politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn and McCluskey, comrades in arms
Options
Comments
-
Ah I see.John_M said:
It's like the WWI Iron Cross 2nd class. Every Tom, Dick and Harry's got one. You get the oak leaves if you're on the receiving end of a peroration.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
Have to say Malcolm is much more erudite when it comes to sending insults,
But then I am a bit partial to Turnips....0 -
A garden of Angels?Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:
There are two problems with that:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
1) For some rather obscure technical subjects, the Internet is not well stocked with information. I wanted some in-depth information on the early history of the Cromford and High Peak Railway, and the only place to get that is an obscure tome published a decade or so ago.
2) Googling one thing can frequently end up with two hours lost in other topics, ranging from the lifecycle of hens to synopses of the episodes of 'I love Lucy'.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.
0 -
How funny, I've been meaning to write one too!david_herdson said:
I have a piece on the French presidential written for when Mike can find time among everything else!anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
To cut a long story short, her odds are far too short at the moment. She'll lose to everyone except Hollande (more black swans permitting), and Hollande is unlikely to make the second round.
Basically, Juppe will be the Les Republicains candidate, beating Sarkozy by 2:1 in the second round. Bayrou will not stand if Juppe is the LR candidate, and so he'll top the first round on perhaps 35%, against 30% for Le Pen. And Juppe walks the second round.
His odds are far too long, hers too short.
And people forget how poorly the FN performed in second rounds in the last 18 months - even after topping the polls in the first rounds. They still haven't become transfer friendly, and probably won't be until Marion Marechel Le Pen takes over the leadership from Marine.0 -
I've just been looking at that.rcs1000 said:
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_French_presidential_election,_2017#Jupp.C3.A9.E2.80.93Le_PenanotherDave said:
She's already at 30% in the 1st round. France is experiencing some pretty black swan stuff at the mo. Purple and blue swans to follow.david_herdson said:
I have a piece on the French presidential written for when Mike can find time among everything else!anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
To cut a long story short, her odds are far too short at the moment. She'll lose to everyone except Hollande (more black swans permitting), and Hollande is unlikely to make the second round.
The last two polls, from April and May, have her 70:30 down to Juppe. The same polls put her on about 30% in the first round. She basically gets no transfer votes when Juppe is her opponent.
Given how corrupt french politics appears to be a scandal hitting any one of the candidates seems possible.
She's competitive against Hollande and Sarkozy now. A year from now, with more domestic terrorist attacks, she may be competitive against all of them.
0 -
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/international-business/French-fishermen-may-get-caught-in-Brexit-net/articleshow/53247223.cmsIanB2 said:
So the question is - how does any agreement change anything and help us? Or help them? Or both? Or neither?BigIan said:
Funny you should say that. I happen to have a glass of some in my hand as we speak.IanB2 said:
Funny, but down the supermarket today there were shelves of Australian and New Zealand wine, just as always.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
There seems to be a sense of excitement among our leaders now as it sinks in that they have real power again and there is a whole world to trade with - and that world is very keen to trade. Its like we're going home.SeanT said:
All true.TOPPING said:SeanT said:TOPPING said:
.kle4 said:
Alry.Sunil_Prasannan said:
It has been posited that this is an element of why people voted Leave. London/the Metropolitan elite benefit from the EU most so even if there is a trickle down effect, it's not sufficient to be accepted by those who are marginalised. Hence they reject the whole thing.
All explained in a good programme here.
Of course, some on here don't like to hear such studies (the programme also found that Leavers are generally fearful of the future, look to an idealised past, and don't like change). But a good programme nevertheless.
I still believe LEAVE was the right decision, and we won't regret it, and we will grow faster over 20 years than if we had stayed. Even if we don't, we have given the people the sense they can control their lives and their country, with a vote. That sense was fast disappearing.
0 -
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
In fact come to think of it you would have very similar issues with Catholic kids whos parents were devotees of the Society of St Pius X.0 -
I berated TSE for being a THICK TEDIOUS TORY TWAT earlier this eveningPaul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
0 -
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.anotherDave said:
I've just been looking at that.rcs1000 said:
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_French_presidential_election,_2017#Jupp.C3.A9.E2.80.93Le_PenanotherDave said:
She's already at 30% in the 1st round. France is experiencing some pretty black swan stuff at the mo. Purple and blue swans to follow.david_herdson said:
I have a piece on the French presidential written for when Mike can find time among everything else!anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
To cut a long story short, her odds are far too short at the moment. She'll lose to everyone except Hollande (more black swans permitting), and Hollande is unlikely to make the second round.
The last two polls, from April and May, have her 70:30 down to Juppe. The same polls put her on about 30% in the first round. She basically gets no transfer votes when Juppe is her opponent.
Given how corrupt french politics appears to be a scandal hitting any one of the candidates seems possible.
She's competitive against Hollande and Sarkozy now. A year from now, with more domestic terrorist attacks, she may be competitive against all of them.
0 -
FWIW my family in California are all voting for him (normally GOP but can't stand Trump - they were fans of Jeb)stjohn said:
BigRich. You highlighted Gary Johnson's POTUS prospects about a month ago. I had never heard of him or the Libertarian Party at the time. After a bit of googling I backed him on Betfair at 1000.BigRich said:
Many thanks for you help, I now understand the difference, and have placed my first ever Political bet, no my first real bet of any type!Pong said:
Not a stupid question at all!BigRich said:
Many thanks, at 450/1 I will do this!Pong said:
The best odds you'll get if you want to back him are on betfair - around 450/1 (0.2%)BigRich said:
I think if Gary Johnson gets to 15% and therefor in to the debates, it wont matter who he takes most from because he could win it!Pulpstar said:
The question is - who does he hurt more ?Pong said:Nate Silver Verified account
@NateSilver538
Gary Johnson up to 9.3% in our national poll average, his high point of the year so far.
Betting Question;
From here, do Gary Johnson's polling numbers go;
A) up
B') down
??
Yes I probably am living in my Libertarian dream world, but 6 mouths ago who thought he could get to 9.3% average? so please let me enjoy this moment.
P.S. I'm a betting novis, if I did want to place say £100 on him winning, what would be a good site to go to and haw much could I expect to win if he did become President?
The American-facing predictit is offering 25/1 (4%) to back, or 33/1 (3%) to lay.
But I don't quite understand how it could be 450/1 on one site and then 33/1 to lay on another site, what is stopping somebody backing on one site and laying on another, and then overall making money whatever the outcome? sorry if this is a stupid question.
Predictit only accepts US customers, Betfair explicitly rejects US customers.
So form now on, when people accuse me of being mad to belief Gary Johnson has a chance I will be able to say I am putting my money where my mouth is!
Good luck to us both!0 -
The status quo policy approach of the West towards Islamism isn't working, albeit it has toughened up a bit in recent years.SeanT said:
Yes. She needs 3 or 4 Bataclans and Bastille Days (and heaven forbid that should happen). She's very very likely to lose.rcs1000 said:
She loses 70:30 to Juppe in round two on all polls. Even if this boosts her 5%, she'll still lose 2:1.anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
The more interesting question is how far right Juppe and Sarko will go, on security and Islam, as they battle to win the nomination and the election.
