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Has Campbell got this right – Hunt’s now PM in all but name – politicalbetting.com

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  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    darkage said:

    Does anyone think the triple lock on pensions will be in the scope of the 'difficult decisions' cited by Hunt?
    No chance . There’s always money for the Tories core vote . Everyone else can just feed off the scraps !
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,689
    Maybe those lads in the Black Shorts strutting around Leicester are going to take over from the Tories as the right of centre party?

    What's their policy on Stamp Duty?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,551
    darkage said:

    Does anyone think the triple lock on pensions will be inside the scope of the 'difficult decisions' cited by Hunt?
    Me sir, pick me sir, I know the answer...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,068
    Andy_JS said:

    It's only a question of time before Farage decides to take over the leadership of the Reform Party again. The current leader is failing to make any impression whatsoever. And when he does their support in the polls will probably rise almost automatically from around 5% to around 10%.
    Perhaps but who the Tory leader is will determine if they rise any further than that
  • Re: some people here thinking that if Hunt tries to stand unopposed, that someone like Kemi/Braverman would challenge them now.

    Both Kemi/Braverman have age on their side. If you're them, you might even want 2024 to be a defeat - but not the wipeout that is currently predicted.

    If the next few years see a movement for rejoin, that persuades Starmer to go for SM membership or similar, there's a very easy narrative for a Kemi type to spin. "Betrayal!!" etc etc - and a much more winnable 2029 than 2024 ever would be.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,068

    You will never win from the right just as Corbyn demonstrated from the left

    The country is utterly weary of the hard right and left, and you will soon be a dinosaur
    Thatcher won from the right, Attlee won from the left, as did Wilson and Corbyn got very close to it in 2017 too.

    The centre does not always win every general election
  • nico679 said:

    No chance . There’s always money for the Tories core vote . Everyone else can just feed off the scraps !
    The correct decision would be a compromise for pensions and benefits
  • Re: some people here thinking that if Hunt tries to stand unopposed, that someone like Kemi/Braverman would challenge them now.

    Both Kemi/Braverman have age on their side. If you're them, you might even want 2024 to be a defeat - but not the wipeout that is currently predicted.

    If the next few years see a movement for rejoin, that persuades Starmer to go for SM membership or similar, there's a very easy narrative for a Kemi type to spin. "Betrayal!!" etc etc - and a much more winnable 2029 than 2024 ever would be.

    It can only be a coronation as going out to the membership is out of the question
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,295
    EPG said:

    They should get real, the necessary 45% corporation tax rate or 50-something% tax on workers they hate would crucify the economy. Indefinite borrowing and cheap energy are over.
    Bit confusing from the unions: if they don't like Hunt's approach, does that mean they were happier with the Truss/Kwarteng policy/policies?
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    HYUFD said:

    Thatcher won from the right, Attlee won from the left, as did Wilson and Corbyn got very close to it in 2017 too.

    The centre does not always win every general election
    As a purely historical matter rather than a debating point, Attlee had been in charge of domestic policy for a half-decade before he became PM, and his cabinet included the left but was not dominated by it. He also had a bunch of rows with the real left, and ended up expelling almost half a dozen anti-Nato MPs who would have been predecessors to Corbyn's sympathies.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398

    Re: some people here thinking that if Hunt tries to stand unopposed, that someone like Kemi/Braverman would challenge them now.

    Both Kemi/Braverman have age on their side. If you're them, you might even want 2024 to be a defeat - but not the wipeout that is currently predicted.

    If the next few years see a movement for rejoin, that persuades Starmer to go for SM membership or similar, there's a very easy narrative for a Kemi type to spin. "Betrayal!!" etc etc - and a much more winnable 2029 than 2024 ever would be.

