Undefined discussion subject.

Mr. B, *sighs* You tinker.

HYUFD said:

A I showed earlier IDS' final poll as leader had the Tories on 35% and Hague got 31% and Howard got 33% so arguably he may have done slightly better than Howard rather than worse than Hague.

Brent East did for him but the Tories still came third there in 2005 under Howard (their candidate was Kwasi Kwarteng)

Perhaps there was also the realisation an election campaign against Blair and Charles Kennedy might not have played to IDS's strengths.

DavidL said:

There are a lot of things to do on Brexit but removing restrictions on the storage of data in the US with the largest and most competent tech companies in the world must surely be on the list.

Reducing data protection standards is what "Take Back Control" was all about...

Once again I make the point that for the Tories to get rid of May immediately after a general election in which more people voted for her as PM since Thatcher's 1987 landslide in seats would have been an affront to democracy, and the Tories would have been rightly lambasted, not least on here, for presenting a leader to the voters during the election, and then imposing another unelected by the voters on the country immediately afterwards.

As for Tory ruthlessness, it is the greatest ruthlessness of all to keep her on as PM while she serves their purpose and then ditching her mid term or closer to the next election and replacing her with a more electable leader.

DavidL said:

Sandpit said:

DavidL said:

DecrepitJohnL said:

DavidL said:

Stereotomy said:

DecrepitJohnL said:

The Times front page has a story about a government IT director buying Amazon cloud services and then going to work for them. The Times worries (so far as I can see because it is paywalled) about revolving door rules but there is another, unasked question.

How many US government services are hosted by British providers? I'm guessing the answer is none because of national security masking protectionism. That is a lesson our government (of either party) needs to learn.

I'm guessing none because the market leaders are all American companies.

The story is a little surprising because we have been told that the Data Commissioner requires privileged information to be stored in the EU unless you are able to immediately produce evidence that the storage out of the EU meets all EU regulations. Frankly this looks like protectionism to me too but I am not clear why this hurdle did not apply to the government.

US cloud companies (the big ones) have datacentres in Europe.

Maybe but they don't warrant that is where your data is going to be held. Of course the government is a rather more important client than me....

US government contracts specify that data servers must be physically located within the USA.

UK givernment is not allowed to do the same, they’re only allowed to specify that data is stored within the EU. Maybe your data’s in a Romanian data centre where those who monitor quality are paid off and those in charge earn €300 a month.

There are a lot of things to do on Brexit but removing restrictions on the storage of data in the US with the largest and most competent tech companies in the world must surely be on the list.

Difficult one. Obviously there’s plenty of US companies who’ll store data, but the issue is that of legal jurisdiction regarding access to it.

As an IT consultant, my question is which company do I use for data storage that can’t be disclosed to country X? To be fair most of the larger cloud providers now use encrypition good enough to defeat most government efforts.

Nigelb said:

Jonathan said:

Success in politics cannot be defined as making it to PM,not least because most people who get there make a hash of it and leave with their reputation diminished.

Yes - Eden might have had a reputation as one of the great might-have-beens, had he not actually been PM...

So Eden might have been the best might-have-been?

Benpointer said:

Nigelb said:

Jonathan said:

Success in politics cannot be defined as making it to PM,not least because most people who get there make a hash of it and leave with their reputation diminished.

Yes - Eden might have had a reputation as one of the great might-have-beens, had he not actually been PM...

So Eden might have been the best might-have-been?

He could have been a contender.

Sandpit said:

JosiasJessop said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Crickey.....

Kevin Spacey apologises over Anthony Rapp 'sexual advance' claim
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41799026

It's hardly surprising. There are going to be lots of stories coming out, with abuse and lesser offences in all directions - i.e. not just against women. The really amazing thing is that anyone's surprised given the famous casting-couch culture.

I daresay someone will be along soon to say the victims should have become hairdressers if they didn't want to be felt up by the talent ...

I still think the most interesting stories are those that haven’t come out - those of the A-list actresses and models who enthusiastically embraced the casting couch and have been introducing their young friends to the likes of Harvey Weinstein and Terry Richardson. Will they ever be considered part of the problem?

In a second you are going to realise what grooming means and then feel foolish.

Nigelb said:

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. B, *sighs* You tinker.

Apologies - that was pretty awful.

One thought on yesterday's events - was Verstappen's engine one of the very few Renaults which didn't blow up because it was the latest upgrade... or do we need to factor in the possibility of mechanical failure for him again at the next GP ?

