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Comments
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Really? Wow. That could make a difference to the GE next month!...no... wait. When is it again? Remind me?rottenborough said:https://twitter.com/tonyroe/status/1265664279178510337
Marginal seat folks.
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Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.0 -
IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
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Explain. I did use "question marks".another_richard said:
Really Sunil I thought better of you.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
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What is the state of the care home industry? What % of their residents have they lost and have attitudes changed towards them making them less likely a routine solution to care?0
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What a combination Serco and the CEO of Talk Talk.. What could possibly go wrong?Quincel said:
Yes, Serco leaked 300 emails by accident.eek said:
Hasn't there already been one, or at least a data leak?rottenborough said:Just realised they have put the former Chief Exec of Talk Talk in charge of track and trace and the app.
Erm, massive data hack anyone?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2020/05/20/serco-apologises-leaking-contact-tracers-personal-email-addresses/3 -
OK, just have to see what the figures are tomorrow.Mexicanpete said:
Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
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What happened to Dominic Cummings's "civic duty"?0
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How do you know that the second wave is not coming in three weeks, soon after the two Bank Holidays in May?another_richard said:
If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.Mexicanpete said:
Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
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Has anyone done an analysis of the Remain/Leave-supporting status of the Tory MPs who've called for Cummings to go?1
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As Andy says plus the usual weekend lag lengthened by the bank holiday.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Explain. I did use "question marks".another_richard said:
Really Sunil I thought better of you.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern?lang=en0 -
£69 anti-body test.
"But the Government is thought to have become jittery about the prospect of people finding out they might be immune to the virus and ignoring lockdown rules. "
(Mail)
Oh they need not worry, people now have the Cummings Get Out Clause* to hand. Who needs to pay £69?
* Opinion is divided on the exact nature of this clause. There are a number of basic ingredients such as driving around with symptoms that might be the virus, an eye test, childcare arrangements, fear of both parents being ill, driving without a rest for 4 or 5 hours. But the details don't matter as the overriding one is: follow instinct at all times!!!
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Interesting - "Save lives and livelihoods
https://twitter.com/DHSCgovuk/status/1265705075336339456?s=202 -
A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.3
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I'm using those figures for analysis too - afraid the exponent has slipped, which indicates the halving time for the virus is now around 15 days rather than 14Andy_JS said:
IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
893e-0.047x R² = 0.9879 since the peak.
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We don't but there doesn't appear to have been a second wave in other countries which have eased restrictions earlier.eristdoof said:
How do you know that the second wave is not coming in three weeks, soon after the two Bank Holidays in May?another_richard said:
If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.Mexicanpete said:
Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
Nor does there seem to be any increase in positive tests since the first bank holiday.0 -
“So what do you suggest?” (@another_richard):-
What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.5 -
2
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At the very least end restrictions on outdoor trade. Its insane that indoor businesses like New Look and Next that can trade all year around are getting ready to open but beer gardens that rely on spring and summer are shut.another_richard said:
So what do you suggest ?Cyclefree said:
You don’t need to tell me. I’ve been boring on about it for weeks now.Philip_Thompson said:
First of many. Many companies rely on Spring and Summer and losing this period will never be regained.Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
For many summer season businesses this will be truly devastating. Many companies will lose money autumn/winter but gain it Spring/Summer.
For companies that have survived last winter only to have now lost money Spring/Summer and now facing an even worse than normal Winter this is just destructive.
When a lot of those job losses are concentrated in particular areas with few alternatives and even those affected by the loss of trade etc, the prospects are poor for those areas.
