We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
And results here of an experiment looking to see what messages and material various types of US voter get steered to online. Sure enough, on the MAGA Right it's dreadful.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
The "people" who use the St Petersburg Ellipsis aren't worth engaging with. They're not "Russian-sympathetic posters" (that's people like Luckyguy and Dura), they're Putin's weapons.
Yes - they might well be trying to sow dissent and get us to question our motives.
And we ban them.
Perhaps - thinking aloud - if it turns out that a particular server was known to host directly-mandated Putin psyops and PB was a known repository of it then that would have not great implications for the site.
The west is slowly waking up to the dangers of the Russian disinformation strategy. Russia has limited resources yet chooses to spend huge amounts paying people to try to sow division and hatred in other countries by means of social media. One assumes that Putin believes it is money well spent.
The height of his ambition appears to be to drag the west down to the same bleak and miserable level most Russians endure. Where we know someone to be one of his agents we would be stupid not to stop them. As others have pointed out that in no way prevents pro-Russian views being aired and debated.
You remind me of those naive souls dancing around on the roof in Mars Attack (I think, ) waving welcome signs to the aliens. Two seconds later the aliens blasted them to kingdom come.
What exactly have I written that strikes you as naive?
Not banning bot written, person edited posts. There's no discussion to be had.
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
Two more thoughts on all-mail voting, since it seems to disturb some of you: First, I oppose it because ballots are not necessarily secret with postal votes. (Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the UK sometimes has problems for that very reason. ) When I was keeping track of vote fraud cases -- and they are now rarer than when I began in 2000 -- the fraudsters almost always used postal ballots. In fact, I was surprised when I learned that the chronic vote fraud in eastern Kentucky did not rely on postal ballots; The men offering the bribes were willing to assume the voters would keep their end of the deal.)
Second, because the bases of the two major parties are so different, it is almost impossible to think of a change in voting rules that does not benefit one party, For example, since felons are far more likely to be Democrats, the Democratic Party often favors allowing them to vote. Or, since members of the armed services are more likely to be Republican, the Democratic Party has not always made it easy for them to vote from overseas.
Democratic leaders often believe that their voters are less likely to vote than Republican voters, and so Democratic leaders often favor all-mail ballots because they think that makes it easier for their marginal voters.
With regards to ex-cons, I'm not sure that's entirely true.
In Florida, it had been assumed that the change to voting (to allow those with discharged convictions to vote) would benefit the Dems, but surveys showed that it was actually a small net benefit to the Republicans.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
And results here of an experiment looking to see what messages and material various types of US voter get steered to online. Sure enough, on the MAGA Right it's dreadful.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
Driver asked: "That system has always struck me as absurd - how long do they wait for USPS to deliver?"
Here's the Washington state law: "Ten days after a special election held in February or April, ten days after a presidential primary held pursuant to chapter 29A.56 RCW, fourteen days after a primary, or twenty-one days after a general election, the county canvassing board shall complete the canvass and certify the results. Each ballot that was returned before 8:00 p.m. on the day of the special election, general election, primary, or presidential primary, and each ballot bearing a postmark on or before the date of the special election, general election, primary, or presidential primary and received no later than the day before certification, must be included in the canvass report." source: https://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=29a.60.190
Because the counties begin counting on election night, the results for most Washington elections are known by the next day, and nearly all within a week.
For the record: I prefer in-person voting, for all who are capable of it -- but recognize that any Republican candidate who proposed going back to it here would be accused of "vote suppression".)
Three weeks? Utterly insane.
Get your postal votes in by close of poll. Declare within 24 hours. We manage it here.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
Hate is Trumps game. He *needs* the haters - the more red faced and screaming the better for him.
The old saw about mud wrestling with a pig comes to mind.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
Why can't your good self and others wear the mantle of being our own "out there" posters, without also facilitating trolls who are not engaging in arguments?
Without naming names we have enough of our own pigheaded people who are unwilling to back down from positions even when they have nowhere else to turn and aren't convinced that they're wrong even when they pointedly are - without importing more paid trolls from abroad to supplement their number.
This is what Martin wrote earlier:
"But the ukrainians cant strike back in russia whilst the russians can destroy ukraines energy infrastructure at will leading to a miserable and freezing winter for many ukrainians. It is possible by january zelensky becones very unpopular"
Pretty out there pro-Russian. Why doesn't PB just point out calmly why Russians can't destroy Ukraine's energy infrastructure and why Ukrainians won't freeze and why Zelensky won't become very unpopular.
Let's imagine the guy is a salaried Russian psyops operative. All of a sudden he is far smarter than the collective brains of PB? Why not take the argument apart and have this guy question his own position.
Or is he very, very stupid. In which case see above.
Or we don't even want to give those pro-Russian views airtime. I do get that. PB doesn't need balance. But I for one am very interested in what those views are.
Or PB moderators don't want to get the site sidetracked into arguing with Russian propaganda. At some point noise just drowns out discussion.
Your "why not" is a strawman - several posters did just that.
You can have a different view of where the mods should draw the line, but that's just your view along with everyone else's. I don't think you can reasonably argue that they shouldn't be drawing that line.
Moderation is a difficult job and anybody doing it has my sympathies. Yes, it is an important and valuable part of moderation of stopping the site being sidetracked into arguing with Russian propaganda. I think it is unfortunate that propaganda from other sources sometimes sidetracks us, particularly some quasi-racist and Islamophobic nonsense, and some other Trumpist conspiracy theories.
I've set out the rules for being a PB poster in the past, and they have not changed.
This is not a highly moderated site, with a team continually assessing peoples' posts. This is not my day job, or OGH's day job or TSE's day job, or any one of the volunteers who help keep this site going.
