Undefined discussion subject.

Stocky said:

Benpointer said:

Feeling a bit depressed by stats today - can someone help me?

UK 7 day cases up by 44%, deaths up by 32%, hospitalisations up by 17%. On what basis does anyone expect the lockdown restrictions to ease in a few weeks time? ☹️

Cases are localised and hospitalisations are largely in the unvaccinated. All adults can now have vaccine (though I accept that many will have 2nd jab to come, they will have some protection from 1st jab).

The cases/hospitalisations/deaths were predicted to rise through road map stages, especially the 17 May relaxations.

So, this was always going to be the case. Likewise, it was also always going to be the case that those seeking to prolong restrictions would try to use this to scare the government into deviating from the road map. They have succeeded once - they mustn't be allowed to again.

We have run out of money.

No justification for further withdrawing of personal liberties. Full stop.

I asked the other day, but got no answer: are we still getting data dumps of deaths from way back? Given how tiny the number of deaths are, doing that would skew the figures significantly.

Stocky said:

contrarian said:

Stocky said:

Benpointer said:

Feeling a bit depressed by stats today - can someone help me?

UK 7 day cases up by 44%, deaths up by 32%, hospitalisations up by 17%. On what basis does anyone expect the lockdown restrictions to ease in a few weeks time? ☹️

Cases are localised and hospitalisations are largely in the unvaccinated. All adults can now have vaccine (though I accept that many will have 2nd jab to come, they will have some protection from 1st jab).

The cases/hospitalisations/deaths were predicted to rise through road map stages, especially the 17 May relaxations.

So, this was always going to be the case. Likewise, it was also always going to be the case that those seeking to prolong restrictions would try to use this to scare the government into deviating from road map. They have succeeded once - they mustn't be allowed to again.

We have run out of money.

No justification for further withdrawing of personal liberties. Full stop.

Johnson's assorted idiots are wondering how they can avoid hitting already disgruntled tories for six with Southern constituency losing tax increases later this year and next.

Growth is the only solution. Not much of a solution but the only one. And the only way to get growth is reopen.

Save the NHS? if it comes to me losing my seat, f8ck the NHS.

At bottom, when you justify the prolonging of lockdowns because "we are nearly there because we have the vaccine silver bullet", and then the vaccines are better than expected and taken up so well and speedily, what do you have left to prolong this abomination any further other than ignorant public opinion feeding populism allied to people who have vested interests all over the place?

Well a vaccine evading variant. The fact is, even if one of those turns up, the Johnson government faces an almighty struggle to go backwards.

The Johnson Cabinet is looking at gargantuan debt. It is looking at the threat of inflation. It is looking at whole industries getting crushed. It is looking at having to hammer tory voters in the depths of winter with huge tax rises and new lockdowns.

It is looking at losing.

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then?

Chip implantation?

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

I used to resist using a card as I wanted 100% of my money to go to the local shop instead of a financial service, but I've never worried about leaving a trail. If MI5 (bizarrely) ever want to know what I'm doing, I'm resigned to the fact that they'll have ways to figure it out, without depending on observing that I've been to Sainsbury.

Black_Rook said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Boo!

https://twitter.com/unit_football/status/1408020325389017090

Football Intelligence Unit
@unit_football
No away fans in the Premier League until at least Christmas

I don't get that. I thought freedom day was removal of basically all restrictions?

If we are "fully vaccinated", we are going to have 140,000 at a Grand Prix, we are going to have 60,000 are Wembley....but we can't have a few 1000 away fans?

This might not be Governmental diktat though. Could be the Premier League itself playing silly buggers.

I fully anticipate being stuck with Covid measures at work for some considerable period of time after July 19th, even if they are all scrapped in wider society. Some businesses are more reluctant to let go of the security blanket than others.

Schools are starting to remove them.

It also looks - from what I am seeing - as though they have been told the isolation requirement for immediate contacts is to be scrapped.

At any rate, they are making no plans to facilitate that next year.

Andy_JS said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

I also discovered this on my last trip to London, except for an Arab restaurant on the Edgware Road which only accepted cash! A lot of small town businesses are still in the "only accepting cash" category.

Once you’ve consumed the goods, received service is a business actually legally allowed to refuse to accept cash? Isn’t that what the whole concept of “legal tender” is all about?

