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They Gush over Truss: Betting on the next Tory Leader – politicalbetting.com

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  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    This Simpson fellow is a decent keeper.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Maybe it's time for women to play best of 5 sets at Wimbledon. It looks like this final is going to be over in a very short time.

    I’ve long advocated equal pay for equal sets. Shorter women’s games has long let the top female players milk the tournaments doubles pot too, in a way that the men cannot.
    I'm not sure there's fan appetite for best of 5 women's matches. Their tennis product is (in general and with exceptions) not as good as the men's. The equal pay is only at slams and is symbolic, not related to time on court or box office power. By setting equal pay (for these slam events where the men and women share the draw and the venue) the tennis world is making a statement that women's hard work and talent is valued as much as men's.
    Without wishing to degenerate this, if the product isn’t as good, why have equal pay? I think you are probably right, in that the depth of talent in women’s tennis is less than in the men’s, and as a rule there are more easy early round wins. But I do think there is an issue with three sets vs five.
    It's just at the slams and is symbolic. A statement by the tennis world that men and women are valued equally. Important and correct imo.

    Consider the alternative and you see why this is so. The alternative would be for the slams to define by how much they value men more than women. That's a minefield so they'd shirk it and go for 60% - and justify this by saying it's actually equal because the women play best of 3 instead of best of 5.

    The women would then INSIST on playing best of 5. Which there isn't the fan appetite for and would bloat the schedule. You'd have an insoluble mess. And bad messaging flying about left right and centre.

    So this is the way. How it now. It's not a problem.
    In my eyes it is a mess. See my point about the doubles. It would be better to have either both play best of five or best of three. That shows that you value both the same. The current version is wrong.
    It's just at the slams. They are special because they are the masthead of the sport and the draw and venue is shared by the sexes. You can't hypothecate the revenue. Tennis is unusual in this respect of having shared events at the pinnacle.

    Given this, and given no appetite in the game or from the fans for women's best of 5, you have a choice between equal prize money or setting the women's as a fraction of the men's. The latter is a can of worms. So the bottom line is, equal prize money at tennis grand slams might irritate some blokes on the internet - and I get why - but it's better than any viable alternative.
    And I should say I am not objecting to equal pay. It’s the unequal nature of the set up, especially the doubles opportunity.
    But you have to consider the practical question - if there is audience demand for men's best/5 but not for women's best/5, how do you suggest the prize money be split (at the slams) if not equally?
    Evidence for the demand?
    Can't link you a YouGov or anything. But most serious tennis fans I've conversed with concur. Plus of course the fact the slams don't do it. If the fans were keen for women's best/5, they'd find a way (as we agreed).

    Any case, back to my question to you. Assuming for these purposes it's right - the consumer demand for women's best/5 isn't there and so we're sticking to women playing best/3 - how are you going to split the prize money at the slams?
    One for you. Should England women internationals be paid the same as their male colleagues? Even if one team sells out Wembley and the other doesn’t?
    Ok. So I'll go with a Yes - because international match fees are very secondary for the men. The symbolism of equal fees would benefit the women's game whilst not harming the men's. Net win.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    This over is not going very well for Callum Parkinson.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586

    DougSeal said:

    It’s like she wasn’t even trying


    Those Pesky Blinders won't get off my lawn.
    For some reason I hear in my head -

    "I'd have got away with it, but for that pesky bunch of Brummie organised criminals!"
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    edited July 2021
    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190
    edited July 2021
    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Maybe it's time for women to play best of 5 sets at Wimbledon. It looks like this final is going to be over in a very short time.

    I’ve long advocated equal pay for equal sets. Shorter women’s games has long let the top female players milk the tournaments doubles pot too, in a way that the men cannot.
    I'm not sure there's fan appetite for best of 5 women's matches. Their tennis product is (in general and with exceptions) not as good as the men's. The equal pay is only at slams and is symbolic, not related to time on court or box office power. By setting equal pay (for these slam events where the men and women share the draw and the venue) the tennis world is making a statement that women's hard work and talent is valued as much as men's.
    Without wishing to degenerate this, if the product isn’t as good, why have equal pay? I think you are probably right, in that the depth of talent in women’s tennis is less than in the men’s, and as a rule there are more easy early round wins. But I do think there is an issue with three sets vs five.
    It's just at the slams and is symbolic. A statement by the tennis world that men and women are valued equally. Important and correct imo.

