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Another post-BoJo quarantine U-turn poll sees CON below 40% and LAB within 4% – politicalbetting.com

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  • eekeek Posts: 28,370
    edited July 2021
    DavidL said:

    eek said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Can any of our Nat friends talk us through this exposition of the currency issue in indy Scotland?

    This guy, a professional, er, mapmaker - but also "Convener of the Scottish Currency Group", has handily sketched out how the new Scottish pound will be established, and how the move from sterling will work. It includes gems like this:


    https://twitter.com/RideoutTim/status/1418627474175533059?s=20

    "Your bank will contact you near the time and ask if you would like to re-mortgage into the S£, or take out new S£ credit cards and loans. The banks, Scottish Government and the Scottish Reserve Bank will run an information campaign."

    So that's a doddle then. As someone on Twitter points out, there are 900,000 Scottish mortgage holders who need to be "contacted" and given advice on "remortgaging into the S£."

    That's quite a long chat. Say two hours per mortgage?

    900,000 x 2 hours is 1.8m hours which is 200 years, add in working hours and holidays it's more like 800-1000 years. If the banks get it together and have 100 dedicated teams working flat out on just this, day in day out, they could easily get in done in eight decades

    They might, in fairness, shorten the process by speaking to the lenders of those 900k mortgages and ask them if they want to be paid back in S£ or Sterling. That might make the 900k discussions somewhat irrelevant.

    Edit and oh, by the way, we don't have a Scottish reserve bank. Or any reserves to put in it.
    Why would a bank offer the chance to redominate a loan into a different currency?

    Remember most mortgages nowadays have been sold as a securtised asset to a pension fund or other investment fund
    Exactly, there is absolutely no chance they would agree to the switch so it wouldn't matter what the borrowers thought. If they tried to make the transfer a matter of statute then the Banks would sue the Scottish government because the value of their assets would have been reduced by something like 20% in breach of Article 1 protocol 1 of the ECHR. It is utter madness by people who are so economically illiterate that they make Nicola look credible.
    The problem with the referendum is that you then get people like Malcolmg who will argue that even though it's practically impossible it doesn't matter as Nicola and the Scottish Parliament will ensure its mortgages are fixed.

    In the same way he believes that the UK government will continue to pay his pension.

    I almost want them to vote Yes to see the eventual fall out but I don't think I can live in a diet of popcorn while laughing
  • glwglw Posts: 9,906

    Indeed. Many of my most valued party colleagues over the decades have been New Scots. But BritNats just don’t get how anybody could identify more with an irrelevant province than the mighty Fatherland.

    Do you ever think "am I doing more harm than good?" before you post? You are a bloody great advert for your opponents.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838

    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Our PBTories do find it hard to grasp the fact that the biggest ethnic minority group in the SNP is the English.
    Indeed. Many of my most valued party colleagues over the decades have been New Scots. But BritNats just don’t get how anybody could identify more with an irrelevant province than the mighty Fatherland.
    Never mind the wrong kind of New Scot:

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/north-east/2050412/banff-and-buchan-conservative-chairman-resigns-over-alleged-racist-twitter-debate/

    Anyway, it's a pleasant sunny day here in Scotland, with a refreshijng light breeze, so I'm off in a moment.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    DavidL said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Indeed. So why are the SNP so keen to have over100k EU citizens in Scotland who haven't applied for UK citizenship to vote in our referendum? Or is the answer just the blindingly obvious one?
    Thank you for concurring with my explanation David.

    The answer is indeed blindingly obvious: they have embraced their new country. The sturdy European credentials of Scots are easily recognised by folk who move from the mainland.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,632
    O/T does anyone know the best way of fumigating a suitcase that has been full of a week long holiday clothes that have been very sweaty, sandy, and dirty?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838
    DavidL said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Indeed. So why are the SNP so keen to have over100k EU citizens in Scotland who haven't applied for UK citizenship to vote in our referendum? Or is the answer just the blindingly obvious one?
    Because they were allowed to vote in the last, as they werre rightly regarded as people contributing to Scotland.

    It'sset in the the standard UK legislation for referenda.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,820
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    Multi story carparks are indeed a blight on so many levels.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Our PBTories do find it hard to grasp the fact that the biggest ethnic minority group in the SNP is the English.
    Indeed. Many of my most valued party colleagues over the decades have been New Scots. But BritNats just don’t get how anybody could identify more with an irrelevant province than the mighty Fatherland.
    Never mind the wrong kind of New Scot:

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/north-east/2050412/banff-and-buchan-conservative-chairman-resigns-over-alleged-racist-twitter-debate/

    Anyway, it's a pleasant sunny day here in Scotland, with a refreshijng light breeze, so I'm off in a moment.
    Yes, if I was a civilised Scottish fellow like you, but I had a fellow Nationalist venting full-on Blood and Soil Nationalism, I'd probably make my excuses and skip away

    Enjoy your day!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,820
    eek said:

    DavidL said:

    eek said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Can any of our Nat friends talk us through this exposition of the currency issue in indy Scotland?

