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The Chancellor’s controversial letter to Chesham and Amersham voters – politicalbetting.com

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  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    Most of the (very rare) rabies cases we have here can be traced back to bats that make it over from France
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.
    Historically there hs been far more antisemitism in the Tory party.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,908

    Russia has seen nearly 425,000 excess deaths since start of Covid-19 pandemic, raising suspicions that the country's official death toll is much higher than 123,000.

    The country's 425,000 excess deaths had been recorded from April 2020 to April 2021, according to Reuters calculations based on data released by Russia's state statistics service on Friday.

    Putin and his cronies are a gang of crooks but bits of the Russian government do seem to do their job properly. In a country where criticising the leader or making him look bad is literally dangerous even statisticians need to be brave at times.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    I see the EU is criticising the idea that the UK might trigger Article 16…
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    Charles said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Charles said:

    IanB2 said:

    I don't recall the government advising people to book holidays in Portugal?

    I feel really sorry for all those who followed Government advice & in good faith booked holidays in Portugal.

    https://twitter.com/BarrySheerman/status/1400757894941925376?s=20

    Apart from banning leisure travel to the entire rest of the world and then putting a green flag with a big arrow pointing to well known beach-and-sun destination Portugal, they did nothing to encourage it, at all.

    "It's holiday time, folks! Here's where you can go:

    - a few places that won't let you in anyway;
    - a few more places no sane person would take a holiday;
    - Portugal !! "
    I’m tempted to go to Malta
    Don't. Their "hunters" blast all our migrant birds - on a massive scale.
    They are very fond of shooting dogs too and there's fucking rubbish everywhere. Lively nightlife on The Gut though.
    On the other hand they have a couple of Caravaggios that I’ve never seen
    The ancient temples at Tarxien and the Hal Saflieni hypogeum, both from c.3000 BC are amazing. I’m sure if a certain Tom Knox, sometime of this parish, had visited them they’d’ve made it into one of his novels.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    edited June 2021
    Charles said:

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    I see the EU is criticising the idea that the UK might trigger Article 16…
    Just have a Cabinet member declare it, then have Boris say he had no idea about it happening and how dare people get cross about it, since it won't now happen.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Wake me up when this madness ends.




  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,595
    kle4 said:

    Charles said:

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    I see the EU is criticising the idea that the UK might trigger Article 16…
    Just have a Cabinet member declare it, then have Boris say he had no idea about it happeniong and how dare people get cross about it, since it won't now happen.
    Boris could just say triggering it was a "mistake" - the EU playbook....
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Charles said:

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    Most of the (very rare) rabies cases we have here can be traced back to bats that make it over from France
    You believe it really comes from bats? Have you not been following what Leon has to say?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
  • oggologioggologi Posts: 29

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    Isn't it Joe Boden pushing for it?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,080
    edited June 2021
    Well this hasn't aged well...

    https://twitter.com/RachelReevesMP/status/1401125695393255428?s=19

    Or I presume they will be claiming something something not enough, given in to big US tech, think of the nurses...
  • oggologioggologi Posts: 29

    ping said:

    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    The economic liberals are truly in retreat.

    This is great news.
    I’m getting the impression that Ireland getting a boot in the baws is almost more important than a more equitable international corporation tax deal for some.

    I seem to recall at various times during the Brexit Via Dolorosa some Brexiteers suggesting that this was a marvellous opportunity for Global Britain to become more 'competitive' in the tax arena. At least there should be a merciful respite from that sort of guff.
    Wonder when Rushi will declare himself a non Thatcherite Tory. Thatcherism is dead
  • TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Cyclefree said:
    "I now have a late blooming career as a waitress"

    As we used to say in the playground "A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away":

    "That's pretty neat."
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    I think they're more scared of her than me ....... A charming friendly lass she is. But there's steel behind the smile. She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,375
    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865

    Well this hasn't aged well...

    https://twitter.com/RachelReevesMP/status/1401125695393255428?s=19

    Or I presume they will be claiming something something not enough, given in to big US tech, think of the nurses...

    How did they not hear the same rumours we had in the city last night that the deal was done on the digital services tax? I heard about it just after the end of the day at drinks.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    oggologi said:

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    Isn't it Joe Boden pushing for it?
    Brilliant typo. I can just see him in the elders section of the Boden catalogue.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,080
    MaxPB said:

    Well this hasn't aged well...

    https://twitter.com/RachelReevesMP/status/1401125695393255428?s=19

    Or I presume they will be claiming something something not enough, given in to big US tech, think of the nurses...

    How did they not hear the same rumours we had in the city last night that the deal was done on the digital services tax? I heard about it just after the end of the day at drinks.
    Because they are captured in the twitter bubble....
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    DougSeal said:

    MattW said:

    One for the lawyers to comment on. A charge for murder where the person died 21 years after the incident. I don't think I've seen such a delay previously.

    A MAN has been charged with murder following the death of a woman who died more than 20 years after being set on fire.

    Jacqueline Kirk, 62, died in August 2019 - 21 years after she was set on fire in Weston-super-Mare.

    Detectives from Avon and Somerset Police's Major Crime Investigation Team charged Steven Paul Craig, 57, of Brailsford Crescent, York, with murder last night (June 3).

    The charge was authorised by the Crown Prosecution Service South West’s Complex Casework Unit.

    Craig was remanded in custody and is due to appear at Bristol Magistrates Court this morning (June 4).

