politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » There’s an argument for saying that REMAINers feel more strong
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I'm no more a strong or weak Leaver than I would be a strong or weak Labour Party supporter after a Labour GE victory (remember those?).
With both our Leave decision and a Lab govt I disagree with the direction we are pursuing, believe it will impoverish many, and that especially those who are least able to withstand the economic hit will be hit hardest. And it will all be done in the name of a fallacious ideal because in actual fact, aside from the impoverishment, nothing much will change.
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Everyone is fretting over May meeting Trump - what be more useful is her meeting with senior GOP leaders today.....0
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Or be more sensible, allow people to express their personal views on the EU and to vote in accordance with them. Result when tried in the past: a free debate before the 1975 referendum (Castle, Benn and Shore vs. Callaghan and Healey with Wilson staying above the fray). Relative party unity afterwards.Blue_rog said:
so, sack and withdraw the whipScott_P said:@jessicaelgot: I understand there are at least two shadow cabinet members who are seriously considering defying Labour's three line whip on Article 50 bill
'Three line whips' imply that MPs can't be allowed to think for themselves.0 -
Yet the EU share of global trade is shrinking rapidly. Its share has shrunk by a fifth in just 20 years. And that is in spite of the population growth you mention.swing_voter said:The EU as a trading bloc is a dead dog is a far too sweeping statement. as a trading bloc it is growing in terms of members and size - think of the achievements of the last 12 years - massive population growth (accession of Poland, Romania for example) and some cases of huge growth (Slovakia), to top it all a club that people want to join (Turkey). Sweeping generalisations about Asia (which part - Japan, India or Indonesia?) are you referring to - none of which are at all interested in free trade as we know it. To typify the EU as a dead dog is a gross simplification - it has its problems but a lack of expansion is not one of them
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Technically, yes. Practically, it'd be difficult to explain why the PM shouldn't have the power to implement the decision of the people and parliament. And of course, if a PM did invoke A50 after some theoretical and currently-unplanned second referendum reversed the first, it's highly likely that the PM wouldn't last the week in office.williamglenn said:
Also, if we ended up not leaving, is this a permanent power grab by the PM that would allow them to invoke Article 50 on a whim at any time in the future?rkrkrk said:So the act gives PM the right to invoke A50. Not sure whether it's important- but that does mean that she could decide to delay invoking if she felt she needed more time.
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Yes it is. Sure we have good access to 440 million* potential customers but that provides a cap on our trading potential that we can bilaterally negotiate. Outside the confines of the EU there are 7 billion people in this world so why should we only have access to 7% of them?SouthamObserver said:Almost all countries and trading blocs are protectionist - and will continue to be so. The Single Market is where we send over 40% of our exports. That may change over time, but it will not do so rapidly. And being a part of it means that all times - whatever happens elsewhere - we have full access to over 500 million potential customers. That is a good place from which to start and we will get nothing like it from any other trading arrangement we may negotiate. I accept that there are good reasons to leave the EU, but improving our trading potential is not one of them.
The US single market is worth more than the entire rEU altogether. If we can get a deal with the EU AND a deal with America we will have more than doubled our potential customer base in a single stroke. That is before we do deals with anyone else.
* It is only 500 million if you include us. Regardless of an in or our hokey pokey we will always have access to ourselves.0 -
The numbers do not lie.Pulpstar said:
Sorry but this reminds me of the whole "Texas trending Democrat" situation in the USA.Richard_Tyndall said:
The EU as a trading bloc is a dead dog. It is a very mature market where the chances of radically increasing trade are extremely limited. Asia is the big emerging market and Africa will follow suit eventually. the EU will be left far behind as a protectionist backwater.SouthamObserver said:
The Germans are certainly gearing up for American aggression, but the Single Market shields them somewhat. And by pulling out of Asia, Trump leaves the way open for the EU. This is his problem with the EU - as a trading bloc it has the heft to cause problems to his America First policies. Far, far better for him to have Europe as a collection of individual countries that the US can dictate to. That's why he is such a fan of Brexit, of course: isolated, the UK will have to take whatever trade deal the US tells us to, or we will get nothing at all.SeanT said:
No, I don't think it's anything as complex or grand as that. I doubt he has a real opinion on the EU either way, apart from thinking it doesn't work very well, and the Merkel migrant thing was massively stupid (and he's right on both counts).SouthamObserver said:
He wants to destroy the EU. If he can get at Germany he is more likely to achieve this. It would, of course, be catastrophic for the UK economy were that to happen.SeanT said:Does Trump have a grudge against Germany?
https://twitter.com/JGForsyth/status/824564320176594945
Remember he's a rampant, frothing narcissist. I reckon he's just insulted that the Germans have been so cool to him, even after the inauguration. Whereas the Brits have changed their tune.