    Consider the alternative and you see why this is so. The alternative would be for the slams to define by how much they value men more than women. That's a minefield so they'd shirk it and go for 60% - and justify this by saying it's actually equal because the women play best of 3 instead of best of 5.

    The women would then INSIST on playing best of 5. Which there isn't the fan appetite for and would bloat the schedule. You'd have an insoluble mess. And bad messaging flying about left right and centre.

    So this is the way. How it now. It's not a problem.
    In my eyes it is a mess. See my point about the doubles. It would be better to have either both play best of five or best of three. That shows that you value both the same. The current version is wrong.
    It's just at the slams. They are special because they are the masthead of the sport and the draw and venue is shared by the sexes. You can't hypothecate the revenue. Tennis is unusual in this respect of having shared events at the pinnacle.

    Given this, and given no appetite in the game or from the fans for women's best of 5, you have a choice between equal prize money or setting the women's as a fraction of the men's. The latter is a can of worms. So the bottom line is, equal prize money at tennis grand slams might irritate some blokes on the internet - and I get why - but it's better than any viable alternative.
    And I should say I am not objecting to equal pay. It’s the unequal nature of the set up, especially the doubles opportunity.
    But you have to consider the practical question - if there is audience demand for men's best/5 but not for women's best/5, how do you suggest the prize money be split (at the slams) if not equally?
    Presumably sprinters should be paid less than long distance runners on the same basis.

    Isn't the reality that time on court or field is only the time to decide the winner, and that the effort to train daily for years is equivalent, whether the final contest is one hour or three? Endurance is only one aspect of the game.

  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,427
    Why would Prince Charles care whether Prince Edward is Duke of Edinburgh or not? Seems fairly petty.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    No Russian troll will ever beat the one that that was pretending to be someone from Birmingham whilst not knowing where Brum was.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    Alistair said:

    No Russian troll will ever beat the one that that was pretending to be someone from Birmingham whilst not knowing where Brum was.

    Oh God yes.

    https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/930437291109122048
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    Pakistan now falling faster than Hancock’s trousers.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    No spoilers wanted….?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301

    Why would Prince Charles care whether Prince Edward is Duke of Edinburgh or not? Seems fairly petty.

    Depending on what you read, Prince Charles is jealous of the close relationship Prince Edward had with his parents, or that Prince Charles wants a slimmed down monarchy.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    Alistair said:

    No Russian troll will ever beat the one that that was pretending to be someone from Birmingham whilst not knowing where Brum was.

    Oh God yes.

    https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/930437291109122048
    Do you have another link? DAG has made his tweets private.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,344
    ydoethur said:

    Pakistan now falling faster than Hancock’s trousers.

    Simile used to be a tarts knickers
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Swarms of flying ants could swarm to Wembley and cloud the Euro 2020 final, after a radar detected millions of bugs over London and the south-east on Friday.

    As luck has it, the final between England and Italy is taking place on Sunday, which could fall into the mating period of ants, which go on a “nuptial flight” in huge numbers between June and September.

    Although the Met Office has forecast “promising” weather for Sunday, it also picked up on the phenomenon potentially coinciding with the fixture and becoming a nuisance for buzzing players and fans.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,578
    ydoethur said:

    tlg86 said:



    I think one set would be a bit disrespectful! I’ve never done any analysis of this so perhaps my gut feelings are wrong.

    If you had men and women playing five sets each then scheduling would be tricky. At the moment, the women’s matches fit neatly in and around the men. Obviously from the QFs onwards at Wimbledon the two are separated and you could have best of five women’s matches no problem whatsoever.

    I’m not sure Emma Raducanu would agree with that...but in a sense, that proves your point better.
    [Vic Reeves voice] RADUCANU!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    ydoethur said:

    Alistair said:

    No Russian troll will ever beat the one that that was pretending to be someone from Birmingham whilst not knowing where Brum was.

    Oh God yes.

    https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/930437291109122048
    Do you have another link? DAG has made his tweets private.
    Here you go.


  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,920
    ydoethur said:

    Alistair said:

    No Russian troll will ever beat the one that that was pretending to be someone from Birmingham whilst not knowing where Brum was.

    Oh God yes.

    https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/930437291109122048
    Do you have another link? DAG has made his tweets private.
    Here you go...


  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Maybe it's time for women to play best of 5 sets at Wimbledon. It looks like this final is going to be over in a very short time.