“Levelling up” my arse!2 -
So Sunil is a panicking alarmist?Sunil_Prasannan said:
Explain. I did use "question marks".another_richard said:
Really Sunil I thought better of you.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
--> ? <—0 -
This for me is the best summary, shows roughly care home deaths ~4% daily decline, hospitals 5%, homes 6% (although home deaths are almost zero now so that part isn't so important going forward).Andy_JS said:
IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending15may2020
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Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.2 -
If it weren’t for the handful of small scale studies finding low levels of antibodies, you’d look at the data and conclude that significant proportions of the population now has either immunity or significant resistance.another_richard said:
We don't but there doesn't appear to have been a second wave in other countries which have eased restrictions earlier.eristdoof said:
How do you know that the second wave is not coming in three weeks, soon after the two Bank Holidays in May?another_richard said:
If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.Mexicanpete said:
Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
Nor does there seem to be any increase in positive tests since the first bank holiday.0 -
Indeed. What these smartarses don't understand is that making that argument automatically exposes them as hypocrites. After all, the moral outrage against Cummings is predicated on the premise that endangering public health is the worst thing in the world, so when the exact same people then conclude 'therefore I can go ahead and endanger public health as much as I like', it reveals them as the intellectually-limited hypocrites that they are.Andy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
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It’s the other way around. Those who have made significant sacrifice were consoling themselves with the thought that we were all in it together. Until we weren’t.Andy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
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I know, I've been agreeing with you and making similar points myself. On this we think alike.Cyclefree said:
You don’t need to tell me. I’ve been boring on about it for weeks now.Philip_Thompson said:
First of many. Many companies rely on Spring and Summer and losing this period will never be regained.Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
For many summer season businesses this will be truly devastating. Many companies will lose money autumn/winter but gain it Spring/Summer.
For companies that have survived last winter only to have now lost money Spring/Summer and now facing an even worse than normal Winter this is just destructive.
When a lot of those job losses are concentrated in particular areas with few alternatives and even those affected by the loss of trade etc, the prospects are poor for those areas.
“Levelling up” my arse!1 -
Come on. The threshold is clearly lower than 200.BluestBlue said:
Literally five times as many. For it to have an actual effect beyond virtue-signalling, they would have to resign the whip and destroy their own careers, and even then they probably wouldn't achieve their goal. They ain't gonna do that for this pointless nonsense.Stuartinromford said:
OK- how many backbench Conservatives have to go public saying "Cummings must go" for it to be a problem? How many for that problem to be terminal?BluestBlue said:
My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?AlastairMeeks said:So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.
It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
There's an iceberg effect here- we just don't know how big.
Also, think back to Jezza v Thatch; even a 55-45 win isn't enough, really. Technically, maybe, but not really.
So what is?0 -
You've nailed him. He's finished.noneoftheabove said:
The highway code recommends 15 mins break every 2 hours. Driving 350 miles without stopping, with an ill family, when you think you might be ill yourself and after an extremely stressful week at work puts others at risk.Monkeys said:
Some people regularly drive 250 miles. I think people in London think driving is impossible or something.noneoftheabove said:
How is driving 350 miles after a stressful period at work without stopping not reckless driving? He was putting anyone on those roads at great risk. Or more likely stopped, probably more than once given they couldnt last 30 minutes without a stop on their next journey, when they were well.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.1 -
Except that Cummings came up with the lockdown rules! What a Hypocrite!BluestBlue said:
Indeed. What these smartarses don't understand is that making that argument automatically exposes them as hypocrites. After all, the moral outrage against Cummings is predicated on the premise that endangering public health is the worst thing in the world, so when the exact same people then conclude 'therefore I can go ahead and endanger public health as much as I like', it reveals them as the intellectually-limited hypocrites that they are.Andy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
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Its astonishing that the government expects the economy to survive and thrive under the welter of additional burdens placed on it. I thought these people were conservatives.Cyclefree said:“So what do you suggest?” (@another_richard):-
What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Wait until they find out the truth. And wait until they finally have to make the decisions they have been desperate to avoid for months.2 -
They seem sensible ideas at first glance (haven't looked at previous thread).Cyclefree said:“So what do you suggest?” (@another_richard):-
What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Might I suggest you contact local MPs, government departments, trade bodies etc.
The problem the government faces is that the likes of Piers Moron will rant that the government wants to kill people whenever there's any suggestion of reducing restrictions.1 -
Let's say 150 signalling virtue. Probably 20 resigning the whip.Stuartinromford said:
Come on. The threshold is clearly lower than 200.BluestBlue said:
Literally five times as many. For it to have an actual effect beyond virtue-signalling, they would have to resign the whip and destroy their own careers, and even then they probably wouldn't achieve their goal. They ain't gonna do that for this pointless nonsense.Stuartinromford said:
OK- how many backbench Conservatives have to go public saying "Cummings must go" for it to be a problem? How many for that problem to be terminal?BluestBlue said:
My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?AlastairMeeks said:So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.
It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
There's an iceberg effect here- we just don't know how big.
Also, think back to Jezza v Thatch; even a 55-45 win isn't enough, really. Technically, maybe, but not really.
So what is?