That said, President Trump can turn personal grudges into geopolitical strategies, and he does, so the Germans can possibly expect hostile actions.0 -
A very good point. Given the whole Supreme Court case, if the Bill is passed as written, a PM would have the power to invoke A50 but not to revoke notification, irrespective of the result of the Irish court case.rkrkrk said:
I thought it would be to invoke article 50... But it's actually to give the PM the power to do so.SandyRentool said:
Well that is definitely the first time I have read a government Bill from start to finish!dr_spyn said:Bill on Article 50.
https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/824592972574584833
Maybe that doesn't matter.
It's also written in such a way that if it turns out a50 is reversible... It doesn't say PM has the power to reverse it?0 -
Cos we sell nothing to the USA now.Philip_Thompson said:The US single market is worth more than the entire rEU altogether. If we can get a deal with the EU AND a deal with America we will have more than doubled our potential customer base in a single stroke.
Oh, wait...
More economic illiteracy from the Brexiteers0 -
Why? Either she risks being drawn into inter-GOP intrigue against Trump on behalf of the pro-NATO, anti-Russia wing, or she risks being asked to make commitments that she can't back up. There's not much upside for her either way.CarlottaVance said:Everyone is fretting over May meeting Trump - what be more useful is her meeting with senior GOP leaders today.....
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As discussed yesterday, the Supreme Court case recognises the Government right to make deals, just not undo themdavid_herdson said:A very good point. Given the whole Supreme Court case, if the Bill is passed as written, a PM would have the power to invoke A50 but not to revoke notification, irrespective of the result of the Irish court case.
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Nominal GDP:
USA $16.7 trillion
EU (excluding UK) $14.1 trillion
Why should we turn our nose up at the bigger prize? Before anyone says PPP trade happens with real money not PPP.0 -
@BethRigby: NEW Tulip Siddiq tells me she'll resign from front bench if 3 line whip. MPs saying Clive Lewis/Cat Smith/Dawn Butler/Jo Stevens'll quit too0
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Theresa needs to be careful here. I've often felt that the moment that Maggie passed her noon was when she allowed the US to bomb Libya from British air bases. Regardless of the rights or wrongs, a powerful part of here magic was lost that day. If Theresa is too craven, then it will easy for her enemies to paint any trade deal with Trump as a humiliating capitulation. That in turn will demolish one of principal intellectual pillars of Brexit. The reputations of both Theresa and Brexit are on the line.williamglenn said:0 -
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Here's another to double your quotient (topping and tailing elided for brevity):SandyRentool said:
Well that is definitely the first time I have read a government Bill from start to finish!
1 Capacity of women to be members of Parliament.
A woman shall not be disqualified by sex or marriage for being elected to or sitting or voting as a Member of the Commons House of Parliament.
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I'd much rather a power grab by a PM than a power grab by your beloved Euro federalists.williamglenn said:
Also, if we ended up not leaving, is this a permanent power grab by the PM that would allow them to invoke Article 50 on a whim at any time in the future?rkrkrk said:So the act gives PM the right to invoke A50. Not sure whether it's important- but that does mean that she could decide to delay invoking if she felt she needed more time.
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I do love Alan Whicker
BBC Archive
It's #AustraliaDay! Lesser social accounts might resort to lazy stereotype, but not us. Here are some kangaroos, koalas and a platypus... https://t.co/bvTPG5H7ux0 -
Blairites.Scott_P said:@BethRigby: NEW Tulip Siddiq tells me she'll resign from front bench if 3 line whip. MPs saying Clive Lewis/Cat Smith/Dawn Butler/Jo Stevens'll quit too
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FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.