Mostly we let you lot get on with it. But this is supposed to be a place where people come and discuss things, and do so for pleasure. It shouldn't be a place where the conversation is dominated by people who are paid to post, and who are not who they pretend to be.
The ban hammer is not swung lightly. If we determine you are paid to post, and you are unresponsive to email, and you tediously repeat the same Kremlin talking points (vaccines, trans, etc.), then - yes - you will face expulsion.
The go-to reference for a culture in which dissenters were usually condemned as agents of foreign powers must surely be the USSR at the time of the big show trials under Stalin. Joseph McCarthy came later.
Those who were wondering whether or not they should dissent were keenly aware that as soon as they did so, that would be what they were accused of - as would anybody who sprang to their defence. When you heard your neighbour's door being kicked in, the idea was just to shut up and watch your step, because next time it might be you. And of course the culture of informing burgeoned.
One of the most intelligent views I have ever seen expressed on the Moscow show trials was the one held by British anarchist Albert Meltzer. His view was that the accused in the big trials were probably guilty. He may have been right, he may have been wrong, but he certainly wasn't a Stalinist of any kind, as anybody who knows about his personal history will be aware.
He also had a very interesting opinion about the Provisional IRA.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Russian battle mage Mikhail Vasiliev, who is known for advising Russian mothers to give birth to more children so that they would not be so afraid to send their sons to war, died in the war in Ukraine on November 6, 2022. P.S: hope his mother has multiple children https://twitter.com/bayraktar_1love/status/1589615504116748289
Perhaps God will send a son, as a replacement.
Not sure His message would be what Mikhail would want to hear, though.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
Hate is Trumps game. He *needs* the haters - the more red faced and screaming the better for him.
The old saw about mud wrestling with a pig comes to mind.
Oppose him. Effectively.
You can hate Trump/MAGA in a calm controlled manner. That's the optimum combination.
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
The Earth is flat. Convince me otherwise.
Can you point on a map where the boundaries of the flat Earth lie? And then explain how world trade navigates those boundaries?
The boundaries are at the edges, obviously. And you may notice the atlases of your so-called 'oblate spheroid' hypothesis are also flat. You mucked up there, didn't you? And ships navigate the way you would on the roads in a city - on a flat plane. Again, obvious.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
The Earth is flat. Convince me otherwise.
Can you point on a map where the boundaries of the flat Earth lie? And then explain how world trade navigates those boundaries?
The boundaries are at the edges, obviously. And you may notice the atlases of your so-called 'oblate spheroid' hypothesis are also flat. You mucked up there, didn't you? And ships navigate the way you would on the roads in a city - on a flat plane. Again, obvious.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
We never get the Russian viewpoint
We get “aren’t the woke/WWC/gays/whoever dreadful we should fight them.
It’s all about division, never anything interesting
Exactly. Russian trollbots are paid to sow discord. They will happily take opposing sides of any current hot button topic if it serves their interests to do so. Winding up everyone involved & eliminating any possibility of finding common ground is the goal. If they can do that then they win.
BLM, trans issues, immigration, class divides, regional divides: it really doesn’t matter what the topic is. If they can use it as a tool to drive wedges into the polity then that’s what they’ll do.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
It's perfectly rational to fear all of that if Donald Trump gets back to the WH with a MAGA controlled Congress and State Legislatures, plus a stacked Judiciary.
Farage heading to the US to cheer on the GOP ahead of the midterms tomorrow. He is also attending Trump's expected announcement of his 2024 candidacy later this week
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
At least part of it is. Trump has been pretty open about wanting rules changed so his supporters can toss out election results he doesn't like. He believes the VP should have done it last time (and despite not agreeing that VP will probably back Trump when he wins nomination)
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
(One thing that may have changed in recent decades: Men and women in the US now have widely divergent voting patterns. The last time he were about the same in presidential elections was 1976. Since felons are far more likely to be men, I would not be surprised to see that they are less Democratic than they were back then. But, as I assume you know, in the US felons are very disproportionately poor blacks and Hispanics, two groups not known for their allegiance to the GOP, so I would be very skeptical of any such studies.)
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
We never get the Russian viewpoint
We get “aren’t the woke/WWC/gays/whoever dreadful we should fight them.
It’s all about division, never anything interesting
Exactly. Russian trollbots are paid to sow discord. They will happily take opposing sides of any current hot button topic if it serves their interests to do so. Winding up everyone involved & eliminating any possibility of finding common ground is the goal. If they can do that then they win.
BLM, trans issues, immigration, class divides, regional divides: it really doesn’t matter what the topic is. If they can use it as a tool to drive wedges into the polity then that’s what they’ll do.
Add eco to your list. "Extinction" is as nuthouse an idea as letting everyone choose their own gender.
"Green" functioned successfully in more or less getting rid of the class-oriented left in Europe too, though.
So let's not put home-market strategic psywar experts poles apart from Russian trollbots.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
We never get the Russian viewpoint
We get “aren’t the woke/WWC/gays/whoever dreadful we should fight them.
It’s all about division, never anything interesting
Exactly. Russian trollbots are paid to sow discord. They will happily take opposing sides of any current hot button topic if it serves their interests to do so. Winding up everyone involved & eliminating any possibility of finding common ground is the goal. If they can do that then they win.
BLM, trans issues, immigration, class divides, regional divides: it really doesn’t matter what the topic is. If they can use it as a tool to drive wedges into the polity then that’s what they’ll do.
"Perhaps women need to conquer obesity so men will work harder to win the prize."
HYFUD said: "Farage heading to the US to cheer on the GOP ahead of the midterms tomorrow. He is also attending Trump's expected announcement of his 2024 candidacy later this week."
More evidence that the US needs tighter border controls.
