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What’s this doing to Johnson’s survival chances? – politicalbetting.com

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  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493

    rcs1000 said:

    So I have spent the past few days “defending” the Rwanda policy to my friends, or at least refusing to condemn it outright.

    I see today that scheme is for men only?

    Presumably husbands will be separated from their wives; fathers from their children.

    Fuck right off.
    This is an abomination.

    I see too the IMF is predicting the UK will be slowest economy between 20 and 24 - essentially static on a per capita basis.

    We can’t stand another two years of this.
    The government needs to fall NOW.

    No no no! The only men coming to these shores are terrorists and scroungers. So off they go to Rwanda, The women and children get on these boats to claim asylum because being drowned in the channel is preferable to just claiming asylum in the oh yeah there is no legal way they can claim asylum.

    So yeah. Separate families it is. You're against that? Big wet blanket ye are.

    To be fair its not hard enough. Lets punish them further! Make them live on Canvey Island! Make them drink tapwater! Fly them out of Manchester Airport!
    You sick bastard.
    Mrs RP has a build. "Why fly them out at all? The queue at Manchester Airport is never-ending. They'll never escape"
    @Gardenwalker its focused on *single* men (I think between ages of 18-25 but not sure about that) - so prone economic migrants. Married men travelling with their family are exempt
    Yes, so as May said this will lead to a big increase in women and children trafficking. "You can't deport me, here are my family"
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,003
    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938
    On Ukraine, BBC reporting (unable to verify):

    - After attempts by Russian forces to storm Rubizhne and Severodonetsk localities, around 130 wounded troops were taken to a local hospital.

    - Ukrainian military have repulsed 10 attacks by Russian forces in Donetsk and Luhansk over the past 24 hours.

    - Twelve tanks, 28 armoured vehicles and one artillery system have been destroyed, and Ukraine's air force has hit nine targets - one plane, one helicopter, six UAVs and a cruise missile.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644

    Taz said:

    There is a lingering feeling that PBers are less keen on moving on from covid than the public at large. The statistics are clear: it’s less risky than influenza and has been for some time.

    Since the mask mandate was dropped here yesterday I think the number of people complying with the request by Tesco et al to wear a mask is 80%. As soon as pox rates collapse back into singe digits I'll stop bothering.
    I’d say we saw similar here in Waitrose when it ceased to be a legal requirement but was a request by the store, most carried on. It’s gradually declined to around 10 to 20% now.
    I do our weekly shop in our local sainsburys in Durham. If I see more than a couple of people with masks that is all, same on the buses.

    I just don’t bother now, either.
    There’s a lady on my street who seemingly wears a mask at all times. I walked past her house the other day and she was masked while scrubbing her own front step. Bar her, I rarely see a mask on anyone all day.
    I was hoping to catch up with somebody at a conference in a few months time and they said that the conference isn't going to enforce mask wearing rules so they wouldn't be attending and although they aren't clinically vulnerable, vaccinated etc, they wouldn't feel safe.

    Each to their own, but I wonder some people are suffering a sort of PTSD, where they see danger at every turn and lost sense of the a) the risk profile and b) that unless you insist on living like a hermit for the rest of your days, you are going to come into contact with COVID at some point.
    a) That’s not now PTSD works. b) Have we not learnt by now that you can get multiple re-infections? You write as if getting COVID is a one and done affair.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    jonny83 said:

    Looks like this 'mystery' Hepatitis in children is turning up in more countries:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-61157909

    One of Putin's presents to the world?
    Well, we all know he’s yellow right through.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 29,177
    Good morning one and all.

    Hope OGH recovers quickly, with no lasting after-effects.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 57,066
    edited April 20
    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493

    Taz said:

    There is a lingering feeling that PBers are less keen on moving on from covid than the public at large. The statistics are clear: it’s less risky than influenza and has been for some time.

    Since the mask mandate was dropped here yesterday I think the number of people complying with the request by Tesco et al to wear a mask is 80%. As soon as pox rates collapse back into singe digits I'll stop bothering.
    I’d say we saw similar here in Waitrose when it ceased to be a legal requirement but was a request by the store, most carried on. It’s gradually declined to around 10 to 20% now.
    I do our weekly shop in our local sainsburys in Durham. If I see more than a couple of people with masks that is all, same on the buses.