Sarko has set down a marker: close Salafist mosques. It will be popular on the Right. I wouldn't dismiss his chances.
Ergo, at some stage in the future, I expect it to toughen further.0 -
The only part I disagree with is Marion. I do not see the FN re-positioning itself to make it more attractive to transfers under her.rcs1000 said:
How funny, I've been meaning to write one too!david_herdson said:
I have a piece on the French presidential written for when Mike can find time among everything else!anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
To cut a long story short, her odds are far too short at the moment. She'll lose to everyone except Hollande (more black swans permitting), and Hollande is unlikely to make the second round.
Basically, Juppe will be the Les Republicains candidate, beating Sarkozy by 2:1 in the second round. Bayrou will not stand if Juppe is the LR candidate, and so he'll top the first round on perhaps 35%, against 30% for Le Pen. And Juppe walks the second round.
His odds are far too long, hers too short.
And people forget how poorly the FN performed in second rounds in the last 18 months - even after topping the polls in the first rounds. They still haven't become transfer friendly, and probably won't be until Marion Marechel Le Pen takes over the leadership from Marine.0 -
Indeed, along with a Hotel of the Land of Angels?Tim_B said:
A garden of Angels?Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The lastwas during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:
There are two problems with that:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
1) For some rather obscure technical subjects, the Internet is not well stocked with information. I wanted some in-depth information on the early history of the Cromford and High Peak Railway, and the only place to get that is an obscure tome published a decade or so ago.
2) Googling one thing can frequently end up with two hours lost in other topics, ranging from the lifecycle of hens to synopses of the episodes of 'I love Lucy'.
I've slowly though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.
0 -
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
The only fiction I have left now is the Flashman series, a few funnies on the shelves in the downstairs loo (Pratchett mostly) plus some treasures including one by a certain Thaddeus White. On a happy note my shelves are now full again and herself yesterday presented me with another book about the situation in 1940 (my current period of interest).
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
However, it was not all plain sailing, Churchill was nearly ousted (he was really I think saved by Chamberlain) and the mood in the country wobbled too. I think once the Blitz started and people saw they could survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.0 -
Sarkozy is flailing badly. After having created Les Republicians, he thought he'd walk the nomination, but he's gone backwards, and keeps on going backwards.SeanT said:
Yes. She needs 3 or 4 Bataclans and Bastille Days (and heaven forbid that should happen). She's very very likely to lose.rcs1000 said:
She loses 70:30 to Juppe in round two on all polls. Even if this boosts her 5%, she'll still lose 2:1.anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
The more interesting question is how far right Juppe and Sarko will go, on security and Islam, as they battle to win the nomination and the election.
Sarko has set down a marker: close Salafist mosques. It will be popular on the Right. I wouldn't dismiss his chances.
I was in Paris last month seeing politicos (Macron, btw, is very impressive), and the general view was that Sarkozy won't want to run and lose badly. He'd rather step back and accept the PM role under Juppe, especially as Juppe is 70. I find that very plausible, which means that it'll be a walkover for Juppe against Le Pen.0 -
Nick Palmer wears his Blue Max with self-effacing pride. Tim sent his back in disgust after his departure from PB.John_M said:
It's like the WWI Iron Cross 2nd class. Every Tom, Dick and Harry's got one. You get the oak leaves if you're on the receiving end of a peroration.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
PS PB Pedants will never let me get away with the 'oak leaves' crack. Brace yourself for a lengthy monograph on German medal hierarchies.0 -
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.0 -
Wasnt that long ago (like less than 25 years) that we had to put up with similar comments to the effect that all Catholics / Irish were terrorists or harbourers/sympathisers of them.SeanT said:
Amish Terror. The New Threat, written in crayon by Paul "my IQ is lower than anyone guessed!" Bedfordshire.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
0 -
Who said "non angli sed angeli?"Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:
There are two problems with that:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
1) For some rather obscure technical subjects, the Internet is not well stocked with information. I wanted some in-depth information on the early history of the Cromford and High Peak Railway, and the only place to get that is an obscure tome published a decade or so ago.
2) Googling one thing can frequently end up with two hours lost in other topics, ranging from the lifecycle of hens to synopses of the episodes of 'I love Lucy'.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.0 -
Thanks. I was aware of that, but someone's already done that particular work for me.Moses_ said:
Just a thought but Ordnance Survey have a huge amount of details and records like that taken over the years. The information was explained on a recent documentary. It might be useful or it might not but worth a check you never know?JosiasJessop said:IanB2 said:
Ah, but that's not detailed enough. For instance the book tells me that the line between Minninglow and Friden (which some illustrious readers might have walked or ridden along) was constructed by Porteus & Co. , whilst the Middleton Incline was built by Higgots & Hollins.
Also where engines and rails were obtained from, how many cubic yards of earth were removed from cuttings, etc, etc.
And many other facts that are useful to no-one except people planning a novel based on the building of the line.
https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/resources/historical-map-resources/archive-info.html
One of the advantages of something like railways is that there's bound to be some bloke (or in this case, woman) somewhere who has researched it before you. Even something as obscure at the Cromford and High Peak. Although to be fair, it's a fairly famous line.
I wonder who it was engineered by? 0 -
Sure, but numbers move.rcs1000 said:
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.
Mr Sarkozy's offering today about salafists, and I think Mr Juppe said something about Turkey joining the EU. Both suggest they feel pressed to move closer to FN. Every time they do that FN becomes more mainstream.
--
A medium article posted the other day had an interesting snippet about FN.
"...the FN has conquered the internet. In Britain, trolling, Twitter and alternative news sites are a leftist thing; in France the FN has built and been echoed by its own alt-media. Websites like www.fdesouche.com — a play on Français de souche, or real, pure, Frenchmen with roots — pump out an alternative news agenda, with stories every day of migrant rapes and Arab knifings. It is among the most popular sites in France."
https://medium.com/@b_judah/islam-and-the-french-republic-from-the-banlieus-to-le-pen-land-92d8a1fbf0e0
0 -
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite0 -
Juppe (or Sarkozy) will get first shot. If he makes a mess of it, then Mdme MLP will be in key position.
0 -
Just being wrong on one issue of fact doesn't make you dumb, does it? Hope not, or which of us is safe? And see under Pope Gregory I: Non Angli, sed angeli.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:
There are two problems with that:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
1) For some rather obscure technical subjects, the Internet is not well stocked with information. I wanted some in-depth information on the early history of the Cromford and High Peak Railway, and the only place to get that is an obscure tome published a decade or so ago.
2) Googling one thing can frequently end up with two hours lost in other topics, ranging from the lifecycle of hens to synopses of the episodes of 'I love Lucy'.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one annoyance are things like some Tom Clancy books being unavailable. Grrrr.
However, sometimes a good textbook is simply the best. Saying that, I recently gave away my copy of Soustroup C++. I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.
Edit to Charles: snap!0 -
It may be.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.
