I’m delighted OFCOM has endorsed my right to disbelieve the Duke & Duchess of Sussex’s incendiary claims to Oprah Winfrey, many of which have proven to be untrue. This is a resounding victory for free speech and a resounding defeat for Princess Pinocchios. Do I get my job back? https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1432995892353765377?s=20
Excellent. Glad to see the regulator standing up for freedom of speech.
Maybe ITV might wish to reflect on their treatment of Mr Morgan, in light of this ruling.
Hang on. Didn't he quit in a strop?
No, ITV demanded he apologised, he said no, they gave him the heave-ho.
You are thinking about when he flounced off in a huff for 10 mins, then came back.
The newly appointed head of forthcoming super-regulator Ofcom, Lord David Currie, has denied claims from opposition MPs that he was appointed because of his links to the government. He insisted that the fact he has donated money to the Labour Party in the past and has given economic advice to Tony Blair and Gordon Brown played no part in his appointment.
I’m delighted OFCOM has endorsed my right to disbelieve the Duke & Duchess of Sussex’s incendiary claims to Oprah Winfrey, many of which have proven to be untrue. This is a resounding victory for free speech and a resounding defeat for Princess Pinocchios. Do I get my job back? https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1432995892353765377?s=20
Excellent. Glad to see the regulator standing up for freedom of speech.
Maybe ITV might wish to reflect on their treatment of Mr Morgan, in light of this ruling.
I am not really a fan of Morgan or his style when he was on GMB, but it was demonstrable that Meghan told some absolute massive whoppers during that interview.
Oh indeed. Morgan’s a total arsehole most of the time, but standing up for freedom of speech often means defending arseholes and idiots, of whom there are plenty in the media.
Programmes should however seek be generally impartial on divisive topics, which the regulator was satisfied was the case here. Saying that someone can describe their opinions as ‘facts’, which puts them beyond critisism, is a dangerous path to go down…
I’m delighted OFCOM has endorsed my right to disbelieve the Duke & Duchess of Sussex’s incendiary claims to Oprah Winfrey, many of which have proven to be untrue. This is a resounding victory for free speech and a resounding defeat for Princess Pinocchios. Do I get my job back? https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1432995892353765377?s=20
Seems a sensible decision, he says things in a provocative way but he is not obliged to believe any claim others make.
And I assume his question about his job is rhetorical, since he went because they did not like what he said (or the reaction to it), not because it was definitely a breach of any codes.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
It's not like you're being asked to wear the branks.
If it assuages the fears of your fellow citizens at a time of national anxiety why wouldn't you? Unless it's just pure vice semaphoring and you feel the need to have conspicuous visual indication of a what icy rationalist you are.
No sephamoring.
Its uncomfortable, it makes it hot and sweaty and harder to breath and its deeply unpleasant. And in my opinion it serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever that can't be better achieved by those who are concerned wearing an FFP3 mask.
That's more enough for me. Others are free to make their own judgement. That's part of having a free society.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
Nope. Purely for masochists. And completely pointless.
I wish we would approach the natural world from a holistic Gaia starting point. Straight lines, bird lists and other “square” ways of looking at our landscape, geology and nature sap the sheer joy out of the experience. Just pull up a picnic chair and sit there for an hour or two. Just absorb nature. You don’t need to *do* anything.
Each to their own but I do agree with you about some pointless masochism. Indeed, I've increasingly come to find a middle way here: eschewing the more ridiculous challenges which you're probably right to critique, but at the same time not simply sitting on my derriere. A friend of mine asked me recently to do the three peaks challenge in Yorkshire and I was pleased simply to say 'no'. Why would belting up and down three austere peaks in 24 hours be remotely sensible, enjoyable or getting close to nature?
Of course, a lot of people use extreme exercise to challenge themselves but also to escape from things: literally running away. It's probably better than hitting the bottle but not by much.
Walking is a magnificent form of exercise if you're able to put in a good couple of hours of it each time. It's part of my covid recalibration that this is exactly what I now do every day.
Being pedantic, the Yorkshire three peaks challenge has a notional time limit of 12 hours, not 24, to complete 24 miles. The local Cave Rescue Organisation is often plucking inexperienced walkers off the Whernside descent, which is steep and not good for tiring legs, or from the slopes of Ingleborough which has many similar looking descents which head off in different directions.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
I’m delighted OFCOM has endorsed my right to disbelieve the Duke & Duchess of Sussex’s incendiary claims to Oprah Winfrey, many of which have proven to be untrue. This is a resounding victory for free speech and a resounding defeat for Princess Pinocchios. Do I get my job back? https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1432995892353765377?s=20
Excellent. Glad to see the regulator standing up for freedom of speech.
Maybe ITV might wish to reflect on their treatment of Mr Morgan, in light of this ruling.
Hang on. Didn't he quit in a strop?
No, ITV demanded he apologised, he said no, they gave him the heave-ho.
You are thinking about when he flounced off in a huff for 10 mins, then came back.
And its entirely appropriate that they're free to demand he apologises since its their platform and they're partnering with charities and others who strongly objected to what he said and how he said it.
Just because something is not illegal to say, doesn't mean that someone else is obliged to employ someone who says it.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
A typical selfish right-winger's response, fuelled by that rag the Daily Telepgraph.
It's not a personal choice if you are both infecting others (without knowing it) or becoming infected yourself which is perfectly possible double jabbed or not.
This stinks. And trouble is coming.
I'm a left winger. It is the vaccine that protects us now, not masks.
Except it isn't. We expected those double vaxxed to be immune. They aren't. We expected them to be incapable of infecting others. They can. If they were unlucky enough to catch it we did not expect them to be ill. But they are in sufficient numbers to stress our hospital system.
Vaccines are good. They massively reduce death. They reduce the risk of serious illness. But they are not going to stop Covid. Not on their own.
What is going to stop covid is everyone being infected.
Vaccines allow that to happen with a 95% reduction in pain and risk.
For the fully vaccinated masks are more likely to be detrimental than beneficial.
Would you prefer to be infected when your vaccine is wearing off ?
I would prefer not to be infected at all.
This is entirely possible as the prevalence of the virus will decrease over time. Procrastination also helps as there are likely to both be better vaccines and better therapies in time.
Perhaps and perhaps not - Delta is more prevalent and dangerous than the original strain.
So ultimately it comes down to the individual's own judgment on factors such as previous infection, vaccine status, inherent risks, employment type and lifestyle.
Of course many, perhaps most, of the the people currently being infected don't even know that they have been as they're asymptomatic.
And ultimately the more people are infected and acquire immunity the safer those who haven't been become - so it makes full sense for the fully vaccinated low risk people to come into contact with Delta now.
The World Health Organization has warned that another 236,000 people could die from COVID-19 in Europe by December 1, sounding the alarm over rising infections and stagnating vaccine rates on the continent.
Countries across the region have seen infection rates tick up as the highly transmissible Delta variant takes hold, particularly among the unvaccinated.
But empty supermarket shelves should not prompt a bout of ugly schadenfreude on the part of those (including myself) who never wanted to leave the EU in the first place. Low-paid workers are enjoying more workplace leverage than they have had for many years. We may not agree with the path taken to get here, and we might grumble about missing items on our weekly shop but our dysfunctional labour market – supporting a middle-class world of convenience and abundance – has depended for many years on a large reservoir of exploited labour. Now that it’s been choked off, I expect some workers are rejoicing.