    I’ve long advocated equal pay for equal sets. Shorter women’s games has long let the top female players milk the tournaments doubles pot too, in a way that the men cannot.
    I'm not sure there's fan appetite for best of 5 women's matches. Their tennis product is (in general and with exceptions) not as good as the men's. The equal pay is only at slams and is symbolic, not related to time on court or box office power. By setting equal pay (for these slam events where the men and women share the draw and the venue) the tennis world is making a statement that women's hard work and talent is valued as much as men's.
    Without wishing to degenerate this, if the product isn’t as good, why have equal pay? I think you are probably right, in that the depth of talent in women’s tennis is less than in the men’s, and as a rule there are more easy early round wins. But I do think there is an issue with three sets vs five.
    It's just at the slams and is symbolic. A statement by the tennis world that men and women are valued equally. Important and correct imo.

    Consider the alternative and you see why this is so. The alternative would be for the slams to define by how much they value men more than women. That's a minefield so they'd shirk it and go for 60% - and justify this by saying it's actually equal because the women play best of 3 instead of best of 5.

    The women would then INSIST on playing best of 5. Which there isn't the fan appetite for and would bloat the schedule. You'd have an insoluble mess. And bad messaging flying about left right and centre.

    So this is the way. How it now. It's not a problem.
    In my eyes it is a mess. See my point about the doubles. It would be better to have either both play best of five or best of three. That shows that you value both the same. The current version is wrong.
    It's just at the slams. They are special because they are the masthead of the sport and the draw and venue is shared by the sexes. You can't hypothecate the revenue. Tennis is unusual in this respect of having shared events at the pinnacle.

    Given this, and given no appetite in the game or from the fans for women's best of 5, you have a choice between equal prize money or setting the women's as a fraction of the men's. The latter is a can of worms. So the bottom line is, equal prize money at tennis grand slams might irritate some blokes on the internet - and I get why - but it's better than any viable alternative.
    And I should say I am not objecting to equal pay. It’s the unequal nature of the set up, especially the doubles opportunity.
    But you have to consider the practical question - if there is audience demand for men's best/5 but not for women's best/5, how do you suggest the prize money be split (at the slams) if not equally?
    Presumably sprinters should be paid less than long distance runners on the same basis.

    Isn't the reality that time on court or field is only the time to decide the winner, and that the effort to train daily for years is equivalent, whether the final contest is one hour or three? Endurance is only one aspect of the game.
    Yes. And on the money in tennis it's just the slams where it's equal. The rest of the tour operates on a market basis and the men get paid more because demand for their offering is higher. The women DO get a sweetheart deal with the slams but it's justified for 2 main reasons. (1) The symbolism. It's the sport in its flagship events affirming equality of the sexes. (2) There is no good practical alternative given no hypothecation of ticket revenue and no great demand for women playing best/5.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    IanB2 said:

    Swarms of flying ants could swarm to Wembley and cloud the Euro 2020 final, after a radar detected millions of bugs over London and the south-east on Friday.

    As luck has it, the final between England and Italy is taking place on Sunday, which could fall into the mating period of ants, which go on a “nuptial flight” in huge numbers between June and September.

    Although the Met Office has forecast “promising” weather for Sunday, it also picked up on the phenomenon potentially coinciding with the fixture and becoming a nuisance for buzzing players and fans.

    Should be grateful they aren't septemdecennial cicadas.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,578
    ydoethur said:

    Pakistan now falling faster than Hancock’s trousers.

    You mean they're collapsing faster than they did in December 1971? :lol:
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
    He’s currently the Earl of Wessex. The last Earl of Wessex died at the Battle of Hastings.

    (It’s also a title in Julia Quinn’s silly period romances.)
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,793
    IanB2 said:

    Swarms of flying ants could swarm to Wembley and cloud the Euro 2020 final, after a radar detected millions of bugs over London and the south-east on Friday.

    As luck has it, the final between England and Italy is taking place on Sunday, which could fall into the mating period of ants, which go on a “nuptial flight” in huge numbers between June and September.

    Although the Met Office has forecast “promising” weather for Sunday, it also picked up on the phenomenon potentially coinciding with the fixture and becoming a nuisance for buzzing players and fans.

    might actually watch the game then!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190
    IanB2 said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    No spoilers wanted….?
    No thanks, still one all.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Maybe it's time for women to play best of 5 sets at Wimbledon. It looks like this final is going to be over in a very short time.

