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Remember Truss was 3rd place amongst CON MPs – politicalbetting.com

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  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    IanB2 said:

    You must be joking (on the first bit). My grammar school Latin teacher used to give extra marks if our Latin homework was handed in done in different coloured pens; “beauty marks”, he used to call them. I dropped that subject as soon as I could, and have yet to find a country where what little I can remember from those classes helps me order a beer.
    Try any ancient church or cathedral, medieval charters, most of Rome and you will find plenty of Latin inscriptions
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    Carnyx said:

    What an attitude to intellectual endeavour you have - it only counts if it is the traditional upper class style c. 1930:

    posh - tick
    public school - tick
    history of art - tick
    Balliol College - double tick
    Latin and Greek - tick, double tick if it's Greats at Oxford ...

    An intellectual is supposed to read widely on a range of subjects, including science, history, art etc. You said you have no interest in history of art so clearly it does not apply to us
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,835
    HYUFD said:

    Try any ancient church or cathedral, medieval charters, most of Rome and you will find plenty of Latin inscriptions
    Do they serve beer?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,321

    It’s just that the actual substance of what he was selling wasn't good most of the time. He was polishing a turd. If he'd been selling great policies, he'd have been amazing.
    Well there's no point pining for what never was in the first place.

    He's gone (he's gone) oh my - we'd better learn how to face it ....
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    IanB2 said:

    Al Zahawi’s trajectory has been remarkable, promoted from obscurity to UK government chancellor, then knifes his boss a few days later, puts up for the leadership but is rejected by his colleagues, then slain by an American drone. Has there ever been a political career like it?
    I think that contribution is almost as confused as my contributions on ancient Greek. Well done.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    ohnotnow said:

    I've only just twigged that 2024 might be the year of :

    * UK general election
    * "Indyref2" (in theory - assuming the SNP run their election campaign as an 'indyref' platform)
    * London mayoral election
    * US Presidential election

    Combined with possible economic bad times, that's going to be quite the news cycle.
    Don’t forget the Paris Olympics, Bulgaria joining the Euro, the Russian presidential election, Queen Elizabeth surpassing Louis XIV as the longest-reigning monarch in verified history and Euro 24 in Germany.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 33,924
    edited August 2022
    Leon said:

    It's getting quite bad down here.....


    "London's River Thames has shrunk as extreme heat and looming drought dries up its headwaters..."

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/05/uk/uk-london-thames-river-climate-gbr-intl/index.html
    Because there are too many people living in the south-east of England.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    darkage said:

    I've been thinking a bit about the complaints by Conservatives about the 'left blob' thing.
    A major contributory factor to the left blob is that people who work in public service are not really motivated by remuneration.
    The Civil service recruit at low levels of pay, and it is the same across much of the public sector.
    Also, when you join the civil service, you can't pursue other financial interests and this is normally a condition of your employment.
    So what you end up is with a certain kind of person that goes in to it, ie: not driven by money, modest expenditure, careful, churchgoer.
    They are more likely to be sympathetic to left wing ideas than right wing.
    People who are entrepeneurial don't go in to this type of job. Nor are people who have experienced any significant success in the commercial world.
    The tories have had 12 years to do something meaningful about this, but actually they have done very little, and freezing the pay of the civil service, which in my view exacerbates the fundamental problem.
    I don’t really buy all of this, but it is a fundamental tenet of modern Toryism to not give a fuck about structural issues because they are quite boring, and to blame “the blob”, “left wing lawyers”, “the wokerati”, “remoaners” etc instead.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    IanB2 said:

    Do they serve beer?
    Certainly in Rome and indeed a few cathedral cafes
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,321
    Leon said:

    It's getting quite bad down here.....


    "London's River Thames has shrunk as extreme heat and looming drought dries up its headwaters..."

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/05/uk/uk-london-thames-river-climate-gbr-intl/index.html
    Sods law if I move to a house on the river just as it dries up and disappears.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    Speaking of structural issues, this thread claims that European rail electrification costs 30% of what it does in the UK.

    https://twitter.com/garethdennis/status/1555520222106378240?s=21&t=aQQi4z2sSzK7BnF1bmyNNw

    Getting to grips with this stuff is the kind of deeply tedious effort that we haven’t seen for quite a while now.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,255

    I don’t really buy all of this, but it is a fundamental tenet of modern Toryism to not give a fuck about structural issues because they are quite boring, and to blame “the blob”, “left wing lawyers”, “the wokerati”, “remoaners” etc instead.
    And to be fair, Neil is himself rather a large blob these days.

