Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Most people, unlike us, aren't political. They just want someone sane who isn't going to wreck stuff. Hunt fits that bill. Truss doesn't. Boris doesn't. Yes Boris won in 2019. You think that makes him a winner forever. It doesn't. He won because of Brexit and Corbyn and since has absolutely destroyed his reputation.
Boris and indeed Truss also won on a platform of low taxes while not cutting public services, something Chancellor Hunt has now completely reversed. Now that might be necessary because of the financial situation post Covid and post Ukraine but it is not what voters voted Conservative for in 2019
Voters in 2019 did not face covid and war in Europe in case you haven't noticed
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
Rarely in politics is it easy to draw a direct line from a single policy decision to the harm it’s done, but in this case, it will be simple. If any woman or girl suffers voyeurism, sexual harassment, assault or rape in consequence of the Scottish government’s lax new rules, the blame will rest squarely with those at Holyrood who ignored safeguarding experts and women’s campaigners.
And nobody should be held to higher account than the first minister, the “real feminist” who’s riding roughshod over the rights of women and girls.
Rarely in politics is it easy to draw a direct line from a single policy decision to the harm it’s done, but in this case, it will be simple. If any woman or girl suffers voyeurism, sexual harassment, assault or rape in consequence of the Scottish government’s lax new rules, the blame will rest squarely with those at Holyrood who ignored safeguarding experts and women’s campaigners.
And nobody should be held to higher account than the first minister, the “real feminist” who’s riding roughshod over the rights of women and girls.
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
Well if Hunt and Truss now push to rejoin the EU too then that really would be curtains for them and Farage really would overtake them as the leader of the main party of the right
@Roger is desperately wanting to rejoin but neither the conservative party or labour are on his page and certainly it is a very long time away if ever
We could have a better relationship if Macron's proposals for a closer relationship with non EU states including the UK develops and that would be welcome
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
The question is what exactly would Farage be proposing to cut, in order to fund his tax cuts. Because the problem is that there isn't exactly a big political demand for small state libertarianism, as Truss has just found out.
I think Farage takes the view that he has already put his shift in, and is now happy with a retirement being a pundit on GB News.
I would speculate the next wave of right wing activism is going to be a whole lot nastier than that espoused by Farage.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Offering unfunded tax cuts has been proven not to work, psephologically and financially. Why would it work for Farage when it didn’t for Truss?
Tax cuts on the back of spending cuts won’t be popular with voters either.
Sure, there’s 9% of the population that would go for it. If (big if), he can peel that 9% away from the Conservatives, he gets nothing and he dooms the Conservatives.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Is it really arrogant to want a credible party rather than the sh*t shower of incompetents and fools that currently comprise what used to be the Conservative Party?
If anyone around here is arrogant, it is you with your assertions that everything is peachy and delightful and the rest of us are unhinged.
Reality will be giving you a firm kick up the ar*e one day soon and you can argue with her all you like - she is not known for listening.
When have I said everything is easy and delightful, globally we are in a period of high inflation and cost of living because of the Ukraine war and rising interest rates regardless of the mini budget, the most controversial elements of which have been reversed.
As you would never vote Tory anyway the last thing it needs is to listen to who you want as leader
Why is why you and your party will lose.
Did you vote Tory in 2019 when the Tories won their biggest majority since 1987? No.
So no it isn't
2019 was the Brexit election when that section of the electorate that still believed the lies told by Leavers lent the Conservative their vote.
Now Brexit has been exposed for the steaming great pile of poop that it is. Even the Daily Telegraph is admitting it now.
Your party has betrayed the country, betrayed savers, betrayed home owners, betrayed the young,... actually it is probably quicker to list who it kept its promises to: The ERG and .... errr....that's it.
You all deserve to be barred from public office for what you all did.
Comfortably over 40% still back Brexit even now (not much different to most of the final wrong EU referendum polls) which is significantly higher than the Tories are polling now. Voters who voted for Brexit got the end to free movement and regained sovereignty they voted for
IIRC the last poll from a couple of days ago had only 35% saying they would vote to stay out if there was a referendum to rejoin. I think your figure is out of date. Since the Brexiteer engineered debacle of the last couple of weeks I think an increasing number of people are reconsidering their position. Support for Brexit has been gradually declining ever since we actually "got Brexit done"
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
Well if Hunt and Truss now push to rejoin the EU too then that really would be curtains for them and Farage really would overtake them as the leader of the main party of the right
If Dua Lipa we’re my girlfriend, I wouldn’t be posting to PB right now. I mention this as Dua Lipa becoming my girlfriend is as likely as Hunt and Truss pushing to rejoin the EU.