Bunch of new outbreaks in Colchester area last 2 days, including one at a school where one of my sons works.

malcolmg said:

Burgessian said:

CarlottaVance said:

Cases up, testing up, positivity up.....

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/2332783/nearly-3000-new-covid-cases-in-scotland-as-dundee-outbreak-soars/

FWIW i think Nicola's scrap with Andy Burnham was quite a considerable misstep by her. The Anglophobia just too blatant. Might fire up the base but a big turn-off for everyone else.

Two arses with ideas above their stations, a pair of useless fannies.

Enough! Scotland simply isn't so gloomy.

Scott_xP said:

BREAKING: Rudy Giuliani's law license has been suspended.

A disciplinary body says he made "demonstrably false and misleading statements to courts, lawmakers and the public at large in his capacity as lawyer for former President Donald J. Trump."
http://www.nycourts.gov/courts/ad1/calendar/List_Word/2021/06_Jun/24/PDF/Matter of Giuliani (2021-00506) PC.pdf

Reading that makes Giuliani seem mentally incompetent. To pick just one pointed comment:

On their face, these numerical claims are so wildly divergent and irreconcilable, that they all cannot be true at the same time. Some of the wild divergences were even stated by respondent in the very same sentence

Black_Rook said:

CarlottaVance said:

Latest rates for Greater Manchester areas Scot Gov has banned travel to/from

* Manchester 378 (cases per 100k people over 7 days)
* Salford 335
* Bolton 251

Latest rates for worst-hit Scottish councils (no travel restrictions)

* East Lothian 391
* Dundee 381
* Edinburgh 336

https://twitter.com/ChrisMusson/status/1408111801598947330?s=20

And yet, no signs of howling lunatics in hazmat suits patrolling the border at Berwick, screaming at the Scots to go home. Fancy that.

Only Carlotta as usual leading the dirge.

SandyRentool said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Are we all excited for Microsoft Windows 11?

Is that a cricket team?

EE sucks. Crap signal iny area and now they are paying for all that advertising by screwing their customers


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/0211ddb8-d4ee-11eb-b50d-ece47261907f?shareToken=3e25699e9f7a459fdbf58b1fe86075aa

83% of adults have now received at least one jab.

ydoethur said:

Black_Rook said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Boo!

https://twitter.com/unit_football/status/1408020325389017090

Football Intelligence Unit
@unit_football
No away fans in the Premier League until at least Christmas

I don't get that. I thought freedom day was removal of basically all restrictions?

If we are "fully vaccinated", we are going to have 140,000 at a Grand Prix, we are going to have 60,000 are Wembley....but we can't have a few 1000 away fans?

This might not be Governmental diktat though. Could be the Premier League itself playing silly buggers.

I fully anticipate being stuck with Covid measures at work for some considerable period of time after July 19th, even if they are all scrapped in wider society. Some businesses are more reluctant to let go of the security blanket than others.

Schools are starting to remove them.

It also looks - from what I am seeing - as though they have been told the isolation requirement for immediate contacts is to be scrapped.

At any rate, they are making no plans to facilitate that next year.

Which would doubtless be a huge relief for all concerned. One continues to read of children being sent home because someone in the class coughed from sources left, right and centre.

Elsewhere, I think I spy more encouraging news in the Covid stats, this time from Scotland. Glasgow was one of the early Delta hotspots, yet the Covid patient total for the whole country is still well below where it was last August and there *may* be signs of the hospital admission rate starting to level off.

It's one of the more Plague-affected corners of the map at the moment, so if the healthcare system there doesn't come under significant pressure then it augurs well for everywhere else.

alex_ said:

ydoethur said:

alex_ said:

Andy_JS said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

I also discovered this on my last trip to London, except for an Arab restaurant on the Edgware Road which only accepted cash! A lot of small town businesses are still in the "only accepting cash" category.

Once you’ve consumed the goods, received service is a business actually legally allowed to refuse to accept cash? Isn’t that what the whole concept of “legal tender” is all about?

No:

https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/knowledgebank/what-is-legal-tender

I’m not sure if that’s “no” I’m wrong or “no” I’m right!