    I’ve long advocated equal pay for equal sets. Shorter women’s games has long let the top female players milk the tournaments doubles pot too, in a way that the men cannot.
    I'm not sure there's fan appetite for best of 5 women's matches. Their tennis product is (in general and with exceptions) not as good as the men's. The equal pay is only at slams and is symbolic, not related to time on court or box office power. By setting equal pay (for these slam events where the men and women share the draw and the venue) the tennis world is making a statement that women's hard work and talent is valued as much as men's.
    Without wishing to degenerate this, if the product isn’t as good, why have equal pay? I think you are probably right, in that the depth of talent in women’s tennis is less than in the men’s, and as a rule there are more easy early round wins. But I do think there is an issue with three sets vs five.
    It's just at the slams and is symbolic. A statement by the tennis world that men and women are valued equally. Important and correct imo.

    Consider the alternative and you see why this is so. The alternative would be for the slams to define by how much they value men more than women. That's a minefield so they'd shirk it and go for 60% - and justify this by saying it's actually equal because the women play best of 3 instead of best of 5.

    The women would then INSIST on playing best of 5. Which there isn't the fan appetite for and would bloat the schedule. You'd have an insoluble mess. And bad messaging flying about left right and centre.

    So this is the way. How it now. It's not a problem.
    In my eyes it is a mess. See my point about the doubles. It would be better to have either both play best of five or best of three. That shows that you value both the same. The current version is wrong.
    It's just at the slams. They are special because they are the masthead of the sport and the draw and venue is shared by the sexes. You can't hypothecate the revenue. Tennis is unusual in this respect of having shared events at the pinnacle.

    Given this, and given no appetite in the game or from the fans for women's best of 5, you have a choice between equal prize money or setting the women's as a fraction of the men's. The latter is a can of worms. So the bottom line is, equal prize money at tennis grand slams might irritate some blokes on the internet - and I get why - but it's better than any viable alternative.
    And I should say I am not objecting to equal pay. It’s the unequal nature of the set up, especially the doubles opportunity.
    But you have to consider the practical question - if there is audience demand for men's best/5 but not for women's best/5, how do you suggest the prize money be split (at the slams) if not equally?
    Evidence for the demand?
    Can't link you a YouGov or anything. But most serious tennis fans I've conversed with concur. Plus of course the fact the slams don't do it. If the fans were keen for women's best/5, they'd find a way (as we agreed).

    Any case, back to my question to you. Assuming for these purposes it's right - the consumer demand for women's best/5 isn't there and so we're sticking to women playing best/3 - how are you going to split the prize money at the slams?
    One for you. Should England women internationals be paid the same as their male colleagues? Even if one team sells out Wembley and the other doesn’t?
    It might raise the question what is being sold? Tickets? Broadcast rights? Sponsorship? Minutes of play?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,344

    IanB2 said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    No spoilers wanted….?
    No thanks, still one all.
    Reminds one of the story about Oscar Wilde translating the Last Supper from the Greek in a viva at Oxford.
    ‘Thank you Mr. Wilde’ said the examiners after a few minutes.
    ‘Oh do let me go on’ said Wilde. ‘I want to see how it turns out!’
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    Galileo has died.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Was there not previously talk of changing the number of games needed to win a set of tennis, mainly because folk tended to tune out at the start of a set and only really switch back on when the set neared the crucial games? I seem to remember a suggestion that someone wanted to make a set first to 4 rather than 6.

    Not that it bothers me either way but if they brought that change in might be an opportunity to equalise the number of sets in the men's/women's game.

    On the men's side, if I remember rightly does the Olympics not have the slightly odd set up of being best of 3 sets for all matches other than the final being a best of 5, or did I make that up?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    In 1642 ?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    I'd be interested to see who else played for England who didn't actually appear in 1966 :wink:
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    But will live on via G1 winners until the 12th of never.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Raheem definitely wouldn't have got that pen back then.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    Aliens taking out the satellites before invasion.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    Omnium said:

    ydoethur said:

    glw said:

    Today's edition of 'Surely it's a parody?' from a Scottish nationalist:

    Reading interesting stuff about England’s hand in starting the Second World War. Scotland and Ireland actually had a pretty good relationship with Europe but England’s was confrontational which led to imposing harsh sanctions on Germany.

    https://twitter.com/CalistaHebburn/status/1413845725155373060

    IIRC the SNP's position on WWII was somewhat 'questionable'.
    That's because the English are "natural aggressors whereas we and Ireland always looked to work with others instead of against them".