I've certainly got some sympathy with that viewpoint. The thing is, this is potentially good for people in the (or with interest to be in the) logistics sector, maybe for other sectors if similar pressures apply,* but it also likely leads to increases in the cost of food, which - being an essential - will hit those with lower incomes more than those with higher incomes.** So I'm not yet convinced that this leads to a better standard of life for those on lower incomes.
* Logistics is a sector in which you need people driving lorries here. In some other setors jobs can be offshored (e.g. call centres) or offshore companies can outcompete if wages rise (e.g. manufacturing) ** Because food is likely a higher percentage of total costs and also because for cheaper foods transportation presumably makes up a greater amount of the total cost than more expensive food - shifting a cheap chicken from A to B must have similar cost to shifting an organic free range chicken from A to B, so if transport costs for up by X amount that will lead to a greater % increase in the price of the cheap chicken than the expensive chicken.
I’m delighted OFCOM has endorsed my right to disbelieve the Duke & Duchess of Sussex’s incendiary claims to Oprah Winfrey, many of which have proven to be untrue. This is a resounding victory for free speech and a resounding defeat for Princess Pinocchios. Do I get my job back? https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1432995892353765377?s=20
Excellent. Glad to see the regulator standing up for freedom of speech.
Maybe ITV might wish to reflect on their treatment of Mr Morgan, in light of this ruling.
Hang on. Didn't he quit in a strop?
No, ITV demanded he apologised, he said no, they gave him the heave-ho.
You are thinking about when he flounced off in a huff for 10 mins, then came back.
And its entirely appropriate that they're free to demand he apologises since its their platform and they're partnering with charities and others who strongly objected to what he said and how he said it.
Just because something is not illegal to say, doesn't mean that someone else is obliged to employ someone who says it.
I didn't say they were, although there is some huge double standards here.
He has been massively rude with and about lots of other people and topics, and not always factually correct either. On this occasion, he called out BS, it was clear at the time and since, that a lot of what she said was not true (or twisted), and they threw him under the bus.
The result is ITV ratings have gone through the floor, but that's their decision. One upside is my social media isn't how filled with people retwattering him screaming over the top of interviewees with the comment of "p'owned em".
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
Just like ridiculously priced NFT profile avatars.....something I would never be involved in.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
Or better still get vaccinated.
Certainly anybody wearing a mask still who has refused to be double vaccinated has no right to lecture someone who has been double vaccinated but has made the personal decision to no longer wear a mask in shops or at large events
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
A typical selfish right-winger's response, fuelled by that rag the Daily Telepgraph.
It's not a personal choice if you are both infecting others (without knowing it) or becoming infected yourself which is perfectly possible double jabbed or not.
This stinks. And trouble is coming.
I'm a left winger. It is the vaccine that protects us now, not masks.
Except it isn't. We expected those double vaxxed to be immune. They aren't. We expected them to be incapable of infecting others. They can. If they were unlucky enough to catch it we did not expect them to be ill. But they are in sufficient numbers to stress our hospital system.
Vaccines are good. They massively reduce death. They reduce the risk of serious illness. But they are not going to stop Covid. Not on their own.
What is going to stop covid is everyone being infected.
Vaccines allow that to happen with a 95% reduction in pain and risk.
For the fully vaccinated masks are more likely to be detrimental than beneficial.
Would you prefer to be infected when your vaccine is wearing off ?
I would prefer not to be infected at all.
This is entirely possible as the prevalence of the virus will decrease over time. Procrastination also helps as there are likely to both be better vaccines and better therapies in time.
Perhaps and perhaps not - Delta is more prevalent and dangerous than the original strain.
So ultimately it comes down to the individual's own judgment on factors such as previous infection, vaccine status, inherent risks, employment type and lifestyle.
Of course many, perhaps most, of the the people currently being infected don't even know that they have been as they're asymptomatic.
And ultimately the more people are infected and acquire immunity the safer those who haven't been become - so it makes full sense for the fully vaccinated low risk people to come into contact with Delta now.
Plus surely its better to come into contact with Delta now, during the summer, when viral loads are lower due to being outdoors more and when the NHS is under less strain than the winter when we're indoors and its flu season?
I strongly suspect Boris Johnson's popularity rating will sink through the floor by next spring when covid has surged this winter and his northern fan club finally twig about what a prat the man is.
Next PM (shortest from each party) Sunak Con 3/1 Starmer Lab 5/1 Farage 66/1 Carmichael LD 75/1
Next FM (shortest from each party) Robertson SNP 7/2 Sarwar SLab 12/1 Ross SCon 18/1 Rennie SLD 100/1
Carmichael 75-1. In which fantasy was that idea spawned? I'd have Liz Saville-Roberts (Plaid Cymru) as more likely.
Next FM is even worse , the 3 also rans cannot be below 1000-1
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The zero-case obsession, a binary position that says we either have no COVID cases or catastrophic outbreaks on a scale witnessed in Italy and New York at the start of the pandemic, has been consigned to the epidemiological dustbin.
The virus is here to stay. It will continue to spread in Victoria, more people will get critically sick and some will die.
Instead of pretending this can be avoided with curfews, five-kilometre rules and stopping children from playing on swings and monkey bars, Victoria has joined NSW in accepting we cannot protect life by keeping it on hold forever.
But empty supermarket shelves should not prompt a bout of ugly schadenfreude on the part of those (including myself) who never wanted to leave the EU in the first place. Low-paid workers are enjoying more workplace leverage than they have had for many years. We may not agree with the path taken to get here, and we might grumble about missing items on our weekly shop but our dysfunctional labour market – supporting a middle-class world of convenience and abundance – has depended for many years on a large reservoir of exploited labour. Now that it’s been choked off, I expect some workers are rejoicing.
I've certainly got some sympathy with that viewpoint. The thing is, this is potentially good for people in the (or with interest to be in the) logistics sector, maybe for other sectors if similar pressures apply,* but it also likely leads to increases in the cost of food, which - being an essential - will hit those with lower incomes more than those with higher incomes.** So I'm not yet convinced that this leads to a better standard of life for those on lower incomes.
* Logistics is a sector in which you need people driving lorries here. In some other setors jobs can be offshored (e.g. call centres) or offshore companies can outcompete if wages rise (e.g. manufacturing) ** Because food is likely a higher percentage of total costs and also because for cheaper foods transportation presumably makes up a greater amount of the total cost than more expensive food - shifting a cheap chicken from A to B must have similar cost to shifting an organic free range chicken from A to B, so if transport costs for up by X amount that will lead to a greater % increase in the price of the cheap chicken than the expensive chicken.
Technically I suppose there are a lot more crap cheapo chooks than free range ones, so more economy of scale there ... but once you have a full lorry load at a time, for instance with other goods, it doesn't make much difference.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The staff at my local Waitrose are 100% masked for eight hours a day, and if they feel the need I will respect their feelings by doing likewise for 5 minutes.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
The zero-case obsession, a binary position that says we either have no COVID cases or catastrophic outbreaks on a scale witnessed in Italy and New York at the start of the pandemic, has been consigned to the epidemiological dustbin.
The virus is here to stay. It will continue to spread in Victoria, more people will get critically sick and some will die.
Instead of pretending this can be avoided with curfews, five-kilometre rules and stopping children from playing on swings and monkey bars, Victoria has joined NSW in accepting we cannot protect life by keeping it on hold forever.
