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Who is behind the door of Number 10 is the only one to worry about.....solarflare said:The other thing about a Christmas election is just think how many "advent calendar" memes/jokes/schticks we're going to get from the broadcasters.
"What's behind the door to the 5th? It's Jezza, and a nationalised railway!"0 -
Late to the party, but my own little observation on the Lib Dem magazine: we also got it here in North East Herts. The Lib Dems have been making council gains where I live (Royston, which is in the Pale of Cambridge) for several years, but nonetheless leafleting us like this is nothing if not ambitious. Our Tory incumbent is sitting on a twenty thousand majority IIRC, and he's not exactly a hard Brexiteer either.0
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If they do, what happens to his suspension? Can such things cross parliaments? The timing is deeply unfortunate as it seems like he will escape the process of recall.MarqueeMark said:
Will Labour let him stand again in December?justin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Irrelevant. If it’s true or not , you can’t beat a pathological liar like Bozo with a campaign built on the highest ethics.RobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .
Will you also be calling out any possible Tory misinformation.
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Why should trifling inconvenience like the truth get in the way of the most effective scare tactic in the next general election.RobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .0 -
The flaw in that plan is that it is a bank holiday in Scotland.MarqueeMark said:
SNP pipe up it isn't a Bank Holiday in Scotland. Everything has to revolve around London, eh?justin124 said:
No elections on Bank Holidays.MarqueeMark said:December 26th is a Thursday.
Just saying.....0 -
Lefty types on Twitter predicting Hodge will win her reselection tonight.0
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Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .0 -
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Yeah, Christmas politics jokes are going to become very tired, very quickly. The comedy bar for TV journalists and politicians is set extremely low.solarflare said:The other thing about a Christmas election is just think how many "advent calendar" memes/jokes/schticks we're going to get from the broadcasters.
"What's behind the door to the 5th? It's Jezza, and a nationalised railway!"0 -
On the other hand , the St Andrews Day Bank Holiday means that Dissolution has to happen a day earlier across the UK.!MarqueeMark said:
SNP pipe up it isn't a Bank Holiday in Scotland. Everything has to revolve around London, eh?justin124 said:
No elections on Bank Holidays.MarqueeMark said:December 26th is a Thursday.
Just saying.....0 -
Can he stand in an election whilst suspended? That would be ludicrous.justin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Vaz and decency .... nahegg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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When you're totally shameless and being paid seventy-odd grand a year to do bugger all, of course.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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It’s the big majority of electorate compromising around taking a step in that direction, from which we could step either way in future.Philip_Thompson said:
I don't give a rats ass about immigration.DougSeal said:
In a CU but out of the Single Market sorts your immigration issues out. Once that is done I doubt very many Joe Publics give a monkeys about who negotiates your FTAs.Philip_Thompson said:
CU Brexit is pointless. Can you name any prominent leavers who back that? Why would that even be a proposal?egg said:
Labour’s brexit policy is to do the easiest brexit deal and negotiation in the world, offer EU all UK in CU, and then put that to the people in a CU deal v remain ref.MarqueeMark said:
Nope. This will be front, back and centre a Brexit election. Partly because the other parties know Labour has no answer and will pour salt into that wound.Benpointer said:
Not many.MarqueeMark said:
How many of the public are going to say "You know, I think what the public REALLY want is a LOT more dicking around on the deal with the EU, and then have the Govt. say "We have negotiated a really shit deal: please vote it down in a Referendum that we will hold sometime in the summer, so that you can get real comfortable with just how shit a deal it was. Oh, and in the meantime, the SNP will get their referendum to break up the United Kingdom." Yep, that has to be real easy sell.....nico67 said:
Agreed. Things could go horribly wrong in the election if the public decide the best way to finish this is either with Johnson’s deal or the Lib Dem revoke policy .numbertwelve said:Labour are falling apart in front of our eyes. If Jezza has a successful election I will be tremendously impressed to be honest, it will show him to be one of the greatest political campaigners of our age. Because right now Labours position looks abysmal.
But people won't be voting Labour with Brexit in mind and, despite our PB fascination with it, I suspect that for a large chunk of the population Brexit is a secondary consideration.
That compromise position between the extremes of revoke and Boris flawed deal will surely play well in a general election campaign? Why can’t Tories and Libdems both in hoc and on here see that?
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?0 -
You are relying on Trump as your source? Hahahahaha!Anabobazina said:
Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .0 -
His words are on camera and US pharmaceutical companies have long pushed for changes .Anabobazina said:
Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .
Labour will use this against the Tories and so will the rest of the opposition. They need to eat into the over 65 vote who currently are Bozos base .
