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Rishi should have touched on climate change – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited January 2023 in General
imageRishi should have touched on climate change – politicalbetting.com

Sunak gets a lot of coverage in the papers this morning for his first big speech of year setting out his thoughts on the main themes that no doubt will run until the general election.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • First by far.
  • Ironically, on Vanilla the header shows only the Telegraph front page which splashes Starmer's speech and does not mention the Prime Minister.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    I disagree with you. The government is constantly and noisily attacked by people claiming to be green-inclined, stating that the government is not doing enough, or even anything. The truth is they have done blooming well in decarbonising since 2010 (building on earlier good work by Labour, although early wins are always easier).

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/carbon-co2-emissions

    It has been a massive success for the UK, albeit a somewhat painful one. People who make out this government has done nothing about it are not interested in preventing a climate catastrophe, but base politics.
  • TazTaz Posts: 10,703
    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    FPT - 40 is the cut-off point. We all know that.

    And I say that as someone who's now there myself.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    DavidL said:

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    I disagree with you. The government is constantly and noisily attacked by people claiming to be green-inclined, stating that the government is not doing enough, or even anything. The truth is they have done blooming well in decarbonising since 2010 (building on earlier good work by Labour, although early wins are always easier).

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/carbon-co2-emissions

    It has been a massive success for the UK, albeit a somewhat painful one. People who make out this government has done nothing about it are not interested in preventing a climate catastrophe, but base politics.
    Agreed, this morning we are getting 42% from renewables and 21% from nuclear. It is a remarkable success that will shortly get even better as 2 of the largest offshore windfarms in the world come on line. This looked like a very expensive investment by the UK which threatened our remaining heavy energy use businesses with excessive costs but given the current price of gas we got lucky.
    although of course, we will be losing most of our nuclear in the very near future.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    He claims there was blood, he was terrified and he called his therapist. I mean, really. He comes across as such a wet lettuce.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,735
    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion
  • TazTaz Posts: 10,703
    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    But he has monetised it.
  • TazTaz Posts: 10,703

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    I disagree with you. The government is constantly and noisily attacked by people claiming to be green-inclined, stating that the government is not doing enough, or even anything. The truth is they have done blooming well in decarbonising since 2010 (building on earlier good work by Labour, although early wins are always easier).

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/carbon-co2-emissions

    It has been a massive success for the UK, albeit a somewhat painful one. People who make out this government has done nothing about it are not interested in preventing a climate catastrophe, but base politics.
    Yes we have done well and we have come a long long way but nothing will ever be enough to appease the fanatics and from the way the story is covered in the media you would think we had done nothing.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,287
    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    felix said:

    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    He claims there was blood, he was terrified and he called his therapist. I mean, really. He comes across as such a wet lettuce.
    That’s an insult to wet lettuces. Hopefully, after this week, everyone will just ignore the pair of them, and let them have the privacy they say they wanted.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    felix said:

    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    He claims there was blood, he was terrified and he called his therapist. I mean, really. He comes across as such a wet lettuce.
    I hear William also stole his Capri-Sun and said he smelled of wee as well.
  • I see the Star has another excellent front page.

    Did all the Sun's top people migrate to the Star?
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,880

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,060
    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
    The Coronation is going to be popcorn time for the people watchers.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    I disagree with you. The government is constantly and noisily attacked by people claiming to be green-inclined, stating that the government is not doing enough, or even anything. The truth is they have done blooming well in decarbonising since 2010 (building on earlier good work by Labour, although early wins are always easier).

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/carbon-co2-emissions

    It has been a massive success for the UK, albeit a somewhat painful one. People who make out this government has done nothing about it are not interested in preventing a climate catastrophe, but base politics.
    Agreed, this morning we are getting 42% from renewables and 21% from nuclear. It is a remarkable success that will shortly get even better as 2 of the largest offshore windfarms in the world come on line. This looked like a very expensive investment by the UK which threatened our remaining heavy energy use businesses with excessive costs but given the current price of gas we got lucky.
    although of course, we will be losing most of our nuclear in the very near future.
    We have commissioned Hinkley Point C and Sizewell C but both at least 10 years too late, and there's a gap for a 3rd and possibly a 4th too.