Although Boris has already kicked 20 of his own MPs out of the Conservative Party in a single day for defying him, so maybe even that wouldn't do the trick.0 -
He might be if someone saw him at the services.Monkeys said:
You've nailed him. He's finished.noneoftheabove said:
The highway code recommends 15 mins break every 2 hours. Driving 350 miles without stopping, with an ill family, when you think you might be ill yourself and after an extremely stressful week at work puts others at risk.Monkeys said:
Some people regularly drive 250 miles. I think people in London think driving is impossible or something.noneoftheabove said:
How is driving 350 miles after a stressful period at work without stopping not reckless driving? He was putting anyone on those roads at great risk. Or more likely stopped, probably more than once given they couldnt last 30 minutes without a stop on their next journey, when they were well.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.0 -
y = 959e-0.049xAndrew said:
This for me is the best summary, shows roughly care home deaths ~4% daily decline, hospitals 5%, homes 6% (although home deaths are almost zero now so that part isn't so important going forward).Andy_JS said:
IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending15may2020
R² = 0.9888
From the peak (Yes 959 is artificially fitted, as was 893 for the hospitals) so slightly more positive actually.
Edit: English and welsh hospitals that's for...
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What happened to Dominic Cummings's "civic duty"?Andy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
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I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.1 -
When people are facing mass unemployment for years, they won;t give a f8ck what Piers Morgan says. As if they ever didanother_richard said:
They seem sensible ideas at first glance (haven't looked at previous thread).Cyclefree said:“So what do you suggest?” (@another_richard):-
What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Might I suggest you contact local MPs, government departments, trade bodies etc.
The problem the government faces is that the likes of Piers Moron will rant that the government wants to kill people whenever there's any suggestion of reducing restrictions.2 -
What for?Andy_JS said:Has anyone done an analysis of the Remain/Leave-supporting status of the Tory MPs who've called for Cummings to go?
Brexit Tory MPs hate Cummings because he correctly identified that they were a load of useless idiotic tossers who would do their campaign more harm than good unless they were ruthlessly pushed aside.
Remainers hate Cummings for precisely the same reason.0 -
Twitter reckons
Dido oversaw one of the biggest breaches of private data whilst at Talk Talk.
Tories gave her a job in charge of data.
Any idea if its true?0 -
"As coronavirus arrived in France this winter, staff at an army base in the east of the country were dutifully burning hundreds of thousands of facemasks.
The incinerations were part of a money-saving programme to run down the state’s stock of 1.7 billion protective masks that had reached a peak in 2011.
Neither ministers nor MPs had questioned the initiative, which would almost certainly have escaped attention altogether if the pandemic had never struck."
(£)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/coronavirus-frances-facemask-fiasco-burns-deep-for-macron-kfkbdsd570 -
It’s true. It’ll be your life for rent.bigjohnowls said:Twitter reckons
Dido oversaw one of the biggest breaches of private data whilst at Talk Talk.
Tories gave her a job in charge of data.
Any idea if its true?3 -
Worrying about how many minutes apart golf partners should tee off from?Cyclefree said:
I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Unlocking outdoor hospitality should be done already. Its literally insane when we know that outdoor transmission is much less likely than indoor transmission that we are opening up indoor businesses while keeping outdoor ones locked out.
Are they seriously suggesting that in a couple of weeks time if I'm bored I can go spend time with thousands of other people browsing in a shopping complex like The Trafford Centre but I can't sit in the sunshine keeping summer hospitality businesses alive?
Its insane. The government is doing an awful job here going arse over tit.3 -
All settings is either
y = 1280e-0.035x R² = 0.9496 or
y = 1434.7e-0.04x R² = 0.9666
Which indicates a 17 to 20 day halving time for the virus, take your pick.
0 -
0
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Glad you've noticed.Philip_Thompson said:
Its insane. The government is doing an awful job here going arse over tit.1 -
"Inverclyde death rate is double the average" (£)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/scotland/coronavirus-in-scotland-inverclyde-death-rate-is-double-the-average-qjpxvxjbv0 -
I quite agree. There is no sense to what the government is doing. It seems driven by panic and the need for favourable publicity.Philip_Thompson said:
Worrying about how many minutes apart golf partners should tee off from?Cyclefree said:
I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Unlocking outdoor hospitality should be done already. Its literally insane when we know that outdoor transmission is much less likely than indoor transmission that we are opening up indoor businesses while keeping outdoor ones locked out.
Are they seriously suggesting that in a couple of weeks time if I'm bored I can go spend time with thousands of other people browsing in a shopping complex like The Trafford Centre but I can't sit in the sunshine keeping summer hospitality businesses alive?