My main beef that started this off is people videoing women and kids going about their business on the streets, and then publishing them with derogatory references to how they are dressed. Not Cricket.0 -
lolSeanT said:
Amish Terror. The New Threat, written in crayon by Paul "my IQ is lower than anyone guessed!" Bedfordshire.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.0 -
That's not a true SeanT insult trust me. Sean has mellowed slightly but some years ago they were eye wateringly withering but also funny.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
You are yet to be on the end of one of those.......0 -
Amidst the week's horror, including the deaths of children and infants, lynch mobs in Turkey and so on, I'm oddly hung up on the death of Qandeel Baloch. To be murdered by your own brother for making Youtube videos and dancing in public...I just can't comprehend what on earth makes people behave like that.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.0 -
They will probably protest by making sure Pen is in the second round then pull back.SeanT said:
I cannot believe there won't be - at some point - an intense emotional reaction to Nice.rcs1000 said:
Sarkozy is flailing badly. After having created Les Republicians, he thought he'd walk the nomination, but he's gone backwards, and keeps on going backwards.SeanT said:
Yes. She needs 3 or 4 Bataclans and Bastille Days (and heaven forbid that should happen). She's very very likely to lose.rcs1000 said:
She loses 70:30 to Juppe in round two on all polls. Even if this boosts her 5%, she'll still lose 2:1.anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
The more interesting question is how far right Juppe and Sarko will go, on security and Islam, as they battle to win the nomination and the election.
Sarko has set down a marker: close Salafist mosques. It will be popular on the Right. I wouldn't dismiss his chances.
I was in Paris last month seeing politicos (Macron, btw, is very impressive), and the general view was that Sarkozy won't want to run and lose badly. He'd rather step back and accept the PM role under Juppe, especially as Juppe is 70. I find that very plausible, which means that it'll be a walkover for Juppe against Le Pen.
At the moment (judging by my French friends on social media) there is a kind of numbness, tinged with denial. They just want to go on holiday and forget. It's too much, too awful - all the dead kids. And who can blame them. I find it hard to think about Nice, as a father.
But in time? It will surely shift French politics very significantly to the Right. Question is: how far.0 -
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.HurstLlama said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
The only fiction I have left now is the Flashman series, a few funnies on the shelves in the downstairs loo (Pratchett mostly) plus some treasures including one by a certain Thaddeus White. On a happy note my shelves are now full again and herself yesterday presented me with another book about the situation in 1940 (my current period of interest).
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
However, it was not all plain sailing, Churchill was nearly ousted (he was really I think saved by Chamberlain) and the mood in the country wobbled too. I think once the Blitz started and people saw they could survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.0 -
Did IRA men wear Burqas?Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Wasnt that long ago (like less than 25 years) that we had to put up with similar comments to the effect that all Catholics / Irish were terrorists or harbourers/sympathisers of them.SeanT said:
Amish Terror. The New Threat, written in crayon by Paul "my IQ is lower than anyone guessed!" Bedfordshire.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
0 -
Absolutely. That poor young woman's life, ended by a member of her own family, out of some misguided notion of 'honour'. Depressing.John_M said:
Amidst the week's horror, including the deaths of children and infants, lynch mobs in Turkey and so on, I'm oddly hung up on the death of Qandeel Baloch. To be murdered by your own brother for making Youtube videos and dancing in public...I just can't comprehend what on earth makes people behave like that.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.0 -
I think it will take Marion Marechel Le Pen to win the Presidency for the FN. While Mme Le Pen has thrown off some of the antisemitism, she remains surrounded by friends of her father who have not. Marion gets rid of it completely.chestnut said:Juppe (or Sarkozy) will get first shot. If he makes a mess of it, then Mdme MLP will be in key position.
She's also much more astute on the causes of the rest of France's malaises - she doesn't see free trade and big business as evil. Nor does she think a lack of regulation is what is holding France back. She's more in the PVV mold: believing the FN is at the Christian vanguard against the Muslim hordes. I think that's a pitch that goes beyond the 30% ceiling of Marine.0 -
You haven't really been here until you have been told by SeanT to get away from here.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
0 -
No one much cared when the French were similarly massacring Algerian Muslims on a far larger scale between 1830 and 1962.SeanT said:
I cannot believe there won't be - at some point - an intense emotional reaction to Nice.rcs1000 said:
Sarkozy is flailing badly. After having created Les Republicians, he thought he'd walk the nomination, but he's gone backwards, and keeps on going backwards.SeanT said:
Yes. She needs 3 or 4 Bataclans and Bastille Days (and heaven forbid that should happen). She's very very likely to lose.rcs1000 said:
She loses 70:30 to Juppe in round two on all polls. Even if this boosts her 5%, she'll still lose 2:1.anotherDave said:
Marine Le Pen must look ever more likely. Every terrorist attack pushes voters to the strongest response, and that's always going to be Le Pen.david_herdson said:
It's roughly what google translate says too: "I hope that the prefects are authorized to immediately close any place of worship Related Salafism"SeanT said:
So my schoolboy French tells me. Could be wrong.FrancisUrquhart said:
He is proposing to close all Salafist places right?SeanT said:Et voila
Sarkozy wins the election?
@NicolasSarkozy 25m25 minutes ago View translation
Je souhaite que les préfets soient autorisés à fermer immédiatement tout lieu de culte ayant un lien avec le salafisme #NS20H
But it won't win Sarkozy the election. It won't even win him the nomination unless Juppe does or says something stupid, which isn't his style.
The more interesting question is how far right Juppe and Sarko will go, on security and Islam, as they battle to win the nomination and the election.
Sarko has set down a marker: close Salafist mosques. It will be popular on the Right. I wouldn't dismiss his chances.
I was in Paris last month seeing politicos (Macron, btw, is very impressive), and the general view was that Sarkozy won't want to run and lose badly. He'd rather step back and accept the PM role under Juppe, especially as Juppe is 70. I find that very plausible, which means that it'll be a walkover for Juppe against Le Pen.
At the moment (judging by my French friends on social media) there is a kind of numbness, tinged with denial. They just want to go on holiday and forget. It's too much, too awful - all the dead kids. And who can blame them. I find it hard to think about Nice, as a father.
But in time? It will surely shift French politics very significantly to the Right. Question is: how far.0 -
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.Tim_B said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.HurstLlama said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
The only fiction I have left now is the Flashman series, a few funnies on the shelves in the downstairs loo (Pratchett mostly) plus some treasures including one by a certain Thaddeus White. On a happy note my shelves are now full again and herself yesterday presented me with another book about the situation in 1940 (my current period of interest).
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
However, it was not all plain sailing, Churchill was nearly ousted (he was really I think saved by Chamberlain) and the mood in the country wobbled too. I think once the Blitz started and people saw they could survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.0 -
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite0 -
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.0 -
I doubt any of you can beat "The Railways of Great Britain - a Historical Atlas" by Col. Michael H. Cobb.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.Tim_B said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.HurstLlama said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
The only fiction I have left now is the Flashman series, a few funnies on the shelves in the downstairs loo (Pratchett mostly) plus some treasures including one by a certain Thaddeus White. On a happy note my shelves are now full again and herself yesterday presented me with another book about the situation in 1940 (my current period of interest).