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
You are even funnier.
Someone being involved in geopolitics decades ago, even if correct, is not guaranteed to be correct now. Kissinger is 99 and there's no reason to suppose he has the knowledge or insight on modern Ukraine.
Indeed, people can be so caught it in what the case was when they were in power that they cannot see things are not the same. Regurgitating tropes from the 60s and 70s is a big red flag someone is intellectually past it.
Its not realism to declare certain states are not permitted to be free. It shows his analysis ignores masses of relevant factors because it goes against his beliefs, and because he's not up to date.
And I'm one who has suggested things might end with Ukraine ceding Crimea for example, I'm not automatically dismissive of 'realists'.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Trump leads some 2024 polls v Biden and Harris anyway now.
However it would need Trump supporters in both the governors mansion and state legislature majorities in most states and Trumpite majority in both Chambers of Congress to make a difference and overturn the EC result if he loses it again
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
You can be clever and be a dick.
There's more to it than that: no-one is knowledgeable in every field; nobody is 'clever' in every way. Musk may (or may not) be 'clever in running engineering businesses; that does not necessarily mean he has the skills required to run a social media company. Or a boring company, for that matter. Or a Hyperloop company. etc, etc.
We really need to get away from this idea that just because someone is successful in one field, they will automagically be successful in another.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Trump has explicitly sought the first 2 of those.
There's a slate od election denying, January 6th attending GOP candidayes up for election.
More GOP candidates deny Biden won the election than confirm he did.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Perhaps so. But we don't try.
It's probably not even a full person, it's more likely 10% of a person's work time editing bot generated responses to sound kind of human.
The issue I have is that whoever the person is they are not here to debate. No attempt to engage properly in discussion. Now there are others like that here too, but these are different. They are here to gain a foothold and then start pushing the same tired narrative that Ukraine can't win and should negotiate. In the end there will be negotiations, but I hope its when the Russians have withdrawn from their illegal invasion.
Isn’t that the MAGA position too? Very soon half the US government could want “peace talks” and in just over two years, all the US government too?
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
At least part of it is. Trump has been pretty open about wanting rules changed so his supporters can toss out election results he doesn't like. He believes the VP should have done it last time (and despite not agreeing that VP will probably back Trump when he wins nomination)
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
Quite possibly, not much more than the average person now, given his age and how long he's been out of the loop.
Also remember his time was 50 years ago. His views still seem to reflect the power block mentalities of that time, rather than the different geopolitical realities that have emerged since.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
At least part of it is. Trump has been pretty open about wanting rules changed so his supporters can toss out election results he doesn't like. He believes the VP should have done it last time (and despite not agreeing that VP will probably back Trump when he wins nomination)
Trump literally tried to have Pence lynched.
And he still dare not speak that openly against Trump. Shows it all.
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
You can be clever and be a dick.
There's more to it than that: no-one is knowledgeable in every field; nobody is 'clever' in every way. Musk may (or may not) be 'clever in running engineering businesses; that does not necessarily mean he has the skills required to run a social media company. Or a boring company, for that matter. Or a Hyperloop company. etc, etc.
We really need to get away from this idea that just because someone is successful in one field, they will automagically be successful in another.
You took a pithy statement and Sir Humphrey Appleby-ed it.
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
You are even funnier.
Someone being involved in geopolitics decades ago, even if correct, is not guaranteed to be correct now. Kissinger is 99 and there's no reason to suppose he has the knowledge or insight on modern Ukraine.
Indeed, people can be so caught it in what the case was when they were in power that they cannot see things are not the same. Regurgitating tropes from the 60s and 70s is a big red flag someone is intellectually past it.
Its not realism to declare certain states are not permitted to be free. It shows his analysis ignores masses of relevant factors because it goes against his beliefs, and because he's not up to date.
And I'm one who has suggested things might end with Ukraine ceding Crimea for example, I'm not automatically dismissive of 'realists'.
On geopolitics, Roosevelt, Stalin and Churchill knew a lot more than us or anyone alive today I bet about such matters, so we should apply their logic and suggestions to the modern world.
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
You can be clever and be a dick.
There's more to it than that: no-one is knowledgeable in every field; nobody is 'clever' in every way. Musk may (or may not) be 'clever in running engineering businesses; that does not necessarily mean he has the skills required to run a social media company. Or a boring company, for that matter. Or a Hyperloop company. etc, etc.
We really need to get away from this idea that just because someone is successful in one field, they will automagically be successful in another.
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
You can be clever and be a dick.
There's more to it than that: no-one is knowledgeable in every field; nobody is 'clever' in every way. Musk may (or may not) be 'clever in running engineering businesses; that does not necessarily mean he has the skills required to run a social media company. Or a boring company, for that matter. Or a Hyperloop company. etc, etc.
We really need to get away from this idea that just because someone is successful in one field, they will automagically be successful in another.
Isn't that how cabinet ministers are appointed?
Cabinet ministers have not normally been successful in any field.
I see Musk has gone from "Comedy is legal now" to "Perm ban for anyone changing their name to Elon Musk" inside a week.
Exactly as predicted.
I don’t see how Musk + Twitter are sustainable. I don’t see how Musk is different from a 14 year old boy, for that matter. Thinks he’s very clever, but isn’t. After the Paul Pelosi thing, he’s now had to delete a post where he approved of a quote from a neo-Nazi. He is the loosest of loose cannons.
He has many faults, but Musk is clearly very clever.
He may be clever on some limited specific topics. He’s clearly not clever in a general sense of the word. Owning Twitter and repeatedly supporting far right tweets and then having to delete his posts where he did that is not clever.
And it involves upfront ad sales. Let me explain...
