After a disappointing set of results for LAB one figure appears to have bucked the trend – political
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Bit stupid of the returning officer to start talking at 4 minutes to the hour when all the news channels are doing the weather, etc.0
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Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.5 -
That will be an interesting interview if she still turns up.....rottenborough said:Pippa Crerar
@PippaCrerar
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2h
A Labour source tells me: “Angela was going to do Marr to defend Keir. Her team had drafted lines for Keir’s team.”
And I can confirm she *is* down the pub.0 -
That isn't the worst part of their business model but that requires too much typing for this time of night.FrancisUrquhart said:
They are the group behind the likes of MyProtein....they have the most annoying business model ever...the price is never the price, it is always possible to get 30-40-50% off and they bombard you daily with these offer codes.tlg86 said:Fan power:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/may/08/manchester-united-lose-200m-training-kit-deal-over-fans-anti-glazers-campaign
Manchester United have missed out on a proposed new training kit deal worth £200m over 10 years after the Manchester-based company The Hut Group had concerns about the supporters’ campaign to boycott the club’s commercial partners in protest at the Glazers’ ownership, the Observer understands.
Richard Arnold, United’s group managing director, was told on Friday that THG had pulled out of a contract which was due to start on 1 July.
No, I'd never heard of The Hut Group either.
So you buy a box of protein bars from them, then every day you get spam email after spam email, but if you unsubscribe you won't get the offer codes and so if you want to restock your protein bars you will have to pay 2x the price.
The products they sell are fine, but its the sales tactics that drive you mad.0 -
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.0 -
London turnout: 42.2%.
Sky News showing the declaration, BBC showing an advert.0 -
It's the only way to get them out, hurt their cash balance and force them to sell. The fans should keep up their campaign and make more companies pull out of sponsorship dealstlg86 said:Fan power:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/may/08/manchester-united-lose-200m-training-kit-deal-over-fans-anti-glazers-campaign
Manchester United have missed out on a proposed new training kit deal worth £200m over 10 years after the Manchester-based company The Hut Group had concerns about the supporters’ campaign to boycott the club’s commercial partners in protest at the Glazers’ ownership, the Observer understands.
Richard Arnold, United’s group managing director, was told on Friday that THG had pulled out of a contract which was due to start on 1 July.
No, I'd never heard of The Hut Group either.1 -
By dead people?kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.5 -
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?0 -
2016 result was Khan on 1,148,716 and Goldsmith 909,755.1
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Lol - you have me there. No comment.Charles said:
It’s not boring if you’re doing it right…kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
(Not that I ever have to be clear)
But you know what I mean. It's just not very fascinating to me. A bloke doesn't go up in my estimation if I find out he gets around. The opposite if anything.0 -
By many people who've had near-death experiences.BluestBlue said:
By dead people?kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.0 -
Durham might be but County Durham features some of the most depressing villages I've ever encountered anywhere in the UK..MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.
If you don't believe me take the A68 south from Corbridge and you will identify exactly when you leave Northumberland and again when you hit Darlington Borough Council.
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You would think that would be the very first check....we are meant to have x ballot boxes.....do we have that many?ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?1 -
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically0 -
Yes, the WY leg of Grand Central is rather like my first flight. Booked Edinburgh-Paris through the agent, took off, turned round, flew along the M8. There was a 90m stop in Glasgow. Could've got up 2 hours later.RochdalePioneers said:
Nicola Murray and her aid bailed from the train at Brighouse, so the bit after Donny. Once they found out that Big Ben Swain was on manuevers.Stuartinromford said:
Which part of the journey? The London-Doncaster fast bit, or the Doncaster-Bradford bit where you can watch the snails whizz by?RochdalePioneers said:
To be authentic Starmer needs to be conducting the reshuffle from the vestibule of a Grand Central service from London to Bradford.Scott_xP said:Sound of screeching brakes? I'm hearing the reshuffle may have stalled because of the backlash to Angela Rayner's sacking
https://twitter.com/REWearmouth/status/1391139439716483074
Likewise, you could get off at Wakefield Kirkgate, hail a taxi and beat the train to Bradford easily. Or, it being Kirkgate. you could peg it out of there so fast and not stop running till the relative safety of Bradford, and still beat the train.1 -
Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%
2016 result was Khan 56.8%, Goldsmith 43.2%.
Swing from Lab to Con: 1.6%5 -
Should have seen Consett, back in the day.....eek said:
Durham might be but County Durham features some of the most depressing villages I've ever encountered anywhere in the UK..MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.0 -
I’ve nearly pissed myself laughing at this.BluestBlue said:
By dead people?kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.1 -
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%1 -
From an outsider the 'City of Durham' constituency looks weird full stop - remain won there and it's got a respected university but it's long term trend seems to be towards the Tories.MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.0 -
I presume the deep state stole all the ballots for Brian Rose....Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%0 -
I for one won’t be visiting Rwanda any time soon.MaxPB said:
It's the only way to get them out, hurt their cash balance and force them to sell. The fans should keep up their campaign and make more companies pull out of sponsorship dealstlg86 said:Fan power:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/may/08/manchester-united-lose-200m-training-kit-deal-over-fans-anti-glazers-campaign
Manchester United have missed out on a proposed new training kit deal worth £200m over 10 years after the Manchester-based company The Hut Group had concerns about the supporters’ campaign to boycott the club’s commercial partners in protest at the Glazers’ ownership, the Observer understands.
