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On the contrary, it is the only generally-accepted criterion for the job.eristdoof said:
Winning an election is not proof of being suited to the job of prime-minister.HYUFD said:
Rubbish, Boris won a bigger majority than any Tory leader since Thatcher and the biggest of any leader since Blair in 2001.Nigel_Foremain said:This moment does remind me of when some Labour supporters who had so long wished Brown to take over from Blair started the slow realisation that their man was a crock of shit. I had the advantage of a little inside knowledge on Boris Johnson. He is even more unsuited to the job of PM than Gordy. People thought that TMay was poor. She is a colossus compared to her hopeless successor.
Neither Brown nor May won a majority.
As long as the Tories still lead most polls Boris is going nowhere1 -
First they came for Regulation 6 of the Covid laws and I did nothing.SouthamObserver said:Prediction - neither the Liaison Committee nor PMQs will exist in their current form by the end of this Parliament. Both will be changed to ensure that Johnson faces less scrutiny.
Then they came for the Liaison Committee and I did nothing.
....0 -
Already happening:SouthamObserver said:Prediction - neither the Liaison Committee nor PMQs will exist in their current form by the end of this Parliament. Both will be changed to ensure that Johnson faces less scrutiny.
Meets less often.
Members of the committee no longer allowed to pick their own chair.
Prominent senior critics of the PM excluded.0 -
The virus isn't picking on the UK. If we have a second lockdown it is exceedingly likely other countries suffering as we are now will do also. No one has eradicated it and it takes just one person to set it all off again.Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".0 -
"We must follow the track and trace guidelines" says Hancock.
Good luck with that mate! Not a bloody chance in hell now. I doubt the public will even read them or the stupid letter that is probably coming.
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Winston Churchill wouldn’t have thanked you for that remark.BluestBlue said:
On the contrary, it is the only generally-accepted criterion for the job.eristdoof said:
Winning an election is not proof of being suited to the job of prime-minister.HYUFD said:
Rubbish, Boris won a bigger majority than any Tory leader since Thatcher and the biggest of any leader since Blair in 2001.Nigel_Foremain said:This moment does remind me of when some Labour supporters who had so long wished Brown to take over from Blair started the slow realisation that their man was a crock of shit. I had the advantage of a little inside knowledge on Boris Johnson. He is even more unsuited to the job of PM than Gordy. People thought that TMay was poor. She is a colossus compared to her hopeless successor.
Neither Brown nor May won a majority.
As long as the Tories still lead most polls Boris is going nowhere1 -
Portillo.. the man with two faces, ultimate Thatcherite to Mr smooth stalking bar stewardAndy_JS said:Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".
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Not that this matters, but I call him Boris and everyone I know calls him Boris and I don't know any leavers (that I am aware of). I don't think it has anything to do with your politics it is just easily identifiable (not many people named Boris) and short (so May, Boris). Nothing to do with your opinion of them.HYUFD said:
Tories and Leavers call him Boris, left-wingers and Remainers call him Johnson.OnlyLivingBoy said:
I always call him Johnson. As a friend put it on Facebook once, he couldn't call him "Boris" because he wasn't his mate, and he was a dick.ydoethur said:
It’s funny, but I think I’m the only poster who refers to him consistently as ‘Johnson.’ Never called him ‘Boris’ since he became FS.Mexicanpete said:
I previously regularly referred to him as Johnson, I have been criticised for using his surname for being agressively partisan as everyone knows him as Boris.Nigel_Foremain said:
"Boris" as you affectionately refer to him does not just come over as a fool, he is a fool. Not necessarily educationally (though an Eton education always helps), but from every aspect of leadership that one would expect from a PM he is an idiot. Cummings is clever, in that he is riding a donkey for as long as said donkey thinks it needs him and not the other way around.Mexicanpete said:
Cummings is clever but arrogant, he needs to stay, Boris comes over as a fool, he needs to take a rest until the end of the pandemic.Nigel_Foremain said:This is a lose-lose for Bozo now. If he fires him he will look weak. if he keeps him he looks weak. POBWAS
Just doesn’t feel right to me to call the PM by their first name.
Also as others have noted, the whole "Boris" thing is part of his PR operation, and isn't even his actual name.