6/ @elonmusk has had months to address these concerns or even learn about them. But instead, he's insisted on antagonizing the very businesses and people that sustain Twitter.
Back in May, the groups and companies weren't calling for a boycott, they were asking basic questions...
On geopolitics, Roosevelt, Stalin and Churchill knew a lot more than us or anyone alive today I bet about such matters, so we should apply their logic and suggestions to the modern world.
Churchill's a good example because by the 1950s he had some distinctly weird ideas on geopolitics - ending the Cold War through conferences chaired by Britain, for example - that clearly grew out of a much earlier time and didn't reflect the reality that Britain was a second rank power.
Much the same attitude continued to infect Eden, with much more unfortunate consequences.
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
You are even funnier.
Someone being involved in geopolitics decades ago, even if correct, is not guaranteed to be correct now. Kissinger is 99 and there's no reason to suppose he has the knowledge or insight on modern Ukraine.
Indeed, people can be so caught it in what the case was when they were in power that they cannot see things are not the same. Regurgitating tropes from the 60s and 70s is a big red flag someone is intellectually past it.
Its not realism to declare certain states are not permitted to be free. It shows his analysis ignores masses of relevant factors because it goes against his beliefs, and because he's not up to date.
And I'm one who has suggested things might end with Ukraine ceding Crimea for example, I'm not automatically dismissive of 'realists'.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
The Earth is flat. Convince me otherwise.
The topography of a turtle’s back is such that a sphere sits better
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
We never get the Russian viewpoint
We get “aren’t the woke/WWC/gays/whoever dreadful we should fight them.
It’s all about division, never anything interesting
Exactly. Russian trollbots are paid to sow discord. They will happily take opposing sides of any current hot button topic if it serves their interests to do so. Winding up everyone involved & eliminating any possibility of finding common ground is the goal. If they can do that then they win.
BLM, trans issues, immigration, class divides, regional divides: it really doesn’t matter what the topic is. If they can use it as a tool to drive wedges into the polity then that’s what they’ll do.
Add eco to your list. "Extinction" is as nuthouse an idea as letting everyone choose their own gender.
"Green" functioned successfully in more or less getting rid of the class-oriented left in Europe too, though.
So let's not put home-market strategic psywar experts poles apart from Russian trollbots.
You're getting a little less subtle, but I do think we are getting much more personal-flavoured interesting content from you than most of the others.
What would be genuinely fascinating would be an inside view on the role of a trollbot. A day in the life - how micro-managed is the job or are you given freedom to go where you wish within a framework? Is there a hierarchy? I get the sense there is, some input being more obviously labour intensive and other more bot-like. Are there rules of engagement? One I generally see is that the troll doesn't ever directly respond to other posters casting aspersions on the poster's identity. Are there sacred cows and views you're not allowed to express, e.g. a positive attitude on LGBTQ issues or eagerness for decarbonisation? Are there multiple competing agencies or organisations? How much is centralised vs outsourced to the private sector.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
The Earth is flat. Convince me otherwise.
The topography of a turtle’s back is such that a sphere sits better
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Perhaps so. But we don't try.
It's probably not even a full person, it's more likely 10% of a person's work time editing bot generated responses to sound kind of human.
The issue I have is that whoever the person is they are not here to debate. No attempt to engage properly in discussion. Now there are others like that here too, but these are different. They are here to gain a foothold and then start pushing the same tired narrative that Ukraine can't win and should negotiate. In the end there will be negotiations, but I hope its when the Russians have withdrawn from their illegal invasion.
Isn’t that the MAGA position too? Very soon half the US government could want “peace talks” and in just over two years, all the US government too?
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
Some senior Republicans including Senator Romney and the Cheneys are still very anti Putin. Indeed in 2012 Romney was tougher on Putin than Obama.
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
Indeed. It seems Sunak is going to make the same mistake Johnson made time and time again: standing by someone after a first allegation, only for - shock! horror! - more similar allegations to pile up. I would be very surprised if we don't see a bunch more very specific stories and more screenshots. When people exhibit a pattern of behaviour there's almost always more.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Perhaps so. But we don't try.
It's probably not even a full person, it's more likely 10% of a person's work time editing bot generated responses to sound kind of human.
The issue I have is that whoever the person is they are not here to debate. No attempt to engage properly in discussion. Now there are others like that here too, but these are different. They are here to gain a foothold and then start pushing the same tired narrative that Ukraine can't win and should negotiate. In the end there will be negotiations, but I hope its when the Russians have withdrawn from their illegal invasion.
Isn’t that the MAGA position too? Very soon half the US government could want “peace talks” and in just over two years, all the US government too?
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
Some senior Republicans including Senator Romney and the Cheneys are still very anti Putin. Indeed in 2012 Romney was tougher on Putin than Obama...
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
While that would normally be a fair point, I think it's incredibly optimistic to assume the bunch of drug addled QAnon spouting nutters loosely known as the Republicans will be curbed merely by sharing power.
Heck, their excesses aren't even noticeably curbed by reality.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Perhaps so. But we don't try.
It's probably not even a full person, it's more likely 10% of a person's work time editing bot generated responses to sound kind of human.
The issue I have is that whoever the person is they are not here to debate. No attempt to engage properly in discussion. Now there are others like that here too, but these are different. They are here to gain a foothold and then start pushing the same tired narrative that Ukraine can't win and should negotiate. In the end there will be negotiations, but I hope its when the Russians have withdrawn from their illegal invasion.
Isn’t that the MAGA position too? Very soon half the US government could want “peace talks” and in just over two years, all the US government too?
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
Some senior Republicans including Senator Romney and the Cheneys are still very anti Putin. Indeed in 2012 Romney was tougher on Putin than Obama.