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There's no Parliament during an election, so there are no MPs and you can't be suspended from itAramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can he stand in an election whilst suspended? That would be ludicrous.justin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Who knows but *cough*MarqueeMark said:
Will Labour let him stand again in December?justin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
https://order-order.com/2019/10/28/labour-candidate-booted-anti-semitism-tweets-re-selected/0 -
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:
I don't give a rats ass about immigration.DougSeal said:
In a CU but out of the Single Market sorts your immigration issues out. Once that is done I doubt very many Joe Publics give a monkeys about who negotiates your FTAs.Philip_Thompson said:
CU Brexit is pointless. Can you name any prominent leavers who back that? Why would that even be a proposal?egg said:
Labour’s brexit policy is to do the easiest brexit deal and negotiation in the world, offer EU all UK in CU, and then put that to the people in a CU deal v remain ref.MarqueeMark said:
Nope. This will be front, back and centre a Brexit election. Partly because the other parties know Labour has no answer and will pour salt into that wound.Benpointer said:
Not many.MarqueeMark said:
How many of the public are going to say "You know, I think what the public REALLY want is a LOT more dicking around on the deal with the EU, and then have the Govt. say "We have negotiated a really shit deal: please vote it down in a Referendum that we will hold sometime in the summer, so that you can get real comfortable with just how shit a deal it was. Oh, and in the meantime, the SNP will get their referendum to break up the United Kingdom." Yep, that has to be real easy sell.....
But people won't be voting Labour with Brexit in mind and, despite our PB fascination with it, I suspect that for a large chunk of the population Brexit is a secondary consideration.
That compromise position between the extremes of revoke and Boris flawed deal will surely play well in a general election campaign? Why can’t Tories and Libdems both in hoc and on here see that?
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.0 -
Having just perused his Wiki entry, decency left the building quite some time ago.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Trump won't be negotiating the FTA. It will most likely be President Elizabeth Warren.nico67 said:
His words are on camera and US pharmaceutical companies have long pushed for changes .Anabobazina said:
Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .
Labour will use this against the Tories and so will the rest of the opposition. They need to eat into the over 65 vote who currently are Bozos base .0 -
Evidence of that? I've not seen anyone at all let alone 'a big majority of electorate' "compromising around taking a step in that direction" I just see people who openly say they don't want Brexit putting up a form of Brexit that Brexiteers don't want and is universally condemned as moronic as the alternative to Remaining.egg said:
It’s the big majority of electorate compromising around taking a step in that direction, from which we could step either way in future.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?0 -
Never stopped a political attack ad beforeRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .0 -
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?0 -
Immigration? The debate is beyond immigration now.DougSeal said:
In a CU but out of the Single Market sorts your immigration issues out. Once that is done I doubt very many Joe Publics give a monkeys about who negotiates your FTAs.Philip_Thompson said:
CU Brexit is pointless. Can you name any prominent leavers who back that? Why would that even be a proposal?egg said:
Labour’s brexit policy is to do the easiest brexit deal and negotiation in the world, offer EU all UK in CU, and then put that to the people in a CU deal v remain ref.MarqueeMark said:
Nope. This will be front, back and centre a Brexit election. Partly because the other parties know Labour has no answer and will pour salt into that wound.Benpointer said:
Not many.MarqueeMark said:
How many of the public are going to say "You know, I think what the public REALLY want is a LOT more dicking around on the deal with the EU, and then have the Govt. say "We have negotiated a really shit deal: please vote it down in a Referendum that we will hold sometime in the summer, so that you can get real comfortable with just how shit a deal it was. Oh, and in the meantime, the SNP will get their referendum to break up the United Kingdom." Yep, that has to be real easy sell.....nico67 said:
Agreed. Things could go horribly wrong in the election if the public decide the best way to finish this is either with Johnson’s deal or the Lib Dem revoke policy .numbertwelve said:Labour are falling apart in front of our eyes. If Jezza has a successful election I will be tremendously impressed to be honest, it will show him to be one of the greatest political campaigners of our age. Because right now Labours position looks abysmal.
But people won't be voting Labour with Brexit in mind and, despite our PB fascination with it, I suspect that for a large chunk of the population Brexit is a secondary consideration.
That compromise position between the extremes of revoke and Boris flawed deal will surely play well in a general election campaign? Why can’t Tories and Libdems both in hoc and on here see that?
Think the deliveroo advert “no carbs before marbs”.
The people cooking that food for us, do you think they currently come in under an immigration policy. Do you think they will stop coming in under a post brexit immigration policy?
The moment someone plays football for England who came here illegally is the moment immigration is tippexed out the Oxford English Dictionary.0 -
I would be happy if that was the case but in the here and now Trump is there and Labour need to tie Bozo to him .Gabs2 said:
Trump won't be negotiating the FTA. It will most likely be President Elizabeth Warren.nico67 said:
His words are on camera and US pharmaceutical companies have long pushed for changes .Anabobazina said:
Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .
Labour will use this against the Tories and so will the rest of the opposition. They need to eat into the over 65 vote who currently are Bozos base .
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I’d almost bet on a pre-cooked Boris/Trump “confrontation” in their bilat around the NATO summit where Boris gets to tell him “the NHS is not for sale” (again). Would barely register in the US and the quid pro quo would be something next August/September.DougSeal said:
Never stopped a political attack ad beforeRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .0 -
About as likely as President John Kerry wasGabs2 said:
Trump won't be negotiating the FTA. It will most likely be President Elizabeth Warren.nico67 said:
His words are on camera and US pharmaceutical companies have long pushed for changes .Anabobazina said:
Your beloved Trumpton keeps saying it isRobD said:
Except it isn't true...nico67 said:Labour really need to go hard on the NHS up for sale under the Tories .
They really need to close the gap in the over 65 vote . Its a shame you can’t use foreign leaders in ads but Trump saying its going to be part of any trade deal and connecting him with Bozo would certainly I think have an impact .
Labour will use this against the Tories and so will the rest of the opposition. They need to eat into the over 65 vote who currently are Bozos base .0 -
You could paint a job lot of horse shit red and they'd vote for it in Leicester East. Keith Vaz has one of the safest jobs in the country.Black_Rook said:
When you're totally shameless and being paid seventy-odd grand a year to do bugger all, of course.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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The Chartists will be delighted.GIN1138 said:
Says who?AndyJS said:
The only downside to having an election this year is that we won't be able to look forward to one next year.nico67 said:The media and journalists will think they’ve just landed the jackpot.
After years of Brexit drama they now have an election to cover .
December 1923 election lead to October 1924 election...0 -
The negotiation part of labour’s policy is the easiest part, first day can we have UK wide CU please? Workers rights, environmental and consumer rights all in the WA. You think there will be wrangling more than one day? No Irish border issue at all.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
The second part begins the second day, confirmatory ref that type of brexit v remain at first convenient date.
I say where you have some defending the issues around Boris deal, others defending the extreme position of revoking even without a second ref, Labour’s more measured approach will appear different on the oxygen of a GE campaign, because it won’t appear like ramming a divisive brexit policy through based on that general election win,
If you step outside of a bubble where you want it to be a disaster of a policy and look at it objectively, is it really going to be so complicated to sell and defend that it’s a disaster of a GE position?0 -
You’re wasting way too much energy trying to figure out the logic behind the FPTA.rpjs said:
So what is the point of the provision that the countdown can be stopped if a VOC is passed?ydoethur said:
No it wasn’t. The convention was that there would be an election, DURING WHICH THE INCUMBENT PRIME MINISTER STAYED IN PLACE. There has been one occasion since the war when that was needed -1979. I think you will find James Callaghan was still PM until after the election.rpjs said:
Please show me the statute or convention that says "The PM remains in office until that time". The convention before the FTPA was that the administration would resign on losing a VONC.
The rest of your post is wishful thinking, aka complete rubbish. Do you honestly think the Queen would summon an alternative candidate unless it was clear as result of a vote that they could command a majority? A motion could be put down as an indication, before the formal vote later.
If the FTPA is to be read that a VONC automatically triggers a dissolution fourteen days later, which is what you appear to be saying, why does it contain a provision about a VOC cancelling the countdown?
A VOC can only apply to the government in office, whether that government is two years or two days old. it cannot apply to some proposed future government that has not actually been commissioned by the monarch.
The SOLE purpose was to stop the Tories screwing the LibDems in the coalition by calling an early general election. (Eg hence the idea of a VoC stopping to clock if they patched up their differences).
It wasn’t well though out with an internally coherent logic0 -
If we stay in the Customs Union it will make Brexit a lot easier to implement. There will be less economic disruption in the short run and it keeps all our existing trade deals intact. It beats me why anyone would want to leave it, but it really should appeal to Brexiters who want their project to bed in and be a success.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?0 -
No, it will turn off Leavers who will either back the Boris Deal or Farage's No Deal and at the same time turn off Remainers who will back the LDs revoke policy instead.egg said:
Labour’s brexit policy is to do the easiest brexit deal and negotiation in the world, offer EU all UK in CU, and then put that to the people in a CU deal v remain ref.MarqueeMark said:
Nope. This will be front, back and centre a Brexit election. Partly because the other parties know Labour has no answer and will pour salt into that wound.Benpointer said:
Not many.MarqueeMark said:
How many of the public are going to say "You know, I think what the public REALLY want is a LOT more dicking around on the deal with the EU, and then have the Govt. say "We have negotiated a really shit deal: please vote it down in a Referendum that we will hold sometime in the summer, so that you can get real comfortable with just how shit a deal it was. Oh, and in the meantime, the SNP will get their referendum to break up the United Kingdom." Yep, that has to be real easy sell.....nico67 said:
Agreed. Things could go horribly wrong in the election if the public decide the best way to finish this is either with Johnson’s deal or the Lib Dem revoke policy .numbertwelve said:Labour are falling apart in front of our eyes. If Jezza has a successful election I will be tremendously impressed to be honest, it will show him to be one of the greatest political campaigners of our age. Because right now Labours position looks abysmal.
