Test – politicalbetting.com

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

.

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Foxy said:

MrEd said:

williamglenn said:

Leon said:

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

It’s a remarkable spectacle, full blown late stage Remoanerism in action. It is definitely a mental syndrome, as we have often discussed on here. It must be a syndrome because the symptoms and behaviourisms are so similar across a wide spectrum of people of different ages

It is an entire social class that has always had its own way, fundamentally - until this sudden, brutal reverse. They can’t cope. For the first time in their lives, they are serious Losers

Recognising how irrational people on my previous side of the debate had become was a big factor in me changing my position.

I think there might be something in the theory that the people at the top and the bottom of society both have a common understanding that you can't run a society by laws alone, whereas the upper professional classes have an absolute faith in process and systems and rules, so withdrawing from what they see as a rules-based system (however much the reality belies that) just doesn't compute.

There is one big caveat to that, namely when the rules and laws work in their favour.

The EU was a big plus for upper professional classes who relied on cheap labour to do building jobs, clean their houses, waiter at their favourite restaurants and, of course, when it meant they could holiday in France or Portugal in their second homes without waiting with the plebs.

If the rules were against their interests, they would be crying foul ad infinitum

Did working class people never use a plumber or have building works, or buy beer from a Slovakian barmaid, nor have their mother looked after by Polish nursing home staff?

Builders - unlikely, given the cost involved and / or they would do it themselves and / or use friends

Beer - yes but so what? The beer companies would put up the price of beer regardless of the cost of Labour. The profit went to the beer companies not the consumer. Just look at how much beer in bars has risen?

Nursing homes - again, if you are poor, you are not going to put your mother in a private nursing home. And a far greater proportion are from non-EU countries

Counter point, Poorer people see far more fat to day impact when it comes to their kids at school having bigger classes and / or resources switched to non-English speaking pupils, plus bigger queues at the doctors for treatment.

You do realise around half of nursing home residents are state funded ?

I do. And I am sure you realise that most of the staff are not coming from non-U.K., EU countries?

So, if you are poor, you may well still put you mum in a private nursing home.
And you’re also apparently wrong about ‘most of the staff’:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/articles/internationalmigrationandthehealthcareworkforce/2019-08-15

Err, have you actually looked at what that data quoted - it said EU nationals were more likely to work in the private health sector than non-EU or U.K. staff.

Not exactly backing your case that EU staff are holding up state nursing homes...

Why do you imagine there is a clear distinction between state and private nursing homes ?
A good deal of the clients of the private sector (which accounts for the vast majority of such homes in the UK) are council funded.

Three things;

1. On that data, 88pc of health staff are U.K. nationals. EU staff do not hold up the system;
2. Of the 12pc, the data states 6pc are EU and 6pc non-EU staff.
3. On your specific point, yes councils fund non-state homes but, given the very definitions, it is more likely that poorer older people are in state homes than private ones

Leon said:

This weather is dismal. A week of rain ahead. Pfff

dixiedean said:

Just caught up with Max Whitlock.
The human body can't adopt such positions .Gravity ought to prevent it.
And yet I saw it. With my own eyes.
Sad for the Taiwanese who came second.
He was flawless.

MaxPB said:

alex_ said:

MaxPB said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Ugh, I'm going to infected with the ghastly Oxford jab aren't I?

Booster vaccines are to be offered to 32million Britons starting early next month with up to 2,000 pharmacies set to deliver the programme, The Telegraph can disclose.

Amid fears that the efficacy of the vaccines may begin to decline, ministers are planning to deliver an average of almost 2.5million third doses a week starting in the first week of September.

Pharmacies will be at the forefront of the vaccine programme so that GPs and other NHS staff can focus on the growing backlog of patients waiting for other treatments.

All adults aged 50 and over, as well as the immuno-suppressed, will be offered the booster jabs.

The campaign could start as soon as Sept 6, which would see the rollout completed by early December if it goes to plan. It is hoped the timetable will leave at least a fortnight for the final people vaccinated to benefit from the jab's effect before Christmas....

...Ministers are considering giving people a different booster jab to the shot they received for their first and second dose, after early trials suggested that mixing vaccines could provoke an enhanced immune response. It could mean a significant reduction in the use of AstraZeneca jabs.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/08/01/vaccine-booster-shots-32m-begin-next-month/

Thr Daily Mail has the opposite story that it will all be Pfizer. 🤷🏼‍♂️

I think it will be a mix and 2.5m doses per weeks seems very low. We should easily be able to call up all groups 1-6 immediately and get them done at a rate of 4-5m per week given that our current roll out has ground to a halt.

I get the impression that there is a lot of debate about whether booster vaccines actually serve any useful purpose or whether the push for them is being pushed at least in part by the pharmaceutical companies themselves.