    Still, better late than never.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Sandpit said:

    felix said:

    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    He claims there was blood, he was terrified and he called his therapist. I mean, really. He comes across as such a wet lettuce.
    That’s an insult to wet lettuces. Hopefully, after this week, everyone will just ignore the pair of them, and let them have the privacy they say they wanted.
    It is all unutterably sad, if the story is true or even if it is false. Now the accusation is public, it will be even harder for the relationship between the brothers to be healed. Harry will know that; I wonder if he cares.

    I'm guessing the palace will have to respond, even if it is in a "recollections may vary" way.

    I'd also guess that this book is pretty much the end of it; all Harry's ammunition will have used. Communications between the royals and Harry will be muted and careful, as it's obvious that anything they say or do may be spun against them.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Everything costs, but money invested in renewables insulates us from energy shocks like the one that we're in now. Oh, and the 'fuel' is free forever.
    It is a global issue and it isn't one we are solving alone, just look at the stats for China's renewables and the USA's Inflation Reduction Act. We should continue to do our bit out of enlightened self interest.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
    Not as though Harry is exactly small and weak either.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,760

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    I disagree with you. The government is constantly and noisily attacked by people claiming to be green-inclined, stating that the government is not doing enough, or even anything. The truth is they have done blooming well in decarbonising since 2010 (building on earlier good work by Labour, although early wins are always easier).

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/carbon-co2-emissions

    It has been a massive success for the UK, albeit a somewhat painful one. People who make out this government has done nothing about it are not interested in preventing a climate catastrophe, but base politics.
    The only quibble I have with this post is the first sentence. You are not disagreeing with me!
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    And she isn't.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,760
    DavidL said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Between a book and TV series I am not sure that young Harry has quite mastered the premise of a private life for his family.
    Also I’ve got to say the allegation of William physically pushing him over doesn’t ring true (whereas I can believe him losing his cool and shouting - more in the “oh FFS!”’frustratedmode)
  • Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    I wonder what the difference was between the difficult, rude abrasiveness of MM and that of Philip, Duke of Slitty Eyes?
  • Of course he should have mentioned the climate. We should be investing to develop, build and export solar, wind and tidal. Building the kit, installing the lagoons and wind/solar farms here, exporting in bulk to foreign customers, and exporting surplus clean power via the interconnectors for a profit. We should be registering then subsiding companies lagging lofts, installing roof panels and heat pumps.

    But we won't do any of those things. Because paying the Chinese government a vast mark-up for nuclear power which may come on line in a decade gives us a weapon to taunt Keir Starmer with.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,009
    How about: "I will make the trains run"?
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,760

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Everything costs, but money invested in renewables insulates us from energy shocks like the one that we're in now. Oh, and the 'fuel' is free forever.
    It is a global issue and it isn't one we are solving alone, just look at the stats for China's renewables and the USA's Inflation Reduction Act. We should continue to do our bit out of enlightened self interest.
    I agree with all that. But it shouldn’t be one of 5 or 6 pledges as it doesn’t really impact on people’s day to day & the activists will complain no matter what the government does

  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Jonathan said:

    It really annoys me when people try to undermine wind power by saying we burn gas when the wind doesn’t blow. Whereas it’s genuinely remarkable that on a windy day we no longer have to burn gas.

    Yeah, it's bizarre. It surely is a good thing to burn half as much gas, even if it has to be used the other half of the time.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,760

    Of course he should have mentioned the climate. We should be investing to develop, build and export solar, wind and tidal. Building the kit, installing the lagoons and wind/solar farms here, exporting in bulk to foreign customers, and exporting surplus clean power via the interconnectors for a profit. We should be registering then subsiding companies lagging lofts, installing roof panels and heat pumps.