But people won't be voting Labour with Brexit in mind and, despite our PB fascination with it, I suspect that for a large chunk of the population Brexit is a secondary consideration.
That compromise position between the extremes of revoke and Boris flawed deal will surely play well in a general election campaign? Why can’t Tories and Libdems both in hoc and on here see that?
So by trying to please everyone, Labour will end up pleasing nobody and its vote will collapse to its socialist core0 -
A meaningless Brexit that nobody wants is not "measured".egg said:
The negotiation part of labour’s policy is the easiest part, first day can we have UK wide CU please? Workers rights, environmental and consumer rights all in the WA. You think there will be wrangling more than one day? No Irish border issue at all.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
The second part begins the second day, confirmatory ref that type of brexit v remain at first convenient date.
I say where you have some defending the issues around Boris deal, others defending the extreme position of revoking even without a second ref, Labour’s more measured approach will appear different on the oxygen of a GE campaign, because it won’t appear like ramming a divisive brexit policy through based on that general election win,
If you step outside of a bubble where you want it to be a disaster of a policy and look at it objectively, is it really going to be so complicated to sell and defend that it’s a disaster of a GE position?
As for it being 'complicated' yes absolutely. "We will negotiate a deal we don't want and then campaign against it" is obviously and hilariously absurd.0 -
Judging by your posting name I suggest you are biased towards December twelve!numbertwelve said:I am starting to wonder if labour will back the bill for the 12th. If LDs vote against, it neutralises the “only party scared of having an election” line somewhat.
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Yet every Remainer proposing it actually wants to Remain and every Brexiteer is saying its a bad idea.Recidivist said:
If we stay in the Customs Union it will make Brexit a lot easier to implement. There will be less economic disruption in the short run and it keeps all our existing trade deals intact. It beats me why anyone would want to leave it, but it really should appeal to Brexiters who want their project to bed in and be a success.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
Should tell you something that this supposed 'success' is one that nobody wants.0 -
That was the *main* purpose but removing prerogative powers in case some maniac tries to abuse them is a longstanding goal of LibDem types.Charles said:
You’re wasting way too much energy trying to figure out the logic behind the FPTA.rpjs said:
So what is the point of the provision that the countdown can be stopped if a VOC is passed?ydoethur said:
No it wasn’t. The convention was that there would be an election, DURING WHICH THE INCUMBENT PRIME MINISTER STAYED IN PLACE. There has been one occasion since the war when that was needed -1979. I think you will find James Callaghan was still PM until after the election.rpjs said:
Please show me the statute or convention that says "The PM remains in office until that time". The convention before the FTPA was that the administration would resign on losing a VONC.
The rest of your post is wishful thinking, aka complete rubbish. Do you honestly think the Queen would summon an alternative candidate unless it was clear as result of a vote that they could command a majority? A motion could be put down as an indication, before the formal vote later.
If the FTPA is to be read that a VONC automatically triggers a dissolution fourteen days later, which is what you appear to be saying, why does it contain a provision about a VOC cancelling the countdown?
A VOC can only apply to the government in office, whether that government is two years or two days old. it cannot apply to some proposed future government that has not actually been commissioned by the monarch.
The SOLE purpose was to stop the Tories screwing the LibDems in the coalition by calling an early general election. (Eg hence the idea of a VoC stopping to clock if they patched up their differences).
It wasn’t well though out with an internally coherent logic
Also, the point of stopping the clock wasn't to let LD patch things up with Con, it was to negotiate a rainbow coalition *without* Con. The ability to do that was the whole point of the exercise.0 -
Because it’s a solution that deserves consideration? Are you saying that ideas should never be considered because they are unpopular?Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
Not sure why only prominent Brexiteers should have a say. And anyway, a prominent Brexiteer supporting it is Jeremy Corbyn.0 -
So say Labour conclude they can't avoid an election forever, when do *they* want it?0
-
Please God, no!MarqueeMark said:
Who is behind the door of Number 10 is the only one to worry about.....solarflare said:The other thing about a Christmas election is just think how many "advent calendar" memes/jokes/schticks we're going to get from the broadcasters.
"What's behind the door to the 5th? It's Jezza, and a nationalised railway!"
An election on Dec 9 will be a horror show for that very joke alone!!-1 -
You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....0 -
Labour's position has the benefit of being easy to understand.Philip_Thompson said:
A meaningless Brexit that nobody wants is not "measured".egg said:
The negotiation part of labour’s policy is the easiest part, first day can we have UK wide CU please? Workers rights, environmental and consumer rights all in the WA. You think there will be wrangling more than one day? No Irish border issue at all.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
The second part begins the second day, confirmatory ref that type of brexit v remain at first convenient date.