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We have trade access to every single country in the world now. We are not going to get single market access to the US. We are not going to get anything like the deal we currently get from the Single Market with anyone else anywhere.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes it is. Sure we have good access to 440 million* potential customers but that provides a cap on our trading potential that we can bilaterally negotiate. Outside the confines of the EU there are 7 billion people in this world so why should we only have access to 7% of them?SouthamObserver said:Almost all countries and trading blocs are protectionist - and will continue to be so. The Single Market is where we send over 40% of our exports. That may change over time, but it will not do so rapidly. And being a part of it means that all times - whatever happens elsewhere - we have full access to over 500 million potential customers. That is a good place from which to start and we will get nothing like it from any other trading arrangement we may negotiate. I accept that there are good reasons to leave the EU, but improving our trading potential is not one of them.
The US single market is worth more than the entire rEU altogether. If we can get a deal with the EU AND a deal with America we will have more than doubled our potential customer base in a single stroke. That is before we do deals with anyone else.
* It is only 500 million if you include us. Regardless of an in or our hokey pokey we will always have access to ourselves.
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I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.0 -
Also Republic Day in India...PlatoSaid said:I do love Alan Whicker
BBC Archive
It's #AustraliaDay! Lesser social accounts might resort to lazy stereotype, but not us. Here are some kangaroos, koalas and a platypus... https://t.co/bvTPG5H7ux0 -
I'm afraid the economic illiteracy is to believe that we will get anything close to resembling the Single Market in any deal that we negotiate with any country from here-on-in. I do think that is important to have a strong home market for goods and services, and to go from there. Quite why you don't is beyond me.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yet another economic illiterate who thinks that 7% of the world's population should be more important for our future trade prospects than the other 93%. Membership of the EU actively hinders trade with the rest of the world. Being outside the Single Market will not significantly change the amount of trade we do with them but will allow us to make our own trade deals with the rest of the world.SouthamObserver said:
Almost all countries and trading blocs are protectionist - and will continue to be so. The Single Market is where we send over 40% of our exports. That may change over time, but it will not do so rapidly. And being a part of it means that all times - whatever happens elsewhere - we have full access to over 500 million potential customers. That is a good place from which to start and we will get nothing like it from any other trading arrangement we may negotiate. I accept that there are good reasons to leave the EU, but improving our trading potential is not one of them.
In 20 years the EU's share of global trade has dropped from 30% to 24% and it will continue to shrink.
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Would not notifying of a revocation, without explicit authorisation, be a prerogative act against the wishes of parliament as expressed in legislation? Surely that's exactly what the case was about?Scott_P said:
As discussed yesterday, the Supreme Court case recognises the Government right to make deals, just not undo themdavid_herdson said:A very good point. Given the whole Supreme Court case, if the Bill is passed as written, a PM would have the power to invoke A50 but not to revoke notification, irrespective of the result of the Irish court case.
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Malloch was an adviser to the IEA wasn't he?SeanT said:
No, I don't think it's anything as complex or grand as that. I doubt he has a real opinion on the EU either way, apart from thinking it doesn't work very well, and the Merkel migrant thing was massively stupid (and he's right on both counts).SouthamObserver said:
He wants to destroy the EU. If he can get at Germany he is more likely to achieve this. It would, of course, be catastrophic for the UK economy were that to happen.SeanT said:Does Trump have a grudge against Germany?
https://twitter.com/JGForsyth/status/824564320176594945
Remember he's a rampant, frothing narcissist. I reckon he's just insulted that the Germans have been so cool to him, even after the inauguration. Whereas the Brits have changed their tune.
That said, President Trump can turn personal grudges into geopolitical strategies, and he does, so the Germans can possibly expect hostile actions.
If so he probably has pretty strong views on the Greek bailout regardless of Trump0 -
Cos we sell nothing to the EU post-Brexit.Scott_P said:
Cos we sell nothing to the USA now.Philip_Thompson said:The US single market is worth more than the entire rEU altogether. If we can get a deal with the EU AND a deal with America we will have more than doubled our potential customer base in a single stroke.
Oh, wait...
More economic illiteracy from the Brexiteers
Oh, wait...
More economic illiteracy from the Remoaners.
Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU. You can't have your cake and eat it.0 -
Well, they say travel broadens the mind.SeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.0 -
Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.. 0 -
It's a funny old world to be sure. Today we have before us, for our entertainment, the curious spectacle of Jeremy Corbyn being sensible over Article 50, whereas some of the nominally moderate and reasonable Labour MPs are threatening to vote against implementing the result of a referendum which they themselves voted for.0
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As already noted, not all deals are equal.Philip_Thompson said:Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU.
