 2012

    Anything over 250 to chase in test cricket is incredibly rare in test cricket.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    We want Hawaii.

    Their flag is proof they want to be a part of the UK.
    King Kamehameha wanted to have the protection of Union Jack for his own ships BUT without having to actually fly it.

    Though that didn't stop Brits from THIS act of piracy, known as Paulet Affair aka "British Hawaii":

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paulet_affair
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049
    edited July 2023

    UKers already tried THAT gambit between 1861-65.

    Best go back to the drawing board (or is it room?) to dream yet more horseshit.
    Imperial Federation was also a thing from 1881 to 1931.

    Indeed Lord Rosebery was Prime Minister and President of the Imperial Federation League (not at the same time).

    A whole economic policy was based on it, called at various times Tariff Reform, Imperial Preference, Empire Free Trade and Neville Chamberlain's budget.

    It didn't work.

    Just as Malta's request to join the UK in the 1950s was rebuffed.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    edited July 2023
    boulay said:

    Yes, but you mentioned an experiment and surely there is an experiment already going on where there are students spending long hours “in school” compared to the accepted timetable in State Schools where you can compare hours spent in schools against other metrics.

    As I know absolutely nothing about being a teacher I can’t hope to know your experience but I’ve always wondered why the school day isn’t changed, with any necessary uplift in pay for teachers, to finish after 5pm for 13+ as it would have the benefit of freeing up parents to work a full day rather than having to work part time which would be good for parents, productivity and tax receipts surely.
    Some of my kids have 4 hour plus per day travel time.
    You can't guarantee they will be fed or have a quiet, safe place to sleep, let alone study.
    Plus they all have a special needs diagnosis.
    You aren't comparing like with like.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    ydoethur said:

    Imperial Federation was also a thing from 1881 to 1922.

    Indeed Lord Rosebery was Prime Minister and President of the Imperial Federation League (not at the same time).

    It didn't work.

    Just as Malta's request to join the UK in the 1950s was rebuffed.
    It did for the US, and for Russia.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049

    It did for the US, and for Russia.
    We federated with the US and Russia? I missed that.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    edited July 2023

    I know this is all in fun, but shouldn't we just make the UK and its economy work first? Do we always have to find someone to glue ourselves to to make things better? Talking about looking for love in all the wrong places.
    Britain needs some frontier mentality to re-energise its entrepreneurial spirit.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    Carnyx said:

    But doesn't your suggestion imply 2 hours of sport (or voluntary service or whatever) every afternoon, on the private school model? That would need more playing fields than (so I understand) schools tend to have these days.
    It doesn’t just have to be 2 hours of sport. And not all sport needs playing fields as there are potentially other sports and exercise options that don’t need the space. It could be a mix of sport, activities - art, crafts, drama, and yes, community service, cadet forces, anything but also that time could be set aside as a sort of “prep” time where pupils do what would otherwise be homework under supervision where the teacher supervising each class gets time to do marking whilst being paid rather than it being in their free time at home and pupils catch up on work in a solid environment rather than trying to do it at home where they might not have peace, space, equipment or might be corralled into other things.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,378
    kjh said:

    Here is hoping you're watching cricket all day.
    Well that hope didn't last long.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    pigeon said:

    Discussions about four versus five day weeks are, in and of themselves, bourgeois, of course. How many people working low wage crap jobs in a whole range of sectors (care homes and shops immediately spring to mind) get all their weekends off? For that matter, how many hard-up workers do more than one job, spread over six or seven days of the week?
    Indeed, but on the other hand a 4 day week might actually help some folk - whether for child or oldie care or to double bank.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    ydoethur said:

    We federated with the US and Russia? I missed that.
    I mean to say that US and Russian “imperial federations” survived (if not thrived, in Russia’s case) to the modern day.