Richard Arnold, United’s group managing director, was told on Friday that THG had pulled out of a contract which was due to start on 1 July.
No, I'd never heard of The Hut Group either.0 -
I agree with you. At best it is a shrug.kinabalu said:
Lol - you have me there. No comment.Charles said:
It’s not boring if you’re doing it right…kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
(Not that I ever have to be clear)
But you know what I mean. It's just not very fascinating to me. A bloke doesn't go up in my estimation if I find out he gets around. The opposite if anything.1 -
Despite all the patronising criticism of them then, both Shaun Bailey and RT have got a swing to the Tories since 2016Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%
2016 result was Khan 56.8%, Goldsmith 43.2%.
Swing from Lab to Con: 1.6%2 -
Author of the coupletLeon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically
I sometimes think that I would like
To be the saddle of a bike0 -
I don't think anyone predicted a swing to the Tories in the London mayoral race, however small.1
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Labour are going to do well to just win back the seats they have lost in subsequent by-elections....Pagan2 said:
A few weeks back I said that I thought that at the next GE labour would on net lose a few seats. I grow ever more confident that I was rightMarqueeMark said:
Just when you thought Labour's fortunes couldn't go any lower.....Starmer bends down and opens up a trapdoor.Taz said:
This is a complete shambles, it is making Starmer look incredibly weak.Scott_xP said:Sound of screeching brakes? I'm hearing the reshuffle may have stalled because of the backlash to Angela Rayner's sacking
https://twitter.com/REWearmouth/status/13911394397164830740 -
Another Labour Mayor makes a better speech than Starmer.
Khan says he's "a proud Englishman and a Brit".0 -
Some of County Durham is very attractive, down Weardale and Teesdale. Some ex-pit villages are very depressing, but there are some very smart villages too.eek said:
Durham might be but County Durham features some of the most depressing villages I've ever encountered anywhere in the UK..MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.
If you don't believe me take the A68 south from Corbridge and you will identify exactly when you leave Northumberland and again when you hit Darlington Borough Council.2 -
You can't go to sleep now
Bristol is counting the second preferences.
Labour and Green are the top 2
Rees (LAB) 50,510
Hore-Ruthven (GRN) 36,331
Watson (CON) 25,860
Gooch (LD) 15,517
Connelly (Independent) 4,952
Baldwin (TUSC) 3,194
Langley (Independent) 1,528
Clarke (Reform UK) 806
Shaw (Indendent) 3890 -
Bruce WillisBluestBlue said:
By dead people?kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.2 -
Well thats the hard left cancelling him thenHarryFreeman said:Another Labour Mayor makes a better speech than Starmer.
Khan says he's "a proud Englishman and a Brit".0 -
“Hey Sir Keir... what the hells got into you?”1
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Easy win for Khan in the end. But many like me want to see him do much more in his next term. I voted second preference (first Luisa) but without any great enthusiasm.0
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Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%0 -
Bailey's a mummy boy0
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Yes alright. The bullshit is strong in that arena. I do think you might sometimes try to detect some virtue in people though. Ah well. Perhaps you do but don't feel it useful to say.Pagan2 said:
They selected a career where 80% of them will only have enough nous to go through the correct lobby. Your evidence they aren't is what precisely? I also acknowledged they were probably knowledgeable in the area they got their degree in but pointed out to many of that ilk think being knowledgeable in one small are makes you knowledgeable in all. I have seen far too many mp's talking about things they obviously have no idea about to not think they are mostly too thick to realise they don't know what the hell they are talking about. That is what makes them thick as mince. From covid for example I at least no I don't know enough about epidemiology to comment.....not so with plenty of our mp's and mediakinabalu said:
One awaits the day when you utter a sentiment about anybody or anything which is not infused with mean spirited contempt and bumpkin ignorance.Pagan2 said:
3 times average salary isnt enough already to attract working and lower middle class people? Frankly most of our mps are thick as mince. Yes they may be well educated but that just means they know a lot about a narrow slice of knowledge, but they have less common sense than a dead herring. Sadly though they then go on to pontificate about stuff with absolutely no knowledge of the subject because their degree or phd gives them and over inflated sense of their own intelligence. For an extreme example I point at Macron and his I have trained my self in epidemiolgy schtickLeon said:
More money, Is the only way. We can't stop harsh criticism and social media aggression in a democracyFrankBooth said:
They are already in the top 1 or 2% of earners believe it or not. Is the salary the major downside? I suspect it is more the lifestyle and demands of being a politician that people don't want. Something we all ought to consider. How can we make it more appealing?Leon said:
Personally, I would double or triple MPs wages, and do the same for ministers or prime ministers. Let the Prime Minister of the UK earn £300,000 a year. He's running an entire country. And a big important country, at that. CEOs of minor charities earn more than the present PM. It is ridiculous. Little Davey Miliband earns £1m in a charity at NYC - and he's utterly uselessTaz said:
Absolutely,right. Also with advance fares you can get it cheaper,than std class.Leon said:
I support Angela Rayner hereeek said:
I usually justify the quieter carriage and a guaranteed table for workingTheScreamingEagles said:
Better than that, plebs and oiks, which is why I travel first class.tlg86 said:
First class protects you from psychopathic killers?Scott_xP said:EXC: Angela Rayner was sacked hours after opponents leaked info about her conduct on the campaign trail — incl her using 1st class train tickets
Rayner says she did use them: for safety, travelling alone after Sarah Everard's murder
New level of toxicity
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/shaken-keir-starmer-wields-knife-sacking-angela-rayner-as-labour-party-chairwoman-0zbls9dm0
but that doesn't work when you have to be one for the people (and you can only claim second class if on Parliamentary business / expenses). Which is why the local MPs now fly down..