We are throwing away the best deal we will ever have in the vain hope of picking up scraps from Trump's table.
Good deals are meaningful, crap deals are all we will have left.0 -
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
I trust it was off-limits except to prefects.John_M said:
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite..0 -
I guess it depends at what stage the other legislation is at. Revocation after the Repeal Bill had passed would require explicit authorisation, but before then I don't see that it would.david_herdson said:
Would not notifying of a revocation, without explicit authorisation, be a prerogative act against the wishes of parliament as expressed in legislation? Surely that's exactly what the case was about?Scott_P said:
As discussed yesterday, the Supreme Court case recognises the Government right to make deals, just not undo themdavid_herdson said:A very good point. Given the whole Supreme Court case, if the Bill is passed as written, a PM would have the power to invoke A50 but not to revoke notification, irrespective of the result of the Irish court case.
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Tristam Hunt is well out of it.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
Does he think that's funny?Scott_P said:0 -
We may end up being able to export more high-quality cheese to the US. Surely that is enough. Rejoice.Scott_P said:
As already noted, not all deals are equal.Philip_Thompson said:Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU.
We are throwing away the best deal we will ever have in the vain hope of picking up scraps from Trump's table.
Good deals are meaningful, crap deals are all we will have left.
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Were the employees male or female?John_M said:
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite..0 -
Travel just broadens the arse....rottenborough said:
Well, they say travel broadens the mind.SeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.0 -
Speaking?John_M said:
Here's another to double your quotient (topping and tailing elided for brevity):SandyRentool said:
Well that is definitely the first time I have read a government Bill from start to finish!
1 Capacity of women to be members of Parliament.
A woman shall not be disqualified by sex or marriage for being elected to or sitting or voting as a Member of the Commons House of Parliament.0 -
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He can't afford to lose any. Cat Smith, Dawn Butler, Clive Lewis, they're HIS people. Lose them and he has no MP support.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
It will be interesting to see which MPs carry out their threat to resign. – Zero?rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
I once went to a fascinating place in Casablanca that, over the course of several hours, went from being a restaurant to a venue for a band to a dance-hall to a brothel.SeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.
It seemed to be a very successful business model.0 -
All girls. I'm trying to think of a delicate way to express the reason, but good taste (and my vague hope of not alienating every last woman who posts here) dictates otherwise.Sean_F said:
Were the employees male or female?John_M said:
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite..0 -
Not sure that one's going to fly now that Wisconsin is a key swing state.SouthamObserver said:
We may end up being able to export more high-quality cheese to the US. Surely that is enough. Rejoice.Scott_P said:
As already noted, not all deals are equal.Philip_Thompson said:Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU.
We are throwing away the best deal we will ever have in the vain hope of picking up scraps from Trump's table.
Good deals are meaningful, crap deals are all we will have left.0 -
Clive Lewis since his nuclear speech does seem to be drifting away.Artist said:
He can't afford to lose any. Cat Smith, Dawn Butler, Clive Lewis, they're HIS people. Lose them and he has no MP support.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
Fulfilling Ampleforth's obligation to provide a rounded education to its pupils?John_M said:
All girls. I'm trying to think of a delicate way to express the reason, but good taste (and my vague hope of not alienating every last woman who posts here) dictates otherwise.Sean_F said:
Were the employees male or female?John_M said:
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite..0 -
The Izmailovo in Moscow (ex-Olympic village athletes' accomodation), has a strip club too. Also the third floor, Gamma block, IIRC. Didn't ask about other services.SeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite.0 -
He obviously enjoys leadership elections.rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
@BBCPhilipSim: ScotGov pressing ahead to apply to Presiding Officer for Holyrood consent motion on Article50 bill. Say A50 clearly impacts on devolved govt0
-
Yes not all deals are equal. I suspect a deal with America won't entail Americans being able to unilaterally change our laws on everything from employment rights to standards despite how those we elect in Britain vote.Scott_P said:
As already noted, not all deals are equal.Philip_Thompson said:Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU.
We are throwing away the best deal we will ever have in the vain hope of picking up scraps from Trump's table.
Good deals are meaningful, crap deals are all we will have left.0 -
Yep. It's all rather good, isn't it?Artist said:
He can't afford to lose any. Cat Smith, Dawn Butler, Clive Lewis, they're HIS people. Lose them and he has no MP support.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!