    This guy, a professional, er, mapmaker - but also "Convener of the Scottish Currency Group", has handily sketched out how the new Scottish pound will be established, and how the move from sterling will work. It includes gems like this:


    https://twitter.com/RideoutTim/status/1418627474175533059?s=20

    "Your bank will contact you near the time and ask if you would like to re-mortgage into the S£, or take out new S£ credit cards and loans. The banks, Scottish Government and the Scottish Reserve Bank will run an information campaign."

    So that's a doddle then. As someone on Twitter points out, there are 900,000 Scottish mortgage holders who need to be "contacted" and given advice on "remortgaging into the S£."

    That's quite a long chat. Say two hours per mortgage?

    900,000 x 2 hours is 1.8m hours which is 200 years, add in working hours and holidays it's more like 800-1000 years. If the banks get it together and have 100 dedicated teams working flat out on just this, day in day out, they could easily get in done in eight decades

    They might, in fairness, shorten the process by speaking to the lenders of those 900k mortgages and ask them if they want to be paid back in S£ or Sterling. That might make the 900k discussions somewhat irrelevant.

    Edit and oh, by the way, we don't have a Scottish reserve bank. Or any reserves to put in it.
    Why would a bank offer the chance to redominate a loan into a different currency?

    Remember most mortgages nowadays have been sold as a securtised asset to a pension fund or other investment fund
    Exactly, there is absolutely no chance they would agree to the switch so it wouldn't matter what the borrowers thought. If they tried to make the transfer a matter of statute then the Banks would sue the Scottish government because the value of their assets would have been reduced by something like 20% in breach of Article 1 protocol 1 of the ECHR. It is utter madness by people who are so economically illiterate that they make Nicola look credible.
    The problem with the referendum is that you then get people like Malcolmg who will argue that even though it's practically impossible it doesn't matter as Nicola and the Scottish Parliament will ensure its mortgages are fixed.

    In the same way he believes that the UK government will continue to pay his pension.

    I almost want them to vote Yes to see the eventual fall out but I don't think I can live in a diet of popcorn while laughing
    For those who live north of the border its really not a laughing matter I'm afraid. These people are completely delusional about the consequences of their actions and reckless as a result.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    DougSeal said:

    Sandpit said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    There have been so many tales of Brexit and Covid related empty shelves these past 5 years I lose count. I couldn’t see anything missing in my out of the way village Co-Op down here in deepest East Kent. Similarly the posh farm shop. Maybe it will happen but there’s a lot of wolf crying at the moment,
    There’s possibly some line item shortages around, and possibly a few outlets with larger problems of missed deliveries, but the issues that do exist are being massively amplified by anti-government partisans on Twitter.
    As an anti-government partisan myself it does my head in that we have not learned that these exaggerated tales of catastrophe on Twitter do not work. 2016 should have taught us that. It’s so annoying.
    It appears to be a consequence of so much political discourse moving online in recent years.

    The problem, as you understand, is that a few hundred people catastrophising everything to each other on social media, doesn’t match with what the vast majority of people are observing in the real world. So when they do have something useful to say, they’re the boys who cried wolf.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    A civilised and knowledgeable PBer. What a lovely breath of fresh air. Only problem is, now I’m hungry.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,361
    Leon said:

    Some more gems


    "If I re-mortgage how does this work?
    You are best to ask your bank to do this during the Exchange Period, the first two months or so. That will avoid you having any currency fees to pay or any risk from exchange rate changes."

    "After you instruct your bank to arrange an S£ mortgage you will complete the standard process of selecting a mortgage (fixed term, tracker, etc), an updated valuation if required and the legal paperwork. On the date agreed with your bank they will release the S£ funds."


    900,000 mortgages calmly switching over "in the first two months". "Or so".

    Luckily this process will avoid "any risk from exchange rate changes"

    It doesn't matter. It doesn't have to be true, or even barely credible, it just has to have enough truthiness to enable enough people to deny reality until polling day. Then, if the Independence vote is won, that will be that. See, for example, Brexit, and the claims made in that campaign.

    And even if you do win the argument on the detail, you've then lost it on positivity and identity, as you're the negative English person telling Scots they are too poor and too stupid to run their own country.

    Just as with Brexit, winning a referendum on lies and nationalism will be the easy bit. Dealing with the almighty mess created will be much harder.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Our PBTories do find it hard to grasp the fact that the biggest ethnic minority group in the SNP is the English.
    And do Nats struggle to grasp the fact that nearly twice as many Scots live in England as English live in Scotland?

    And 50% more Scots live in Wales than Welsh live in Scotland....In fact the only part of the UK which has fewer Scots than expats is NI...
  • In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    A civilised and knowledgeable PBer. What a lovely breath of fresh air. Only problem is, now I’m hungry.
    People that put cream in carbonara aren't welcome in my home
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,820
    edited July 2021
    Carnyx said:

    DavidL said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Indeed. So why are the SNP so keen to have over100k EU citizens in Scotland who haven't applied for UK citizenship to vote in our referendum? Or is the answer just the blindingly obvious one?
    Because they were allowed to vote in the last, as they werre rightly regarded as people contributing to Scotland.