FFS she's the deputy leader of the Opposition. So she travels first class on a British train, for the very good reason that it is easier to work there?
On First Class you don't get endless free champagne and a selection of the finest charcuterie, this is not Emirates Airways from London to Sydney. You get a bigger seat, a quieter carriage and more space to work. And a free coffee. And that's it
The constant demand that our MPs must live the most humble lives possible is tedious and self defeating. We want smart, talented people to become MPs, which is often a thankless, unstable and boring job - so we need to give them a damn good salary and the means to do the job well. And for God's sake don't quibble about train classes
It’s a petty criticism.
We are saddled with inept mediocrities at Westminster because that's the level of salary we offer, the kind of wages that attracts awkward incompetents. Westminster used to get round this by the huge expenses-fiddling nonsense but that's been rumbled, so now the MPs really are reduced to pretty crap wages (by the standards of high powered London jobs) - so we need to increase the wages
We want to attract the best people to a tough demanding job where they will face fierce criticism daily. Who is going to do that for £80k a year if they can earn three or five times that elsewhere?
We have just 600-odd MPs. Pay Them Well so we get Lots of Smart People
So pay them REALLY well. Insulate them with cash and attract the best talent around
Giving every MP £150k a year would cost us £97m a year
Not a small sum but compared to the £300bn we have just spent on Covid in 12 months, it is tiny little peanuts
More importantly, it would attract working and lower middle class people to have a go. People with talent who also need to make really good money - and have the ability to do so
Most MPs are NOT thick as mince.0 -
Boris is our blond whoremonger. To (mis)quote Suetonius.Charles said:
I agree with you. At best it is a shrug.kinabalu said:
Lol - you have me there. No comment.Charles said:
It’s not boring if you’re doing it right…kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
(Not that I ever have to be clear)
But you know what I mean. It's just not very fascinating to me. A bloke doesn't go up in my estimation if I find out he gets around. The opposite if anything.1 -
Just checked the results in my old patch in County Durham. Former MP Helen Goodman stood for the council and lost to a Tory. The other Labour candidate got almost 300 votes more than she did and was elected.
Meanwhile the rough end of Bishop now has two Tory councillors. Incredible.1 -
Hmm - if you can think of one ...Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%0 -
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.1 -
Khan only gets another 3 years. Will he stand again ?0
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Rory Stewart?HarryFreeman said:
Hmm - if you can think of one ...Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%1 -
Like I say. One job to do.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.0 -
Thanks to Boris, not themselves.HYUFD said:
Despite all the patronising criticism of them then, both Shaun Bailey and RT have got a swing to the Tories since 2016Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%
2016 result was Khan 56.8%, Goldsmith 43.2%.
Swing from Lab to Con: 1.6%0 -
I guess he will return to Westminster. There has to be a fair chance he can takeover Harriet Harman's seat of Camberwell and PeckhamHarryFreeman said:Khan only gets another 3 years. Will he stand again ?
0 -
In all fairness Bailey got his arse kicked. Barely any improvement on the hopeless Goldsmith last time (who was the worst Tory mayoral candidate ever).Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%
Khan won but hasn’t really inspired - he needs to do much more with his second term.0 -
Bloody flag shagger.HarryFreeman said:Another Labour Mayor makes a better speech than Starmer.
Khan says he's "a proud Englishman and a Brit".0 -
I was an observer for the London mayoral/assembly vote about 9 years ago when they lost a box of votes by putting it in the completed pile. It added about 2 hours to the count trying to find it.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/13911350034011422810 -
Neither Sanjeev nor I would have been invited to join the Pitt club.YBarddCwsc said:
Only the other day you were bragging about undergraduate meetings at the Pitt Club with Sanjeev Guptarcs1000 said:
In my first year after University, a few of my friends ended up working for Accenture, and were put on a big project in Newcastle. This meant they all got First Class Open Returns between Newcastle and London.Charles said:
How were they caught?TheScreamingEagles said:
I once sacked someone over their first class ticket use.YBarddCwsc said:
If she was worried about Covid (no matter whether it is rational fear or not), then first class makes sense. She did mention both COVID and safety from attack as her reason.noneoftheabove said:
I don't get the safety angle at all, surely you are safer where there are more people.Scott_xP said:EXC: Angela Rayner was sacked hours after opponents leaked info about her conduct on the campaign trail — incl her using 1st class train tickets
Rayner says she did use them: for safety, travelling alone after Sarah Everard's murder
New level of toxicity
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/shaken-keir-starmer-wields-knife-sacking-angela-rayner-as-labour-party-chairwoman-0zbls9dm0
But what is the issue with the deputy leader of the opposition using first class tickets? Why do we have two classes of tickets still if we think it is unreasonable someone that senior uses first class.