Yes, I don't know how much Biden can push without Congress, but if I were Zekensky I'd not be as confident about the amounts of army surplus I'd be getting in future. Lots of very short term thinking.
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Trump leads some 2024 polls v Biden and Harris anyway now.
However it would need Trump supporters in both the governors mansion and state legislature majorities in most states and Trumpite majority in both Chambers of Congress to make a difference and overturn the EC result if he loses it again
Would it? It could be down to just one or two States. And if they fix the election in those states what can either chamber of congress do about it. We already have targeted voter suppression.
1. Russian-sympathetic poster arrives posting content which seeks to undermine "The West's" orthodox view on eg the Ukraine war, but also democracy, the US, Jaffa Cakes, etc 2. Everyone says "you are a Russian-sympathetic poster posting content which seeks to undermine...etc 3. Russian-sympathetic poster says what about freedom of speech, etc while continuing to seek to undermine...etc 4. Russian-sympathetic poster is banned because everyone is focused on him and therefore the accusation of troll become self-fulfilling.
A real shame imo because if they are a Russian-sympathetic poster then why not engage. Let's hear the Russian-sympathetic view. We are just sticking our fingers in our ears and shouting la la la. It's a shame, especially so on PB of all places.
He/She/(they but I doubt it) wasn't wrong when they said on certain topics PB is like an echo-chamber with no dissenting voices allowed.
On what serious topic do you think no dissenting voices are allowed on?
The Ukraine war.
Edit: but it changes. Lockdown when they were happening, for example; vaccines, etc
How the heck do you make out that dissenting voices on Ukraine are 'not allowed' ? Your good self and Dura_Ace have been at the forefront of giving sane, alternative views (and thankfully your negativism has, IMO, been proven wrong so far).
But that does not mean that you won't have your views questioned strongly by others - as well see on all sorts of topics.
I don't think our "sane, alternative views" (tyvm) have been anything to do with who should win. Just that I for example have counselled against war by twitter report (sozza @Nigelb but that classic look at the Russians getting a shellacking which turned out to be video game footage being a case in point).
But for the shall we say "out there" posters, of which Martin was the most recent, what is wrong with picking apart every point they put forward so they have nowhere else to turn and indeed we convince them of our position.
It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Perhaps so. But we don't try.
It's probably not even a full person, it's more likely 10% of a person's work time editing bot generated responses to sound kind of human.
The issue I have is that whoever the person is they are not here to debate. No attempt to engage properly in discussion. Now there are others like that here too, but these are different. They are here to gain a foothold and then start pushing the same tired narrative that Ukraine can't win and should negotiate. In the end there will be negotiations, but I hope its when the Russians have withdrawn from their illegal invasion.
Isn’t that the MAGA position too? Very soon half the US government could want “peace talks” and in just over two years, all the US government too?
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
Some senior Republicans including Senator Romney and the Cheneys are still very anti Putin. Indeed in 2012 Romney was tougher on Putin than Obama.
We are talking “some” though arn’t we. Like me you suspect MAGA will be cold on ‘Biden’s largesse to Ukraine” when they win these coming elections?
It could be from an idealogical point of view, or that their Glorious Orange skinned leader loves Putin so they take a cue from that, or it could be it’s a Biden Position so I am not that.
Trump was in 4 years whilst Putin held parts of Ukraine that will now be taken back with US support, before the conflict stops. Provided Trump and his army stay the course. You saying you think they will?
“How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?” Going back to my question, in general away from the war there’s a lot they do share? Anti woke? Anti EU? Anti Net Zero?
I see climate "reparations" is now the leading article on both The Times and The Telegraph and the comments section is going absolutely ballistic over it.
Unite has just announced it will ask its 100,000 NHS workers whether they want to strike - it is on top of potential strikes of more that 300,000 RCN nurses, plus other unions (GMB's 15k ambulance workers etc). NHS situation looking more and more dire everyday
What has been very noticeable in recent days is that the casualty rates of Russia have gone up enormously from under 200 to over 700 a day on average. That is because, despite their difficult logistical problems, they have been trying to attack in several areas and not just sitting on defense. Much of this has been disastrous as this story tells: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/11/6/2134063/-Ukraine-Update-Russian-naval-infantry-decimated-at-Pavlivka-in-stunning-defeat Relying on Russian sources it speaks to a unit being thrown into battle with inadequate support and losing a very significant proportion of their strength.
Why are they doing this? I would suggest a few reasons. (1) they very much hope that the end is in sight because there is a real risk that a republican dominated congress will cut off the $2bn a month that is keeping Ukraine alive. (2) At the worst they hope that Ukraine will be pressured into negotiations and they want as much ground in their possession for those negotiations as possible. (3) They know that they can only maintain the current intensity of fighting for a short period so they are willing to gamble that it to be now. (4) As their equipment becomes ever more dilapidated the odds against them on the battlefield only increase. (5) they cannot afford another humiliation like they got in the retreat from Kharkiv.
Some of these are just variations on a theme but the central thrust is that they are hanging on and hoping that the US drawing back will give them some sort of a chance.
I see climate "reparations" is now the leading article on both The Times and The Telegraph and the comments section is going absolutely ballistic over it.
Front page of mail this morning too. Any idea which way Sunak and his government swings on this yet? Considering PM Truss would have ruled it out by now?
We face a hellish situation after tomorrow, States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos.
Every time I think Trump is a nutter with no grasp on reality, the haters show they are worse.
There's no respectable position on Trump other than "hater".
Opponent.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
I think to hate him and what he's done IS rational.
"States changing their election rules ensuring Trump is elected. Then what leading Democrats arrested on trumped up charges, moves to a one party state, martial law and world chaos" isn't.
Trump leads some 2024 polls v Biden and Harris anyway now.