That’s why I said “consumed the goods/received the service”. At that point there’s a debt. Different to purchasing something in a shop.

If they have advertised in advance of ordering that they didn’t accept cash, that wouldn’t apply. Remember, it’s an offence to purchase consumables without having the means to pay for them.

NickPalmer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

They aren't my neighbours, landlords/servants depending on your POV.

But seriously, I still would be deeply uncomfortable with having Muslims as neighbours.

As you know I'm a very good Muslim and they'd feel bad because they weren't as pious as me.

lol. Prompts me to tell my classic weird racist tale that I'm not sure I've told here before. I was doing my weekly "Hi I'm your MP, how are things?" canvass round, and came to one where the lady said, "Things are OK, but the neighbour has really let us down."

Me: Why is that?

Lady: Didn't you read about it? He was a former police officer, imprisoned for having a lot of child pornography. They only just let him out.

Me: Ah, I can see you'd be concerned. Well, I suppose he's paid his debt to society...

Lady: No, no, you misunderstand! He's lovely, but he's worried what people will say if he comes back, so he's let his house out to TWO POLES! I didn't move to Kimberley to live next to Polish people!

I called on them next - turned out to be two middle-aged nurses, who seemed both peaceful and contented. I thought I'd better not tell them about their horrid neighbour or landlord...

I'd say Kimberley residents have mellowed since I went to school there!

ydoethur said:

alex_ said:

Andy_JS said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

I also discovered this on my last trip to London, except for an Arab restaurant on the Edgware Road which only accepted cash! A lot of small town businesses are still in the "only accepting cash" category.

Once you’ve consumed the goods, received service is a business actually legally allowed to refuse to accept cash? Isn’t that what the whole concept of “legal tender” is all about?

No:

https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/knowledgebank/what-is-legal-tender

What is wrong with the following argument? If you've consumed the goods then presumably you received them according to the contract of sale; therefore you owe money; therefore the seller can't turn down payment in legal tender.

Edit: yes, OK, doesn't apply if they've said they won't accept cash. But if they haven't said anything...

Black_Rook said:

ydoethur said:

Black_Rook said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Boo!

https://twitter.com/unit_football/status/1408020325389017090

Football Intelligence Unit
@unit_football
No away fans in the Premier League until at least Christmas

I don't get that. I thought freedom day was removal of basically all restrictions?

If we are "fully vaccinated", we are going to have 140,000 at a Grand Prix, we are going to have 60,000 are Wembley....but we can't have a few 1000 away fans?

This might not be Governmental diktat though. Could be the Premier League itself playing silly buggers.

I fully anticipate being stuck with Covid measures at work for some considerable period of time after July 19th, even if they are all scrapped in wider society. Some businesses are more reluctant to let go of the security blanket than others.

Schools are starting to remove them.

It also looks - from what I am seeing - as though they have been told the isolation requirement for immediate contacts is to be scrapped.

At any rate, they are making no plans to facilitate that next year.

Which would doubtless be a huge relief for all concerned. One continues to read of children being sent home because someone in the class coughed from sources left, right and centre.

Elsewhere, I think I spy more encouraging news in the Covid stats, this time from Scotland. Glasgow was one of the early Delta hotspots, yet the Covid patient total for the whole country is still well below where it was last August and there *may* be signs of the hospital admission rate starting to level off.

It's one of the more Plague-affected corners of the map at the moment, so if the healthcare system there doesn't come under significant pressure then it augurs well for everywhere else.

From recent data I have seen there are few going into hospital and hardly anyone in ICU, positive cases have gone up but not seen anything much re hospital admissions. Currently 177 in hospital and only 17 in ICU, cases up 3K but only up 7 in hospital, so unless big lag it does not seem to be in sync at all.

kamski said:

Got my digital vaccine passport on my phone yesterday. Gotta say it felt good.

My mother is very happy with her letter confirming status.

TheScreamingEagles said:

NickPalmer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

They aren't my neighbours, landlords/servants depending on your POV.

But seriously, I still would be deeply uncomfortable with having Muslims as neighbours.

As you know I'm a very good Muslim and they'd feel bad because they weren't as pious as me.

lol. Prompts me to tell my classic weird racist tale that I'm not sure I've told here before. I was doing my weekly "Hi I'm your MP, how are things?" canvass round, and came to one where the lady said, "Things are OK, but the neighbour has really let us down."