0 -
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)0 -
They can say as they please, but the Supreme Court didn't support them.Scott_P said:@BBCPhilipSim: ScotGov pressing ahead to apply to Presiding Officer for Holyrood consent motion on Article50 bill. Say A50 clearly impacts on devolved govt
0 -
That will do nicelyCharles said:
Fulfilling Ampleforth's obligation to provide a rounded education to its pupils?John_M said:
All girls. I'm trying to think of a delicate way to express the reason, but good taste (and my vague hope of not alienating every last woman who posts here) dictates otherwise.Sean_F said:
Were the employees male or female?John_M said:
There used to be a small brothel in Ampleforth, down on Mill Lane iirc. Can't think whySeanT said:
I once stayed in a hotel in Minsk which had its very own official strip bar and brothel on the third floor.david_herdson said:
I'm fairly sure there is (or was) a hotel in Toulouse that could give it a run for its money, which we stayed in during RWC2007. Arrived back after a match. One bar, three stools, three hookers. Walked on.Charles said:FPT @SeanT
Don't go there. Go to the Plaza Athenee (or Le Meurice). Georges Cinq is pretentious and caters to Middle Eastern taste. Plaza has the most hookers per square foot of any hotel in the WestSeanT said:
Funnily enough, I am actually in Paris for a week or so in March, where my French publishers are launching the new S K Tremayne, La Menace, and they want me to do publicity, signings etc. Le Doute (the Ice Twins) was a big hit over there.
https://www.amazon.fr/S-K-Tremayne/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i:aps,k:S.K. Tremayne
i think they're putting me up in the George V or something ridiculous. I'll let you know if I get any perspective from my suite... 0 -
It's the kind of "joke" you'd expect from Sandi Toksvig.SeanT said:
It's just kind of .... sad. Obviously clever people reduced to this gibberish.Sean_F said:
Does he think that's funny?Scott_P said:
The Remoaners must now be at Kubler Ross Grief stage 94: Run into the streets naked pouring jelly on your head while singing Joy Division's Atmosphere, then chop your own goolies off with a fishknife.0 -
Article 50 has an impact on Suffolk County Council but I don't see it presuming that its consent is required.Scott_P said:@BBCPhilipSim: ScotGov pressing ahead to apply to Presiding Officer for Holyrood consent motion on Article50 bill. Say A50 clearly impacts on devolved govt
0 -
I can think of many more Labour MPs who should be in museums frankly.rottenborough said:
Tristam Hunt is well out of it.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
"Walk, in silence....ow, that fuckin' hurts!"SeanT said:
It's just kind of .... sad. Obviously clever people reduced to this gibberish.Sean_F said:
Does he think that's funny?Scott_P said:
The Remoaners must now be at Kubler Ross Grief stage 94: Run into the streets naked pouring jelly on your head while singing Joy Division's Atmosphere, then chop your own goolies off with a fishknife.0 -
Ah, is today another 'Despite Brexit' day?
0 -
Jeez - a roll call of quality in the modern Labour party - pathetic.Artist said:
He can't afford to lose any. Cat Smith, Dawn Butler, Clive Lewis, they're HIS people. Lose them and he has no MP support.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
There is an obvious joke about dippy having created a vacancy at the Natural History Museum but I can't quite make it work.felix said:
I can think of many more Labour MPs who should be in museums frankly.rottenborough said:
Tristam Hunt is well out of it.GarethoftheVale2 said:
You wouldn't think Corbyn could afford to lose any more ministers. Back to Paul Flynn double hatting I guess...rottenborough said:Labour - 3 line whip says Corbyn on Sky.