Same as Labour supporters called Corbyn Jeremy and Tories called him by his surname0 -
Test and trace isolation is "Civic Duty" and voluntary.
Bad news for snitchers.1 -
You need to look at the numbers some time if you think the probability of our having a second lockdown is the same as for other countries.ozymandias said:
The virus isn't picking on the UK. If we have a second lockdown it is exceedingly likely other countries suffering as we are now will do also. No one has eradicated it and it takes just one person to set it all off again.Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
As for "just one person" to set it off again, according to the ONS we currently have 140,000.0 -
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Inpatients at midnight on the day enumerated, so 155 at midnight on Sunday 17th May etc. Our communications team sends an email to all staff at about 1700 most weekdays.rottenborough said:
Are these how many in patients there are, or how many were admitted on that day?Foxy said:As a matter of interest, I have collated a table of the numbers of Covid-19 inpatients in Leics. This is from published figures, using all the dates when our comms team sent out an update:
6 May: 139
10 May: 145
11 May: 138
12 May: 131
13 May: 125
14 May: 140
17 May: 155
19 May: 156
21 May: 141
26 May: 141
There seems to be a weekend effect, with a slight uptick both BH Weekend (8-10 May) and the following one (16-17 May).
There seems to be a peak 10 days after the VE day BH, and we end the three weeks no better than we started. Not much of a downward trend here.
Deaths up from 256 to 332 over the period, discharged up from 558 to 738
We have a population of just over a million in Leics and Rutland. There are around 15 patients in our ECMO unit, many of whom are out of region transfers, so counting as our inpatients, not sure about mortality, or whether that is credited to the sending unit.0 -
Ok Lt Onoda..Chris said:
You need to look at the numbers some time if you think the probability of our having a second lockdown is the same as for other countries.ozymandias said:
The virus isn't picking on the UK. If we have a second lockdown it is exceedingly likely other countries suffering as we are now will do also. No one has eradicated it and it takes just one person to set it all off again.Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
As for "just one person" to set it off again, according to the ONS we currently have 140,000.
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Ooh, the App isn't dead - it will be 'rolled out'0
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We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
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Portillo was scared stiff at the prospect of Boris as PM in 2016, but last year thought it the best thing to break the deadlock of Brexit.Andy_JS said:Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".
I wonder if Cameron now regrets abdicating his responsibilty as he did? We could have done with a PM of 6 -10 years experience in the period 2016-20201 -
Number of deaths that took place 6 days ago was 131.
https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1265637066802696195/photo/10 -
Indeed, most party members and MPs would rather have a crap PM who wins the party a general election than a great PM who loses a general election.BluestBlue said:
On the contrary, it is the only generally-accepted criterion for the job.eristdoof said:
Winning an election is not proof of being suited to the job of prime-minister.HYUFD said:
Rubbish, Boris won a bigger majority than any Tory leader since Thatcher and the biggest of any leader since Blair in 2001.Nigel_Foremain said:This moment does remind me of when some Labour supporters who had so long wished Brown to take over from Blair started the slow realisation that their man was a crock of shit. I had the advantage of a little inside knowledge on Boris Johnson. He is even more unsuited to the job of PM than Gordy. People thought that TMay was poor. She is a colossus compared to her hopeless successor.
Neither Brown nor May won a majority.
As long as the Tories still lead most polls Boris is going nowhere
Brutal but true.
Competence and electoral appeal is the ideal but on a forced choice most would prefer the latter1 -
ozymandias said:
You do know the next GE is fours years from now?OllyT said:
What difference does that make?
I thought it was going to take a good 12-24 months for Starmer to get back in contention. Nice of the monkey and the organ grinder to have done so much of the heavy lifting for him.
Sure loads can happen before the next GE but elections really aren't just decided in the last couple of weeks and from what I've seen so far I can see things getting a whole lot worse with Bozo at the helm. I very much doubt that Hunt would have made such an unholy mess of things.