    It'sset in the the standard UK legislation for referenda.
    That's absurd. In the last referendum we were members of the EU and had treaty obligations determining when and for what they were entitled to vote. We no longer do and they aren't.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    Multi story carparks are indeed a blight on so many levels.
    That’s an old Tim Vine joke.
    “Car theft from the multi-storey, that’s a crime on so many levels”.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,135
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    Yes fair enough and I agree in the abstract. But I used it a lot and got that thrilling 'beating the system' feeling. 2 hours free parking in Central London. In North London's equivalent of Soho. No checks. Not applicable for you since you could just easily walk there.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    It's really not "how most nations work"

    Take Britain. My country

    Unless you actively want to wreak violence on my country, out of some hatred, then if you live here permanently, you are British, and you are entitled to any lawful political opinion you care to hold. Even Scottish Nationalism.
    You can call me anything you like Sean. That is your prerogative.

    I am not British. That is my prerogative.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,361

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Tebbit's cricket test for Scotland. I count as a foreigner in Scotland if I vote for the Union. Lovely.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    MattW said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    How are the Grand Union Walk Grimshaw houses down the back of the Sainsbury's looking these days?
    I cycled along the Grand Union Canal today (going to see tinnitus increased since vaccine aged aunt). The canal is both disgusting and beautiful.

    I notice one barge is selling coffees/breakfast just by the Sainsbury's.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Leon said:

    Some more gems


    "If I re-mortgage how does this work?
    You are best to ask your bank to do this during the Exchange Period, the first two months or so. That will avoid you having any currency fees to pay or any risk from exchange rate changes."

    "After you instruct your bank to arrange an S£ mortgage you will complete the standard process of selecting a mortgage (fixed term, tracker, etc), an updated valuation if required and the legal paperwork. On the date agreed with your bank they will release the S£ funds."


    900,000 mortgages calmly switching over "in the first two months". "Or so".

    Luckily this process will avoid "any risk from exchange rate changes"

    It doesn't matter. It doesn't have to be true, or even barely credible, it just has to have enough truthiness to enable enough people to deny reality until polling day. Then, if the Independence vote is won, that will be that. See, for example, Brexit, and the claims made in that campaign.

    And even if you do win the argument on the detail, you've then lost it on positivity and identity, as you're the negative English person telling Scots they are too poor and too stupid to run their own country.

    Just as with Brexit, winning a referendum on lies and nationalism will be the easy bit. Dealing with the almighty mess created will be much harder.
    But this guy's argument is so risible I'm not sure it contains any "truthiness" let alone truth. Even the follow-up remarks from fellow Nats are awkward and hesitant. They know it is bollocks, and sounds like bollocks
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Update on Italian vaccination efficacy data (Delta ~60% of cases):

    - symptomatic infection: 88%
    - hospitalization: 95%
    - Death: 96%

    Perfectly in line with UK and Canada. Israel remains an outlier so far.


    https://twitter.com/marcotrizzino/status/1418843534086524928?s=20
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,158
    Presumably with McCluskey holding the other end :smile:
  • kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Can any of our Nat friends talk us through this exposition of the currency issue in indy Scotland?

    This guy, a professional, er, mapmaker - but also "Convener of the Scottish Currency Group", has handily sketched out how the new Scottish pound will be established, and how the move from sterling will work. It includes gems like this:


    https://twitter.com/RideoutTim/status/1418627474175533059?s=20

    "Your bank will contact you near the time and ask if you would like to re-mortgage into the S£, or take out new S£ credit cards and loans. The banks, Scottish Government and the Scottish Reserve Bank will run an information campaign."

    So that's a doddle then. As someone on Twitter points out, there are 900,000 Scottish mortgage holders who need to be "contacted" and given advice on "remortgaging into the S£."

    That's quite a long chat. Say two hours per mortgage?

    900,000 x 2 hours is 1.8m hours which is 200 years, add in working hours and holidays it's more like 800-1000 years. If the banks get it together and have 100 dedicated teams working flat out on just this, day in day out, they could easily get in done in eight decades

    That spiel is pretty much a copy n paste of a SeanT post in 2013. All doubt removed.
    But is this the new SNP currency position? That's what I want to know
    Tell you what Sean, if you ‘fess up to your countless sock-puppets, I’ll give you a straight answer. (Although why you’re asking some random poster on an obscure blog what the party policy is of a political party with its own website is is a bit of a mystery to me.)
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,219
    Well, YouGov's house effects tend to maximise the Conservative lead, so if they have C+4...
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,631

    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    It's really not "how most nations work"

    Take Britain. My country

    Unless you actively want to wreak violence on my country, out of some hatred, then if you live here permanently, you are British, and you are entitled to any lawful political opinion you care to hold. Even Scottish Nationalism.
    You can call me anything you like Sean. That is your prerogative.

    I am not British. That is my prerogative.
    That's like saying you're not European. You are British regardless of the constitutional status of Scotland.
  • Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    They should all be underground. Though that might be a problem on flood plains..
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,820
    Sandpit said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    Multi story carparks are indeed a blight on so many levels.
    That’s an old Tim Vine joke.
    “Car theft from the multi-storey, that’s a crime on so many levels”.
    Indeed. I am claiming my recycling badge for the day.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    Full recovery from Covid a week after testing positive.