    I think they would always go for it if an opportunity comes up. But I also think they will be more cautious after seeing what happened to Truss and her agenda.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    Andy_JS said:

    Bit confusing from the unions: if they don't like Hunt's approach, does that mean they were happier with the Truss/Kwarteng policy/policies?
    I'd say yes, because it was more likely to end with two ok outcomes for them: random taxes imposed on investors by Labour to make up the deficit, or devaluation of the pound that would have hurt the export sector more than public services. A more balanced Conservative budget will probably be harder to change for Labour in future, so yes, I'd prefer Kwarteng's budget as a union boss even if I didn't admit it.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,068
    EPG said:

    I'd say yes, because it was more likely to end with two ok outcomes for them: random taxes imposed on investors by Labour to make up the deficit, or devaluation of the pound that would have hurt the export sector more than public services. A more balanced Conservative budget will probably be harder to change for Labour in future, so yes, I'd prefer Kwarteng's budget as a union boss even if I didn't admit it.
    A lower £ should boost exports as they are cheaper, it is companies which import a lot that are hit with more expensive supplies
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,073
    edited October 2022
    maxh said:

    This is very annoying, because I kind of half agree with your point about the energy price guarantee, but if I admit that then you'll tell me you're 1000% winning the argument or something similar. :smile:

    So, as I'm the sober one here, I'll attempt a compronise...
    - The fundamentals in the economy are a lot less 'fundamental' than you are arguing. Yeah, we are borrowing too much. But an astute politician could have presented something like the energy price guarantee with lots of reassuring noises and 'look over here' distraction tactics to sustain market confidence (e.g. an OBR forecast that suggested a reassuring medium-term picture). Perhaps the market reassurance would only have been for a period of time, but still.
    - It took political idiocy to try to get markets to take the strain of another big spending commitment (the energy price guarantee) whilst also refusing to do any of the reassuring noises or distraction tactics - in fact to do the opposite of simultaneously throwing any appearance of fiscal responsibility to the winds.
    - I agree it is possible that the energy price guarantee would have been the straw that breaks the camel's back regardless of the political window-dressing, but looking at e.g. debt-to-GDP ratios of major economies, it is very hard to argue that this moment, right now, is the moment when the UK's spending commitments become unaffordable.
    - And what happened after the budget was in no way simply a polling crash. Mortgage rates are the biggest real impact, but the pension funds are close behind.

    Hmm...not sure that compromise will satisfy you, and I'm off to bed (I know, I know, it's before 9pm. That's my life with a two-year old and a pregnant wife) but this has been fun. Thanks.
    Oh. There you were after all @maxh I must have had the Pringles in the way when you posted. 🫤

    Line by line.
    “The fundamentals in the economy are a lot less 'fundamental' than you are arguing. But an astute politician could have” Nope. When you are maxed out on card, when you get the basket to the till the card process says UhUh! No amount of sweet talking can change the fundamentals of “no. You can’t afford it.”

    “It took political idiocy to try to get markets to take the strain of another big spending commitment (the energy price guarantee) whilst also refusing to do any of the reassuring noises or distraction tactics - in fact to do the opposite of simultaneously throwing any appearance of fiscal responsibility to the winds.” All true. But the fundamentals fact is, whatever Starmer or Truss would have tried the answer would still have been no. Quarter of trillion in basket, credit worthiness a lot less than that, off goes the klaxons wobbly go the markets. If an OBR would have said you can’t put that in the basket and take it to the till, but you so want to play with the new credit card you’ve inherited with all your pirate liberterian ideas and create lovely growth growth growth becuase you are oh so clever - then you won’t even bother to engage an OBR to be told otherwise will you?

    “the energy price guarantee would have been straw that breaks the camel's back regardless of the window-dressing, but looking at debt-to-GDP ratios of major economies, it is hard to argue that right now is the moment when the UK's spending commitments become unaffordable.”
    It’s a good question what our limit is. Some say 98.6% of GDP isn’t great, because we keep throwing more money at public services through borrowing, and high taxation, a sounder footing would be no more unless it’s funded by growth, yet what’s the Japan GDP % 200%+?
    Certainly we can’t get away with what USA can get away with, so shouldn’t be thinking we can merely copy them. I guess it’s a far bigger equation, how good are your assets, how exposed are you to coming commitments like a demographic time bomb. In which instance all countries will be in a different place. Or perhaps you could always borrow some money in, just that the bigger risk you are, the more maxxed out you are, the more basket case you are, the bigger the rates you have to pay back, which is sort of what’s happened. Which should make you think twice about expensive policies then - I don’t think Truss government have thought through the Energy Price Guarantee or perhaps even aware of alternatives, they really do seem to be in their own world and out of touch with impact of their own policies.