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Eventually...SandyRentool said:Ooh, the App isn't dead - it will be 'rolled out'
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You really are too moronic to absorb the meaning of just two sentences of simple English, aren't you?TGOHF666 said:
Ok Lt Onoda..Chris said:
You need to look at the numbers some time if you think the probability of our having a second lockdown is the same as for other countries.ozymandias said:
The virus isn't picking on the UK. If we have a second lockdown it is exceedingly likely other countries suffering as we are now will do also. No one has eradicated it and it takes just one person to set it all off again.Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
As for "just one person" to set it off again, according to the ONS we currently have 140,000.0 -
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So if you are told that you have to isolate because you have been in contact with someone with the virus, who pays your wages?
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"If you have symptoms you should self isolate"
"DO NOT LEAVE HOME"
Says NHS head.
LOL. Just hilarious.
Do not leave home, but you can drive to Durham.0 -
Why would we have a second lockdown and not others who are doing pretty much the same as us?Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
Apart from those naughty Swedes of course. I guess in your book a second lockdown for them is pretty much nailed on, so loose has been their lockdown.
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All those contacted in England sent to get a test - unlike Scotland.
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"...elections really aren't just decided in the last couple of weeks".OllyT said:ozymandias said:
You do know the next GE is fours years from now?OllyT said:
What difference does that make?
I thought it was going to take a good 12-24 months for Starmer to get back in contention. Nice of the monkey and the organ grinder to have done so much of the heavy lifting for him.
Sure loads can happen before the next GE but elections really aren't just decided in the last couple of weeks and from what I've seen so far I can see things getting a whole lot worse with Bozo at the helm. I very much doubt that Hunt would have made such an unholy mess of things.
More often than not they actually are.0 -
Don't make me laugh, Johnson's never worked 14-16 hours a day in his life.NerysHughes said:
Boris nearly died and has gone straight back to work, probably 14-16 hours per day. His government is funding millions of people on Furlough to protect their jobs. Yes he has not sacked someone but to say that he is treating the public like shit is nonsense.Cyclefree said:
Durham to Barnard Castle is about 30 miles, depending on where you start from and which route you take. If he did it in half an hour he was driving at 60 mph. As a test drive? On those roads? When he was unsure of his eyesight?rcs1000 said:
If I wanted to take a drive to test my eyesight* I would probably prefer not to stray too far from home, in case I decided it wasn't up to a long drive. It's a bit risky going 25 miles away, IMHO, because what do you do in this CV-19 world if you get to Castle Bernard and decide your eyesight is not good enough?Philip_Thompson said:
I think it's logical before you go for a long cross country drive if you've just recovered from illness to take a half hour drive to see that you're up to the pressures of driving.rcs1000 said:
In all your comments, you seem to pretend there was only one beach of regulations, not three or more.Philip_Thompson said:
Indeed and having a young infant with no childcare is harmful. QED it is reasonable to leave the home to get childcare.Freggles said:
The regulations specifically allow you to leave home in order to prevent injury.Philip_Thompson said:I'm wondering how many people speaking about the instruction to stay at home would have done so if their fire alarm was going off and the building was being engulfed in flames.
Using your own personal judgement is what any sentient intelligent person should do. People banging on as if there's one rule for every situation don't just insult our intelligence they're insulting their own.
Very specific aren't they?
Forget the trips (plural) between London and Durham, and tell me how the Castle Bernard sojourn was in the rules.
I believe that's what Cummings meant but not what he said. The way it was phrased was awful but the logic I understood.
* Which, I would assume, the DVLA does not recommend
The whole story is nonsense. And anyone believing it really needs help getting dressed.
Why he said it is much more interesting. But no-one is following up on that.
Anyway, it scarcely matters now. The affair has shown us what the two men at the top of government are like and what they think of us.
What happens next is what interests me - and I expect them to mess that up too.0 -
Surely if you find out you might have covid thru the test track and trace system the responsible thing to do is find out where is 350 miles away and drive there without stopping hoping you dont fall asleep?rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.0 -
change the fecking record. Its someone from the NHS not a political personrottenborough said:"If you have symptoms you should self isolate"
"DO NOT LEAVE HOME"
Says NHS head.
LOL. Just hilarious.
Do not leave home, but you can drive to Durham.0 -
Portillo is one of the best political analysts around IMO. He gets to the heart of the issues at hand without being overly partisan, at the same time as not pretending he doesn't have opinions of his own. In other words he gets the balance just right, something which most journalists and pundits seem to be increasingly incapable of.Peter_the_Punter said:
Yes, very interesting.Andy_JS said:Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".