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
Well if Hunt and Truss now push to rejoin the EU too then that really would be curtains for them and Farage really would overtake them as the leader of the main party of the right
'Brexit' like 'Tory' is now a brand. One that is now irretrievably down the toilet. It's tarnished beyond repair. Reading recent articles even strong supporters have now given up on the brand. As Warner says it's poison and is responsible for most of our woes.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
The missing information at the moment is the opinions of Conservative members. Without this it is difficult to work out what might happen if (or when) Truss finally gets turfed out. The right could only realistically oppose the coronation or a sensible candidate if they have support in the membership, either to put up an opponent, or to put pressure on existing MPs. There is polling of Conservative voters but not members, as far as I am aware.
I had a look through the comments on conhome and couldn't get any insights from there. A lot of the usual GB News style grumbling about the woke etc but not much obvious support for Truss.
The Tories are paralysed until they figure out a way of bypassing the loony membership. Truss is perfectly safe till they figure that out. My guess is she will be with us for some time.
The membership is loony, but there are plenty of the swivel-eyed brigade in Westminster too...
Agreed but they don't need to win the MP's vote they just need enough votes to get a loony into the membership ballot. IIRC 113 votes was enough to land us with Truss
Another example of that celebrated Russian culture.
I did not post it until it was confirmed. Now prosecutor's office opened the criminal case. Russians killed conductor of Kherson philharmonic orchestra Juriy Kerpatenko in his home in Kherson for refusing to work under occupation. https://twitter.com/AKurkov/status/1581291384602243072
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
I think they are going for Wallace because he is the most popular with the membership, he always polled well with the membership in the run up to the current leadership contest (as I recall).
Edit - yes it is an example of their dysfunction, they need a competent performer at the highest level like Sunak or Hunt - Wallace could well turn out to be another Truss.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
Long may they continue electing a Farage approved candidate. It's going so swimmingly after all.
Agreed but I do also care what happens to the country.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Offering unfunded tax cuts has been proven not to work, psephologically and financially. Why would it work for Farage when it didn’t for Truss?
Tax cuts on the back of spending cuts won’t be popular with voters either.
Sure, there’s 9% of the population that would go for it. If (big if), he can peel that 9% away from the Conservatives, he gets nothing and he dooms the Conservatives.
Actually the cut in the basic rate of income tax was popular with voters and Hunt now wants to reverse that too.
Farage also isn't PM and not likely to be, he just needs to produce a populist package that can appeal to former Boris voters
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
I wish you were right, @Roger. But about the only part of the article that says that Britain's status as a non-member of the EU is in trouble is the title.
Brexit was always mental, and I'm not surprised that when someone suggests it might be about to fail definitively, the suggestion arises that Nigel Farage might lead a new party on a promise to "end the Channel crossings". Given that the French coast is not under British control, I cannot see any sensible way to avoid interpreting that possibility as featuring lots of drowned (unarmed, civilian, desperate, poor) foreigners against a backdrop of rightwing British loonies shouting "That'll learn ya!"
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
I wish you were right, @Roger. But about the only part of the article that says that Britain's status as a non-member of the EU is in trouble is the title.
Brexit was always mental, and I'm not surprised that when someone suggests it might be about to fail definitively, the suggestion arises that Nigel Farage might lead a new party on a promise to "end the Channel crossings". Given that the French coast is not under British control, I cannot see any sensible way to avoid interpreting that possibility as featuring lots of drowned (unarmed, civilian, desperate, poor) foreigners against a backdrop of rightwing British loonies shouting "That'll learn ya!"
Viler than Orban? Viler than Bolsonaro?
Orban won, Bolsonaro won last time, Meloni won.
