If punters are right tomorrow’s MidTerms will good for GOP – politicalbetting.com

Driver said:

Martin10 said:

Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address

What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

kjh said:

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Do they? Genuine question. My children weren't taught that, although they have been out of school for a few years now.

Or is it a case of an unbiased view. Rather than just a hero who led us through WW2 a rounded view including his failures.

StuartDickson said:

John Curtice writes for State of the Nation:

"Diverting voters’ attention towards immigration is no longer a route to electoral success."

Why immigration is no longer a vote-winner for the Tories

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1589565874134032384?s=46&t=Vt6moVCVbLe_hnJ8feM4aA

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Stocky said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

We too have a multitude of wooden spoons.

Driver said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

Just yesterday we had someone here praising a TA for spending hours making "pronoun badges" for the staff.

MoonRabbit said:

Thought for the day. It’s good Chief Whip offers “pastoral care” to backbenchers, as well as thumb screws.

Have we heard from Oldie since he signed off for an operation?

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Cookie said:

Selebian said:

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

The four-dot ellipsis is weird, isn't it? Stands out, you'd think it would be avoided by now.

What also stands out is the sentence structure of short clauses separated by ellipses with no punctuation save for an opening capital letter. Very odd the number of new posters we get using that unusual and distinctive style.

mwadams said:

Cookie said:

Selebian said:

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

The four-dot ellipsis is weird, isn't it? Stands out, you'd think it would be avoided by now.

What also stands out is the sentence structure of short clauses separated by ellipses with no punctuation save for an opening capital letter. Very odd the number of new posters we get using that unusual and distinctive style.

Especially as the four-dot ellipsis is an atrocity that should be dealt with by an immediate and aggressive use of the ban hammer, if not the space cannon.

MoonRabbit said:

Thought for the day. It’s good Chief Whip offers “pastoral care” to backbenchers, as well as thumb screws.

Have we heard from Oldie since he signed off for an operation?

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

MoonRabbit said:

MoonRabbit said:

Martin10 said:

Russia is pioneering a new type of warfare...destroy the energy infrastructure of a non nuclear power knowing that country is powerless to strike back in their own country because of a threat of nuclear weapons use....quite clever in a twisted way

Whilst you are here SovBot, would you like to field a question on where Russia sees the Polish-Ukraine relationship these days? Do you think they really are that lovey dovey in 21st century, or the peoples still hate each other?

A secondary question if I may. In early days of Putin’s failed invasion of Ukraine in 2022, some of the early tanks crossing the border were sporting old Soviet Union flags - in your opinion why were they doing that?

Northern_Al said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

More pertinently, what's the secret? How on earth do you manage to keep your cooker so clean?

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

Chris said:

Martin10 said:

Russia is pioneering a new type of warfare...destroy the energy infrastructure of a non nuclear power knowing that country is powerless to strike back in their own country because of a threat of nuclear weapons use....quite clever in a twisted way

It seems to me that almost exactly the converse is true.

So far from the Ukrainians being powerless to strike back in their own country, they are striking back very effectively and Russia is losing the war. The Russians don't dare to use nuclear weapons, but Putin is so politically vulnerable that he feels he must retaliate, so he hits high-profile civilian targets, which will have little effect on the Ukrainian war effort and won't even kill large numbers of civilians. But evidently Putin hopes it will save enough of his face for him to survive.

williamglenn said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Stocky said:

kjh said:

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Do they? Genuine question. My children weren't taught that, although they have been out of school for a few years now.

Or is it a case of an unbiased view. Rather than just a hero who led us through WW2 a rounded view including his failures.

It's not schools - at least not mainly - it's social media. My daughters are massively influenced by it and when an issue comes up in conversation I have to gently pick apart their views with logic. Not sure it does any good.

Yes this is my experience. The "extreme woke" positions that are undoubtedly popular among the young are self and peer motivated, rather than coming from schools.
And isn't this how it's always been? The younger generation take up views that their parents find incomprehensible, and eventually the received wisdom inches forwards in the direction of the young's views, while the young's own views mellow as they gain experience? Hence today's baby boomers rail against the "wokeness" of the young while holding views themselves that their own grandparents would find bafflingly liberal.

If this were how it has always been then social trends would only ever go in one direction, which is not the case.

Anabobazina said:

mwadams said:

Cookie said:

Selebian said:

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

The four-dot ellipsis is weird, isn't it? Stands out, you'd think it would be avoided by now.