Also of interest was his opinion that the pursuit of Cummings was a bit of a waste of time now since the PM has decided that he will not be sacked come what may.
Starmer is a very lucky General!1 -
If you'd like to hear more of this hopeless case, please now switch over to BBC 2.
(Surely it should be BBC 3, that's were they break all the new comedy shows isn't it?)0 -
So let me get this straight: undermining the lockdown / T&T is a moral outrage and the crime of the century when Cummings does it once (in private), but no problem at all when Piers Morgan does it all day, every single day, in public to his vast audience.rottenborough said:
Have I got this pious moralizing thing right yet?
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Van Tam said "Good Afternoon" WHAT AN AMAZING DIG AT CUMMINGS.squareroot2 said:
change the fecking record. Its someone from the NHS not a political personrottenborough said:"If you have symptoms you should self isolate"
"DO NOT LEAVE HOME"
Says NHS head.
LOL. Just hilarious.
Do not leave home, but you can drive to Durham.
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He should host a political chat show on tvAndy_JS said:
Portillo is one of the best political analysts around IMO. He gets to the heart of the issues at hand without being overly partisan, at the same time as not pretending he doesn't have opinions of his own. In other words he gets the balance just right, something which most journalists and pundits seem to be increasingly incapable of.Peter_the_Punter said:
Yes, very interesting.Andy_JS said:Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".
Also of interest was his opinion that the pursuit of Cummings was a bit of a waste of time now since the PM has decided that he will not be sacked come what may.
Starmer is a very lucky General!1 -
14-16 hours a week possibly...OllyT said:
Don't make me laugh, Johnson's never worked 14-16 hours a day in his life.NerysHughes said:
Boris nearly died and has gone straight back to work, probably 14-16 hours per day. His government is funding millions of people on Furlough to protect their jobs. Yes he has not sacked someone but to say that he is treating the public like shit is nonsense.Cyclefree said:
Durham to Barnard Castle is about 30 miles, depending on where you start from and which route you take. If he did it in half an hour he was driving at 60 mph. As a test drive? On those roads? When he was unsure of his eyesight?rcs1000 said:
If I wanted to take a drive to test my eyesight* I would probably prefer not to stray too far from home, in case I decided it wasn't up to a long drive. It's a bit risky going 25 miles away, IMHO, because what do you do in this CV-19 world if you get to Castle Bernard and decide your eyesight is not good enough?Philip_Thompson said:
I think it's logical before you go for a long cross country drive if you've just recovered from illness to take a half hour drive to see that you're up to the pressures of driving.rcs1000 said:
In all your comments, you seem to pretend there was only one beach of regulations, not three or more.Philip_Thompson said:
Indeed and having a young infant with no childcare is harmful. QED it is reasonable to leave the home to get childcare.Freggles said:
The regulations specifically allow you to leave home in order to prevent injury.Philip_Thompson said:I'm wondering how many people speaking about the instruction to stay at home would have done so if their fire alarm was going off and the building was being engulfed in flames.
Using your own personal judgement is what any sentient intelligent person should do. People banging on as if there's one rule for every situation don't just insult our intelligence they're insulting their own.
Very specific aren't they?
Forget the trips (plural) between London and Durham, and tell me how the Castle Bernard sojourn was in the rules.
I believe that's what Cummings meant but not what he said. The way it was phrased was awful but the logic I understood.
* Which, I would assume, the DVLA does not recommend
The whole story is nonsense. And anyone believing it really needs help getting dressed.
Why he said it is much more interesting. But no-one is following up on that.
Anyway, it scarcely matters now. The affair has shown us what the two men at the top of government are like and what they think of us.