    But it’s Labours problem too, they support this stupid policy, this won’t be forgotten.

    Not much unanswerable response, I answered it. No I don’t accept your 50/50 compromise, you offered nothing to suggest other than your 100% defeat.
    But fair play for taking it on, everyone else on PB being frit on this argument.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    HYUFD said:

    A lower £ should boost exports as they are cheaper, it is companies which import a lot that are hit with more expensive supplies
    Yes apologies, typing too quickly. A devaluation would hurt finance and overseas investors, not the industry as such.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,295

    It can only be a coronation as going out to the membership is out of the question
    What's the point of being a member if you can't vote for the leader?
  • EPG said:

    As a purely historical matter rather than a debating point, Attlee had been in charge of domestic policy for a half-decade before he became PM, and his cabinet included the left but was not dominated by it. He also had a bunch of rows with the real left, and ended up expelling almost half a dozen anti-Nato MPs who would have been predecessors to Corbyn's sympathies.
    True although I think nearly all were later readmitted to the party.
    Anyway, obviously Attlee wasn't on the left of the Labour party, but that doesn't mean he wasn't on the left in a broader sense.
    It's worth bearing in mind that the 1945 manifesto stated Labour's ambition was to create a Socialist Commonwealth of Great Britain.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,068
    edited October 2022
    EPG said:

    As a purely historical matter rather than a debating point, Attlee had been in charge of domestic policy for a half-decade before he became PM, and his cabinet included the left but was not dominated by it. He also had a bunch of rows with the real left, and ended up expelling almost half a dozen anti-Nato MPs who would have been predecessors to Corbyn's sympathies.
    Attlee also nationalised half the economy, expanded the welfare state and introduced the NHS and the top rate of income tax was 90% under his government.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,852
    edited October 2022
    Andy_JS said:

    It's only a question of time before Farage decides to take over the leadership of the Reform Party again. The current leader is failing to make any impression whatsoever. And when he does their support in the polls will probably rise almost automatically from around 5% to around 10%.
    There's an overlap between some of Farage's views on constitutional reform and the likes of the Lib Dems, so if he takes that angle, it could make for an interesting pincer movement.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 16,405
    Interesting that the Tories have gone from potentially installing the loser of Truss vs Sunak as PM to installing the loser of Johnson vs Hunt. Perhaps Leave vs Remain is the next election result they're going to overturn.
  • HYUFD said:

    Attlee also nationalised half the economy, expanded the welfare state and introduced the NHS and the top rate of income tax was 90% under his government.
    Sensible policies for a happier Britain, Baldrick
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,556
    Andy_JS said:

    What's the point of being a member if you can't vote for the leader?
    What's the point of being a member if you can't understand Truss is a disaster?
  • Andy_JS said:

    What's the point of being a member if you can't vote for the leader?
    That would be an ecumenical matter, Father
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited October 2022
    If I was Hunt, I’d impose rise-with-earnings settlements, right across the board.

    Pensions, benefits, all unsettled public sector pay deals etc.

    Heavily spin the “fairness” angle, which should help keep the public onside for when some unions don’t play ball.

    This is his misery budget. The key is to make everyone equally depressed.

    No rabbits. No hats. Noone can be seen to escape the pain.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,068
    edited October 2022

    Interesting that the Tories have gone from potentially installing the loser of Truss vs Sunak as PM to installing the loser of Johnson vs Hunt. Perhaps Leave vs Remain is the next election result they're going to overturn.

    If they tried than that is the end of the party as I said earlier, Farage would be Leader of the Opposition to PM Starmer's government. The Tories would have a handful of MPs left at most in West London and Surrey
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,551

    There's an overlap between some of Farage's views on constitutional reform and the likes of the Lib Dems, so if he takes that angle, it could make for an interesting pincer movement.
    Constitutional reform will be so so so irrelevant at GE 2024.

    It will be economics and wages and inflation and and mortgages and tax.

    Nothing else will get a look in.