Me: Why is that?

Lady: Didn't you read about it? He was a former police officer, imprisoned for having a lot of child pornography. They only just let him out.

Me: Ah, I can see you'd be concerned. Well, I suppose he's paid his debt to society...

Lady: No, no, you misunderstand! He's lovely, but he's worried what people will say if he comes back, so he's let his house out to TWO POLES! I didn't move to Kimberley to live next to Polish people!

I called on them next - turned out to be two middle-aged nurses, who seemed both peaceful and contented. I thought I'd better not tell them about their horrid neighbour or landlord...

Voters, what would we do without them.

I remember back in 2009 I had a friend campaigning for the Tory party and he met a delightful chap and the conversation went something along the lines of

Canvasser: Can I ask who you plan to vote for in the locals and Euros?

Voter: Well I wanted to vote BNP but the BNP guy says he's not a racist so I'm not voting for them.

Canvasser: Err ok.

Honest at least.

Black_Rook said:

ydoethur said:

Black_Rook said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Boo!

https://twitter.com/unit_football/status/1408020325389017090

Football Intelligence Unit
@unit_football
No away fans in the Premier League until at least Christmas

I don't get that. I thought freedom day was removal of basically all restrictions?

If we are "fully vaccinated", we are going to have 140,000 at a Grand Prix, we are going to have 60,000 are Wembley....but we can't have a few 1000 away fans?

This might not be Governmental diktat though. Could be the Premier League itself playing silly buggers.

I fully anticipate being stuck with Covid measures at work for some considerable period of time after July 19th, even if they are all scrapped in wider society. Some businesses are more reluctant to let go of the security blanket than others.

Schools are starting to remove them.

It also looks - from what I am seeing - as though they have been told the isolation requirement for immediate contacts is to be scrapped.

At any rate, they are making no plans to facilitate that next year.

Which would doubtless be a huge relief for all concerned. One continues to read of children being sent home because someone in the class coughed from sources left, right and centre.

Elsewhere, I think I spy more encouraging news in the Covid stats, this time from Scotland. Glasgow was one of the early Delta hotspots, yet the Covid patient total for the whole country is still well below where it was last August and there *may* be signs of the hospital admission rate starting to level off.

It's one of the more Plague-affected corners of the map at the moment, so if the healthcare system there doesn't come under significant pressure then it augurs well for everywhere else.

Unfortunately part of the problem is driven by the kids. Unsurprising after a year of propoganda to spread fear. I've heard from more than 1 teacher of kids hearing about a case in the school and having full on tantrums demanding to be sent home for their safety.

Black_Rook said:

Andy_JS said:

83% of adults have now received at least one jab.

The first dose figures fluctuate a little but seem to be going up by an average of around 0.4% per day. In crude terms, this should mean that (assuming that 90% of adults take up the offer of a vaccine) we should have substantively completed the first doses by about July 12th.

It currently looks as if second doses might be done by about the end of August, assuming that supply doesn't get any slower.

Also assuming the doses don't get diverted to teenage first doses vs 2nd doses for 20 year olds.

Philip_Thompson said:

MattW said:

Philip_Thompson said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

williamglenn said:

Wow:

Mark Rutte: "For me, Hungary has no place in the EU anymore”

Rutte if they refuse to withdraw the legislation: “then as far as I am concerned, then there is nothing left for them in the EU”

“This is such a fundamental point, that if we let that go, we are nothing more than a trading block and a currency”

https://twitter.com/SkyScottBeasley/status/1408077831091937288

The horror!

The mask slips.....as we know to EU bods, such an arrangement just isn't sufficient.

No mask. The EU bods never intended for the EU to be that.

It was only British politicians and Remainers who were adamant the EU was just a trade bloc etc despite Europeans being keen for that not to be what it was.

It's why Britain was in hindsight fundamentally unsuitable for Europe. All the talk of two speeds etc never worked, either people should have got on board with the full project or got off the train.

We eventually did the right thing and I hope the Dutch etc can now do the right thing for them without us in their way. Good luck to them. But yes the Hungarians should be expelled, but I don't think they can be. No idea how they fix that mess.