    But we won't do any of those things. Because paying the Chinese government a vast mark-up for nuclear power which may come on line in a decade gives us a weapon to taunt Keir Starmer with.

    Not as one of 5 pledges

  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 14,911

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    It's like nobody has ever met any Americans.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    And she isn't.
    You pals with them then, she comes across as your average bigheaded , think they are special actress. Good old William he is not a wimp after all , rahter it is the big butch soldier boy who is Mr Wimpy.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,096
    The Daily Telegraph have led with Keir Starmer, not Rishi Sunak.

    Extraordinary.
  • Of course he should have mentioned the climate. We should be investing to develop, build and export solar, wind and tidal. Building the kit, installing the lagoons and wind/solar farms here, exporting in bulk to foreign customers, and exporting surplus clean power via the interconnectors for a profit. We should be registering then subsiding companies lagging lofts, installing roof panels and heat pumps.

    But we won't do any of those things. Because paying the Chinese government a vast mark-up for nuclear power which may come on line in a decade gives us a weapon to taunt Keir Starmer with.

    Not as one of 5 pledges

    To encourage the Tory voter, they should have pledged to put boat people to work on a series of giant treadmills. They can tramp around all day to generate clean electricity, then be fed supermarket leftovers. Mealtimes supervised by the local residents association where the local Hefe screams "MORE????" at them when they complain they are hungry / dying.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    malcolmg said:

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    And she isn't.
    You pals with them then, she comes across as your average bigheaded , think they are special actress. Good old William he is not a wimp after all , rahter it is the big butch soldier boy who is Mr Wimpy.
    I think he meant, 'and she isn't 100% correct in everything she says.'

    I was thinking if she tires of the public spotlight she has a fabulous career ahead of her at OFSTED on that basis.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,096
    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
    The Coronation is going to be popcorn time for the people watchers.
    I have booked a holiday abroad and will ignore the whole thing, as I did with the Queen's funeral.

    The royal family is farcical and I don't like gawping at their entitled nonsense.

    Give me real people watching. Sitting in cafes, chatting in shops, exchanging conversations with people on walks. Real people, real lives.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,096
    In other news, the Kiwis are chugging along on Day 4 at 3 runs an over. They might yet go on to win the game but the contrast with the McCullum-Stokes revolution is so stark.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/scorecard/ECKO55719
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,287
    Heathener said:

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
    The Coronation is going to be popcorn time for the people watchers.
    I have booked a holiday abroad and will ignore the whole thing, as I did with the Queen's funeral.

    The royal family is farcical and I don't like gawping at their entitled nonsense.

    Give me real people watching. Sitting in cafes, chatting in shops, exchanging conversations with people on walks. Real people, real lives.
    You mean you don't have a subscription to Hello magazine. I'm shocked.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    I wonder what the difference was between the difficult, rude abrasiveness of MM and that of Philip, Duke of Slitty Eyes?
    I defer to the royal experts, who clearly make a close study of these matters.

    It's a relatively harmless hobby.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571
    Say what you like about Nancy Pelosi, but she actually got things done.
    This guy appears to have problems tying his own shoelaces.

    McCarthy’s political operation spent millions on lawmakers now opposing his speaker dreams
    https://www.politico.com/news/2023/01/04/mccarthy-political-action-committee-opposition-00076377
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571
    ydoethur said:

    malcolmg said:

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    And she isn't.
    You pals with them then, she comes across as your average bigheaded , think they are special actress. Good old William he is not a wimp after all , rahter it is the big butch soldier boy who is Mr Wimpy.
    I think he meant, 'and she isn't 100% correct in everything she says.'

    I was thinking if she tires of the public spotlight she has a fabulous career ahead of her at OFSTED on that basis.
    Fabulous career and OFSTED are not two things you often see linked.
  • I see the Star has another excellent front page.