What happens next is what interests me - and I expect them to mess that up too.0 -
Look. You've been spouting the same drivel here for weeks, and people have been patiently trying to explain things to you.contrarian said:
Why would we have a second lockdown and not others who are doing pretty much the same as us?Chris said:
Not if the other countries don't have a second lockdown.ozymandias said:
Same as every other economy I suppose.Chris said:
What I'm wondering is how much more screwed the British economy will be if we have a second lockdown.eristdoof said:
Do you also have the figures for how screwed the economy would have been had there been the Corona pandemic but no lockdown?kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
Do you really expect me to waste my time on someone so absolutely ineducable?0 -
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Yep. Obviously you will also need to check your eyesight.noneoftheabove said:
Surely if you find out you might have covid thru the test track and trace system the responsible thing to do is find out where is 350 miles away and drive there without stopping hoping you dont fall asleep?rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
And don't forget peeps to throw in a visit to the local, rural A&E when your symptoms are at their height as that will only add to the joys of your little country break.0 -
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
Of course it could be worse, it could have been 6 weeks ago.Scott_xP said:0 -
Herd immunity does not exist.Chris said:
Maybe that strategy of the most stupid 60% going for herd immunity really has merit.TGOHF666 said:Test and trace isolation is "Civic Duty" and voluntary.
Bad news for snitchers.
Sweden went for that and failed. Lower antibody numbers than London. But their deaths per million still below ours
Now why is that Chris?0 -
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With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.BluestBlue said:
So let me get this straight: undermining the lockdown / T&T is a moral outrage and the crime of the century when Cummings does it once (in private), but no problem at all when Piers Morgan does it all day, every single day, in public to his vast audience.rottenborough said:
Have I got this pious moralizing thing right yet?0 -
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.0 -
We received a message today saying that a couple of our offices will reopen in early July, rest to follow later. Expecting that no greater than 40% occupancy will be possible. WFH for the foreseeable future.
Presumably the company has been advised of future government easing of policy.0 -
Hospital, hospital.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.1 -
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How is driving 350 miles after a stressful period at work without stopping not reckless driving? He was putting anyone on those roads at great risk. Or more likely stopped, probably more than once given they couldnt last 30 minutes without a stop on their next journey, when they were well.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.0 -
Apart from the hospital visit, and their daytrip to Barnard Castle.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.
Perhaps they should have gone to South Devon instead, like the other Londoners with second homes...
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Would love to know your company's advice source ! Is there some backchannel for larger firms ?SandyRentool said:We received a message today saying that a couple of our offices will reopen in early July, rest to follow later. Expecting that no greater than 40% occupancy will be possible. WFH for the foreseeable future.
Presumably the company has been advised of future government easing of policy.0 -
That's another low number of positive tests.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265662409995423745
No evidence that the end of lockdown and the increased number working has increased R.0 -
The premise of Alastair's piece is that Cummings broke 'guidelines' not laws. And that as a result any future Government action is put in jeopardy.Peter_the_Punter said:
Richard, there are Laws, and it appears that Cummings may have broken them, notably in connection with the Castle excursion.Richard_Tyndall said:I am clear Cummings should have resigned.
But Alastair's piece is just so much poppycock.
Guidelines are guidelines. Laws are laws. Unless and until the Government passes specific laws with specific penalties for transgressing those laws then all Government guidance is open to interpretation.
Cummings was wrong to do what he did because as someone in a position of authority he should have been leading by example and because in not doing so he has made it seem as if the guidance actually doesn't matter. Of course it does. But the idea that there was no interpretation involved until Cummings performed his idiocy is just humbug.
If there are points at which the Government thinks it really is vital that its guidance is followed - such as the 14 day quarantine for new arrivals - then they should pass it into law. If they chose not to do that then people will indeed interpret it - or just ignore it - because that is the nature of our system of governance and law. If something is not explicitly forbidden then it is allowed.
The rest of your drift is absolutely right though. Someone one in his position should have been leading by example, Law or no Law.
If the Government thinks something is serious enough that it needs to be enforced then that should be a law not a guideline. This is why we have the sad spectacle of all those prosecutions being thrown out when certainly some of them should have stood.