    Anyway, 2023 is v different.
    We have the internet.
    The world is smaller.
    And Britain’s geopolitical strategy is no longer centred on the defence of India.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,389
    edited July 2023
    If England win this test then next weekend I'll give you a thread on AV.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    boulay said:

    It doesn’t just have to be 2 hours of sport. And not all sport needs playing fields as there are potentially other sports and exercise options that don’t need the space. It could be a mix of sport, activities - art, crafts, drama, and yes, community service, cadet forces, anything but also that time could be set aside as a sort of “prep” time where pupils do what would otherwise be homework under supervision where the teacher supervising each class gets time to do marking whilst being paid rather than it being in their free time at home and pupils catch up on work in a solid environment rather than trying to do it at home where they might not have peace, space, equipment or might be corralled into other things.
    That would require a heck of a lot more staff.
    How do you supervise whilst marking?
    Almost all schools have after school clubs which do this already.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,787
    Andy_JS said:

    When did it become okay for people to use their personal phones while doing a job? I'm sure it wasn't allowed in most jobs when phones first became available.
    My relative who runs a construction company got complaints.

    Because he restricted the provided WiFi on site and in the office to block social media.

    No, he wasn’t grabbing people’s mobiles off them. Just if they wanted Farcebook or Twatter, it came out of the employee’s data plans…
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,820
    This will get a few people excited.

    The inheritance of social status: England, 1600 to 2022
    https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2300926120
    There is widespread belief across the social sciences in the ability of social interventions and social institutions to significantly influence rates of social mobility. In England, 1600 to 2022, we see considerable change in social institutions across time. Half the population was illiterate in 1,800, and not until 1,880 was compulsory primary education introduced. Progressively after this, educational provision and other social supports for poorer families expanded greatly. The paper shows, however, that these interventions did not change in any measurable way the strong familial persistence of social status across generations...

    … Abstract

    A lineage of 422,374 English people (1600 to 2022) contains correlations in social outcomes among relatives as distant as 4th cousins. These correlations show striking patterns. The first is the strong persistence of social status across family trees. Correlations decline by a factor of only 0.79 across each generation. Even fourth cousins, with a common ancestor only five generations earlier, show significant status correlations. The second remarkable feature is that the decline in correlation with genetic distance in the lineage is unchanged from 1600 to 2022. Vast social changes in England between 1600 and 2022 would have been expected to increase social mobility. Yet people in 2022 remain correlated in outcomes with their lineage relatives in exactly the same way as in preindustrial England. The third surprising feature is that the correlations parallel those of a simple model of additive genetic determination of status, with a genetic correlation in marriage of 0.57.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    edited July 2023
    boulay said:

    It doesn’t just have to be 2 hours of sport. And not all sport needs playing fields as there are potentially other sports and exercise options that don’t need the space. It could be a mix of sport, activities - art, crafts, drama, and yes, community service, cadet forces, anything but also that time could be set aside as a sort of “prep” time where pupils do what would otherwise be homework under supervision where the teacher supervising each class gets time to do marking whilst being paid rather than it being in their free time at home and pupils catch up on work in a solid environment rather than trying to do it at home where they might not have peace, space, equipment or might be corralled into other things.
    I suspect that overestimates how much space there is in the average state school. The gym for instance might be rather more demanded in those circs than it normally is. Like new hospitals, schools seem to have been ground down to the absolute minimum space for the current situation with little flexibility.

    Edit: for instance, where does one put the armoury for the cadet force?

    And supervising while marking ... But there is certainly a wider question of why the working day in the state school is as it is, bearing in mind the travel issue.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,425

    UKers already tried THAT gambit between 1861-65.