    I just don’t bother now, either.
    There’s a lady on my street who seemingly wears a mask at all times. I walked past her house the other day and she was masked while scrubbing her own front step. Bar her, I rarely see a mask on anyone all day.
    I was hoping to catch up with somebody at a conference in a few months time and they said that the conference isn't going to enforce mask wearing rules so they wouldn't be attending and although they aren't clinically vulnerable, vaccinated etc, they wouldn't feel safe.

    Each to their own, but I wonder some people are suffering a sort of PTSD, where they see danger at every turn and lost sense of the a) the risk profile and b) that unless you insist on living like a hermit for the rest of your days, you are going to come into contact with COVID at some point.
    a) That’s not now PTSD works. b) Have we not learnt by now that you can get multiple re-infections? You write as if getting COVID is a one and done affair.
    Follow the logic
    Covid is just a cold
    Covid restrictions were an over-reaction
    So Boris did no wrong
    So vote Tory.

    The Tory MPs and lickspittles now attacking the rules as being to blame (instead of their boss) are saying everyone who followed the rules was stupid and thus their boss so smart. Yet why did every member of the cabinet say over and over again that we MUST obey the rules?

    Its like the GBeebies presenter making an arse of himself on Twitter. Full-on defence of Boris being compared with his full-on attack of the opponents of Boris (Neil Ferguson in the specific example) doing what Boris did and being described as an "utter prick" for doing so.

    Its the level of disdain in which the Tories hold people. "They are so stupid they will forget everything we said".
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Nothing will happen to him though. The Germans don’t get rid of their leaders very easily. They even gave Schröder eight years.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Yes, but Germany has taken more Ukranian refugees than the UK, so Germany good and Boris bad…
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,003
    Sandpit said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Yes, but Germany has taken more Ukranian refugees than the UK, so Germany good and Boris bad…
    You're confusing Germany with Scholz.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,003
    ydoethur said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Nothing will happen to him though. The Germans don’t get rid of their leaders very easily. They even gave Schröder eight years.
    Depends on how much economic damage the war does. And Scholz is helping it drag on.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Yes, but Germany has taken more Ukranian refugees than the UK, so Germany good and Boris bad…
    You're confusing Germany with Scholz.
    Easy to confuse Scholz with Russians.... His actions and Russia's best interests do seem to massively overlap.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 57,066
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 3,347

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938
    If they had any left, no doubt the Russians would slam half a dozen cruise missiles into it....
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
    Germany. Being on the wrong side of history since....?
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 3,347

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
    Germany. Being on the wrong side of history since....?
    Quintilius Varus?

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,003
    The new conservative administration might scrap this traditional system.
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=327245
    ...Unlike the international norm that starts with the age of zero at birth and then adds a year on birthdays, under the Korean system, a newborn baby's age is counted starting from one rather than zero, and everyone gets a year older all together on New Year's Day. So on Jan. 1, hospital maternity wards are filled with two-year-old babies born yesterday.

    This traditional system is used widely in daily life, while the international system, which was introduced in the country in 1962, is used in official records and the civil code.

    In addition, there is a third system in which newborns start out at age zero, but everybody's age advances on New Year's Day, regardless of their actual date of birth. This method is used for military conscription and for defining the age of juveniles under the Youth Protection Act....
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938
    ydoethur said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
    Germany. Being on the wrong side of history since....?
    They just snap under Prussia.
    The P is silent.....
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938
    Nigelb said:

    The new conservative administration might scrap this traditional system.
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=327245
    ...Unlike the international norm that starts with the age of zero at birth and then adds a year on birthdays, under the Korean system, a newborn baby's age is counted starting from one rather than zero, and everyone gets a year older all together on New Year's Day. So on Jan. 1, hospital maternity wards are filled with two-year-old babies born yesterday.

    This traditional system is used widely in daily life, while the international system, which was introduced in the country in 1962, is used in official records and the civil code.

    In addition, there is a third system in which newborns start out at age zero, but everybody's age advances on New Year's Day, regardless of their actual date of birth. This method is used for military conscription and for defining the age of juveniles under the Youth Protection Act....

    We have the same system with racehorses....
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 3,347

    ydoethur said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
    Germany. Being on the wrong side of history since....?
    They just snap under Prussia.
    The P is silent.....
    Now you’re just taking the P…
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    Nigelb said:

    The new conservative administration might scrap this traditional system.
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=327245
    ...Unlike the international norm that starts with the age of zero at birth and then adds a year on birthdays, under the Korean system, a newborn baby's age is counted starting from one rather than zero, and everyone gets a year older all together on New Year's Day. So on Jan. 1, hospital maternity wards are filled with two-year-old babies born yesterday.