What also stands out is the sentence structure of short clauses separated by ellipses with no punctuation save for an opening capital letter. Very odd the number of new posters we get using that unusual and distinctive style.

Especially as the four-dot ellipsis is an atrocity that should be dealt with by an immediate and aggressive use of the ban hammer, if not the space cannon.

Agreed. Added.

• Heavy lifting
• Colour me …
• IANAE/IANAL
• Feature, not a bug
• Ad hom
• This
• It’s a view
• North of
• As I’ve said passim
• One of those irregular verbs
• Late of this parish
• Nail. Head.
• Unspoofable
• …. (four dot ellipsis)

Taz said:

Yesterday Ed Miliband, on behalf of labour, told us we should be paying climate ‘reparations’. Now it looks like the Tories are happy to sign up to this too.

At a time of oncoming austerity, tax rises and declining living standards where Will this come from ? I cannot see this being anything other than electoral poison.

https://digitaleditions.telegraph.co.uk/data/1149/reader/reader.html?#!preferred/0/package/1149/pub/1149/page/2/article/NaN

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

So does hanging up the pan...

Was not the point being discussed.

TimS said:

Chris said:

Martin10 said:

Russia is pioneering a new type of warfare...destroy the energy infrastructure of a non nuclear power knowing that country is powerless to strike back in their own country because of a threat of nuclear weapons use....quite clever in a twisted way

It seems to me that almost exactly the converse is true.

So far from the Ukrainians being powerless to strike back in their own country, they are striking back very effectively and Russia is losing the war. The Russians don't dare to use nuclear weapons, but Putin is so politically vulnerable that he feels he must retaliate, so he hits high-profile civilian targets, which will have little effect on the Ukrainian war effort and won't even kill large numbers of civilians. But evidently Putin hopes it will save enough of his face for him to survive.

I prefer DJ41. He/she is much more sophisticated.

MoonRabbit said:

Martin10 said:

Russia is pioneering a new type of warfare...destroy the energy infrastructure of a non nuclear power knowing that country is powerless to strike back in their own country because of a threat of nuclear weapons use....quite clever in a twisted way

Whilst you are here SovBot, would you like to field a question on where Russia sees the Polish-Ukraine relationship these days? Do you think they really are that lovey dovey in 21st century, or the peoples still hate each other?

Selebian said:

Anabobazina said:

mwadams said:

Cookie said:

Selebian said:

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

The four-dot ellipsis is weird, isn't it? Stands out, you'd think it would be avoided by now.

What also stands out is the sentence structure of short clauses separated by ellipses with no punctuation save for an opening capital letter. Very odd the number of new posters we get using that unusual and distinctive style.

Especially as the four-dot ellipsis is an atrocity that should be dealt with by an immediate and aggressive use of the ban hammer, if not the space cannon.

Agreed. Added.

• Heavy lifting
• Colour me …
• IANAE/IANAL
• Feature, not a bug
• Ad hom
• This
• It’s a view
• North of
• As I’ve said passim
• One of those irregular verbs
• Late of this parish
• Nail. Head.
• Unspoofable
• …. (four dot ellipsis)

That's 'This' as a complete comment? We are still allowed, under your proposals, to use 'this' within a sentence, such as this one?

TOPPING said:

Driver said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

So does hanging up the pan...

Was not the point being discussed.

That depends on what the meaning of the word "for" is.

The hole is designed for hanging up the pan, but can also be used for putting a wooden spoon in.

The discussion was @Cookie's dilemma of putting the spoon in the pan itself.

OnlyLivingBoy said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

williamglenn said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Stocky said:

kjh said:

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Do they? Genuine question. My children weren't taught that, although they have been out of school for a few years now.

Or is it a case of an unbiased view. Rather than just a hero who led us through WW2 a rounded view including his failures.

It's not schools - at least not mainly - it's social media. My daughters are massively influenced by it and when an issue comes up in conversation I have to gently pick apart their views with logic. Not sure it does any good.

Yes this is my experience. The "extreme woke" positions that are undoubtedly popular among the young are self and peer motivated, rather than coming from schools.
And isn't this how it's always been? The younger generation take up views that their parents find incomprehensible, and eventually the received wisdom inches forwards in the direction of the young's views, while the young's own views mellow as they gain experience? Hence today's baby boomers rail against the "wokeness" of the young while holding views themselves that their own grandparents would find bafflingly liberal.

If this were how it has always been then social trends would only ever go in one direction, which is not the case.