Does the expulsion process even exist?

The 'voluntary' process did not exist for the first 50 years, and then when it was 'created' it was deliberately crippled to make it impossible to use.

And then people wonder whether certain things were said a little cynically. Duh.

Not expelled but membership rights can be suspended, but it requires unanimity which Rutte won't be able to get.

Poland and the other Visegrad states won't allow Hungary to be suspended, and vice-versa Hungary will protect the other Visegrad states.

Guess we're getting that two speed EU after all.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Philip_Thompson said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Are we all excited for Microsoft Windows 11?

I thought they'd said Windows 10 would be the last version? And it'd be just updates from there?

The general rule with Windows is that every other version is good, every other one is crap. So Windows 11 is scheduled to be the shit one.

I don't know if that was marketing spin that got out of control. Even at the time there seemed to be contradictory statements from different Microsoft people.

It looks like Windows 11 has some nice additions e.g. run Android apps natively.

Running Android natively is a really neat improvement.

Maybe Windows 11 won't be a disappointment afterall.

kle4 said:

Er, what the f*ck?

An indigenous nation in Canada says it has found 751 unmarked graves at the site of a former residential school in Saskatchewan.

The Cowessess First Nation said the discovery was "the most significantly substantial to date in Canada".

It comes weeks after the remains of 215 children were found at a similar residential school in British Columbia.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-57592243

What's the least horrific explanation? That the school was unintentionally so horrible that many died?

Yes.

The Marieval Indian Residential School was operated by the Roman Catholic Church from 1899 to 1997 in the area where Cowessess is now located in southeastern Saskatchewan. It is not yet clear if all of the remains are linked to the school.

It was one of more than 130 compulsory boarding schools funded by the Canadian government and run by religious authorities during the 19th and 20th Centuries with the aim of assimilating indigenous youth.

An estimated 6,000 children died while attending these schools, due in large part to the squalid health conditions inside. Students were often housed in poorly built, poorly heated, and unsanitary facilities.

Physical and sexual abuse at the hands of school authorities led others to run away.

maaarsh said:

Black_Rook said:

Andy_JS said:

83% of adults have now received at least one jab.

The first dose figures fluctuate a little but seem to be going up by an average of around 0.4% per day. In crude terms, this should mean that (assuming that 90% of adults take up the offer of a vaccine) we should have substantively completed the first doses by about July 12th.

It currently looks as if second doses might be done by about the end of August, assuming that supply doesn't get any slower.

Also assuming the doses don't get diverted to teenage first doses vs 2nd doses for 20 year olds.

That's a fair point. The mood music from officialdom is blowing cold on vaccines for schoolchildren at the moment, but we know how many volte-face there have been already during the course of this horror show.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Are we all excited for Microsoft Windows 11?

The only time I've used Windows was when Windows 95 was a free add-on to our mid-1990s Macintosh computer.

maaarsh said:

Black_Rook said:

ydoethur said:

Black_Rook said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Boo!

https://twitter.com/unit_football/status/1408020325389017090

Football Intelligence Unit
@unit_football
No away fans in the Premier League until at least Christmas

I don't get that. I thought freedom day was removal of basically all restrictions?

If we are "fully vaccinated", we are going to have 140,000 at a Grand Prix, we are going to have 60,000 are Wembley....but we can't have a few 1000 away fans?

This might not be Governmental diktat though. Could be the Premier League itself playing silly buggers.

I fully anticipate being stuck with Covid measures at work for some considerable period of time after July 19th, even if they are all scrapped in wider society. Some businesses are more reluctant to let go of the security blanket than others.

Schools are starting to remove them.

It also looks - from what I am seeing - as though they have been told the isolation requirement for immediate contacts is to be scrapped.

At any rate, they are making no plans to facilitate that next year.

Which would doubtless be a huge relief for all concerned. One continues to read of children being sent home because someone in the class coughed from sources left, right and centre.

Elsewhere, I think I spy more encouraging news in the Covid stats, this time from Scotland. Glasgow was one of the early Delta hotspots, yet the Covid patient total for the whole country is still well below where it was last August and there *may* be signs of the hospital admission rate starting to level off.

It's one of the more Plague-affected corners of the map at the moment, so if the healthcare system there doesn't come under significant pressure then it augurs well for everywhere else.