    Best go back to the drawing board (or is it room?) to dream yet more horseshit.
    Perhaps you're right. The incompatible sense of humour makes it unworkable.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    dixiedean said:

    Some of my kids have 4 hour plus per day travel time.
    You can't guarantee they will be fed or have a quiet, safe place to sleep, let alone study.
    Plus they all have a special needs diagnosis.
    You aren't comparing like with like.
    dixiedean said:

    Some of my kids have 4 hour plus per day travel time.
    You can't guarantee they will be fed or have a quiet, safe place to sleep, let alone study.
    Plus they all have a special needs diagnosis.
    You aren't comparing like with like.
    I accept totally that I’m not comparing like with like but it’s absolutely outrageous that kids would have a 4 hour travel to school and that needs fixing. I’m also a strong believer that the gov should pay to feed kids at school whatever the cost so if a longer school day dovetailed with all kids getting three meals a day then it’s surely a win?

    Sorry, I haven’t really thought it out but it just seems like the current model is largely accepted and there does need to be a serious experiment of changing school hours for the benefit of children and society. I clearly don’t have the answers but it seems it isn’t right as it is.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,787
    Nigelb said:

    About that rapid Polish rearmament…

    In last two days, Poland's prime minister has talked about acquiring nuclear weapons, hinted at the need for martial law, and said Poland is under equal threat from Wagner in the east and from German Christian democrats, linked to the Polish democratic opposition, in the west.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1675164589569310720

    Talking down to Poland, by Germany, for years, has proved to have been a brilliant plan.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049

    If England win this test then next weekend I'll give you a thread on AV.

    So what are you planning to give us a thread header on instead?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,425

    Talking down to Poland, by Germany, for years, has proved to have been a brilliant plan.
    There's also a lot of bad blood between Macron and Morawiecki over France's high-handed attitude towards Poland.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022

    If England win this test then next weekend I'll give you a thread on AV.

    Come on Australia! 🇦🇺
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,221
    boulay said:


    As I know absolutely nothing about being a teacher I can’t hope to know your experience but I’ve always wondered why the school day isn’t changed, with any necessary uplift in pay for teachers, to finish after 5pm for 13+ as it would have the benefit of freeing up parents to work a full day rather than having to work part time which would be good for parents, productivity and tax receipts surely.

    I'm going to guess that that "necessary uplift in pay" part is a big chunk of the reason. "We should change the way we've always done things, in a way that involves a lot more money being spent, with a theoretical and hard to measure gain" is always a hard sell...
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,389
    ydoethur said:

    So what are you planning to give us a thread header on instead?
    Scottish independence.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049
    edited July 2023
    Sandpit said:

    Come on Australia! 🇦🇺
    England winning this test would be worth a thread header on AV.

    Heck, it would be worth eating an extra-large Hawaiian with extra pineapple. While watching Carry on Columbus followed by The Last Jedi.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    Scottish independence.
    Because they won the cricket?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    Anglo-Canada would have roughly the same trade volume with the US as with the EU, together about 70% of volume. Asia Pacific economies probably another 25%.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 5,173

    Britain needs some frontier mentality to re-energise its entrepreneurial spirit.
    Britain needs to (a) stop indulging in cakeist fantasies and make a realistic assessment of what can be achieved and what we want to achieve, and (b) desist from structuring everything around the needs of wealthy people over the age of 50, to the detriment/exclusion of everyone else. After that, we'll see where we end up.
  • FffsFffs Posts: 90

    My relative who runs a construction company got complaints.

    Because he restricted the provided WiFi on site and in the office to block social media.

    No, he wasn’t grabbing people’s mobiles off them. Just if they wanted Farcebook or Twatter, it came out of the employee’s data plans…
    Does that not just come across as him being a massive cheapskate?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039

    Anglo-Canada would have roughly the same trade volume with the US as with the EU, together about 70% of volume. Asia Pacific economies probably another 25%.

    They’re going to need to check the White House fire alarms if this happens.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,641
    Sandpit said:

    Come on Australia! 🇦🇺
    Duckett Root and Stokes might get 100s!

    Could be all about differing voting systems next weekend!

  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049

    Duckett Root and Stokes might get 100s!

    Could be all about differing voting systems next weekend!