But it might be true. There's lots of things which oscillate between extremes instead of settling down at a nice equilibrium. If the facts are binary, a binary position is the right one. If there is a 500 ton meteor which might or might not hit earth, then there is. There is no point in arguing the political merits of it being bound to hit us, but only weighing half a ton.
Spending lots of my time today telling people over 60 that they are safe to have AZ and watching them refuse and wait for Pfizer because they have high blood pressure or had an SCC removed or platelets of 120. So frustrating. Thanks to all the people that trashed AZ
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The staff at my local Waitrose are 100% masked for eight hours a day, and if they feel the need I will respect their feelings by doing likewise for 5 minutes.
Well that's different perhaps. I wonder why the staff there feel the need? Or if its the Waitrose brand insisting the staff do it?
Prediction: Con 333, Lab 230, SNP 55, Lib Dem 9, DUP 8, SF 7, PC 4, SDLP 2, All 1, Grn 1, Ref 0 Conservative majority of 16
DUP 8 looks unlikely!?!
New Boundaries 2023 “Electoral Calculus has completed a detailed analysis of the proposed new parliamentary seats for England, inclduing predictions, maps and key demographic and political indicators for each one.
It is expected that these final versions of the new boundaries will take effect by 2023.
You can get access to likely impact, maps, seat details, and postcode lookup at New Boundaries 2023.
Please note that initial proposals for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have not been published yet.”
Can I combine Covid UK bullshit testing and Brexit for a minute? One obvious thing I should be doing for my business trip to London and Cologne (and Dusseldorf FFS) is trying to travel greenly. Koln to London by train is a doddle. Or would be if we didn't have the multiple hours required whilst changing trains at Brussels for all our enhanced border checks. So bollocks to the train and the planet and fly we will.
I have found various German clinics in and around the expo centre that will do rapid antigen tests on a turn up and go basis - you need to book but I can book for later this hour. For €25. For my day 2 test? Pre-book in advance for your choice of providers, so many of whom are unknown and reportedly ripoff operations. And laughably I read upthread that nobody in the UK is remotely interested in the actual test being carried out or the result. Its just a code on the locator form.
Outbound I am changing planes in Amsterdam, and what a lovely load of hoops we now have as a 3rd country to try and jump through. Though with our own Lozza Fox intoning why masks should not be imposed on his liberties its no wonder our cases numbers are vastly higher than everyone else.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The staff at my local Waitrose are 100% masked for eight hours a day, and if they feel the need I will respect their feelings by doing likewise for 5 minutes.
They won't feel the need, it will be corporate diktat.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Question the answer to which is probably the bleedin' obvious.
Does the service operate world wide? In other words can you be in, say, Thailand, and have the box sent to you?
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Isn't a pharmacy easier? In Portugal I had a selection of places to go to in walking distance so I am happy with there (going to same place). I paid 60 Euros last time (could have got it for 30 Euros, but would have had to get a lift from my host), but now the Govt have set up a place at 15 Euros. My worry in France is I won't see anything appropriate until the afternoon/evening before the morning I travel when I cycle into St Malo. But if any old pharmacy does provide it I should be ok. They appear to, but you never know what real life is like!
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Do tats and jewellry protect against Covid? Who knew?
Who the fuck think it's a good idea conducting the end of your marriage through the medium of a tabloid column? I'm almost beginning to feel some sympathy for the Gover.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The staff at my local Waitrose are 100% masked for eight hours a day, and if they feel the need I will respect their feelings by doing likewise for 5 minutes.
I take my cue from the staff and I think most do. Hence in places where the staff are wearing, so are most of the customers, and if not, not. Not a hard & fast rule but that's more or less what I'm finding.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Isn't a pharmacy easier? In Portugal I had a selection of places to go to in walking distance so I am happy with there (going to same place). I paid 60 Euros last time (could have got it for 30 Euros, but would have had to get a lift from my host), but now the Govt have set up a place at 15 Euros. My worry in France is I won't see anything appropriate until the afternoon/evening before the morning I travel when I cycle into St Malo. But if any old pharmacy does provide it I should be ok. They appear to, but you never know what real life is like!
A pharmacy may indeed be easier. But you have to find one , hope it's open etc and for me that would be a bigger faff and something to worry about on my travels. But I am a bit of a worrier.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Question the answer to which is probably the bleedin' obvious.
Does the service operate world wide? In other words can you be in, say, Thailand, and have the box sent to you?
Answering my own question; yes the bleedin' obvious applies! Quick Google, avoiding the error of Google assuming the word was 'queried' and found a very comprehensive and clear site!
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I'm not quite as pessimistic as that. But that's probably only for self-care reasons.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
I wear a mask in Waitrose out of respect for the staff. I'm in there for five minutes and don't interact with anyone, but they're in for eight hours and have to interact with anyone who choses. The difference between paper masks and proper masks is irrelevant: the key point is that the workers have 50 times greater exposure than I do and if they get sick I don't eat. In the end it all boils down to selfishness.
There's nothing selfish about it whatsoever.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The staff at my local Waitrose are 100% masked for eight hours a day, and if they feel the need I will respect their feelings by doing likewise for 5 minutes.
I do as well if the staff are masked, but it is improbable it is a choice for them whether to wear one.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I agree with you on a lot of things but on this I completely disagree.
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
New greener petrol will be introduced to service stations across Britain from today despite fears that hundreds of thousands of drivers still do not know whether their car can use it without being damaged.
More than 8,000 petrol stations will start selling E10 fuel, which is designed to cut greenhouse gas emissions from combustion engines, throughout September. The petrol is blended with 10 per cent bioethanol, which is made from materials such as grains, sugars and waste wood.
E5 petrol, which is sold throughout the UK at present, has 5 per cent bioethanol.
I filled up with E10 in France yesterday. So far, so good.
@IanB2 I'm cycling in France shortly, then returning and almost immediately going to Portugal again.
I think I know what I am doing but would appreciate checking with you.
I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy? I probably wont see one until I cycle into St Malo just before my ferry.
Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)?
A comment for every one else; the process is a shambles. You might remember from my previous trip to Portugal the booking of the return test had to be done before, then changed, which was fortunate as I couldn't do it without a return flight, now it seems we are back to before. Nobody checks you have taken the day 2 test; anyone could have done it for you. The paperwork is barely checked and then only by the courier (my passenger locator form was in a folder and not removed), the antigen certificate could have been anything with a few stamps on it. A survey of French pharmacies shows they have no idea what the UK technical requirements are (they are on the web site), but their certificates are all accepted.
I went on the Govt web site. The 4 cheapest Day 2 providers lie about their starting price and by a factor of 350%. The next has a rating of 1 out of 5. Don't expect a test from them or a result if you do get one, you are just getting the number you need for the Passenger Location Form. Five have been removed for not having any tests at all (just scams). Various who claim to be using certain tests or certain locations for tests haven't actually bought those tests or booked those locations (Which checked with the suppliers)
Antigen and PCR tests can vary in price for exactly the same thing from £20 to over £500!
Acceptance of the NHS app as being compatible with the EU certificate is completely up in the air (another wonderful benefit of Brexit). Some accept it, some don't, but some might (might is a fat lot of use at the terminal). The UK Govt is in negotiations with the EU. France seem to, Portugal might, but might is not good enough. That is going to cost us £100 for 2 Antigen tests (well actually for 2 certificates, the test is free if you do it yourself)
Bizarely you actually don't need any of these test. You need a number to put on your Passenger Locator form that nobody looks at and a piece of paper that anyone could produce and is only checked by the person at the boarding gate. he had no idea who the Doctor was who gave me my certificate in Portugal last time.