However it would need Trump supporters in both the governors mansion and state legislature majorities in most states and Trumpite majority in both Chambers of Congress to make a difference and overturn the EC result if he loses it again
Would it? It could be down to just one or two States. And if they fix the election in those states what can either chamber of congress do about it. We already have targeted voter suppression.
Congress has to affirm the EC results and can object to state results if they consider them inaccurate
Indeed. It seems Sunak is going to make the same mistake Johnson made time and time again: standing by someone after a first allegation, only for - shock! horror! - more similar allegations to pile up. I would be very surprised if we don't see a bunch more very specific stories and more screenshots. When people exhibit a pattern of behaviour there's almost always more.
Is it that, when Chief Whips have a book of stuff, the done thing is only to use it for whipping - only a right cad dines out on the knowledge for own self interest long after being a whip?
"Kent, an ex-Green Beret, eliminated incumbent six-term Republican Rep. Jaime Herrera Beutler in Washington’s top-two August primary. [Marie] Gluesenkamp Perez finished first with 31 percent of the vote, while Kent nosed out Herrera Beutler for the second spot on the November ballot. He was boosted by an endorsement from Trump and a fundraiser held at the ex-president’s Mar a Lago Florida estate. Herrera Beutler was one of 10 Republican House members who voted to impeach Trump after the January 6, 2021 insurrection at the U.S. Capitol.
Gluesenkamp Perez is benefiting from the Republicans’ summer fratricide. She trails by only three points, while the same poll found the GOP’s Tiffany Smiley leads Democratic Sen. Patty Murray by a 53-42 percent margin in the 3rd District. Public Policy Polling contacted 834 likely voters on Sept. 19 and 20, half of them by land line and the remainder online through text messages. The firm has Democratic roots but made its marks with accurate predictions of the “shellackings” (President Obama’s word) endured by Democrats in the 2010 and 2014 mid-term elections. Its polling in this state pegged Sen. Maria Cantwell’s winning margin in 2018, and two years later Washington voters’ surprisingly robust support for mandatory sex education in public schools. It revealed weakness of state schools superintendent Chris Reykdal in time for Democrats to rescue his reelection." source: https://www.postalley.org/2022/09/21/surprise-new-poll-tight-race-for-southwest-washingtons-3rd-congressional-district/
One thing that favors Kent: The district is across the Columbia River from Portland, Oregon, and would get much of its TV news from that city. The continuing disorder in Portland is not a big vote winner for Democrats, especially in traditionally Republican areas.
Did anyone tell @ydoethur that Gov DeSantis was a fellow history teacher ? Though "history" might be more accurate.
Pranks, Parties and Politics: Ron DeSantis’s Year as a Schoolteacher At a private school 20 years ago, the future Florida governor was a popular history teacher and coach. But some students were taken aback by his comments on the Civil War and abortion. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/05/us/desantis-high-school-teacher-georgia.html
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
Unite has just announced it will ask its 100,000 NHS workers whether they want to strike - it is on top of potential strikes of more that 300,000 RCN nurses, plus other unions (GMB's 15k ambulance workers etc). NHS situation looking more and more dire everyday
If Truss was our PM she would certainly make clear, rather than gathering together to greet the storm, this is unions siding with Putin, to hurt the most vulnerable and at need in our country. Will Sunak make this clear at PMQs?
Zelensky has said 4.5 million households in Ukraine now without power in nightly address
What are your bosses trying to achieve by doing that?
Its getting cold in ukraine now...not nice to be without power....reason why people like kissinger are calling for negotiations
Kissinger from before the war started stated Ukraine should be recognised to be part of Russia's 'sphere of influence', ie they are not allowed to make their own choices and should do what Russia talks them.
To be ignored.
You are funny. Henry Kissinger - what does he know about geopolitical realism and international relations, eh?
In the 2020s? Very little that's for sure.
He's a link to a time that has been and gone, parroting tropes that may have been relevant when he was half a century ago, but aren't anymore.
The world has moved on even if he hasn't and at 99 almost certainly never will.
Unite has just announced it will ask its 100,000 NHS workers whether they want to strike - it is on top of potential strikes of more that 300,000 RCN nurses, plus other unions (GMB's 15k ambulance workers etc). NHS situation looking more and more dire everyday
Two more thoughts on all-mail voting, since it seems to disturb some of you: First, I oppose it because ballots are not necessarily secret with postal votes. (Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the UK sometimes has problems for that very reason. ) When I was keeping track of vote fraud cases -- and they are now rarer than when I began in 2000 -- the fraudsters almost always used postal ballots. In fact, I was surprised when I learned that the chronic vote fraud in eastern Kentucky did not rely on postal ballots; The men offering the bribes were willing to assume the voters would keep their end of the deal.)
Second, because the bases of the two major parties are so different, it is almost impossible to think of a change in voting rules that does not benefit one party, For example, since felons are far more likely to be Democrats, the Democratic Party often favors allowing them to vote. Or, since members of the armed services are more likely to be Republican, the Democratic Party has not always made it easy for them to vote from overseas.
Democratic leaders often believe that their voters are less likely to vote than Republican voters, and so Democratic leaders often favor all-mail ballots because they think that makes it easier for their marginal voters.
"since felons are far more likely to be Democrats"
Was proven to NOT be the case in WA State 2004 contested governor's race.
As the legal eagles for Republican hopeful Dino Rossi learned to the hard way. They kept on repeating it as though it was gospel . . . despite fact that NONE of the felon votes disallowed by the court and subtracted from the count were cast for the eventual Democratic winner Christine Gregoire.