    This traditional system is used widely in daily life, while the international system, which was introduced in the country in 1962, is used in official records and the civil code.

    In addition, there is a third system in which newborns start out at age zero, but everybody's age advances on New Year's Day, regardless of their actual date of birth. This method is used for military conscription and for defining the age of juveniles under the Youth Protection Act....

    We have the same system with racehorses....
    And it foals everyone.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    I can't even see a new thread.....
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 2,249
    edited April 20
    It is a gift to the relevant PCPs. The mendacity may be priced in for Boris himself, but a means to project that guilt directly to a specific constituency, in a way that is clear and unambiguous... A bit of a godsend.

    How many pictures of Boris and the Tory candidate will appear on opposition leaflets? (Ok I know, I know, none, probably - but I doubt Boris will appear on any Tory election leaflets either; and if that is the case, how does one justify supporting him as an "election winner"?)
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 29,177
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    And the Gray report may well be out sometime this year.
    What this does of course is keep the pot simmering.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    edited April 20
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Yesterdays performances by Patel and Boris at the dispatch box were toe curling awful and with Rishi looking as sick as a parrot next to Boris, if conservative mps do not wake up and smell the coffee and vote Boris out, then they will go down with him to a titanic style defeat in 24
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 10,472
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Labour are obviously hoping that it will replicate the Owen Paterson vote - where although Johnson won the vote he really did lose the argument, and was subsequently forced to back down.

    Will be interesting to see how it plays out. I'm sure there will be lots of Tory MPs who would privately concede that the PMs initial statements to the House were not entirely accurate, and would rather not be put on the spot like this.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Nigelb said:

    The new conservative administration might scrap this traditional system.
    https://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=327245
    ...Unlike the international norm that starts with the age of zero at birth and then adds a year on birthdays, under the Korean system, a newborn baby's age is counted starting from one rather than zero, and everyone gets a year older all together on New Year's Day. So on Jan. 1, hospital maternity wards are filled with two-year-old babies born yesterday.

    This traditional system is used widely in daily life, while the international system, which was introduced in the country in 1962, is used in official records and the civil code.

    In addition, there is a third system in which newborns start out at age zero, but everybody's age advances on New Year's Day, regardless of their actual date of birth. This method is used for military conscription and for defining the age of juveniles under the Youth Protection Act....

    We have the same system with racehorses....
    All horses. So you want your foals (and children, if we adopt the system) in January to give them an 11.75 month at best head start

    On topic of the new header having been cleaned out betting phatboi was toast by end March I now think he is toast this year. We cannot go on like yesterday but we are going to have to because strikingly be made no bid to buy himself out of repeat performances by generalising his apology to cover all his sins before he saw the light
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868
    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,916
    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 6,775
    Bit like Jimmy Durante's "Lost chord", this missing thread.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,187

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Yesterdays performances by Patel and Boris at the dispatch box were toe curling awful and with Rishi looking as sick as a parrot next to Boris, if conservative mps do not wake up and smell the coffee and vote Boris out, then they will go down with him to a titanic style defeat in 24
    Is there a competition today for getting the most idioms into a single post?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,242
    Is it a good street though? Could be a competition amongst world leaders - my street has an embassy on it, whilst his has a dunkin donuts...they clearly like him more.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 6,775
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
    Only works if it literally rings alarm bells, Shirley.

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868
    kle4 said:

    Is it a good street though? Could be a competition amongst world leaders - my street has an embassy on it, whilst his has a dunkin donuts...they clearly like him more.
    Didn’t somewhere rename the street containing a Russian embassy as Ukraine St or Zelensky St?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,187

    Taz said:

    There is a lingering feeling that PBers are less keen on moving on from covid than the public at large. The statistics are clear: it’s less risky than influenza and has been for some time.

    Since the mask mandate was dropped here yesterday I think the number of people complying with the request by Tesco et al to wear a mask is 80%. As soon as pox rates collapse back into singe digits I'll stop bothering.
    I’d say we saw similar here in Waitrose when it ceased to be a legal requirement but was a request by the store, most carried on. It’s gradually declined to around 10 to 20% now.
    I do our weekly shop in our local sainsburys in Durham. If I see more than a couple of people with masks that is all, same on the buses.