I say where you have some defending the issues around Boris deal, others defending the extreme position of revoking even without a second ref, Labour’s more measured approach will appear different on the oxygen of a GE campaign, because it won’t appear like ramming a divisive brexit policy through based on that general election win,
If you step outside of a bubble where you want it to be a disaster of a policy and look at it objectively, is it really going to be so complicated to sell and defend that it’s a disaster of a GE position?
As for it being 'complicated' yes absolutely. "We will negotiate a deal we don't want and then campaign against it" is obviously and hilariously absurd.
It also has the downside of being hilarious. Point and laugh at Labour's Brexit position - not so good. When Mock The Week rip the piss out of it, it's not going to be going so well....
0 -
Maybe. But at least we didn’t vote to invade Iraq. Unlike some parties.tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....2 -
TBF having this election once the extension was secured was literally Labour policy until like last week...tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....4 -
Without an election it’s quite clear that Brexit is going through anyway, backed by a number of Labour MPs and a nod and a wink from Corbyn. At least an election beforehand gives people the chance to reject it. It may be a long shot - largely because of our ludicrous voting system for which the Libs can hardly be blamed - but it’s worth taking given the alternative.tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....0 -
The interesting thing about the next election is that the Tories are going to be relying on the votes of people who are not traditional Tory voters and who are not regular voters at all. Getting them to turn out on a cold, dark December night in constituencies where the local party is not necessarily that strong is going to be a challenge. If Labour has another leader it may not be one they’d meet.0
-
You could blame the LibDems for going for a referendum on AV (thread required) and not holding out for an electoral system that was better, popular and good enough to win in a referendumIanB2 said:
Without an election it’s quite clear that Brexit is going through anyway, backed by a number of Labour MPs and a nod and a wink from Corbyn. At least an election beforehand gives people the chance to reject it. It may be a long shot - largely because of our ludicrous voting system for which the Libs can hardly be blamed - but it’s worth taking given the alternative.tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....0 -
I'm listening to "Gordon Brown on The Gospel Of Wealth" on BBC Sounds. It's about Andrew Carnegie and his philanthropy. It's rather listenable.0
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Except it isn't. The referendum result was to leave, but not leave options are as good as staying. So they are going to come back with the best they can and we can choose whether we still want the coat when we've seen the cloth and the cut.MarqueeMark said:
Labour's position has the benefit of being easy to understand.Philip_Thompson said:
A meaningless Brexit that nobody wants is not "measured".egg said:
The negotiation part of labour’s policy is the easiest part, first day can we have UK wide CU please? Workers rights, environmental and consumer rights all in the WA. You think there will be wrangling more than one day? No Irish border issue at all.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
The second part begins the second day, confirmatory ref that type of brexit v remain at first convenient date.
I say where you have some defending the issues around Boris deal, others defending the extreme position of revoking even without a second ref, Labour’s more measured approach will appear different on the oxygen of a GE campaign, because it won’t appear like ramming a divisive brexit policy through based on that general election win,
If you step outside of a bubble where you want it to be a disaster of a policy and look at it objectively, is it really going to be so complicated to sell and defend that it’s a disaster of a GE position?
As for it being 'complicated' yes absolutely. "We will negotiate a deal we don't want and then campaign against it" is obviously and hilariously absurd.
It also has the downside of being hilarious. Point and laugh at Labour's Brexit position - not so good. When Mock The Week rip the piss out of it, it's not going to be going so well....0 -
Anything Clegg had backed would have sunk in a referendum in the circumstances. We should be thankful proper PR wasn’t tarnished by being lost in a vote. The LDs should have gone for STV for local government without a referendum.philiph said:
You could blame the LibDems for going for a referendum on AV (thread required) and not holding out for an electoral system that was better, popular and good enough to win in a referendumIanB2 said:
Without an election it’s quite clear that Brexit is going through anyway, backed by a number of Labour MPs and a nod and a wink from Corbyn. At least an election beforehand gives people the chance to reject it. It may be a long shot - largely because of our ludicrous voting system for which the Libs can hardly be blamed - but it’s worth taking given the alternative.tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....0 -
So the super-majority rule WAS Clegg's idea!Charles said:
You’re wasting way too much energy trying to figure out the logic behind the FPTA.rpjs said:
So what is the point of the provision that the countdown can be stopped if a VOC is passed?ydoethur said:
No it wasn’t. The convention was that there would be an election, DURING WHICH THE INCUMBENT PRIME MINISTER STAYED IN PLACE. There has been one occasion since the war when that was needed -1979. I think you will find James Callaghan was still PM until after the election.rpjs said:
Please show me the statute or convention that says "The PM remains in office until that time". The convention before the FTPA was that the administration would resign on losing a VONC.