    Symptoms were very mild, thanks to amazing vaccines.

    Please - if you haven’t yet - get your jab, as we learn to live with, rather than cower from, this virus.


    https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1418932718847541248?s=20

    At the risk of tempting fate, I almost, almost want to catch Covid now. Seems like the amazing vaccines are working.
    I don’t really want to catch Covid.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    NEW: Sam White, who worked for Alistair Darling under Blair and Brown, to take over as Keir Starmer's chief of staff.

    Completes New Lab reunion in his office: Matthew Doyle, Blair's frmr political director, director of comms. Deborah Mattinson, Brown's pollster, head of strategy


    https://twitter.com/Gabriel_Pogrund/status/1418938242850820112?s=20
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Andy_JS said:

    Taking an average of recent polls, the Tories are down quite a bit but Labour are only up slightly. The bottom two polls on the list have Lab on 34% and 35%, exactly the same as the two new ones.

    Meaning… Lib Dem surge. Oh, wait a minute…
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,158
    edited July 2021
    Leon said:

    MattW said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    How are the Grand Union Walk Grimshaw houses down the back of the Sainsbury's looking these days?
    Actually OK. They are well maintained. And at night they are beautifully lit up in multiple colours, which reflect off the canal

    Still not sure I'd like to live in one - tiny windows?! - but they are certainly not slums
    I viewed one once. Now around £10000 per sqm.

    The industrial shutters and balconies were a genius idea. They need something for getting canoes onto the canal, though, and gardens.

    33 years old, now.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,632
    Based on the past tweets of James and Adam I'm going for a no change poll.

    They do this when there's no change.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,958

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Tebbit's cricket test for Scotland. I count as a foreigner in Scotland if I vote for the Union. Lovely.
    Regardless of whether you are or you aren't one, why is being a foreigner such a negative thing?
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    So a bit of fun, what will Opinium say for the headline percentages? Get your predictions in early

    SCon 46%
    SLab 21%
    SLD 19%
    SNP 5%

    Gawd bless our jellied eels.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    ...or Conservatives exceed 50%

    ... or Labour/LD crossover

    ... or more likely Labour nudge up a notch or two and the Tories ratchet down a notch or two.
  • Based on the past tweets of James and Adam I'm going for a no change poll.

    They do this when there's no change.
    I'm going for a tied poll!
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,158

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    A civilised and knowledgeable PBer. What a lovely breath of fresh air. Only problem is, now I’m hungry.
    Be fun if Blanche is another instantiation of SeanT :smile:
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Full recovery from Covid a week after testing positive.

    Symptoms were very mild, thanks to amazing vaccines.

    Please - if you haven’t yet - get your jab, as we learn to live with, rather than cower from, this virus.


    https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1418932718847541248?s=20

    At the risk of tempting fate, I almost, almost want to catch Covid now. Seems like the amazing vaccines are working.
    I don’t really want to catch Covid.
    I was thinking the same thing recently

    If there is a nastier new variant in the wings, and you are double jabbed, it is almost better to get it now, have (very probably) a mild case, then recover, and be even more immune?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,811

    How much better we would have been if Brown had called that election. Underrated PM

    He would have lost and we'd have had the same Tory/LD coalition just in 2007 rather than 2010. The British people would not have voted for Brown, the guy was a complete numpty.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    edited July 2021

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    They should all be underground. Though that might be a problem on flood plains..
    Agree 100%. It's amazing how it was thought for so long to be a good idea to take up valuable space in towns and cities by building them above ground.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Ouch! When even the rent-a-quotes are turning you down:


    Richard Murphy @RichardJMurphy

    I was just invited to do @gbnews and took the greatest pleasure in saying no


    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1418942433413537797?s=20
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    It's funny, the way Stuart Dickson describes what counts as his fellow countrymen is the way some on the far right say my family cannot be British.

    Curious.

    Now you’re trying to provoke me into saying what got that Labour MP expelled from the chamber the other day. She was right, and so am I.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sandpit said:

    Genuine blip I think. Many people think the restrictions should still be there.

    This is the most politically difficult time of the whole pandemic. The government can do little more on vaccines, and now need to carefully navigate the balance between economic damage and public health. They’re probably a week or two ahead of the people in this regard, but if Europe and the US have to start re-introducing restrictions as UK case numbers drop, then we’ll be back to 10 point leads.

    At some point, the opposition are going to have to say what they’re for, rather than simply what they’re against. Last time the government fell, in 2019, the same party picked up and pushed forward under a new leader. Who’s to say that can’t happen again?

    Right now Boris is leading the country, going against the polls, rather than having government by opinion polls.