    I just don’t bother now, either.
    There’s a lady on my street who seemingly wears a mask at all times. I walked past her house the other day and she was masked while scrubbing her own front step. Bar her, I rarely see a mask on anyone all day.
    I was hoping to catch up with somebody at a conference in a few months time and they said that the conference isn't going to enforce mask wearing rules so they wouldn't be attending and although they aren't clinically vulnerable, vaccinated etc, they wouldn't feel safe.

    Each to their own, but I wonder some people are suffering a sort of PTSD, where they see danger at every turn and lost sense of the a) the risk profile and b) that unless you insist on living like a hermit for the rest of your days, you are going to come into contact with COVID at some point.
    a) That’s not now PTSD works. b) Have we not learnt by now that you can get multiple re-infections? You write as if getting COVID is a one and done affair.
    Nope. Francis has said repeatedly on here that we’ll all get covid multiple times during our lives.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    geoffw said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
    Only works if it literally rings alarm bells, Shirley.

    Not sure, Robert often says will people please not use it frivolously as they get pinged or something.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 10,472
    kle4 said:

    Is it a good street though? Could be a competition amongst world leaders - my street has an embassy on it, whilst his has a dunkin donuts...they clearly like him more.
    It's not exactly a grand boulevard, but it is pleasingly green.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    Being stuck on this thread while there is another thread somewhere else but one that we can't see or participate in sounds like a plot point from Black Mirror.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,187

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    Netflix is barely worth the subscription fee now, as I was saying the other day. iPlayer is superior I think (although I still subscribe to both, plus Prime).

    Disney+ is utter garbage. Apple has just two good shows. So they have both been binned.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236
    TOPPING said:

    Being stuck on this thread while there is another thread somewhere else but one that we can't see or participate in sounds like a plot point from Black Mirror.

    I can see the thread header and @Big_G_NorthWales clearly can too because he has copy pasted some of it but no one can post on it.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    TOPPING said:

    geoffw said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
    Only works if it literally rings alarm bells, Shirley.

    Not sure, Robert often says will people please not use it frivolously as they get pinged or something.
    And whoever marked my thread as off-topic loses the satisfaction of doing so because off-topic flags are unattributable. So their comedic genius will go unrecognised.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 10,472

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    How are they going to tighten up on shared accounts, and how would they avoid pissing off customers who have to travel for work?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    Now that so many younger people seem to use mobile data for watching videos, trying to clamp down further on account sharing is likely to annoy legitimate users at least as much as it prevents the login sharing - most of which is between families anyway.

    Most of the ‘illegitimate’ login sharing is going to be between changing households - an ex-housemate or ex-girlfriend - or a group of students each of whom subscribes to one service themselves.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Yesterdays performances by Patel and Boris at the dispatch box were toe curling awful and with Rishi looking as sick as a parrot next to Boris, if conservative mps do not wake up and smell the coffee and vote Boris out, then they will go down with him to a titanic style defeat in 24
    Its a cult. They see nothing wrong with anything that Boris did or the Rwanda press release or a non-dom lecturing people on paying taxes. Nothing to see, move along.

    The question is just how stupid are voters? The Tories assume they can say and do anything and people will support them. I hope that isn't the case.
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    TOPPING said:

    geoffw said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
    Only works if it literally rings alarm bells, Shirley.

    Not sure, Robert often says will people please not use it frivolously as they get pinged or something.
    I think that's the spam flag rather than the off topic flag.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 7,789
    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Leaving the ethics to one side (this is a political website, after all), does preventing an enquiry cauterise the story?

    Everyone knows/believes/expects that there are other, worse parties to be confirmed, don't they?

    And whilst postponing pain until tomorrow is the essence of Borisism, it doesn't seem like wise politics for the Conservatives. Johnson is dispensable; at least some Conservative MPs will be hoping to have a future after him.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    Netflix is barely worth the subscription fee now, as I was saying the other day. iPlayer is superior I think (although I still subscribe to both, plus Prime).

    Disney+ is utter garbage. Apple has just two good shows. So they have both been binned.
    Disagree. All the channels have one or two must-see things. It's difficult to distinguish. Even iPlayer although less, imo, than the others. Disney and Apple I don't do, that said.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    Applicant said:

    TOPPING said:

    geoffw said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    @rcs1000 if you’re around, someone needs to restart the VF/Wordpress interface service, new thread is not connecting to VF.

    I should really label your comment "off topic" as that apparently triggers a notification to the mods. But I won't because it wasn't.
    Only works if it literally rings alarm bells, Shirley.