The rest of your post is wishful thinking, aka complete rubbish. Do you honestly think the Queen would summon an alternative candidate unless it was clear as result of a vote that they could command a majority? A motion could be put down as an indication, before the formal vote later.
If the FTPA is to be read that a VONC automatically triggers a dissolution fourteen days later, which is what you appear to be saying, why does it contain a provision about a VOC cancelling the countdown?
A VOC can only apply to the government in office, whether that government is two years or two days old. it cannot apply to some proposed future government that has not actually been commissioned by the monarch.
The SOLE purpose was to stop the Tories screwing the LibDems in the coalition by calling an early general election. (Eg hence the idea of a VoC stopping to clock if they patched up their differences).
It wasn’t well though out with an internally coherent logic0 -
Tories are going to be relying on blow-in Labour voters in places like Warwick and Leamington switching to LibDem because they'd like to Remain. There were nearly 8000 additional Labour voters in 2017. How loyal are they likely to be? Not very, in my opinion.SouthamObserver said:The interesting thing about the next election is that the Tories are going to be relying on the votes of people who are not traditional Tory voters and who are not regular voters at all. Getting them to turn out on a cold, dark December night in constituencies where the local party is not necessarily that strong is going to be a challenge. If Labour has another leader it may not be one they’d meet.
0 -
Theresa May cried after the EU referendum when Leave won, a new book claims
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7621213/Remain-supporter-Theresa-cried-Leave-won-2016-referendum.html0 -
Osborne came up with most of it, according to insidersSunil_Prasannan said:
So the super-majority rule WAS Clegg's idea!Charles said:
You’re wasting way too much energy trying to figure out the logic behind the FPTA.rpjs said:
So what is the point of the provision that the countdown can be stopped if a VOC is passed?ydoethur said:
No it wasn’t. The convention was that there would be an election, DURING WHICH THE INCUMBENT PRIME MINISTER STAYED IN PLACE. There has been one occasion since the war when that was needed -1979. I think you will find James Callaghan was still PM until after the election.rpjs said:
Please show me the statute or convention that says "The PM remains in office until that time". The convention before the FTPA was that the administration would resign on losing a VONC.
The rest of your post is wishful thinking, aka complete rubbish. Do you honestly think the Queen would summon an alternative candidate unless it was clear as result of a vote that they could command a majority? A motion could be put down as an indication, before the formal vote later.
If the FTPA is to be read that a VONC automatically triggers a dissolution fourteen days later, which is what you appear to be saying, why does it contain a provision about a VOC cancelling the countdown?
A VOC can only apply to the government in office, whether that government is two years or two days old. it cannot apply to some proposed future government that has not actually been commissioned by the monarch.
The SOLE purpose was to stop the Tories screwing the LibDems in the coalition by calling an early general election. (Eg hence the idea of a VoC stopping to clock if they patched up their differences).
It wasn’t well though out with an internally coherent logic0 -
I'm all for a lack of loyalty for all political parties.Alphabet_Soup said:
Tories are going to be relying on blow-in Labour voters in places like Warwick and Leamington switching to LibDem because they'd like to Remain. There were nearly 8000 additional Labour voters in 2017. How loyal are they likely to be? Not very, in my opinion.SouthamObserver said:The interesting thing about the next election is that the Tories are going to be relying on the votes of people who are not traditional Tory voters and who are not regular voters at all. Getting them to turn out on a cold, dark December night in constituencies where the local party is not necessarily that strong is going to be a challenge. If Labour has another leader it may not be one they’d meet.
It would be delightful to rid politics of the tribal element, and parties of 75% of their power.0 -
Every now and again you have to sit back in astonishment. Boris Johnson is prime minister, but doesn’t command the Commons after he lost his MPs and partner. He ploughs on in office despite it. He should have quit ages ago.
0 -
Labour loyalists defending their Brexit position showing they have no sense of humour.....Recidivist said:
Except it isn't. The referendum result was to leave, but not leave options are as good as staying. So they are going to come back with the best they can and we can choose whether we still want the coat when we've seen the cloth and the cut.0 -
Both parties are down on their 2017 vote shares. Tories by either a little bit, or a lot. Labour by either a lot, or lots and lots and lots. This suggests that both parties will be struggling to hold onto as many of their existing voters - ie voters who voted for them in 2017 - as possible, and the party that is most successful at that will win.SouthamObserver said:The interesting thing about the next election is that the Tories are going to be relying on the votes of people who are not traditional Tory voters and who are not regular voters at all. Getting them to turn out on a cold, dark December night in constituencies where the local party is not necessarily that strong is going to be a challenge. If Labour has another leader it may not be one they’d meet.