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
"My sister lives in Knightsbridge now and when I go to visit her I buzz three times on the intercom and say Lulu, it's your solicitor I once walked in and caught her sitting naked on top of Henry Kissinger Take my word or take this Polaroid picture"
(I would link to the video, but it's not safe for work...)
"My sister lives in Knightsbridge now and when I go to visit her I buzz three times on the intercom and say Lulu, it's your solicitor I once walked in and caught her sitting naked on top of Henry Kissinger Take my word or take this Polaroid picture"
(I would link to the video, but it's not safe for work...)
And Monty Python, too, of course:
Henry Kissinger How I'm missing yer You're the Doctor of my dreams With your crinkly hair and your glassy stare And your machiavellian schemes I know they say that you are very vain And short and fat and pushy but at least you're not insane
Comments
Can't believe nobody overnight came up with Natalie Imbruglia's infamous cover either.
In Florida, it had been assumed that the change to voting (to allow those with discharged convictions to vote) would benefit the Dems, but surveys showed that it was actually a small net benefit to the Republicans.
Hatred risks irrationality, eg in the comment I replied to.
Get your postal votes in by close of poll. Declare within 24 hours. We manage it here.
I then received a mouthful of abuse for doing something so stupid.
We will continue to use a spoon rest.
The old saw about mud wrestling with a pig comes to mind.
Oppose him. Effectively.
I've set out the rules for being a PB poster in the past, and they have not changed.
This is not a highly moderated site, with a team continually assessing peoples' posts. This is not my day job, or OGH's day job or TSE's day job, or any one of the volunteers who help keep this site going.
Mostly we let you lot get on with it. But this is supposed to be a place where people come and discuss things, and do so for pleasure. It shouldn't be a place where the conversation is dominated by people who are paid to post, and who are not who they pretend to be.
The ban hammer is not swung lightly. If we determine you are paid to post, and you are unresponsive to email, and you tediously repeat the same Kremlin talking points (vaccines, trans, etc.), then - yes - you will face expulsion.
I don't think that's unreasonable.
Those who were wondering whether or not they should dissent were keenly aware that as soon as they did so, that would be what they were accused of - as would anybody who sprang to their defence. When you heard your neighbour's door being kicked in, the idea was just to shut up and watch your step, because next time it might be you. And of course the culture of informing burgeoned.
One of the most intelligent views I have ever seen expressed on the Moscow show trials was the one held by British anarchist Albert Meltzer. His view was that the accused in the big trials were probably guilty. He may have been right, he may have been wrong, but he certainly wasn't a Stalinist of any kind, as anybody who knows about his personal history will be aware.
He also had a very interesting opinion about the Provisional IRA.
Now there was a guy who could think for himself.
Not sure His message would be what Mikhail would want to hear, though.
To be ignored.
BLM, trans issues, immigration, class divides, regional divides: it really doesn’t matter what the topic is. If they can use it as a tool to drive wedges into the polity then that’s what they’ll do.
https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/1589630499655659521?s=20&t=Rwqp5x7q9YCl1BH2qp9pCg
Do you have any links to those Florida studies?
(One thing that may have changed in recent decades: Men and women in the US now have widely divergent voting patterns. The last time he were about the same in presidential elections was 1976. Since felons are far more likely to be men, I would not be surprised to see that they are less Democratic than they were back then. But, as I assume you know, in the US felons are very disproportionately poor blacks and Hispanics, two groups not known for their allegiance to the GOP, so I would be very skeptical of any such studies.)
"Green" functioned successfully in more or less getting rid of the class-oriented left in Europe too, though.
So let's not put home-market strategic psywar experts poles apart from Russian trollbots.
This one stood out for me the other day.
More evidence that the US needs tighter border controls.
Someone being involved in geopolitics decades ago, even if correct, is not guaranteed to be correct now. Kissinger is 99 and there's no reason to suppose he has the knowledge or insight on modern Ukraine.
Indeed, people can be so caught it in what the case was when they were in power that they cannot see things are not the same. Regurgitating tropes from the 60s and 70s is a big red flag someone is intellectually past it.
Its not realism to declare certain states are not permitted to be free. It shows his analysis ignores masses of relevant factors because it goes against his beliefs, and because he's not up to date.
And I'm one who has suggested things might end with Ukraine ceding Crimea for example, I'm not automatically dismissive of 'realists'.
But ossified opinions aren't realism.
https://twitter.com/IAPolls2022/status/1588579174276820992?s=20&t=Rwqp5x7q9YCl1BH2qp9pCg
However it would need Trump supporters in both the governors mansion and state legislature majorities in most states and Trumpite majority in both Chambers of Congress to make a difference and overturn the EC result if he loses it again
We really need to get away from this idea that just because someone is successful in one field, they will automagically be successful in another.
More GOP candidates deny Biden won the election than confirm he did.
How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?
Come to think of it, Trump was a bit frosty toward Ukraine first time round. 😟
Also remember his time was 50 years ago. His views still seem to reflect the power block mentalities of that time, rather than the different geopolitical realities that have emerged since.
Discuss.
Bismarck another one to follow uncritically.
https://twitter.com/GoAngelo/status/1588696157794242560
1/ There is some pretty substantial context about Twitter's 2023 revenue and advertisers that I think partly help explains why Musk is really losing it...
And it involves upfront ad sales. Let me explain...
6/
@elonmusk has had months to address these concerns or even learn about them. But instead, he's insisted on antagonizing the very businesses and people that sustain Twitter.
Back in May, the groups and companies weren't calling for a boycott, they were asking basic questions...
Much the same attitude continued to infect Eden, with much more unfortunate consequences.