Kaboom!!!0 -
Since the EU started the % of our exports to other EU countries has steadily fallen at a rate of circa 1 percentage point a year, dropping to a headline of 44% in 2015. It accelerated down with the Lisbon Treaty. There is also the Rotterdam effect of transhipment which inflates the EU share of our exports by at least 2 percentage points even according to the ONS. We will therefore soon be under 40% and on a trend line to a real 30% level, even if we did not have the referendum vote and Brexit.SouthamObserver said:
Almost all countries and trading blocs are protectionist - and will continue to be so. The Single Market is where we send over 40% of our exports. That may change over time, but it will not do so rapidly. ....Richard_Tyndall said:
The EU as a trading bloc is a dead dog. It is a very mature market where the chances of radically increasing trade are extremely limited. Asia is the big emerging market and Africa will follow suit eventually. the EU will be left far behind as a protectionist backwater.SouthamObserver said:
The Germans are certainly gearing up for American aggression, but the Single Market shields them somewhat. And by pulling out of Asia, Trump leaves the way open for the EU. This is his problem with the EU - as a trading bloc it has the heft to cause problems to his America First policies. Far, far better for him to have Europe as a collection of individual countries that the US can dictate to. That's why he is such a fan of Brexit, of course: isolated, the UK will have to take whatever trade deal the US tells us to, or we will get nothing at all.SeanT said:
No, I don't think it's anything as complex or grand as that. I doubt he has a real opinion on the EU either way, apart from thinking it doesn't work very well, and the Merkel migrant thing was massively stupid (and he's right on both counts).SouthamObserver said:
He wants to destroy the EU. If he can get at Germany he is more likely to achieve this. It would, of course, be catastrophic for the UK economy were that to happen.SeanT said:Does Trump have a grudge against Germany?
https://twitter.com/JGForsyth/status/824564320176594945
Remember he's a rampant, frothing narcissist. I reckon he's just insulted that the Germans have been so cool to him, even after the inauguration. Whereas the Brits have changed their tune.
That said, President Trump can turn personal grudges into geopolitical strategies, and he does, so the Germans can possibly expect hostile actions.
0 -
They may not appreciate it; too strong a taste for Americans. Blandless rules there.SouthamObserver said:
We may end up being able to export more high-quality cheese to the US. Surely that is enough. Rejoice.Scott_P said:
As already noted, not all deals are equal.Philip_Thompson said:Seriously: Either trade deals are meaningless in which case no harm leaving the EU or trade deals are meaningful in which case better opportunities outside the EU.
We are throwing away the best deal we will ever have in the vain hope of picking up scraps from Trump's table.
Good deals are meaningful, crap deals are all we will have left.0 -
MarqueeMark said:
"Walk, in silence....ow, that fuckin' hurts!"SeanT said:
It's just kind of .... sad. Obviously clever people reduced to this gibberish.Sean_F said:
Does he think that's funny?Scott_P said:
The Remoaners must now be at Kubler Ross Grief stage 94: Run into the streets naked pouring jelly on your head while singing Joy Division's Atmosphere, then chop your own goolies off with a fishknife.
0 -
I'm sure it's unrelated to population growth and the industrialisation of mainland Asia.NewsTaker said:Since the EU started the % of our exports to other EU countries has steadily fallen at a rate of circa 1 percentage point a year, dropping to a headline of 44% in 2015.
Population growth by continent0 -
GPS orbits and configurations were specifically designed to make it difficult to degrade or destroy via standard ground based ASAT. I've long since lost track of any developments in space-based ASAT capability. Anyone know?Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)
0 -
Like a fair few who were Remainers before the vote Richard has proved himself a democrat. He doesn't like the result but he accepts it and now wants it to work as best it can despite his misgivings. Damian Green is another who has proved worthy of respect for this since the vote.SeanT said:
You seem to have become quite the Leaver. Welcome to our Happy Home.Richard_Nabavi said:It's a funny old world to be sure. Today we have before us, for our entertainment, the curious spectacle of Jeremy Corbyn being sensible over Article 50, whereas some of the nominally moderate and reasonable Labour MPs are threatening to vote against implementing the result of a referendum which they themselves voted for.
Seriously, it's good that you are reconciled (however reluctantly). Brexit is going to be tricky and tough. So the country needs the smarter Remainers to get the F over it, man up, and put their brains to better use.0 -
That's not right. The Supreme Court said that it could not enforce the Sewel convention. It did not say that it was not in play.Sean_F said:
They can say as they please, but the Supreme Court didn't support them.Scott_P said:@BBCPhilipSim: ScotGov pressing ahead to apply to Presiding Officer for Holyrood consent motion on Article50 bill. Say A50 clearly impacts on devolved govt
0 -
The EU share of our exports was steady at above 50% until around 2002 and that wave of integration, regulation etc etc.williamglenn said:
I'm sure it's unrelated to population growth and the industrialisation of mainland Asia.NewsTaker said:Since the EU started the % of our exports to other EU countries has steadily fallen at a rate of circa 1 percentage point a year, dropping to a headline of 44% in 2015.