There is a serious danger that the Government/Scientists might use them to create a new measure of "progress" to inform the reintroduction of restrictions over the winter.

Ultimately we've already paid for them and if anything having a booster programme is very much a safety first approach. As I said I'd be shocked if it takes beyond the end of October to complete it we already have plenty of the three major vaccines in fridges around the country.

Booster doses result in an 8-20x boost in antibodies, that alone will give is a pretty good reduction in the R as many millions become fully immune from infection. The booster programme should be open to everyone 4 months after their second dose. We really need to play it safe and just get everyone who wants one a booster shot. Going into winter we should do whatever it takes to avoid a repeat of last year.

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

stodge said:

Late evening all

Just a comment on the piece in tomorrow's Guardian including the quote from Steve Baker MP.

I suspect many would find the notion of deprivation and poverty in places like High Wycombe risible.

It's not - there's a lot of relative poverty in the south and south-east - it's often masked by the larger areas of wealth but it is foolish to deny their existence.

The cost of housing, for example, is one of those key measures which mark out the real problems some face in the supposedly affluent areas.

williamglenn said:

Leon said:

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

It’s a remarkable spectacle, full blown late stage Remoanerism in action. It is definitely a mental syndrome, as we have often discussed on here. It must be a syndrome because the symptoms and behaviourisms are so similar across a wide spectrum of people of different ages

It is an entire social class that has always had its own way, fundamentally - until this sudden, brutal reverse. They can’t cope. For the first time in their lives, they are serious Losers

Recognising how irrational people on my previous side of the debate had become was a big factor in me changing my position.

I think there might be something in the theory that the people at the top and the bottom of society both have a common understanding that you can't run a society by laws alone, whereas the upper professional classes have an absolute faith in process and systems and rules, so withdrawing from what they see as a rules-based system (however much the reality belies that) just doesn't compute.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Malmesbury said:

Now for a *really* contentious issue....

The Schleswig-Holstein Question

Only three people have ever really understood the Schleswig-Holstein business – the Prince Consort, who is dead – a German professor, who has gone mad – and I, who have forgotten all about it.

Leon said:

another_richard said:

Mexicanpete said:

another_richard said:

Dura_Ace said:

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

That and that we genuinely quite despise leavers wishing them nothing but ill.

But don't you hate everyone ?

Was that a consequence of being kicked out of the RN or a cause ?

There is rather an unpleasant atmosphere on here tonight, and your final paragraph is about as personally unpleasant as it gets.

Its odd, on the rare occasions I have tried to annoy people I rarely get a response.

But when I haven't I sometimes do.

And I certainly bear no ill will to DA, who incidentally has mentioned his departure from the RN (the tuktuk affair) many times and also boasts of his antipathy towards much of the country (though whether he really does I don't know).

Dura Ace is an anti vaxxer. He wants the rest of us to die because he can’t be arsed to have an injection. It’s hard to get more antipathetic than THAT

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

.

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Foxy said:

MrEd said:

williamglenn said:

Leon said:

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

It’s a remarkable spectacle, full blown late stage Remoanerism in action. It is definitely a mental syndrome, as we have often discussed on here. It must be a syndrome because the symptoms and behaviourisms are so similar across a wide spectrum of people of different ages

It is an entire social class that has always had its own way, fundamentally - until this sudden, brutal reverse. They can’t cope. For the first time in their lives, they are serious Losers

Recognising how irrational people on my previous side of the debate had become was a big factor in me changing my position.

I think there might be something in the theory that the people at the top and the bottom of society both have a common understanding that you can't run a society by laws alone, whereas the upper professional classes have an absolute faith in process and systems and rules, so withdrawing from what they see as a rules-based system (however much the reality belies that) just doesn't compute.

There is one big caveat to that, namely when the rules and laws work in their favour.

The EU was a big plus for upper professional classes who relied on cheap labour to do building jobs, clean their houses, waiter at their favourite restaurants and, of course, when it meant they could holiday in France or Portugal in their second homes without waiting with the plebs.

If the rules were against their interests, they would be crying foul ad infinitum

Did working class people never use a plumber or have building works, or buy beer from a Slovakian barmaid, nor have their mother looked after by Polish nursing home staff?

Builders - unlikely, given the cost involved and / or they would do it themselves and / or use friends

Beer - yes but so what? The beer companies would put up the price of beer regardless of the cost of Labour. The profit went to the beer companies not the consumer. Just look at how much beer in bars has risen?

Nursing homes - again, if you are poor, you are not going to put your mother in a private nursing home. And a far greater proportion are from non-EU countries

Counter point, Poorer people see far more fat to day impact when it comes to their kids at school having bigger classes and / or resources switched to non-English speaking pupils, plus bigger queues at the doctors for treatment.

You do realise around half of nursing home residents are state funded ?