    You absolute arse.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    Root gone.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,425

    Anglo-Canada would have roughly the same trade volume with the US as with the EU, together about 70% of volume. Asia Pacific economies probably another 25%.

    In an acknowledgement of the posiiton of Quebec, we could join the Francophonie and France could join the Commonwealth in a new Entente Cordiale.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,787

    There's also a lot of bad blood between Macron and Morawiecki over France's high-handed attitude towards Poland.
    The Poles I know are the liberal bunch - they equate the current government with Putinism.

    They are united in believing that Germany and France regard Eastern Europe as something to be negotiated with Russia. As in a bargaining chip. They also believe that Poland needs to arm to the teeth, 100% back the other Eastern European nations of like mind (Baltics, Ukraine). Oh, and fuck over Germany and France in terms of foreign policy.

    The comment - “we will sell *their* interests” came up a few times.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    Anglo-Canada would have 20 of the world’s best university, behind USA with 27.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,732
    ydoethur said:

    So what are you planning to give us a thread header on instead?
    Roman pizza?

    https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/jul/01/how-i-recreated-the-pompeii-pizza-smelled-like-toffee-apples
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    pigeon said:

    Britain needs to (a) stop indulging in cakeist fantasies and make a realistic assessment of what can be achieved and what we want to achieve, and (b) desist from structuring everything around the needs of wealthy people over the age of 50, to the detriment/exclusion of everyone else. After that, we'll see where we end up.
    When the chess position looks impossible, enlarge the board.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,389
    Carnyx said:

    Because they won the cricket?
    Yes.

    Actually I've got a Scotland piece to use from a few weeks ago. I may use that tomorrow.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,871

    Yes.

    Actually I've got a Scotland piece to use from a few weeks ago. I may use that tomorrow.
    SCOTLAND CRICKET TEAM WIN INDEPENDENCE BY ALTERNATIVE VOTE METHOD

    ?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    Yes.

    Actually I've got a Scotland piece to use from a few weeks ago. I may use that tomorrow.
    Mphm!
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,641
    ydoethur said:

    You absolute arse.
    SORRY! 😡
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155
    O/T I am increasingly of an age where I notice some changes with sadness.

    Not that I have read (or was able to read) this particular newspaper but the end is nigh for traditional printed daily papers everywhere.

    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/jul/01/worlds-oldest-newspaper-prints-final-edition-after-320-years
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049

    Anglo-Canada would have 20 of the world’s best university, behind USA with 27.

    How many from Canada? Four? I would guess Toronto, BC, McGill, possibly Carleton?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049
    Harry Brook just isn't good enough for this. Drop him and recall Foakes.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    BAnZai-ball.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,787
    Fffs said:

    Does that not just come across as him being a massive cheapskate?
    He has this strange belief that he shouldn’t pay for other people’s social lives. If they want to live on Facebook, why should he provide it?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    Anglo-Canada would only be sixth largest spender of R&D globally, but would be within spitting distance of fifth (South Korea).
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    O/T I am increasingly of an age where I notice some changes with sadness.

    Not that I have read (or was able to read) this particular newspaper but the end is nigh for traditional printed daily papers everywhere.

    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/jul/01/worlds-oldest-newspaper-prints-final-edition-after-320-years

    Interesting concept, a 'national' newspaper in Vienna over 320 years ...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049

    SORRY! 😡
    Leon's the one who's going to be sorry. No cricket for him tomorrow.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    Down to requiring Stokes heroics....
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155
    Oh dear!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049
    This just makes the decision to make Lyon bat look even madder.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,109
    Time to bring back Geoff Boycott and Chris Tavare.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    Its the hope that kills you.....
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,049
    Andy_JS said:

    Time to bring back Geoff Boycott and Chris Tavare.

    Tavaré's heroics won England a Test in 1981. 147 runs across two innings, scored in about twelve hours at Manchester.