    Did all the Sun's top people migrate to the Star?

    A pedant wonders if the Star has not placed the Prime Minister in place of Captain Darling, albeit with Private Baldrick's catchphrase.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    malcolmg said:

    Apparently the confrontation escalated because William called Meghan Markle “difficult, rude, and abrasive.”

    That's the way she comes across to me, even if she is 100% correct in everything she says.

    And she isn't.
    You pals with them then, she comes across as your average bigheaded , think they are special actress. Good old William he is not a wimp after all , rahter it is the big butch soldier boy who is Mr Wimpy.
    I think he meant, 'and she isn't 100% correct in everything she says.'

    I was thinking if she tires of the public spotlight she has a fabulous career ahead of her at OFSTED on that basis.
    Fabulous career and OFSTED are not two things you often see linked.
    somebody can have a personally fabulous career while being an incompetent dickhead who leaves chaos in their wake.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    edited January 2023

    I see the Star has another excellent front page.

    Did all the Sun's top people migrate to the Star?

    A pedant wonders if the Star has not placed the Prime Minister in place of Captain Darling, albeit with Private Baldrick's catchphrase.
    Melchett: 'honestly Darling, you are the most graceless, dimwitted bumpkin I ever met.'
    Darling (puzzled): 'I don't think you should say that to her, sir.'
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Its consequences, and how they are addressed, will be one of the most significant factors for the world economy over the next couple of decades.
    In some respects (reducing our own CO2 emissions), we've done fairly well.
    In others - creating new industrial infrastructure, for example - far less so.
    Electric motors, batteries, electric vehicles, power inverters etc are largely produced elsewhere, and our balance of payments will feel that for the foreseeable future.

    It's partly the attitude that sees all if this as a cost, rather than a business opportunity, which means our economy will probably continue to underperform relative to our peers.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,335
    Jonathan said:

    It really annoys me when people try to undermine wind power by saying we burn gas when the wind doesn’t blow. Whereas it’s genuinely remarkable that on a windy day we no longer have to burn gas.

    I agree, we've been benefiting from a lot if wind power lately, yet we are still paying gas price equivalent electricity. We should be storing the gas at ti.es like these, like a gas battery or something. At Milford haven we have lng gas containers and I remember we used to store gas in the North Sea Wells off Yarmouth
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571
    Nigelb said:

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Its consequences, and how they are addressed, will be one of the most significant factors for the world economy over the next couple of decades.
    In some respects (reducing our own CO2 emissions), we've done fairly well.
    In others - creating new industrial infrastructure, for example - far less so.
    Electric motors, batteries, electric vehicles, power inverters etc are largely produced elsewhere, and our balance of payments will feel that for the foreseeable future.

    It's partly the attitude that sees all if this as a cost, rather than a business opportunity, which means our economy will probably continue to underperform relative to our peers.
    Other states that grew rich on oil recognise that.

    Tesla Officially Begins Construction of Lithium Refinery in Texas
    https://www.tesmanian.com/blogs/tesmanian-blog/tesla-officially-begins-construction-of-lithium-refinery-in-texas
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    The 'pledges' are pretty risible, though.
    At least two of them will be achieved (or not), almost irrespective of what government does.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jan/05/nhs-hospital-ward-understaffed-12-hour-shifts-we-cant-even-get-basic-care-done

    Why aren't we paying nurses and ambulance staff more to deal with understaffing, regardless of the strikes? If we were running a factory we'd need to pay the salaries necessary to get staff. Leaving aside considerations of where it's best to tax, would people begrudge (say) 1p on tax to pay for adequate hospital care? Don't think so.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Nigelb said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    The 'pledges' are pretty risible, though.
    At least two of them will be achieved (or not), almost irrespective of what government does.
    Something doesn't add up here. No wonder he needs remedial maths.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,741
    Pakistan have just gone favourites for the Test.
  • Off-topic, really enjoying
    Nigelb said:

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Its consequences, and how they are addressed, will be one of the most significant factors for the world economy over the next couple of decades.
    In some respects (reducing our own CO2 emissions), we've done fairly well.
    In others - creating new industrial infrastructure, for example - far less so.
    Electric motors, batteries, electric vehicles, power inverters etc are largely produced elsewhere, and our balance of payments will feel that for the foreseeable future.