  • Perhaps Hunt should think outside the box? If he adopted a leftwing programme of increasing taxes for the rich and maintained levels of public spending, all Labour's attacks would be nullified. The spectre of the nasty party would be once more lain to rest, or whatever happens to spectres. And rightwing people would still vote Tory anyway on the assumption that Labour would be worse. And even if they didn't, the memory of a Compassion Conservatism might help the party recover at a future election.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,322
    Scott_xP said:

    Defence Secretary Ben Wallace could resign if Jeremy Hunt scraps defence spending boost http://news.sky.com/story/defence-secretary-ben-wallace-could-resign-if-jeremy-hunt-scraps-defence-spending-boost-12720949

    Last week the RAF used a £12m UAS (MQ-4B Reaper) and £120,000 missile (AGM-114 Hellfire) to do the extra-judicial execution of one raggy lad on a motorbike in Iraq. Supposed to be "ISIS" but whatever...

    While they can afford to do stupid, pointless shit like that they've got too much money.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    HYUFD said:

    Attlee also nationalised half the economy, expanded the welfare state and introduced the NHS and the top rate of income tax was 90% under his government.
    In a lot of cases they were nationalised because there was no private capital left after two wars and a great Depression, and the government had been running them anyway since the beginning of the war. The railways being a good example - famously the UK's nationalised railway policy was mostly about reducing the industry rather than maintaining it.
  • That would be an ecumenical matter, Father
    Tories only got the right to vote on the party leader in the late 90s. They already had members before then. I'm not sure that giving them the vote caused an uptick in membership, either.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    pancakes said:

    Perhaps Hunt should think outside the box? If he adopted a leftwing programme of increasing taxes for the rich and maintained levels of public spending, all Labour's attacks would be nullified. The spectre of the nasty party would be once more lain to rest, or whatever happens to spectres. And rightwing people would still vote Tory anyway on the assumption that Labour would be worse. And even if they didn't, the memory of a Compassion Conservatism might help the party recover at a future election.

    A few years ago people used to bang on about the need for Labour to be exactly like the Tories in order to win a future election, but it turns out parties like doing some things because they believe them to be true.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited October 2022
    Over the last 24hrs, I’ve loaded up on truss out in 2024 / 2025 or later.

    She’s not ~92% certain to go in the next 14 1/2 months.

    Those odds are just wrong.
  • After 8 innings, Houston Astros 0, Seattle Mariners 0

    Series stands at Houston 2 versus Seattle 0, so Mariners must win today OR will be eliminated, after first playoff game in two decades.
  • There's an overlap between some of Farage's views on constitutional reform and the likes of the Lib Dems, so if he takes that angle, it could make for an interesting pincer movement.
    Ives: They're running a temporal pincer movement.

    The Protagonist: A what?

    Ives: Pincer movement. But not in space, in time. Half his team moves forward through the event. He monitors them and then attacks at the end moving backwards. Knowing everything.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    I’ve also greened out of my hunt for next con leader position. Rode his price down from ~10/1 to ~4/1.
  • After 8 innings, Houston Astros 0, Seattle Mariners 0

    Series stands at Houston 2 versus Seattle 0, so Mariners must win today OR will be eliminated, after first playoff game in two decades.

    Has anyone ever suggested making the bats a bit bigger ?

    Do baseball fans enjoy the low scoring or high scoring games more ?

    More tension in the first but more excitement in the latter I'll guess.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,594
    edited October 2022
    Andy_JS said:

    What's the point of being a member if you can't vote for the leader?
    The same point there was for members prior to 2001?

    A period, by the way, which included a much higher membership.

    Argue that they cannot go back to that, fine, but let's not keep pretending there is no point to being a member if you cannot vote for the leader.

    https://esrcpartymembersprojectorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/02/sn05125_hoc_membershipofukpoliticalparties.pdf
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,594
    pancakes said:

    Tories only got the right to vote on the party leader in the late 90s. They already had members before then. I'm not sure that giving them the vote caused an uptick in membership, either.
    It went down in fact.
  • Has anyone ever suggested making the bats a bit bigger ?

    Do baseball fans enjoy the low scoring or high scoring games more ?

    More tension in the first but more excitement in the latter I'll guess.
    Baseball has damn well been ruined by emphasis on hitting home runs.

    Most fans like high scoring games, some like low-scoring pitching battle, but ALL fans want their team to win.