    Everyone forgets his obduracy was the reason why Botham could cut loose for 118 at the other end, knowing one end was in very safe hands. He may only have scored 28 runs in a 150 run partnership, but he was critical to that victory.
  • FffsFffs Posts: 90

    He has this strange belief that he shouldn’t pay for other people’s social lives. If they want to live on Facebook, why should he provide it?
    The marginal cost of the extra data to him will be close to zero. The opportunity cost of people being on facebook instead of working will presumably not be, but if they just switch wifi off and carry on regardless then he won't see any savings here, surely?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    edited July 2023
    Don’t worry, we at least have the Rugby World Cup to assert our sporting greatness over the Aussies.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,157

    Its the hope that kills you.....

    In which case, English cricket followers should be in excellent health.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155

    Its the hope that kills you.....

    England have as much hope of winning this as the Tories do of winning the next GE.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 5,173
    Carnyx said:

    Indeed, but on the other hand a 4 day week might actually help some folk - whether for child or oldie care or to double bank.
    Well, it's all academic: some employers are much better with flexible working than others, but even those that are very receptive to letting people work four day weeks will simply expect the working hours in each day to be 25% longer, or cut pay by 20%.

    The former gets you nowhere and the latter is only any good if you're well-enough paid to afford the luxury of trading money for time.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    ydoethur said:

    This just makes the decision to make Lyon bat look even madder.

    unlike us , aussies do not throw away runs - they added 15 by Lyons coming in - wont need them now but could have done - compare to the most ridiculous declaration in the first test by stoakes
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,389
    I am quite confident on England winning the 2023 cricket world cup.

    The Ashes, I mean who cares about that, the world cup is where the real glory is.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    boulay said:

    Don’t worry, we at least have the Rugby World Cup to assert our sporting greatness over the Aussies.

    Yes.
    But rugby union isn't even in Australia's top three forms of football.
    Nor indeed anywhere near their top kind of rugby.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155

    I am quite confident on England winning the 2023 cricket world cup.

    The Ashes, I mean who cares about that, the world cup is where the real glory is.

    I think it is pretty obvious England are going to win this series 3-2. Who could doubt it?
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,449
    boulay said:

    It doesn’t just have to be 2 hours of sport. And not all sport needs playing fields as there are potentially other sports and exercise options that don’t need the space. It could be a mix of sport, activities - art, crafts, drama, and yes, community service, cadet forces, anything but also that time could be set aside as a sort of “prep” time where pupils do what would otherwise be homework under supervision where the teacher supervising each class gets time to do marking whilst being paid rather than it being in their free time at home and pupils catch up on work in a solid environment rather than trying to do it at home where they might not have peace, space, equipment or might be corralled into other things.
    As I understand it, one of the problems with a school day ending later than 3:30 would be students having to go home in the dark for much of the winter.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    pigeon said:

    Well, it's all academic: some employers are much better with flexible working than others, but even those that are very receptive to letting people work four day weeks will simply expect the working hours in each day to be 25% longer, or cut pay by 20%.

    The former gets you nowhere and the latter is only any good if you're well-enough paid to afford the luxury of trading money for time.
    The former is actually popular with many people precisely for its economic benefit. For instance I seem to recall one of my colleagues only needing to pay for 4 instead of 5 days childcare a week. And/or 4 instead of 5 commutes (not everyone goes by a season ticket on public transport).
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    dixiedean said:

    Yes.
    But rugby union isn't even in Australia's top three forms of football.
    Nor indeed anywhere near their top kind of rugby.
    It was a joke as we are currently shit at rugby, likely to end up facing Australia if we get through the group and progress, and then face the manager we sacked. What could go wrong.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    The irony about this outburst about the 4 day week is that the civil service have been allowing staff to do flexi time and compressed hours for at least the last 20 years. It is very common across the public sector.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,274
    Picnic it is, then
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    darkage said:

    The irony about this outburst about the 4 day week is that the civil service have been allowing staff to do flexi time and compressed hours for at least the last 20 years. It is very common across the public sector.

    yes not sure it has worked with recent examples of government run services being not that efficient
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    yes not sure it has worked with recent examples of government run services being not that efficient
    Works well, if sensibly managed. It helps keep staff and the staff can work more efficiently - for instance on field work or when doing long and tricky jobs which can now be finished in one day.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 5,173

    When the chess position looks impossible, enlarge the board.
    There is no realistic possibility of the UK and Canada turning into a political federation.
  • eekeek Posts: 29,478
    darkage said:

    The irony about this outburst about the 4 day week is that the civil service have been allowing staff to do flexi time and compressed hours for at least the last 20 years. It is very common across the public sector.

    The other thing is its only the 4 day week that has allowed the council to actually recruit staff and I suspect the agency staff cost savings have been substantial.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    Carnyx said:

    Works well, if sensibly managed. It helps keep staff and the staff can work more efficiently - for instance on field work or when doing long and tricky jobs which can now be finished in one day.
    well sorry to differ but recent customer experience of services like the passport office /HMRC and border controls leave many wondering how efficient the civil service is
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,933

    We don't know that the remodel has been tasteless - we only saw pictures of Lytle's own flat, which is always going to be the most extreme expression of the decorators' tastes.
    If Sunak wanted to hit back at the clown….
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    well sorry to differ but recent customer experience of services like the passport office /HMRC and border controls leave many wondering how efficient the civil service is
    Those services were efficient until the last few years, yet the civil service has been using flexitime for over 40 years - or at least when I was doing stuident vacation work in the 1970s the organization employing me was. It's not flexitime that did the damage, but political management.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,933
    Meanwhile, after five days, the perfect weather day arrives in Norway. For some inexplicable reason the dog didn’t make it into this one.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    What I would say about Council's is that if you are good at your job and start working too fast then they let you know and ask you to slow down. However this is not just Councils. It is similar in the private sector, where you get asked to stretch out projects to earn more money for the company. In my experience there are very few work situations which are entirely driven by trying maximise productivity in any objective sense.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    boulay said:

    It was a joke as we are currently shit at rugby, likely to end up facing Australia if we get through the group and progress, and then face the manager we sacked. What could go wrong.
    Australia aren't very hot either. And their Union is close to bankrupt. And the NRL is mopping up all their juniors.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,157
    eek said:

    The other thing is its only the 4 day week that has allowed the council to actually recruit staff and I suspect the agency staff cost savings have been substantial.
    The other (slightly depressing) thought that's ocurred to me...

    I reckon Dave-in-opposition would have been all for this. Localities trying new ideas, getting better value (because if it improves staff retention and reduces the need for agency staff, it will be better value), wellbeing and so on.

    Now the Conservative government has gone back to miserable curtain-twitching. Even if it fails, even if you think it is likely to fail, it seems worth a try, especially with one of our two great universities checking what happens. The hopeless sense that, if someone is getting a better life, it can only be because they are cheating.

    Which is another way of saying that the Conservatives really need to lose the next election, because there is nothing left in the tank.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155
    edited July 2023

    well sorry to differ but recent customer experience of services like the passport office /HMRC and border controls leave many wondering how efficient the civil service is
    How can you tell? Surely you'd need to know the numbers of staff versus numbers of calls/requests etc.?