  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    edited August 2022
    ohnotnow said:

    I guess in days gone by - the entrepreneurial types would have had a role advising the Treasury or the like in a 'Captains of Industry' position. Not sure when that kind of thing disappeared. 60s at a guess? Once in a while we see someone like 'Former head of Tesco' being brought in to do something with a 'taskforce' or whatever, but not really the same thing.
    Yeah that still happens. But these ceremonial advisory roles don't change the structure and values of institutions.
    You have to look at the people on here, ie @Casino_Royale who are quite successful and do well in their career; around the time when government were trying to hire people to deliver Brexit, as I recall they looked at the wage on offer; and just said no thanks.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,565
    IanB2 said:

    Do they serve beer?
    With a Blood of Christ chaser.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    Off topic

    A quick shout out to the people behind the .gov portal. All things considered, it works really rather well.

    Simple, very clear and quick.

    Well done.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,177
    In America you can rent a 12 ton truck with a regular licence.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    edited August 2022

    Are you saying you’ve never found an opportunity to employ the word thalassocracy?

    Just wow.
    Or thalassemia?

    Bloody autocorrect. Thalassaemia
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,565
    IshmaelZ said:

    The Greeks were very, very clear on the worthlessness of everything not Greek....
    That makes Greece sound a lot like Yorkshire.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
  • In America you can rent a 12 ton truck with a regular licence.
    Absolutely insane
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    I can and do do that anyway, so it is only a reversion to status quo.

    And why illustrate a story about 7.5 tonners with a pic of a row of 12.5t minimum lorries?
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    RIP little Mr Battersbee.

    Very sad situation.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    IanB2 said:


    ..
    Despite the heat in MD these past few weeks, neither are we. Taking out the recycling wheelie bin Thursday night:


  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    IanB2 said:


    ..

    Beautiful
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    darkage said:

    Yeah that still happens. But these ceremonial advisory roles don't change the structure and values of institutions.
    You have to look at the people on here, ie @Casino_Royale who are quite successful and do well in their career; around the time when government were trying to hire people to deliver Brexit, as I recall they looked at the wage on offer; and just said no thanks.
    I don't think it is necessarily left-wing to be "not driven by money, modest expenditure, careful, churchgoer". I think the more plausible explanation is that Neil's conspiracy theory about elders of woke is false, and that the Andrew Baileys and Dido Hardings of this world are just typical of their background.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,006
    ping said:
    Why not, gen x and boomers can drive 7.5 tonnes - at the moment it's just a ban for millenials
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,729
    I also think the "blob" theory is just a rewriting of the Cathedral conspiracy theory of American "neo-reactionary" writer Curtis Yarvin, which probably reached Dom via the so-called intellectual dark web of Silicon Valley right-wingers. If this all sounds daft, welcome to the Internet era!
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    edited August 2022
    France drought: Parched towns left short of drinking water

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62436468

    USA: Half the country is in drought, and no region has been spared

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/04/weather/drought-map-northeast-texas-climate/index.html

    More than 75% of the world could face drought by 2050, UN report warns

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/05/drought-2050-un-report-climate-change/

    End Times. Seriously.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,821

    In America you can rent a 12 ton truck with a regular licence.
    And buy an assault rifle.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468

    Absolutely insane
    Not to mention some pretty heavy-duty construction or farm equipment. But at about $365 per day for a 65 horse tractor (our big one is in the shop in pieces while the hay is rotting in the field), I am not sure many would want to.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,484

    Yes. Which is obviously bad. However, it does show an effect at work. If some Rwanda became 'all claims processed in Rwanda (or similar)' those getting on boats at all would basically be nil.
    Alternatively, the price is dropping to fill seats.

    {O’Leary has entered the chat}

    “Cut prices, hellish conditions?”
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,214
    IshmaelZ said:

    France drought: Parched towns left short of drinking water

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62436468

    USA: Half the country is in drought, and no region has been spared

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/04/weather/drought-map-northeast-texas-climate/index.html

    More than 75% of the world could face drought by 2050, UN report warns

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/05/drought-2050-un-report-climate-change/

    End Times. Seriously.

    I find these stories utterly ridiculous. Where do people think the water can go? If it goes up, it must come down.

    Mad greens (in line with EU policy) have been trying to stop new reservoirs being built for years precisely to stoke such ludicrous alarmism. If it's not drought, it's floods, with rivers that haven't been dredged for years (again, green blob) mysteriously bursting their banks.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,006
    I'd just have the 7.5 tonne restricted to people who obtained a license > 5 years ago
    You probably don't want green 17 year olds charging round in those.
    But the situation at the moment bns those of us born in the early 80s, some of us are the wrong side of 40 :smiley:
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,928
    Andy_JS said:

    Because there are too many people living in the south-east of England.
    The Regent’s Park, two seconds ago. All the trees are dropping leaves in desperation. Like it is mid October

    Another two weeks of this…


  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    HYUFD said:

    An intellectual is supposed to read widely on a range of subjects, including science, history, art etc. You said you have no interest in history of art so clearly it does not apply to us
    I can identify paintings roughly to era and sometimes to artist. And discuss Uccello's use of perspective in his works.