    Not sure, Robert often says will people please not use it frivolously as they get pinged or something.
    I think that's the spam flag rather than the off topic flag.
    ahh.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493
    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    You don't think there is a moral issue. That rules matter. Propriety matters. The law matters. Just headlines.

    As Starmer said yesterday, what a joke.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,476
    ...
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Johnson is here for the long haul. He is morphing into Trump by the day.

    According to Sky News, Boris Johnson came out swinging last night with his ebullient and unrepentant performance to rally his troops, and rally them he did. Withering attacks on the enemies of Johnsonianism, for example Welby, who has been critical of Rwanda and not Putin (the second part is a lie, but who cares) and on Starmer for debasing politics with his highly personal attacks (an irony of ironies- Jimmy Savile says hi!).

    Johnson is going nowhere. January 2025 can't come soon enough, and even then who says he doesn't return bigger and stronger.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    Holier than thou people hold the values they claim in utter contempt.
  • eekeek Posts: 21,770
    edited April 20
    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Nope - the risk for any Tory MP is that the fact that the opposition will be able to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is happy that Boris broke the law by partying as your relatives died alone.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 10,472

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Leaving the ethics to one side (this is a political website, after all), does preventing an enquiry cauterise the story?

    Everyone knows/believes/expects that there are other, worse parties to be confirmed, don't they?

    And whilst postponing pain until tomorrow is the essence of Borisism, it doesn't seem like wise politics for the Conservatives. Johnson is dispensable; at least some Conservative MPs will be hoping to have a future after him.
    So the alternative approach would be something like - instruct all Tory MPs to abstain from the vote and to absent themselves from the debate preceding it. Claim that Labour are wasting time on frivolous Westminster politics while the government is concentrating on dealing with important issues. Deride the subsequent investigation as a sham and a kangeroo court.

    One advantage of that is it avoids forcing Tory MPs to vote against the facts, but it means there will be another report, which could well conclude the PM lied, and has to apologise for doing so. Could he survive that, or would a calculation be that it would be difficult for the standards commissioner to explicitly conclude he had lied, and thereby implicitly call for his resignation?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Yesterdays performances by Patel and Boris at the dispatch box were toe curling awful and with Rishi looking as sick as a parrot next to Boris, if conservative mps do not wake up and smell the coffee and vote Boris out, then they will go down with him to a titanic style defeat in 24
    Is there a competition today for getting the most idioms into a single post?
    I was quite surprised by myself to be fair
  • eekeek Posts: 21,770
    edited April 20
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    Now that so many younger people seem to use mobile data for watching videos, trying to clamp down further on account sharing is likely to annoy legitimate users at least as much as it prevents the login sharing - most of which is between families anyway.

    Most of the ‘illegitimate’ login sharing is going to be between changing households - an ex-housemate or ex-girlfriend - or a group of students each of whom subscribes to one service themselves.
    Our contribution to that in Twin B's student flat is a National Theatre at Home subscription. Pretentious, Moi?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,916
    edited April 20

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,018
    Pagan2 said:

    pb seems to be on the blink

    They banned all left wingers and tory posters so its just me and thee left
    Regular www.political.betting doesn't have the comments working at all.

    Another Vanilla "upgrade"?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,032
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    You are a Christian, but support lack of honesty and integrity in your political mind ?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631
    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Nope - the risk for any Tory MP is that the fact that the opposition will be able to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is happy that Boris broke the law by partying as your relatives died alone.
    Fabricant didn't seem too happy that Starmer had quoted one of his constituents.

    Which serves him right, of course, and is unlikely to make much difference in Lichfield where they have cheerfully voted for a donkey in a blue rosette for years, but I can see why those with more marginal seats would be nervous.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Interesting thread....

    In 2012, Netflix had just lost 800,000 subscribers and lost a $30,000,000 licensing agreement with Starz.

    In Q4 of 2021, they added 10x that number of subscribers and are worth $151,000,000,000.

    The key? World-class data science.

    Here's how they outfoxed the media industry 🧵

    https://twitter.com/marktenenholtz/status/1516386146321780737?t=C6hFnM356h6l25LdyaIH8w&s=19

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61153252
    Their share price was off 20% at one point yesterday. The fragmentation of the streaming industry is going to be bad for all competitors, and the need for original content is going to be the trump card in future.