Christian Horner insists that it’s a TAG-Heuer engine despite the engineers all over their cars in Renault shirts.

Rumours yesterday suggested the STR engine issues are related to the installation, and won’t affect the factory team or RB, but I’m sceptical.

Benpointer said:

stevef said:

Once again I make the point that for the Tories to get rid of May immediately after a general election in which more people voted for her as PM since Thatcher's 1987 landslide in seats would have been an affront to democracy, and the Tories would have been rightly lambasted, not least on here, for presenting a leader to the voters during the election, and then imposing another unelected by the voters on the country immediately afterwards.

As for Tory ruthlessness, it is the greatest ruthlessness of all to keep her on as PM while she serves their purpose and then ditching her mid term or closer to the next election and replacing her with a more electable leader.

Nothing in your first paragraph would have held though had May, as widely expected, have resigned in the Friday after the election.

It would because she was the Tory leader who millions of people had voted for. If she had resigned the next day, she and the Tory party would have been accused of foisting an unelected prime minister on the country. Can you think of a single PM in our history who has resigned the day after he or she was re-elected as PM?

Benpointer said:

stevef said:

Once again I make the point that for the Tories to get rid of May immediately after a general election in which more people voted for her as PM since Thatcher's 1987 landslide in seats would have been an affront to democracy, and the Tories would have been rightly lambasted, not least on here, for presenting a leader to the voters during the election, and then imposing another unelected by the voters on the country immediately afterwards.

As for Tory ruthlessness, it is the greatest ruthlessness of all to keep her on as PM while she serves their purpose and then ditching her mid term or closer to the next election and replacing her with a more electable leader.

Nothing in your first paragraph would have held though had May, as widely expected, have resigned in the Friday after the election.

She and the Tories would have been accused of foisting an unelected PM on the country. Can you name me a single PM in 400 years who has resigned the day after he or she has been re-elected as PM?

Alistair said:

Sandpit said:

JosiasJessop said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Crickey.....

Kevin Spacey apologises over Anthony Rapp 'sexual advance' claim
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41799026

It's hardly surprising. There are going to be lots of stories coming out, with abuse and lesser offences in all directions - i.e. not just against women. The really amazing thing is that anyone's surprised given the famous casting-couch culture.

I daresay someone will be along soon to say the victims should have become hairdressers if they didn't want to be felt up by the talent ...

I still think the most interesting stories are those that haven’t come out - those of the A-list actresses and models who enthusiastically embraced the casting couch and have been introducing their young friends to the likes of Harvey Weinstein and Terry Richardson. Will they ever be considered part of the problem?

In a second you are going to realise what grooming means and then feel foolish.

The question remains the same - will the famous female groomers of young women to powerful men be sufficiently vilified?

TGOHF said:

Jezza looking dafter by the week

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/815836/jeremy-corbyn-prime-minister-by-christmas

'I could be in No 10 by Christmas' Jeremy Corbyn insists he can oust Theresa May.

"GLOATING Jeremy Corbyn today insisted that he could be prime minister by Christmas."

Can we bet on that?

He does know that the DUP abstaining gives the Tories a majority of the MPs who take their seats?

Morris_Dancer said:

F1: blimey. Betfair already has the 2018 title markets up.

Not really got going yet. Put down 230 for Alonso.

Interestingly, Ladbrokes, which also has a market, has McLaren and Renault drivers shorter than Force India. It's a shame the latter don't have a bit more cash.

I think it's too soon for Renault. They need a bit more time, in my view. None of the Ladbrokes odds tempt me at the moment.

Edited extra bit: I should clarify, those are the odds, not my stake, on Alonso

The BBC this am seemed to have gone into Lewis Hamilton overdrive (not as good as the Bachman Turner sort), suggesting that Hamilton could equal Schumacher's record of 7 titles by 2020. Shades of English footie team chicken counting hype?

Not that I'm suggesting Hamilton isn't vastly more capable than the current English football team.

TGOHF said:

Jezza looking dafter by the week

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/815836/jeremy-corbyn-prime-minister-by-christmas

'I could be in No 10 by Christmas' Jeremy Corbyn insists he can oust Theresa May.

"GLOATING Jeremy Corbyn today insisted that he could be prime minister by Christmas."

You're quoting an article from June 11th - I don't think it was beyond the realms of possibility at that point, with the Tories yet to agree a deal with the DUP.

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. L, why wouldn't I be able to say that?