This presages one of the most divisive and polarising general elections of my lifetime. A pure core vote contest, rather than an appeal to new voters. Motivation to vote on a dark and wet December day will be generated by anger, fear and hate. An unedifying prospect.0 -
I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
But it is a commentary on how rubbish his opponents areJonathan said:Every now and again you have to sit back in astonishment. Boris Johnson is prime minister, but doesn’t command the Commons after he lost his MPs and partner. He ploughs on in office despite it. He should have quit ages ago.
0 -
The problem with Iraq from the Yellow Peril viewpoint is that they had nothing to gain by voting for it...but plenty to gain from voting against....DougSeal said:
Maybe. But at least we didn’t vote to invade Iraq. Unlike some parties.tyson said:You cannot really make up the Lib Dems......barely 10 years after their useless Cabal couldn't wait to get into their ministerial limos.....now you have the rampant opportunism of Swinson's Yellow Peril pitching to double their seats at the price of a hard right Brexit....
Maybe the party never had any integrity...but fuck me...this lot are a fucking opportunistic shower of shits.....
But this latest wheeze makes it seem like...perhaps if a coalition ministerial seat was on offer, or possibly a few extra constituencies, the LD's would quite happily gouge out the eyes of their own grandmother with a well rusted spoon....
From opposing tuition fees, to jumping in a coalition, from opposing Iraq to supporting bombing Assad...and now this latest opportunistic ploy...as said a bunch of useless twats who'll gain about 20 seats but at the next election (after) will be quite rightly obliterated for being nothing to anyone.....
0 -
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
I'm sure the differential turnout modellers will be having the heebie jeebies at the prospect of a December election.OblitusSumMe said:Motivation to vote on a dark and wet December day will be generated by anger, fear and hate. An unedifying prospect.
0 -
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
-
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Vaz though does hit a number of good set of identity politic memes...mental health, ethnicity, LGBT, legalisation of drugs and prostitution.....I think the LD''s could make good use of himNemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
-
There is no choice, without a majority for the Tories his Deal will not passrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Sort of. I am saying that ideas should be promoted by people who believe in them who should seek election seeking to implement them because they think its a good idea.DougSeal said:
Because it’s a solution that deserves consideration? Are you saying that ideas should never be considered because they are unpopular?Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
Not sure why only prominent Brexiteers should have a say. And anyway, a prominent Brexiteer supporting it is Jeremy Corbyn.
People trying to implement ideas they don't believe in is a recipe for disaster.0 -
Agreed.MarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
On current polling Corbyn is more likely to go down as the worst Labour leader of them all, Labour is currently polling even worse than 1983 under Footrottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Pollster "Oi, spod! Build a model based on factors that haven't worked in the past, combined with circumstances that haven't happened for nearly a century! Chop chop!"solarflare said:
I'm sure the differential turnout modellers will be having the heebie jeebies at the prospect of a December election.OblitusSumMe said:Motivation to vote on a dark and wet December day will be generated by anger, fear and hate. An unedifying prospect.
Modeller "Dear CityJobs.com, please find attached my CV..."0 -
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Indeed - he has so much in common with Johnson.MarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
I have just read on the guardian website that No Deal planning has cost £2 billion! That is a hell of a waste of cash. It works out at. approxiamtly £30 per person. That £2 billion could of bought a dozen or more F35 fighters for one of the aircraft carriers or paid for accomadation for the homeless or food for families who cannot make ends meet. Brexit needs to be stopped before more borrowed money is funnelled toward an option rather than an necessity....0
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It does not deserve consideration because it cannot happen. It is as much a unicorn as any extremist Brexiteer fantasy. No Deal might be terrible but it is possible. Staying in the EU CU is not possible without remaining in the EU.DougSeal said:
Because it’s a solution that deserves consideration? Are you saying that ideas should never be considered because they are unpopular?Philip_Thompson said:
Labour's policy as far as I can tell is they don't want to leave but that is the bullshit they're putting up as the alternative.DougSeal said:
I didn’t mean “your” in literally just you.Philip_Thompson said:I don't give a rats ass about immigration.
Now who is calling for out of SM but in the CU exactly? Besides Remainers trying to foist nonsense on us, can you name anyone who actually thinks this is better than either Remaining or Leaving properly?
We wouldn’t be in the (definite article) CU but we would negotiate a CU with the EU. Turkey has one. It’s an important difference and it is leaving properly as we will no longer be signatories to the EU treaties. Also keeps Unionists and Nationalists in NI happy in a way an FTA wouldn’t. Have you tried exporting anything to Canada? Hardly frictionless.
So far as I can tell this is Labour’s policy but TBF who can be sure these days.
Can you name any prominent Brexiteers who are promoting a CU as being the Brexit they want. Why would you put up a form of Brexit nobody wants, not even the people proposing it?
Not sure why only prominent Brexiteers should have a say. And anyway, a prominent Brexiteer supporting it is Jeremy Corbyn.0 -
Putting Boris before Brexit.rottenborough said:
It wouldn't have passed I hear the cries say? Well many remainers thought the opposite, and Boris never even tried.
Does fit the Boris profile though - taking the easy way out.0 -
Oh lordHYUFD said:
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
You're lovely!HYUFD said:
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Walked past Vaz the other day looking a bit vacantMarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
0 -
You know Boris cannot hear you, you could save that level of praise until he actually achieves it!HYUFD said:
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Or about six weeks of EU membership fees....The_Taxman said:I have just read on the guardian website that No Deal planning has cost £2 billion! That is a hell of a waste of cash. It works out at. approxiamtly £30 per person. That £2 billion could of bought a dozen or more F35 fighters for one of the aircraft carriers or paid for accomadation for the homeless or food for families who cannot make ends meet. Brexit needs to be stopped before more borrowed money is funnelled toward an option rather than an necessity....
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Probably thinking how to best fix his spin cycle.HYUFD said:
Walked past Vaz the other day looking a bit vacantMarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
(Is that a coat I see before me?)1 -
Wise wordskle4 said:
You know Boris cannot hear you, you could save that level of praise until he actually achieves it!HYUFD said:
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
Margaret Hodge survives deselection attempt, according to the Twitters.0
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But why should poor people who rely on benefits, and public services vote for a Neo-liberal, capitalist charlatan wanker who wants to turn the UK into a capitalist, Trump outpost of the US?philiph said:
I'm all for a lack of loyalty for all political parties.Alphabet_Soup said:
Tories are going to be relying on blow-in Labour voters in places like Warwick and Leamington switching to LibDem because they'd like to Remain. There were nearly 8000 additional Labour voters in 2017. How loyal are they likely to be? Not very, in my opinion.SouthamObserver said:The interesting thing about the next election is that the Tories are going to be relying on the votes of people who are not traditional Tory voters and who are not regular voters at all. Getting them to turn out on a cold, dark December night in constituencies where the local party is not necessarily that strong is going to be a challenge. If Labour has another leader it may not be one they’d meet.
It would be delightful to rid politics of the tribal element, and parties of 75% of their power.
I get why rich bankers vote Tory....I bet not many of these are going to jump ship....
Boris's schtick is to fool the poor he is on their side....get Brexit done....
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Labour polled 22% in the 2010 GE, they then achieved a week or two later 29%.HYUFD said:
On current polling Corbyn is more likely to go down as the worst Labour leader of them all, Labour is currently polling even worse than 1983 under Footrottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.
Your predications are lol! I would be embarrased if i was disprovern as regulary as you have been lately.0 -
"Magic 8-Ball says...'ask again later'"viewcode said:
Pollster "Oi, spod! Build a model based on factors that haven't worked in the past, combined with circumstances that haven't happened for nearly a century! Chop chop!"solarflare said:
I'm sure the differential turnout modellers will be having the heebie jeebies at the prospect of a December election.OblitusSumMe said:Motivation to vote on a dark and wet December day will be generated by anger, fear and hate. An unedifying prospect.
Modeller "Dear CityJobs.com, please find attached my CV..."0 -
I doubt that he noticed.HYUFD said:
Walked past Vaz the other day looking a bit vacantMarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
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Chickens and hatched come to mindHYUFD said:
Boris is the best Tory leader since Thatcher, as election night will prove when he wins the biggest Tory majority since Maggie!Recidivist said:
I think he's already managed that distinction by a wide margin.rottenborough said:
If he loses to Corbyn he will go down in history as the worst Tory leader of them all.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He isrottenborough said:I have said repeatedly in recent months that a GE is our system's safety valve.
It is time to go back to the people.
But, boy, Johnson is taking an enormous gamble.0 -
This!!!!
https://twitter.com/JohnRentoul/status/1188944025321201665
Yet again, those who want Brexit have chosen to block it.
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Any idea when the votes will be tomorrow or when we will find out whether Labour is willing to back an election or have to be dragged kicking and screaming? Are we going for all 3 readings tomorrow?0
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Johnson is scum to you because he has championed Brexit, got it through the referendum and when the Houe of Common is rid of the Remainer blockers, will deliver it.justin124 said:
Indeed - he has so much in common with Johnson.MarqueeMark said:
Vaz is just scum.Nemtynakht said:
It’s worse than that though - he’s despicably trying to say he has a mental illness - rightly described as ludicrous.egg said:
He should have resigned before now. How can you have that sort of judgement passed on you and not have the decency to resign?IanB2 said:
The recall process falls, if there’s a GEjustin124 said:On other matters, I do not believe Keith Vaz should be allowed to remain in Parliament. He should be recalled.
Vaz is scum because the House of Commons has investigated him and proven him to be.0
