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A Tory coronation? – politicalbetting.com

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  • OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,272
    People just aren't being bright about this are they?

    Rother District Council told people to avoid visiting Camber Sands in East Sussex, because of the risk of getting stuck in traffic.

    "The Met Office has issued an extreme heat warning, so the last place you want to be is stuck in a car!" it said.

    By 14:00 BST traffic stretched back several miles and car parks were full.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-62198021
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.
  • prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 441
    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
  • prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 441

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    Sorry - that should be 4:03pm, not 4:30!
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 14,884
    kle4 said:

    Goddamn it is green in this country


    Not for much longer if this heat keeps up... Salisbury plain looking very brown and yellow right now.
  • OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,272

    kle4 said:

    Goddamn it is green in this country


    Not for much longer if this heat keeps up... Salisbury plain looking very brown and yellow right now.
    Captain Mainwaring will be loading up the smoke shells for an exercise then.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760
    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    She could be both, of course
    Of course. I suspect that's the right answer.
    Well, she is a Conservative MP. That's usually an fair indication.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited July 2022
    Massive missed stumping / catch there.
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 2,397
    Cyclefree (and others) may find this story of interest: "A transgender inmate who impregnated two women while incarcerated at Edna Mahan Correctional Facility for Women has been moved to a new facility, according to the Department of Corrections.

    Demi Minor, 27, was transferred to Garden State Youth Correctional Facility, a prison for young adult offenders in Burlington County, last month, Dan Sperrazza, a Department of Corrections spokesman, said."
    source: https://www.nj.com/news/2022/07/transgender-woman-who-impregnated-2-inmates-removed-from-njs-female-prison.html (Many legal details in the rest of the article.)

    Minor is not in for a minor offense: He/She is serving 30 years for manslaughter.

    (The article doesn't mention what happened to the two fetuses/babies, so I assume they were disposed of before birth. And I would agree that Edna Mahan does not soudn like a good place to raise a child.)
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,840
    edited July 2022

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    Ah!
    So you're one of those snowflakes the Common Sense Group has identified?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    The second debate is tonight, isn't it? Which channel?
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 14,884

    kle4 said:

    Topley been a revelation this summer.

    His hairstyle is a disgrace.
    You aren't down with the kids. Mullet all the rage.
    Never a surer sign that the latest generation are going astray. Sod all that pronoun business.
    At least you can do something about the terrible haircut, the terrible tats a lot of younger people have (that isn't to say all tatoos are bad, just I see a hell of a lot of terrible ones)....I foresee tattoo removable businesses being a massive growth industry in 10 years time.
    One rather attractive young lady I saw today looked like she’d been in a road accident, so much black and purple covered her arms and legs. Only on slightly closer viewing did it resolve to rather ugly tattoos.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,840
    OnboardG1 said:

    People just aren't being bright about this are they?

    Rother District Council told people to avoid visiting Camber Sands in East Sussex, because of the risk of getting stuck in traffic.

    "The Met Office has issued an extreme heat warning, so the last place you want to be is stuck in a car!" it said.

    By 14:00 BST traffic stretched back several miles and car parks were full.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-62198021

    The newspapers have chosen to highlight stories of extreme heat with pictures of happy folk on the beach.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,739
    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074
    edited July 2022
    FF43 said:

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    I don’t think any of that is vacuous. They just need elaboration.

    I noted last night though that her claim that “welfare begins at home” should logically mean that wealthy pensioners should stay using the equity in their houses.

    The welfare bill is overwhelmingly pensions and assorted elderly add-ons.
    You are so kind to Badenoch. The definition of "vacuous" surely is that it needs elaboration.

    Not my usual reading but saw a discussion about Badenoch on Mumsnet. They totally saw through her, particularly on the subject of teaching assistants that she apparently dismissed as useless. They know TAs are often keeping schools together.
    Yes - that was a stupid mistake by her.

    Lack of knowledge? That would be odd given that she has 3 children.

    Inexperience? Possibly.

    Or too wedded to ideology? That would be worrying.
  • OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,272
    Speaking of insulation, the quite expensive PIR boards I had put up in my attic a couple of months ago have started falling down. To give the tradesman involved his due he replied within the hour on a Saturday night and offered to come in the week after next to fix it. He's well accredited so he trades on a good reputation. I assume they weren't cut to size correctly when installed. I'm sure it'll all get sorted out but it's an arseache I really don't need.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    If TSE finds you after that, your last words will sound a bit French:

    'Help! help! Murd...'
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,153

    The second debate is tonight, isn't it? Which channel?

    ITV 7pm
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    edited July 2022
    dixiedean said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    People just aren't being bright about this are they?

    Rother District Council told people to avoid visiting Camber Sands in East Sussex, because of the risk of getting stuck in traffic.

    "The Met Office has issued an extreme heat warning, so the last place you want to be is stuck in a car!" it said.

    By 14:00 BST traffic stretched back several miles and car parks were full.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-62198021

    The newspapers have chosen to highlight stories of extreme heat with pictures of happy folk on the beach.
    By Tuesday, they’ll be talking about all the idiots who ignored official advise and spent the day outside - on the beach - and ended up in the hospital.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Hang on, you said "The Nazis were quite good at some things" but so far have not explained what things they were good at.

    I mean, I can think of a few things (genocide, oppression, aggression, forced sterilisation...) but I am guessing these are not what you had in mind?
    Well, that part of their philosophy, the pursuit of the healthy body, was what I was going to say they were quite good at. It wasn't a developed point, hence I didn't post it, vanilla saved it and reinserted it into my post.

    This is a common thread running through most of my arguments about public policy. Being healthy - positively thriving, not just 'not sick', is a solution to so much. It's a solution to funding the NHS and later years care, it's a solution to extending the life of our workforce, it's a solution to dealing with Covid - not just strategies for 'not getting it', but to being robust enough to shrug it off. Perhaps behind spiritual health, physical health is the most important thing that we have.

    I seem to remember your solution includes quite a few 'odd' ideas on nutrition, never proven by any testing?

    That said, I am personally convinced that modern diets do a lot of harm. Ultra processed foods in particular seem to be rather suspect. See Tim Spector's recent Zoe podcasts on the subject of UPFs and the gut biome.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969

    The second debate is tonight, isn't it? Which channel?

    ITV1 at 7pm.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760
    edited July 2022
    Scott_xP said:

    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
    Hey, don't look at me. I built my own computer, but air con is tougher.
  • prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 441
    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
    when they show up
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969

    Massive missed stumping / catch there.

    I've said for years that they should give the gloves to Bairstow, he's a better keeper than Buttler.

    It'll allow Buttler to focus on his captaincy and batting.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,281

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Why are high cheekbones 'physical perfection'?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
    Hey, don't look at me. I built my own computer, but air con is tougher.
    An old freezer is a good starting point, for a MacGyver or A-Team air conditioner.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Injected with *botulism?*!!!!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969
    edited July 2022

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
    when they show up
    Luddite.

    We're all very committed to the job, because of the sanctions following the further invasion of Ukraine, my staff and I have earned enough TOIL time to take the rest of the year off.

    But we won't take off the rest of the year, just July, August, and December.

    But they'll remember times like this week about how good we are to them, it's not always just about the money.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    I have never heard Badenoch attack Sunak. Not once. I didn't watch the debate. But if she reserves all her ire for Penny, and leaves Sunak alone, that bears questioning. Why does she think Sunak wouldn't be as good a leader as her? What is her critique of his stewardship of the economy, which is surely more important than her critique of Mordaunt's toilet policy?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,760
    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
    Hey, don't look at me. I built my own computer, but air con is tougher.
    An old freezer is a good starting point, for a MacGyver or A-Team air conditioner.
    Aaaaand we're off about Johnson again.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047
    ydoethur said:

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Injected with *botulism?*!!!!
    Yes, what do you think botox is? It's rat poison.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
    when they show up
    Luddite.

    We're all very committed to the job, because of the sanctions following the further invasion of Ukraine, my staff and I have earned enough TOIL time to take the rest of the year off.

    But we won't take off the rest of the year, just July, August, and December.

    But they'll remember times like this week about how good we are to them, it's not always just about the money.
    yeah just responding to your usual smugness with a cheap jibe - sorry i know you are perfect
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Anything happening with Penny, her price just went over 3 on bf.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    What she’s saying, is that the legislation she worked on was initiated when Ms Mourdaunt was the minister responsible, and it looked like it had been written by Stonewall and the civil service.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    Pulpstar said:

    Anything happening with Penny, her price just went over 3 on bf.

    Busy Lizzy moving in a touch.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    Hotels that promise cool rooms see bookings soar on Monday and Tuesday

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-11021791/Families-book-hotel-rooms-temperatures-reach-35-degrees.html

    For all SeanT aliases.....
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Why are high cheekbones 'physical perfection'?
    That's a circular question. We appreciate physical 'perfection' because it's indicative of good prospects for procreation. Prominent cheekbones, I suppose, mean the body has had spare resources of minerals to develop a thicker bone structure in that area. Perfact teeth are another example, because the jaw has developed big enough for the teeth to hang straight. All the traditional attractiveness markers are indicators of physical health, just like a ripe juicy apple is an indicator of a healthy fruit.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    OnboardG1 said:

    Speaking of insulation, the quite expensive PIR boards I had put up in my attic a couple of months ago have started falling down. To give the tradesman involved his due he replied within the hour on a Saturday night and offered to come in the week after next to fix it. He's well accredited so he trades on a good reputation. I assume they weren't cut to size correctly when installed. I'm sure it'll all get sorted out but it's an arseache I really don't need.

    You have a good username
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,739
    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,933
    OnboardG1 said:

    People just aren't being bright about this are they?

    Rother District Council told people to avoid visiting Camber Sands in East Sussex, because of the risk of getting stuck in traffic.

    "The Met Office has issued an extreme heat warning, so the last place you want to be is stuck in a car!" it said.

    By 14:00 BST traffic stretched back several miles and car parks were full.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-62198021

    An air-conditioned car might be all right but anyone with a modern car ought to have Waze or similar to warn of congestion.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
    when they show up
    Luddite.

    We're all very committed to the job, because of the sanctions following the further invasion of Ukraine, my staff and I have earned enough TOIL time to take the rest of the year off.

    But we won't take off the rest of the year, just July, August, and December.

    But they'll remember times like this week about how good we are to them, it's not always just about the money.
    yeah just responding to your usual smugness with a cheap jibe - sorry i know you are perfect
    As a relentless optimist I try and see the best from any situation and I'm trying to the take positives from Covid-19.

    I think it has massively changed working practices for the good for both employer and employees.

    Productivity has improved for so many as the staff don't waste 2/3 hours a day commuting in. It also leads to a better work life balance.

    Other benefits for the employers is we can recruit further afield.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,789

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Why are high cheekbones 'physical perfection'?
    That's a circular question. We appreciate physical 'perfection' because it's indicative of good prospects for procreation. Prominent cheekbones, I suppose, mean the body has had spare resources of minerals to develop a thicker bone structure in that area. Perfact teeth are another example, because the jaw has developed big enough for the teeth to hang straight. All the traditional attractiveness markers are indicators of physical health, just like a ripe juicy apple is an indicator of a healthy fruit.
    I've just re-named my girlfriend "ripe juicy apple" on whatsapp.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,933
    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
    Hey, don't look at me. I built my own computer, but air con is tougher.
    An old freezer is a good starting point, for a MacGyver or A-Team air conditioner.
    What do professional hot-weather workers use? Ice-packs in jacket pockets? Or Formula One drivers sitting on the grid for what seems like hours before kick-off?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    edited July 2022

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ydoethur said:

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My school has aircon only in 10 rooms. Five are ComSci, one is English (long story).

    Do you think it's too late for me to retrain as a DT teacher?
    Can you not find enough bits in the science/engineering departments to manufacture one?
    Hey, don't look at me. I built my own computer, but air con is tougher.
    An old freezer is a good starting point, for a MacGyver or A-Team air conditioner.
    What do professional hot-weather workers use? Ice-packs in jacket pockets? Or Formula One drivers sitting on the grid for what seems like hours before kick-off?
    F1 drivers use something like this:

    https://www.amazon.com/Compcooler-Outerwear-breathable-Freezable-Comfortble/dp/B07CMCHJ7P/

    It pumps cold water around the jacket with a small electric motor, sourced from an ice gel pack which you put in the freezer beforehand.

    For those on smaller budgets, a cloth wet with cold water on the head, or a wet t-shirt.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,933
    edited July 2022

    Betfair next prime minister
    2.76 Rishi Sunak 36%
    2.9 Penny Mordaunt 34%
    6.6 Liz Truss 15%
    7.6 Kemi Badenoch 13%
    95 Tom Tugendhat
    130 Dominic Raab

    To make the final two
    1.09 Rishi Sunak 92%
    1.5 Penny Mordaunt 67%
    3.05 Liz Truss 33%
    5.3 Kemi Badenoch 19%
    48 Tom Tugendhat

    Next PM
    2.58 Rishi Sunak 39%
    3.3 Penny Mordaunt 30%
    4.7 Liz Truss 21%
    8.4 Kemi Badenoch 12%
    110 Dominic Raab
    110 Tom Tugendhat

    Next Con leader
    2.58 Rishi Sunak 39%
    3.45 Penny Mordaunt 29%
    4.8 Liz Truss 21%
    8.2 Kemi Badenoch 12%
    100 Tom Tugendhat

    To make the final two
    1.07 Rishi Sunak 93%
    1.55 Penny Mordaunt 65%
    2.62 Liz Truss 38%
    5.8 Kemi Badenoch 17%
    90 Tom Tugendhat

    ETA we've mentioned this before but it is worth noting there is not enough money in these markets for the bot-writers to link them, so occasionally odd gaps open up.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,281
    edited July 2022

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    Absolutely - look how much one debate has changed it.

    After more debates and campaigning I wouldn't be surprised if Sunak beats Truss pretty easily.

    The fact the numbers are moving so much so quickly shows nobody's support is at all solid.

    If Sunak outdebates and outperforms Truss significantly in the Final campaign against Truss then members will quickly move away from Truss.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,047

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Of all the contenders, he's the only one we've had an extended advanced preview of - he's been the one running the economy. And he can't use the line that Boris told him what to do, as events have shown that he consistently blocked policies that the Treasury didn't like. I think incapable is a fair assessment. Inadequate is perhaps an even better word.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,973
    Had a lovely conversation with my Tory voting, Boris loving grandparents in their 80s today.

    Unprompted - they said - “anyone but Liz Truss”

    Interesting
  • jonny83jonny83 Posts: 1,261

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Not sure competent is a word I would use, especially when it comes to his performance with the economy.

    Best of a bad bunch? One could argue that. Bad is still bad though.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Not sure competent is a word I would use, especially when it comes to his performance with the economy.

    Best of a bad bunch? One could argue that. Bad is still bad though.
    To me (not a tory member) the two most suitable grown up competent candidates went out in the first round (Hunt and Zahawi). Not sure what it says about modern MPs that they selected this bunch for the final rounds
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,933
    MikeL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    Absolutely - look how much one debate has changed it.

    After more debates and campaigning I wouldn't be surprised if Sunak beats Truss pretty easily.

    The fact the numbers are moving so much so quickly shows nobody's support is at all solid.

    If Sunak outdebates and outperforms Truss significantly in the Final campaign against Truss then members will quickly move away from Truss.
    Perhaps, or it might be that Truss goes back and rehearses her answers for next time whereas Sunak rests on his laurels. We'll find out in a couple of hours, I guess.

    But I can't see that Rishi destroyed Boris's career. That was Boris.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688
    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Not sure competent is a word I would use, especially when it comes to his performance with the economy.

    Best of a bad bunch? One could argue that. Bad is still bad though.
    A poor chancellor.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,074

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,071
    edited July 2022

    ydoethur said:

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Injected with *botulism?*!!!!
    Yes, what do you think botox is? It's rat poison.
    No, that is warfarin.

    Botox is Botulinum Toxin, hence the abbreviation.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,071
    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,088

    Hotels that promise cool rooms see bookings soar on Monday and Tuesday

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-11021791/Families-book-hotel-rooms-temperatures-reach-35-degrees.html

    For all SeanT aliases.....

    Moving into one myself to seek shelter for the two nights of Hadean horror. Work also has a very good aircon system, so my overall exposure to vile oven-like conditions ought hopefully to be very limited.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969
    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,349
    edited July 2022
    Every time I see Liz Truss now, I think ... "Gottle of geer, gottle of geer."
  • eekeek Posts: 24,797

    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Not sure competent is a word I would use, especially when it comes to his performance with the economy.

    Best of a bad bunch? One could argue that. Bad is still bad though.
    To me (not a tory member) the two most suitable grown up competent candidates went out in the first round (Hunt and Zahawi). Not sure what it says about modern MPs that they selected this bunch for the final rounds
    Zahawi - never seen a tax avoidance scheme He’s not tried once is a suitable person to be PM?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,026

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    Not much in it though. I think I'd want to be backing Rishi in any members ballot there. ConHome is a tough right-wing crowd for him.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    Well that's pretty awful. The West Indies have long been the heart of cricket. The fun of cricket. The wonderful shinyness of cricket.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,026
    Pulpstar said:

    Anything happening with Penny, her price just went over 3 on bf.

    If you're explaining, you're losing.

    Also the latest ConHome poll.
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,349
    Ms Cyclefree,

    "The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity."

    At least she's come to the right side now. I'll forgive as she's easy on the eye.

    I never denied being shallow.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,281
    edited July 2022
    I'm surprised Sunak is odds against.

    He beats Mordaunt (still his most likely opponent) head to head and I reckon he's at least 50:50 to beat Truss.

    Note that Con Home still haven't published run-off results involving Badenoch.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    Omnium said:

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    Well that's pretty awful. The West Indies have long been the heart of cricket. The fun of cricket. The wonderful shinyness of cricket.
    Sort of would help though if West indies (players and fans) supported Test Cricket more though -
  • eekeek Posts: 24,797

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    I would expect nothing less of that place. Is it in working hours or do you need to make up the billable hours?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,026
    MikeL said:

    I'm surprised Sunak is odds against.

    He beats Mordaunt (still his most likely opponent) head to head and I reckon he's at least 50:50 to beat Truss.

    I think Rishi is a buy. Debate tonight will be interesting.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,415
    edited July 2022
    eek said:

    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Rishi Sunak: 42 per cent (Last Monday: 34 per cent.)

    Liz Truss: 49 per cent. (Last Monday: 51 per cent.)

    Decent for Sunak, feels like he has the momentum again.
    What he's done is try to destroy someone's political career to force his unwanted attentions toward a job that he is manifestly incapable of on the Tory party. I think he'll regret that.
    I think all the contenders are a bit out of their depth really, but Sunak is probably the most competent.
    Not sure competent is a word I would use, especially when it comes to his performance with the economy.

    Best of a bad bunch? One could argue that. Bad is still bad though.
    To me (not a tory member) the two most suitable grown up competent candidates went out in the first round (Hunt and Zahawi). Not sure what it says about modern MPs that they selected this bunch for the final rounds
    Zahawi - never seen a tax avoidance scheme He’s not tried once is a suitable person to be PM?
    well as long as he has not broken the law ( unlike Rishi who definitely has broken the law and fined for it ) then astute tax planning at least shows he has some ruthlessness and shrewdness. He was in charge of the most sucessful government operation for years in the vaccine roll-out
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772

    All-Ireland hurling final this afternoon at 3:30pm. PP's odds are:
    Limerick 2/5
    Kilkenny 15/8
    Limerick highly fancied to win their third in a row, but it's 28C in Dublin this afternoon and Kilkenny have a younger team, so that may be to their advantage.

    Limerick hang on for a win by 1-31 to 2-26
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969
    How come Betfred restricted my account to penny stakes and let others put on £30k?

    If Rory wins Open it's going to cost us at least £750k. One golf expert in London got £30k on at 12/1

    https://twitter.com/Betfred/status/1548702683514736641
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,773

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    They are sound bites but not vacuous

    1/2/4 basically say that the government isn’t good at delivering and needs to be reformed so it is more efficient

    3/5 say that a government needs a vision - that it shouldn’t be responding just to what Twitter/the media says nor what they thing the public want to hear … they need to focus on doing what they believe

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    edited July 2022

    Our CEO just emailed to tell us all employees are being given Monday and Tuesday afternoon off with pay (office based job). Hopefully other employers are feeling similarly enlightened!

    On Friday I issued a full WFH order for Mon/Tues with the note that if becomes too hot for WFH they can down tools.
    You are becoming very French.
    It's the reason why I've got the best staff retention stats in the office.
    Any openings? I may be slightly undercut by lack of any knowledge, experience or skill in the field, but I have competent Word skills. Except spelling.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,281
    Rory hasn't holed a single putt.

    With average putting he would be three or maybe four ahead.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 23,933

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    My American international megacorp's compulsory training gave us a certificate in dealing with an active shooter.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,071

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    My hospital is distributing ice lollies and drinks, but apart from that it is mask up, and keep at it.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,243

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    Why not?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,408
    Omnium said:

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    Well that's pretty awful. The West Indies have long been the heart of cricket. The fun of cricket. The wonderful shinyness of cricket.
    Terrible decision. There are few enough teams, it should have five years at least between tours.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Omnium said:

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    Well that's pretty awful. The West Indies have long been the heart of cricket. The fun of cricket. The wonderful shinyness of cricket.
    Sort of would help though if West indies (players and fans) supported Test Cricket more though -
    One of the biggest industries in the WIndies is tourism. More tourists turn up to watch England visit, than any other team.

    I’ve definitely thought about both a Carribean tour and Ashes tour, take a couple of months off and combine sport with a holiday.

    I’ve got 17 Grands Prix still to go to as well!
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 6,773

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    I don’t think any of that is vacuous. They just need elaboration.

    I noted last night though that her claim that “welfare begins at home” should logically mean that wealthy pensioners should stay using the equity in their houses.

    The welfare bill is overwhelmingly pensions and assorted elderly add-ons.
    You are fundamentally missing her point because you view it through a financial lens

    She is saying that families have a responsibility to care for their relatives and can’t just rely on the state

  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    @Xipe
    I see you. And if you are who I think you are, please just stay gone.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,072

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    I don’t think any of that is vacuous. They just need elaboration.

    I noted last night though that her claim that “welfare begins at home” should logically mean that wealthy pensioners should stay using the equity in their houses.

    The welfare bill is overwhelmingly pensions and assorted elderly add-ons.
    You are fundamentally missing her point because you view it through a financial lens

    She is saying that families have a responsibility to care for their relatives and can’t just rely on the state

    Like not asking the state to subsidise their inheritance you mean?
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    My American international megacorp's compulsory training gave us a certificate in dealing with an active shooter.
    Is it tasteless that I'm imagining the certificate to be one of those gun shooting range bad guy target outlines?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,812

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    I don’t think any of that is vacuous. They just need elaboration.

    I noted last night though that her claim that “welfare begins at home” should logically mean that wealthy pensioners should stay using the equity in their houses.

    The welfare bill is overwhelmingly pensions and assorted elderly add-ons.
    You are fundamentally missing her point because you view it through a financial lens

    She is saying that families have a responsibility to care for their relatives and can’t just rely on the state

    But this is a principle upon which we are expected to imagine policies.

    So what policies can we imagine?

    I would also argue there is a context here which we all broadly concede, which is that the country’s finances are a bit fucked.

  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 395
    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.
  • OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,272

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    They are sound bites but not vacuous

    1/2/4 basically say that the government isn’t good at delivering and needs to be reformed so it is more efficient

    3/5 say that a government needs a vision - that it shouldn’t be responding just to what Twitter/the media says nor what they thing the public want to hear … they need to focus on doing what they believe

    I struggle to see how this is anything other than a platitude farm.

    Note: The you is the royal you referring to Badenoch, not any specific poster.
    1. Everyone says this. "Fix the way government works" has been a filler line since my Dad was a babe.
    2. Doing less for better is the political equivalent of "Work smarter not harder". It is an empty phrase unless you can reasonably explain what you aren't going to do.
    3. I'm not sure the present government, or any government thus far, has given a damn about Twitter. Even right-wing twitter. It's a strawman. State what you believe people's priorities to be and then explain how you will address them. Otherwise this is meaningless.
    4. Again, unless you specify "different" this is meaningless. You could invade France or scrap the state pension and it would be different.
    5. This is a fine sentiment, but you've promised tax cuts and not explained what you'll cut to pay the piper. Details.
    We regularly drag Starmer on here (often rightly) for talking in these sorts of soundbites without presenting a compelling vision and this isn't any different. All I get is a sort of ill-defined small-stateism with no meat on it. That could change tonight at the debate but I bet it doesn't.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,088

    How come Betfred restricted my account to penny stakes and let others put on £30k?

    If Rory wins Open it's going to cost us at least £750k. One golf expert in London got £30k on at 12/1

    https://twitter.com/Betfred/status/1548702683514736641

    You were too successful too often and got blacklisted? We've got one of those at work, got too good at picking the horses, now the bookies won't deal with him. For all you know, that "golf expert" might actually have flushed several hundred grand down the toilet backing their failed guesses in the past.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 113,969
    EXCLUSIVE:

    In a big campaign pledge today Rishi Sunak promised a bonfire of retained EU law by the next election

    But leaked documents show just last month he argued this would take longer than 2026, and EU tax law had to be exempt


    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1548683950884896768
This discussion has been closed.