Mr. B, hard to say on the engine front. A similar thing happened at the preceding race too, so it seems the new version might be more reliable.

Mr. L (2), Not sure about the odds. If the Renault engine is competitive and reliable enough that adds Alonso into the mix.

It may be a regional thing. Here a tinker is a name for an itinerant person, typically a Gypsy, of doubtful honesty and reliability. Using it as an abusive term is arguably racist and evidence of racial stereotyping in a way that may have problems with the Equality Act. Having looked it up online I see in other areas it is used to describe a mischievous child which is certainly consistent with your use.

Mr. Divvie, I must concur with Mr. Sandpit's reaction (backed Hamilton to win SPOTY) so if the BBC want to go overboard, and you're probably right, that's fine by me.

Mr. L, hmm. You're still a tinker

Benpointer said:

TGOHF said:

Jezza looking dafter by the week

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/815836/jeremy-corbyn-prime-minister-by-christmas

'I could be in No 10 by Christmas' Jeremy Corbyn insists he can oust Theresa May.

"GLOATING Jeremy Corbyn today insisted that he could be prime minister by Christmas."

You're quoting an article from June 11th - I don't think it was beyond the realms of possibility at that point, with the Tories yet to agree a deal with the DUP.

And not long after that a senior Tory MP told me more or less the same thing.

Sandpit said:

UK givernment is not allowed to do the same, they’re only allowed to specify that data is stored within the EU. Maybe your data’s in a Romanian data centre where those who monitor quality are paid off and those in charge earn €300 a month.

This is yet another Brexit scare story. Bidding must be open to all, but the final decision is up to the buyer. UK government departments invariably host with either UK-based providers or Amazon/Microsoft.

EU data protection rules a) protect EU citizens from misuse of data and b) help level the playing field for EU-based data centres including UK SMEs - but still, HMRC recently helped one go under by switching a big contract to Amazon. Expect more of that if rules are loosened after Brexit.

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Morris_Dancer said:

F1: blimey. Betfair already has the 2018 title markets up.

Not really got going yet. Put down 230 for Alonso.

Interestingly, Ladbrokes, which also has a market, has McLaren and Renault drivers shorter than Force India. It's a shame the latter don't have a bit more cash.

I think it's too soon for Renault. They need a bit more time, in my view. None of the Ladbrokes odds tempt me at the moment.

Edited extra bit: I should clarify, those are the odds, not my stake, on Alonso

The BBC this am seemed to have gone into Lewis Hamilton overdrive (not as good as the Bachman Turner sort), suggesting that Hamilton could equal Schumacher's record of 7 titles by 2020. Shades of English footie team chicken counting hype?

Not that I'm suggesting Hamilton isn't vastly more capable than the current English football team.

Good news - I’m on Lewis for SPOTY at 10/1.

It does seem like Hamilton is the current default go-to for SPOTY when no one else shines. Only other person i can think of is Chris Froome for winning the TDF

Sandpit said:

https://order-order.com/2017/10/30/vince-cables-stunning-harassment-hypocrisy/Vince Cable seems to have conveniently forgotten about Chris Rennard.

He handled it as well as he could have done on Pienaar yesterday. No story really.

Alistair said:

Theuniondivvie said:

SandyRentool said:

Sugartitsgate is the perfect dead cat for May to distract everyone's attention from the Brexit negotiations.

Expect more to come out on budget day.

Not working out so well for others.

https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/924772675087687680

Ruth making jokes about receiving risqué text messages from Crabb seems like a less good idea now.

She also seems to be messaging people who pointed out she was a strong supporter of Crabb to try and get them to retract or something.

https://twitter.com/lauraewaddell/status/924761496957194241

Slick SCon PR machine not oiled enough, or too well oiled? Maybe it wasn't that slick in the first place.

DavidL said:

AlastairMeeks said:

I expect that there are quite a few men in the public eye who are feeling rather nervous today.

We’re going on a bear witch hunt. I’m not scared.

Maybe.

Personally, if I'd made a drunken pass at a 14 year old boy in my bedroom, I think I'd remember it even at 30 years' distance.

If there are 36 Conservative male MPs of whom complaints have been made by Commons workers, that's just under 15% of all Conservative male MPs. It's legitimate to talk about a real culture problem (which may not just be a Conservative problem of course).