This Government, just like so many others, seems to have a very poor grasp of what laws mean, not in their individual detail, but in terms of the philosophy of Governance. If something is serious enough that it needs to be legislated for this should be done through an explicit set of crystal clear laws. Anything else means either judicial overreach by either the police or the courts or uncertainty and the exploitation of loopholes on the part of the public.1 -
"Maitlis’s speech, which she wrote herself, was praised by the Labour MP as an example of “public service broadcasting”, and by Ed Davey, the acting Lib Dem leader, as “brilliant journalism”. Maitlis retweeted praise from a viewer who called the monologue “savage brilliance”.Brom said:
The BBC has not responded to a request for comment"0 -
I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
Some people regularly drive 250 miles. I think people in London think driving is impossible or something.noneoftheabove said:
How is driving 350 miles after a stressful period at work without stopping not reckless driving? He was putting anyone on those roads at great risk. Or more likely stopped, probably more than once given they couldnt last 30 minutes without a stop on their next journey, when they were well.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.0 -
When will she make a full and wholesome on screen apologyBrom said:0 -
I agree with you. The Barnard Castle excursion was foolish - he could/should have left the child playing socially distanced in the garden with a niece and then just driven nearby for 10 minutes or so on a loop route. Anyway, he did what he did.Peter_the_Punter said:ExiledInScotland said:The Rules are not the Law. The Law states what we are required to do, what defences we are allowed if we breach it, and what penalties we will suffer if we are convicted. It does not say you must keep a specific distance, not go to parks, wear face masks, etc. Those are separate Rules that politicians have announced. They are sensible Rules which I have tried to follow at all times, but I always knew that I could break them if necessary based on my judgement of Risk to myself and others, being prepared to take the consequences.
You might like to look at the FT piece I quoted earlier, Exiled:ExiledInScotland said:The Rules are not the Law. The Law states what we are required to do, what defences we are allowed if we breach it, and what penalties we will suffer if we are convicted. It does not say you must keep a specific distance, not go to parks, wear face masks, etc. Those are separate Rules that politicians have announced. They are sensible Rules which I have tried to follow at all times, but I always knew that I could break them if necessary based on my judgement of Risk to myself and others, being prepared to take the consequences.
https://www.ft.com/video/e82b5a00-3ad5-4d2c-9703-ff14942aa5b1
It's long (though instructive) so the Executive Summary is that in order to be on the right side of the Law (Regulation 6, apparently) Cummings had to have a reasonable excuse for his excursions. He offered three for journey North, and it is possible but by no means certain that one of these or a combination may have sufficed.
As regards the Castle expedition, only one excuse was offered, i.e. the much ridiculed 'eyesight' reason. This was so implausible that it would be unlikely to stand up in a court of Law.
Those arguing that Cummings broke no Law may well be wrong.0 -
https://twitter.com/BBCNewsPR/status/1265666465308573696BBC statement on last night's Newsnight pic.twitter.com/JFm4Nt5YMv
— BBC News Press Team (@BBCNewsPR) May 27, 20200 -
The Moron Party?noneoftheabove said:
I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
Wonder if they regret hiring the partisan Labour activist plonker from Sky ?Brom said:BBC statement on last night's Newsnight pic.twitter.com/JFm4Nt5YMv
— BBC News Press Team (@BBCNewsPR) May 27, 2020
1 -
Don't hold your breath. Runs contrary to the pitch-fork brigade's mentality.Big_G_NorthWales said:
When will she make a full and wholesome on screen apologyBrom said:0 -
I suspect that there might be.Pulpstar said:
Would love to know your company's advice source ! Is there some backchannel for larger firms ?SandyRentool said:We received a message today saying that a couple of our offices will reopen in early July, rest to follow later. Expecting that no greater than 40% occupancy will be possible. WFH for the foreseeable future.
Presumably the company has been advised of future government easing of policy.0 -
Did you watch Emily's tour de force?BluestBlue said:
I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight!TGOHF666 said:Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?
Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.
I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.0 -
I await his feedback on tomorrows figures when they halve.noneoftheabove said:
I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
Hey, is it Monday yet? I'm pretty sure you said Cummings would be gone by then, but I've kind of lost track of time...rottenborough said:0 -
Anything America can do we can do worse ?noneoftheabove said:
I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
She's not my representative. I have no EU representative. So I couldn't care less.Mango said:
But you did vote for her. You marked a ballot paper in support of her party, in the constituency where she was top of the list. She was duly elected as your representative. Job done.Philip_Thompson said:
I didn't vote for her. I voted a protest vote and I voted for there to be no MEPs.Mango said:
Except, you know, when you voted for her.Philip_Thompson said:
I dislike Claire Fox. I don't support her, never have.