I'm not making any claims about this as a universal phenomenon but on most social questions (eg racial and sexual equality, sexual identity) the trend in this country has been fairly monotonic since the turn of the last century at least, hasn't it?

No, that's survivor bias.

Evolution provides both good and bad mutations. The bad ones tend to wither and die, the good ones survive. Over time if you look at what's changed you see the good mutations that made it, you don't see all the bad ones that withered and fell by the wayside.

Societal evolution follows the same process.

It's great that racial equality, women's liberation and gay rights have happened since the turn of the last century.

But the less said about failed then-"progressive" ideas like PIE or eugenics, the better.

Until hindsight it's not possible to know if new ideas are this generations women's liberation, or eugenics.

I agree with you, I don't think what I said and what you said are inconsistent. I'm sure there is a mixture of good and bad in the "woke" views of the young. Some of it seems a bit loopy to me, but then I am approaching 50.

Pagan2 said:

TOPPING said:

Driver said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

So does hanging up the pan...

Was not the point being discussed.

That depends on what the meaning of the word "for" is.

The hole is designed for hanging up the pan, but can also be used for putting a wooden spoon in.

The discussion was @Cookie's dilemma of putting the spoon in the pan itself.

for @Cookie this is what I use
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Angoily-Stainless-Silicone-Flexible-Accessories/dp/B09LHWMD3F/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=spoon+holder+for+pot&qid=1667821384&sprefix=spoon+holder,aps,100&sr=8-5

OnlyLivingBoy said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

williamglenn said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Stocky said:

kjh said:

Martin10 said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

True the schools bombard kids with woke propaganda...most now think churchill is a bad man...people have a right to be angry about this....

Do they? Genuine question. My children weren't taught that, although they have been out of school for a few years now.

Or is it a case of an unbiased view. Rather than just a hero who led us through WW2 a rounded view including his failures.

It's not schools - at least not mainly - it's social media. My daughters are massively influenced by it and when an issue comes up in conversation I have to gently pick apart their views with logic. Not sure it does any good.

Yes this is my experience. The "extreme woke" positions that are undoubtedly popular among the young are self and peer motivated, rather than coming from schools.
And isn't this how it's always been? The younger generation take up views that their parents find incomprehensible, and eventually the received wisdom inches forwards in the direction of the young's views, while the young's own views mellow as they gain experience? Hence today's baby boomers rail against the "wokeness" of the young while holding views themselves that their own grandparents would find bafflingly liberal.

If this were how it has always been then social trends would only ever go in one direction, which is not the case.

I'm not making any claims about this as a universal phenomenon but on most social questions (eg racial and sexual equality, sexual identity) the trend in this country has been fairly monotonic since the turn of the last century at least, hasn't it?

No, that's survivor bias.

Evolution provides both good and bad mutations. The bad ones tend to wither and die, the good ones survive. Over time if you look at what's changed you see the good mutations that made it, you don't see all the bad ones that withered and fell by the wayside.

Societal evolution follows the same process.

It's great that racial equality, women's liberation and gay rights have happened since the turn of the last century.

But the less said about failed then-"progressive" ideas like PIE or eugenics, the better.

Until hindsight it's not possible to know if new ideas are this generations women's liberation, or eugenics.

I agree with you, I don't think what I said and what you said are inconsistent. I'm sure there is a mixture of good and bad in the "woke" views of the young. Some of it seems a bit loopy to me, but then I am approaching 50.

Driver said:

Pagan2 said:

TOPPING said:

Driver said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

So does hanging up the pan...

Was not the point being discussed.

That depends on what the meaning of the word "for" is.

The hole is designed for hanging up the pan, but can also be used for putting a wooden spoon in.

The discussion was @Cookie's dilemma of putting the spoon in the pan itself.

for @Cookie this is what I use
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Angoily-Stainless-Silicone-Flexible-Accessories/dp/B09LHWMD3F/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=spoon+holder+for+pot&qid=1667821384&sprefix=spoon+holder,aps,100&sr=8-5

I use a bit of kitchen towel...

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

Selebian said:

Martin10 said:

StillWaters said:

Martin10 said:

Stereodog said:

Is it only me who thinks Desantis would be more of a disaster for America and the world than Trump? Trump was worryingly erratic and his rhetoric could be dangerous but at heart he was Democrat who was too disorganised to properly mount a coup or even get Obamacare repealed. Desantis has all of the dangerous MAGA beliefs with the additional worries that he actually believes them and is smart enough to carry them out.