Nigelb said:

PClipp said:

MarqueeMark said:

Theresa May is safe until a) she decides she's had enough or b) Brexit looks like it will have an OK resolution. Otherwise, why would you agitiate to get the top job - and walk straight into a kicking from the voters? Being remembered as the shortest ever PM who let in Jeremy Corbyn - and consequently, facilitated the UK's biggest ever economic disaster - hardly an attractive epitaph is it, Boris?
Theresa May: on and on..... Nailed on.

I rather thought were were already facing the UK`s biggest ever economic disaster... 100% home-made by the Conservative Party...

I think the electorate need to take a little of the responsibility ?
No good voting for Brexit and then complaining, should it kill growth for a few years (though it's entirely fair to say the current lot are making a horlicks of the negotiations with the EU). And you can't entirely blame the government for the continuing rise in household debt.

I accept that, up to a point. However, it was the stupid Conservatives who set up the Brexit referendum, with a meaningless question, which left room for any number of damaging interpretations afterwards - and all to keep together the unholy alliance which is the Conservative Party.

They would have done better to grasp the nettle years ago, and decide whether they were a progressive party with an international outlook and a growing economy; or a party still yearning for Victorian social values, and an unfounded belief in their own entitlement. And then split.

We might then have had a proper re-alignment of British politics. Instead we have two over-large unstable coalitions masquerading as Labour and Conservatives. And when it comes to election time, they both fight on both sides of the argument. And we end up with the most unstable government anybody could ever imagine.

In kinder, gentler news:
https://twitter.com/Tim_R_Dawson/status/924611858547576832

https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/924938993497788417

TheScreamingEagles said:

https://twitter.com/LopezOnSports/status/924772252595433473

Doesn’t say where they hyphen was intended to go!

OldKingCole said:

Benpointer said:

AlastairMeeks said:

If there are 36 Conservative male MPs of whom complaints have been made by Commons workers, that's just under 15% of all Conservative male MPs. It's legitimate to talk about a real culture problem (which may not just be a Conservative problem of course).

Anyone else think this could lead to a number of by-elections over the next 12-18 months?

Just like expenses didn’t!

Garnier has support of his constituency assoc apparently.

OldKingCole said:

Benpointer said:

AlastairMeeks said:

If there are 36 Conservative male MPs of whom complaints have been made by Commons workers, that's just under 15% of all Conservative male MPs. It's legitimate to talk about a real culture problem (which may not just be a Conservative problem of course).

Anyone else think this could lead to a number of by-elections over the next 12-18 months?

Just like expenses didn’t!

Expenses did lead to a few by elections, when the MPs were convicted.

Actually thinking about it, the recall law could trigger a few by elections without the need for criminal convictions.

TheScreamingEagles said:

OldKingCole said:

Benpointer said:

AlastairMeeks said:

If there are 36 Conservative male MPs of whom complaints have been made by Commons workers, that's just under 15% of all Conservative male MPs. It's legitimate to talk about a real culture problem (which may not just be a Conservative problem of course).

Anyone else think this could lead to a number of by-elections over the next 12-18 months?

Just like expenses didn’t!

Expenses did lead to a few by elections, when the MPs were convicted.

True, but I was thinking of the last round! Election expenses.

OldKingCole said:

Benpointer said:

AlastairMeeks said:

If there are 36 Conservative male MPs of whom complaints have been made by Commons workers, that's just under 15% of all Conservative male MPs. It's legitimate to talk about a real culture problem (which may not just be a Conservative problem of course).

Anyone else think this could lead to a number of by-elections over the next 12-18 months?

Just like expenses didn’t!

But only because the next GE was bound to happen within a year. More than 20 MPs across the parties agreed to stand down or were deselected for the next election.

AlastairMeeks said:

DavidL said:

AlastairMeeks said:

I expect that there are quite a few men in the public eye who are feeling rather nervous today.

We’re going on a bear witch hunt. I’m not scared.

Personally, if I'd made a drunken pass at a 14 year old boy in my bedroom, I think I'd remember it even at 30 years' distance.

Unless it was a not-uncommon event.......I think it's fair to say that in seeking to dig himself out of one hole, Mr Spacey has dug himself another one.....

They've really gone too far now.

'You know, Radiohead is a fine band, but they stole everything from Coldplay. Like Radiohead is the poor man's Coldplay.'

http://tinyurl.com/yauuyonp

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Eagles, hmm. Didn't even realise the recall law went through. How does it work? 10,000 condemnatory tweets triggers a by-election?

The Bill provides for a recall petition to be triggered if a Member is sentenced to a prison term or is suspended from the House for at least 21 sitting days. If either occurred, the Speaker would give notice to a petition officer, who in turn would give notice to parliamentary electors in the constituency.