Like much of modern life, it doesn't make much sense!
Whatever, it surely not a sack-able offence.
If Labour only want to refund a 2nd class ticket from party funds, fine. But, as a reason to sack someone ... wtf
My employer is very generous on things like rail tickets, so a first class open return from Manchester to Euston is around £360.
One employee used to buy those tickets and reclaim them on expenses.
Turned out they'd buy them then refund them so they'd get £350 back (£360 less the £10 admin fee) and buy first class advance tickets for £25 a pop, so they'd be making a profit of £300 a time and this was someone who probably went to London 3/4 times a month.
The really strange thing? They were earning a six figure salary and their regular credit reports showed they weren't in debt other than a mortgage which was manageable for them.
Quite a lot of them would do as TSE recounts and buy the ticket, submit the receipt, and then get a refund. It probably doubled the disposable income of a 22 year old.
But it was also fundamentally dishonest.
It does seem as though most people you met in your time as an undergraduate at Cambridge University were -- shall we say -- singularly broad-minded in financial matters.
Ah well, they do say a Cambridge man can always look indulgently on a financial scheme if he sees a bit in it for himself.0 -
I have seen 2 MPs defeated at 2019 GE elected as Cllrs this week
Sandy Martin (Ipswich 2017-19) elected to Suffolk CC
Ruth George (High Peak 2017-19) elected to Derbyshire CC. She defeated Edwing Currie in her division.
3 were elected as MPs
Paul Sweeney (ex Glasgow NE)
Martin Whitfield (ex East Lothian). He actually stood and lost East Lothian at Holyrood too but he got in through the regional list
Stephen Kerr (ex Stirling)1 -
And what job do you do, totally perfectly all the time no doubt?ozymandias said:
Like I say. One job to do.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.
It's easy to sneer at how other people do THEIR jobs, when you know diddly squat about what the job actually entails.0 -
That will be his excuse why he got f##k all done...HarryFreeman said:Khan only gets another 3 years. Will he stand again ?
1 -
The Greens are hoping for Tory transfers in Bristol after they get into the second round against Labour.
https://twitter.com/Joe_C_London/status/13911534264662794290 -
Not a Conservative it turns out.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Rory Stewart?HarryFreeman said:
Hmm - if you can think of one ...Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%0 -
Nah, Bailey did okay in the end. Shit candidate but 55/45 isn't bad in a Labour city after brexit with an incumbent Tory government. A better candidate would have beaten Sadiq, who very few are enthusiastic about. Even his supporters say his best characteristic is that he's a known quantity.Anabobazina said:
In all fairness Bailey got his arse kicked. Barely any improvement on the hopeless Goldsmith last time (who was the worst Tory mayoral candidate ever).Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%
Khan won but hasn’t really inspired - he needs to do much more with his second term.1 -
No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP1 -
Even City of Durham contains a few ex-pit villages - which probably just about outvote the 'city' bits.Foss said:
From an outsider the 'City of Durham' constituency looks weird full stop - remain won there and it's got a respected university but it's long term trend seems to be towards the Tories.MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.0 -
Brian Coleman.Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%2 -
Would depend on what Starmer is "at". If it's Johnson type antics, yes. No place for double standards. But I bet loads would judge him harshly who give Johnson a pass. This is what drives me nuts.MarqueeMark said:
But if Starmer were to be at it too, it would rather cut off at the knees those who use it to expose Boris' lack of ethics....kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.0 -
First reply asks if transfers have ever flipped a winner.Andy_JS said:The Greens are hoping for Tory transfers in Bristol after they get into the second round against Labour.