    https://twitter.com/CalistaHebburn/status/1413853561360891909
    Ah yes the famously non-agressive Scots and Irish.
    Or, as a somewhat racist 'joke' of the 50's put it 'The Irish don't know what they want and are willing to fight for it!"
    There was a German spy parachuted into Ireland to stir up the IRA and cause trouble in the north. In the few weeks he was working for them before the Garda caught up, he become rather disillusioned. He once told his hosts ‘you may know how to die for Ireland, but you don’t have a fucking clue how to fight for it.’
    The Germans and the Irish seem unlikely bed-fellows.
    The Germans had been trying to use the IRA as a weapon against the UK since *before* WWI...
    There was no IRA *before* WW1.
    Yes, formally came into existence in 1917, but there were plenty of people bombing and shooting before the war. On both sides.

    The Imperial German attempts to co-opt them into their plans often sounded like high farce.
    You had the "Irish Volunteers" from 1913, which gave rise to the short-lived "National Volunteers" and then the IRA from 1917 - although they didn't "officially" start military operations until 1919.
    With the same Irish name all the way through.....
    Tsk! You should've written:

    "The Germans had been trying to use the Irish Volunteers as a weapon against the UK since *before* WWI..."
    Or maybe

    "The Germans had been trying to use the Óglaigh na hÉireann as a weapon against the UK since *before* WWI..."

    In fact they tried to work with various groups before that.
    Ah! I didn't know they had the same name in Irish!

    Anyway, interesting that the National Volunteers supported the War Effort and went off to fight in France, and actually comprised almost all of the Irish Volunteers, leaving only a rump to plot with the Germans.
    Here is a fascinating interview with an Irishman who joined the British Army in the First World War.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWnc-ZlIo5s
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    kinabalu said:

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    But will live on via G1 winners until the 12th of never.
    That is true.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,210
    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
    He’s currently the Earl of Wessex. The last Earl of Wessex died at the Battle of Hastings.
    Actually that's not true: the last Earl of Wessex before Edward was William FitzOsbern who was given the title after the Conquest. His son only became Earl of Hereford, though.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
    He’s currently the Earl of Wessex. The last Earl of Wessex died at the Battle of Hastings.
    Actually that's not true: the last Earl of Wessex before Edward was William FitzOsbern who was given the title after the Conquest. His son only became Earl of Hereford, though.
    Only on PB ...
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    In 1642 ?
    They didn't give the exact time of death, Big G.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,920
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    The GPS/GLONASS/BeiDou/QZSS alternative?
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    There's something wrong with my picture because the game doesn't keep freezing every 60 seconds so that someone can writhe around on the floor in "agony".
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    My current no.1 hunter is out of a Coolmore foster mare, which Coolmore standardly hire for so much per week plus a covering by one of their stallions (but you don't get to know which one). So there's a 1 in 20 ish he is by Galileo.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    The GPS/GLONASS/BeiDou/QZSS alternative?
    The horse.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    There's something wrong with my picture because the game doesn't keep freezing every 60 seconds so that someone can writhe around on the floor in "agony".
    They didn't bring their Siebe Gorman sports wear to the game in those days.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,798
    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165

    Redfield & Wilton

    Public attitude to lifting restrictions on the 19th July

    Support 41

    Oppose 37

    Neither 19


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1413898467018264581?s=19

    I'd be interested to see the public sector / private sector split on this question.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    So anyone know what colour these vaccine passports will be?

    Burgundy or a blue that borders on black?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    Not least in the ignorance of actual history. About as balanced as Evelyn Waugh's Sword of Honour trilogy.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190

    IanB2 said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    No spoilers wanted….?
    No thanks, still one all.
    Wolfgang Weber equalises in the last minute of the 90.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    edited July 2021

    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
    He’s currently the Earl of Wessex. The last Earl of Wessex died at the Battle of Hastings.
    Actually that's not true: the last Earl of Wessex before Edward was William FitzOsbern who was given the title after the Conquest. His son only became Earl of Hereford, though.
    FitzOsbern does not appear to have been given a territorial designation. Rather, he was made comes of a polity funded by estates in Hereford and Gloucester with wide-ranging palatinate powers through the whole of the old earldom of Wessex. As a result, there are some scholars who argue he was ‘Earl of Wessex’ some who argue he was ‘Earl of Hereford’ and some who argue he was just ‘Earl Fitz Osbern of wherever William happened to need him.’ There’s quite a good summary here, which argues his title of comes was ‘personal, not territorial.’

    https://doi.org/10.1093/ref:odnb/9620

    Fascinating man though.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    edited July 2021
    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Carnyx said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    Not least in the ignorance of actual history. About as balanced as Evelyn Waugh's Sword of Honour trilogy.
    She is convincing, however - most of us here were fooled at first. Because the Nats ARE often mad

    And check her followers, she has 670 of them, nearly all Scot Nats, following this Fake account
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800

    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'

    What's your problem - is there the slightest chance you could be peaking a shade early?