Its insane. The government is doing an awful job here going arse over tit.4 -
It is pretty lamentable whenever it happens really.stodge said:
The curious thing is if this is the reaction when the Conservatives are still 6 points ahead - what will it be like when Labour leads by 10-15 points?isam said:
Yes, just what I used to think when everyone banged on about Farage sweating and making hilarious mis-spellings/pronunciations of his name. It was fair game then, apparently... some used to think it was funny too
It probably does mean they fear him though0 -
Irrelevant. Either endangering the public health is a moral evil or it isn't. To put it another way, would it be OK to murder someone just because an authority figure committed a murder? No, it bloody well would not!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Except that Cummings came up with the lockdown rules! What a Hypocrite!BluestBlue said:
Indeed. What these smartarses don't understand is that making that argument automatically exposes them as hypocrites. After all, the moral outrage against Cummings is predicated on the premise that endangering public health is the worst thing in the world, so when the exact same people then conclude 'therefore I can go ahead and endanger public health as much as I like', it reveals them as the intellectually-limited hypocrites that they are.Andy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
People making the argument that it would be OK expose their 'morality' as a sham.0 -
They'll be having meetings and meetings about meetings.Cyclefree said:
I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.1 -
Or perhaps you were voting for there to be no Bosnian muslim men left alive.Philip_Thompson said:
No its the idea that I was voting for an MEP that I'm struggling with.
Its preposterous. I was voting for there to be no MEPs.0 -
If you take care homes out the analysis you get back to a 14 day halving period. On their own, at least 17 days if not more.0
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Then we can expect the medical experts within Sage to resign, if the Government is flagrantly gaming lockdown to get out of its own political hole.Cyclefree said:
I quite agree. There is no sense to what the government is doing. It seems driven by panic and the need for favourable publicity.Philip_Thompson said:
Worrying about how many minutes apart golf partners should tee off from?Cyclefree said:
I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Unlocking outdoor hospitality should be done already. Its literally insane when we know that outdoor transmission is much less likely than indoor transmission that we are opening up indoor businesses while keeping outdoor ones locked out.
Are they seriously suggesting that in a couple of weeks time if I'm bored I can go spend time with thousands of other people browsing in a shopping complex like The Trafford Centre but I can't sit in the sunshine keeping summer hospitality businesses alive?
Its insane. The government is doing an awful job here going arse over tit.
Alternatively they could be following advice.1 -
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Oh dear0
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Another 6 point gap, Labour will be on par soon0
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0
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Still not 38-40 thenCorrectHorseBattery said:Another 6 point gap, Labour will be on par soon
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I may suggest these to my MP, Trudi Harrison. Fat lot of good it will do. She is Boris’s PPS. But she has said nothing - absolutely nothing - about the hospitality sector, despite it being a very significant employer in her constituency.another_richard said:
They'll be having meetings and meetings about meetings.Cyclefree said:
I know. But I was at a funeral that day and had other matters on my mind.eek said:
Specialist Leisure Group went into administration last Friday...Cyclefree said:And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.
44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
I thought one needed geniuses to do all sorts of thinking for the government. I dreamt these up in 5 minutes. What the hell are all these political geniuses and advisors actually doing?Philip_Thompson said:
Very good suggestions, number 10 should be simple enough to do blanket for the entire nation. Legalise all licenced premises to sell for on or off trade overnight and suspend regulations against outdoor drinking (but not being drunk and disorderly or other crimes).Cyclefree said:What I said on the previous thread.
1. Start opening up the hospitality sector.
2. Set out the advice on risks and sensible hygiene practices.
3. Do not put them into law.
4. Businesses to adopt what is reasonable for their premises.
5.Get rid of the 2 metre guidance. The WHO recommends 1 metre and this is widely used in the rest of Europe.
6. Maintain furlough on a sliding / transitional basis for, say, a month or so.
7. Offer compensation sums instead of furlough for those businesses that want to close to allow investment in other businesses.
8. Work with insurance sector to have fairer burden sharing in relation to business interruption insurance.
9. Make it law that businesses are not liable if their customers catch this virus just as they are not liable if one of their customers catches the flu etc.
10. Relax licensing laws to allow pubs / hotels to do as much business outside without needing to go through time-consuming and expensive individual applications.
How about these for starters.