It may not be palatable but there is a significant market for hardline anti immigration policies
Rarely in politics is it easy to draw a direct line from a single policy decision to the harm it’s done, but in this case, it will be simple. If any woman or girl suffers voyeurism, sexual harassment, assault or rape in consequence of the Scottish government’s lax new rules, the blame will rest squarely with those at Holyrood who ignored safeguarding experts and women’s campaigners.
And nobody should be held to higher account than the first minister, the “real feminist” who’s riding roughshod over the rights of women and girls.
And when it turns out this doesn't happen perhaps she will drop all this shit and return to writing novels.
"Shut up" appears to be the only argument left.
Not at all. The argument in favour of a less lengthy and harrowing process to obtain a GRC is strong. The May government were persuaded by it. The Scottish government too. It's been done in several countries.
I remember those years . Labour did many great things , positive changes . Iraq will always blight Blair’s legacy but putting that aside there were many achievements . The Tories have destroyed the country, peddled division and their EU psychodrama led to Brexit .
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings
And how might I ask would he achieve that?
Brexit’s had a good stab already, the length of time it takes to get to the Channel ports nowadays!
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
I think they are going for Wallace because he is the most popular with the membership, he always polled well with the membership in the run up to the current leadership contest (as I recall).
Edit - yes it is an example of their dysfunction, they need a competent performer at the highest level like Sunak or Hunt - Wallace could well turn out to be another Truss.
Being popular with the current membership ought to disqualify him automatically.
The Blair video below the Brown one is also well worth a watch.
Love the way Brown carefully checks for dandruff on his suit when Blair says: "he has introduced extra child benefit for millions" pointing at the CoE.
The most significant story of the day. If the Tory house rag agrees with it's deputy financial editor then Brexit as we know it is in serious trouble. As he says it's calamitous for the UK and it's reputation. Time to get us back in. The country is teetering. Just the climate to get this bandwagon rolling and once it starts it will roll fast
I wish you were right, @Roger. But about the only part of the article that says that Britain's status as a non-member of the EU is in trouble is the title.
Brexit was always mental, and I'm not surprised that when someone suggests it might be about to fail definitively, the suggestion arises that Nigel Farage might lead a new party on a promise to "end the Channel crossings". Given that the French coast is not under British control, I cannot see any sensible way to avoid interpreting that possibility as featuring lots of drowned (unarmed, civilian, desperate, poor) foreigners against a backdrop of rightwing British loonies shouting "That'll learn ya!"
Viler than Orban? Viler than Bolsonaro?
Orban won, Bolsonaro won last time, Meloni won.
It may not be palatable but there is a significant market for hardline anti immigration policies
Yes, I agree. In Britain one only has to consider the Sun, Daily Mail, and Daily Express, and to listen to how many talk, both in the "white van man" and the "blue rinse" brigades.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Who would he be offering tax cuts to and who would he be offering to take the money from to pay for it ?
They’ll find out how much they have to cut when the bond market opens on Monday.
By Wednesday things will be clear.
Everything Hunt has said so far is directly aimed at Gilt traders. If yields reduce, then cuts will be moderate. If they rise, they’ll be severe. He’s using the press to signal all sorts of cuts and tax rises this weekend. Whether they actually get implemented depends, as I said, on the bond market next week.
Thats the terrifying truth about how politics works, right now.
Who was it who said that when he was young he wanted to be resurrected as US President, but now he wanted to come back as the bond market as it had more power?
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings
And how might I ask would he achieve that?
Yeah Cos that proposition is summat that's never been conceived of before.
They’ll find out how much they have to cut when the bond market opens on Monday.
By Wednesday things will be clear.
Everything Hunt has said so far is directly aimed at Gilt traders. If yields reduce, then cuts will be moderate. If they rise, they’ll be severe. He’s using the press to signal all sorts of cuts and tax rises this weekend. Whether they actually get implemented depends, as I said, on the bond market next week.
Thats the terrifying truth about how politics works, right now.
Who was it who said that when he was young he wanted to be resurrected as US President, but now he wanted to come back as the bond market as it had more power?
The Ragin' Cajun himself. Clinton's chief of staff and election guru.
They’ll find out how much they have to cut when the bond market opens on Monday.
By Wednesday things will be clear.
Everything Hunt has said so far is directly aimed at Gilt traders. If yields reduce, then cuts will be moderate. If they rise, they’ll be severe. He’s using the press to signal all sorts of cuts and tax rises this weekend. Whether they actually get implemented depends, as I said, on the bond market next week.