https://twitter.com/Joe_C_London/status/1391153426466279429
Well yes. Today in Cambs mayor.0 -
I'll put you down as a maybe....bigjohnowls said:No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP0 -
Snigger
https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/1391149428438978566
"This reshuffle is going to be Labour’s Super League isn’t it?" - Labour wag3 -
That kind of error is indeed maddening. But NOT fraudulent, or even grossly incompetent.Balrog said:
I was an observer for the London mayoral/assembly vote about 9 years ago when they lost a box of votes by putting it in the completed pile. It added about 2 hours to the count trying to find it.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
Just slightly incompetent. By people who do NOT do this kind of work every working day, but only every once and awhile.0 -
Out from 5 to 7.2 since the start of this thread as next PM on Betfair.bigjohnowls said:No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP0 -
Ok a reasonable reply deserves a reasonable answerkinabalu said:
Yes alright. The bullshit is strong in that arena. I do think you might sometimes try to detect some virtue in people though. Ah well. Perhaps you do but don't feel it useful to say.Pagan2 said:
They selected a career where 80% of them will only have enough nous to go through the correct lobby. Your evidence they aren't is what precisely? I also acknowledged they were probably knowledgeable in the area they got their degree in but pointed out to many of that ilk think being knowledgeable in one small are makes you knowledgeable in all. I have seen far too many mp's talking about things they obviously have no idea about to not think they are mostly too thick to realise they don't know what the hell they are talking about. That is what makes them thick as mince. From covid for example I at least no I don't know enough about epidemiology to comment.....not so with plenty of our mp's and mediakinabalu said:
One awaits the day when you utter a sentiment about anybody or anything which is not infused with mean spirited contempt and bumpkin ignorance.Pagan2 said:
3 times average salary isnt enough already to attract working and lower middle class people? Frankly most of our mps are thick as mince. Yes they may be well educated but that just means they know a lot about a narrow slice of knowledge, but they have less common sense than a dead herring. Sadly though they then go on to pontificate about stuff with absolutely no knowledge of the subject because their degree or phd gives them and over inflated sense of their own intelligence. For an extreme example I point at Macron and his I have trained my self in epidemiolgy schtickLeon said:
More money, Is the only way. We can't stop harsh criticism and social media aggression in a democracyFrankBooth said:
They are already in the top 1 or 2% of earners believe it or not. Is the salary the major downside? I suspect it is more the lifestyle and demands of being a politician that people don't want. Something we all ought to consider. How can we make it more appealing?Leon said:
Personally, I would double or triple MPs wages, and do the same for ministers or prime ministers. Let the Prime Minister of the UK earn £300,000 a year. He's running an entire country. And a big important country, at that. CEOs of minor charities earn more than the present PM. It is ridiculous. Little Davey Miliband earns £1m in a charity at NYC - and he's utterly uselessTaz said:
Absolutely,right. Also with advance fares you can get it cheaper,than std class.Leon said:
I support Angela Rayner hereeek said:
I usually justify the quieter carriage and a guaranteed table for workingTheScreamingEagles said:
Better than that, plebs and oiks, which is why I travel first class.tlg86 said:
First class protects you from psychopathic killers?Scott_xP said:EXC: Angela Rayner was sacked hours after opponents leaked info about her conduct on the campaign trail — incl her using 1st class train tickets
Rayner says she did use them: for safety, travelling alone after Sarah Everard's murder
New level of toxicity
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/shaken-keir-starmer-wields-knife-sacking-angela-rayner-as-labour-party-chairwoman-0zbls9dm0
but that doesn't work when you have to be one for the people (and you can only claim second class if on Parliamentary business / expenses). Which is why the local MPs now fly down..
FFS she's the deputy leader of the Opposition. So she travels first class on a British train, for the very good reason that it is easier to work there?
On First Class you don't get endless free champagne and a selection of the finest charcuterie, this is not Emirates Airways from London to Sydney. You get a bigger seat, a quieter carriage and more space to work. And a free coffee. And that's it
The constant demand that our MPs must live the most humble lives possible is tedious and self defeating. We want smart, talented people to become MPs, which is often a thankless, unstable and boring job - so we need to give them a damn good salary and the means to do the job well. And for God's sake don't quibble about train classes
It’s a petty criticism.
We are saddled with inept mediocrities at Westminster because that's the level of salary we offer, the kind of wages that attracts awkward incompetents. Westminster used to get round this by the huge expenses-fiddling nonsense but that's been rumbled, so now the MPs really are reduced to pretty crap wages (by the standards of high powered London jobs) - so we need to increase the wages
We want to attract the best people to a tough demanding job where they will face fierce criticism daily. Who is going to do that for £80k a year if they can earn three or five times that elsewhere?
We have just 600-odd MPs. Pay Them Well so we get Lots of Smart People
So pay them REALLY well. Insulate them with cash and attract the best talent around
Giving every MP £150k a year would cost us £97m a year
Not a small sum but compared to the £300bn we have just spent on Covid in 12 months, it is tiny little peanuts
More importantly, it would attract working and lower middle class people to have a go. People with talent who also need to make really good money - and have the ability to do so
Most MPs are NOT thick as mince.
I start from the position that someone who goes into politics is doing it because they think they have a better idea over how we should live than people that don't go into politcs. I don't mean that either as a positive or negative thing.
Because of this yes I hold them to a higher standard than the average non politician. If you are going to propose laws or vote on laws that affect people I do expect them to do a modicum of research so they have a clue what they are talking about , proposing or voting on. Mostly sadly they don't which is why we get things suggested such as banning encryption, porn passports, vax passports and all the other stuff. Computers are my area hence why I mentioned those as examples. Ydoethur is critical about the education things politicians go on about for example as his area of expertise...others do other area's.
Far too often we get bad laws passed and promoted by people who don't actually understand any of the issues. I am sorry if you think its wrong of me to hold politicians to a higher bar but joe bloggs in the bar pontificating about stuff they don't know jack shit about doesn't really effect me....an mp doing the same often does.