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.
Comes in two giant volumes, and print run was only a few hundred.
0 -
Tried to find the Churchill book but can only see uk site. It's obviously 5 times the price there . Tried to go on the USA but it sends me back to uk site?Tim_B said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.HurstLlama said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
The only fiction I have left now is the Flashman series, a few funnies on the shelves in the downstairs loo (Pratchett mostly) plus some treasures including one by a certain Thaddeus White. On a happy note my shelves are now full again and herself yesterday presented me with another book about the situation in 1940 (my current period of interest).
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
However, it was not all plain sailing, Churchill was nearly ousted (he was really I think saved by Chamberlain) and the mood in the country wobbled too. I think once the Blitz started and people saw they could survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.0 -
Bala-Burqas I believe.....Sunil_Prasannan said:
Did IRA men wear Burqas?Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Wasnt that long ago (like less than 25 years) that we had to put up with similar comments to the effect that all Catholics / Irish were terrorists or harbourers/sympathisers of them.SeanT said:
Amish Terror. The New Threat, written in crayon by Paul "my IQ is lower than anyone guessed!" Bedfordshire.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.0 -
Crikey, there are any number of books on the period that are cracking good reads. For a boo that combines first class scholarship, the political, technicals as well as battle history i don't think one can do better that James Holland, "The Battle of Britain" (ISBN 978-0-552-15610-3). It is also eminently readable. As a primer for someone wanting to look into the period I don't think it can be beaten. Mind you at just under a thousand pages (including reference and index) it is not a small book.Tim_B said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.
The Narrow Margin was written, if memory serves, in the late fifties. It is very good but I think written too near the time, when the wounds were not yet healed. A cracking read but not necessarily good history.0 -
You know you're not supposed to actually be proud of being a colossal nerd, right?Sunil_Prasannan said:
I doubt any of you can beat "The Railways of Great Britain - a Historical Atlas" by Col. Michael H. Cobb.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.Tim_B said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.HurstLlama said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.JohnO said:
1940 is one of my favourite years, particularly on the domestic front - l'm currently ploughing through a tome containing all the Ministry of Information reports of morale around the country from May to August. And I need to have a third reading of John Luckas's Five Days in London. What's the book your good lady has presented?HurstLlama said:
I am not surprised, Mr. Dave. I am horrified by the casual way you say you used to cull your books as if they were deer that were over-breeding in the local wood. When I cleared my fiction shelves it was a wrench to get rid of any of them - even the Tom Clancy novels.anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.
Comes in two giant volumes, and print run was only a few hundred. 0 -
This though sums up the entire problem.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Absolutely. That poor young woman's life, ended by a member of her own family, out of some misguided notion of 'honour'. Depressing.John_M said:
Amidst the week's horror, including the deaths of children and infants, lynch mobs in Turkey and so on, I'm oddly hung up on the death of Qandeel Baloch. To be murdered by your own brother for making Youtube videos and dancing in public...I just can't comprehend what on earth makes people behave like that.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.
If they are willing to do this in their own family and be applauded for it then what chance us? Add to that terrorists that don't care if they die in an attack and in fact actually welcome it and you can see how difficult this is to deal with. It's the brainwashing from birth and the hatred that seems to be instilled within. You have to tackle the source because tackling the result is never going to succeed.
Sarkozy recognises this.
0 -
The Birds of Pakistan, Volumes 1 and 2 - most of the contributions are by crusty Raj military types. (But I did find a bird new to Pakistan once....)Sunil_Prasannan said:
I doubt any of you can beat "The Railways of Great Britain - a Historical Atlas" by Col. Michael H. Cobb.
Comes in two giant volumes, and print run was only a few hundred.
But the Field Guide to the Micro-moths of Great Britain and Ireland is unlikely to be on many of the bookshelves hereabouts.0 -
Just reading through the latest French opinion poll (http://www.bva.fr/data/sondage/sondage_fiche/1888/fichier_pop2017_-_intentions_de_vote_-_vague_404553.pdf) from about two weeks ago.
Francois Hollande could be fifth if Sarkozy is the LR candidate (as Bayrou stands), and fourth if he is not.
(Le Pen, Sarkozy, Bayrou and Melechon could all beat him, with him staggering along on just 13%...)0 -
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.0 -
Falaise Gap, 1944. Opened the way up to Paris and the German frontier.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.
0 -
Arguably this baggage holds us back. So much so its almost impossible to imagine that before 1940 this was not a part in the British identity at all.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.0 -
There was some talk of TV scheduling of Braveheart helping the scots nats. I think a June 22nd showing of 'This Happy Breed' would have helped Leave.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.
0 -
And London, England has a Swiss Cottage. You can get a train there, if you're lucky.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.0 -
Some of them subscribe to that notion. I'm not sure that the North Siders would want to be called Catholics though.Charles said:
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.0 -
The trouble is, where is this reformation to come from? The direction of travel seems to be in one direction - backwards. Iran and Afghanistan were very western in the 70s. Lebanon was the playground of the Med.SeanT said:
Islam.John_M said:AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
No, but the concept of 'modest dress' is frequently used to control/limit women's behaviour and full participation in society.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Yes but not every muslim who dresses modestly is an extremist nutter - in fact most of them are not - and if you were teaching in somewhere like West Virginia you would have similar problems with the amish kids.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'm a Catholic, too - although my reaction is quite the opposite.SeanT said:Paul_Bedforshire
"Maybe it is because I am catholic that my initial reaction to a woman in full length dress and a headscarf is respect for their sense of modesty amongst the sick decadence and hedonism all around them."
That's what I think when I see the burqa, too. I think "respect". Also FGM. Save these poor girls from their immoral clitorises. Teach their vaginas to respect.
Perhaps when you've had to teach 11 year old girls sent to school dressed like that, when their parents want to withdraw them from large sections of the curriculum including non-participation in sport/music, removing them from school for months on end, harming their educational prospects - culminating in them going altogether to marry someone against their express wishes - you *might* have a rather different view of the extremes of certain religions.
My experiences are from inner city UK schools in the 21st century, not the backwaters of Appalachia.
Islam is horribly diseased. It is a great faith suffering a terrible psychosis, lurching back to the cruel and hideous verities of the early Middle Ages. How hard is this to grasp? The evidence is everywhere: it dominates the news daily.
It's an arms race, within Islam, of theologically-inspired barbarity and homicide. And this is itself intensified by a gruesome war between Shia and Sunni - like our own 30 Years War, but happening now.
As such the best we can do in the west is insulate ourselves from Islam as it goes through its madness. We reduce Muslim immigration into our countries to near zero, we strongly encourage Muslims of the more fundamentalist kind to leave the West (by making it hard for them to follow the faith), and we cease our interference in their affairs - let the Islamic world do what it wants to do, so be it.
This is the only option.