It is all a lot of bollocks, with a lot of people ripping people off from the out and out scammers to the high st chemists taking advantage of an opportunity.
And why have we made it so much more complex than the French and Portuguese.
Addressing three of your points:
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Re Qured: I've used it four times so far. Excellent. But you have to be organised and it requires decent internet for the video call of course.
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Question the answer to which is probably the bleedin' obvious.
Does the service operate world wide? In other words can you be in, say, Thailand, and have the box sent to you?
Yes it works anywhere that you can access the internet. The box is posted to you while you are in the UK (i.e. before you travel) and you pop it in your suitcase.
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
It’s only being written about because the Guardian doesn’t like him
Terrible that a board member of a regulator should have “strong views”. Leave it to the professionals right?
Provided that he exercises his role appropriately I don’t care whether he thinks the moon is made of cheese
Surely nobody sane could think Dacre is appropriate for that job. It is impossible to know where to start. I would have the same view if someone with his background was suggested from the left. He is completely inappropriate for that role. There are many other roles he maybe appropriate for. It is such a bizarre suggestion.
His views on whether the moon is made of cheese are not the ones that matter.
There is no rich old right winger that Charles won't die on a cross to defend.
It's class solidarity, totally rational, unlike those working class voters enabling 80 seat Tory majorities.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Do tats and jewellry protect against Covid? Who knew?
I reckon I could produce an epidemiological study showing that they do, at least for more severe outcomes. As long as I don't control for sex and age...
(to be fair, it's possible to produce an epidemiological study showing almost anything with careful selection of sample and variables)
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
Just like ridiculously priced NFT profile avatars.....something I would never be involved in.
You must have higher morals than me! I'd be quite happy to be involved in selling an NFT anything if there was some mug willing to buy
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Do tats and jewellry protect against Covid? Who knew?
I reckon I could produce an epidemiological study showing that they do, at least for more severe outcomes. As long as I don't control for sex and age...
(to be fair, it's possible to produce an epidemiological study showing almost anything with careful selection of sample and variables)
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I agree with you on a lot of things but on this I completely disagree.
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
I know we disagree on this. Yours and mine are the difference between shallow and deep ecology (shallow isn't meant to be derogatory in this context).
Deep ecologists have pretty much given up. Shallow ecologists think technology will rescue the planet.
Another difference is in the the conception of value. Deep ecologists value nature intrinsically while others just instrumentally. Small anecdote: I'm a member of a local naturalist group and there is a debate about allowing new access across a meadow. My view is no but another member of the group said "if the public can't see the flowers what is the point of them".
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I agree with you on a lot of things but on this I completely disagree.
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
I know we disagree on this. Yours and mine are the difference between shallow and deep ecology (shallow isn't meant to be derogatory in this context).
Deep ecologists have pretty much given up. Shallow ecologists think technology will rescue the planet.
Another difference is in the the conception of value. Deep ecologists value nature intrinsically while others just instrumentally. Small anecdote: I'm a member of a local naturalist group and there is a debate about allowing new access across a meadow. My view is no but another member of the group said "if the public can't see the flowers what is the point of them".
Technology is capable of solving almost any problem we set our minds to. Its better than giving up, that feels deeply miserable - no offence.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Good for you.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
"Stylish" cloth masks seem to have become a fashion thing for some. Combination of look at my cool mask plus virtue signalling they are still doing the mask thing. Rather than use a mask that works, which are easy to come by.
100% agreed with this, its a fashion now.
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
Do tats and jewellry protect against Covid? Who knew?
I reckon I could produce an epidemiological study showing that they do, at least for more severe outcomes. As long as I don't control for sex and age...
(to be fair, it's possible to produce an epidemiological study showing almost anything with careful selection of sample and variables)
And if you don't control for wealth, either.
Nah, I'll even throw in wealth if you let me define it and the banding
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
I think denialist are down to 15-20% of the electorate. The debate is about what we do, how far we go and how quickly - even what parts of it we must 'accept' and adapt to.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
It seems to be that way in Europe already. Super or premium unleaded is no longer full of magic ingredients that clean your engine and wash your car as you drive along, and is simply the old E5 unleaded we had before
How many guesses do I need for "3 days work for 5 days pay"?
I would hazard a guess that -
"A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a three-day week if they retained the same salary" "A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a two-day week if they retained the same salary" "A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a one-day week if they retained the same salary" "A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a zero-day week if they retained the same salary"
Working people "In favour of effective massive pay rise" shock.
In related news, 1%'s were polled, and discovered to be in favour of 40% returns on government bonds, providing there was no downside.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I agree with you on a lot of things but on this I completely disagree.
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
I know we disagree on this. Yours and mine are the difference between shallow and deep ecology (shallow isn't meant to be derogatory in this context).
Deep ecologists have pretty much given up. Shallow ecologists think technology will rescue the planet.
Another difference is in the the conception of value. Deep ecologists value nature intrinsically while others just instrumentally. Small anecdote: I'm a member of a local naturalist group and there is a debate about allowing new access across a meadow. My view is no but another member of the group said "if the public can't see the flowers what is the point of them".
Is there not a happy medium by creating a defined path? or does that stop it from being a meadow?
What I find a little disconcerting about the climate change stuff is that I always suspect that some people think that we ought to be fucked for what we're doing to the planet. It feels a bit religious to me.
Now, I'm all in favour of changing our behaviour as in the long run we need to anyway. But I do have a nagging doubt about the "science" of climate change.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
The main dividing line is people's conception of our species; with those humanist types who are relentless in their belief that humans are a force for good (which comes from religion: humans = special) on one side and those who see the species as a rogue species which could be regarded as some sort or blight on the planet and is now impotently whaling away thinking it can fix the problems of its own making.
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
I agree with you on a lot of things but on this I completely disagree.
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
I know we disagree on this. Yours and mine are the difference between shallow and deep ecology (shallow isn't meant to be derogatory in this context).
Deep ecologists have pretty much given up. Shallow ecologists think technology will rescue the planet.
Another difference is in the the conception of value. Deep ecologists value nature intrinsically while others just instrumentally. Small anecdote: I'm a member of a local naturalist group and there is a debate about allowing new access across a meadow. My view is no but another member of the group said "if the public can't see the flowers what is the point of them".
Technology is capable of solving almost any problem we set our minds to. Its better than giving up, that feels deeply miserable - no offence.
I'd agree with your other member.
Ronald Knox' poem applies, I think. Although it might spark theistic discussion “There was a young man who said "God Must find it exceedingly odd To think that the tree Should continue to be When there's no one about in the quad."
Reply: "Dear Sir: Your astonishment's odd; I am always about in the quad. And that's why the tree Will continue to be Since observed by, Yours faithfully, God.”
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
I think denialist are down to 15-20% of the electorate. The debate is about what we do, how far we go and how quickly - even what parts of it we must 'accept' and adapt to.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
It is usually us oldies that rail against the mores of the upcoming generation, the angst heightened because we know that, however much we protest and however strong our arguments, simple demographics and the passage of time guarantees that we are destined to lose.