So yes I often come off as negative about mp's of all parties purely because I think they do need to be held to a higher standard on their pronouncements purely because they do have a potentially catastrophic impact when they get it wrong1 -
I've only done an election once. But I was impressed by how well-tracked everything was. Based on my experience, I can't really understand how any boxes were just mislaid.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.0 -
Thanks for coming Keir 😊😊😊1
-
But compare it to York Central - a constituency seemingly designed to include a bunch of student accommodation and most of the grotty bits of York (Kingsway, Tang Hall, Acomb). You’re not seeing the same kinds of trend there.Cookie said:
Even City of Durham contains a few ex-pit villages - which probably just about outvote the 'city' bits.Foss said:
From an outsider the 'City of Durham' constituency looks weird full stop - remain won there and it's got a respected university but it's long term trend seems to be towards the Tories.MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.0 -
A Sheffield University guide says 'whiteness and Eurocentrism of our science' must be dismantled
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/05/08/charles-darwins-theory-natural-selection-justified-white-male/0 -
Goodnight.Leon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically0 -
I certainly don’t do my job perfectly. But then again I do my job eveyday, day on day. And involves more than counting.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
And what job do you do, totally perfectly all the time no doubt?ozymandias said:
Like I say. One job to do.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.
It's easy to sneer at how other people do THEIR jobs, when you know diddly squat about what the job actually entails.
They have one job. On one occasion. To count. It’s not rocket science. I fail to see how complicated it is.
They know how many boxes there are.
Counting isn’t difficult. Most humans have grasped the concept within three or four years of being born, enabled by the suitable education.
Vote counts aren’t a mystical art only discernible by those privileged few supposedly initiated into the secret ancient art of counting boxes and bits of paper.
0 -
Really.IshmaelZ said:
Out from 5 to 7.2 since the start of this thread as next PM on Betfair.bigjohnowls said:No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP
PLP has 36 Socialist Group MPs and after the Rayner fiasco there could easily be enough in total (40) for a challenge.
Hope so Labour has no chance under Starmer.
W Yorks mayor win - By Election - Andy Burnham stands/ wins - leadership challenge.
Sounds like a lot of hurdles but it needs to happen0 -
He was the candidate for one of the counts I was observing on behalf of the electoral commission. I'm a tory voter but he is well, sufficiently not nice to make me vote Labour if he was the candidate I had to vote to. He came out with a long and unnecessary tirade about the electoral commission and his speech on winning was about as ungracious as you could get.Sean_F said:
Brian Coleman.Andy_JS said:
Clearly Sadiq Khan could have been beaten with an exceptionally good Tory candidate. Not sure who that would have been though.HarryFreeman said:
Bailey 1.6% better than Zac Goldsmith.Andy_JS said:Second prefs:
Khan 192,313 => 1,206,034
Bailey 84,550 => 977,601
Khan 55.23%
Bailey 44.77%0 -
Yep. Sort of.BluestBlue said:
By dead people?kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.0 -
CoE to review 1000s of monuments in churches with links to slavery and colonalism, with some expected to be removed.....
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1391158212108369922?s=20
I mean if they are going to go down this route, they might as well just shut themselves down, because the church sins are greater than most, with their forcing of religion on the inhabitants of other nations.3 -
He's Tootin' Common?AndreaParma_82 said:Bailey's a mummy boy
1 -
Man, the Lib Dems really shat the bed in London. It should have been a good campaign for them, unpopular incumbent, shite challenger from the Tories, it's a liberal city with lots of die hard remainerism.
Absolutely terrible campaign in the end. Their mayoral candidate almost seemed like she was a glorified paper candidate (which I'm guessing she was) but she should have done a lot better. I mean the YouTube meme candidate almost got half the votes she did and he had no party machinery and didn't get any PPBs.1 -
I don't know Kingsway or Tang Hall, but I wouldn't describe Acomb as Grotty!Foss said:
But compare it to York Central - a constituency seemingly designed to include a bunch of student accommodation and most of the grotty bits of York (Kingsway, Tang Hall, Acomb). You’re not seeing the same kinds of trend there.Cookie said:
Even City of Durham contains a few ex-pit villages - which probably just about outvote the 'city' bits.Foss said:
From an outsider the 'City of Durham' constituency looks weird full stop - remain won there and it's got a respected university but it's long term trend seems to be towards the Tories.MarqueeMark said:
Much of Durham is too nice to be Labour.another_richard said:Back to elections, Labour has lost 21 councillors in Durham and control of the council.
Durham council had been controlled continuously by Labour since 1919.
And City of Durham's ex-pit villages - Bowburn, Ushaw Moor, etc. - are outside of the city in a way that nowhere in York Central is. And they are mirroring the trend to Con of ex-pit villages everywhere, as monolithic housing/employment/political culture which strongly favoured Labour dies, and gets replaced by something much more mixed.0 -
The average Anglican is actually now a black Nigerian woman not a white Englishman, no forcing involved.FrancisUrquhart said:CoE to review 1000s of monuments in churches with links to slavery and colonalism, with some expected to be removed.....