Thats the terrifying truth about how politics works, right now.
Who was it who said that when he was young he wanted to be resurrected as US President, but now he wanted to come back as the bond market as it had more power?
If you have a budget surplus and growing economy you don't need to worry too much about the markets as you don't need to borrow much
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
Long may they continue electing a Farage approved candidate. It's going so swimmingly after all.
Agreed but I do also care what happens to the country.
We need a Labour government then. This lot will just fight like ferrets.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Who would he be offering tax cuts to and who would he be offering to take the money from to pay for it ?
Ordinary voters who Hunt has just said will no longer see a cut in the basic income tax rate
They’ll find out how much they have to cut when the bond market opens on Monday.
By Wednesday things will be clear.
Everything Hunt has said so far is directly aimed at Gilt traders. If yields reduce, then cuts will be moderate. If they rise, they’ll be severe. He’s using the press to signal all sorts of cuts and tax rises this weekend. Whether they actually get implemented depends, as I said, on the bond market next week.
Thats the terrifying truth about how politics works, right now.
Who was it who said that when he was young he wanted to be resurrected as US President, but now he wanted to come back as the bond market as it had more power?
If you have a budget surplus and growing economy you don't need to worry too much about the markets as you don't need to borrow much
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Who would he be offering tax cuts to and who would he be offering to take the money from to pay for it ?
Ordinary voters who Hunt has just said will no longer see a cut in the basic income tax rate
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Offering unfunded tax cuts has been proven not to work, psephologically and financially. Why would it work for Farage when it didn’t for Truss?
Tax cuts on the back of spending cuts won’t be popular with voters either.
Sure, there’s 9% of the population that would go for it. If (big if), he can peel that 9% away from the Conservatives, he gets nothing and he dooms the Conservatives.
Actually the cut in the basic rate of income tax was popular with voters and Hunt now wants to reverse that too.
Farage also isn't PM and not likely to be, he just needs to produce a populist package that can appeal to former Boris voters
I think the 19p has to go. NI was increased to fix social care. Johnson and Sunak told us that. Truss reversed it, meaning social care gets unfixed unless the funding comes from elsewhere, the obvious place being NI's alter ego, income tax. So income tax not only can't come down it has to go up. 21p therefore.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Who would he be offering tax cuts to and who would he be offering to take the money from to pay for it ?
Ordinary voters who Hunt has just said will no longer see a cut in the basic income tax rate
And who is the money taken from ?
Vacuous promises will no longer be believed.
By working class and lower middle class voters who voted for Boris in 2019 with the promise of tax cuts and falling immigration now facing the reverse under this government, why not?
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
He has already said that is the wrong thing to do. Those of us in the centre have the wrong views and our votes are not wanted.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Firstly, there are more possible outcomes than Wallace or Hunt. Truss may hang on. We could have Sunak, or Mordaunt.
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
One of the ironies of British politics is that while the Tory party declares itself to be the party of aspiration, for much of its market what actually predominates is the fear of losing what they've got (both absolutely and relatively). For many of its members and voters, that is felt far more keenly than any drive to acquire or achieve more.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Offering unfunded tax cuts has been proven not to work, psephologically and financially. Why would it work for Farage when it didn’t for Truss?
Tax cuts on the back of spending cuts won’t be popular with voters either.
Sure, there’s 9% of the population that would go for it. If (big if), he can peel that 9% away from the Conservatives, he gets nothing and he dooms the Conservatives.
Actually the cut in the basic rate of income tax was popular with voters and Hunt now wants to reverse that too.
Farage also isn't PM and not likely to be, he just needs to produce a populist package that can appeal to former Boris voters
I think the 19p has to go. NI was increased to fix social care. Johnson and Sunak told us that. Truss reversed it, meaning social care gets unfixed unless the funding comes from elsewhere, the obvious place being NI's alter ego, income tax. So income tax not only can't come down it has to go up. 21p therefore.
Truss believed social care could be fixed by issuing more debt.
Like a lot of other stuff.
The bond markets agreed.
But they named their price.
It's not like they won't buy the debt. It's just they have their own ideas what they will pay.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
In which case he would lose badly.