    Quite right too. We should all be hoping the right decision has been made and the end of restrictions can be permanent now without collapsing the NHS.
  • In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    A civilised and knowledgeable PBer. What a lovely breath of fresh air. Only problem is, now I’m hungry.
    Thank you Stuart. I think I am probably quite civilised and knowledgeable when it comes to feeding myself; I might even boldly venture to include enlightened and multicultural. When it comes to my politics, I guess we'll all find out soon enough..
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,377
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Incidentally, talking of supermarkets, just been to M&S in Camden and there was no sign of any shortage of anything, except ready flaked parmesan. That's it.


    Where are these empty shelves?!

    The loss of the big Camden Morrisons is keenly felt. Used to be able to park up for 2 hours totally free, just get a packet of fags and a tinny, and go hang out by the lock for ... well for just under 2 hours. Pretty unique loophole now closed.
    it hasn't gone forever. There's a new temporary version next door as they remake the old one. I liked it for the petrol station. There are very few around here, so it was handy
    Yes but the big free carpark isn't coming back. Flats.
    Car parks are an abomination. A blight on any city. Huge ugly blocks of land dedicated to storing transport. They could be housing, or garden squares, or parks, or happy playgrounds. I yearn for the day we can get rid of all of them
    Multi story carparks are indeed a blight on so many levels.
    Yes, car parks should stick to the same story! :)
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Carnyx said:

    DougSeal said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    What next. DNA tests?
    It’s the Conservatives who wants the DNA tests.

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/scottish-independence-scots-living-in-rest-of-uk-should-be-allowed-to-vote-in-any-future-referendum-alastair-stewart-3288715

    I do remembner Mr Cameron going on and on about blood in 2014 - how people like him should be remembered. Indeed if we are talking about blood and soil I recall that he spoke about how the sacrifices of the dead of the Somme demanded a No vote (and even then I don't think many on PB realised what a dog-whistle that was in Glasgow, where he was speaking).
    PBers who don’t understand Scotland is not a new phenomenon.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,958
    edited July 2021
    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless (cheeseless?) search for flaked Parmesan are you?
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    Spaghetti is the king of pastas. I always knew you were a heathen.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    edited July 2021

    So a bit of fun, what will Opinium say for the headline percentages? Get your predictions in early

    Con 36%, Lab 36%, LD 9%, Green 7%.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,811
    Leon said:

    Full recovery from Covid a week after testing positive.

    Symptoms were very mild, thanks to amazing vaccines.

    Please - if you haven’t yet - get your jab, as we learn to live with, rather than cower from, this virus.


    https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1418932718847541248?s=20

    At the risk of tempting fate, I almost, almost want to catch Covid now. Seems like the amazing vaccines are working.
    I don’t really want to catch Covid.
    I was thinking the same thing recently

    If there is a nastier new variant in the wings, and you are double jabbed, it is almost better to get it now, have (very probably) a mild case, then recover, and be even more immune?
    Yeah it's part of the considerations for having a summer exit wave. If vaccinated people catch this variant it just helps the push for herd immunity.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,958
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
  • Andy_JS said:

    So a bit of fun, what will Opinium say for the headline percentages? Get your predictions in early

    Con 36%, Lab 36%, LD 9%, Green 7%.
    This was going to be much where I put my prediction, so I will just copy yours
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,135

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    LOL

    You actually can't do it, can you? It's like some bizarre mental block
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
    Because the Scots who identify primarily as British, are opposed to independence? Who’d have thought that!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,811

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
    That's not great for independence. Looks like we're stuck with you lot. Sad.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,361

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    Tebbit's cricket test for Scotland. I count as a foreigner in Scotland if I vote for the Union. Lovely.
    Regardless of whether you are or you aren't one, why is being a foreigner such a negative thing?
    Because people want to feel like they belong where they live, and the designation as a foreigner would mark me out as an outsider, at best a guest, a temporary visitor, if not worse.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
    You could make it with pasta for those that like it and split a bit of the cheese/egg/pasta water/guanciale and fat into a different pan to make the sauce for your chips?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,820
    Sandpit said:

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
    Because the Scots who identify primarily as British, are opposed to independence? Who’d have thought that!
    What we really need is some polling of those with ginger hair and freckles.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
    Because the Scots who identify primarily as British, are opposed to independence? Who’d have thought that!
    What we really need is some polling of those with ginger hair and freckles.
    lol
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,821

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    He said this:

    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,990
    BoZo is a liberal...

    🚨🚨🚨| BREAKING: Boris Johnson is to launch a new programme where the government tracks what people eat and how much exercise they do. And if people do well they get discounts and free stuff

    Via @Telegraph

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1418944731434913803
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited July 2021

    Redfield & Wilton Strategies @RedfieldWilton

    If a referendum for independence were to be held in Scotland, who do Britons think would win?

    The 'pro-UK' side: 32%
    The 'pro-Independence' side: 24%
    Don't know: 44%


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1418911675844079618?s=20

    From the linked report:

    Amongst those who identify as Scottish, a plurality of 45% support Scottish independence… followed by 38% who oppose it.
    You missed a bit....

    Compared to the general public, a much smaller proportion of those who identify as Scottish say they neither support nor oppose it (15%), indicating that the issue is much more polarised among Scottish people. Meanwhile, of respondents who live in Scotland—who may or may not identify as Scottish—41% oppose and 40% support independence, while a further 17% neither support nor oppose it.