    I just don't have the time to be interested in everything.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,006
    Leon said:

    The Regent’s Park, two seconds ago. All the trees are dropping leaves in desperation. Like it is mid October

    Another two weeks of this…


    The SE of England ought to be using desalination.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,755
    EPG said:

    I also think the "blob" theory is just a rewriting of the Cathedral conspiracy theory of American "neo-reactionary" writer Curtis Yarvin, which probably reached Dom via the so-called intellectual dark web of Silicon Valley right-wingers. If this all sounds daft, welcome to the Internet era!

    It's just conventional 'othering' from a political party that has absolutely run out of ideas and so has nothing to offer to the country except fear and divisiveness.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,001
    IshmaelZ said:

    France drought: Parched towns left short of drinking water

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62436468

    USA: Half the country is in drought, and no region has been spared

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/04/weather/drought-map-northeast-texas-climate/index.html

    More than 75% of the world could face drought by 2050, UN report warns

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/05/drought-2050-un-report-climate-change/

    End Times. Seriously.


    Time to buy shares in solar powered desalination plant makers.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    edited August 2022
    DavidL said:

    I am starting to see that I didn't get as much out of those 4 or 5 classes in 1978 as I thought. Oh well. If ignorance is bliss I am a happy boy.
    You missed some subtleties - like the middle* tense, between active and passive. The dual, between singuilar and plural. And the doubling of the initial syllable for a particular past tense of a verb, perfect I think, with an added initial e for the pluperfect IIRC. All adding to the memorisation task.

    * I teach my son. I have Socrates teach my son. I am taught by Socrates. would IIRC cover the three..
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,888

    Speaking of structural issues, this thread claims that European rail electrification costs 30% of what it does in the UK.

    https://twitter.com/garethdennis/status/1555520222106378240?s=21&t=aQQi4z2sSzK7BnF1bmyNNw

    Getting to grips with this stuff is the kind of deeply tedious effort that we haven’t seen for quite a while now.

    There will be a whole host of reasons for this, and there will be no 'easy' solution.

    A few years ago, I gave an example of how much it cost to add one signal onto an existing railway - and it was in the order of hundreds of thousands of pounds. And from what I could ascertain, much of that was *not* spent on the ground, but in offices.

    But wrt electrification, we do have issues that do not plague Europe as much. We tend to be denser-populated, which means we have more overbridges (just look at the Midland Main Line in Belper for an extreme example). Our loading gauge is smaller, meaning there is less room (though that difference can be overplayed).

    I'd argue that a major issue is that the projects are not cash-strapped. If they run out of money, they're bailed out. People joke about the ECML having 'weak' catenary that blows down in a small breeze, but it was built relatively cheaply and *works*. The GWML electrification appears to be gold-plated. Ingenious solutions to reduce costs are often not tried. Or if they are, they're massively expensive innovations that do not work (as happened with the GWML job).

    But this is also not new. ISTR that Gerry Fiennes mentions the electrification of the lines towards ?Southend?, which seemed to have suffered similar problems to the ones faced by the GWML team today...
  • Speaking of structural issues, this thread claims that European rail electrification costs 30% of what it does in the UK.

    https://twitter.com/garethdennis/status/1555520222106378240?s=21&t=aQQi4z2sSzK7BnF1bmyNNw

    Getting to grips with this stuff is the kind of deeply tedious effort that we haven’t seen for quite a while now.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/sir-roy-mcnulty-report-on-rail-value-for-money-west-coast
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited August 2022

    I don’t really buy all of this, but it is a fundamental tenet of modern Toryism to not give a fuck about structural issues because they are quite boring, and to blame “the blob”, “left wing lawyers”, “the wokerati”, “remoaners” etc instead.
    That's on the home front. Meanwhile in Foreignistan there was Britain's place in Churchill's three "concentric cirles" (North Atlantic, Europe, Commonwealth - sic), now undergoing replacement by forcefully taking the Crimea away from Mr Putin just as Mr Khrushchev (who said he'd vote Tory if he were British) would have wanted, and by committing British forces to get involved in the Chinese civil war if it hots up again: British power on both land and sea! Guns before winter heating!

    Truss - wannabe liberator of the Crimea.
    Sunak - if his illustrious backer William Hague is anything to go by, a wannabe China whacker?

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/us-must-make-clear-it-would-fight-for-taiwan-wd3pft3mv

    "China must be told that an invasion would risk world war" - Hague.