    Quite why Netflix now thinks that throwing millions at Mr and Mrs Sussex is the way to achieve that, is another question.
    From that thread about their 'world class data science'...
    They noticed 3 key things:

    1. The British version of House of Cards was a hit.

    2. Films with Kevin Spacey were, too...


    They were an innovator on their own back then. Now they're scrapping in the gutter with everyone else.
    Two things they should do:

    Tighten up significantly on shared accounts
    Offer an annual pass at similar to todays prices, but bump up monthly by 10%+ per year or so to deal with people choosing to do 4 months with netflix, 4 month with amazon, 4 months with dsiney/apple on rotation and get all the content over a year for the price of 3.
    Now that so many younger people seem to use mobile data for watching videos, trying to clamp down further on account sharing is likely to annoy legitimate users at least as much as it prevents the login sharing - most of which is between families anyway.

    Most of the ‘illegitimate’ login sharing is going to be between changing households - an ex-housemate or ex-girlfriend - or a group of students each of whom subscribes to one service themselves.
    https://www.npr.org/2022/03/17/1087133199/netflix-plans-to-start-charging-for-password-sharing-and-customers-arent-happy?t=1650440791310

    Being tested in Latin America by restricting the number of profiles and charging for additional ones. They also have tested 2FA.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236
    Quite a good summary of the highs and lows of Macron's first period in office:https://graphics.france24.com/macron-presidency-timeline/

    He's seriously fortunate that he has such a beatable opponent.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,868
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 46,938

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Good morning

    Looks like there is a new thread but I cannot access it normally or here

    Unfortunately there seems to be a problem with the comments plug-in on the main site, and until somebody posts a comment on the aforesaid main site it doesn't appear in VF.

    So until TSE or RCS wakes up, we're stuck on this one.
    The new thread seem missing on vanilla
    Yes. Because we can't comment on it in vanilla until there's a comment on the main site. And we can't post a comment on the main site as Vanilla isn't working on it.

    Catch-22.
    This is the thread when it becomes active

    CON MPS WOULD BE MAKING A MISTAKE BLOCKING A JOHNSON INQUIRY

    20/4/2022 Mike Smithson Comments 0 Comment

    Their vote could be career-defining Just imagine you are running a LAB/LD/SNP campaign in a marginal constituency where you think there is a chance at the next general election. In the current context there could be nothing better for the incumbent CON MP to vote to block the inquiry into the PM’s consistent failure to be honest. If Tory MPs follow their leader and seek to scupper the move then they too will be tarred by Johnson’s behaviour and that…
    I think that Boris will win the vote relatively easily. Whether the Tories suffer long term damage from it remains to be seen but SKS has definitely taken the right steps here, having failed to move a VONC when the initial Gray report came out which would also have put these MPs on the spot.
    Yesterdays performances by Patel and Boris at the dispatch box were toe curling awful and with Rishi looking as sick as a parrot next to Boris, if conservative mps do not wake up and smell the coffee and vote Boris out, then they will go down with him to a titanic style defeat in 24
    Is there a competition today for getting the most idioms into a single post?
    It makes a change from getting the most idiots into a single thread.....
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493
    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Nope - the risk for any Tory MP is that the fact that the opposition will be able to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is happy that Boris broke the law by partying as your relatives died alone.
    Fabricant didn't seem too happy that Starmer had quoted one of his constituents.

    Which serves him right, of course, and is unlikely to make much difference in Lichfield where they have cheerfully voted for a donkey in a blue rosette for years, but I can see why those with more marginal seats would be nervous.
    Have to ask at which point the good people of Lichfield feel a bit of sick rising up the back of their throats. It is Solid Blue Tory. Which means nothing once the tide goes out as we have seen solid one colour seats flip to become solid for another colour.

    As Big_G so eloquently puts it, do you support a lack of honesty and integrity? Tories running as Tories are saying "vote for lies, vote for illegality, vote for dishonesty - these are the values I identify with.

    Question is at which point do enough voters say "you might, but I don't".
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,476
    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Nope - the risk for any Tory MP is that the fact that the opposition will be able to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is happy that Boris broke the law by partying as your relatives died alone.
    Fabricant didn't seem too happy that Starmer had quoted one of his constituents.

    Which serves him right, of course, and is unlikely to make much difference in Lichfield where they have cheerfully voted for a donkey in a blue rosette for years, but I can see why those with more marginal seats would be nervous.
    He may be a donkey in a blue rosette but he has beautiful mane!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    edited April 20
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    As ridiculous as the two women walking along (allowed) holding a coffee each (not allowed).