If Trump gets in he will be more ruthless and extreme this time no doubt...the MAGA crowd are much angrier now

This whole trying to generate strife and division thing is very tedious. It
doesn’t work and, even if it did, this site doesn’t matter in the scheme of
things

(With apologies to @rcs1000 )

Someones having a bad day...im making a statement of fact....maybe you find the chaotic modern world too much for you....

The four-dot ellipsis is weird, isn't it? Stands out, you'd think it would be avoided by now.

Pagan2 said:

Driver said:

Pagan2 said:

TOPPING said:

Driver said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

turbotubbs said:

TOPPING said:

Cookie said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Cookie said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

kjh said:

pm215 said:

Endillion said:

No_Offence_Alan said:

A lesson for the Tories here, who think "wokeness" outweighs the economy?

No-one on the Tory side thinks that. We think Labour activists think that, and therefore it's good tactics to get them talking about it, so voters think Labour think " "wokeness" outweighs the economy".

If that's the strategy, I'm not sure the execution is up to par, because mainly the people I notice banging on about 'woke' are the right...

I think it is a mix of both in a way.

a) It is only the right that is fixated by woke.
b) However if the right do bang on about an almost non existent issue the non-political may well think it is an issue and think the left are bonkers for being so woke, when in fact they aren't. It is a common practice for all side to play. Make your opponents seem like ideological nutters.

I think if the Tories stick to the specific issues in this space that voters care about (eg the Albanian armada) then they will be fine. If they keep banging on about things that most people don't care about then they will be punished because voters have a long list of things they want politicians to fix for them and will think it is ridiculous for them to be wasting time on marginal issues.
What I find weird is that so many people on the right seem to confuse left wing nutters on Twitter with the Labour Party. Some loons staking out extreme woke positions doesn't mean that most left of centre people sign up to the same views.

It's not just some nutters on twitter though. If you ever interact with an educational establishment, or the arts, or a museum, or pretty much any sphere of public life, you will be bombarded by the woke's views on matters of race, gender and the environment in the same way that more pious regimes will bombard you with the tenets of their particular faith, or that communist Eastern Europe would bombard you with the tenets of international socialism.

I've got three kids at school and frequently go to museums and the only things I've ever encountered are fairly mainstream views, eg racism and slavery = bad. But I'm going on a primary school trip to a museum tomorrow and will report back if I am offered gender reassignment therapy or a seminar on critical race theory while we're there!

I have never come across anything "woke" in real life, or any issues through schools etc.

My kids school is great, my only frustration recently is that we were asked at very short notice to bring in wooden spoons this morning for a project they're making today for Remembrance. I didn't have any wooden spoons in, and all the local shops were cleared out of them too due to a mad panic of other parents also trying to source the same thing at the same time. Eventually found some, but a bit more notice next time would be convenient.

Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

What? You don't have any wooden spoons? Other parents don't have wooden spoons? Surely everyone who has a kitchen has at least two? I have at least 6. Mysteriously, only one of them has a handle of what I consider a satisfactory length i.e. one where the spoon end can nestle where the base of the pan meets the rim and the handle can balance on the opposite rim, for the large frying pan.
This is, I concede, one of the more minor issues which has been tackled on these boards. But I am still surprised by your lifestyle decision.

Ever wondered what that hole was for?

Hanging up the pan. Don't fall for fake 'I never knew that' memes on Facebook.

But it works. Just tried it with a range of pans/saucepans.

So does hanging up the pan...

Was not the point being discussed.

That depends on what the meaning of the word "for" is.

The hole is designed for hanging up the pan, but can also be used for putting a wooden spoon in.

The discussion was @Cookie's dilemma of putting the spoon in the pan itself.

for @Cookie this is what I use
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Angoily-Stainless-Silicone-Flexible-Accessories/dp/B09LHWMD3F/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=spoon+holder+for+pot&qid=1667821384&sprefix=spoon+holder,aps,100&sr=8-5

I use a bit of kitchen towel...

Will you not think of the environement !!!!

Eabhal said:

StillWaters said:

I see that Stop Oil have closed the M25 by scaling gantries.

Assuming they are of sound mind, why do we close the motorway? We don’t close it if there is someone on a bridge.

If they fall off, that’s at their own risk, and we deal with it then. If they drop something off we prosecute them. There’s not a meaningful risk to the drivers of cars.

I'm not sure you'd survive a 70kg body falling through your windscreen at 80mph.

Source: Wrote a minibus off hitting a deer near Ullapool.