Recently finished Bernard Lewis's 'What Went Wrong'. Came away utterly depressed.0 -
Hollande also runs fifth in who PS voters want to be their candidate!rcs1000 said:Just reading through the latest French opinion poll (http://www.bva.fr/data/sondage/sondage_fiche/1888/fichier_pop2017_-_intentions_de_vote_-_vague_404553.pdf) from about two weeks ago.
Francois Hollande could be fifth if Sarkozy is the LR candidate (as Bayrou stands), and fourth if he is not.
(Le Pen, Sarkozy, Bayrou and Melechon could all beat him, with him staggering along on just 13%...)0 -
For the first 14 years of my life our next door neighbor was a survivor of the Burma campaign, who had worked on the Burma railroad. He and his wife were always so kind to me, letting me eat meals there and generally being honorary aunt and uncle to next door's kid. He had terrible digestive problems and mental flashbacks. One day I showed him my pride and joy - a new model car. He looked at it and made admiring comments, then turned it over. When he saw 'Made in Japan' his reaction was so bad that his wife immediately escorted me home through the hedge and explained to my parents. He was such a nice man and died very young. The Burma campaign folks really suffered.John_M said:Tim_B said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.HurstLlama said:
My favorite Battle of Britain book is The Narrow Margin. ISBN 0850529158. I've had several copies over the years. I'm about to read Martin Gilbert's single volume Churchill bio. A deal at $1.99 on amazon.JohnO said:
Matthew Parker's Battle of Britain (ISBN 0-7472-3452-3), it is a collection of interviews of people in various stations of life in the period July to October. I don't suppose it will tell me anything that I don't already know, but it will be good reading.HurstLlama said:anotherDave said:I used to just cull my books once in a while. I had some very nice OUP editions of Christopher Fry's plays that I sold to the local 2nd book shop. I've regretted doing that every since!
If you are looking at civilian morale in the Spring/Early summer of 1940 I think you are probably having a very interesting time. I spent a lot of time at the National Archives looking at the cabinet papers for the period - Chamberlain going out, Churchill coming in, Halifax wetting himself, Churchill eventually by sheer force of personality and oratory achieving control of the Cabinet, the House and the Country.
However, it was not all plain sailing, Churchill was nearly ousted (he was really I think saved by Chamberlain) and the mood in the country wobbled too. I think once the Blitz started and people saw they could survive (Trenchard's the bomber will always get through in the 1930s was a scary thing) then the Brits got bloody minded (as we are want to do, even now) and Churchill was safe in power.0 -
Anglo-catholicism is aesthetically magnificent. Theologically I feel it has become hopelessly compromised, wedged between a silly pretence to be wholly Roman on the one side and trying to accommodate the authority of female bishops on the other.Charles said:
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.0 -
"I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron."
My wife's uncle was in Burma during WW2. Great bloke, came back and ran the local legion club for many years. Sadly he died a few years ago and in all the time I knew him (at least 25 years) I never heard him speak of it even once. That alone shows how bad it really must have been and how we could never really begin to comprehend0 -
Farron calls for new party or alliance of centre-left. Independent front page tonight.0
-
-
Does he expect to lead it?rottenborough said:Farron calls for new party or alliance of centre-left. Independent front page tonight.
0 -
He's leaving his Defence role???rottenborough said:Farron calls for new party or alliance of centre-left. Independent front page tonight.
0 -
I know.Charles said:
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.
My mother was born and raised Roman Catholic, joining CofE on marrying my father.0 -
They would be better buying 10,000 memberships...TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Fair go, but there is only so much one can do in one lifetime. Slim was in my view our best general in WWII, and the British Pacific Fleet in late '44/45 had its own fascinating tale to tell. But who has time to research all that and WWI and ETO 1944/45, and UK 1940. Not to mention the 14th century. There are only 24 hours in a day, some of which have to be spent asleep and there is the ironing to do before Herself really starts moaning. On which note I bid you all good night.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.0 -
Um, yes, Jubilee line - first visited it in 2008, though would have first passed through without stopping in 1994/95.Anorak said:
And London, England has a Swiss Cottage. You can get a train there, if you're lucky.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.
0 -
I looked at that UK vs US immigration fears graph and trace the data back to its original source, which is here:http://www.policyuncertainty.com/immigration_fear.html . It has indices for the US, UK, German, French and Spanish fear of immigration.rcs1000 said:
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.
Here's a thing
The UK has suffered very little from recent immigration, at least in comparison to France and Germany. But the UK's fear of immigration index is considerably higher than France's, Germany's, the US or Spain's.
I think this differential fear will distort our view of the upcoming French election, and cause us to assume Le Pen (whichever one) is more popular than reality. This has implications with respect to betting.
0 -
Indeed. But I think it is important to remember some of the other aspects of history for what it meant at the time.SeanT said:
Yes, possibly. But it is a fundamental part of our identity now, just as the French revolution crucially forms their self image, even though the country dates back a thousand years before 1789.Jonathan said:
Arguably this baggage holds us back. So much so its almost impossible to imagine that before 1940 this was not a part in the British identity at all.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.
I think nostalgia is killing us as a country.
Take a steam train. Look at it not as a piece of nostalgia. We need to try to recall what they meant at the time.
They were scary, futuristic, fast, dangerous. They were adventure.
That was what Britain was all about. We've lost this as we try to preserve rust.
0 -
Who are the lib dems?TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Evelyn Waugh, (via cousin Jasper) in Brideshead Revisited - Beware the Anglo-Catholics. They're all sodomites with unpleasant accents.PeterC said:
Anglo-catholicism is aesthetically magnificent. Theologically I feel it has become hopelessly compromised, wedged between a silly pretence to be wholly Roman on the one side and trying to accommodate the authority of female bishops on the other.Charles said:
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.0 -
A few days ago Malc revealed that, while incredibly drunk in Texas, he ate a frog. The man is a hero. Whatever people say about "too many non-political non-betting posts on PB," I know my life would feel far less complete if he had never told us that.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Ah I see.John_M said:
It's like the WWI Iron Cross 2nd class. Every Tom, Dick and Harry's got one. You get the oak leaves if you're on the receiving end of a peroration.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
Have to say Malcolm is much more erudite when it comes to sending insults,
But then I am a bit partial to Turnips....
It tasted of chicken, apparently. Which disappointed me, since that seems to be what all meat-eaters think any new non-fishy meat tastes like, though as a vegetarian I don't really know that translates to. I had my hopes pinned on something more exotic though. If he'd said "it tasted like horse" or "tang of jellyfish" then I think I'd have awarded him a medal!0 -
Not many of them are Anglicans though - mainly PresbyteriansPaul_Bedfordshire said:
Some of them subscribe to that notion. I'm not sure that the North Siders would want to be called Catholics though.Charles said:
Anglicans are Catholics, of course.Tim_B said:
If even the catholics think the English are angels, does this mean I should rethink my CofE affiliation?Charles said:
Although, to quote Pope Gregory*, "not Angles but angels they should be called"Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.
* at least according to Henrietta Marshall, whose book remains my absolute favorite
Just not Roman Catholics.