What would be genuinely fascinating would be an inside view on the role of a trollbot. A day in the life - how micro-managed is the job or are you given freedom to go where you wish within a framework? Is there a hierarchy? I get the sense there is, some input being more obviously labour intensive and other more bot-like. Are there rules of engagement? One I generally see is that the troll doesn't ever directly respond to other posters casting aspersions on the poster's identity. Are there sacred cows and views you're not allowed to express, e.g. a positive attitude on LGBTQ issues or eagerness for decarbonisation? Are there multiple competing agencies or organisations? How much is centralised vs outsourced to the private sector.
It is objectively a very interesting industry.
https://twitter.com/estwebber/status/1589637104992419842
While some leftwing Democrats including AOC in Congress have been pushing for peace talks as much as Trumpites
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2022/10/25/biden-left-wingers-ukraine-peace-plan-branded-olive-branch-putin/
Shared power curbs the worst excesses of both parties, therefore I recommend voting for a Republican Congress, given that the Presidency is Democratic.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589639376186724354
Heck, their excesses aren't even noticeably curbed by reality.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1588676939463946241
Thank you.
A thermonuclear name & shame is exactly what will happen if this continues.
It could be from an idealogical point of view, or that their Glorious Orange skinned leader loves Putin so they take a cue from that, or it could be it’s a Biden Position so I am not that.
Trump was in 4 years whilst Putin held parts of Ukraine that will now be taken back with US support, before the conflict stops. Provided Trump and his army stay the course. You saying you think they will?
“How to spot the difference between SovBots and MAGA bots, are there key differences?”
Going back to my question, in general away from the war there’s a lot they do share? Anti woke? Anti EU? Anti Net Zero?
https://twitter.com/soph_husk/status/1589644208062615552
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/11/6/2134063/-Ukraine-Update-Russian-naval-infantry-decimated-at-Pavlivka-in-stunning-defeat
Relying on Russian sources it speaks to a unit being thrown into battle with inadequate support and losing a very significant proportion of their strength.
Why are they doing this? I would suggest a few reasons.
(1) they very much hope that the end is in sight because there is a real risk that a republican dominated congress will cut off the $2bn a month that is keeping Ukraine alive.
(2) At the worst they hope that Ukraine will be pressured into negotiations and they want as much ground in their possession for those negotiations as possible.
(3) They know that they can only maintain the current intensity of fighting for a short period so they are willing to gamble that it to be now.
(4) As their equipment becomes ever more dilapidated the odds against them on the battlefield only increase.
(5) they cannot afford another humiliation like they got in the retreat from Kharkiv.
Some of these are just variations on a theme but the central thrust is that they are hanging on and hoping that the US drawing back will give them some sort of a chance.
Any idea which way Sunak and his government swings on this yet? Considering PM Truss would have ruled it out by now?
*short punchy post alert*
There's a word for that, isn't there?
"Kent, an ex-Green Beret, eliminated incumbent six-term Republican Rep. Jaime Herrera Beutler in Washington’s top-two August primary. [Marie] Gluesenkamp Perez finished first with 31 percent of the vote, while Kent nosed out Herrera Beutler for the second spot on the November ballot. He was boosted by an endorsement from Trump and a fundraiser held at the ex-president’s Mar a Lago Florida estate. Herrera Beutler was one of 10 Republican House members who voted to impeach Trump after the January 6, 2021 insurrection at the U.S. Capitol.
Gluesenkamp Perez is benefiting from the Republicans’ summer fratricide. She trails by only three points, while the same poll found the GOP’s Tiffany Smiley leads Democratic Sen. Patty Murray by a 53-42 percent margin in the 3rd District. Public Policy Polling contacted 834 likely voters on Sept. 19 and 20, half of them by land line and the remainder online through text messages. The firm has Democratic roots but made its marks with accurate predictions of the “shellackings” (President Obama’s word) endured by Democrats in the 2010 and 2014 mid-term elections. Its polling in this state pegged Sen. Maria Cantwell’s winning margin in 2018, and two years later Washington voters’ surprisingly robust support for mandatory sex education in public schools. It revealed weakness of state schools superintendent Chris Reykdal in time for Democrats to rescue his reelection."
source: https://www.postalley.org/2022/09/21/surprise-new-poll-tight-race-for-southwest-washingtons-3rd-congressional-district/
One thing that favors Kent: The district is across the Columbia River from Portland, Oregon, and would get much of its TV news from that city. The continuing disorder in Portland is not a big vote winner for Democrats, especially in traditionally Republican areas.
Though "history" might be more accurate.
Pranks, Parties and Politics: Ron DeSantis’s Year as a Schoolteacher
At a private school 20 years ago, the future Florida governor was a popular history teacher and coach. But some students were taken aback by his comments on the Civil War and abortion.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/05/us/desantis-high-school-teacher-georgia.html
He's a link to a time that has been and gone, parroting tropes that may have been relevant when he was half a century ago, but aren't anymore.
The world has moved on even if he hasn't and at 99 almost certainly never will.
Was proven to NOT be the case in WA State 2004 contested governor's race.
As the legal eagles for Republican hopeful Dino Rossi learned to the hard way. They kept on repeating it as though it was gospel . . . despite fact that NONE of the felon votes disallowed by the court and subtracted from the count were cast for the eventual Democratic winner Christine Gregoire.
Couldn't happen to a nicer shit hole of a website.
"My sister lives in Knightsbridge now and when I go to visit her
I buzz three times on the intercom and say Lulu, it's your solicitor
I once walked in and caught her sitting naked on top of Henry Kissinger
Take my word or take this Polaroid picture"
(I would link to the video, but it's not safe for work...)
Henry Kissinger
How I'm missing yer
You're the Doctor of my dreams
With your crinkly hair and your glassy stare
And your machiavellian schemes
I know they say that you are very vain
And short and fat and pushy but at least you're not insane