A petition would then be open for signing for eight weeks. If at the end of that period at least 10 per cent of eligible electors had signed the petition, the seat would be declared vacant and a by-election would follow. The Member who was recalled could stand in the by-election.

https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2014-15/recallofmps.html

Slackbladder said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Morris_Dancer said:

F1: blimey. Betfair already has the 2018 title markets up.

Not really got going yet. Put down 230 for Alonso.

Interestingly, Ladbrokes, which also has a market, has McLaren and Renault drivers shorter than Force India. It's a shame the latter don't have a bit more cash.

I think it's too soon for Renault. They need a bit more time, in my view. None of the Ladbrokes odds tempt me at the moment.

Edited extra bit: I should clarify, those are the odds, not my stake, on Alonso

The BBC this am seemed to have gone into Lewis Hamilton overdrive (not as good as the Bachman Turner sort), suggesting that Hamilton could equal Schumacher's record of 7 titles by 2020. Shades of English footie team chicken counting hype?

Not that I'm suggesting Hamilton isn't vastly more capable than the current English football team.

Good news - I’m on Lewis for SPOTY at 10/1.

It does seem like Hamilton is the current default go-to for SPOTY when no one else shines. Only other person i can think of is Chris Froome for winning the TDF

Isn't there some boxer or other as well ?

Mr. Eagles, that actually sounds relatively sensible. Cheers.

Hollywood or Dagenham? Seems an unlikely choice, but see:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/30/hollywood-plot-thickens-dagenham-film-studio-london-sadiq-khan

PClipp said:

Nigelb said:

PClipp said:

MarqueeMark said:

Theresa May is safe until a) she decides she's had enough or b) Brexit looks like it will have an OK resolution. Otherwise, why would you agitiate to get the top job - and walk straight into a kicking from the voters? Being remembered as the shortest ever PM who let in Jeremy Corbyn - and consequently, facilitated the UK's biggest ever economic disaster - hardly an attractive epitaph is it, Boris?
Theresa May: on and on..... Nailed on.

I rather thought were were already facing the UK`s biggest ever economic disaster... 100% home-made by the Conservative Party...

I think the electorate need to take a little of the responsibility ?
No good voting for Brexit and then complaining, should it kill growth for a few years (though it's entirely fair to say the current lot are making a horlicks of the negotiations with the EU). And you can't entirely blame the government for the continuing rise in household debt.

I accept that, up to a point. However, it was the stupid Conservatives who set up the Brexit referendum, with a meaningless question, which left room for any number of damaging interpretations afterwards - and all to keep together the unholy alliance which is the Conservative Party.

They would have done better to grasp the nettle years ago, and decide whether they were a progressive party with an international outlook and a growing economy; or a party still yearning for Victorian social values, and an unfounded belief in their own entitlement. And then split.

We might then have had a proper re-alignment of British politics. Instead we have two over-large unstable coalitions masquerading as Labour and Conservatives. And when it comes to election time, they both fight on both sides of the argument. And we end up with the most unstable government anybody could ever imagine.

Quite - it was only the '100%' bit I objected to. That seems to let the electorate off way too lightly from any responsibility for the consequences of their votes.

Mr. B, any idea why Joshua's odds are so short?

WSJ:

https://twitter.com/leedrutman/status/924708445521108992

Sandpit said:

TOPPING said:

Sandpit said:

https://order-order.com/2017/10/30/vince-cables-stunning-harassment-hypocrisy/Vince Cable seems to have conveniently forgotten about Chris Rennard.

He handled it as well as he could have done on Pienaar yesterday. No story really.

Why is it no story that the party leader’s out campaigning with a known sex pest?

That could mean some small campaigning teams!

I have no idea of the recent history (which means no one anywhere will have any idea) and VC said, twice: he is not a part of my team.

Economic with the actualite? Who knows but he batted it away ok enough for me.

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. B, any idea why Joshua's odds are so short?

Because he is a cheeky chappy, he calls it as he sees it, he gets all the dynamics around boxing and his division, and the most frequent object of his criticism is himself.

As to the boxing side, well as they say he can only beat what's in front of him and he has done that to date.

Perhaps someone can name me a prime minister who who was forced to resign by his or her party just day, or weeks or months after being re-elected by the voters as prime minister. You have 400 years worth of prime ministers to choose from.

Trump's awake. Something about DNC funding on his tweet feed.