    Them was the rules, as we all can't quite fucking believe now. And they were cheered on by plenty, including those here on the mighty PB.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,018
    ydoethur said:

    Quite a charge sheet:

    Timeline of 🇩🇪's @OlafScholz's many lies:

    1) At the end of February Germany's defense industry sends Scholz a long list of all available weapons.
    2) Scholz doesn't share the list with Ukraine.
    3) Scholz says that there are no more weapons left in Germany to give to Ukraine.

    1/7


    https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1516545893805273091?

    Why does GermanyScholz hate Ukraine so much?
    They don’t hate Ukraine. But they have thrown their lot (and their pockets) in with Putin.

    For everyone who mutters about “Londongrad” - Germany is what buying influence really looks like
    Germany. Being on the wrong side of history since....?
    They just snap under Prussia.
    It's more than that - for many Germans, peace with Russia is part of the being the Germany that isn't... the other kind of Germany. It's part of being decent people.

    I know one chap who is almost in pain from being pulled in two directions on this. A mutual aquaintance (first generation immigrant) to Germany remarked on it - for him it is simple - Putin is being an arsehole etc.

  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    It had to be specifically essential for work.
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884
    mwadams said:

    rcs1000 said:

    carnforth said:

    The thing about these graphs which does surprise is the spike after 2016 when conventional wisdom (and I think what I’ve read from some analysts) is that Theresa May and Nick Timothy cut down specifically on the student visa route.

    May reduced the time a graduate could work after their degree from 2 years to 4 months. It has since been increased to 2 years again, by the current government. I don’t think she formally limited numbers.

    She did have an odd bee in her bonnet about counting students in the immigration figures, which never seemed to make sense to me.

    Undergraduates can work 20 hours per week during their degree (those of us from Fen Poly often forget that one can work during a degree - we were banned from doing so, save for holidays. Maybe at some other places too?)
    Eh?

    I was at Cambridge 92-95 and worked part time (and was allowed to work).
    I was there from 91, and we definitely were not. Maybe it was the change to the 3 digit userids that heralded the change.
    The other place, there for best part of ten years and was both a porter and ran the college bar. Had both jobs when undergraduate and kept them for my DPhil.

    For one summer, I worked as a porter at night and did my research during the day. Couple of hours of sleep a day tops.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 55,093
    TOPPING said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    As ridiculous as the two women walking along (allowed) holding a coffee each (not allowed).

    Them was the rules, as we all can't quite fucking believe now. And they were cheered on by plenty, including those here on the mighty PB.
    Tory MPs voted in droves for all these rules. Now they say they were ridiculous.

    They weren't saying that at the time.

    Utter hypocrites.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236
    TOPPING said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    As ridiculous as the two women walking along (allowed) holding a coffee each (not allowed).

    Them was the rules, as we all can't quite fucking believe now. And they were cheered on by plenty, including those here on the mighty PB.
    They were indeed absurd and irrational. Only the common sense of most police officers in interpreting them judiciously (in the main) stopped them from falling into disrepute before they did.

    Which rather brings home, once again, that the offence here is lying about it to the HoC. That is unacceptable.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631
    edited April 20

    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    Nope - the risk for any Tory MP is that the fact that the opposition will be able to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is happy that Boris broke the law by partying as your relatives died alone.
    Fabricant didn't seem too happy that Starmer had quoted one of his constituents.

    Which serves him right, of course, and is unlikely to make much difference in Lichfield where they have cheerfully voted for a donkey in a blue rosette for years, but I can see why those with more marginal seats would be nervous.
    Have to ask at which point the good people of Lichfield feel a bit of sick rising up the back of their throats. It is Solid Blue Tory. Which means nothing once the tide goes out as we have seen solid one colour seats flip to become solid for another colour.

    As Big_G so eloquently puts it, do you support a lack of honesty and integrity? Tories running as Tories are saying "vote for lies, vote for illegality, vote for dishonesty - these are the values I identify with.

    Question is at which point do enough voters say "you might, but I don't".
    They very nearly voted him out in 1997. He came within about 250 votes of losing.

    Since then, with a few boundary changes, it's so safely Conservative it's really hard to see him being voted out even with his having clearly lost what little plot he ever had, although given his age he may of course decide to retire.
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884
    I also worked in the biker pub on Gloucester Green for the first term of my final year. That was more instructive than any tutorial.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 21,493

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Yes exactly. We cannot have an executive who break the law and openly lie to parliament. "Its just a bit of cake" is wilful ignorance of the issue for political reasons.