    Go and put some pineapple on a pizza or listen to some Radiohead to calm down.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705

    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'

    Do they have any comments on the Wimbledon Grand High Championship Final Deciding Challenge Match Encounter (TM)?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    They think it’s all over.

    (Simpson takes the catch)

    It is now!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    IshmaelZ said:

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    My current no.1 hunter is out of a Coolmore foster mare, which Coolmore standardly hire for so much per week plus a covering by one of their stallions (but you don't get to know which one). So there's a 1 in 20 ish he is by Galileo.
    When it comes home by 20 lengths in the Members you'll know.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    edited July 2021
    stodge said:

    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'

    What's your problem - is there the slightest chance you could be peaking a shade early?

    Go and put some pineapple on a pizza or listen to some Radiohead to calm down.
    I was made aware of it by a former Lib Dem media/comms guy who was despairing/cringing at that press release.

    It's the sort of comment you'd expect from Roger the nouveau football fan from The Fast Show.

    It's as cringey as Boris Johnson pretending to be a football fan and wearing an England shirt over his tie and shirt.

    I'm surprised he didn't go full kit wanker.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    The GPS/GLONASS/BeiDou/QZSS alternative?
    A truly remarkable stallion and the most influential thoroughbred of the last 20 years.

    The sire of FRANKEL among others and the damsire of so many of the most successful horses of the past decade including last week's Eclipse winner ST MARK'S BASILICA.

    While we're on the subject. horse racing is one of those sports where male and female participants are on equal terms. Male and female jockeys compete against each other and it's worth remembering the toughest race of them all, the Grand National, was won by a female jockey.

    Now, some may say it's the horse not the jockey that matters. I'd contend horse racing is more of a sport than for example Formula 1 where the best car should win and if it doesn't, it's usually because it's not driven by the best driver.

    In terms of overall fitness levels, I'd put jockeys right up there in the pantheon of professional sport - I would concede the Tour de France is the most individual gruelling sports event out there (I don't know enough about ultramarathons to comment).
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    stodge said:

    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'

    What's your problem - is there the slightest chance you could be peaking a shade early?

    Go and put some pineapple on a pizza or listen to some Radiohead to calm down.
    Check this guy. He spoofs American cluelessness about "soccer"

    Awesome. And v funny


    "HurriKane season arrives late at the Wembley Arena as England Soccer Club eliminize Doucheland in the Sweet 16s. The Soccer Chicken goalshot inserter has been kinda lame lately, goofing around on the field and not doing good plays."

    https://twitter.com/usasoccerguy/status/1410274392450416640?s=20
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800

    stodge said:

    Jesus fecking Christ.

    The Lib Dems have sent out an embargoed press release about tomorrow's match.

    As a proper football fan Sir Ed Davey is calling tomorrow's match

    'The Euro 2020 grand final match between England and Italy.'

    What's your problem - is there the slightest chance you could be peaking a shade early?

    Go and put some pineapple on a pizza or listen to some Radiohead to calm down.
    I was made aware of it by a former Lib Dem media/comms guy who was despairing/cringing at that press release.

    It's the sort of comment you'd expect from Roger the nouveau football fan from The Fast Show.
    I agree inasmuch as I don't think politicians of any party should be waving their patriotic credentials about - the English football team have enough to worry about without the pressure of the support of the Liberal Democrats or that numpty in No.10.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    "Garth Bale fists his buddy as the Whales get harpooned outta the Euro World Championships of the world, becoming the second English franchise to get eliminized:"

    https://instagram.com/p/CQl_sfHHy_-/?utm_medium=copy_link

    https://twitter.com/usasoccerguy/status/1408859511964774404?s=20
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    I liked ye olde clock graphic.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Uh oh, the fornicator and adulterer that is Prince Charles wanted to start using the title of the Duke of Edinburgh but was told not to, however Prince Charles has decided to ignore his father's wishes and keep the DoE dukedom when he becomes monarch and not give it to Prince Edward.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edward-wants-to-be-duke-but-neither-history-nor-his-brother-is-on-his-side-77v25z3b0