    Crowd at THIS game is all-hepped up by fact that post-season baseball games in Seattle are rare indeed!
  • RunDeepRunDeep Posts: 77
    kinabalu said:

    And when it turns out this doesn't happen perhaps she will drop all this shit and return to writing novels.
    It has already happened to women here and in other countries.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,073

    Oh. There you were after all @maxh I must have had the Pringles in the way when you posted. 🫤

    Line by line.
    “The fundamentals in the economy are a lot less 'fundamental' than you are arguing. But an astute politician could have” Nope. When you are maxed out on card, when you get the basket to the till the card process says UhUh! No amount of sweet talking can change the fundamentals of “no. You can’t afford it.”

    “It took political idiocy to try to get markets to take the strain of another big spending commitment (the energy price guarantee) whilst also refusing to do any of the reassuring noises or distraction tactics - in fact to do the opposite of simultaneously throwing any appearance of fiscal responsibility to the winds.” All true. But the fundamentals fact is, whatever Starmer or Truss would have tried the answer would still have been no. Quarter of trillion in basket, credit worthiness a lot less than that, off goes the klaxons wobbly go the markets. If an OBR would have said you can’t put that in the basket and take it to the till, but you so want to play with the new credit card you’ve inherited with all your pirate liberterian ideas and create lovely growth growth growth becuase you are oh so clever - then you won’t even bother to engage an OBR to be told otherwise will you?

    “the energy price guarantee would have been straw that breaks the camel's back regardless of the window-dressing, but looking at debt-to-GDP ratios of major economies, it is hard to argue that right now is the moment when the UK's spending commitments become unaffordable.”
    It’s a good question what our limit is. Some say 98.6% of GDP isn’t great, because we keep throwing more money at public services through borrowing, and high taxation, a sounder footing would be no more unless it’s funded by growth, yet what’s the Japan GDP % 200%+?
    Certainly we can’t get away with what USA can get away with, so shouldn’t be thinking we can merely copy them. I guess it’s a far bigger equation, how good are your assets, how exposed are you to coming commitments like a demographic time bomb. In which instance all countries will be in a different place. Or perhaps you could always borrow some money in, just that the bigger risk you are, the more maxxed out you are, the more basket case you are, the bigger the rates you have to pay back, which is sort of what’s happened. Which should make you think twice about expensive policies then - I don’t think Truss government have thought through the Energy Price Guarantee or perhaps even aware of alternatives, they really do seem to be in their own world and out of touch with impact of their own policies.

    But it’s Labours problem too, they support this stupid policy, this won’t be forgotten.

    Not much unanswerable response, I answered it. No I don’t accept your 50/50 compromise, you offered nothing to suggest other than your 100% defeat.
    But fair play for taking it on, everyone else on PB being frit on this argument.
    In the mini thread above, it’s conceded to me We all agree a fire was already going. And We all agree What you refer to as a “trusster fuck” is a fire ongoing where gasoline was poured on hence flare up.

    (A few way behind the curve still think there was no problem at all till the mini budget caused the problems - B Ark the lot of them)

    What you need to agree, because it’s fact, The gasoline to cause clusterfuck was in large part quarter of a trillion loan for energy handout, and small part was the net minus thirteen billion budget redistributing wealth from workers to owners, owners with ideas and ambition but not the capital to match hence no growth in economy (says Trussism).
    (Net-13bn from 45bn cuts minus 2bn uturn minus 30bn stealth tax)
    Someone tried to argue there was zero stealth take back in £45bn giveaway growth budget, where did I get the ridiculous £30bn from? From the IFS actually.

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/oct/06/ifs-millions-in-britain-face-stealth-tax-raid-under-liz-trusss-plans

    Labour very unlikely to have done the 45bn/£13bn net tax change workers to owners switcheroo, but they do believe in the up to quarter of a trillion of borrowing at new expensive rates (minus a small percentage for windfall tax and a small percentage for other tax rises, but tax rising is limited now due to the politically maxxed out level of tax burden already) for a wrong headed and ruinous system of handouts - my argument, which is a winning argument, it’s now known as a Trussterfuck only because she was PM not Loto, whilst Starmer’s budget would also have poured a lot of gasoline on the same fire with similar result, and it would have been known the Starmerfuck - and Ninja Libertarian Truss as LOTO would now be steaming ahead in the polls, with this same ethos and policy agenda.

    What bit of all this is not fact?