I'm not sure you understand this democracy business at all...
My protest was acknowledged and there are no MEPs. Job done.
If she was my EU representative and if that job mattered you'd have a point.0 -
Wonder if they regret hiring the partisan Labour activist plonker from Sky ?TGOHF666 said:Brom said:BBC statement on last night's Newsnight pic.twitter.com/JFm4Nt5YMv
— BBC News Press Team (@BBCNewsPR) May 27, 2020
Goodall is a young Paul Mason in the making, wasn't taken seriously at Sky but I guess he comes fairly cheap.
But what a step down Maitlis is from the golden days of Paxo. From a universally lauded journalist to a female James O'Brien impersonator.2 -
It isn't just the BBC to be fair. I watched ITV News at TEn a fortnight or so ago, and the presenter introduced the first item, a poll they had carried out of BAME NHS workers in the style of the host of Watchdog rather than an impartial news bulletin.TGOHF666 said:
"Maitlis’s speech, which she wrote herself, was praised by the Labour MP as an example of “public service broadcasting”, and by Ed Davey, the acting Lib Dem leader, as “brilliant journalism”. Maitlis retweeted praise from a viewer who called the monologue “savage brilliance”.Brom said:
The BBC has not responded to a request for comment"
Maybe the days of impartialty are over, and we will become even more Americanised.1 -
Mr. kinabalu, Maitlis' intro was subjective and opinionated. It isn't the role of current affairs coverage to tell people the personal views of presenters and how the audience should think, but to provide information objectively and in a neutral fashion.
The PM's a vacillating coward of ill-judgement, and Cummings should have resigned. None of that justifies Newsnight deciding presenting things in a balanced way is unnecessary.1 -
To be honest your comments rather proves the admittance by the BBC of lack of impartialitykinabalu said:
Did you watch Emily's tour de force?BluestBlue said:
I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight!TGOHF666 said:Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?
Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.
I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.2 -
Er, even the BBC has admitted that her propaganda 'did not meet our standards of due impartiality', so no.kinabalu said:
Did you watch Emily's tour de force?BluestBlue said:
I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight!TGOHF666 said:Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?
Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.
I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.
I've never had a problem with her before, but I'm afraid she's definitely Emily No-Mates to me now.0 -
-
BBC journo asks a non Cummings question.
Hancock recoils in surprise.
2 -
The highway code recommends 15 mins break every 2 hours. Driving 350 miles without stopping, with an ill family, when you think you might be ill yourself and after an extremely stressful week at work puts others at risk.Monkeys said:
Some people regularly drive 250 miles. I think people in London think driving is impossible or something.noneoftheabove said:
How is driving 350 miles after a stressful period at work without stopping not reckless driving? He was putting anyone on those roads at great risk. Or more likely stopped, probably more than once given they couldnt last 30 minutes without a stop on their next journey, when they were well.MarqueeMark said:
The Cummins family was isolated. In London. In the car. In County Durham.rottenborough said:We said "isolate" when you had symptoms. Hancock.
Hang on, the last three days you've been telling us that that regulation was guided by instinct and could be ignored if there are issues such as childcare.
It is just bollocks now. Totall bollocks. I don't know how they keep a straight face.
At no point did they come in contact with Joe Public or put them at any additional risk.0 -
Perhaps he'll lead by example and boycott it.Pulpstar said:Not sure why Trump his mad at Twitter, it's been an amazing platform for him.
0 -
Populist politicians dont deal with facts as we are getting used to.TGOHF666 said:
I await his feedback on tomorrows figures when they halve.noneoftheabove said:
I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
ozymandias said:
I seem to remember multiple times last year that both Cummings and Johnson were written off. Using much the same language as now. Remember the Prorogation that was going to end the dastardly careers of both of them?ydoethur said:
Yes.ozymandias said:
You do know the next GE is fours years from now?OllyT said:
Four years of Dominic Cummings doing this level of damage and it won’t be a new Thatcher the Tories need but a new Clement Davies.
I also remember a winning 80 seat majority in a "close" (at least as Twitter was concerned) election.
Political fortunes twist and turn. Four years from now sweaty Starmer could be looking at reducing his pitiful MP count even further,. Who knows?