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1391158212108369922?s=20
I mean if they are going to go down this route, they might as well just shut themselves down, because the church sins are greater than most, with their forcing of religion on the inhabitants of other nations.1 -
You have a steering wheel down your y-fronts?kinabalu said:
Would depend on what Starmer is "at". If it's Johnson type antics, yes. No place for double standards. But I bet loads would judge him harshly who give Johnson a pass. This is what drives me nuts.MarqueeMark said:
But if Starmer were to be at it too, it would rather cut off at the knees those who use it to expose Boris' lack of ethics....kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.2 -
Gotta be Burnham. He's twice won votes from folk who don't vote Labour.bigjohnowls said:
Really.IshmaelZ said:
Out from 5 to 7.2 since the start of this thread as next PM on Betfair.bigjohnowls said:No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP
PLP has 36 Socialist Group MPs and after the Rayner fiasco there could easily be enough in total (40) for a challenge.
Hope so Labour has no chance under Starmer.
W Yorks mayor win - By Election - Andy Burnham stands/ wins - leadership challenge.
Sounds like a lot of hurdles but it needs to happen
Rather like another Mayor from another Party did.
But his appeal won't travel they say. They said that about the PM too. I know cos I used to say it.0 -
When I was 17 I had a casual job with a gang of older blokes and one of them was always saying that. Not in couplet form but that exact sentiment. "When I come back I hope it's as a bike seat," he used to go, and he'd screw his face up and loll his tongue around. Always directed at me. Used to creep me out.IshmaelZ said:
Author of the coupletLeon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically
I sometimes think that I would like
To be the saddle of a bike0 -
Sounds like the opening of a particularly disturbing B movie.kinabalu said:
When I was 17 I had a casual job with a gang of older blokes and one of them was always saying that. Not in couplet form but that exact sentiment. "When I come back I hope it's as a bike seat," he used to go, and he'd screw his face up and loll his tongue around. Always directed at me. Used to creep me out.IshmaelZ said:
Author of the coupletLeon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically
I sometimes think that I would like
To be the saddle of a bike3 -
Depends on number of factors, such the number of ballots to count, time & staff allocated to count them, and how well-trained & experienced worker are; b) the quality of the facilities & systems for processing & counting ballots.Cookie said:
I've only done an election once. But I was impressed by how well-tracked everything was. Based on my experience, I can't really understand how any boxes were just mislaid.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.
To mislay a ballot box or mail tray, all it takes is for one person to mess up, and nobody notices until the error becomes obvious.
In the examples I mentioned (and others I did not) discovery of the mistakes led to changes in the processing routine, to ensure (as much as possible) that same mistakes were NOT repeated in the future.
Close elections and recounts tend to reveal these kind of mistakes, because people (election supervisors & observers) are watching like hawks, and in recounts of course ballots are counted again, so big discrepancies are revealed.
Back in razor-thin 2004 WA State governors race (final margin 133 votes) the errors and omissions discovered led to MAJOR changes in election law & procedures.
Especially in King Co (one-third of state) where serious problems were almost entirely the result of serious underfunding of the Elections Department. The upshot was that the county budged a LOT more money to improve the facilities and equipment (previously pretty bad) upgrade staff & training & tighten up the whole system.
With considerable success. Discrepancies between ballots received & counted reduced to the literal vanishing point, and recounts with miniscule or zero changes.
For example, Republicans doubtful of the election requested a hand recount of all ballots in one precinct they selected, for President, Congress, Governor & state Attorney General. Result - no change from original count.0 -
NOW being the operative word. The point is they are going to go removing things like stained glass windows that were put up because somebody bunged the church a load of money back in the day to build the place, but the actual institution is complicit as any of the donors.HYUFD said:
The average Anglican is actually now a black Nigerian woman not a white Englishman, no forcing involved.FrancisUrquhart said:CoE to review 1000s of monuments in churches with links to slavery and colonalism, with some expected to be removed.....
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1391158212108369922?s=20
I mean if they are going to go down this route, they might as well just shut themselves down, because the church sins are greater than most, with their forcing of religion on the inhabitants of other nations.0 -
That's very "fools and horses" - hats off.isam said:
You have a steering wheel down your y-fronts?kinabalu said:
Would depend on what Starmer is "at". If it's Johnson type antics, yes. No place for double standards. But I bet loads would judge him harshly who give Johnson a pass. This is what drives me nuts.MarqueeMark said:
But if Starmer were to be at it too, it would rather cut off at the knees those who use it to expose Boris' lack of ethics....kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.1 -
Looks like people couldn't be bothered to vote for Khan, there hasn't been much swap to Bailey at all.
https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1391160663821602819
That's a good move.
But also Burnham seems to be on the war path0 -
Well it was clear on here a lot of more Tory leaning voters in London weren't exactly rushing out to vote Bailey, but think Khan is rubbish.CorrectHorseBattery said:Looks like people couldn't be bothered to vote for Khan, there hasn't been much swap to Bailey at all.
https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1391160663821602819
That's a good move.