    Come on. I’m still awake.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,551
    ping said:

    I’ve also greened out of my hunt for next con leader position. Rode his price down from ~10/1 to ~4/1.

    Green is good!
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192

    Sensible policies for a happier Britain, Baldrick
    I think it actually Prince George saying it to Blackadder...
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192
    HYUFD said:

    Attlee also nationalised half the economy, expanded the welfare state and introduced the NHS and the top rate of income tax was 90% under his government.
    And he was more successful than Truss
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,594
    kinabalu said:

    And when it turns out this doesn't happen perhaps she will drop all this shit and return to writing novels.
    She hasn't stopped writing novels, one came out just last month, so there's nothing to 'return' to doing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,594
    darkage said:

    Does anyone think the triple lock on pensions will be inside the scope of the 'difficult decisions' referred to by Hunt?
    In the theoretical sense only.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,551
    ping said:

    Over the last 24hrs, I’ve loaded up on truss out in 2024 / 2025 or later.

    She’s not ~92% certain to go in the next 14 1/2 months.

    Those odds are just wrong.

    It's not impossible that somehow she ends up still being leader in the Jan 25 election.

    But imo she will resign on Monday.

    Probably in time for lunchtime news.
  • I think it actually Prince George saying it to Blackadder...
    It was. The ‘Baldrick’ was addressing it to HY

    Thanks for trying to correct me though
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,594
    Dura_Ace said:

    Last week the RAF used a £12m UAS (MQ-4B Reaper) and £120,000 missile (AGM-114 Hellfire) to do the extra-judicial execution of one raggy lad on a motorbike in Iraq. Supposed to be "ISIS" but whatever...

    While they can afford to do stupid, pointless shit like that they've got too much money.
    I assume these missiles have use before dates though, so really we have to use 'em somewhere.
  • Bottom of 9th inning, with two outs, Astros and Mariners tied 0-0
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,295
    HYUFD said:

    The party is still the clear second placed party in the polls, if they continue with higher taxes, Hunt now suggesting will include a reversal in the cut in the basic income tax rate which was actually popular and add spending cuts on top of that, which will go down terribly in the redwall and fail to get a grip on immigration then they may not even have that. Farage is watching and waiting, a Hunt led government of tax rising, spending cutting technocrats is his ideal scenario.

    The 45p cut to the additional rate may have needed to go as unaffordable and politically damaging, the cut to the basic rate did not
    Maybe it ought to be Wallace as leader and Sunak as chancellor again.
  • Now bottom of 10th inning, still 0-0 Houston v Seattle.

    IF the Mariners score now, they win. If not, extra innings continue to 11th.

    IF they do win, Seattle fans get one more home game tomorrow. If not, their post-season is over.
  • Andy_JS said:

    What's the point of being a member if you can't vote for the leader?
    Party members did not have a vote until IDS was elected in 2001.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,924
    edited October 2022

    Now bottom of 10th inning, still 0-0 Houston v Seattle.

    IF the Mariners score now, they win. If not, extra innings continue to 11th.

    IF they do win, Seattle fans get one more home game tomorrow. If not, their post-season is over.

    At what point do you have a Super Over?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    Oh dear what a shame…..

    The United Nations has rejected a bid led by Stonewall to downgrade Britain’s equality watchdog to the status of equivalent bodies in Azerbaijan and Bahrain.

    The Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) will retain its A-status despite allegations that it is failing to sufficiently protect trans rights.

    Campaign groups led by Stonewall, the equalities charity, and the Good Law Project, headed by the barrister Jolyon Maugham,


    https://archive.ph/2022.10.15-194108/https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/10/15/un-rejects-stonewalls-bid-downgrade-britains-equality-watchdog/
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,736
    edited October 2022
    Whether it's Brexit or not, the UK car industry is going through a pretty poor time.

    BMW to axe UK production of electric Mini and relocate to China
    Cowley factory on outskirts of Oxford not up to challenge of creating electric vehicles, says Mini boss
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/oct/15/bmw-axe-uk-production-electric-mini-relocate-china

    ...A new, electric version of the largest Mini model, the Countryman, will, BMW has confirmed, be manufactured at its plant in Leipzig....