You seem to have come down with a very early case and are destined for a miserable old age surrounded by people with long hair and loud music...as the generation before me would have complained
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
Exactly. I too am of the opinion that the main point of all activity is to distract from existential angst but it can be any activity. It doesn't have to be paid work. In fact a lot of paid work is mundane and allows much space for existential angst. Whereas cf something like posting on PB - eg this post I'm doing right here and now - isn't paid work but it does, just for the time that I'm doing it, keep the black howling wolf from the door. So if you ever see a post of mine and think, "ffs, that's a very longwinded way of getting his point across," please cut me some slack. There's a reason for it. Oh god, I have to finish this one now, can't think of a way to continue, oh god oh god, emptiness beckons, the futility the futility ...
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
I think denialist are down to 15-20% of the electorate. The debate is about what we do, how far we go and how quickly - even what parts of it we must 'accept' and adapt to.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
It is usually us oldies that rail against the mores of the upcoming generation, the angst heightened because we know that, however much we protest and however strong our arguments, simple demographics and the passage of time guarantees that we are destined to lose.
You seem to have come down with a very early case and are destined for a miserable old age surrounded by people with long hair and loud music...as the generation before me would have complained
I was out clubbing at the Ministry of Sound last Friday night until 4am. And I also don't live with my mum.
I suspect I'm a tad more 'hip' than your good self.
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
Exactly. I too am of the opinion that the main point of all activity is to distract from existential angst but it can be any activity. It doesn't have to be paid work. In fact a lot of paid work is mundane and allows much space for existential angst. Whereas cf something like posting on PB - eg this post I'm doing right here and now - isn't paid work but it does, just for the time that I'm doing it, keep the black howling wolf from the door. So if you ever see a post of mine and think, "ffs, that's a very longwinded way of getting his point across," please cut me some slack. There's a reason for it. Oh god, I have to finish this one now, can't think of a way to continue, oh god oh god, emptiness beckons, the futility the futility ...
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
I think denialist are down to 15-20% of the electorate. The debate is about what we do, how far we go and how quickly - even what parts of it we must 'accept' and adapt to.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
It is usually us oldies that rail against the mores of the upcoming generation, the angst heightened because we know that, however much we protest and however strong our arguments, simple demographics and the passage of time guarantees that we are destined to lose.
You seem to have come down with a very early case and are destined for a miserable old age surrounded by people with long hair and loud music...as the generation before me would have complained
I was out clubbing at the Ministry of Sound last Friday night until 4am. And I also don't live with my mum.
I suspect I'm a tad more 'hip' than your good self.
Bloody hell were you? How did they take to your red cords?
Edit: MoS was of course founded by a couple of OEs.
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
Exactly. I too am of the opinion that the main point of all activity is to distract from existential angst but it can be any activity. It doesn't have to be paid work. In fact a lot of paid work is mundane and allows much space for existential angst. Whereas cf something like posting on PB - eg this post I'm doing right here and now - isn't paid work but it does, just for the time that I'm doing it, keep the black howling wolf from the door. So if you ever see a post of mine and think, "ffs, that's a very longwinded way of getting his point across," please cut me some slack. There's a reason for it. Oh god, I have to finish this one now, can't think of a way to continue, oh god oh god, emptiness beckons, the futility the futility ...
That's fair, and I guess I don't view it as futile.
It's best to view life as a rich experience, to derive as much from as you can, and focus on what you can do rather than what you can't.
I know some people who've been dealt terrible sets of cards - and experienced some awful personal tragedies - but, like so much else, it's about one's attitude subsequently since you can't change or control that.
Mr. Kinabalu, remember what Plato said: no human thing is of serious importance.
Yes, that's my deep and innate feeling. Had it all my life. Fought it all my life.
Embrace it, enjoy the ride. For one day the whole of human existence - endeavour, creation, genius, conflict, joy and pain and suffering will mean nothing. The species will be gone. Like a fart in a wind tunnel our species, our planet, our galaxy, exists for a fleeting moment in the infinity of the universe, only to be quickly blown away.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
Mr. Kinabalu, remember what Plato said: no human thing is of serious importance.
Yes, that's my deep and innate feeling. Had it all my life. Fought it all my life.
Embrace it, enjoy the ride. For one day the whole of human existence - endeavour, creation, genius, conflict, joy and pain and suffering will mean nothing. The species will be gone. Like a fart in a wind tunnel our species, our planet, our galaxy, exists for a fleeting moment in the infinity of the universe, only to be quickly blown away.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
It's being so cheerful what keeps me going.
That was a beautiful post, until I got to fart in a wind tunnel.
"Green" issues will simply be absorbed into the political mainstream with the dividing line being technological capitalists versus luddite ecosocialism.
There's another dividing line in approximately the same place: wishful thinkers and denialists versus prepared to bite the bullet. The profit motive is powerful and necessary but it won't be fixing this on its own. It needs coordinated action from governments of all stripes.
I think denialist are down to 15-20% of the electorate. The debate is about what we do, how far we go and how quickly - even what parts of it we must 'accept' and adapt to.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
It is usually us oldies that rail against the mores of the upcoming generation, the angst heightened because we know that, however much we protest and however strong our arguments, simple demographics and the passage of time guarantees that we are destined to lose.
You seem to have come down with a very early case and are destined for a miserable old age surrounded by people with long hair and loud music...as the generation before me would have complained
I was out clubbing at the Ministry of Sound last Friday night until 4am. And I also don't live with my mum.
I suspect I'm a tad more 'hip' than your good self.
I am quite sure that you are. But it was an analogy remembering the complaints old people used to make when I was your age.
Resistance [to generational social change] is futile. And will simply condemn you to an unhappy old age
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
Exactly. I too am of the opinion that the main point of all activity is to distract from existential angst but it can be any activity. It doesn't have to be paid work. In fact a lot of paid work is mundane and allows much space for existential angst. Whereas cf something like posting on PB - eg this post I'm doing right here and now - isn't paid work but it does, just for the time that I'm doing it, keep the black howling wolf from the door. So if you ever see a post of mine and think, "ffs, that's a very longwinded way of getting his point across," please cut me some slack. There's a reason for it. Oh god, I have to finish this one now, can't think of a way to continue, oh god oh god, emptiness beckons, the futility the futility ...
That's fair, and I guess I don't view it as futile.
It's best to view life as a rich experience, to derive as much from as you can, and focus on what you can do rather than what you can't.
I know some people who've been dealt terrible sets of cards - and experienced some awful personal tragedies - but, like so much else, it's about one's attitude subsequently since you can't change or control that.
Been watching the Paralympics? The physical handicaps above which some people rise ......
Mr. Kinabalu, remember what Plato said: no human thing is of serious importance.
Yes, that's my deep and innate feeling. Had it all my life. Fought it all my life.
Embrace it, enjoy the ride. For one day the whole of human existence - endeavour, creation, genius, conflict, joy and pain and suffering will mean nothing. The species will be gone. Like a fart in a wind tunnel our species, our planet, our galaxy, exists for a fleeting moment in the infinity of the universe, only to be quickly blown away.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
It's being so cheerful what keeps me going.
That was a beautiful post, until I got to fart in a wind tunnel.
The zero-case obsession, a binary position that says we either have no COVID cases or catastrophic outbreaks on a scale witnessed in Italy and New York at the start of the pandemic, has been consigned to the epidemiological dustbin.
The virus is here to stay. It will continue to spread in Victoria, more people will get critically sick and some will die.
Instead of pretending this can be avoided with curfews, five-kilometre rules and stopping children from playing on swings and monkey bars, Victoria has joined NSW in accepting we cannot protect life by keeping it on hold forever.