    Well, he can’t. The monarch is ex officio Duke of Lancaster, but all other titles would merge with the crown and cease to exist. As Duke of York has on every occasion it has been created since 1491.*

    *Note: not 1461. Edward IV was never Duke of York, as in law the title was forfeited after the Battle of Wakefield.
    Keep in this sense is to not create a new DoE when he becomes King, or at least NOT give it to Prince Edward.
    He could troll him in epic fashion by offering the title of Duke of Hastings instead?
    The punchline being ...? I could understand Duke of Lympstone, but that?
    He’s currently the Earl of Wessex. The last Earl of Wessex died at the Battle of Hastings.
    Actually that's not true: the last Earl of Wessex before Edward was William FitzOsbern who was given the title after the Conquest. His son only became Earl of Hereford, though.
    FitzOsbern does not appear to have been given a territorial designation. Rather, he was made comes of a polity funded by estates in Hereford and Gloucester with wide-ranging palatinate powers through the whole of the old earldom of Wessex. As a result, there are some scholars who argue he was ‘Earl of Wessex’ some who argue he was ‘Earl of Hereford’ and some who argue he was just ‘Earl Fitz Osbern of wherever William happened to need him.’ There’s quite a good summary here, which argues his title of comes was ‘personal, not territorial.’

    https://doi.org/10.1093/ref:odnb/9620

    Fascinating man though.
    PB
    stodge said:

    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    The GPS/GLONASS/BeiDou/QZSS alternative?
    A truly remarkable stallion and the most influential thoroughbred of the last 20 years.

    The sire of FRANKEL among others and the damsire of so many of the most successful horses of the past decade including last week's Eclipse winner ST MARK'S BASILICA.

    While we're on the subject. horse racing is one of those sports where male and female participants are on equal terms. Male and female jockeys compete against each other and it's worth remembering the toughest race of them all, the Grand National, was won by a female jockey.

    Now, some may say it's the horse not the jockey that matters. I'd contend horse racing is more of a sport than for example Formula 1 where the best car should win and if it doesn't, it's usually because it's not driven by the best driver.

    In terms of overall fitness levels, I'd put jockeys right up there in the pantheon of professional sport - I would concede the Tour de France is the most individual gruelling sports event out there (I don't know enough about ultramarathons to comment).
    Ultramarathons are gender segregated.
    To give the men a chance.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    I liked ye olde clock graphic.
    Space Age technology that graphic.

    Where’s the England flags? It’s all Jacks.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662
    edited July 2021
    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    It's like seeing someone in 1930 dying of TB on tv and screaming at the telly telling them.to give her antibiotics....
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165
    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    Why aren't our security services doing something about these bots?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,798
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    Not least in the ignorance of actual history. About as balanced as Evelyn Waugh's Sword of Honour trilogy.
    She is convincing, however - most of us here were fooled at first. Because the Nats ARE often mad

    And check her followers, she has 670 of them, nearly all Scot Nats, following this Fake account
    Great to have an authority on what is a convincing fake online identity.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677

    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    Not least in the ignorance of actual history. About as balanced as Evelyn Waugh's Sword of Honour trilogy.
    She is convincing, however - most of us here were fooled at first. Because the Nats ARE often mad

    And check her followers, she has 670 of them, nearly all Scot Nats, following this Fake account
    Great to have an authority on what is a convincing fake online identity.
    Shame about that indyref2, eh. Still, there's always the next life
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,798
    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    Yep, and fair play to you for doing a bit of digging.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    Why aren't our security services doing something about these bots?
    Because the government has other things to worry about and it's just a coincidence that they benefit.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    It's like seeing someone in 1930 dying of TB on tv and screaming at the telly telling them.to give her antibiotics....
    It’s like watching the Tea Dance on Chigley. This ain’t football with all that backing off.

    There’s people sat on the pitch half a yard from the goal line!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190
    gealbhan said:

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    I liked ye olde clock graphic.
    Space Age technology that graphic.