    It is residents you want to vote, isn't it?
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
    You could make it with pasta for those that like it and split a bit of the cheese/egg/pasta water/guanciale and fat into a different pan to make the sauce for your chips?
    Or make it as a sauce to go with some parboiled roasted chips. The cooler water from the longer ago cooked chips would probably help by cooling the ban a bit before you add the eggs as you definitely don't want them cooked, just warm enough to melt the cheese. You only need a tiny bit of the starchy water, but it seems important in getting the right emulsification with the fat and eggs.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,402
    edited July 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    BoZo is a liberal...

    🚨🚨🚨| BREAKING: Boris Johnson is to launch a new programme where the government tracks what people eat and how much exercise they do. And if people do well they get discounts and free stuff

    Via @Telegraph

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1418944731434913803

    Sounds like the Simpsons episode where Homer discovers if he gains a few more pounds he will qualify as disabled.

    What could possibly go wrong?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,431
    eek said:

    DavidL said:

    eek said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Can any of our Nat friends talk us through this exposition of the currency issue in indy Scotland?

    This guy, a professional, er, mapmaker - but also "Convener of the Scottish Currency Group", has handily sketched out how the new Scottish pound will be established, and how the move from sterling will work. It includes gems like this:


    https://twitter.com/RideoutTim/status/1418627474175533059?s=20

    "Your bank will contact you near the time and ask if you would like to re-mortgage into the S£, or take out new S£ credit cards and loans. The banks, Scottish Government and the Scottish Reserve Bank will run an information campaign."

    So that's a doddle then. As someone on Twitter points out, there are 900,000 Scottish mortgage holders who need to be "contacted" and given advice on "remortgaging into the S£."

    That's quite a long chat. Say two hours per mortgage?

    900,000 x 2 hours is 1.8m hours which is 200 years, add in working hours and holidays it's more like 800-1000 years. If the banks get it together and have 100 dedicated teams working flat out on just this, day in day out, they could easily get in done in eight decades

    They might, in fairness, shorten the process by speaking to the lenders of those 900k mortgages and ask them if they want to be paid back in S£ or Sterling. That might make the 900k discussions somewhat irrelevant.

    Edit and oh, by the way, we don't have a Scottish reserve bank. Or any reserves to put in it.
    Why would a bank offer the chance to redominate a loan into a different currency?

    Remember most mortgages nowadays have been sold as a securtised asset to a pension fund or other investment fund
    Exactly, there is absolutely no chance they would agree to the switch so it wouldn't matter what the borrowers thought. If they tried to make the transfer a matter of statute then the Banks would sue the Scottish government because the value of their assets would have been reduced by something like 20% in breach of Article 1 protocol 1 of the ECHR. It is utter madness by people who are so economically illiterate that they make Nicola look credible.
    The problem with the referendum is that you then get people like Malcolmg who will argue that even though it's practically impossible it doesn't matter as Nicola and the Scottish Parliament will ensure its mortgages are fixed.

    In the same way he believes that the UK government will continue to pay his pension.

    I almost want them to vote Yes to see the eventual fall out but I don't think I can live in a diet of popcorn while laughing
    Bit like Brexit then.

    Yes, I'm a Rejoiner, and the sooner the better.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,260
    Scott_xP said:

    BoZo is a liberal...

    🚨🚨🚨| BREAKING: Boris Johnson is to launch a new programme where the government tracks what people eat and how much exercise they do. And if people do well they get discounts and free stuff

    Via @Telegraph

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1418944731434913803

    Predicted this - see the staggering success of Prudential Vitality.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,386

    MattW said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    A civilised and knowledgeable PBer. What a lovely breath of fresh air. Only problem is, now I’m hungry.
    Be fun if Blanche is another instantiation of SeanT :smile:
    Be a lot of fun for me if I had access to his bank account(s)
    Although you would have to pay his alimonies as well...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,386
    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    There's no depths to which these angry Scots won't plumb to support their nationalist and separatist agenda. If that means "Scottish votes for truly Scottish people" then that's what they'll do. In @StuartDickson's world my parents aren't really British and their votes should count for less if at all because they weren't born in the UK.

    The true face of Scottish nationalism. A racist movement supported by angry white Scottish men who's whole existence is small dick energy personified.
    The irony that occurred to me is by that definition Stuart isn’t Swedish...
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,135

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    Spaghetti is the king of pastas. I always knew you were a heathen.
    It's not the taste I don't like, it's the faff. Have never mastered the twirl on fork technique. Chips so much easier. Just stab them and dip.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838
    edited July 2021

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. Edit: Someone would complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,431
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    Spaghetti is the king of pastas. I always knew you were a heathen.
    It's not the taste I don't like, it's the faff. Have never mastered the twirl on fork technique. Chips so much easier. Just stab them and dip.
    Same with noodles. Even worse with chopsticks.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,260
    ydoethur said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    There's no depths to which these angry Scots won't plumb to support their nationalist and separatist agenda. If that means "Scottish votes for truly Scottish people" then that's what they'll do. In @StuartDickson's world my parents aren't really British and their votes should count for less if at all because they weren't born in the UK.

    The true face of Scottish nationalism. A racist movement supported by angry white Scottish men who's whole existence is small dick energy personified.
    The irony that occurred to me is by that definition Stuart isn’t Swedish...
    Some Scandinavian countries are quite protective of their culture. A friend is on the track to become a Danish citizen - which requires learning Danish to a very high degree among other things.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,593

    Andy_JS said:

    So a bit of fun, what will Opinium say for the headline percentages? Get your predictions in early

    Con 36%, Lab 36%, LD 9%, Green 7%.
    This was going to be much where I put my prediction, so I will just copy yours
    It would be delicious if Lab squeezed another 1% out of the LDs and Greens, and OGH could have an "I told you you so" follow up to the "back a Labour lead" threader of a few days ago.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,821
    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,135

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
    You could make it with pasta for those that like it and split a bit of the cheese/egg/pasta water/guanciale and fat into a different pan to make the sauce for your chips?
    Or make it as a sauce to go with some parboiled roasted chips. The cooler water from the longer ago cooked chips would probably help by cooling the ban a bit before you add the eggs as you definitely don't want them cooked, just warm enough to melt the cheese. You only need a tiny bit of the starchy water, but it seems important in getting the right emulsification with the fat and eggs.
    The deal breaker is saying I can't use oven chips. No way will I be deep frying them in a pan full of volcanic spitting oil. That's not an option.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    Spaghetti is the king of pastas. I always knew you were a heathen.
    It's not the taste I don't like, it's the faff. Have never mastered the twirl on fork technique. Chips so much easier. Just stab them and dip.
    Oh, I like using pasta like cavatappi and fusilli for the same reason. That may make me a heathen in some Italian pasta circles, but I don't care. I love the way those pastas get coated by a good carbonara sauce.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So? "your fellow countrymen" must mean the Scots born as that is the PBTory default option.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,354
    Re Opinium, beware that polls that are ramped are frequently damp squibs.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
    You could make it with pasta for those that like it and split a bit of the cheese/egg/pasta water/guanciale and fat into a different pan to make the sauce for your chips?
    Or make it as a sauce to go with some parboiled roasted chips. The cooler water from the longer ago cooked chips would probably help by cooling the ban a bit before you add the eggs as you definitely don't want them cooked, just warm enough to melt the cheese. You only need a tiny bit of the starchy water, but it seems important in getting the right emulsification with the fat and eggs.
    The deal breaker is saying I can't use oven chips. No way will I be deep frying them in a pan full of volcanic spitting oil. That's not an option.
    Could cook the spuds, resewrving the water for the sauce and then slicing and frying the spuds in shallow oil?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,431
    Just dropped in for half an hour to give a break from sport and it's as bad as the TV. If it isn't sport, it's cooking!
    Think I'll get some exercise!

    Bye!!!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,821
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So? "your fellow countrymen" must mean the Scots born as that is the PBTory default option.
    Hang on! @StuartDickson Dickson is a PB Tory then???

    Or, more likely, does he really think you have to be born in Scotland to have a vote in any IndyRef past or future?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    Yes, despite all Carnyx's guff (and how disappointing from the most urbane Nat on here) what Stuart Dickson said is obvious: his "fellow countrymen" are Scots born in Scotland. That's it. Everyone else is not truly Scottish, not a "fellow countryman", and if they don't embrace Scottish independence they are..... God knows what he thinks.

    At the core of Nat ideology is ethnocentricity and anti-Englishness. Twas ever thus. All the rest- from civic Nationalism to pro-EU sentiment - is transient fancy packaging designed to disguise this central and rather unpleasant ethos. We know this because the pro-EU thing is a completely new invention, given that a YES vote in 2014 meant instant departure from the EU.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,838

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So? "your fellow countrymen" must mean the Scots born as that is the PBTory default option.
    Hang on! @StuartDickson Dickson is a PB Tory then???

    Or, more likely, does he really think you have to be born in Scotland to have a vote in any IndyRef past or future?
    (a) no - just using words in a way which will be understood.

    (b) He is a SNP member of long standing. That is the complete opposite of party policy.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,811
    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. Edit: Someone would complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    I made no such definition of countrymen. It was @StuartDickson who defined it as only those people born in Scotland. Quite simply this is the face of your nationalist movement. Blood and soil nationalism built on nothing more than hatred of the English.

    The sooner you come to terms with what Scotland will become as an independent nation the better. You're already the most hostile nation to immigrants within the UK with the smallest proportion of people from immigrant backgrounds. The two times I've been racially harassed in London was by Scots, one a police officer and the other someone who seemed to take issue with the fact that I was on a date with a white woman (my then gf, now wife who rejected his advances).
  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673

    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    I've been on holiday for the last week but someone did message me the other day and said Boris Johnson's decision to ignore the ping then deny it was a bit like Gordon Brown denying he had planned to call a snap election in 2007.

    Don't take the piss with the voters is the message.

    Brown chickened out of the snap election in 2007 after seeing the polling from Scotland
    Wrong, it was the polling from middle England, they loved Dave and George's IHT plans.