I do. And I am sure you realise that most of the staff are not coming from non-U.K., EU countries?

So, if you are poor, you may well still put you mum in a private nursing home.
And you’re also apparently wrong about ‘most of the staff’:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/articles/internationalmigrationandthehealthcareworkforce/2019-08-15

Err, have you actually looked at what that data quoted - it said EU nationals were more likely to work in the private health sector than non-EU or U.K. staff.

Not exactly backing your case that EU staff are holding up state nursing homes...

Why do you imagine there is a clear distinction between state and private nursing homes ?
A good deal of the clients of the private sector (which accounts for the vast majority of such homes in the UK) are council funded.

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

.

MrEd said:

Nigelb said:

MrEd said:

Foxy said:

MrEd said:

williamglenn said:

Leon said:

another_richard said:

Leon said:

Scott_xP said:

Leon said:

We’ve all learned to avoid the topic

Surely you can reassure them with tales of how brilliant Brexit is?

All the great success?

The fantastic new opportunities?

But no, you sit in embarrassed silence...

No, I can’t reassure them. And you know why? Because as soon as I calmly say ‘we now elect and reject those who govern us and…’ they go mad. They start jumping up and down like you. They froth and rage about Boris and Dom and ‘drooling fuckwit racist Leavers’ - on and on and on. Like enraged toddlers. It really is deeply embarrassing - for them.

The last time it happened - quite recently - a good friend (works in TV, Cambridge graduate) ended up purple-faced and frantically screaming about ‘the Nazi Tories’. I do not exaggerate.

At this point his wife (also a Remoaner, but saner) put a calming hand on his shoulder and he suddenly stopped, looked around, and realised the entire pub was looking at him in horror. So he shut the fuck up and stayed quiet for the rest of the evening

Their hatred is continually refueled by the failure of the disaster they so confidently predicted and so desperately wanted to happen.

It’s a remarkable spectacle, full blown late stage Remoanerism in action. It is definitely a mental syndrome, as we have often discussed on here. It must be a syndrome because the symptoms and behaviourisms are so similar across a wide spectrum of people of different ages

It is an entire social class that has always had its own way, fundamentally - until this sudden, brutal reverse. They can’t cope. For the first time in their lives, they are serious Losers

Recognising how irrational people on my previous side of the debate had become was a big factor in me changing my position.

I think there might be something in the theory that the people at the top and the bottom of society both have a common understanding that you can't run a society by laws alone, whereas the upper professional classes have an absolute faith in process and systems and rules, so withdrawing from what they see as a rules-based system (however much the reality belies that) just doesn't compute.

There is one big caveat to that, namely when the rules and laws work in their favour.

The EU was a big plus for upper professional classes who relied on cheap labour to do building jobs, clean their houses, waiter at their favourite restaurants and, of course, when it meant they could holiday in France or Portugal in their second homes without waiting with the plebs.

If the rules were against their interests, they would be crying foul ad infinitum

Did working class people never use a plumber or have building works, or buy beer from a Slovakian barmaid, nor have their mother looked after by Polish nursing home staff?

Builders - unlikely, given the cost involved and / or they would do it themselves and / or use friends

Beer - yes but so what? The beer companies would put up the price of beer regardless of the cost of Labour. The profit went to the beer companies not the consumer. Just look at how much beer in bars has risen?

Nursing homes - again, if you are poor, you are not going to put your mother in a private nursing home. And a far greater proportion are from non-EU countries

Counter point, Poorer people see far more fat to day impact when it comes to their kids at school having bigger classes and / or resources switched to non-English speaking pupils, plus bigger queues at the doctors for treatment.

You do realise around half of nursing home residents are state funded ?

I do. And I am sure you realise that most of the staff are not coming from non-U.K., EU countries?

So, if you are poor, you may well still put you mum in a private nursing home.
And you’re also apparently wrong about ‘most of the staff’:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/articles/internationalmigrationandthehealthcareworkforce/2019-08-15

Err, have you actually looked at what that data quoted - it said EU nationals were more likely to work in the private health sector than non-EU or U.K. staff.

Not exactly backing your case that EU staff are holding up state nursing homes...

Why do you imagine there is a clear distinction between state and private nursing homes ?
A good deal of the clients of the private sector (which accounts for the vast majority of such homes in the UK) are council funded.

Three things;

1. On that data, 88pc of health staff are U.K. nationals. EU staff do not hold up the system;
2. Of the 12pc, the data states 6pc are EU and 6pc non-EU staff.
3. On your specific point, yes councils fund non-state homes but, given the very definitions, it is more likely that poorer older people are in state homes than private ones

Andy_JS said:

It's regrettable the whole Brexit saga ended up the way it did. Some sort of compromise between the two sides would have been preferable, and probably would have happened in the era before social media when everyone was more reasonable.