A lot of people, including a good number of Tories, did not believe Johnson was up to being PM. Many also recognised that he was extremely lucky to be facing Corbyn.
The way this government is panning out is no surprise to me at all, just the speed with which it is being found out. I grant you events may yet throw up more surprises but nothing is going to suddenly turn Johnson into a competent leader. Personally I don't think he will even be PM by the next GE>0 -
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Well they did start flagging his tweets as potentially misleading (aka barefaced lies).Pulpstar said:Not sure why Trump his mad at Twitter, it's been an amazing platform for him.
Did that come as a surprise for him ?
In other news...
https://twitter.com/tomgara/status/1265638547551379456
0 -
Mr. Isam, yeah, not watched ITV News since they threw Alastair Stewart overboard for quoting Shakespeare.
But even before that, Bradby's daft aside and Peston's rambling opinions were not exactly compelling.
Ironically, one of the last things I saw was Rageh Omar[sp] and a piece about people turning away from the mainstream media and watching more Youtube.2 -
Balance doesn't require giving a load of old bollocks equal weighting with the truth.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, Maitlis' intro was subjective and opinionated. It isn't the role of current affairs coverage to tell people the personal views of presenters and how the audience should think, but to provide information objectively and in a neutral fashion.
The PM's a vacillating coward of ill-judgement, and Cummings should have resigned. None of that justifies Newsnight deciding presenting things in a balanced way is unnecessary.2 -
When it comes to the misreporting / still total misunderstanding of these figures but the media, i can't work out if it is deliberate or just they are morons. Prof Cricket has been on R4 a load of times to explain things and is widely quoted on twitter, yet Piers Moron still gets it wrong. Sky did yesterday with excess deaths using daily announced figures (not when died) vs average deaths in each calendar week.another_richard said:
Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.rottenborough said:
Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/12656624099954237450 -
I very much agree,kyf_100 said:Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.
I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.
If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.
We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".
Cummings has bade some tragic errers:
1) He pushed for schools to be closed
2) He pushed for the lock-down
Both of theses where largely a result of his opinion and not IAW the siantific evidence.
he also missed 2 possible opportunitys to intervene
1) He could/should have countered PHE ban of the prvet sector doing testing at the start.
2) He could/should have stopped old people being returned from hospitals to care homes and taking the virus with them.
To be fire the last to apply to the whole government, but his is meant to be the outside thinker out of the box, countering the government blob, and he failed.
What he did with his family, is an irrelevance, he pushed the rules to the point of absurdity, but largely to help his family, I do not care.
0 -
At least they are not rewriting their charter and backdating it to show that she was following their guidelines...BluestBlue said:
Er, even the BBC has admitted that her propaganda 'did not meet our standards of due impartiality', so no.kinabalu said:
Did you watch Emily's tour de force?BluestBlue said:
I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight!TGOHF666 said:Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?
Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.
I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.
I've never had a problem with her before, but I'm afraid she's definitely Emily No-Mates to me now.3 -
That you all got - "sweaty", "Schtarmer" ?ozymandias said:
With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.
Pathetic.
0 -
Mr. Rentool, aye. And Maitlis just had to avoid telling us her very important views on the 'lazy label of elite' and so forth. The facts and polling are all against the Government. I think the PM's totally wrong on this.
That doesn't mean slanted current affairs riddled with personal views is a good thing.
And with that, I must be off. Play nicely, everyone.0 -
40 is Numberwang, isn't it?Scott_xP said:0 -
So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.0
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Oh dear. What an unfortunate comment. A window to the soul and the view is murky.ozymandias said:
With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.BluestBlue said:
So let me get this straight: undermining the lockdown / T&T is a moral outrage and the crime of the century when Cummings does it once (in private), but no problem at all when Piers Morgan does it all day, every single day, in public to his vast audience.rottenborough said:
Have I got this pious moralizing thing right yet?0 -
How many are standing down and fighting a bye election as an independent ?AlastairMeeks said:So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.
I mean if they were really serious they would do so ?1 -
For the record I dont think Maitlis should go, but now that her bosses have said she got it wrong, perhaps she should apologise. After calling for Cumming's head it only seems fair.0