    I keep reading in the British media that the dispute between the PRC and the ROC is about the PRC's view of a rebellious province versus the ROC's view of an island that wants independence. Strange that neither of the actual sides in the dispute see it that way. They both think there's one China. Clearly British wisdom is required.

    Once they've reversed Ukraine's territorial losses and forced the People's Republic of China to wind its neck in on the high seas, the Tories will build a British Apple or Google apparently. And all while cutting taxes. Nurse!
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    edited August 2022
    EPG said:

    I don't think it is necessarily left-wing to be "not driven by money, modest expenditure, careful, churchgoer". I think the more plausible explanation is that Neil's conspiracy theory about elders of woke is false, and that the Andrew Baileys and Dido Hardings of this world are just typical of their background.
    The alternative assessment of this is that the "woke" have now captured the institutions of capitalism, so you can be woke and earn millions.
  • TimT said:


    Beautiful
    I assume you meant to comment on the original picture from God’s own country…
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,888
    ping said:

    Off topic

    A quick shout out to the people behind the .gov portal. All things considered, it works really rather well.

    Simple, very clear and quick.

    Well done.

    That's the thing about both national and local governments - when the services fail, we notice and complain. When the services work well - as they all so often do - we barely think about it.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    Carnyx said:

    I can identify paintings roughly to era and sometimes to artist. And discuss Uccello's use of perspective in his works.

    I just don't have the time to be interested in everything.
    If you can do this, you can do much more than most.

    A little goes a long way, I reckon. Same with wine appreciation.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Pulpstar said:

    The SE of England ought to be using desalination.
    It is

    https://www.water-technology.net/projects/water-desalination/
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    darkage said:

    The alternative assessment of this is that the "woke" have now captured the institutions of capitalism, so you can be woke and earn millions.
    Utter bollocks, except in rarefied parts of US academe-cum-consulting.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,755
    IshmaelZ said:

    It is

    https://www.water-technology.net/projects/water-desalination/
    The Telegraph were reporting the other day that Thames Water have shut down one in East London because it was too expensive.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    IshmaelZ said:

    It is

    https://www.water-technology.net/projects/water-desalination/
    Er, wrong tense apparently?

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/aug/04/emergency-water-plant-london-unusable-despite-drought-risk

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/05/thames-water-shut-emergency-drought-plant-save-money/
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    edited August 2022
    There’s definitely a blob.

    It’s called resistance to change, and exists in every institution ever.

    No doubt Ug the caveman had to face down all sorts of naysayers and jobsworths when he first discovered fire.

    Being anti-blob doesn’t amount to anything approaching a political philosophy or strategy though.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,888
    edited August 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    It is

    https://www.water-technology.net/projects/water-desalination/
    An actual Boris Johnson success story, given Livingstone's repeated attempts to stop the project!

    ISTR it was *very* controversial.

    Edit: I've seen Carnyx's response. Perhaps it *was* a typical Johnson project after all... ;)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    Carnyx said:

    You missed some subtleties - like the middle* tense, between active and passive. The dual, between singuilar and plural. And the doubling of the initial syllable for a particular past tense of a verb, perfect I think, with an added initial e for the pluperfect IIRC. All adding to the memorisation task.

    * I teach my son. I have Socrates teach my son. I am taught by Socrates. would IIRC cover the three..
    I missed out. A couple of days ago I quoted from 1984 and the concept of newspeak brilliantly articulated by Orwell. It was a way of limiting the ability to think by the limitations imposed on language. Some thoughts just become impossible. Given those sorts of options it is not quite so surprising that Greeks are still the starting point for any serious philosophy 3000 years on.
  • Alternatively, the price is dropping to fill seats.

    {O’Leary has entered the chat}

    “Cut prices, hellish conditions?”
    Isn't this just capitalism doing what it does?

    Start with a premium product for the elite.

    Then use the profits and development from that to attack the lower-cost mass market, because that's where the real money is.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766

    I find these stories utterly ridiculous. Where do people think the water can go? If it goes up, it must come down.

    Mad greens (in line with EU policy) have been trying to stop new reservoirs being built for years precisely to stoke such ludicrous alarmism. If it's not drought, it's floods, with rivers that haven't been dredged for years (again, green blob) mysteriously bursting their banks.
    It could end up in the sea, salty and useless. The amount of fresh water in the world is collapsing with the ice sheets of Greenland and Antartica but much of the world that could rely on a steady flow from mountain tops is going to become more arid too. And of course there are far too many people.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 16,261
    Tres said:

    It's just conventional 'othering' from a political party that has absolutely run out of ideas and so has nothing to offer to the country except fear and divisiveness.
    "the blob" and "woke" are just terms the Right uses to denigrate people or ideas that they disagree with but are too lazy to argue against coherently. And Andrew Neil can rant as much as he likes about the Left but it seems to be politicians on the right who are trying to deprive him of a living by refusing to be interviewed by him!
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,177
    Dynamo said:

    That's on the home front. Meanwhile in Foreignistan there was Britain's place in Churchill's three "concentric cirles" (North Atlantic, Europe, Commonwealth - sic), now undergoing replacement by forcefully taking the Crimea away from Mr Putin just as Mr Khrushchev (who said he'd vote Tory if he were British) would have wanted, and by committing British forces to get involved in the Chinese civil war if it hots up again: British power on both land and sea! Guns before winter heating!