Tim Farron, on the other hand, has been very active and vocal.0 -
Being rather brutal taking care homes out gives a better guide as to how restrictions can be eased.Pulpstar said:If you take care homes out the analysis you get back to a 14 day halving period. On their own, at least 17 days if not more.
0 -
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No, it's still 80, you silly billy!CorrectHorseBattery said:
The pretty pictures on your computer are not reality - nor are the electoral calculus projections.0 -
It was in this week's Private Eye.bigjohnowls said:Twitter reckons
Dido oversaw one of the biggest breaches of private data whilst at Talk Talk.
Tories gave her a job in charge of data.
Any idea if its true?
When she was asked if the hacked data at Talk Talk was encrpyted her reply was:
"The awful truth is I don't know"
She is the chair of the Test and Trace programme so therefore persumably oversees the App. What could possibly go wrong?0 -
Squeaky Dom timeCorrectHorseBattery said:
1 -
Agreed. I also don't get why people think it's relevant to sayAndy_JS said:A lot of people (not on PB) are making fools of themselves by implying that "because Cummings allegedly did something wrong it's okay for other people to do the same." Logical fallacy.
"I didn't visit my dying relative, yet he can go to Durham"
He didn't visit dying relatives, he wouldn't be allowed in the hospital/care home same as anyone else. Even if he had just gone to Durham because it was more comfortable than staying in London, it shouldn't give people grievance over their non visiting of people with covid-19 in hospitals, it makes no difference
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3
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Newsnight have got that scalp !
EM canned from tonights show...
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I knew she was ex communist and pro IRA but didn't realise the bit about her being a genocide denier till now.Mango said:
Or perhaps you were voting for there to be no Bosnian muslim men left alive.Philip_Thompson said:
No its the idea that I was voting for an MEP that I'm struggling with.
Its preposterous. I was voting for there to be no MEPs.1 -
Or an alarming panickistIanB2 said:
So Sunil is a panicking alarmist?Sunil_Prasannan said:
Explain. I did use "question marks".another_richard said:
Really Sunil I thought better of you.Sunil_Prasannan said:412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
--> ? <—</p>
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Just a word of warning. We thought we were home and dry in 1992 and then came Kinnock's Sheffield Rally. 'Oh yeah, bring it on'...20 seat Conservative majority! Pride comes before a fall!CorrectHorseBattery said:Another 6 point gap, Labour will be on par soon
1 -
What are the chances of a holiday in Portugal mid July? The resort is open, the planes might be flying...
But would it be much of a holiday? We are staying in a hotel down the road from our friends.. would the hotels let people come and go? Masks worn?0 -
Even ignoring the super elite like Cummings, the idea that our law treats people equally regardless of class or race is miles away from reality. Particularly on an issue like this, how you respond initially to the police (and importantly their perception of your response) will have far more impact on whether you get charged than the severity of the crime you committed.Andy_JS said:
If you live in an urban area you're more likely to find yourself in breach of a regulation based on getting too close to other people than people living in the middle of nowhere.Scott_xP said:
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0
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Portugal did a pretty good job of containing the virus. I doubt they're going to let the likes of you in, Sam.isam said:What are the chances of a holiday in Portugal mid July? The resort is open, the planes might be flying...
But would it be much of a holiday? We are staying in a hotel down the road from our friends.. would the hotels let people come and go? Masks worn? 2 -
My guess short of second wave then apart from a degree of social distancing and no buffet meals and reduced capacity then yes you would get a holiday.isam said:What are the chances of a holiday in Portugal mid July? The resort is open, the planes might be flying...
But would it be much of a holiday? We are staying in a hotel down the road from our friends.. would the hotels let people come and go? Masks worn?1 -
Its always interesting how trusting certain posters are of Western figures whilst being absolutely certain that Chinas are out by 50x.AlastairMeeks said:
* I dont know and accept I wont ever know the truth either way. All these years later estimates for Chernobyl range from 31 to a few million!0 -
Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.isam said:
Apparently care home residents are 0.6% of the UK population, and 38% of UK Covid deathsPulpstar said:If you take care homes out the analysis you get back to a 14 day halving period. On their own, at least 17 days if not more.
0 -
I preferred her early work, particularly White Flag.bigjohnowls said:Twitter reckons
Dido oversaw one of the biggest breaches of private data whilst at Talk Talk.
Tories gave her a job in charge of data.