    It's partly the attitude that sees all if this as a cost, rather than a business opportunity, which means our economy will probably continue to underperform relative to our peers.
    This was the point I was making earlier. The British Disease is that we have so decried investment that every time anything big comes along the response is "how do we afford that" or "who pays for that". We borrow. We invest. We receive a Return on Investment. Even better when we invest in things we need and things we can sell.

    Instead the Spiv set who own the Tory party get very rich as middlemen selling everything off for a fat fee, and then in managing contracts from foreign owners always threatening to pull out unless subsidies are paid. Then close up shop anyway.

    Whilst we are building a load of off-shore wind, none of the kit is UK. We have demand, we have industrial know-how, we have industrial capabilities. But we don't want to invest, especially in green crap, so we buy it from someone else then shout at the people stuck in warehousing jobs that they are unproductive.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274
    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?
  • Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    I rate Starmer (vs the rest of the Tory contenders) but he remains hobbled by his ideology which paints him into a corner. His list of priorities - some of these have been around since 2010 and sod all has been done about them. The question for all of them is "how".

    They have no answers at all. The problem with setting out the things that concern people and then doing nothing about them is that voters tend to get a bit upset...
  • Palantir's Covid-era UK health contract extended without competition
    US spy-tech firm's controversial work with patient data pushed out 6 months due to delayed data platform procurement

    https://www.theregister.com/2023/01/04/palantirs_covidera_uk_health_contract/
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274

    First by far.

    By over two hours - must be some kind of record.

    I presume everyone else was absorbed by the fast-moving House Speaker vote drama.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    ydoethur said:

    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?

    How could they? None of them have ever grasped the difference.
    Cameron used to talk about “Paying off the deficit” or “Paying down the deficit”. Wrong then, and wrong now.

    He also talked about “Austerity” while increasing government spending in real terms for four years straight, so I guess politicians will say anything they think the opposition (and an innumerate media, see yesterday morning’s thread) will not properly challenge.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,080
    So I see that in the US, McCarthy made another batch of procedural concessions including proposing that in future just one member could table a vote to remove the Speaker, without success, and it's still logjammed.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jan/05/nhs-hospital-ward-understaffed-12-hour-shifts-we-cant-even-get-basic-care-done

    Why aren't we paying nurses and ambulance staff more to deal with understaffing, regardless of the strikes? If we were running a factory we'd need to pay the salaries necessary to get staff. Leaving aside considerations of where it's best to tax, would people begrudge (say) 1p on tax to pay for adequate hospital care? Don't think so.

    The current situation is madness. Sunak's 'Sack the Nurses' bill is going to help immensely, obvs.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    I rate Starmer (vs the rest of the Tory contenders) but he remains hobbled by his ideology which paints him into a corner. His list of priorities - some of these have been around since 2010 and sod all has been done about them. The question for all of them is "how".

    They have no answers at all. The problem with setting out the things that concern people and then doing nothing about them is that voters tend to get a bit upset...
    Did you mean Sunak?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,274
    ydoethur said:

    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?

    How could they? None of them have ever grasped the difference.
    Well a few of us have pointed it out on here - don't the political journos check PB out every day routinely?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571
    edited January 2023
    edit. ydoethur got there first.
  • Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    I rate Starmer (vs the rest of the Tory contenders) but he remains hobbled by his ideology which paints him into a corner. His list of priorities - some of these have been around since 2010 and sod all has been done about them. The question for all of them is "how".