    The Crown Prosecution Service confirmed that it had authorised detectives to charge Craig with murder.

    A spokesman said Ms Kirk had suffered “serious burns injuries” during an incident 21 years before her

    https://www.somersetcountygazette.co.uk/news/19349817.steven-craig-charged-murder-jacqueline-kirk-appears-bristol-magistrates-court/

    Since the year and a day rule was abolished, rendered obsolete by advances in medical care which can (for example) keep someone alive it I n a coma for years, it’s perfectly possible for such a charge to be brought if the proximate cause of death was the act, with no new act intervening, however long ago it took place. To my mind the difficulty for the prosecution would be showing that the act caused the death but that’s not insurmountable.
    But is the public interest really served by this? Wouldn’t it have been more logically to charge him with attempted murder at the time?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,689
    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Perhaps I am missing something in the skimming of the story, but what would stop the small nations just not agreeing to this? I presume part of the idea is the bigger nations making the legal fiction of being based in somewhere like Ireland harder, but wouldn't it be worth it for the multinationals to do whatever it took to get taxed less?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited June 2021
    UK 5th largest update to vaccination numbers in absolute terms and bottom third in relative terms:

    https://www.politico.eu/coronavirus-in-europe/




  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    I think it’s 20% of profits > 10% margin are reallocated and taxed as if they were local income in the countries where they operate rather than a 20% tax.

    So for companies with a 15% margin, for example, 14% of profits (10% + ((15-10)*(1-0.8)) is taxed locally and 1% of profits taxed globally. It’s more impactful for more profitable companies - Facebook makes a 40% margin so 6% of profits will be allocated to international operations (and 34% to the US)
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Be interesting to see if this bounce back continues. Haldane's prediction of turbo charged v recovery may be happening.

    Certainly the level of building work around me is astonishing.
    I'd be concerned about inflationary pressures if capacity constraints continue.

    Daughter is being careful about the timing of her bookings to ensure that the chef can cope, no-one has to wait too long and staff don't collapse with exhaustion. She also tries to prioritise her regulars because they will still be here after the tourists have left and they have been loyal to her and generally supportive - buying takeaways etc - during this last year and this has kept her going, mentally as much as anything, especially when she came v v close to giving up altogether at the end of last year.

    Some other places are restricting opening hours or days on which they are open simply because they cannot get the staff

    Actually, the work is quite energising but it does mean that mealtimes and socialising happens at very odd hours. We've all become very familiar with the dawns around here which start at 3:30.
    I am truly delighted to hear this news.
    Kudos to your daughter for hanging in there, in the face of govt neglect and miscommunication.
    Thank you.

    Yes - it has been quite the business education. She will have learnt so much - not least about her ability to cope with grace under pressure. An invaluable lesson.

    I do hope the government doesn't muck up the next stage. The next few weeks are critical for her and so many businesses like hers. The theatre in our little town is reopening next week as well and they are so excited by it. People will feel crushed if we end up in another lockdown or permanent restrictions and a half-life.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,988
    edited June 2021
    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    That “139 countries” note is either intended to suggest any deal is impossible, or is a passive aggressive moan about big countries overriding smaller countries.

    However, it is well beyond time that Ireland’s (and Luxembourg’s, and the BOT’s) little racket was dismantled.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    DougSeal said:

    Wake me up when this madness ends.




    I was convinced that was a wind up… but my word it’s true
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    Charles said:

    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    I think it’s 20% of profits > 10% margin are reallocated and taxed as if they were local income in the countries where they operate rather than a 20% tax.

    So for companies with a 15% margin, for example, 14% of profits (10% + ((15-10)*(1-0.8)) is taxed locally and 1% of profits taxed globally. It’s more impactful for more profitable companies - Facebook makes a 40% margin so 6% of profits will be allocated to international operations (and 34% to the US)
    The devil will be in the detail. The precise drafting of any new rules, the exceptions etc will matter a great deal if this is going to lead to these companies actually paying more tax. Good headlines are great. But I'd be concerned that the companies will find enough loopholes and it will not amount to much.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Charles said:

    DougSeal said:

    MattW said:

    One for the lawyers to comment on. A charge for murder where the person died 21 years after the incident. I don't think I've seen such a delay previously.

    A MAN has been charged with murder following the death of a woman who died more than 20 years after being set on fire.

    Jacqueline Kirk, 62, died in August 2019 - 21 years after she was set on fire in Weston-super-Mare.

    Detectives from Avon and Somerset Police's Major Crime Investigation Team charged Steven Paul Craig, 57, of Brailsford Crescent, York, with murder last night (June 3).

    The charge was authorised by the Crown Prosecution Service South West’s Complex Casework Unit.

    Craig was remanded in custody and is due to appear at Bristol Magistrates Court this morning (June 4).

    The Crown Prosecution Service confirmed that it had authorised detectives to charge Craig with murder.

    A spokesman said Ms Kirk had suffered “serious burns injuries” during an incident 21 years before her

    https://www.somersetcountygazette.co.uk/news/19349817.steven-craig-charged-murder-jacqueline-kirk-appears-bristol-magistrates-court/

    Since the year and a day rule was abolished, rendered obsolete by advances in medical care which can (for example) keep someone alive it I n a coma for years, it’s perfectly possible for such a charge to be brought if the proximate cause of death was the act, with no new act intervening, however long ago it took place. To my mind the difficulty for the prosecution would be showing that the act caused the death but that’s not insurmountable.
    But is the public interest really served by this? Wouldn’t it have been more logically to charge him with attempted murder at the time?
    That I cannot answer.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    HYUFD said:

    darkage said:

    HYUFD said:

    darkage said:

    On the actual topic, I think that the trouble with the tories doing this is that labour could do the same thing.
    One suggestion is to select about 20 constituencies in the south east that they have no hope of winning and declare that they will each have 100,000 houses in the next five years, all over the green belt/countryside, including a vast programme of council house building to ease the pressure on central london and house every homeless person, with a promise that the remaining consituencies (ie marginal ones that labour have a chance of winning) will be protected with no housebuilding at all.