Would he? About a quarter to a third of the electorate at least would vote for just such a populist right agenda.
He might not win but he could come second
In FPTP, 25-30% doesn't get you far, unless it is pretty lumpy.
What he could do is kick the Conservative party into the grave they have dug for themselves.
It could get him 50-100 seats, 100-200 if he got to 30%. That would then be curtains for the Tories under Hunt yes. Assuming Starmer Labour got 40%+ then the Hunt led Tories would be down to about 10-15%, they would be lucky to get more than a handful of seats at most
You are living in a fantasy world and seem to want the conservative party to be extinguished
I don't but I just recognise there is a Canada 1993 style extinction event scenario if Hunt leads the party, with the Tories squeezed to their left by Labour and the LDs and to their right by Farage
Farage is a busted flush
Arrogance and complacency in equal measure
No, he just does not suffer from your paranoid delusions and fears.
What do you care? Arrogantly telling Tories to make Hunt leader while you would still never vote Tory anyway
Many of us want someone who can restore some integrity and competence to the party following toxic Johnson and the most hapless, dreadful PM in my lifetime and also want to see the likes of yourself, ERG and Farage get consigned to history just like the Corbynites
The appetite amongst the electorate for 2 dull, corporatist, tax rising Remainers as leader of the main 2 parties is limited, hence Farage would return
Offering what ?
The only debate is going to be who take from and who to give to.
And both Starmer and Hunt are proposing tax rises, Farage would offer tax cuts.
Farage would propose to end the channel crossings and slash immigration and take on the Woke Agenda too.
Who would he be offering tax cuts to and who would he be offering to take the money from to pay for it ?
Ordinary voters who Hunt has just said will no longer see a cut in the basic income tax rate
And who is the money taken from ?
Vacuous promises will no longer be believed.
By working class and lower middle class voters who voted for Boris in 2019 with the promise of tax cuts and falling immigration now facing the reverse under this government, why not?
Because pretty much everyone knows that all the money has already been spent on covid and now energy subsidies.
The magic money tree has been shaken so hard that its been pulled up.
So to make promises of tax cuts or spending increases then you need to say from whom that money will be taken from.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
Farage has retired from frontline politics. I think it makes more sense to fight for those centre voters than to fear a bogeyman on the populist Right will steal their remaining support.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yes, if he promises not to u-turn the u-turn economically then he could easily wrap up the former loyalists and rebels in one go, and it wouldn't piss off the members (until they were inevitably disappointed in him).
Never really seen many of his performances, so honestly have no clue how he comes across. Given he must have plenty of airtime in the last 8 months that's an impressively low profile.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Firstly, there are more possible outcomes than Wallace or Hunt. Truss may hang on. We could have Sunak, or Mordaunt.
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
This hits the nail on the head. He's telling us going against Truss's ideas will kill the party, but the party is being killed right now for those ideas.
They should get real, the necessary 45% corporation tax rate or 50-something% tax on workers they hate would crucify the economy. Indefinite borrowing and cheap energy are over.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
I’d love to see Farage come back and screw the Tories . I’d like to see them utterly destroyed at the next GE . However I don’t think it’s happening. I just don’t see there’s much mileage now in brand Farage .
They should get real, the necessary 45% corporation tax rate or 50-something% tax on workers they hate would crucify the economy. Indefinite borrowing and cheap energy are over.
Plenty of successful countries have higher overall tax rates than us and working economies. We could increase funding for education and health.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Firstly, there are more possible outcomes than Wallace or Hunt. Truss may hang on. We could have Sunak, or Mordaunt.
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
This hits the nail on the head. He's telling us going against Truss's ideas will kill the party, but the party is being killed right now for those ideas.
The party is still the clear second placed party in the polls, if they continue with higher taxes, Hunt now suggesting will include a reversal in the cut in the basic income tax rate which was actually popular and add spending cuts on top of that, which will go down terribly in the redwall and fail to get a grip on immigration then they may not even have that. Farage is watching and waiting, a Hunt led government of tax rising, spending cutting technocrats is his ideal scenario.
The 45p cut to the additional rate may have needed to go as unaffordable and politically damaging, the cut to the basic rate did not
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Firstly, there are more possible outcomes than Wallace or Hunt. Truss may hang on. We could have Sunak, or Mordaunt.