But it might be true. There's lots of things which oscillate between extremes instead of settling down at a nice equilibrium. If the facts are binary, a binary position is the right one. If there is a 500 ton meteor which might or might not hit earth, then there is. There is no point in arguing the political merits of it being bound to hit us, but only weighing half a ton.
In the case of Zerocovid, it's demonstrably untrue.
The strain, currently dubbed C.1.2, was first detected in South Africa in May 2021 and in the last week has gathered significant attention because of a preprint study by South African researchers published on Aug. 24. Preprints are research articles which have not yet undergone a peer review process.
The preprint didn't gather much momentum until a Twitter thread by a former Harvard epidemiologist went viral on Aug. 29, rippling out across the Twitterverse. Hours later, mainstream publications across the world had cobbled together stories with alarming headlines foreshadowing disaster.
Mr. Kinabalu, remember what Plato said: no human thing is of serious importance.
Yes, that's my deep and innate feeling. Had it all my life. Fought it all my life.
Embrace it, enjoy the ride. For one day the whole of human existence - endeavour, creation, genius, conflict, joy and pain and suffering will mean nothing. The species will be gone. Like a fart in a wind tunnel our species, our planet, our galaxy, exists for a fleeting moment in the infinity of the universe, only to be quickly blown away.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
It's being so cheerful what keeps me going.
Yes, I don't mean to conjur up a complete Bleak House. 'All is absurd' is liberating and empowering as well as an intense downer. It depends how you process it and that varies. On the whole, however, I'd trade it in for something more 'meat and 2 veg'.
Sainsbury's sitrep midday yesterday. For the first time, there are many (though still a minority, say 20 per cent of) customers not wearing masks. Some shelves are still bare.
It's utter madness at the moment not to be wearing a mask in a confined indoor space. I had a go at M&S staff two days ago. All the customers were in masks and none of the staff. My other local shop had to shut because, surprise surprise, the anti-mask staff got struck down by covid.
We only need to look at Israel to see this ain't yet over. Where's Johnson on this? Nowhere. So a month or two from now we will start playing catch up.
If you have been double vaccinated it should be personal choice if you want to wear a mask in shops.
Yes you might be slightly more likely to catch Covid but you are very unlikely to be hospitalised anyway.
If you have not been double vaccinated then getting jabbed would protect you from Covid far more than just wearing a mask would and almost everyone has been offered both jabs now
With respect HYUFD, the point of conforming to mask-wearing is to signal to other people that you are not threatening them with the virus.
With respect, its gesture bollocks and I won't take part in it anymore (unless I'm on someone's property and they tell, not ask, me to).
I've been double jabbed and that's it as far as I'm concerned. We need to get back on with our lives and wearing flimsy cloth masks post-vaccines is meaningless.
If you're concerned, go out and get a proper mask that actually works rather than replying upon strangers wearing cloth masks that don't.
Cloth masks made sense when there was a limitation on supply of proper masks, and when vaccines weren't available. That time has passed.
There are plenty of people out there who would be scared by your blithe insouciance as you swagger maskless around Waitrose potentially shedding virus even though you've been double-vaxxed. Anti-social behaviour imho.
I'm sorry but I have no intention to pander to irrational phobias. Are those people wearing FFP3 masks?
If not, and I never see them at Tesco's, then I couldn't give a fuck what they're irrationally afraid of. Get a proper mask and move on, FFP3 masks work and third-party cloth masks don't.
Philibet the Libertarian Tells Other People What To Do, Part 999874.
Nope. I'm saying other people can do whatever they please. Wear a cloth mask, don't wear any mask, wear an FFP3 mask, put a sock on their head and put pencils up their nose . . . whatever they choose its their choice.
If they're afraid post-vaccines then the sensible thing to do is to wear an FFP3 mask. Or stay at home. Or get over their irrational phobias.
My wife really doesn't want to get Covid because of health issues. I might suggest you broaden your little mind and try to understand why people's fear might not be 'irrational phobias'.
A month ago I said I'd continue wearing masks where I felt it was appropriate. In response, someone said: "just as long as you don't condemn those who decide differently." Well, I've tried not to. But now it appears fine to criticise people continuing to wear them.
Just to remind you: Covid hasn't gone away. For some people Covid is a real threat - and they're not all old. But in your mind that's just 'irrational phobias'.
(As an aside, I feel we'll all get Covid eventually. I see no harm - and a fair bit of good - in delaying getting it.)
I have no qualms with your or your wife or anyone else wearing a mask. What I have a qualm with is being told I must because others are "afraid" if I don't.
If you or your wife or anyone else is "afraid" of me not wearing a mask then yes that is an irrational phobia. Especially if the person in question is not wearing an FFP3 mask.
I avoid public places indoors where mask refusers accumulate, it is a fairly good and visible flag for other reckless behaviour.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
And when you're wearing a mask are you wearing an FFP3 mask that works properly? Or a cloth mask that has negligible post-vaccination real world impact?
At the football I wear an FFP3, on places like the Red Funnel, I wear a FFP2, when not outside.
Very unusual now. As far as I can see almost nobody wears masks at football matches.
The Whitehall blame game continued today after the foreign secretary suggested that military intelligence failures were responsible for the West’s humiliation in Afghanistan.
Dominic Raab seemed to criticise the Ministry of Defence and the Home Office and to question the entire basis of Britain’s 20-year campaign.
Mr. Kinabalu, remember what Plato said: no human thing is of serious importance.
Yes, that's my deep and innate feeling. Had it all my life. Fought it all my life.
Embrace it, enjoy the ride. For one day the whole of human existence - endeavour, creation, genius, conflict, joy and pain and suffering will mean nothing. The species will be gone. Like a fart in a wind tunnel our species, our planet, our galaxy, exists for a fleeting moment in the infinity of the universe, only to be quickly blown away.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
It's being so cheerful what keeps me going.
That was a beautiful post, until I got to fart in a wind tunnel.
Cheer up, not everyone gets to fart in a wind tunnel.
LOL Ofcom haven't simply said there's nothing wrong with what Piers Morgan said - they've said there was nothing wrong with ITV broadcasting it because the "potentially harmful and highly offensive statements about mental health and suicide" had "sufficient challenge to such statements which meant they were adequately contextualised".
So nothing wrong because Morgan's former colleagues stood up to him and said how offensive it was. Not because Morgan was in the right and vindicated.
Quite appropriate then for ITV to demand an apology and let him go when none was forthcoming.
Andrew Lilico @andrew_lilico · 4h Almost all commentary on the mass vaccination of 12-15 yr olds fails to grant the context that the epidemic is de facto over. Would ministers be trying to apply political pressure to JCVI to mass vaxx 12-15s if they believed the epidemic finished?
There seems to be clear logic in @Philip_Thompson 's position: if you are still fearful of covid, despite your vaccination status, you are at liberty to spend all your time in public wearing a FFP3 mask while avoiding anywhere that agitates your fear.
If you are not fearful, and want to try to live your life as normally as possible, then you are equally at liberty to abandon your mask.
I fit into the latter group, but realise that some people differ.
The whole planet is heading in this direction. I think we’re heading fast to three day weeks.
I personally work as few hours as I possibly can, typically about 30 hours a week, but sometimes fewer. I regard people who work more than 50 hours per week to be mentally retarded.
The habit of “presenteeism” is a tragedy. Folk hanging around doing fuck all. Twats. Either be productive or go home.