    Truss - wannabe liberator of the Crimea.
    Why stop at Crimea? Should Ukraine not take as much Russian territory as necessary for its security? It's what Khrushchev would have wanted.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,778
    @DavidL it's Hume who usually has the cone.

    Smith is much harder to get up to (I would think, having never tried it myself...). Getting one on Wellington - that's seriously impressive.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110

    "the blob" and "woke" are just terms the Right uses to denigrate people or ideas that they disagree with but are too lazy to argue against coherently. And Andrew Neil can rant as much as he likes about the Left but it seems to be politicians on the right who are trying to deprive him of a living by refusing to be interviewed by him!
    Andrew Neil has become a pathetic caricature of himself. It’s long time he disappeared into the Riviera, or some other sunny place for shady people.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Carnyx said:

    Er, wrong tense apparently?

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/aug/04/emergency-water-plant-london-unusable-despite-drought-risk

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/05/thames-water-shut-emergency-drought-plant-save-money/
    "Experts said Thames Water had failed to take into account the varying salt water levels in the Thames estuary."

    Easy sort of detail to overlook.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    Pulpstar said:

    I'd just have the 7.5 tonne restricted to people who obtained a license > 5 years ago
    You probably don't want green 17 year olds charging round in those.
    But the situation at the moment bns those of us born in the early 80s, some of us are the wrong side of 40 :smiley:

    I am pretty sure that I was able to hire a 7.5 tonne removal van back in the days we had flats and moved around a bit more. It must have been legal then.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,006
    IshmaelZ said:

    It is

    https://www.water-technology.net/projects/water-desalination/
    Not in use according to what I heard on the radio yesterday
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    DavidL said:

    I am pretty sure that I was able to hire a 7.5 tonne removal van back in the days we had flats and moved around a bit more. It must have been legal then.
    It's a grandfather clause thing. you can still do it if you passed a car test pre 2000 ish.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    Eabhal said:

    @DavidL it's Hume who usually has the cone.

    Smith is much harder to get up to (I would think, having never tried it myself...). Getting one on Wellington - that's seriously impressive.

    Not the last couple of weeks but yes, the sedentary Hume is an easier target for those so inclined.

    Henry Dundas would presumably be the ultimate challenge.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,006
    DavidL said:

    I am pretty sure that I was able to hire a 7.5 tonne removal van back in the days we had flats and moved around a bit more. It must have been legal then.
    Yes but you passed your test before 1997 didn't you. Its just a de facto exclusion on anyone under 42 now
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    IshmaelZ said:

    It's a grandfather clause thing. you can still do it if you passed a car test pre 2000 ish.
    Ah right, yes it would have been before that. I don't think I would do it now to be honest.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,588
    IshmaelZ said:

    It's a grandfather clause thing. you can still do it if you passed a car test pre 2000 ish.
    Before 1997.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,484
    Pulpstar said:

    Not in use according to what I heard on the radio yesterday
    Pulpstar said:

    Not in use according to what I heard on the radio yesterday
    What we need is more reservoirs to fill when it is wet.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 33,924
    "Why Labour should fear Liz Truss
    Her popularity among the grassroots is no accident
    BY JOHN MCTERNAN
    John McTernan is a British political strategist and former advisor to Tony Blair"

    https://unherd.com/2022/08/why-labour-should-fear-liz-truss/
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,484

    Isn't this just capitalism doing what it does?

    Start with a premium product for the elite.

    Then use the profits and development from that to attack the lower-cost mass market, because that's where the real money is.
    We need more data - to start with why were the prices high? Because that was what the limited capacity would clear at? Was the number of boats limited?
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 16,261

    Andrew Neil has become a pathetic caricature of himself. It’s long time he disappeared into the Riviera, or some other sunny place for shady people.
    It's a shame because he is a serious political journalist and probably our best interviewer of politicians. He didn't do himself any favours getting involved with the farcical GB News.
    People who are attracted to public service careers probably do skew left wing, but equally people in sectors like finance skew right wing. As a left winger in finance I just shrug my shoulders and get on with it - it's not a conspiracy. If we want more right wing civil servants we should probably pay them more.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,110
    Andy_JS said:

    "Why Labour should fear Liz Truss
    Her popularity among the grassroots is no accident
    BY JOHN MCTERNAN
    John McTernan is a British political strategist and former advisor to Tony Blair"

    https://unherd.com/2022/08/why-labour-should-fear-liz-truss/

    One of the main reasons Labour should fear Liz Truss - or Rishi Sunak - or my Aunt Gladys - is that SKS is not very good at retail politics.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,214
    edited August 2022
    DavidL said:

    It could end up in the sea, salty and useless. The amount of fresh water in the world is collapsing with the ice sheets of Greenland and Antartica but much of the world that could rely on a steady flow from mountain tops is going to become more arid too. And of course there are far too many people.
    I don't agree that there are too many people - that is a deeply spurious shibboleth in my opinion. No other living thing shares that view of its own species. When we approach capacity in this planet (if that is possible) we will colonise space.

    The water in the sea still evaporates and falls again as rain. As for the ice sheets melting, that would add more water to the cycle, not take it away. We will perhaps revisit this conversation when facing the usual winter flooding alarm.

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 33,924
    "Almost 35,000 Britons in limbo as Portugal fails to issue post-Brexit ID cards
    British nationals living in country are unable to access healthcare, change jobs or travel in and out

    British nationals living in Portugal are unable to access healthcare, change jobs, or travel in and out of the country as its ministers have not issued them with post-Brexit residency cards, it has emerged. The UK government has raised the issue at ministerial level and urged Portugal to implement fully the withdrawal agreement and protect the rights of the 34,500 Britons who made the country their home before Brexit. People have been left detained at airports, paying to have broken bones treated or risked losing their jobs due to the delays in getting a biometric card that is vital to everyday life and proves their legal status. Under the UK-EU withdrawal agreement, British citizens in Portugal were guaranteed their social and employment rights would be protected. However, the Portuguese government has yet to provide the biometric residency cards.Instead, a temporary document and QR code has been issued, which Britons say is not recognised locally or at international borders."

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/aug/06/britons-portugal-post-brexit-id-cards
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022

    She was (and is fundamentally) a stunning woman. But so many celebrities these days have got 'Putinface' - gone for fillers to puff out the face, eliminate wrinkles, and exaggerate desired characteristics like cheekbones. It looks terrible, especially in motion.

    Trivia: I heard Madonna was originally in line to sing Massive Attack's Teardrop. Which would have made it a very different song. 'Love, love, is a verb. Love is a doing word.'
    Elizabeth Fraser absolutely killed on that track. All-time classic.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,841
    Andy_JS said:

    "Almost 35,000 Britons in limbo as Portugal fails to issue post-Brexit ID cards
    British nationals living in country are unable to access healthcare, change jobs or travel in and out

    British nationals living in Portugal are unable to access healthcare, change jobs, or travel in and out of the country as its ministers have not issued them with post-Brexit residency cards, it has emerged. The UK government has raised the issue at ministerial level and urged Portugal to implement fully the withdrawal agreement and protect the rights of the 34,500 Britons who made the country their home before Brexit. People have been left detained at airports, paying to have broken bones treated or risked losing their jobs due to the delays in getting a biometric card that is vital to everyday life and proves their legal status. Under the UK-EU withdrawal agreement, British citizens in Portugal were guaranteed their social and employment rights would be protected. However, the Portuguese government has yet to provide the biometric residency cards.Instead, a temporary document and QR code has been issued, which Britons say is not recognised locally or at international borders."

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/aug/06/britons-portugal-post-brexit-id-cards

    The Portuguese government is busy trying to attract British talent to Portugal right now, so I'm going with typical government shitness rather than conspiracy.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,841

    I don't agree that there are too many people - that is a deeply spurious shibboleth in my opinion. No other living thing shares that view of its own species. When we approach capacity in this planet (if that is possible) we will colonise space.

    The water in the sea still evaporates and falls again as rain. As for the ice sheets melting, that would add more water to the cycle, not take it away. We will perhaps revisit this conversation when facing the usual winter flooding alarm.

    The earth could easily support 50 or 100 bn people, and quite possibly a lot more, albeit there would need to be some fairly substantial lifestyle changes to achieve this.

    With that said, given reproduction is now in the easy control of humans (almost anywhere), birth rates have absolutely collapsed.

    So the likelihood of the world population exploding (or even growing particularly quickly), seems pretty remote.

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022
    edited August 2022
    Pulpstar said:

    Why not, gen x and boomers can drive 7.5 tonnes - at the moment it's just a ban for millenials
    Yes, 7.5t was the standard weight for a car driving licence up until 1997, when an EU directive standardised it at the smaller 3.5t weight - but with grandfather rights for existing licence-holders.

    It does actually give a lot of issues at the moment, for example using a large car to tow a caravan is often overweight for those with the newer licence. Reverting to the status quo ante is actually a decent Brexit benefit.