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
This hits the nail on the head. He's telling us going against Truss's ideas will kill the party, but the party is being killed right now for those ideas.
Which is also strange when he is saying getting rid of Boris was a mistake, and at least some of what is proposed is to go back to what Boris was doing.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Firstly, there are more possible outcomes than Wallace or Hunt. Truss may hang on. We could have Sunak, or Mordaunt.
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
This hits the nail on the head. He's telling us going against Truss's ideas will kill the party, but the party is being killed right now for those ideas.
The party is still the clear second placed party in the polls, if they continue with higher taxes, Hunt now suggesting will include a reversal in the cut in the basic income tax rate which was actually popular and add spending cuts on top of that, which will go down terribly in the redwall and fail to get a grip on immigration then they may not even have that. Farage is watching and waiting, a Hunt led government of tax rising, spending cutting technocrats is his ideal scenario.
The 45p cut to the additional rate may have needed to go as unaffordable and politically damaging, the cut to the basic rate did not
We're in deep shit right now, made deeper by Truss. Unpalatable options may need to occur, as you have acknowledged to some degree. Even if that means upsetting the Red Wall and Farage.
Yes that may make winning the next election extremely difficult. But it won't be winnable if we collapse economically either.
They should get real, the necessary 45% corporation tax rate or 50-something% tax on workers they hate would crucify the economy. Indefinite borrowing and cheap energy are over.
Plenty of successful countries have higher overall tax rates than us and working economies. We could increase funding for education and health.
If low and average earners hands over 30% to 45% of their income as tax like in Belgium or Finland, which, well, they won't.
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
They should get real, the necessary 45% corporation tax rate or 50-something% tax on workers they hate would crucify the economy. Indefinite borrowing and cheap energy are over.
Does anyone think the triple lock on pensions will be inside the scope of the 'difficult decisions' referred to by Hunt?
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
Farage has retired from frontline politics. I think it makes more sense to fight for those centre voters than to fear a bogeyman on the populist Right will steal their remaining support.
Only temporarily, Farage despises Hunt and if Hunt became leader would be back to lead RefUK in 5 minutes
Labour's been supporting the reduction of the 20% rate, which is the highest paid by a large proportion of workers. That's not compatible with a 20th century Continental welfare state.
The French government is to order workers back to their jobs at a major fuel refinery, as petrol shortages continue amid a long-running nationwide strike for better salaries and a share of oil firm’s huge profits.
The government confirmed that the requisition of essential fuel workers at the blockaded Port Jérôme refinery at Notre-Dame-de-Gravenchon, in Normandy, would begin on Wednesday. But the controversial move could risk stoppages spreading to other sectors in support of the fuel strikers.
The government is facing a deepening crisis after weeks of stoppages led by the leftwing CGT trade union, which is seeking large pay rises for workers at two oil firms, the French TotalEnergies and the US ExxonMobil. Strikers want better pay amid the cost-of-living crisis and a share of companies’ high profits.
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
You will never win from the right just as Corbyn demonstrated from the left
The country is utterly weary of the hard right and left, and you will soon be a dinosaur
Wallace "rethinking" his family reasons for not being PM says Mail tonight.
Game on.
Yeah. But is he any good? I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent. Rather like Liz.
He doesn't have that burning desire to be PM that should exclude most people from being PM. You know, those who "think they'd be quite good at it."
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
FWIW, I think going for Wallace will be a mistake as he is completely untested in the public eye at the most senior levels.
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace at least would not risk leaking Tory voters en masse to Farage as Hunt would
Look at the polls. You’ve already leaked them.
The choice now for the Tories is between heavy defeat or extinction. Wallace at least avoids extinction and the Tories live to fight again. Hunt however may not and our main right of centre party may be one in future led by Nigel Farage and his followers if that occurred, ultimately taking over the rump of the Tories a la Canada after the Canadian Tories rout in 1993 and replacement by the populist Reform as the main party of the right
Your way is certain extinction
No, the Tories will never face extinction at the hands of Labour, even after landslide defeats like 1997 they come back eventually.