But also Burnham seems to be on the war path0 -
Would some respect for your views on this IF you had ever observed an election up close & personal.ozymandias said:
I certainly don’t do my job perfectly. But then again I do my job eveyday, day on day. And involves more than counting.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
And what job do you do, totally perfectly all the time no doubt?ozymandias said:
Like I say. One job to do.SeaShantyIrish2 said:
What I mean is, it is a somewhat hectic environment, with people rushing to & fro and boxes (or in WA State mail trays) of ballot being stacked & processed.ozymandias said:
Nope. Is that a problem?SeaShantyIrish2 said:
Have you ever observed an actual election count, in person? Am guessing not.ozymandias said:
Presumably the “contingency” boxes if things were a little closer than they are.Andy_JS said:"Rachael Burford
@RachaelBurford
Reason for the delay here at the City & East - staff found three unopened boxes of votes after everything else had been counted"
https://twitter.com/RachaelBurford/status/1391135003401142281
I can count though. And “whoopsie daisie” here’s three big black boxes full of votes that were “overlooked” looks shit. I mean. They have one job to do. Really?
So not inherently criminal let alone suspicious when - occasionally - something gets overlooked.
Example - Back in 2000, one small WA county, a very Republican one, managed somehow to run a batch of ballots through the tabulation machines twice, and it wasn't caught.
Until the recount for US Senate. When the error was corrected, it greatly benefited Democratic challenger Maria Cantwell over incumbent Republican Slade Gorton.
Another Example - in 2004 governor's race, during (first) recount, a mail tray full of valid but uncounted ballots was discovered; it had ended up at the bottom of a stack of empty mail trays. When the Dems & Reps were told about it, both sides got quite excited.
Based on analysis of votes cast & counted in the affected precincts, both sides thought these ballots were gonna favor Democrat Christine Gregoire over Republican Dino Rossi. And Republicans insisted they be tabulated separately, so that they could be removed from the count IF a judge ordered it. When they were counted, turned out they broke . . . wait for it . . . for Rossi.
Assuming every election error is fraud is a sign that you've never actually observed an election.
It's easy to sneer at how other people do THEIR jobs, when you know diddly squat about what the job actually entails.
They have one job. On one occasion. To count. It’s not rocket science. I fail to see how complicated it is.
They know how many boxes there are.
Counting isn’t difficult. Most humans have grasped the concept within three or four years of being born, enabled by the suitable education.
Vote counts aren’t a mystical art only discernible by those privileged few supposedly initiated into the secret ancient art of counting boxes and bits of paper.
Since you have not, I do not.0 -
I'm long at 7.4 from yesterday. Could this be the end of my hot streak?IshmaelZ said:
Out from 5 to 7.2 since the start of this thread as next PM on Betfair.bigjohnowls said:No Charisma,
No Policies
No Bollocks
No Chance
SKS RIP0 -
Betfair pays up.
Clink clink clink Thank you Brian Rose.4 -
About 99.46% certainty that he was NOT getting any.kinabalu said:
When I was 17 I had a casual job with a gang of older blokes and one of them was always saying that. Not in couplet form but that exact sentiment. "When I come back I hope it's as a bike seat," he used to go, and he'd screw his face up and loll his tongue around. Always directed at me. Used to creep me out.IshmaelZ said:
Author of the coupletLeon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically
I sometimes think that I would like
To be the saddle of a bike3 -
1
-
Did you work for Noel Clarke?kinabalu said:
When I was 17 I had a casual job with a gang of older blokes and one of them was always saying that. Not in couplet form but that exact sentiment. "When I come back I hope it's as a bike seat," he used to go, and he'd screw his face up and loll his tongue around. Always directed at me. Used to creep me out.IshmaelZ said:
Author of the coupletLeon said:
I'm referencing the famous Betjeman quote. When asked, on his deathbed, and after a marvellously interesting, rich and colourful life, whether there was anything he regretted, the Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman said, quite firmly and pointedly, "Yes, I wish I'd had more sex"kinabalu said:
When you die you don't think about sex at all. You think about the big relationships in your life and what they've meant to you. That's what I've been told anyway.kle4 said:
Probably not, though they probably used to claim they thought that, when seeking to be absolved for their sinful life on their deathbeds. Those priests will buy anything.Leon said:
But no one died thinking "I wish I'd had sex less often and with fewer women"kinabalu said:
No, the reason he gets away with that sort of stuff is that people put their brains in a jar when it comes to assessing him.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't really care if Starmer is or isn't. One reason Boris gets away with that kind of stuff is it is a) expected and b) he never claims be to whiter than white.
When it hurts politicians is if you preach purity and then found to be a hypocrite e.g. Tory back to basics.
There's nothing interesting about womanising or sexual infidelity. It's a sign of moral laxity and is yawningly common. It's boring.
He was a highly sexed man (see his poems) hidebound by mid 20th century morality, and his own shyness. I expect in this day and age he's have shagged several hundreds, to put it gently and poetically
I sometimes think that I would like
To be the saddle of a bike1
This discussion has been closed.