Unfortunately part of the problem is driven by the kids. Unsurprising after a year of propoganda to spread fear. I've heard from more than 1 teacher of kids hearing about a case in the school and having full on tantrums demanding to be sent home for their safety.

I suppose that a certain amount of that sort of thing must be going on. The GP of the day on the BBC Breakfast show the other morning was talking about the urgency of getting back to normal, and one of the problems that she highlighted was an explosion of child mental illness. Social phobia was specifically mentioned, but I guess that over a year of wall-to-wall terror messaging about this disease will have taken its toll in other ways. Apparently child and adolescent mental health services are collapsing under the weight of demand. It's very sad.

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

kamski said:

Got my digital vaccine passport on my phone yesterday. Gotta say it felt good.

Am I right in thinking you can get a paper version which is just as good in terms of being accepted?

Andy_JS said:

kamski said:

Got my digital vaccine passport on my phone yesterday. Gotta say it felt good.

Am I right in thinking you can get a paper version which is just as good in terms of being accepted?

Yes.

Andy_JS said:

kamski said:

Got my digital vaccine passport on my phone yesterday. Gotta say it felt good.

Am I right in thinking you can get a paper version which is just as good in terms of being accepted?

Don't inflict your Luddism on the rest of us.

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

Canada Goose to end the use of all fur on coats

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-57592599

How will one tell the difference from the knock-offs all the chavs wear?

NickPalmer said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

I used to resist using a card as I wanted 100% of my money to go to the local shop instead of a financial service, but I've never worried about leaving a trail. If MI5 (bizarrely) ever want to know what I'm doing, I'm resigned to the fact that they'll have ways to figure it out, without depending on observing that I've been to Sainsbury.

The fact that MI5 can put people under surveillance, for mostly good reasons, is not to my mind a good reason to accept mandatory card payments. Nor ID cards, nor CCTV everywhere etc - its the same slippery slope.

I don't mind card payments myself, but would rather preserve these freedoms.

maaarsh said:

Sri Lanka choosing to bat first was always going to short change spectators and this is setting up to be a men against boys waste of time.

Sri Lanka aren't very good are they.

Evening all

It's that time of the week (don't you just love it?) when I take a look at the latest vaccination numbers in my own back yard, the London Borough of Newham.

This time last week, 143,429 adults over 30 had received a first vaccination - this week the number is 147,866 so that's 4,500 extra.

Among all those over 16, it was 162,150 last week and this week it's 174,037 so nearly another 12,000 first vaccinations and well over half of them under 30 year olds so all welcome.

Looking at 2nd vaccination numbers, the number of adults 30 and above who had received two vaccinations was 90,272 (84,870 last week) and for all over 16 it's 100,139 compared with 93,163 last week.

The proportion of adults over 30 having received a first vaccination is now 58% compared with 56.3% last week while the second dose proportion is now 35.4% from 33.3% last week.

There remain over 100,000 adults over 30 in Newham who have yet to be vaccinated - we did 4,500 last week so you can work out how long it's going to take if everyone wanted it. Assuming 80% take up which would be roughly 200,000 people we aren't three quarters of the way there and it's taken nearly seven months - at 4,500 per week we're still looking at three months to get everyone over 30 to have a single vaccination.

The notion the vaccination rollout is near complete may be valid in some places - it's not valid in Newham.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

I believe Samsung Pay continues to work even if card is reported as lost. Its authorisation process is separate.

https://www.nationwide.co.uk/support/payments-and-transfers/samsung-pay-card-lost-stolen#:~:text=Yes, if you report your,wait for your new card.

More good news: whilst Covid case rates continue to climb in much of the Home Counties, all three of the Bedfordshire unitaries (where Delta hit earlier) are now on their way down. Moreover, the total number of Covid patients in the local hospital trust - updated as recently as Tuesday - is only 21, and all hospital indicators (admissions, total patients and ventilator beds) have been virtually static for the last fortnight.

Covid deaths for the whole of Bedfordshire so far this month, using the within 28 days of a test measure, stand at 4. In a population of nearly 700,000.

It's all immensely encouraging.

Galloway on C4 news being his usual charming self. Female interviewer asking unhelpful questions on the GG campaign bus.