The Anglicans pray every day for the 'universal catholic church'0 -
I thought he was an American TV host? Why does he want to start a UK political party?rcs1000 said:
He's leaving his Defence role???rottenborough said:Farron calls for new party or alliance of centre-left. Independent front page tonight.
0 -
No-one much cared that hundreds of thousands of Muslims were killed in Iraq by the actions of secular, enlightened Westerners. This is not mere historical filigree to the dozens of madmen in Europe killing perhaps a thousand Europeans in the last decade.Paul_Bedfordshire said:No one much cared when the French were similarly massacring Algerian Muslims on a far larger scale between 1830 and 1962.
0 -
Though Trafalgar fulfilled much the same function. "England has saved herself by her exertions, and will, as I trust, save Europe by her example," and all that. And before that, the Armada.Jonathan said:
Arguably this baggage holds us back. So much so its almost impossible to imagine that before 1940 this was not a part in the British identity at all.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.0 -
0
-
Fear of immigration does not correlate with actual levels of actual immigration. Compare the referendum result in London (massive immigration) with the result in the North East, or Norfolk, or Wales.viewcode said:
I looked at that UK vs US immigration fears graph and trace the data back to its original source, which is here:http://www.policyuncertainty.com/immigration_fear.html . It has indices for the US, UK, German, French and Spanish fear of immigration.rcs1000 said:
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.
Here's a thing
The UK has suffered very little from recent immigration, at least in comparison to France and Germany. But the UK's fear of immigration index is considerably higher than France's, Germany's, the US or Spain's.
I think this differential fear will distort our view of the upcoming French election, and cause us to assume Le Pen (whichever one) is more popular than reality. This has implications with respect to betting.
It's really a fear of change.0 -
The British tradition celebrates our stoicism and bravery even in defeat. Nicholson at Dehli. Wheeler at Cawnpore. The 44th at Gandamack. Pulleine's column at Isandlwana. The defence of Rorke's drift. Cavagnari at the Kabul residency. The old Contemptibles at Mons. We could go on like that for a long time.SeanT said:
Yes, possibly. But it is a fundamental part of our identity now, just as the French revolution crucially forms their self image, even though the country dates back a thousand years before 1789.Jonathan said:
Arguably this baggage holds us back. So much so its almost impossible to imagine that before 1940 this was not a part in the British identity at all.SeanT said:
Britain was exhausted by, say, 1944. And understandably. We didn't especially distinguish ourselves in D Day, tho there was particular heroism in places.anotherDave said:
I read Mr Johnson's 'Churchill Factor" recently.John_M said:
I think my most obscure books are the two volume 'Bloody Shambles' series, on the WW2 British air war in the Pacific. Pretty heavy going, but fascinating. We really don't pay as much attention to the Burma campaign as we should. Men of iron.
Apparently Stalin used to mock Churchill for the british military's reluctance to fight, and inability to win.
Bit of a surprise to me, when I was growing up WW2 propaganda films were used by the TV bods as cheap fillers, so I absorbed a version full of pluck and triumph.
Our great triumph was the Battle of Britain and the sheer moral courage of withstanding the Blitz and the rest. Standing entirely alone - and then winning. When everyone else was absent, or fallen. It's why many Europeans slightly and subconsciously resent us, even now. We have this sense of self-worth that they lost, forever.
And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
It's 1940.
That's why I love George McDonald Fraser. He really brings out that mixture of heroism and humbug that we cultivated in the 19th century. I am bloody proud to be English.0 -
The most amazing outcome of Brexit seems to be that Boris goes to see a barber.FrancisUrquhart said:Bojo in a spot of bother...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36820756 0 -
A handwringers' and losers' alliance, appealing to a small metropolitan minority.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
I hope he's cheaper than Francois Hollande's £100k hairdresser.chestnut said:
The most amazing outcome of Brexit seems to be that Boris goes to see a barber.FrancisUrquhart said:Bojo in a spot of bother...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-368207560 -
Re the videoing on phones of American cops and publishing on social media discussed up thread, this is rather interesting and takes it to a more professional level
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-367790220 -
There must be a recognised physiological label for someone who is always at the extreme of every debate - even if it is the opposite extreme from their earlier posts - but never manages to discover the happy medium?SeanT said:
The UK has suffered "very little" from recent immigration??viewcode said:
I looked at that UK vs US immigration fears graph and trace the data back to its original source, which is here:http://www.policyuncertainty.com/immigration_fear.html . It has indices for the US, UK, German, French and Spanish fear of immigration.rcs1000 said:
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.
Here's a thing
The UK has suffered very little from recent immigration, at least in comparison to France and Germany. But the UK's fear of immigration index is considerably higher than France's, Germany's, the US or Spain's.
I think this differential fear will distort our view of the upcoming French election, and cause us to assume Le Pen (whichever one) is more popular than reality. This has implications with respect to betting.
Did you overlook the 1400 white girls gang raped by racist Muslims in Rotherham alone? Or did that slip your mind?
Because it sure as hell didn't get overlooked by lots of Brexit voters. Who took the only chance they had, however clumsy, to register their distress.0 -
Does this make him a flight risk?FrancisUrquhart said:Bojo in a spot of bother...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36820756 0 -
Victoria and Albert had a Swiss Cottage also, for their kiddiesSunil_Prasannan said:
Um, yes, Jubilee line - first visited it in 2008, though would have first passed through without stopping in 1994/95.Anorak said:
And London, England has a Swiss Cottage. You can get a train there, if you're lucky.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Geneva, Switzerland has a Jardin Anglais, and a Hotel Angleterre.Tim_B said:
Anglais means English: we might be angels, but it doesn't translate that way. The French for angels is anges. It's not even close. Just dumb.Thrak said:
NIce is also called The Bay of Angels, so they appeared to conflate the two terms.Tim_B said:
The last thing I googled was during the Nice attack - a commentator on Sky (whose name mercifully escapes me at this point) - managed to say two stupid things in quick succession: translating 'Promenade des Anglais' as 'Promenade of Angels', and querying the truck drivers motivation asked if anybody could imagine what drove him to it.JosiasJessop said:IanB2 said:
I have lots of books at home, too. But, be honest, twenty years ago we might go to the bookshelf to look something up. Nowadays it's just Google or Yahoo, right? Or Wikipedia (if the answer isn't there, we can just make something up and type it in).Charles said:
I've got the advantage of another (slightly larger) building where I can store books I'm not allowed to keep at homeHurstLlama said:
Beware though; those shelves get full, then you put up more bookshelves in other rooms, even the downstairs loo, until eventually it is only the family bathroom that does not have books in it. However, still more books arrive and eventually Herself gets the hump. First it is a one in one out - for each new book you buy you have to get rid of one - but of course you circumvent this (smuggling in your latest prized acquisition). You cannot get away with that forever, of course, and then comes the big edict - get rid of books. Its awful, aside from my collection of first edition Flashman, just about my entire collection of fiction had to go. Some of those books were friends.Charles said:
Having a small library is a great idea, but you have to be careful.
I've slowly been getting rid of my paperback novels and replacing them on Kindle: one I couldn't part with 'Code Complete' though; perhaps the best book ever written about software development. And it's by Microsoft. Ahem.0 -
Indeed, good luck to both of us! I wish I had the courage of my convictions a month ago to get 1000 to 1!stjohn said:
BigRich. You highlighted Gary Johnson's POTUS prospects about a month ago. I had never heard of him or the Libertarian Party at the time. After a bit of googling I backed him on Betfair at 1000.BigRich said:
Many thanks for you help, I now understand the difference, and have placed my first ever Political bet, no my first real bet of any type!Pong said:
Not a stupid question at all!BigRich said:
Many thanks, at 450/1 I will do this!Pong said:BigRich said:Pulpstar said:Pong said:Nate Silver Verified account
@NateSilver538
Gary Johnson up to 9.3% in our national poll average, his high point of the year so far.
??
But I don't quite understand how it could be 450/1 on one site and then 33/1 to lay on another site, what is stopping somebody backing on one site and laying on another, and then overall making money whatever the outcome? sorry if this is a stupid question.
Predictit only accepts US customers, Betfair explicitly rejects US customers.
So form now on, when people accuse me of being mad to belief Gary Johnson has a chance I will be able to say I am putting my money where my mouth is!
Good luck to us both!
To recap, the reasons I think that The Librarian party candidate Gary Johnson may be the next POTUS is:
1) Get over 15% in the opinion poles to get in the debates, with both of the main party candidates so unpopular some people will at least tell pollsters that they are backing him to avoid being associated with the other 2.
2) Debates are always levelers, last time Romney was lagging and therefor got a boost out of them. in 2010 in the UK when Clegg was on the stage hear in the UK, he got a huge boost and was even in second place for a time! I could go on.
3) he doesn't need to win 270 Electoral Collage Votes, he just needs to win sufficient to stop ether of the other 2 wining an out right majority. with the other 2 focusing much of there time, money and effort in 12 or so states, there are plenty that will be ignored, and he can appeal to Dems in Republican states to stop Trump in that state and Republicans in Dem states to stop Hilary,
4) if no candidate has 270 ECVs then it foes to the house of congress, where I believe there are sufficient Libertarian leaning Republicans, to team up with the Democrats and nominate Johnson as preferable to Trump.
Its still a long shot, but better than 430 to 1! and more to the point I would much rather be cheering his victory than ether Trump or Hillary!0 -
http://www.healthguidance.org/entry/16426/1/The-Psychology-of-Extremism.htmlIanB2 said:
There must be a recognised physiological label for someone who is always at the extreme of every debate - even if it is the opposite extreme from their earlier posts - but never manages to discover the happy medium?SeanT said:
The UK has suffered "very little" from recent immigration??viewcode said:
I looked at that UK vs US immigration fears graph and trace the data back to its original source, which is here:http://www.policyuncertainty.com/immigration_fear.html . It has indices for the US, UK, German, French and Spanish fear of immigration.rcs1000 said:
But we've had massive numbers of terrorist attacks in France in the last year, and Le Pen has gone backwards against Juppe - from getting 36% to around 30% today.
Here's a thing
The UK has suffered very little from recent immigration, at least in comparison to France and Germany. But the UK's fear of immigration index is considerably higher than France's, Germany's, the US or Spain's.
I think this differential fear will distort our view of the upcoming French election, and cause us to assume Le Pen (whichever one) is more popular than reality. This has implications with respect to betting.
Did you overlook the 1400 white girls gang raped by racist Muslims in Rotherham alone? Or did that slip your mind?
Because it sure as hell didn't get overlooked by lots of Brexit voters. Who took the only chance they had, however clumsy, to register their distress.0 -
Did either taste of chicken?SeanT said:
I've eaten frog. I've also eaten DRIED frog, in Cambodia.MyBurningEars said:
A few days ago Malc revealed that, while incredibly drunk in Texas, he ate a frog. The man is a hero. Whatever people say about "too many non-political non-betting posts on PB," I know my life would feel far less complete if he had never told us that.Paul_Bedfordshire said:
Ah I see.John_M said:
It's like the WWI Iron Cross 2nd class. Every Tom, Dick and Harry's got one. You get the oak leaves if you're on the receiving end of a peroration.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Is there a special badge you get for being insulted here by Sean, or do I have to commission a special T shirt?
Have to say Malcolm is much more erudite when it comes to sending insults,
But then I am a bit partial to Turnips....
It tasted of chicken, apparently. Which disappointed me, since that seems to be what all meat-eaters think any new non-fishy meat tastes like, though as a vegetarian I don't really know that translates to. I had my hopes pinned on something more exotic though. If he'd said "it tasted like horse" or "tang of jellyfish" then I think I'd have awarded him a medal!
Let me tell you, the fresh frog is ambrosia, in comparison.0 -
I am not so sure that the US will welcome these opinion poles?BigRich said:
Indeed, good luck to both of us! I wish I had the courage of my convictions a month ago to get 1000 to 1!stjohn said:
Good luck to us both!BigRich said:
Many thanks for you help, I now understand the difference, and have placed my first ever Political bet, no my first real bet of any type!Pong said:
Not a stupid question at all!BigRich said:
Many thanks, at 450/1 I will do this!Pong said:BigRich said:Pulpstar said:Pong said:Nate Silver Verified account
@NateSilver538
Gary Johnson up to 9.3% in our national poll average, his high point of the year so far.
??
But I don't quite understand how it could be 450/1 on one site and then 33/1 to lay on another site, what is stopping somebody backing on one site and laying on another, and then overall making money whatever the outcome? sorry if this is a stupid question.
Predictit only accepts US customers, Betfair explicitly rejects US customers.
So form now on, when people accuse me of being mad to belief Gary Johnson has a chance I will be able to say I am putting my money where my mouth is!
To recap, the reasons I think that The Librarian party candidate Gary Johnson may be the next POTUS is:
1) Get over 15% in the opinion poles to get in the debates, with both of the main party candidates so unpopular some people will at least tell pollsters that they are backing him to avoid being associated with the other 2.
2) Debates are always levelers, last time Romney was lagging and therefor got a boost out of them. in 2010 in the UK when Clegg was on the stage hear in the UK, he got a huge boost and was even in second place for a time! I could go on.
3) he doesn't need to win 270 Electoral Collage Votes, he just needs to win sufficient to stop ether of the other 2 wining an out right majority. with the other 2 focusing much of there time, money and effort in 12 or so states, there are plenty that will be ignored, and he can appeal to Dems in Republican states to stop Trump in that state and Republicans in Dem states to stop Hilary,
4) if no candidate has 270 ECVs then it foes to the house of congress, where I believe there are sufficient Libertarian leaning Republicans, to team up with the Democrats and nominate Johnson as preferable to Trump.
Its still a long shot, but better than 430 to 1! and more to the point I would much rather be cheering his victory than ether Trump or Hillary!0 -
You need to get out of London moreSeanT said:
I disagree. If they can organise it (most unlikely) there is a huge constituency out there yearning to vote for them. 48% of Brits voted IN. Many of them are very upset. And want a rematch.runnymede said:
A handwringers' and losers' alliance, appealing to a small metropolitan minority.TheScreamingEagles said:
48% was 16 million votes, remember.