    Note that using a 7.5t truck for commercial use, has always required a separate licence and medical.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    I don't agree that there are too many people - that is a deeply spurious shibboleth in my opinion. No other living thing shares that view of its own species. When we approach capacity in this planet (if that is possible) we will colonise space.

    The water in the sea still evaporates and falls again as rain. As for the ice sheets melting, that would add more water to the cycle, not take it away. We will perhaps revisit this conversation when facing the usual winter flooding alarm.
    Quality gibberish. No other living thing has a concept of its own species, let alone the ability to make value judgments about it. and aren't you usually on about how inorganic and empty modern food is? Because you would halve numbers automatically if you abolished non-rockdust fertilisers.

    The ridiculous stories aren't about what might in theory happen, they are about what is actually happening. Do you have any idea how dry the SW USA has been for how long?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,696

    One of the main reasons Labour should fear Liz Truss - or Rishi Sunak - or my Aunt Gladys - is that SKS is not very good at retail politics.
    The piece contains this warning:

    "But [Sunak's] floundering campaign should be a lesson for Labour if they want to confront Liz Truss."

    I confess that I thought Truss would be an utter disaster and they may even ditch her after just one year. I am beginning to wonder whether, like it seems most people, I have seriously underestimated her.

  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    The piece contains this warning:

    "But [Sunak's] floundering campaign should be a lesson for Labour if they want to confront Liz Truss."

    I confess that I thought Truss would be an utter disaster and they may even ditch her after just one year. I am beginning to wonder whether, like it seems most people, I have seriously underestimated her.
    I think there is a non zero chance Starmer will find it quite easy to skewer her repeatedly in HoC, and a 65% likelihood she will fuck up spectacularly over running the country. Being able to see off Sunak in front of a con memb audience doesn't prove very much.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,928
    Insane


  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,841
    IshmaelZ said:

    Quality gibberish. No other living thing has a concept of its own species, let alone the ability to make value judgments about it. and aren't you usually on about how inorganic and empty modern food is? Because you would halve numbers automatically if you abolished non-rockdust fertilisers.

    The ridiculous stories aren't about what might in theory happen, they are about what is actually happening. Do you have any idea how dry the SW USA has been for how long?
    Any yet its population has continued to expand, dramatically.

    Fresh water availability - ultimately - is just an engineering challenge. If we, like the ancient Romans, want lots of people in places without lots of water, then we need to bring it in.

    And if that requires desalination, that requires desalination.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 33,924
    rcs1000 said:

    The Portuguese government is busy trying to attract British talent to Portugal right now, so I'm going with typical government shitness rather than conspiracy.
    That's the explanation 99.9% of the time.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,841
    rcs1000 said:

    Any yet its population has continued to expand, dramatically.

    Fresh water availability - ultimately - is just an engineering challenge. If we, like the ancient Romans, want lots of people in places without lots of water, then we need to bring it in.

    And if that requires desalination, that requires desalination.
    Riyadh, a city of 8 million people in the middle of the desert, is supplied almost entirely from desalination plants on the coast.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,588

    The piece contains this warning:

    "But [Sunak's] floundering campaign should be a lesson for Labour if they want to confront Liz Truss."

    I confess that I thought Truss would be an utter disaster and they may even ditch her after just one year. I am beginning to wonder whether, like it seems most people, I have seriously underestimated her.

    She really is the moron you thought she was. That is not to say the voting public won't be satisfied buyers.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,642
    rcs1000 said:

    The earth could easily support 50 or 100 bn people, and quite possibly a lot more, albeit there would need to be some fairly substantial lifestyle changes to achieve this.

    With that said, given reproduction is now in the easy control of humans (almost anywhere), birth rates have absolutely collapsed.

    So the likelihood of the world population exploding (or even growing particularly quickly), seems pretty remote.

    ISTR something posted a few years back (possibly by you) showing the world has already reached peak child. There will never be more children in the world than there are now. There will be more people, as that peak moves up the age ranges, but it will stabilise at around 11bn, before gently declining.
    Now 11bn is not without its challenges; and nor is a population decline. But I am moderately optimistic about our ability to meet those challenges.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,931
    edited August 2022

    The piece contains this warning:

    "But [Sunak's] floundering campaign should be a lesson for Labour if they want to confront Liz Truss."

    I confess that I thought Truss would be an utter disaster and they may even ditch her after just one year. I am beginning to wonder whether, like it seems most people, I have seriously underestimated her.