‘Are we done here? You’d better get off the bus.’

Mutter, mumble, typical Channel4 etc.

stodge said:

Evening all

It's that time of the week (don't you just love it?) when I take a look at the latest vaccination numbers in my own back yard, the London Borough of Newham.

This time last week, 143,429 adults over 30 had received a first vaccination - this week the number is 147,866 so that's 4,500 extra.

Among all those over 16, it was 162,150 last week and this week it's 174,037 so nearly another 12,000 first vaccinations and well over half of them under 30 year olds so all welcome.

Looking at 2nd vaccination numbers, the number of adults 30 and above who had received two vaccinations was 90,272 (84,870 last week) and for all over 16 it's 100,139 compared with 93,163 last week.

The proportion of adults over 30 having received a first vaccination is now 58% compared with 56.3% last week while the second dose proportion is now 35.4% from 33.3% last week.

There remain over 100,000 adults over 30 in Newham who have yet to be vaccinated - we did 4,500 last week so you can work out how long it's going to take if everyone wanted it. Assuming 80% take up which would be roughly 200,000 people we aren't three quarters of the way there and it's taken nearly seven months - at 4,500 per week we're still looking at three months to get everyone over 30 to have a single vaccination.

The notion the vaccination rollout is near complete may be valid in some places - it's not valid in Newham.

Frustrating though it is that some people are reluctant to get vaccinated, this was always expected to be the case. It’s likely that we will end as one of the highest proportion vaccinated in the world. Sadly some or most of your locals who refuse the jab will have to learn the hard way about Covid. But that’s their choice.

darkage said:

The fact that MI5 can put people under surveillance, for mostly good reasons, is not to my mind a good reason to accept mandatory card payments. Nor ID cards, nor CCTV everywhere etc - its the same slippery slope.

I don't mind card payments myself, but would rather preserve these freedoms.

We didn't "lose our freedoms" due to coronavirus - we gave them away in the name of "security" and "safety" following terrorist attacks such as the Birmingham pub bombings which gave us the Prevention of Terrorism Act.

Everyone willingly signed up to a bit more surveillance and a bit more power for the security state in the name of stopping terror and feeling "safe" and after every outrage it's the same. A bit more control, a bit less freedom and we'll all be safe.

In many ways, irrespective of what @SeanT and others assert happened or didn't happen in Wuhan, coronavirus has been akin to a terrorist outrage. Johnson and the Government (and of course he and the UK aren't alone) have responded as though it were a terrorist attack. The mindset is exactly the same and the thing I've found most interesting is some of those who protest at the curtailment of freedoms now were quite supportive of the curtailment of freedoms following the various terrorist attacks over the past 50 years.

Funny and true.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

That's why you should always have one totally virtual card that is only on your phone. (Or where the physical card is at home.)

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

I believe Samsung Pay continues to work even if card is reported as lost. Its authorisation process is separate.

https://www.nationwide.co.uk/support/payments-and-transfers/samsung-pay-card-lost-stolen#:~:text=Yes, if you report your,wait for your new card.

Interesting.

Not everyone has this app (I didn't and still dont) and there are all kinds of things that can happen like your phone battery can run out. Businesses have dealt with cash forever, it is hardly a nightmare for them to continue to do so, it is probably very low down the list of nightmares particularly now that the vast majority of transactions seem to be done electronically.

But the broader point is that it is wrong to compel people to pay for things in this permanently trackable way.

rcs1000 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

That's why you should always have one totally virtual card that is only on your phone. (Or where the physical card is at home.)

It really annoying that Privacy.com isn't in the UK. That is such a good idea, where you create all these virtual cards for online, so you can have different ones for services you use regularly and you create a one off if you are buying from a website you aren't certain about.

darkage said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

I believe Samsung Pay continues to work even if card is reported as lost. Its authorisation process is separate.

https://www.nationwide.co.uk/support/payments-and-transfers/samsung-pay-card-lost-stolen#:~:text=Yes, if you report your,wait for your new card.

Interesting.

Not everyone has this app (I didn't and still dont) and there are all kinds of things that can happen like your phone battery can run out. Businesses have dealt with cash forever, it is hardly a nightmare for them to continue to do so, it is probably very low down the list of nightmares particularly now that the vast majority of transactions seem to be done electronically.