Population growth by continent
https://fullfact.org/europe/uk-eu-trade/
0 -
The idea that we will suddenly stop trading with the EU because we have left is just plain dumb. What matters is to be able to build on that with the rest of the world which is aleady a far more important market for us. Something that is currently restricted by our membership of the EU.SouthamObserver said:
I'm afraid the economic illiteracy is to believe that we will get anything close to resembling the Single Market in any deal that we negotiate with any country from here-on-in. I do think that is important to have a strong home market for goods and services, and to go from there. Quite why you don't is beyond me.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yet another economic illiterate who thinks that 7% of the world's population should be more important for our future trade prospects than the other 93%. Membership of the EU actively hinders trade with the rest of the world. Being outside the Single Market will not significantly change the amount of trade we do with them but will allow us to make our own trade deals with the rest of the world.SouthamObserver said:
Almost all countries and trading blocs are protectionist - and will continue to be so. The Single Market is where we send over 40% of our exports. That may change over time, but it will not do so rapidly. And being a part of it means that all times - whatever happens elsewhere - we have full access to over 500 million potential customers. That is a good place from which to start and we will get nothing like it from any other trading arrangement we may negotiate. I accept that there are good reasons to leave the EU, but improving our trading potential is not one of them.
In 20 years the EU's share of global trade has dropped from 30% to 24% and it will continue to shrink.0 -
-
Coincidentally also around the time China joined the WTO.NewsTaker said:
The EU share of our exports was steady at above 50% until around 2002 and that wave of integration, regulation etc etc.williamglenn said:
I'm sure it's unrelated to population growth and the industrialisation of mainland Asia.NewsTaker said:Since the EU started the % of our exports to other EU countries has steadily fallen at a rate of circa 1 percentage point a year, dropping to a headline of 44% in 2015.
Population growth by continent
https://fullfact.org/europe/uk-eu-trade/0 -
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)0 -
In fairness, Robert, Max and Casino have all said that the next recession will be a Brexit-induced recession; I share that view. It's not all kittens and rainbows, despite what some of my Panglossian fellow travellers might think.TOPPING said:0 -
"53% don't think May is better than Corbyn."Scott_P said:0 -
.. and, to paraphrase Paul Daniels, "That's tragic" !SandyRentool said:0 -
Looks like the EU version isn't doing so well.FeersumEnjineeya said:
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)
http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-386642250 -
The split in the REMAIN camp between Adults and the Violet-Elizabeth Bott's?Richard_Tyndall said:
Like a fair few who were Remainers before the vote Richard has proved himself a democrat. He doesn't like the result but he accepts it and now wants it to work as best it can despite his misgivings. Damian Green is another who has proved worthy of respect for this since the vote.SeanT said:
You seem to have become quite the Leaver. Welcome to our Happy Home.Richard_Nabavi said:It's a funny old world to be sure. Today we have before us, for our entertainment, the curious spectacle of Jeremy Corbyn being sensible over Article 50, whereas some of the nominally moderate and reasonable Labour MPs are threatening to vote against implementing the result of a referendum which they themselves voted for.
Seriously, it's good that you are reconciled (however reluctantly). Brexit is going to be tricky and tough. So the country needs the smarter Remainers to get the F over it, man up, and put their brains to better use.
0 -
I wonder what majority May would get with the Tories on 47%? Smelling salts on stand by....SandyRentool said:
"53% don't think May is better than Corbyn."Scott_P said:twitter.com/yougov/status/824613191036592129
0 -
Galileo is an EU alternative not European so the Brexitards have fucked that.FeersumEnjineeya said:
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)0 -
Presumably Larry and Palmerston can replace them; they both have more experience of Government.Blue_rog said:
so, sack and withdraw the whipScott_P said:@jessicaelgot: I understand there are at least two shadow cabinet members who are seriously considering defying Labour's three line whip on Article 50 bill
0 -
If we aren't on the EU's side or the USA's side in a situation where such services would be denied to us, something will have gone very wrong!Dura_Ace said:
Galileo is an EU alternative not European so the Brexitards have fucked that.FeersumEnjineeya said:
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)0 -
85% don't think Corbyn is better than May.SandyRentool said:
"53% don't think May is better than Corbyn."Scott_P said:
Lab 2015GE voters are almost equally split on the question and 13% of *current* Labour voters, which potentially gives scope for further swing from Lab (13% of current Lab voters represents about 4% of the voting electorate).0 -
"Organisers said: “The vast majority of our MPs support our membership of the European Union, but are being railroaded into a catastrophe by reckless and incompetent leadership."