    ...BMW’s decision comes after reports that Britain’s only planned large-scale battery factory, being built by Britishvolt in the north-east of England, will go bust if it does not receive a £200m rescue package.

    Only a year ago, Boris Johnson, then prime minister, promised at the Cop26 climate summit in Glasgow, to fund a “£1bn electric car revolution” in the UK “creating hundreds of thousands of jobs”. His predecessor, Theresa May, intended that Britain would become “a world leader” in electric vehicle manufacturing and made it one of the “pillars” of her short-lived industrial strategy.

    Kwasi Kwarteng, who was sacked as chancellor on Friday and replaced by Jeremy Hunt, said last year when he was business secretary that the electrified automotive industry would be “front and centre of Britain building back better”....
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,736
    A dismal failure of government.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 5,709
    edited October 2022
    Nigelb said:

    A dismal failure of government.

    A spokesman from BMW is quoted in the Times this morning saying it will be brought back to the UK when a purpose-built electric-only production line is ready.

    Could be just words, of course, but BMW claim the move is not permanent.

    Meanwhile, MINI cabriolet production is being moved from the Netherlands to Cowley.
  • At what point do you have a Super Over?
    No clue what that is. In baseball, they keep playing until somebody wins.

    "Baseball goes into extra innings. The way baseball works is that if a game is tied after nine innings, the game will continue until one of the teams is winning after the end of the inning. If they are still tied after the end of an inning then the game will go into the next inning."
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,322
    carnforth said:

    A spokesman from BMW is quoted in the Times this morning saying it will be brought back to the UK when a purpose-built electric-only production line is ready.

    Could be just words, of course, but BMW claim the move is not permanent.

    Meanwhile, MINI cabriolet production is being moved from the Netherlands to Cowley.
    Yeah... when BMW binned off Solihull and Longbridge they promised 100% of Mini production would always be at Cowley.

    I reckon they'll sell Cowley to Great Wall. The IC engine plant at Hams Hall is doomed no matter who owns it.
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 3,264
    Baseball games can be played on more than one day, for example: "The Pawtucket Red Sox and the Rochester Red Wings, two teams from the Triple-A International League, played the longest game in professional baseball history. It lasted 33 innings, with 8 hours and 25 minutes of playing time. 32 innings were played April 18–19, 1981, at McCoy Stadium in Pawtucket, Rhode Island, and the final 33rd inning was played June 23, 1981. Pawtucket won the game, 3–2."
    (Links omitted.)

    source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Longest_professional_baseball_game

    Triple-A is the highest level of minor league play.
  • Longest Major League Baseball Game

    Brooklyn Robins 1, Boston Braves 1 on May 1, 1920 – 26 innings

    Note that game DID in a tie that evening, after it got too dark to play. This before artificial lighting at baseball parks. AND apparently before rules cited by Jim Miller.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 5,709
    Dura_Ace said:

    Yeah... when BMW binned off Solihull and Longbridge they promised 100% of Mini production would always be at Cowley.

    I reckon they'll sell Cowley to Great Wall. The IC engine plant at Hams Hall is doomed no matter who owns it.
    I was surprised at the claim that BMW don’t have an electric platform small enough for the mini, so have to use Great Wall’s. Presumably they would want to share a future mini electic platform with the 1 series?
  • In Seattle, now headed to bottom of inning 16, score Mariners versus Astros still zip-zip.

    IF you think that lack of scoring means nothing is happening, you could NOT be further from the truth.

  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,532

    Farage has retired from frontline politics. I think it makes more sense to fight for those centre voters than to fear a bogeyman on the populist Right will steal their remaining support.
    Interesting post that I hadn't thought of. I don't know if it's true and of course someone else might appear on the right, but so far nobody else has got anywhere near filling Farage's boots, so you might well have a very astute observation.
  • New thread.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,507
    kjh said:

    Interesting post that I hadn't thought of. I don't know if it's true and of course someone else might appear on the right, but so far nobody else has got anywhere near filling Farage's boots, so you might well have a very astute observation.
    I'd fill his boots......with concrete, and drop him in the Thames.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,810
    kle4 said:

    She hasn't stopped writing novels, one came out just last month, so there's nothing to 'return' to doing.
    Yes - eg with that "Strike" detective. Quite enjoyed the tv adaptation.
This discussion has been closed.