But the broader point is that it is wrong to compel people to pay for things in this permanently trackable way.

Over the last few years I've paid for 99% of things via my watch.

As someone who works in financial regulation I'll let you into a little secret, cash is also trackable, and people who appear to use cash only attract more attention than card users.

If, inter alia, you pay council tax, have an NI number, on the electoral register or a birth certificate, then the man tracks you.

JohnO said:

Roger said:

Just seen an interview with George Galloway on Ch4 News. He was extremely rude to his female interviewer before telling her to get off his bus. Horrible man!

He probably do well.

Wait a sec. Weren’t you singing his praises this very morn as someone who would speak up for Palestinians in Parliament?

Always a highly optimistic analysis.

As Nick Palmer said far more eloquently than I ever could, the only thing Galloway ever cared about or spoke up for was himself.

BigRich said:

stodge said:

Evening all

It's that time of the week (don't you just love it?) when I take a look at the latest vaccination numbers in my own back yard, the London Borough of Newham.

This time last week, 143,429 adults over 30 had received a first vaccination - this week the number is 147,866 so that's 4,500 extra.

Among all those over 16, it was 162,150 last week and this week it's 174,037 so nearly another 12,000 first vaccinations and well over half of them under 30 year olds so all welcome.

Looking at 2nd vaccination numbers, the number of adults 30 and above who had received two vaccinations was 90,272 (84,870 last week) and for all over 16 it's 100,139 compared with 93,163 last week.

The proportion of adults over 30 having received a first vaccination is now 58% compared with 56.3% last week while the second dose proportion is now 35.4% from 33.3% last week.

There remain over 100,000 adults over 30 in Newham who have yet to be vaccinated - we did 4,500 last week so you can work out how long it's going to take if everyone wanted it. Assuming 80% take up which would be roughly 200,000 people we aren't three quarters of the way there and it's taken nearly seven months - at 4,500 per week we're still looking at three months to get everyone over 30 to have a single vaccination.

The notion the vaccination rollout is near complete may be valid in some places - it's not valid in Newham.

Thanks for your weekly update, hoping the number do speed up,

Just wondering has Newham, been badly hit in any of the earlier waves? if so it could be that many of the unvaccinated have some immunity?

Yes, Newham got absolutely smashed in the January wave. Absolutely crushed.

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

rcs1000 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

darkage said:

kinabalu said:

darkage said:

another thing which I noticed is the amount of places that don't accept cash anymore. I found myself in central london with no cards on me and only cash, I was turned away from literally all of the outlets in charing cross station, the only place I could buy dinner from was marks and spencer.

I went in to Itsu and just well how the fuck am I going to eat anything if no one accepts cash and the woman behind the counter just shrugged.

The pandemic has killed my cash habit and I don't think it's coming back. It's been over 15 months now since I last used.

yeah but what happens if you lose your cards (as I did). What then? Also making payment by card compulsory is a backdoor to permanent surveillance, it is a major encroachment in to freedom.

Cards aren't compulsory but nor should accepting cash be.

Cash is a nightmare for businesses. Insecure, at serious risk of sticky fingers, creates a risk of robberies and theft, and creates problems for transportation. Cards at least guarantee that a transaction processed sees the money reach the bank account and not be disrupted by ending in someone else's pocket instead.

As for losing cards, that's not really much different to losing your cash. Besides you can load your cards onto your phone nowadays too, so even without your cards even if you have your phone you can still use your cards.

With my RBS account if I lose my card/am without my card I can still withdraw cash (£150 per 24 hours) via the RBS app.

How's that any different to if I am without my card I can still pay with any of my cards contactlessly via my Samsung Pay app?

The moment you report your card lost/stolen it should stop working on Samsung Pay/Apple Pay/Google Pay until you receive your new card.

That's why you should always have one totally virtual card that is only on your phone. (Or where the physical card is at home.)

It really annoying that Privacy.com isn't in the UK. That is such a good idea, where you create all these virtual cards for online, so you can have different ones for services you use regularly and you create a one off if you are buying from a website you aren't certain about.

Monzo allow you to do that, but only if you pay.

How much does it cost?