I think the opposite, a 3 day week poses other kinds of social problems. In the end, you must work constantly to make life meaningful; to distract yourself from contemplating the void of existence and the existential trauma it reveals. If you stop working, you quickly end up going mad.
The problem is work that people hate: work that creates deep moral conflict, work that has no meaning.
I think the problem is the word "work" - which implies bosses, grind, repetitiveness - and a better word would be "doing stuff", which can include restoring things, educating and training people, researching and writing things, and community projects.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
Exactly. I too am of the opinion that the main point of all activity is to distract from existential angst but it can be any activity. It doesn't have to be paid work. In fact a lot of paid work is mundane and allows much space for existential angst. Whereas cf something like posting on PB - eg this post I'm doing right here and now - isn't paid work but it does, just for the time that I'm doing it, keep the black howling wolf from the door. So if you ever see a post of mine and think, "ffs, that's a very longwinded way of getting his point across," please cut me some slack. There's a reason for it. Oh god, I have to finish this one now, can't think of a way to continue, oh god oh god, emptiness beckons, the futility the futility ...
Andrew Lilico @andrew_lilico · 4h Almost all commentary on the mass vaccination of 12-15 yr olds fails to grant the context that the epidemic is de facto over. Would ministers be trying to apply political pressure to JCVI to mass vaxx 12-15s if they believed the epidemic finished?
As 94% of UK adults have antibodies, I suppose you could make an argument that the epidemic is de facto over, but everyone has a different threshold for declaring it as such.
Comments
You are thinking about when he flounced off in a huff for 10 mins, then came back.
The newly appointed head of forthcoming super-regulator Ofcom, Lord David Currie, has denied claims from opposition MPs that he was appointed because of his links to the government. He insisted that the fact he has donated money to the Labour Party in the past and has given economic advice to Tony Blair and Gordon Brown played no part in his appointment.
Programmes should however seek be generally impartial on divisive topics, which the regulator was satisfied was the case here. Saying that someone can describe their opinions as ‘facts’, which puts them beyond critisism, is a dangerous path to go down…
And I assume his question about his job is rhetorical, since he went because they did not like what he said (or the reaction to it), not because it was definitely a breach of any codes.
Its uncomfortable, it makes it hot and sweaty and harder to breath and its deeply unpleasant. And in my opinion it serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever that can't be better achieved by those who are concerned wearing an FFP3 mask.
That's more enough for me. Others are free to make their own judgement. That's part of having a free society.
Not forever, but for the next couple of months while the prevalence is so high.
"EU plans big cash offer for Afghanistan’s neighbors to host refugees"
GMB Union ballot result shows 75% of members in favour of industrial action if cuts go ahead
https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/1433001964586024962?s=20
"I am going to be in the middle of nowhere so getting the Antigen test prior to return maybe a challenge. Did you find it easy? Can you just walk into any pharmacy?" - Don't rely on a local pharmacy. Well in advance of your departure from the UK book a zoom service through Qured - you take the test with you and they watch you do it and you email a photo of the result and they email you back a certificate. Cost £40 ish.
"Did you book a proper Day 2 test or go for one of the cheaper dubious ones. After all, all you need is the code for the Passenger Location Form." Randox £43 - not dubious - it is a PCR. Book before you go away and keep record of booking reference as you will need this for the passenger locator form.
Did France accept your NHS vaccine app (plus self notification, which seems trivial)? My advice is to get a paper vaccination certificate from NHS - it is easy - see:
https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/covid-pass/get-your-covid-pass-letter/
Just because something is not illegal to say, doesn't mean that someone else is obliged to employ someone who says it.
Meanwhile at Tesco's almost all I ever see is cloth masks, amongst the minority still wearing masks. Me switching to the minority wearing masks won't change anyone's risk in reality - but people who aren't vaccinated getting vaccinated, or those who aren't wearing FFP2/3 masks putting them on certainly would.
So ultimately it comes down to the individual's own judgment on factors such as previous infection, vaccine status, inherent risks, employment type and lifestyle.
Of course many, perhaps most, of the the people currently being infected don't even know that they have been as they're asymptomatic.
And ultimately the more people are infected and acquire immunity the safer those who haven't been become - so it makes full sense for the fully vaccinated low risk people to come into contact with Delta now.
The World Health Organization has warned that another 236,000 people could die from COVID-19 in Europe by December 1, sounding the alarm over rising infections and stagnating vaccine rates on the continent.
Countries across the region have seen infection rates tick up as the highly transmissible Delta variant takes hold, particularly among the unvaccinated.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/8/30/who-fears-236000-more-covid-deaths-in-europe-by-december
* Logistics is a sector in which you need people driving lorries here. In some other setors jobs can be offshored (e.g. call centres) or offshore companies can outcompete if wages rise (e.g. manufacturing)
** Because food is likely a higher percentage of total costs and also because for cheaper foods transportation presumably makes up a greater amount of the total cost than more expensive food - shifting a cheap chicken from A to B must have similar cost to shifting an organic free range chicken from A to B, so if transport costs for up by X amount that will lead to a greater % increase in the price of the cheap chicken than the expensive chicken.
He has been massively rude with and about lots of other people and topics, and not always factually correct either. On this occasion, he called out BS, it was clear at the time and since, that a lot of what she said was not true (or twisted), and they threw him under the bus.
The result is ITV ratings have gone through the floor, but that's their decision. One upside is my social media isn't how filled with people retwattering him screaming over the top of interviewees with the comment of "p'owned em".
I don't have any tattoos, I don't wear jewellery, and I don't wear masks unnecessarily. I'm just not into any of that crap but fair play to those who are if that's their fashion.
https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/915670471/luxury-velvet-face-masklace-face-mask?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=sexy+face+mask&ref=sr_gallery-1-6
Certainly anybody wearing a mask still who has refused to be double vaccinated has no right to lecture someone who has been double vaccinated but has made the personal decision to no longer wear a mask in shops or at large events
1) Qured - Thanks for that. Didn't know about it.
2) Randox was my plan, used them before and were good. Just wondered about the pointlessness of it all and just going for the £28 dubious one that everyone else seems to be using Cost difference 3 x (43 - 28). Probably not worth worrying about and at least I will be paying a proper organisation for an actual test.
3) My concern was whether they accepted it (in real life). It is all up in the air at the moment re EU countries. France seems to, Portugal not at the moment (so need antigen test before going), but might accept before I go. Was interested in a real life experience. Good idea re taking a paper copy.
Thank you.
Most of the staff at my local Tesco's aren't masked up, just like most of the customers. Indeed the overwhelming majority aren't.
My wearing a mask or not wearing a mask won't make any real difference to the staff at all, because of both their own and other customers lack of masks and the fact that paper/cloth masks do not work like real masks that are available or vaccines do.
If the staff are bothered and want to wear an FFP3 mask they're free to do so. I haven't seen a single one do so, so why the hell would I wear a useless crappy cloth masks that is just uncomfortable and not effective?
The zero-case obsession, a binary position that says we either have no COVID cases or catastrophic outbreaks on a scale witnessed in Italy and New York at the start of the pandemic, has been consigned to the epidemiological dustbin.
The virus is here to stay. It will continue to spread in Victoria, more people will get critically sick and some will die.