    They could do but while Labour may have no chance in most of those Home Counties seats the LDs often will and will be campaigning there on a platform of no building on the greenbelt and countryside as they are doing in Chesham and Amersham.

    Therefore unless Labour win an overall majority, which is extremely unlikely given present polling, to become PM Starmer would almost certainly need LD confidence and supply and the LDs would veto any largescale development in greenbelt areas of their Southeastern target seats
    I don't see the downside. Labour would win the whole of London and large parts of the south east, taking seats off the tories. They would be able to claim to solve the housing problem in London thus scuppering the LD's chances in a load of other seats; the LD;s could not meaningfully campaign on housing issues. Labour could also use the strategy to take seats of the LD's. The LD's would be forced in to the position of becoming anti housebuilding party. Whats the downside for Labour?
    They wouldn't, only 8 of the top 100 Labour target seats are in the South East, Hastings and Rye, Wycombe, Reading West, Southampton Itchen, Milton Keynes North and South, Worthing East and Shoreham amd Crawley. By contrast 31 of the top 100 LD target seats are in the South East.

    Labour might win a few more suburban seats in London plus Kensington but the vast majority of London seats are already Labour anyway.

    Labour therefore needs the LDs to win some Tory seats in the South East to have any chance at all of depriving the Tories of a majority in 2024 unless they make serious inroads in terms of regaining their seats in the Red Wall which again on current polling is very unlikely.

    If the LDs get close to the Tories in Chesham and Amersham but Labour see their majority down in Batley or the Tories even win it that will just confirm the above.

    Not 1 of the 11 LD seats has Labour in second place, so there is also zero mileage for Labour in targeting LD seats
    That’s the cunning part says Professor Fox

    Do it in LibDem target seats and they will oppose… hoovering up the Labour NIMBY vote into those constituencies while scaring all the other constituencies
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    I love the way that the members of Independent SAGE trigger so many PBers on a daily basis.

    On an unrelated note, today I discovered that 'Newark' has an amusing anagram. How I have never realised this for myself, I do not know.

    Now time for an improving book in the garden...

    Nothing like solitary pleasure

    (I’m reading a commercial due diligence report in the garden)
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sandpit said:

    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    Is the EU one country or 27 in the context? Presumably there’s still nothing wrong will all of a company’s EU revenue going through Ireland, but now taxed at 20% rather than 12.5%.
    The split of the overage is based on location of sales not location of legal entity

    And the global minimum tax eliminates the point of Ireland’s sweetheart deals
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,595
    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    I think it’s 20% of profits > 10% margin are reallocated and taxed as if they were local income in the countries where they operate rather than a 20% tax.

    So for companies with a 15% margin, for example, 14% of profits (10% + ((15-10)*(1-0.8)) is taxed locally and 1% of profits taxed globally. It’s more impactful for more profitable companies - Facebook makes a 40% margin so 6% of profits will be allocated to international operations (and 34% to the US)
    The devil will be in the detail. The precise drafting of any new rules, the exceptions etc will matter a great deal if this is going to lead to these companies actually paying more tax. Good headlines are great. But I'd be concerned that the companies will find enough loopholes and it will not amount to much.
    Indeed. Biden’s enthusiasm suggests that more money will end up in the US Treasury coffers, at the expense of Ireland and Luxembourg, but anything that might conceiveably pass the US Congress probably doesn’t end up with more taxes paid overall.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Cyclefree said:

    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
    Well I'm not surprised her staff are scared if she beats up her suppliers! :)
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,375

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,192

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865
    Sandpit said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    MaxPB said:

    Wow the tax deal is even better than we were being told yesterday afternoon.

    20% tax on profits for companies with global margins higher than 10% to be paid to the country where the revenue is driven. It makes Ireland's business model completey useless.

    I think it’s 20% of profits > 10% margin are reallocated and taxed as if they were local income in the countries where they operate rather than a 20% tax.

    So for companies with a 15% margin, for example, 14% of profits (10% + ((15-10)*(1-0.8)) is taxed locally and 1% of profits taxed globally. It’s more impactful for more profitable companies - Facebook makes a 40% margin so 6% of profits will be allocated to international operations (and 34% to the US)
    The devil will be in the detail. The precise drafting of any new rules, the exceptions etc will matter a great deal if this is going to lead to these companies actually paying more tax. Good headlines are great. But I'd be concerned that the companies will find enough loopholes and it will not amount to much.
    Indeed. Biden’s enthusiasm suggests that more money will end up in the US Treasury coffers, at the expense of Ireland and Luxembourg, but anything that might conceiveably pass the US Congress probably doesn’t end up with more taxes paid overall.
    Not really true. Ireland has the 6.25% rate for IP related revenues which is how they hollow out the tax base of countries like the UK and Germany. It's time to just fuck these countries off.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,375
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Be interesting to see if this bounce back continues. Haldane's prediction of turbo charged v recovery may be happening.