    They have no answers at all. The problem with setting out the things that concern people and then doing nothing about them is that voters tend to get a bit upset...
    Did you mean Sunak?
    What a mistake-a to make-a!
  • Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    I could be wrong, but I doubt it will make much difference. People will vote on lived experience and perceptions for the future, not on data points. Sunak promised to half the rate of inflation. So what? The issue is the cost of living. He made no promises about that. He promised to legislate on small boats. And? Anyone can do that. Stopping them is what matters to the Tory voting demographic. Reducing debt. That's meaningless to most voters. It's just a number, as is GDP growth. The only one that will have a direct impact is the waiting lists - but people will still be waiting.

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    Reaction this morning to Harry's allegations that Wills lamped him is pretty positive for Wills alongside "wasn't Harry a soldier?".
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    Nigelb said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    The 'pledges' are pretty risible, though.
    At least two of them will be achieved (or not), almost irrespective of what government does.
    Oh, yes, I think the speech was entirely cynical in that sense, very much in the spirit of "I pledge that the sun will rise tomorrow". But all politicians do that sort of thing, and I think the speech shows him as a possibly effective politician for the first time. That's why it'll be interesting to see how much impact it has, or not - that will test the potential for a Tory recovery.

    In coming months, problems will appear which will make people start to say "Oh, that was all talk", so a recovery will probably slip back somewhat. But I think he can reasonably hope that the lead will initially be cut from 20+ to the 10-15 range.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    Looking at the party messaging doesn't suggest much in the way of understanding.

    Whilst Keir Starmer launches another rebrand, Conservatives are delivering on the people's priorities
    https://twitter.com/Conservatives/status/1610916510838521857

    If you've changed leaders multiple times while in office, accusing the opposition of "rebranding' is just pathetic.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009
    Heathener said:

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    Prince Harry’s book has ‘leaked’,,alleges William attacked him.

    https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1610811173124833283?s=61&t=RHCX_17J7mwCQp2YoiqWPQ

    Unsurprising even if true, such a disloyal family member.
    I have a hard time believing it. Willy Wales looks, as my mother would have said, as soft as clarts. He flinches every time his RealDoll™ Mrs speaks to him.
    The Coronation is going to be popcorn time for the people watchers.
    I have booked a holiday abroad and will ignore the whole thing, as I did with the Queen's funeral.

    The royal family is farcical and I don't like gawping at their entitled nonsense.

    Give me real people watching. Sitting in cafes, chatting in shops, exchanging conversations with people on walks. Real people, real lives.
    As a teacher you've booked a holiday abroad during term-time?

    Interesting.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,092

    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?

    Can you source this please. It is difficult to imagine that RS doesn't know the difference.
  • SandraMcSandraMc Posts: 582
    Wills rips Harry's necklace and Harry falls on top of the dog bowl. So Harry calls his therapist. Yet it is claimed that Meghan was suicidal but she was denied psychiatric help.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    IanB2 said:

    So I see that in the US, McCarthy made another batch of procedural concessions including proposing that in future just one member could table a vote to remove the Speaker, without success, and it's still logjammed.

    He needs to get out the way tbh - dead in the water before he takes office.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 9,155
    edited January 2023
    Duplicate post
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    Funeral of Pope Benedict has started in the Vatican City

    https://news.sky.com/watch-live
  • TimSTimS Posts: 9,155
    Sunak’s Tories are now in the feedback doom loop where anything he or his ministers say is pre-judged as either bad or weak, because public opinion has decided they’re for the chop.

    This is a non-fascist version of “our enemy is strong, and weak” thinking.

    Hard line and typical Tory measures like the bill on industrial action are just confirmation they’re “bad”. And nobody is prepared to allow for good faith in these ideas

    Moderately sensible or practical policy efforts - as mostly articulated in yesterdays speech - are just dismissed as weak and pathetic.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    SandraMc said:

    Wills rips Harry's necklace and Harry falls on top of the dog bowl. So Harry calls his therapist. Yet it is claimed that Meghan was suicidal but she was denied psychiatric help.