Any idea if its true?0 -
Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.0
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If we name all the Liverpool players they may yet still miss out on the title too.....AlastairMeeks said:This idea is evil. But funny:
https://twitter.com/yespaulineeyre/status/1265690199687864320?s=210 -
Tories retaining 96% of their support from the GE according to the new opinion poll.2
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I get the feeling that Boris is going to be pensioned off to recover his health.0
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Actually:Mexicanpete said:
Just a word of warning. We thought we were home and dry in 1992 and then came Kinnock's Sheffield Rally. 'Oh yeah, bring it on'...20 seat Conservative majority! Pride comes before a fall!CorrectHorseBattery said:Another 6 point gap, Labour will be on par soon
"Pride goeth before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall". Proverbs, 16:18.0 -
Following on from the discussion on "Boris" Vs "Johnson", I was wondering whether there is anyone else in political life who uses one name in public and another in private? George Osborne changed his name but as far as I know his family and friends don't call him Gideon. It's a bit weird, no? And maybe a bit unsurprising that he has a rather distant relationship with the truth?0
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Yeah because that's the topic that was being discussed at the election.Mango said:
Or perhaps you were voting for there to be no Bosnian muslim men left alive.Philip_Thompson said:
No its the idea that I was voting for an MEP that I'm struggling with.
Its preposterous. I was voting for there to be no MEPs.
Give over. It didn't matter who the candidates were, they were vapid placeholder names and utterly irrelevant.0 -
Meanwhile, away from the latest revelations about whether Dominic Cummings may have passed wind or not in his fateful trip to Durham, the world continues to miss the point completely about hydroxychloroqin. Trials now being 'suspended' due to 'safety concerns'.
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-trial-hydroxychloroquine-covid-treatment.html
The latest hydroxychloroqin trial that was completed and found that it wasn't efficacious (funded by drug companies who make other stuff) did not use it in conjunction with Zinc, which is the combination that has shown remarkable results anecdotally:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eVs_EWVCVPc
'Must be taken in conjunction with zinc'
'Every patient given this has been symptom free in 8 to 10 hours'
This would be a real scandal. If a cheap and easy to produce anti-malarial drug in combination with a widely available mineral were to be the gold standard coronavirus treatment, and had the capability to stop this being a feared diagnosis, but drug companies and people who frankly just don't like Donald Trump stop it happening.
But as you were, Cummings etc....
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When I wrote a couple of weeks ago that he looked well off his form, I had a lot of consumer resistance to the idea on thread. There seems to be more support for that view now.NorthofStoke said:I get the feeling that Boris is going to be pensioned off to recover his health.
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1
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"The awful truth is I don't know."Saltire said:
It was in this week's Private Eye.bigjohnowls said:Twitter reckons
Dido oversaw one of the biggest breaches of private data whilst at Talk Talk.
Tories gave her a job in charge of data.
Any idea if its true?
When she was asked if the hacked data at Talk Talk was encrpyted her reply was:
"The awful truth is I don't know"
She is the chair of the Test and Trace programme so therefore persumably oversees the App. What could possibly go wrong?
0 -
Sure, the one caveat is the ONS data only goes up to the 15th May at the momentanother_richard said:
Being rather brutal taking care homes out gives a better guide as to how restrictions can be eased.Pulpstar said:If you take care homes out the analysis you get back to a 14 day halving period. On their own, at least 17 days if not more.
0 -
I believe a similar reason was why many prominent people were investigated for witchcraft in the olden days.AlastairMeeks said:This idea is evil. But funny:
https://twitter.com/yespaulineeyre/status/1265690199687864320?s=21
And some people are already in a panic at the possibility:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656938475453603900 -
What drugs are you taking?OnlyLivingBoy said:Following on from the discussion on "Boris" Vs "Johnson", I was wondering whether there is anyone else in political life who uses one name in public and another in private? George Osborne changed his name but as far as I know his family and friends don't call him Gideon. It's a bit weird, no? And maybe a bit unsurprising that he has a rather distant relationship with the truth?
If his friends and family don't call him Gideon then why should the public call him Gideon?
There's something deeply nasty about this name shaming. Call people what they want to be called, its just basic respect.0 -
Our care home death numbers are surprisingly a (relatively) small fraction of our total deaths - in Europe it's a half or more, even 2/3 in Spain. Here it's less than a quarter.Philip_Thompson said:
Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.
The problem has been the wider death rate outside care homes. Our hospital numbers are horrendous.
1 -
What channel?Tim_B said:Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.
0