    When I recently called the Pension Service on behalf of a client to try to get his Pension Credit reduced (as it was clear to him and me that he was being paid too much) the agent we spoke to said they only have enough staff to action emergency issues - i.e. where an individual is not getting the money they are due. Overpayments and recalculations that will reduce payments just never get looked at. So payments are being made that should not be.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    ydoethur said:

    How many from Canada? Four? I would guess Toronto, BC, McGill, possibly Carleton?
    https://www.timeshighereducation.com/world-university-rankings/2023/world-ranking

    18 > U of Toronto
    40 > U of British Columbia (in Vancouver)
    46 > McGill U (in Montreal)
    85 > McMaster U (in Hamilton Ontario)
    111 > U of Montreal
    118 > U of Alberta (in Edmonton)
    137 > U of Ottawa
    201 to 250
    > U of Calgary
    > Western U (formerly Western Ontario U, in London Ontario)
    251 to 300
    > Université Laval (in Québec City)
    > Queen's U (in Kingston Ontario)
    > Simon Fraser U (in Burnaby BC)
    301 to 350
    > Dalhousie U (in Halifax Nova Scotia)
    > U of Victoria (in Vic BC)

  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,039
    dixiedean said:

    Australia aren't very hot either. And their Union is close to bankrupt. And the NRL is mopping up all their juniors.
    True but our Rugby team are going to discover “Fazball” where they just give the ball to Owen Farrell every time and he does crazy Garyowens and we get high on our own supply until it doesn’t work.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155
    edited July 2023
    darkage said:

    What I would say about Council's is that if you are good at your job and start working too fast then they let you know and ask you to slow down. However this is not just Councils. It is similar in the private sector, where you get asked to stretch out projects to earn more money for the company. In my experience there are very few work situations which are entirely driven by trying maximise productivity in any objective sense.

    Not in my experience of 40 years working in the private sector. Then again, I actually worked for the companies I worked for, not for some agency trying to fleece their customers.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,424
    ydoethur said:

    Harry Brook just isn't good enough for this. Drop him and recall Foakes.

    Bit harsh - that was a good ball, as was Popes.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,866
    One thing is for sure.
    No Canadian is going to tolerate for a second central government dictating local authorities' working arrangements.
    You can't unite the most centralised and most de-centralised polities in the Western world.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,274
    IanB2 said:

    Meanwhile, after five days, the perfect weather day arrives in Norway. For some inexplicable reason the dog didn’t make it into this one.

    Beautiful!

    Where exactly?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    edited July 2023
    Have England decided arhhh f##k it, lets play T20, we are good at that.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,155
    darkage said:

    The irony about this outburst about the 4 day week is that the civil service have been allowing staff to do flexi time and compressed hours for at least the last 20 years. It is very common across the public sector.

    Whose outburst? I missed it - been driving all day.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,904

    Have England decided arhhh f##k it, lets play T20, we are good at that.

    Follow the women and make the Ashes a mixed format so that they have a chance.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    pigeon said:

    There is no realistic possibility of the UK and Canada turning into a political federation.
    NZ and Australia are not a political federation.
    I’m suggesting something a bit like that, more integrated in some areas, less in others perhaps.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,922

    NZ and Australia are not a political federation.
    I’m suggesting something a bit like that, more integrated in some areas, less in others perhaps.
    So "separate sovereign states" then.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    I am quite confident on England winning the 2023 cricket world cup.

    The Ashes, I mean who cares about that, the world cup is where the real glory is.

    We will slaughter them in T20 this evening, and the maillot jaune is coming home to Bury. I mean, does anyone still follow men's cricket? Really?
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 10,656

    Whose outburst? I missed it - been driving all day.
    Probably mine but the outburst wasnt about compressed hours it was about south cambridgeshire which is doing a trial on staff working 80% of the time for 100% of the wage.

    My view was simple if productivity hasnt fallen then they were slacking 20% of the time if they can do the same work in 80% of the time
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,922
    Miklosvar said:

    ... does anyone still follow men's cricket? Really?

    Yes, and unfortunately they all post on PB

  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,274
    Calm down, everyone. Stokes is going to personally score 263
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    DavidL said:

    Follow the women and make the Ashes a mixed format so that they have a chance.
    IF trans athletes gave Eng the edge and the thrill of victory, WOULD this shift some opinions, on PB and beyond?
This discussion has been closed.