    Logical inconsistincies throughout, trashing his own brother for publicity and cash. After the coronation Charles should formally cut them both off, formally remove their HRHs and just leave it to working royals
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,009

    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?

    Yes, I was a bit confused by that. The primary deficit isn't expected to be eliminated until 2024-25 with the wider measure of the full deficit in 2027-28.

    He knows this so I can only assume he expects to beat the Autumn Statement by the end of this year and then wants to start making some token down-payments on it to impress the markets.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Wasn't Harry all "I want my brother and Dad back" a couple of days ago ? Now it's 'physical attack' in his new (In the bargain basket already) book.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,522

    Scott_xP said:

    The prime minister’s first speech of the year ended up pleasing nobody, says @ThereseRaphael1 https://trib.al/r8xkFXC via @opinion

    I think this is wrong. Sunak's speech was effective in showing that he understood what is worrying people, and that's half the battle. The first poll after the speech will be interesting and should show the scope that the Conservatives have in recovering lost ground - especially the ex-Tory "don't knows".
    I rate Starmer (vs the rest of the Tory contenders) but he remains hobbled by his ideology which paints him into a corner. His list of priorities - some of these have been around since 2010 and sod all has been done about them. The question for all of them is "how".

    They have no answers at all. The problem with setting out the things that concern people and then doing nothing about them is that voters tend to get a bit upset...
    Did you mean Sunak?
    What a mistake-a to make-a!
    Well, you knew you were going to write "they have no answers at all", so it's an easy mistake to make.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 9,155
    Splendid cartoon in todays guardian


  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    TimS said:

    Duplicate post

    If the Tories are not trusted, do you think that maybe after Johnson and Truss, they take a lot of the blame for that. It’s not irrational to take what this government says with a pinch of salt. Sunak was Johnson’s right hand man after all.

    Sunak didn’t help himself yesterday by creating pledges for things that were likely to happen regardless of anything he did.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Wasn't Harry all "I want my brother and Dad back" a couple of days ago ? Now it's 'physical attack' in his new (In the bargain basket already) book.

    Harry is all 'me, me, me'.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,735
    TimS said:

    Splendid cartoon in todays guardian


    ...
  • TimSTimS Posts: 9,155
    Jonathan said:

    TimS said:

    Duplicate post

    If the Tories are not trusted, do you think that maybe after Johnson and Truss, they take a lot of the blame for that. It’s not irrational to take what this government says with a pinch of salt. Sunak was Johnson’s right hand man after all.

    Sunak didn’t help himself yesterday by creating pledges for things that were likely to happen regardless of anything he did.
    Yes absolutely. They made their bed.

    I’m sitting back and lapping it all up with glee.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,092
    Heir goes spare on the Spare.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    TimS said:

    Splendid cartoon in todays guardian


    That *may* have been a good cartoon if innumeracy wasn't a massive problem. Governments can - and should - be able to address multiple issues at once.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,669
    Pulpstar said:

    IanB2 said:

    So I see that in the US, McCarthy made another batch of procedural concessions including proposing that in future just one member could table a vote to remove the Speaker, without success, and it's still logjammed.

    He needs to get out the way tbh - dead in the water before he takes office.
    Yes, McCarthy unlikely to get the Speakership having been voted down five times.
    My guess is a moderate Republican will eventually make it with many Democrats voting 'Present', but who knows.
    In any case much better than Biden could have expected before the midterms.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,571

    TimS said:

    Splendid cartoon in todays guardian


    That *may* have been a good cartoon if innumeracy wasn't a massive problem. Governments can - and should - be able to address multiple issues at once.
    Since there are few details on either plan, and the few regarding the maths one look bad on their face, the cartoon seems more successful than the speech.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772

    Not sure I agree, Mike

    It is clear the climate is changing and more action should be taken. But this is a global issue and not one we can solve alone.