Instead of pretending this can be avoided with curfews, five-kilometre rules and stopping children from playing on swings and monkey bars, Victoria has joined NSW in accepting we cannot protect life by keeping it on hold forever.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/reality-bites-as-victoria-s-doughnut-dreams-turn-to-fantasy-20210901-p58nxe.html
A week or so before you leave the UK, order the test at £39:
https://qured.com/covid-rapid-tests/
There are two aspects to the order:
1) they post the test to you and you need to take it with you . It is just a small light box.
2) you book the video call, timed for within 72 hours of your return to UK. You book a ten minute slot. You need to remember this appointment, but Qured send you a message on your phone exactly one hour before the video call to remind you and also to provide you with a link. 10 minutes before the appointment time you click on the link and enter a "waiting room". The guy eventually appears and instructs you how to take the test and watches you. You then have to time 15 minutes for the result to be revealed in the little white test box and then you take a photo of it and email it to Qured and they email you back your certificate.
Spending lots of my time today telling people over 60 that they are safe to have AZ and watching them refuse and wait for Pfizer because they have high blood pressure or had an SCC removed or platelets of 120. So frustrating. Thanks to all the people that trashed AZ
https://twitter.com/CatherineOrr73/status/1432892070738337792?s=20
Either way my local ones don't so 🤷♂️
Prediction: Con 333, Lab 230, SNP 55, Lib Dem 9, DUP 8, SF 7, PC 4, SDLP 2, All 1, Grn 1, Ref 0
Conservative majority of 16
DUP 8 looks unlikely!?!
New Boundaries 2023
“Electoral Calculus has completed a detailed analysis of the proposed new parliamentary seats for England, inclduing predictions, maps and key demographic and political indicators for each one.
It is expected that these final versions of the new boundaries will take effect by 2023.
You can get access to likely impact, maps, seat details, and postcode lookup at New Boundaries 2023.
Please note that initial proposals for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have not been published yet.”
I have found various German clinics in and around the expo centre that will do rapid antigen tests on a turn up and go basis - you need to book but I can book for later this hour. For €25. For my day 2 test? Pre-book in advance for your choice of providers, so many of whom are unknown and reportedly ripoff operations. And laughably I read upthread that nobody in the UK is remotely interested in the actual test being carried out or the result. Its just a code on the locator form.
Outbound I am changing planes in Amsterdam, and what a lovely load of hoops we now have as a 3rd country to try and jump through. Though with our own Lozza Fox intoning why masks should not be imposed on his liberties its no wonder our cases numbers are vastly higher than everyone else.
World-leading indeed.
Does the service operate world wide? In other words can you be in, say, Thailand, and have the box sent to you?
I'm firmly in the second camp (along with Sandy) but we are a tiny minority and whilst we remain so the planet is fucked.
A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a four-day week if they retained the same salary, researchers have found
https://twitter.com/thetimesscot/status/1433016136417914887?s=20
How many guesses do I need for "3 days work for 5 days pay"?
I'm as atheist as it gets but I think humans have the potential for great good and bad (which comes from science and technology for which humans 100% are special).
Science and technology is why humans are uniquely capable of fixing the problems of our own making. Which is why the planet isn't fucked.
It's productive and rewarding activity that matters.
(to be fair, it's possible to produce an epidemiological study showing almost anything with careful selection of sample and variables)
Deep ecologists have pretty much given up. Shallow ecologists think technology will rescue the planet.
Another difference is in the the conception of value. Deep ecologists value nature intrinsically while others just instrumentally. Small anecdote: I'm a member of a local naturalist group and there is a debate about allowing new access across a meadow. My view is no but another member of the group said "if the public can't see the flowers what is the point of them".
I'd agree with your other member.
Again, my antennae are very much up because I can smell groups that are trying to use this as a once in a generation opportunity to "reshape society" a mile away.
"A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a three-day week if they retained the same salary"
"A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a two-day week if they retained the same salary"
"A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a one-day week if they retained the same salary"
"A majority of working people in Scotland would favour the introduction of a zero-day week if they retained the same salary"
Working people "In favour of effective massive pay rise" shock.
In related news, 1%'s were polled, and discovered to be in favour of 40% returns on government bonds, providing there was no downside.
What I find a little disconcerting about the climate change stuff is that I always suspect that some people think that we ought to be fucked for what we're doing to the planet. It feels a bit religious to me.
Now, I'm all in favour of changing our behaviour as in the long run we need to anyway. But I do have a nagging doubt about the "science" of climate change.
“There was a young man who said "God
Must find it exceedingly odd
To think that the tree
Should continue to be
When there's no one about in the quad."
Reply:
"Dear Sir: Your astonishment's odd;
I am always about in the quad.
And that's why the tree
Will continue to be
Since observed by, Yours faithfully, God.”
82% of U.S. adults said they’re concerned about the delta variant, up from 73% in late July.
Vaccinated adults are 22 percentage points more likely than their unvaccinated peers to say they’re concerned about the delta variant, 89% to 67%.
https://morningconsult.com/2021/09/01/return-to-normal-delta-variant-concern-polling/
You seem to have come down with a very early case and are destined for a miserable old age surrounded by people with long hair and loud music...as the generation before me would have complained
I suspect I'm a tad more 'hip' than your good self.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAERxf4yYaw
Edit: MoS was of course founded by a couple of OEs.
It's best to view life as a rich experience, to derive as much from as you can, and focus on what you can do rather than what you can't.
I know some people who've been dealt terrible sets of cards - and experienced some awful personal tragedies - but, like so much else, it's about one's attitude subsequently since you can't change or control that.
I find it strangely comforting. If I find myself starting to take life too seriously I try and think about it. Not bleak at all for me. We have been gifted consciousness to enjoy existing. The flipside is consciousness has made existing very complicated. But nevertheless, just enjoy the ride!
It's being so cheerful what keeps me going.
Resistance [to generational social change] is futile. And will simply condemn you to an unhappy old age
The strain, currently dubbed C.1.2, was first detected in South Africa in May 2021 and in the last week has gathered significant attention because of a preprint study by South African researchers published on Aug. 24. Preprints are research articles which have not yet undergone a peer review process.
The preprint didn't gather much momentum until a Twitter thread by a former Harvard epidemiologist went viral on Aug. 29, rippling out across the Twitterverse. Hours later, mainstream publications across the world had cobbled together stories with alarming headlines foreshadowing disaster.
https://www.cnet.com/news/coronavirus-doomsday-variant-headlines-are-wrong-and-dangerous/
The Whitehall blame game continued today after the foreign secretary suggested that military intelligence failures were responsible for the West’s humiliation in Afghanistan.
Dominic Raab seemed to criticise the Ministry of Defence and the Home Office and to question the entire basis of Britain’s 20-year campaign.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/afghanistan-dominic-raab-blames-ministry-of-defence-over-clearly-wrong-intelligence-6fzsc3rnb
So nothing wrong because Morgan's former colleagues stood up to him and said how offensive it was. Not because Morgan was in the right and vindicated.
Quite appropriate then for ITV to demand an apology and let him go when none was forthcoming.
Andrew Lilico
@andrew_lilico
·
4h
Almost all commentary on the mass vaccination of 12-15 yr olds fails to grant the context that the epidemic is de facto over. Would ministers be trying to apply political pressure to JCVI to mass vaxx 12-15s if they believed the epidemic finished?
If you are not fearful, and want to try to live your life as normally as possible, then you are equally at liberty to abandon your mask.
I fit into the latter group, but realise that some people differ.
So what? Live and let live.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFxjnUPRwx4