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— Nicholas Watt (@nicholaswatt) July 12, 2016 (Newsnight)
It's game over for @jeremycorbyn ally tells me after hearing @UKLabour NEC votes to hold secret ballot0 -
They can't be that clever if they went to Oxford if they are Corbynites/dyed in the wool Labour supportersFenster said:Imagine how you would feel if you were a Corbyn supporter and they did this to your man?
I work with two clever brothers who both went to Oxford. They are dyed in the wool Labour.
Both are leaving the party if Corbyn is not on the ballot because they say it will be an affront to democracy.0 -
Watson keeps his reputation as a fixer.0
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Calm down every body
1) There's been no vote yet
2) Even if Jez isn't on the ballot then this is going to court
3) Courts are funny places, full stuffed with lawyers0 -
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
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If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?0
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*cough* think that was me....Jobabob said:
He tipped the NEC to destroy Corbyn. (Which opens up plenty of long-odds leader bets from the Right)Pulpstar said:
But what is the tip ?Jobabob said:Corbyn could be in a spot of bother here. If so, @rottenborough probably a very strong candidate for Tipster of the Year.
We shall see.0 -
It's very Charles I not recognising the court's right to try him.TheScreamingEagles said:
Hopefully not with the same result.0 -
To continue Ruth Davidson's analogy, the NEC have removed Jeremy's trousers and are just about to f[MODERATED}0
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Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?0 -
The 'Labour Vote' are not collectively Corbyn loyalists. The membership are however, and I'm not sure how having so many people out of touch with the rest of the country as Labour members is exactly benefitting Labour.Danny565 said:
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
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You seriously think that half of Labour's current vote would walk away if Corbyn were not leader?Danny565 said:
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
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It is better than him winning the leadership election.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
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Not a good analogy for the right wing of Labour.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's very Charles I not recognising the court's right to try him.TheScreamingEagles said:
Hopefully not with the same result.
Of course they'll execute Corbyn and be rid of him for a few years, but then his successors will be in power in a few years time for many centuries to come
Posthumous execution for Tom Watson?0 -
Short answer - yes!Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
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I make that 3 votes out of 17 million.OllyT said:
Pity people didn't suss what a bunch of chancers and charlatans the Leave campaigners were before June 23rd!CarlottaVance said:
Funny....it used to be a badge of honour.......but then they all ran away.....logical_song said:
All gone, all gone, all gone. All those Tory Brexiteers, gone, gone, gone. A merry, plucky, shameless band, who scaled the heights of the greasy pole, surveyed the view, blanched and threw themselves off. First Boris Johnson, wobbling with vertigo, then shoved from the platform by Michael Gove. Then Mr Gove himself, somehow unable to balance on his own. And now, finally, Andrea Leadsom; a woman who had simply never before climbed so high, didn’t have the coat for it and couldn’t stand the weather
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/andrea-leadsoms-demise-signals-the-end-of-the-nasty-party-h3k3nbwsz?shareToken=f07be91cd860fc1b5e8cd829bf19c2ac0 -
Agreed. This is a moment of fun. Corbyn will be on the ballot and will be re-elected. I would not be surprised if after all this the NEC ends up backing him. That would be very Labour.TheScreamingEagles said:Calm down every body
1) There's been no vote yet
2) Even if Jez isn't on the ballot then this is going to court
3) Courts are funny places, full stuffed with lawyers
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Corbyn isn't off the ballot - he just has to find 50 MPs/MEPs.
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In fairness you may have done so too Ian!IanB2 said:
*cough* think that was me....Jobabob said:
He tipped the NEC to destroy Corbyn. (Which opens up plenty of long-odds leader bets from the Right)Pulpstar said:
But what is the tip ?Jobabob said:Corbyn could be in a spot of bother here. If so, @rottenborough probably a very strong candidate for Tipster of the Year.
We shall see.
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As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.0
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and I bet they won't even get their three quid back!Danny565 said:
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
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I wonder whether it's going to be an Eagle coronation or a contest with Smith.0
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@Danny565 http://www.libdems.org.uk/Danny565 said:
Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?
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This is an elongated, very political trademark dispute. Labour is splitting. But who gets the brand is what counts.Danny565 said:For all their talk of wanting "unity", the PLP are now clearly wanting Labour to split, and don't care about the damage it will do.
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recuse - voluntary step out of the meeting because of a conflictSimonStClare said:G-live: - According to Channel 4 News’ Michael Crick, Jeremy Corbyn is now refusing to leave the room. As Labour leader Corbyn has a seat on the NEC, but some members think he should have to recuse* himself when his situation is being discussed.
*excuse?0 -
Scott_P said:
@stephenkb: "Watson has stitched it up", texts senior loyalist.
Arise Sir Tom...
If Watson has done this he will go down as a legend of the Labour Right if he never lifts another finger again0 -
Rules is rules.Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
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The Joker has just come up with a novel method of choosing our next Labour Party leader:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCXbib9MahE0 -
Ha! I know. English literature types. Dad is a schoolteacher. They aren't Corbynites but they are lefty.TheScreamingEagles said:
They can't be that clever if they went to Oxford if they are Corbynites/dyed in the wool Labour supportersFenster said:Imagine how you would feel if you were a Corbyn supporter and they did this to your man?
I work with two clever brothers who both went to Oxford. They are dyed in the wool Labour.
Both are leaving the party if Corbyn is not on the ballot because they say it will be an affront to democracy.0 -
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Mr. Flashman (deceased), is there a time limit for Corbyn to gather such allies, which would appear to be few and far between?0
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Stephen Kinnock @ 75s on Betfair.0
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Poor Jezza - I'm already feeling nostalgic.
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You really want the hard left to infiltrate the Lib Dems. That's like Tories asking for UKIP members to rejoin!Pulpstar said:
@Danny565 http://www.libdems.org.uk/Danny565 said:
Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?0 -
There is no TOTY vacancy .... you'll need 51 nominations to mount a challenge, whereas the incumbent, namely moi, will not be move from my throne.Jobabob said:Corbyn could be in a spot of bother here. If so, @rottenborough probably a very strong candidate for Tipster of the Year.
Meanwhile ....
Tittle tattle coming my way .... WOW just WOW .... this will not be a tinkering at the edges May cabinet or Cameron-lite operation.0 -
One doesn't want to see scaffolding on WhitehallLuckyguy1983 said:
It's very Charles I not recognising the court's right to try him.TheScreamingEagles said:
Hopefully not with the same result.0 -
I didn't say "the Laboyur vote are collectively Corbyn loyalists". But I do think Corbyn is unquestionably closer to the average Labour voter than the clueless PLP are. The proof of that is the EU Referendum: the Remain campaign (which the PLP would want to base Labour party strategy on) was defeated in two-thirds of current Labour seats.The_Apocalypse said:
The 'Labour Vote' are not collectively Corbyn loyalists. The membership are however, and I'm not sure how having so many people out of touch with the rest of the country as Labour members is exactly benefitting Labour.Danny565 said:
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
The economically conservative / socially liberal party that the PLP wants, with an uncharismatic Establishment politician at the helm, would be destroyed outside of a few middle-class parts of London. But it's now clear that the PLP don't care about how much they lose elections, as long as they get to keep their own particular so-called "centre-ground" ideology in tact.0 -
http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/theresa-may-boring-and-dangerous-1321705512
Devastating critique of May by Oborne. Just Devastating.
What have the conservatives done?
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What happens if say 50 Tory MPs defect to Labour, nominate Corbyn, then defect back?0
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Do you seriously consider @Danny565 on the hard left o_O ?!MaxPB said:
You really want the hard left to infiltrate the Lib Dems. That's like Tories asking for UKIP members to rejoin!Pulpstar said:
@Danny565 http://www.libdems.org.uk/Danny565 said:
Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?0 -
Mr. Borough, I agree, but the rules seem to indicate pretty strongly (to me, at least*) that Corbyn should automatically be on the ballot.
*Disclaimer: I am not on the National Executive Committee of the Labour Party.0 -
Mr Dancer, I'm sure Major didn't need to be nominated to stand against Redwood in 1995?Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
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38 if he resigns IIRC. Although for life of me I can't understand why it is less.TGOHF said:Corbyn isn't off the ballot - he just has to find 50 MPs/MEPs.
But anyway, he wont get them.
Not on ballot = finished = pointless legal action = finished.
Police will be busy though dealing with MP protection for next couple of months.0 -
If you think I'm on the left of the party, then you're in for a shock when you see the reactions of most members if the PLP coup succeeds.Jobabob said:
I'm in the minority of the party which didn't make Jez my first preference last year (or even second preference come to that), and in the even smaller minority of the party who wants to renew Trident.0 -
The Liberal Democrats want to ignore the referendum result and Labour want to keep a man who won 60% of the vote in a four-way contest off the ballot. They don't like democracy much, do they?0
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He was nominated by, I think, Ian Lang and Brian MawhinneySunil_Prasannan said:
Mr Dancer, I'm sure Major didn't need to be nominated to stand against Redwood in 1995?Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
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Trouser-dropping farce.TheScreamingEagles said:What happens if say 50 Tory MPs defect to Labour, nominate Corbyn, then defect back?
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All this assumes Corbyn cant find 50 nominations. On paper he has 40.
The PLP, however, have no choice but to oust him if they want to get power and be useful. Here is the thing, the members and unions got him in but is their voting support in a GE the difference between a Labour win or loss?
I'm not sure. Take out leftist cranks, non voters, opportunists who bought the 3 quid ticket and so on and you'll shred a lot of his party base but how many of the public is that, who actually vote in a GE?
I suspect the same ground level Labour activists will still be there and will the unions close the chequebook? Maybe but not totally and will it matter as much as it used to?
The upside in real elections that count in getting votes from the masses is greater than the downside of some peeling off of some currently in the party, some of whom the party may not want anyway.
Only one problem, no sign that those two who have put their head above the parapet are going to fair well enough with the general public.
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Dr. Prasannan, that appears to agree with me 0
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It's Oborne...taffys said:http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/theresa-may-boring-and-dangerous-1321705512
Devastating critique of May by Oborne. Just Devastating.
What have the conservatives done?0 -
He never should have been on the ballot in the first place. Lets forget this ever happened.Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
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BBC Nick Watt now saying Corbyn ally says it is "game over"0
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I can see no other legitimate interpretation of those rules. For it to be possible to have a challenge, you need to have an incumbent to be challenged. Therefore the challengers have to secure the right to challenge - not the incumbent.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Borough, I agree, but the rules seem to indicate pretty strongly (to me, at least*) that Corbyn should automatically be on the ballot.
*Disclaimer: I am not on the National Executive Committee of the Labour Party.0 -
why does the proportion of lost members and lost votes differ? Is there some further quirk of Labour membership that I'm not aware of?Danny565 said:
Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?0 -
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36771596
I dont see how a faling pound helps them since they are based in America?0 -
Nope. The Establishment is reasserting their authority over the Plebs this week.EdgwareJoel said:The Liberal Democrats want to ignore the referendum result and Labour want to keep a man who won 60% of the vote in a four-way contest off the ballot. They don't like democracy much, do they?
What the upshot of all this is at the next general election is anybody's guess but UKIP should be very seriously thinking about the possibility of holding the balance of power.0 -
Nick Watt looks like a sixth-former although he's probably about 40.rottenborough said:BBC Nick Watt now saying Corbyn ally says it is "game over"
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What does he mean by thatrottenborough said:BBC Nick Watt now saying Corbyn ally says it is "game over"
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Given the last two weeks, I wouldn't rule it outBigIan said:
Trouser-dropping farce.TheScreamingEagles said:What happens if say 50 Tory MPs defect to Labour, nominate Corbyn, then defect back?
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I was expecting a popcorn free day, instead the BBC top story is Corbyn calls for calm amid death threats and smashed windows and back at the NEC, Corbyn has a hissy fit and sit-in.
When will it end…!
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Oborne is all about OborneToryJim said:
It's Oborne...taffys said:http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/theresa-may-boring-and-dangerous-1321705512
Devastating critique of May by Oborne. Just Devastating.
What have the conservatives done?0 -
By "lost votes", I'm talking about Labour votes in general elections.ReggieCide said:
why does the proportion of lost members and lost votes differ? Is there some further quirk of Labour membership that I'm not aware of?Danny565 said:
Most of Labour membership gone, and half of their votes. The rump Labour left with Angela Eagle, someone who has less charisma and leadership skills than Corbyn.Morris_Dancer said:If Corbyn is off the ballot, whilst there's wailing and gnashing of teeth, isn't that the better result, by far, for Labour?
That's the "better result"?0 -
Luckyguy1983 said:
Poor Jezza - I'm already feeling nostalgic.
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The Labour vote would have to be Corbyn loyalists in order to walk away from the Labour party if Corbyn is not on the ballot. The EU is just one issue - and in any case, a big reason as to why so many Labour voters voted for Brexit is due to the issue of immigration. Who advocates freedom of movement and is incredibly pro-immigration? One Jeremy Corbyn is, the guy you claim is closer to the average voter than the PLP are. The PLP want the Labour party at this stage to be a party committed to attaining power via parliamentary democracy, as @SouthamObserver explained so eloquently in his piece yesterday, that I really recommend you read. All fractions of the PLP have turned on Corbyn - from the right of the party to the centre-left. That kind of debunks your idea that this is all about the preservation of a Blairite centre-ground ideology. This is basically about the survival of the Labour party.Danny565 said:
I didn't say "the Laboyur vote are collectively Corbyn loyalists". But I do think Corbyn is unquestionably closer to the average Labour voter than the clueless PLP are. The proof of that is the EU Referendum: the Remain campaign (which the PLP would want to base Labour party strategy on) was defeated in two-thirds of current Labour seats.The_Apocalypse said:
The 'Labour Vote' are not collectively Corbyn loyalists. The membership are however, and I'm not sure how having so many people out of touch with the rest of the country as Labour members is exactly benefitting Labour.Danny565 said:
Yeah, along with most of the Labour membership, and atleast half of Labour's current vote. That's what the PLP are prepared to let happen if it means they get one of "their own" installed.The_Apocalypse said:
That will be a small price to pay in comparison to what could happen if Corbyn wins the leadership again.AndyJS said:
If he's denied a place on the ballot, will he and 15 other Labour MPs resign their seats in the Commons? They can't just take this lying down, surely.The_Apocalypse said:What a laugh Corbyn is. You cannot make this up.
The economically conservative / socially liberal party that the PLP wants, with an uncharismatic Establishment politician at the helm, would be destroyed outside of a few middle-class parts of London. But it's now clear that the PLP don't care about how much they lose elections, as long as they get to keep their own particular so-called "centre-ground" ideology in tact.0 -
he sounds like it too.AndyJS said:
Nick Watt looks like a sixth-former although he's probably about 40.rottenborough said:BBC Nick Watt now saying Corbyn ally says it is "game over"
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As far as he is concerned, he has the overwhelming support of the membership - and thus the damage to unity comes from 172 traitors in the PLPJonathan said:
Why single out the PLP? All parties are at fault. Corbyn is leader, he is accountable for party unity.Danny565 said:For all their talk of wanting "unity", the PLP are now clearly wanting Labour to split, and don't care about the damage it will do.
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It's less because it is for challengers only. There is no justification for excluding an incumbent.rottenborough said:
38 if he resigns IIRC. Although for life of me I can't understand why it is less.TGOHF said:Corbyn isn't off the ballot - he just has to find 50 MPs/MEPs.
But anyway, he wont get them.
Not on ballot = finished = pointless legal action = finished.
Police will be busy though dealing with MP protection for next couple of months.0 -
''What the upshot of all this is at the next general election is anybody's guess but UKIP should be very seriously thinking about the possibility of holding the balance of power. ''
If May lasts that long.0 -
The rules seem to show quite clearly it is only challengers that need nominations!rottenborough said:
Rules is rules.Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
Could the new Labour members press ahead with deselections without Corbyn in place?0 -
I know. That's where he has gone wrong. His job was to represent and lead the whole party, not just his friends and supporters.oxfordsimon said:
As far as he is concerned, he has the overwhelming support of the membership - and thus the damage to unity comes from 172 traitors in the PLPJonathan said:
Why single out the PLP? All parties are at fault. Corbyn is leader, he is accountable for party unity.Danny565 said:For all their talk of wanting "unity", the PLP are now clearly wanting Labour to split, and don't care about the damage it will do.
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Keep chomping. All hell will break lose when the NEC votes and finishes meeting tonight.SimonStClare said:I was expecting a popcorn free day, instead the BBC top story is Corbyn calls for calm amid death threats and smashed windows and back at the NEC, Corbyn has a hissy fit and sit-in.
When will it end…!0 -
Mr Dancer, that's the Tory example closest to the present Labour situation. Though one could also mention Sir Antony Meyer standing against Maggie, as well as Hezza.Morris_Dancer said:Dr. Prasannan, that appears to agree with me
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The Labour party is a complete cancer that really needs to be cut out from our democracy.0
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Cameron is going to fall 91 days short of John Major's length of time in Downing Street.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_the_United_Kingdom_by_tenure0 -
@tobyperkinsmp: On the day an MP has a brick put through their window for doing their job, people asking why volunteers on NEC want a secret ballot?0
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He is clearly of the belief that he is leading - by representing the will of the majority.Jonathan said:
I know. That's where he has gone wrong. His job was to represent and lead the whole party, not just his friends and supporters.oxfordsimon said:
As far as he is concerned, he has the overwhelming support of the membership - and thus the damage to unity comes from 172 traitors in the PLPJonathan said:
Why single out the PLP? All parties are at fault. Corbyn is leader, he is accountable for party unity.Danny565 said:For all their talk of wanting "unity", the PLP are now clearly wanting Labour to split, and don't care about the damage it will do.
It is impossible in the real world to do that without leading in Parliament as well - but Jezza doesn't live in the real world.
He wants a revolution - and to achieve that, you have to expect victims and collateral damage.0 -
They paid in sterling. Sterling has dropped ~20% since Brexit.nunu said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36771596
I dont see how a faling pound helps them since they are based in America?
That's what might prevent a slump in London property prices.0 -
Nick P said it was possible IIRC, but only when the subject comes up as in re-selection for next GE, which will be a couple of years time with fixed term nonsense. But I could be wrong on that.EdgwareJoel said:
The rules seem to show quite clearly it is only challengers that need nominations!rottenborough said:
Rules is rules.Morris_Dancer said:As an aside, it is remarkable the incumbent leader could be kept out of the battle to lead a party after he won a landslide victory less than a year ago.
Could the new Labour members press ahead with deselections without Corbyn in place?
By then the mass of Corbynista will have forgotten, got bored, joined the Greens or formed their own party (apart from ones doing time for vandalism and death threats).0 -
Well the Midlands and "the north" could very easily go to UKIP. Scotland has gone to the SNP already. Presumably by eviscerating Jezza they'll take a major hit in London (maybe to Lib-Dems or Green?)Pulpstar said:The Labour party is a complete cancer that really needs to be cut out from our democracy.
What does that leave for Labour? Wales?0 -
It will end in some lawyers getting richer and more things getting smashed.rottenborough said:
Keep chomping. All hell will break lose when the NEC votes and finishes meeting tonight.SimonStClare said:I was expecting a popcorn free day, instead the BBC top story is Corbyn calls for calm amid death threats and smashed windows and back at the NEC, Corbyn has a hissy fit and sit-in.
When will it end…!0 -
Fwiw, opinion polls put Corbyn's approval rating among Labour voters at around 60% -- that's not great for the standards of a normal party leader, since they should be getting near-universal support from their own supporters if they want a hope of winning over voters from other parties - but, when we're talking about a potential split in the party, it does rather suggest that the MORE THAN HALF of current Labour voters who approve of him WOULD walk away if he was ousted, no?The_Apocalypse said:
The Labour vote would have to be Corbyn loyalists in order to walk away from the Labour party if Corbyn is not on the ballot. The EU is just one issue - and in any case, a big reason as to why so many Labour voters voted for Brexit is due to the issue of immigration. Who advocates freedom of movement and is incredibly pro-immigration? One Jeremy Corbyn is, the guy you claim is closer to the average voter than the PLP are. The PLP want the Labour party at this stage to be a party committed to attaining power via parliamentary democracy, as @SouthamObserver explained so eloquently in his piece yesterday, that I really recommend you read. All fractions of the PLP have turned on Corbyn - from the right of the party to the centre-left. That kind of debunks your idea that this is all about the preservation of a Blairite centre-ground ideology. This is basically about the survival of the Labour party.
In any case, voters wouldn't have to particularly like Corbyn to support a breakaway party -- they would just have to think he was a lesser evil than continuity Labour led by Angela Eagle. And the referendum does show that the PLP are further away from heartlands opinion than Corbyn is -- I don't think the EU is just "one issue", it encapsulates the whole of the Labour moderates' worldview, and it was utterly rejected by Labour seats.
I have met countless Labour voters who voted Leave "in real life" these past few months, and believe me, as little as they think of Corbyn, it's nothing compared to the RAGE that they have for "career politicians" promising more of the same misery that's currently in the country (which, rightly or wrongly, is what the Remain campaign was perceived as).0 -
They paid in sterling. Sterling has dropped ~20% since Brexit.
Does anyone believe that?0 -
Wonder where The Blessed Theresa will finish up on that list?AndyJS said:Cameron is going to fall 91 days short of John Major's length of time in Downing Street.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_the_United_Kingdom_by_tenure
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Sorry mate, we are all stupid racist Brexiteers in Wales.GIN1138 said:
Well the Midlands and "the north" could very easily go to UKIP. Scotland has gone to the SNP already. Presumably by eviscerating Jezza they'll take a major hit in London (maybe to Lib-Dems or Green?)Pulpstar said:The Labour party is a complete cancer that really needs to be cut out from our democracy.
What does that leave for Labour? Wales?0 -
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"Maybe Labour is already dead"
https://www.totalpolitics.com/articles/opinion/abi-wilkinson-labour-has-eagle-it-needs-miracle0 -
National - SurveyMonkey/NBC - Sample 7,869
Clinton 47 .. Trump 44
https://www.scribd.com/document/318010091/NBC-News-SurveyMonkey-Toplines-and-Methodology-7-4-7-100 -
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Been working my through the Yes Minister and Yes PM boxset recently.
Nothing was as farcical as this Labour leadership contest. You simply couldn't write it.0 -
Ok - are you IDS/Bill Cash/Andrea/John Baron, etc, etc. We have a right to know...taffys said:''What the upshot of all this is at the next general election is anybody's guess but UKIP should be very seriously thinking about the possibility of holding the balance of power. ''
If May lasts that long.0 -
The reports from Tory activists, as well as the polls from the pollsters who got sonething right in the past (just saying), would've meant it wasn't worth having the referendum as Remain would win by a double figure marginLuckyguy1983 said:
So we'll never know.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yes we do, the YouGov polls show she was going to get gubbed, JohnO and ToryJim both influential in Tory circles also indicated an absolute gubbing for LeadsomLuckyguy1983 said:
We'll never know.TheScreamingEagles said:
Leadsom is a joke. I'm gutted she pulled out yesterday. She would have been gubbed in the members' vote.logical_song said:
Fellow Tory Lady, too.TheScreamingEagles said:Heh
.@RuthDavidsonMSP sticks the boot in at Lobby Lunch: "Before politics, I single-handedly saved the banking system. Speaking as a mother..."
.@RuthDavidsonMSP: "I didn't say that, you can't report that, and it would be gutter journalism of the lowest order..."0 -
Can someone explain what's actually happening today?0