    Moreover all action comes with a cost (and the UK is already doing a lot). I think in difficult economic times a bread and butter agenda is the right strategy

    Everything costs, but money invested in renewables insulates us from energy shocks like the one that we're in now. Oh, and the 'fuel' is free forever.
    It is a global issue and it isn't one we are solving alone, just look at the stats for China's renewables and the USA's Inflation Reduction Act. We should continue to do our bit out of enlightened self interest.
    I agree with all that. But it shouldn’t be one of 5 or 6 pledges as it doesn’t really impact on people’s day to day & the activists will complain no matter what the government does

    He talked about quite a lot that wasn't just the five pledges. In particular he talked about the future quite a lot, about making Britain the most innovative and productive economy. Ready to slip in a mention for the technology that is part of the great energy transition away from fossil fuels.

    Does make you wonder why he avoided the topic.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Good morning, everyone.

    Football: well, my Atalanta bet failed but it's come off 2/3 times for nice wins so can't be too grumpy.

    Significant result with Inter beating Napoli (admittedly, a home win, but still, defeat for the leaders of Serie A).
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,080

    Pulpstar said:

    IanB2 said:

    So I see that in the US, McCarthy made another batch of procedural concessions including proposing that in future just one member could table a vote to remove the Speaker, without success, and it's still logjammed.

    He needs to get out the way tbh - dead in the water before he takes office.
    Yes, McCarthy unlikely to get the Speakership having been voted down five times.
    My guess is a moderate Republican will eventually make it with many Democrats voting 'Present', but who knows.
    In any case much better than Biden could have expected before the midterms.
    Six times!

    There's a piece on CNN about the history of such cases - one in the 1920s otherwise all 19th Century. Most were resolved by a mix of concessions and switching to plurality voting - problem this time is that the former have all been proposed already and the latter delivers a Dem speaker! CNN reckons half of the rebels might be ready to peel away but this still leaves a hardcore of ten who can continue the blockage.
  • IanB2 said:

    So I see that in the US, McCarthy made another batch of procedural concessions including proposing that in future just one member could table a vote to remove the Speaker, without success, and it's still logjammed.

    The Boebart-Gaetz faction is all in on 'kill everyone, destroy everything' nihilism.

    Given that most of the other GOP congressmen will want to achieve something (and some will lose in 2024 if they don't) there's going to plenty of GOP internal strife, possibly bipartisanship to get some things done, followed by even more GOP internal strife.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 43,614
    edited January 2023
    SandraMc said:

    Wills rips Harry's necklace and Harry falls on top of the dog bowl. So Harry calls his therapist. Yet it is claimed that Meghan was suicidal but she was denied psychiatric help.

    Dog bowl are dangerous

    A friend was incredibly accident prone - getting a glass of water during the night, he trod on and broke the dog bowl.

    This sliced a chunk out of his foot. Hospital job. At the hospital, they asked where the missing chunk of foot was. His finance checked the kitchen - given the paw prints she reckoned it had been… er…. absorbed.

    He ended up having reconstructive surgery.

    At the wedding he got a pile of stainless steel dog bowls inscribed with the Gadsden Flag motto.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772

    Have any of the papers spotted Sunak's inability to distinguish deficit from debt yet?

    Yes, I was a bit confused by that. The primary deficit isn't expected to be eliminated until 2024-25 with the wider measure of the full deficit in 2027-28.

    He knows this so I can only assume he expects to beat the Autumn Statement by the end of this year and then wants to start making some token down-payments on it to impress the markets.
    I'm going to go out on a limb here and I think this was a ruse to try and get the media/Labour to talk about the debt/deficit.

    The country is in a bit of denial about how bad the fiscal situation is, but they're only willing to listen to Sunak/HMG in order to criticise them - so to get people to talk about the debt/deficit you have to say something to be criticised.

    It's not good for Labour if the discussion moves away from how bad public services are, on to the fact that there is even less money than in 2010 to pay for them.
This discussion has been closed.