A new party promising to take us back into the EU only has to get 10 million votes, and they likely win the GE.
What will fox them is time and party politics. But there is a prize to be had, if they get lucky.0 -
Sadly I think the odds are right. A self-confessed current pot user is not going to become president, and the party has even more nut-jobs in it than usual for American politics.BigRich said:
Indeed, good luck to both of us! I wish I had the courage of my convictions a month ago to get 1000 to 1!stjohn said:
BigRich. You highlighted Gary Johnson's POTUS prospects about a month ago. I had never heard of him or the Libertarian Party at the time. After a bit of googling I backed him on Betfair at 1000.BigRich said:
Many thanks for you help, I now understand the difference, and have placed my first ever Political bet, no my first real bet of any type!Pong said:
Not a stupid question at all!BigRich said:
Many thanks, at 450/1 I will do this!Pong said:BigRich said:Pulpstar said:Pong said:Nate Silver Verified account
@NateSilver538
Gary Johnson up to 9.3% in our national poll average, his high point of the year so far.
??
But I don't quite understand how it could be 450/1 on one site and then 33/1 to lay on another site, what is stopping somebody backing on one site and laying on another, and then overall making money whatever the outcome? sorry if this is a stupid question.
Predictit only accepts US customers, Betfair explicitly rejects US customers.
So form now on, when people accuse me of being mad to belief Gary Johnson has a chance I will be able to say I am putting my money where my mouth is!
Good luck to us both!
To recap, the reasons I think that The Librarian party candidate Gary Johnson may be the next POTUS is:0 -
Everyone will feel a lot better once they've experienced our forthcoming two-day summer. We'll all bask under the healing rays of a Brexit sun.SeanT said:
I disagree. If they can organise it (most unlikely) there is a huge constituency out there yearning to vote for them. 48% of Brits voted IN. Many of them are very upset. And want a rematch.runnymede said:
A handwringers' and losers' alliance, appealing to a small metropolitan minority.TheScreamingEagles said:
48% was 16 million votes, remember.
A new party promising to take us back into the EU only has to get 10 million votes, and they likely win the GE.
What will fox them is time and party politics. But there is a prize to be had, if they get lucky.
Mind you, thank God I don't have to commute any more. I shall remember Southern's customers in my prayers.0 -
Certainly shouldn't be written off at this stage. The 48% are, from my anecdotal experience, bloody angry and looking for a home, and that certainly isn't the fratricidal cesspit the Labour party has become.SeanT said:
I disagree. If they can organise it (most unlikely) there is a huge constituency out there yearning to vote for them. 48% of Brits voted IN. Many of them are very upset. And want a rematch.runnymede said:
A handwringers' and losers' alliance, appealing to a small metropolitan minority.TheScreamingEagles said:
48% was 16 million votes, remember.
A new party promising to take us back into the EU only has to get 10 million votes, and they likely win the GE.
What will fox them is time and party politics. But there is a prize to be had, if they get lucky.0 -
Baton Rouge - Sky News
The gunman who shot dead three police officers in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, was the same man later shot dead, according to authorities. The gunman has been named in US media reports as Gavin Eugene Long, an African-American from Kansas City who celebrated his 29th birthday today. He is reported to have been a Dean's List student at the University of Alabama in 2012.
Two people have been detained in another town called Addis, which is near Baton Rouge, and called them "persons of interest".0 -
I think the POTUS election is degenerating to the point at which the slogan will be "Vote for the bankrupt, not the liar." or vice versa depending on your affiliation.williamglenn said:
Sadly I think the odds are right. A self-confessed current pot user is not going to become president, and the party has even more nut-jobs in it than usual for American politics.BigRich said:
Indeed, good luck to both of us! I wish I had the courage of my convictions a month ago to get 1000 to 1!stjohn said:
BigRich. You highlighted Gary Johnson's POTUS prospects about a month ago. I had never heard of him or the Libertarian Party at the time. After a bit of googling I backed him on Betfair at 1000.BigRich said:
Many thanks for you help, I now understand the difference, and have placed my first ever Political bet, no my first real bet of any type!Pong said:
Not a stupid question at all!BigRich said:
Many thanks, at 450/1 I will do this!Pong said:BigRich said:Pulpstar said:Pong said:Nate Silver Verified account
@NateSilver538
Gary Johnson up to 9.3% in our national poll average, his high point of the year so far.
??
But I don't quite understand how it could be 450/1 on one site and then 33/1 to lay on another site, what is stopping somebody backing on one site and laying on another, and then overall making money whatever the outcome? sorry if this is a stupid question.
Predictit only accepts US customers, Betfair explicitly rejects US customers.
So form now on, when people accuse me of being mad to belief Gary Johnson has a chance I will be able to say I am putting my money where my mouth is!
Good luck to us both!
To recap, the reasons I think that The Librarian party candidate Gary Johnson may be the next POTUS is:0 -
Look to what happened in Scotland. The side that lost the vote had the anger and energy to prosper.rottenborough said:
Certainly shouldn't be written off at this stage. The 48% are, from my anecdotal experience, bloody angry and looking for a home, and that certainly isn't the fratricidal cesspit the Labour party has become.SeanT said:
I disagree. If they can organise it (most unlikely) there is a huge constituency out there yearning to vote for them. 48% of Brits voted IN. Many of them are very upset. And want a rematch.runnymede said:
A handwringers' and losers' alliance, appealing to a small metropolitan minority.TheScreamingEagles said:
48% was 16 million votes, remember.
A new party promising to take us back into the EU only has to get 10 million votes, and they likely win the GE.
What will fox them is time and party politics. But there is a prize to be had, if they get lucky.0 -
he has never been the same since getting done for racefixing at lingfield, still at least he didnt go into coalition with the centre right and sell out his lifelong compatriots by signing them up to an austerity agenda which collapsed their partywilliamglenn said:
I thought he was an American TV host? Why does he want to start a UK political party?rcs1000 said:
He's leaving his Defence role???rottenborough said:Farron calls for new party or alliance of centre-left. Independent front page tonight.
0 -
Top quality autocorrect!BigRich said:The Librarian party
0 -
I thought this was perfectly expressed by a witless girl during one of the referendum debates who started ranting that we should leave because we're better than them.SeanT said:And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
48 minutes in:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07czwhx/how-should-i-vote-the-eu-debate0 -
or as Groucho would say - "How many Frenchmen can't be wrong?"williamglenn said:
I thought this was perfectly expressed by a witless girl during one of the referendum debates who started ranting that we should leave because we're better than them.SeanT said:And these things are handed on, via cultural DNA. Without the Battle of Britain there would be no Brexit.
It may be a foolish national delusion, but it exists. It's got nothing to do with nostalgia for Empire, as so many europhiles would have it.
48 minutes in:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07czwhx/how-should-i-vote-the-eu-debate0
This discussion has been closed.