Only Farage and the populist right can deliver extinction for the Tories by replacing them as the main party of the British right
Robert Peston @Peston I completely understand the argument that it would be insane - contempt for the way we do democracy - for a political party to change its leader TWICE after a general election. It is why till recently I assumed Liz Truss would surely lead her party into the next…
Hunt was 48 on BF for next leader yesterday lunchtime when I bet on him.
Now 4.8
Has an MP ever come in faster on the betting?
Given Hunt was eliminated in the first MPs round of voting in the leadership contest and polled worse than Sunak with members let alone Truss or Badenoch, I fail to see how he gets it. Chancellor is probably the highest post he is going to have
That he was out so early ironically makes him more likely a compromise candidate for me, in seeking to secure a coronation. He didn't get involved in the argy bargy of the debates.
Contrarily, whilst people might want to avoid the members voting this time, picking the guy they most definitely rejected, would make crowning Sunak quite the provocation to them.
If there is a Tory leader Farage would be licking his lips over, it is Hunt.
Farage would return to lead RefUK in 5 minutes if Hunt took over.
Farage should just retire already. He's got his most important policy through, does he really want to spend his time setting up and running fractious parties to act as a pressure group on the Tories, rather than just be a pundit?
Farage would definitely run on a low tax, hard Brexit, tough on immigration and channel crossings and anti Woke agenda against Starmer and Hunt who he would portray as near identical centrist, corporatist Remainers
You appear to be saying that the Tories can only choose a leader that is approved of by Farage. Given the current state of the membership you may be correct. It is however a recipe for disaster for the Conservative Party.
In Spring 2019 they had a leader not approved of by Farage and were in 3rd place, by December they had a leader who won back voters from Farage and a landslide general election victory.
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
You are living in the past - Since Brexit has come to pass the ERG Tories + RefUK + UKIP aren't polling 30% between them anymore. You are like bald men arguing over a comb.
It is who wins the majority of that 30% though which is key.
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
It doesn’t matter who gets the majority of this 30% to who can get the keys to No. 10. If you’re fighting over the 30%, you’re not winning elections. The way back for the Tories is to appeal to the centre.
Forget the centre, the centre went to Starmer months ago and is not coming back anytime soon whoever the Tories leader is. Forget winning the next election, that is also gone now.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
Farage has retired from frontline politics. I think it makes more sense to fight for those centre voters than to fear a bogeyman on the populist Right will steal their remaining support.
Only temporarily, Farage despises Hunt and if Hunt became leader would be back to lead RefUK in 5 minutes
It's only a question of time before Farage decides to take over the leadership of the Reform Party again. The current leader is failing to make any impression whatsoever. And when he does their support in the polls will probably rise almost automatically from around 5% to around 10%.
Comments
These two dramatic events has changed everything
Nearly all Remainers are now voting for Starmer Labour or the LDs or SNP, so if they split Leavers with Farage under FPTP the Tories are doomed
Game on.
We could have a better relationship if Macron's proposals for a closer relationship with non EU states including the UK develops and that would be welcome
I think Farage takes the view that he has already put his shift in, and is now happy with a retirement being a pundit on GB News.
I would speculate the next wave of right wing activism is going to be a whole lot nastier than that espoused by Farage.
But is he any good?
I see relatively little evidence. Other than he hasn't yet proved to be totally incompetent.
Rather like Liz.
Tax cuts on the back of spending cuts won’t be popular with voters either.
Sure, there’s 9% of the population that would go for it. If (big if), he can peel that 9% away from the Conservatives, he gets nothing and he dooms the Conservatives.
Houston Astros 0, Seattle Mariners
First post-season home game for Mariners since 2001, five-game series now Astros 2, Mariners 0
A degree of humility we haven't seen at the top of politics in quite a long time.
https://twitter.com/SanjayFBPEUK/status/1580673249326682112
And how might I ask would he achieve that?
If Tories want to save enough seats to be back in contention by 2029 then it has to be Sunak or Hunt.
But the party is almost certainly too far gone down the rabbit hole for that.