    Certainly the level of building work around me is astonishing.
    I'd be concerned about inflationary pressures if capacity constraints continue.

    Daughter is being careful about the timing of her bookings to ensure that the chef can cope, no-one has to wait too long and staff don't collapse with exhaustion. She also tries to prioritise her regulars because they will still be here after the tourists have left and they have been loyal to her and generally supportive - buying takeaways etc - during this last year and this has kept her going, mentally as much as anything, especially when she came v v close to giving up altogether at the end of last year.

    Some other places are restricting opening hours or days on which they are open simply because they cannot get the staff

    Actually, the work is quite energising but it does mean that mealtimes and socialising happens at very odd hours. We've all become very familiar with the dawns around here which start at 3:30.
    I am truly delighted to hear this news.
    Kudos to your daughter for hanging in there, in the face of govt neglect and miscommunication.
    Thank you.

    Yes - it has been quite the business education. She will have learnt so much - not least about her ability to cope with grace under pressure. An invaluable lesson.

    I do hope the government doesn't muck up the next stage. The next few weeks are critical for her and so many businesses like hers. The theatre in our little town is reopening next week as well and they are so excited by it. People will feel crushed if we end up in another lockdown or permanent restrictions and a half-life.
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Be interesting to see if this bounce back continues. Haldane's prediction of turbo charged v recovery may be happening.

    Certainly the level of building work around me is astonishing.
    I'd be concerned about inflationary pressures if capacity constraints continue.

    Daughter is being careful about the timing of her bookings to ensure that the chef can cope, no-one has to wait too long and staff don't collapse with exhaustion. She also tries to prioritise her regulars because they will still be here after the tourists have left and they have been loyal to her and generally supportive - buying takeaways etc - during this last year and this has kept her going, mentally as much as anything, especially when she came v v close to giving up altogether at the end of last year.

    Some other places are restricting opening hours or days on which they are open simply because they cannot get the staff

    Actually, the work is quite energising but it does mean that mealtimes and socialising happens at very odd hours. We've all become very familiar with the dawns around here which start at 3:30.
    I am truly delighted to hear this news.
    Kudos to your daughter for hanging in there, in the face of govt neglect and miscommunication.
    Thank you.

    Yes - it has been quite the business education. She will have learnt so much - not least about her ability to cope with grace under pressure. An invaluable lesson.

    I do hope the government doesn't muck up the next stage. The next few weeks are critical for her and so many businesses like hers. The theatre in our little town is reopening next week as well and they are so excited by it. People will feel crushed if we end up in another lockdown or permanent restrictions and a half-life.
    Excellent news.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    isam said:

    @Alistair where do you get the vaccination data per age group per city please?

    @isam
    https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

    Can select the area in the tip drop down.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    DougSeal said:

    Charles said:

    UK officials insist that the EU cannot seriously believe that rabies will enter the UK, make its way to Northern Ireland, and from there spread into the Republic and beyond to the rest of the EU......

    Writing in the Belfast Telegraph this week, Lord Frost and Northern Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis accused the EU of focusing on risks (to the single market and consumer health) "that don’t exist".

    "Only if implemented in a pragmatic and proportionate way can the Protocol support the peace process and ensure the people of Northern Ireland continue to see the benefits of prosperity and stability. If it does not do this, then it is not working," they wrote.....

    By contrast, the UK is now presenting itself as the more reliable defender of the Good Friday Agreement (a posture that has infuriated Irish officials), while also proclaiming a more proactive approach than the European Commission in trying to find solutions.

    "The UK has now sent more than 10 papers to the European Commission, proposing potential solutions on a wide range of issues," said a UK government spokesperson. "As yet, we have had no written response from the EU."


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0604/1226148-tony-connelly-analysis/

    Most of the (very rare) rabies cases we have here can be traced back to bats that make it over from France
    You believe it really comes from bats? Have you not been following what Leon has to say?
    Well there is a little lab just outside Brno…
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,375
    edited June 2021
    Nigelb said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
    The Chinese armies were mostly inept, but they did inflict a million casualties on the Japanese. One shouldn’t underestimate the contribution of those who wear down the enemy, even if they win few victories of their own.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,612

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Be interesting to see if this bounce back continues. Haldane's prediction of turbo charged v recovery may be happening.

    Certainly the level of building work around me is astonishing.
    The U.K. simply doesn’t have the capacity for everyone to have a staycation... I imagine that people cancelling holidays abroad now are finding it very hard to book anything in the U.K. And if you manage to book somewhere in the Dales, treat finding a car park space in the likes of Malham or Grassington as seriously as reserving a sun lounger by the pool...
    Given that a staycation is staying at your own home it certainly does.
    Point taken with respect to accommodation... however, the same capacity constraints affect the day out at the seaside or walking in the hills...
    Sure.

    But you don't have to drive to the Peaks or Lakes to see nice countryside and lovely old pubs.

    Twenty minutes will get you to it for a majority of people but many lack interest in their own area.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,419
    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
  • AnExileinD4AnExileinD4 Posts: 337
    edited June 2021
    Nigelb said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
    It’s not obviously compelling and an objectively justifiable causal chain would, I feel, be a stretch. How would you convince me otherwise?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    kle4 said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Perhaps I am missing something in the skimming of the story, but what would stop the small nations just not agreeing to this? I presume part of the idea is the bigger nations making the legal fiction of being based in somewhere like Ireland harder, but wouldn't it be worth it for the multinationals to do whatever it took to get taxed less?
    The beauty of it is the small countries don’t need to agree

    So long as the parent company is domiciled in a country that agrees then they are paying the tax

    And Congress has already closed the door on inversions so if you are not already headquartered in Ireland it is difficult for an established company to get there
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,988
    edited June 2021
    Nigelb said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
    China certainly soaked up incredible amounts of Japanese troops and resources. What was an imperialist 'gain' in the 30s turned into a millstone after Pearl Harbour I think.

    The scale of human misery and suffering in China during that period matches the Great Patriotic War for sure.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    tlg86 said:

    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?

    Given it’s an allocation of I’d assume it would be collected by the US and transferred by then.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,285
    edited June 2021
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,410
    edited June 2021
    Sean_F said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
    The Chinese armies were mostly inept, but they did inflict a million casualties on the Japanese. One shouldn’t underestimate the contribution of those who wear down the enemy, even if they win few victories of their own.
    And more than a million troops tied up in a many sided conflict throughout the War.
    To assess fully the Chinese contribution, one needs to assess what the Japanese could have achieved with those extra men, as well as the raw materials available.
    Buggering on ineptly, but doggedly, should be celebrated.

    Edit. @Theuniondivvie has made this point better.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,988
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    Weirdly one of the aforementioned twitter guys is Dutch and has written a book on Arnhem, he was the one so touchy about Monty's reputation.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,080
    edited June 2021
    Dishy Rishi speaks human...so much more a PM sounding than the PM.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_MEjgtm_l8

    And Ed Conway is a knob.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    One of the funnier author notes in the Sharpe series (new one out this year, btw) is Sharpe's Waterloo, where he describes the battle site and the info there, which apparently might give people the impression it was a French victory so great is the emphasis on Napoleon and his greatness. Don't know if that is true now, but I have seen people either surprised about the role of the Prussian force, or go way to the other side and act as though the British contribution was meaningless because of the arrival of the Prussians.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,080
    edited June 2021
    Well Ollie Robinson is making it rather hard to drop next test....but they will.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865
    Charles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?

    Given it’s an allocation of I’d assume it would be collected by the US and transferred by then.
    It's more that the US won't retaliate with tariffs if it perceives US domiciled companies are being targeted.

    Honestly, this is exactly the kind of agreement that we needed to deal with the modern era of the tax non-resident company.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Alistair said:

    isam said:

    @Alistair where do you get the vaccination data per age group per city please?

    @isam
    https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

    Can select the area in the tip drop down.
    Thanks 👍🏻

    I said earlier the Barking and Dagenham rate might have been boosted by people coming from next door Havering, but that was wrong as the numbers per LA would be calculated from the persons address not centre they were jabbed I guess. Bad really that B&D vaccine centre has slots free all day today and only 51% have had first jab (62% in the 45-49 age range)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited June 2021
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Sean_F said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    There’s an argument that WWII had its origins in the Japanese incursion into China in 1937.
    That theatre is relatively neglected in the histories, too, perhaps.
    The Chinese armies were mostly inept, but they did inflict a million casualties on the Japanese. One shouldn’t underestimate the contribution of those who wear down the enemy, even if they win few victories of their own.
    It's why cannon fodder troops can still be useful!
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,585

    Well Ollie Robinson is making it rather hard to drop next test....but they will.

    Ridiculous to drop him.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
    Well I'm not surprised her staff are scared if she beats up her suppliers! :)
    She expects her suppliers to provide what she's paid for. And if they don't she gets them to do so or gets her money back. Nothing wrong with having high expectations.

    And her staff love her. She persuaded them all to leave their existing jobs and join her and they've all stuck with her. It's a happy band.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    Well Ollie Robinson is making it rather hard to drop next test....but they will.

    Would be funny if they didn’t and then got a huge amount of criticism.

    I’m reminded of my Arsenal friends demanding Szczesny to be dropped for smoking in the showers at Southampton. That they didn’t rate him had nothing to do with their outrage at such a crime.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,800
    Good afternoon, everyone.

    F1: interesting grid for tomorrow. Shame Norris is likely to get a penalty.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,595
    edited June 2021

    Good afternoon, everyone.

    F1: interesting grid for tomorrow. Shame Norris is likely to get a penalty.

    That was marginal, he might get away with it on the basis that he couldn’t have made the pit lane after seeing the red flag. Good grid.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    tlg86 said:

    Well Ollie Robinson is making it rather hard to drop next test....but they will.

    Would be funny if they didn’t and then got a huge amount of criticism.

    I’m reminded of my Arsenal friends demanding Szczesny to be dropped for smoking in the showers at Southampton. That they didn’t rate him had nothing to do with their outrage at such a crime.
    Dropping/Selling Szczesny for such a paltry fee was one of Arsenes biggest errors in my opinion. He was better than Cech at that stage of their careers
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
    More likely it's the US wanting to get hold of the tax revenues. I am probably over-cynical but I wonder how much extra tax revenue countries like the U.K. will actually get from the likes of Google and co?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,800
    Mr. Sandpit, aye, but accelerating afterwards is apparently frowned upon by the stewards.

    If he doesn't get a penalty I think he's got a good shot at a podium.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,375

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    The Spanish army fought very doggedly, but most of its generals were inept. But, they always came back for more. In the right circumstances, such as defence of Zaragoza or Gerona, they inflicted dreadful casualties on the French (Zaragoza can be compared to Stalingrad.)

    There’s no clear line between guerillas and soldiers. Many Spanish soldiers, recognising that formal pitched battles against the French were usually suicidal, fought in the manner of irregulars, raiding, harassing, uniting to overwhelm isolated French military units, before dispersing again.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,724
    justin124 said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.
    Historically there hs been far more antisemitism in the Tory party.
    Listen chummy.. we are talking now not 1800s its your party that is antisemitic.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Cyclefree said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
    More likely it's the US wanting to get hold of the tax revenues. I am probably over-cynical but I wonder how much extra tax revenue countries like the U.K. will actually get from the likes of Google and co?
    Seems a fair worry, but if it is none or very little then presumably any agreement will not last long.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    Well Ollie Robinson is making it rather hard to drop next test....but they will.

    Would be funny if they didn’t and then got a huge amount of criticism.

    I’m reminded of my Arsenal friends demanding Szczesny to be dropped for smoking in the showers at Southampton. That they didn’t rate him had nothing to do with their outrage at such a crime.
    Dropping/Selling Szczesny for such a paltry fee was one of Arsenes biggest errors in my opinion. He was better than Cech at that stage of their careers
    I try not to get angry about football, but I struggled to contain my rage after Cech’s debut.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,378

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    So let me get this straight. It was all Sunak's idea and Biden is now hanging onto his coat tails?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,800
    F1: as usual, my F1 tip(s) will be tomorrow morning (as the market takes a while to get up) but got some hopefully decent ideas. Imagine the race might be a shade chaotic.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865
    Cyclefree said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
    More likely it's the US wanting to get hold of the tax revenues. I am probably over-cynical but I wonder how much extra tax revenue countries like the U.K. will actually get from the likes of Google and co?
    You are being cynical. The whole reason rishi held out for the digital services part was to avoid that situation where the US does fine but no one else does. It's taking aim at the likes of Apple, Google and others who use Ireland to shelter their UK profits from the taxman.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    edited June 2021
    Charles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?

    Given it’s an allocation of I’d assume it would be collected by the US and transferred by then.
    Uh oh ....we're dependant on the US sending us our allocation after they've done all the calculations.

    Can't see any problems with that at all.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865
    Cyclefree said:



    Charles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?

    Given it’s an allocation of I’d assume it would be collected by the US and transferred by then.
    Uh oh ....we're dependant on the US sending us our allocation after they've done all the calculations.

    Can't see any problems with that at all.
    I'm not sure Charles has it right. My understanding is that the global operating margin will be applied to location revenue and everything above the 10% margin will be subject to a 20% local tax rate. Revenue is not easy to offshore as someone in the UK will pay for that service in the chain. The consumers are here, not in Ireland.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,988

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    So let me get this straight. It was all Sunak's idea and Biden is now hanging onto his coat tails?
    Biden's getting to have tea with Brenda, he'll go along with anything we tell him.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,348
    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    Getting the French army to march in column, uphill, while he hid his troops behind a reverse slope, was the Wellington thing. So when they reached the crest, knackered after an uphill climb....

    He wore the French Army down between those tactics and the guerillas. That and the revolutionary idea of paying for supplies instead of just robbing the Spanish locals.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    Sounds like sensible tactics.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,595

    justin124 said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The idea that it is somehow critical that the Tories hold their 82 majority as opposed to slipping back to 80 is a bit of a stretch. The reality is that unlike a minority government or even a 1992 government gradually losing power this government is totally dominant in the Commons and indeed in the polls as we saw yesterday. In these circumstances Rishi is somewhat overstating things but its the sort of thing that everyone does in elections. I believe its called politics, a weird past time really.

    Good morning everyone. Let's hope we have some play at Lords today, and at Chelmsford, although I fear Essex' chance of retaining the Championship has been washed away.

    On topic, in yesterday's Guardian, Katy Balls was suggesting that 'the Tory rebellion on aid shows Johnson’s support is a mile wide and an inch deep,' and maybe Rishi's letter is a demonstration of a realisation of that.
    If longstanding MP's in the Home Counties start to fear their careers might be under threat support for Johnson might weaken.
    After all, he's not there because he's liked or admired, or, indeed, I suspect, trusted; he's there because he's seen as a winner and if that goes he's in trouble.
    More wishful thinking by Boris's opponents. I get the feeling that he is going to be "lucky" in C&A once again. Comfortably so.
    A 'reasonably comfortable' win in C&A wouldn't be 'lucky'; it'd be no more than expected.
    If the Tory doesn't win 'reasonably comfortably' alarm bells will ring.

    And, as was pointed out elsewhere ....lived here since 2013 definitely wouldn't make one a 'local' in this neck of the woods.
    But it is the essential LibDem gamebook - anyone who hasn't had seven generations born and died in the constituency will get tarred with the " incomer" brushed. If you do meet that hurdle, you will be fought with the "entitled oppressor" label. Who made their money from slavery. Probably.

    The LibDems are fast becoming the go to party of Home Counties snobs and NIMBYs. Margot Leadbetter would now be a LibDem. As would Hyacinth Bucket.

    That’s nothing!
    Hermann Goering would now be a Tory. As would Dr Crippen.

    And Vlad the Impaler would have voted Brexit, though admittedly for sovereignty reasons rather than immigration per se.
    I think you have that wrong. It's Labour who have the antisemitic problem, not the Tories.. so Hitler would have been Labour.
    Historically there hs been far more antisemitism in the Tory party.
    Listen chummy.. we are talking now not 1800s its your party that is antisemitic.
    Even in the 1800's - *Jewish-born Disraeli waves*
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,419
    Cyclefree said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
    More likely it's the US wanting to get hold of the tax revenues. I am probably over-cynical but I wonder how much extra tax revenue countries like the U.K. will actually get from the likes of Google and co?

    Well if SKS’s twitter feed and the Tax Justice Network spokesman on the ITV news are anything to go by it’s enough to solve the care crisis and fund huge wage rises in the NHS. Very believable.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,348

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    So let me get this straight. It was all Sunak's idea and Biden is now hanging onto his coat tails?

    The UK, France and Italy started on the digital tax thing. Trump was opposed. Biden & the Democrats are looking to raise something in taxes, and see the no-tax thing as especially offensive - so it is more that with Biden, Rishi et al were pushing at an openable door.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,419
    Cyclefree said:



    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
    Well I'm not surprised her staff are scared if she beats up her suppliers! :)
    She expects her suppliers to provide what she's paid for. And if they don't she gets them to do so or gets her money back. Nothing wrong with having high expectations.

    And her staff love her. She persuaded them all to leave their existing jobs and join her and they've all stuck with her. It's a happy band.
    It’s hardly a high expectation To expect a supplier to provide what she’s paid for. More a reasonable,one.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    MaxPB said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    The Irish finance minister doesn't sound happy.

    @Paschald

    I note the joint position by #G7 finance ministers on international corporate taxation. It is in everyone’s interest to achieve a sustainable, ambitious and equitable agreement on the international tax architecture.

    I look forward now to engaging in the discussions at @OECD. There are 139 countries at the table, and any agreement will have to meet the needs of small and large countries, developed and developing.

    Fuck them. Ireland are a parasite economy, ultimately what are they doing to do when this is implemented? Their objection can be ignored.
    Yep, bollocks to them. They are partly the reason why this is coming into being
    More likely it's the US wanting to get hold of the tax revenues. I am probably over-cynical but I wonder how much extra tax revenue countries like the U.K. will actually get from the likes of Google and co?
    You are being cynical. The whole reason rishi held out for the digital services part was to avoid that situation where the US does fine but no one else does. It's taking aim at the likes of Apple, Google and others who use Ireland to shelter their UK profits from the taxman.
    Let's see what it will mean in practice.

    There's a touch of a "what a brilliant Budget!" going on at the moment. Followed by a more sober analysis days later I hope.

    I hope it works. The companies are parasites - far more than Ireland (which is doing what any historically poor country will do - use whatever it can to its advantage, especially if this is at the expense of a larger neighbour which exploited and impoverished it over centuries) - and need to be taken several pegs or more.

    Not just on tax either. They are far too powerful monopolies. Anti-trust action needs to be taken. What are the chances of that I wonder.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,348

    MaxPB said:

    Well this hasn't aged well...

    https://twitter.com/RachelReevesMP/status/1401125695393255428?s=19

    Or I presume they will be claiming something something not enough, given in to big US tech, think of the nurses...

    How did they not hear the same rumours we had in the city last night that the deal was done on the digital services tax? I heard about it just after the end of the day at drinks.
    Because they are captured in the twitter bubble....
    I've noticed that one way the left deals with Conservative policies they actually like, is by denying they are happening.

    I have progressive friends who say things like - "With the Tories running it, we are doing nothing about Global Warming". When you mention the end of coal, giant wind farms etc, they kind of stop for a bit. Then a little later you hear them back in their comfort zone.

    I think it is, that given a choice between acknowledging common ground, and denying reality, reality draws the short straw... Otherwise they would be agreeing.... with... Tories!
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    MaxPB said:

    Cyclefree said:



    Charles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Sorry for being incredibly selfish, but could one of the people who understands tax do a thread header explaining what this deal means, what’s changing and why it’s only become possible now?

    My dad’s question is, how can the UK collect the money if it isn’t already doing it? Won’t the companies shrug their shoulders and carry on as before?

    Given it’s an allocation of I’d assume it would be collected by the US and transferred by then.
    Uh oh ....we're dependant on the US sending us our allocation after they've done all the calculations.

    Can't see any problems with that at all.
    I'm not sure Charles has it right. My understanding is that the global operating margin will be applied to location revenue and everything above the 10% margin will be subject to a 20% local tax rate. Revenue is not easy to offshore as someone in the UK will pay for that service in the chain. The consumers are here, not in Ireland.
    4 questions (for now):-

    1. How are the calculations done?
    2. By whom?
    3. Which entity pays the tax to the U.K. exchequer?
    4. How is this enforced?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,348
    Taz said:

    Cyclefree said:



    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
    Well I'm not surprised her staff are scared if she beats up her suppliers! :)
    She expects her suppliers to provide what she's paid for. And if they don't she gets them to do so or gets her money back. Nothing wrong with having high expectations.

    And her staff love her. She persuaded them all to leave their existing jobs and join her and they've all stuck with her. It's a happy band.
    It’s hardly a high expectation To expect a supplier to provide what she’s paid for. More a reasonable,one.
    In some industries....

    Steel fabricators have got better. A few years back, delivering steel cut to the actual dimensions specified in the drawings was apparently a big ask - you were supposed to live with re-engineering the steel work for a building on site....

    Now they seem to have found out about laser measuring etc and can actually cut to the mm. Most of the time....
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,312
    Taz said:

    Cyclefree said:



    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kle4 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Staff shortages beginning to affect hospitality businesses here in the tourist hotspot that is the Yorkshire Dales. Pubs and cafes choosing to close midweek or run limited services despite huge demand. On a different matter, walk-in vaccinations for over-18s seemed to have stopped suddenly - no idea why.

    Same in the Lakes. Every single cafe, pub, restaurant I have seen or heard from is hiring.

    Demand is off the scale. The other night the usual 35 covers, which is busy for Daughter's small kitchen, went up to 50.

    I now have a late blooming career as a waitress. Comfortable shoes are now the only thing that matter to me .......
    Woe betide any lackadaisical serving staff who think they might pull one over the boss while you're on the floor.
    She's exceptionally good at beating up reps from various suppliers if they don't come up to scratch.
    Well I'm not surprised her staff are scared if she beats up her suppliers! :)
    She expects her suppliers to provide what she's paid for. And if they don't she gets them to do so or gets her money back. Nothing wrong with having high expectations.

    And her staff love her. She persuaded them all to leave their existing jobs and join her and they've all stuck with her. It's a happy band.
    It’s hardly a high expectation To expect a supplier to provide what she’s paid for. More a reasonable,one.
    Sure - but given how often this does not happen it sometimes seems like a high one.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Interesting read on the UAS ongoing situation

    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/40904/faa-data-shows-strange-pattern-of-military-encounters-with-unidentified-aircraft-in-sensitive-airspace

    Whatever the ultimate identities of these aircraft turn out to be, it is clear that they represent an ongoing national security concern. These are not isolated incidents but routine occurrences and we know the majority of which go unreported.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,348
    kle4 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    Sounds like sensible tactics.
    Indeed - a similar thing on a larger scale did for Napoleon in Russia Worn down by a battle or contested river crossing at a time...

    image
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    It worked!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,100

    Ed Conway of Sky saying the G7 agreement is a very big deal and especially as Joe Biden is fully on board

    So let me get this straight. It was all Sunak's idea and Biden is now hanging onto his coat tails?
    Of course, it is politics you know !!!!!!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    DougSeal said:

    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    It worked!
    No sense offering combat if you don't think you will win, just because it seems less grand. When will people listen to Fabius?
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,724
    DougSeal said:

    IanB2 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    There's a strand of twitter historians/history fans that fetishises (not too strong a word I think) the Western Allies' contribution in WWII. They detest Hastings and Beevor for in their view bigging up German and Soviet performances while sneering at the US and particularly British efforts. One of them in all seriousness asked if they should block a tweeter for saying that Montgomery's period in the European theatre was less than perfect.

    To me that just seems wokeness in the mirror.
    Military history is prone to willy-waving. Praising another party’s contribution to allied victory does not imply that one is denigrating one’s own side.

    The Red Army displayed outstanding courage, and Stalin and his clique deserve credit for holding their nerve and providing determined, if ruthless, leadership. OTOH, they deserve huge criticism for the purges, the pact with Hitler, and their inept tactics in the first two years of war.

    My own field, the Peninsular War, is riddled with similar biases. You can read biographies of Wellington and come away with the idea that the Spanish did nothing, or Spanish nationalists who claim that Talavera, Salamanca, and Vitoria were basically Spanish victories.
    My knowledge of the Peninsula War is based entirely on the Sharpe novels. They imply that the Spanish Army was not particularly effective but the guerrillas had a huge impact, bleeding the French occupying forces white.

    How accurate would you say that was?
    Didn’t Welllington’s ‘famous’ peninsula campaign mostly consist of retreating from the French, zigzagging across Portugal and western Spain, while the Spanish guerrillas and poor supply gradually abraded the French armies chasing him about trying to force him to battle? With just the occasional small scale battle when the odds were right.
    It worked!
    Great General... terrible PM
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Sean_F said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    It might not be long until Younge finds himself cancelled, if he carries on writing articles like this.

    He is right though, for the most part statues are dubious works of public art. The broader problem that we should be concerned about is the woke takeover of the historical profession; the overt rewriting of history to suit a fashionable political narrative. It was admirable that the historical profession held out for a long time but the dominoes are now falling at speed. Dominic Sandbrook has written recently about this.
    If you’re referencing the Sandbrook review of a history book written but a noted Twitter moron then it was an absolutely eviscerating. People may not like Sandbrook’s views but they would struggle to construct a compelling argument that his books are either badly written or badly argued (in need of someone to tell him that sometimes less is more, perhaps).

    I’m always fascinated by how people without relevant skills and knowledge feel able to write either history or children’s books. The latter in particular draws the “right name will sell any old shit”. I’m sure you can name a few.
    Yep - fake history is a big problem. Although I do admire Tom Holland, who writes excellent books and hasn't ever had a significant academic position.
    You don’t have to be an academic to be a good historian, as Holland, or Max Hastings demonstrate. But you do have to know the subject you’re writing about, and put in the research.

    I’m pleased to say that wokeness is almost totally absent from my own course in military history.
    Good luck holding the fort. I remember reading about a woke incursion in to diplomatic studies, rather than looking at the events being studied they just went for the whole genre and concluded that it was discredited and needed to be cancelled; perhaps they will will follow a similar approach with military history when they get around to it.

    One thing that causes me endless private amusement is the idea of a woke army, trying to fight an actual war, like against the Russians or the Chinese.
This discussion has been closed.