    Where’s the England flags? It’s all Jacks.
    Simply unpatriotic!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,301
    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    Did pressing begin with the outlawing of the back pass?
    Wouldn't seem an efficient use of energy before that.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
    Maybe it's GPT3 just larking about

    I am pretty sure GPT3 is capable of generating all these tweets, so my suggestion is not entirely comedic
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
    tbf a is next to s on the keyboard. Except in Russia.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Curiouser and curiouser

    So
    @CalistaHebburn
    is a fake account, set up by Scottish Nationalists to troll? Stealing the image of a teacher from a US primary school.
    @springscs

    @TwitterSupport

    https://twitter.com/BingoDemagogue/status/1413905075479666697?s=20
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    She makes the occasional rudimentary error that even other Nats pick her up on. For example -


  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    edited July 2021
    gealbhan said:

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    It's like seeing someone in 1930 dying of TB on tv and screaming at the telly telling them.to give her antibiotics....
    It’s like watching the Tea Dance on Chigley. This ain’t football with all that backing off.

    There’s people sat on the pitch half a yard from the goal line!
    ETA: press photographers.

    Half the players are out on their feet.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
    Maybe it's GPT3 just larking about

    I am pretty sure GPT3 is capable of generating all these tweets, so my suggestion is not entirely comedic
    Which will be fun when GPT3 starts larking about pretending to be an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,354
    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    Galileo!
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    gealbhan said:

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    I liked ye olde clock graphic.
    Space Age technology that graphic.

    Where’s the England flags? It’s all Jacks.
    Simply unpatriotic!
    Somethings changed in fifty years. What caused that?
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
    “do some learnings about racism” was repeated two or three times in response to people calling her out on some of the more inflammatory stuff. That’s not a typo.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    I don’t think that anyone in this country would write about anti-socialist leanings of the TV show “Pesky Blinders” or advise someone to “do learnings about racism”. I think it’s someone in a building in St Petersburg.
    I dunno. Maybe it's a triple bluff.

    Ms Calista knows her UK/Scots politics extremely well, and is highly articulate in English. Would "she" really make a dumb mistake like "Pesky Blinders" or "leanings about racism"?

    I am doubtful. So my guess is this is an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat, to discredit the Nat cause with plausible deniability if unmasked



    It could be an autocorrect/typo.
    Maybe it's GPT3 just larking about

    I am pretty sure GPT3 is capable of generating all these tweets, so my suggestion is not entirely comedic
    Which will be fun when GPT3 starts larking about pretending to be an MI6 dude pretending to be a Russian bot pretending to be a mad Nat
    Using Deepfakes

    Imagine the chaos then. And it is heading our way in about a year, or less
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    dixiedean said:

    gealbhan said:

    Off topic

    Channel 4 showing 1966 World Cup Final in full. I had forgotten what football was like, no man to man marking, Ball, Hunter, Styles and big Jack occasionally clattering the Germans with no I'll effects.

    Alan Ball as dirty as I remember. It's half time and 1-1. Interesting to see what happens in the second half?Sadly its the Hugh Johns, not the Wolstenhome they think its all over commentary.

    Rrrrrrorrrrrrger Hunt.

    It’s dumb football, there’s no pressing at all. Someone’s got the ball the other side turn their backs and run away.

    Shut all that space down, you’re making it end to end.

    This is all wrong. It’s winding me up. Why can’t they play properly.
    Did pressing begin with the outlawing of the back pass?
    Wouldn't seem an efficient use of energy before that.
    Completely unfit and slow into tackle compared to players today.

    Is Stiles playing sweeper?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    TOPPING said:

    Galileo has died.

    Galileo!
    Time has clearly been telescoped.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,080
    Leon said:

    DougSeal said:

    Brillo's convinced, as willing to be outraged as PB's finest.


    It’s insane how willing people are to be taken in by what took me 5 minutes tops was a Russian Bot. And the thing is, it’s success is being played out in real time on this board and on Twitter.
    I am persuaded - by you - that this is a fake

    But at first glance, I believed it, because it is beautifully judged. See the 700 Scot Nat and Alba supporters who follow her. They have also been fooled

    So, the question is: who, how and why?

    Is it some computer algorithm in Moscow, or it some smart Yoon guy in the Borders having a laugh at the Nats' expense? or maybe it is MI6 black ops?!
    The Russians seem to have offices full of people who do this sort of thing. We talk about them as "bots", and perhaps some are, but I think they also use simple brute force of many people. See, for example, this old article: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/02/putin-kremlin-inside-russian-troll-house

    Anyway, the next step is for some misguided ScotNat to take up the argument with Andrew Neil, and it's an extra merit point for the Russian who kicked it off. They can relax with a celebratory vodka and try to start another argument with some of their other accounts.
This discussion has been closed.