Wallace still 3rd favourite:
Sunak 2.84
Hunt 5.4
Wallace 8
Penny 9.2
Boris 15.5
Kemi 22
Braverman 34
I did not post it until it was confirmed. Now prosecutor's office opened the criminal case. Russians killed conductor of Kherson philharmonic orchestra Juriy Kerpatenko in his home in Kherson for refusing to work under occupation.
https://twitter.com/AKurkov/status/1581291384602243072
Edit - yes it is an example of their dysfunction, they need a competent performer at the highest level like Sunak or Hunt - Wallace could well turn out to be another Truss.
Farage also isn't PM and not likely to be, he just needs to produce a populist package that can appeal to former Boris voters
Baldies have been excluded from power for longer than the liberals.
Brexit was always mental, and I'm not surprised that when someone suggests it might be about to fail definitively, the suggestion arises that Nigel Farage might lead a new party on a promise to "end the Channel crossings". Given that the French coast is not under British control, I cannot see any sensible way to avoid interpreting that possibility as featuring lots of drowned (unarmed, civilian, desperate, poor) foreigners against a backdrop of rightwing British loonies shouting "That'll learn ya!"
Viler than Orban? Viler than Bolsonaro?
It may not be palatable but there is a significant market for hardline anti immigration policies
Labour got 29% in 2010, 30% in 2015 and 32% in 2019 (albeit with an aberration 40% in 2019) but unlike the Tories there was never really a threat of the Greens say overtaking them on the left, as there could be with Farage on the right
@theipaper
·
1h
Inside a Tory party searching for a new leader ⤵️
“She’s already lost the election for us. I have a 20,000 majority and I’m looking at it going down to 2,000. She’s f***ed"
Cos that proposition is summat that's never been conceived of before.
This is 100% about pleasing the tory membership. It is sad.
But now I would like to come back as the bond market."
James Carville - Bill Clinton's chief adviser.
This lot will just fight like ferrets.
Vacuous promises will no longer be believed.
You’ve already leaked them.
The focus for the Tories now is holding the right and avoiding extinction, because if Farage overtakes them they will effectively die as a party
Secondly, Wallace is much loved because he’s defence minister during a war. I am entirely unclear what his policies on anything else are. Maybe they’ll be the same as Hunt’s.
What you are basically arguing for is a continuation of Truss’s policies, which is what got the Tories into this mess in the first place. If Truss’s policies were electorally or financially viable, she would’ve stuck with them instead of being forced into a series of embarrassing U-turns.
https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.167249195
Like a lot of other stuff.
The bond markets agreed.
But they named their price.
It's not like they won't buy the debt. It's just they have their own ideas what they will pay.
The magic money tree has been shaken so hard that its been pulled up.
So to make promises of tax cuts or spending increases then you need to say from whom that money will be taken from.
Never really seen many of his performances, so honestly have no clue how he comes across. Given he must have plenty of airtime in the last 8 months that's an impressively low profile.
But Britain is always welcome back!
https://twitter.com/guyverhofstadt/status/1581198441736450050
The chancellor sparked alarm among trade union leaders by promising ‘very difficult decisions’ for government budgets"
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/oct/15/health-teaching-unions-jeremy-hunt-tory-austerity
The 45p cut to the additional rate may have needed to go as unaffordable and politically damaging, the cut to the basic rate did not
Yes that may make winning the next election extremely difficult. But it won't be winnable if we collapse economically either.
The government confirmed that the requisition of essential fuel workers at the blockaded Port Jérôme refinery at Notre-Dame-de-Gravenchon, in Normandy, would begin on Wednesday. But the controversial move could risk stoppages spreading to other sectors in support of the fuel strikers.
The government is facing a deepening crisis after weeks of stoppages led by the leftwing CGT trade union, which is seeking large pay rises for workers at two oil firms, the French TotalEnergies and the US ExxonMobil. Strikers want better pay amid the cost-of-living crisis and a share of companies’ high profits.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/12/totalenergies-exxonmobil-fears-french-fuel-crisis-spread-plans-order-strikers-work
Amazing how Brexit has caused economic chaos all around the world.
The country is utterly weary of the hard right and left, and you will soon be a dinosaur
Only Farage and the populist right can deliver extinction for the Tories by replacing them as the main party of the British right
Robert Peston
@Peston
I completely understand the argument that it would be insane - contempt for the way we do democracy - for a political party to change its leader TWICE after a general election. It is why till recently I assumed Liz Truss would surely lead her party into the next…
https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1581405094871826432