Maybe the public should have been consulted?
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/8246128609365524490 -
The people who go crazy over "leftards" should be along soon to tell him off for that...SeanT said:
Not sure "Brexitards" is gonna work. Doesn't have the immediate appeal and logic of "Remoaners".Dura_Ace said:
Galileo is an EU alternative not European so the Brexitards have fucked that.FeersumEnjineeya said:
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)
Feels more forced, like "Lie-bour" and "Camoron", which happily died out. But good try.0 -
Ouch ouch ouch
Brendan O'Neill doesn't think much of Obama's emotional therapy presidency.
"For those of us who cling to an old-fashioned view of politics as the affairs of state, as ‘the science of good sense applied to public affairs’, as 18th-century US congressman Fisher Ames described it, the past few weeks have been incredibly frustrating. Any attempt to analyse, seriously, the things that were done by the Obama administration — or, as some see it, the things that merely happened under Obama, their authorship unclear or obscured — meets with confusion or even hostility.
Obama, it has been made clear, is not to be judged by such earthly matters as industry or liberty or war and peace, but rather by how he made people feel; by what one author has described as ‘the profound shift in the American psyche’ he brought about. Obama’s impact is mental, not political; curative, not concrete. Even newspaper pieces on his legacy that include discussion of Obamacare and his decisions on the Middle East swiftly move back to the realm of character and emotion, to his grace and style and wisdom. His legacy is judged psychologically rather than politically.
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/article/obama-is-not-your-magical-negro/19350#.WISO2X875Jw.twitter0 -
But the Euroloons kept telling us that the EU IS Europe. That they are one and the same.Dura_Ace said:
Galileo is an EU alternative not European so the Brexitards have fucked that.FeersumEnjineeya said:
I wasn't thinking of Trident in particular, but independence from the US in general. With GPS now an integral component of so many applications, it surely makes good sense to have a European alternative.Dura_Ace said:
Trident D5 uses laser ring gyro INS and stellar navigation. It is specifically designed to work in a GPS denied environment so Galileo is irrelevant. When I was in the RN assignment to a Trident boat was something to be avoided and, if possible, bitterly contested so keeping the boats adequately and appropriately crewed is a far bigger issue than any technical matters.FeersumEnjineeya said:
The Galileo satellite navigation system is certainly looking like a good idea now.rkrkrk said:
There was a discussion on here about Trident...
Do we need a different system that is more independent of the US?
The level of military knowledge on here seems to a complete non-expert like me to be very high so interested to hear views.
(Assuming you accept the premise that Trump is not a friend of the UK)0 -
Link?Richard_Tyndall said:But the Euroloons kept telling us that the EU IS Europe.
0 -
I half expected a mortgage rate rise because the Bank of England endorsed that as going to happen. It would have hurt financially (>£350k in borrowings) but, I did not understand the economic logic that Carney & Osborne spouted, therefore I concluded that they were either fools or liars.SeanT said:
Personally I thought we'd be in recession already, and facing a property slump.John_M said:
In fairness, Robert, Max and Casino have all said that the next recession will be a Brexit-induced recession; I share that view. It's not all kittens and rainbows, despite what some of my Panglossian fellow travellers might think.TOPPING said:
I voted LEAVE with my eyes open, knowing that if we won, the first years would be hard, and I would take a whack on my main asset, my London flat.
I voted for my DAUGHTER and for the COUNTRY, not for me. Remain would probably be better for me, financially.
0 -
OK you voted emotionally for your daughter and country - that doesn't make you noble or right.SeanT said:
Personally I thought we'd be in recession already, and facing a property slump.John_M said:
In fairness, Robert, Max and Casino have all said that the next recession will be a Brexit-induced recession; I share that view. It's not all kittens and rainbows, despite what some of my Panglossian fellow travellers might think.TOPPING said:
I voted LEAVE with my eyes open, knowing that if we won, the first years would be hard, and I would take a whack on my main asset, my London flat.
I voted for my DAUGHTER and for the COUNTRY, not for me. Remain would probably be better for me, financially.
I voted the other way for the same reasons, my 17 year old daughter would really have liked to vote for herself and for Remain.0