    Must annoy you that Scotland was the only place in the UK that saw Labour's vote share go up in 2010.
    Oh, I forgot my place. Tugs forelock. Of course England is much, much, much more important than Scotchland. I’ll never make that mistake again Sir.

    You have a very bizarre concept of what “annoys” people. Psychological projection.
    It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014.
    Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So you don't consider people who have moved to Scotland your fellow countrymen?
    If they embrace their new country: yes.

    If they don’t: no.

    That’s how most nations on the planet work.
    It's really not "how most nations work"

    Take Britain. My country

    Unless you actively want to wreak violence on my country, out of some hatred, then if you live here permanently, you are British, and you are entitled to any lawful political opinion you care to hold. Even Scottish Nationalism.
    You can call me anything you like Sean. That is your prerogative.

    I am not British. That is my prerogative.
    That's like saying you're not European. You are British regardless of the constitutional status of Scotland.
    I remember during the last Indy debate when Nats were INSISTING that an independent Scotland would not deprive anyone of British identity, as it is a proud regional identity like Scandinavia. The inconsistency is hilarious.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    In defence of Waitrose, it's the only supermarket where I can find the crucial ingredient for making proper carbonara: guanciale. It's a very fatty cheek bacon and its high fat content makes a far better sauce than any other bacon or pancetta.

    The only other ingredients are pasta, egg yolks, pecorino cheese (not parmesan), black pepper and a pinch of salt in the pasta water.

    Definitely no cream.

    Ingredients for this recipe for 4 costs about six quid at Waitrose
    https://www.eatalianwithroberto.com/real-carbonara-recipe/

    That sounds great. I don't like spaghetti so I'd have it with chips. What's your view on that?
    It could work, but you'd need to boil raw chipped potatoes to get the starchy water which you need for the sauce, before deep frying them - no oven chips.

    Let me know what it's like if you give it a go!
    Ah. Thanks but I fear that blows me out.
    You could make it with pasta for those that like it and split a bit of the cheese/egg/pasta water/guanciale and fat into a different pan to make the sauce for your chips?
    Or make it as a sauce to go with some parboiled roasted chips. The cooler water from the longer ago cooked chips would probably help by cooling the ban a bit before you add the eggs as you definitely don't want them cooked, just warm enough to melt the cheese. You only need a tiny bit of the starchy water, but it seems important in getting the right emulsification with the fat and eggs.
    The deal breaker is saying I can't use oven chips. No way will I be deep frying them in a pan full of volcanic spitting oil. That's not an option.
    Just thought. Reserve a cup of starchy water next time you boil something starchy and put it in the fridge. You don't have to deep fry anything. Oven chips would be fine. I was just thinking about getting the starchy water.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. You'd complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    He said this:


    "Max: It must eat away at you that your fellow countrymen bottled it in 2014"

    Stuart: Except they didn’t.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/majority-of-scottish-born-voters-said-yes-z7v2mmhc8nt
    So? "your fellow countrymen" must mean the Scots born as that is the PBTory default option.
    It really fucking isn't. Stop being disingenuous.

    Max meant "All the people resident in Scotland, all those entitled to vote in the indyref"

    Dickson came back with "No you're wrong, those aren't my countrymen, my TRUE countrymen are Scots born in Scotland"

    A telling glimpse behind the mask
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,958
    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Interesting.


    When, say, a Tory like HYUFD comes out with some offensive position - like sending tanks over Hadrian's Wall - his fellow Tories are quite happy to denounce him, and distance themselves

    When a Nat like Stuart Dickson comes up with 100% full-fat Powellite Blut Und Boden Scottish ethno-nationalism, his fellow Nats just murmur politely, or say nothing, or quietly tip-toe away, they do not call him out. Loyalty, or cowardice? Perhaps both

    Bit bored after your fruitless search for flaked Parmesan are you?
    For once in your PB life you could show a bit of backbone and say a fellow Nat is talking offensive nonsense

    I've never known you do it, despite ample opportunities. Here is another chance
    You lied about what he said.

    Weedy trolling effort - nul points
    Perhaps more to the point, "your fellow countrymen" is hopelessly ambiguous. It cane from a PBTory in the middle of a debate about whether the correct designation for the so-called British is, well, British (but as any fule kno that is hopelessly ambiguous in NI and the adjacent parts of Scotland and the correct answer is subject of HMTQ of the UK etc). And the only definition of a Scot in PBToryland is a blood definition (as seen by the constant chorus of demand to allow e.g. Mr Cameron a vote in indyref2).

    So Mr Dickson was merely being polite in answering the question in the terms and mindset of the original questioner, and it hardly seems fair to monster him for that. Edit: Someone would complain - and PBTories most certainly do - if one uses a different definition of Scot.
    One recurring airhead PB definition of a Scot is someone coming from a nation of bottlers, apparently referring to Scots who voted no and would again in any indy referendum. Perhaps Unionist Scots with some self respect should consider how some of their fellow Brits look upon them, though I say that more in hope than expectation.
This discussion has been closed.