    The bit that sliced (geddit?) though yesterday was Starmer's response to "its just a cake". The "its a FPN so what" argument that had so embarrassed Brandon Lewis earlier. As Starmer pointed out, the issue is *lying* about a FPN. A jailable offence.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    TOPPING said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    As ridiculous as the two women walking along (allowed) holding a coffee each (not allowed).

    Them was the rules, as we all can't quite fucking believe now. And they were cheered on by plenty, including those here on the mighty PB.
    Tory MPs voted in droves for all these rules. Now they say they were ridiculous.

    They weren't saying that at the time.

    Utter hypocrites.
    Yep. And likely to get away with it if only because we all want to blank that period out and pretend we were never so absurd a nation as to have such rules, still less that we supported them at the time.
  • https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1516673734375100419

    Yes!!!

    There's a "real buzz" in LOTO and Southside around the idea of Ed Balls standing in Wakefield, says a senior Labour source...

    Party figures think he'd bring a "big beast factor" to the by-election and a "big brain" to the Labour benches
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631

    https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1516673734375100419

    Yes!!!

    There's a "real buzz" in LOTO and Southside around the idea of Ed Balls standing in Wakefield, says a senior Labour source...

    Party figures think he'd bring a "big beast factor" to the by-election and a "big brain" to the Labour benches

    Hmmm.

    How would the people of Wakefield react?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,236

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    It had to be specifically essential for work.
    So, for coffee breaks they should have left the building? Can you not see how ridiculous this is?
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    TOPPING said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    As ridiculous as the two women walking along (allowed) holding a coffee each (not allowed).

    Them was the rules, as we all can't quite fucking believe now. And they were cheered on by plenty, including those here on the mighty PB.
    Tory MPs voted in droves for all these rules. Now they say they were ridiculous.

    They weren't saying that at the time.

    Utter hypocrites.
    I think we go with MPs from all parties at the start there.

    The only resistance came from the fringes.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,631
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    It had to be specifically essential for work.
    So, for coffee breaks they should have left the building? Can you not see how ridiculous this is?
    Well, that's not much of a defence given he wrote the rules...
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    It had to be specifically essential for work.
    So, for coffee breaks they should have left the building? Can you not see how ridiculous this is?
    The question is not whether it is ridiculous it is whether it was the law. And in offices I have worked in people have from time to time got themselves a cup of coffee, they haven't gathered together to drink the stuff.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,018

    I also worked in the biker pub on Gloucester Green for the first term of my final year. That was more instructive than any tutorial.

    The Gloc?

    Small world - damned near lived in the place for a while.

    Not exactly a student pub :-)

    Did you meet the guy with slightly droopy eyelid?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,453
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the new thread which we cannot comment on in it, I would say the risk of voting for an inquiry is it extends the issue in the headlines. The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on.

    As for the Green vote being available for Labour to squeeze, don't forget the Tories also have ReformUK to squeeze too

    'The PM and Chancellor have been fined and apologised, we are now out of restrictions anyway, for Tory MPs move on'.

    The only way they are going to move on with this attitude is to extinction

    Where are the values of honesty and integrity - they need to get a backbone and realise ordinary voters hold these values in high esteem
    The latest polls still have the Tories on 32 to 34%. Hardly extinction and indeed still significantly higher than they were polling in the final period of the Major and May governments and indeed than Labour were polling in the final years of the Brown government
    Do you think the Big Man should go? Or is all well just a nine minute party what's all the fuss about.
    Right now, the only decided issue on which the PM has been found to have done anything wrong, is indeed his birthday cake, which he knew nothing about until his wife and a junior member of staff produced at the start of a meeting.

    The alleged misleading of Parliament, relies on this event being called a ‘party’, when he was asked about parties in general more than a year later, with no mention of this specific event in the public domain beforehand.

    If there are more serious offences in reports to come, then fair enough, but right now it just appears to be a distraction from more important things going on in the world - political opponents and journalists getting ever more hyperbolic, doesn’t change the facts of the case.
    How many times do we have to explain that the rules were not about parties, but non work gatherings? You have an unusual blind spot on this, your other posts are consistently logical and accurate whether agreed with or not.
    Maybe the problem is that the idea of a non work gathering with people from work in a work setting is just totally ridiculous. So the cabinet meeting was a work setting until the Mrs brings a cake in at which everybody should apparently have fled?

    The police are damned lucky this nonsense is not being challenged in the courts.
    Well, there was enough evidence for the Police to issue a FPN, and for the PM to pay the fine and accept his guilt.
This discussion has been closed.