    Elements of the Left are spooked by the Boris phenomenon. For them he was just the type of Tory who shouldn't be popular but, for whatever inexplicable reasons, was. But Truss doesn't possess that sort of magic. She's got the kind of face that would make you jump if you turned around at saw it beaming at you, and politically comes across as Boris's annoying younger sister.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    edited August 2022

    One of the main reasons Labour should fear Liz Truss - or Rishi Sunak - or my Aunt Gladys - is that SKS is not very good at retail politics.
    Neither will Truss be, certainly compared to Boris. Whatever else you think about Corbyn he was also a better campaigner and better at retail politics than Starmer even if you would not want him running the country
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,177
    When will Liz Truss have her first meeting with Biden as PM?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    rcs1000 said:

    Any yet its population has continued to expand, dramatically.

    Fresh water availability - ultimately - is just an engineering challenge. If we, like the ancient Romans, want lots of people in places without lots of water, then we need to bring it in.

    And if that requires desalination, that requires desalination.
    Yeah last time I was out your way there were notices on all the restaurant tables saying Fuck off if you were hoping for a glass of water with your meal. How's that going now?

    Everything is just an engineering challenge. The thing is, look how long and how much money it takes to engineer a solution to one specific local problem like the Elizabeth Line or the M25, scale that up to a solution to a global problem, and think of the other global engineering solutions you need like decarbonising and a proper car charging network, and you realise it gets to costing 100x world GDP.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,928

    She really is the moron you thought she was. That is not to say the voting public won't be satisfied buyers.
    I was highly skeptical of Truss in the beginning. Especially after her floundering appearance in that first debate

    But I’ve not seen any evidence she is stupid, let alone “a moron”

    Where is it? What makes her “a moron”? Apart from the fact you disagree with her?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,928
    I feel sorry for anyone on a really expensive Mediterranean holiday right now
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    Dynamo said:

    That's on the home front. Meanwhile in Foreignistan there was Britain's place in Churchill's three "concentric cirles" (North Atlantic, Europe, Commonwealth - sic), now undergoing replacement by forcefully taking the Crimea away from Mr Putin just as Mr Khrushchev (who said he'd vote Tory if he were British) would have wanted, and by committing British forces to get involved in the Chinese civil war if it hots up again: British power on both land and sea! Guns before winter heating!

    Truss - wannabe liberator of the Crimea.
    Sunak - if his illustrious backer William Hague is anything to go by, a wannabe China whacker?

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/us-must-make-clear-it-would-fight-for-taiwan-wd3pft3mv

    "China must be told that an invasion would risk world war" - Hague.

    I keep reading in the British media that the dispute between the PRC and the ROC is about the PRC's view of a rebellious province versus the ROC's view of an island that wants independence. Strange that neither of the actual sides in the dispute see it that way. They both think there's one China. Clearly British wisdom is required.

    Once they've reversed Ukraine's territorial losses and forced the People's Republic of China to wind its neck in on the high seas, the Tories will build a British Apple or Google apparently. And all while cutting taxes. Nurse!
    That is Hague urging the US to contain China, as Biden and Pelosi are already doing. Realistically we are not going to take action v China unless behind the US. Even our actions v Russia on Ukraine are mainly within NATO
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,642
    Leon said:

    Insane


    The weather in Polzeath for the next week is perfect. Cloudless skies, highs of 25. Annoyingly, I have done something painful to my back and almost any movement is tiring and painful. Had hoped to go stand up paddleboarding on Wednesday and will be very disappointed if I can't, not least for my daughters who have been looking forward to it for some time. Fingers crossed for some sort of recovery.
    Anyway, the beach at Polzeath: those who know it will know that it's perfection includes a stream which courses down the beach presenting opportunities for digging and damming. It is just too wide to leap; you have to take your socks and shoes off and ford it. We have been here every August since 2016 and done this. This year, the stream is a bare trickle six inches wife rather than six feet wide.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,305
    Leon said:

    I feel sorry for anyone on a really expensive Mediterranean holiday right now

    If these hot UK summers continue you may as well stay home in summer and go to the Mediterranean in the autumn or the Canary Isles in winter instead
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Cookie said:

    ISTR something posted a few years back (possibly by you) showing the world has already reached peak child. There will never be more children in the world than there are now. There will be more people, as that peak moves up the age ranges, but it will stabilise at around 11bn, before gently declining.
    Now 11bn is not without its challenges; and nor is a population decline. But I am moderately optimistic about our ability to meet those challenges.
    Median world household income is about $10,000. your optimism has to include optimism that the poor are going to be happy staying poor, because in terms of resource consumtion bringing them all up to the living standards of very very poor westerners is equivalent to doubling (at a guess) the population.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,766
    It's blowing a gale here atm. It was raining earlier and the clouds indicate that that is likely to happen again but these people moaning about another week of unbroken sunshine should try living up here. It has been a very ordinary summer and things like BBQs are extremely difficult to plan because we get 2 or 3 different weathers in a day.
This discussion has been closed.