I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
Is the nub of it. Bastard bastard Brexit has screwed Labour to the wall.
We are at peak Brexit. Picture the scene, Alicante Airport and all those Hartlepudlians having to queue with the Russians to clear immigration whilst the Germans sail through.
Yep, this is Peak Tory, Peak Brexit, Peak Johnson. Just generally Peak "Bad" as regards our domestic politics. That "Boris" Blimp in Pools was Jeremy at Glasto. Spookily similar. I'm quite good on peaks. I felt it then, I feel it now.
Margaret Thatcher peaked in 1983...
More a plateau, that, I'd say. But I take the point. The shape can look more like the back of a banana than a church spire or a clifftop walk gone wrong.
The Guardian was told that on one occasion Jim McMahon, the Oldham MP who ran the Hartlepool byelection campaign, told a meeting with the leader’s office that Rayner had been “dressed inappropriately” on a visit to the town on 21 March.
McMahon’s allies strongly denied he had been disparaging about Rayner, whose constituency borders his own in Greater Manchester, and said he was simply expressing displeasure about pictures that had been selected for a leaflet.
The photographs showed Rayner wearing leopard-print trousers, heavy-duty stomper boots and a hoodie during a visit to Hartlepool on a Sunday, when she had travelled there from her home in Tameside.
Rayner’s team “hit the roof” when they heard about the remark, sources said, but chose not to tell the deputy leader for fear of worsening relations in the middle of a difficult byelection campaign.
The Guardian is already collecting material for those fantastic 10,000 words pieces in line by line microdetail on How Labour Had A Million Rows Over Headstones, Trousers And Biscuits Before Losing Again. They are now a regular feature of our cultural life and always compellingly written. Labour provides the script for free, and it is doing it again.
Labour need to find a candidate from Yorkshire, from outside politics, without a Twitter feed to pick through for pro-remain Tweets, amongst other things.
A local business leader like Andy Street would be good.
Geoff Boycott?
A great choice if we're pivoting to "so unwoke we're comatose".
Lives in S Africa
I walked past Boycott in Leeds a couple of years ago. Caught his eye, smiled and nodded to him as I passed and the miserable old git stared right through me and blanked me totally. Definitely a Tory. (I jest, I jest, sorry Tories, only messing. Some of my best friends are Tories. Boycott’s definitely a Tory supporter though, I know that for sure.)
When I was a little kid, 1960s, I used to collect players' autographs at Headingley. Boycott always refused and was foul and dismissive, quite unpleasant to us little ones. The other foul one I remember was Derek Underwood - another Tory, I reckon. By contrast, Gary Sobers was lovely and always found to give us an autograph - a class act.
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
Is the nub of it. Bastard bastard Brexit has screwed Labour to the wall.
We are at peak Brexit. Picture the scene, Alicante Airport and all those Hartlepudlians having to queue with the Russians to clear immigration whilst the Germans sail through.
Yep, this is Peak Tory, Peak Brexit, Peak Johnson. Just generally Peak "Bad" as regards our domestic politics. That "Boris" Blimp in Pools was Jeremy at Glasto. Spookily similar. I'm quite good on peaks. I felt it then, I feel it now.
Not convinced - yet - and Boris has stayed on his high wire a long time. Hartlepool was just one more in a long line of moments that may have been the high point for many. Losing Chesham and failing to win Batley (is there still a sympathy with Labour over Jo Cox there?) would be interesting. We should listen out for expectation management.
But Boris's record is that he has never lost a battle that mattered in the climb up the greasy pole despite appearing to be completely careless about it all.
It was that margin in Hartlepool. Almost double the Labour vote. That's plain silly. A GE next week would be a bigger landslide than Dec 19. The Cons have left themselves nowhere to go now. They've eaten all the pies. Big mistake.
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
Labour need to find a candidate from Yorkshire, from outside politics, without a Twitter feed to pick through for pro-remain Tweets, amongst other things.
A local business leader like Andy Street would be good.
Geoff Boycott?
A great choice if we're pivoting to "so unwoke we're comatose".
Lives in S Africa
I walked past Boycott in Leeds a couple of years ago. Caught his eye, smiled and nodded to him as I passed and the miserable old git stared right through me and blanked me totally. Definitely a Tory. (I jest, I jest, sorry Tories, only messing. Some of my best friends are Tories. Boycott’s definitely a Tory supporter though, I know that for sure.)
I am not sure his stick of rhubarb approach would enthuse voters.
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
I appreciate this is deeply sexist and ungallant and generally shitty, and I know on paper Dodds seems really impressive, but when I see her she brings to mind a lonely, eccentric old spinster who owns too many cats.
I know that’s awful, but that’s what I think.
"I know on paper Dodds seems really impressive"
???
PPE @ Oxford MA then PhD Lecturer for a few years while she lost elections in 2005, 2006 and 2010 MEP without distinction from 2014. Only entered parliament in 2017.
It's almost a caricature of the sort of student-union-activist that's packing out Labour's thin ranks at the moment.
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
Latest from Bristol would point towards Greens and Lab with the same number of seats.
Bristol voters letting down Labour again eh?
Letting themselves down, rather. Bristol Labour make the old Scottish Labour Party look like a model of integrity, ability and imagination. Getting rid of them would have been a definite result for Bristol.
Patrick English @PME_Politics · 3h In a continuation of one of the biggest stories of the weekend, the Greens are absolutely bulldozing their way through Bristol Council right now. They've won seats from Labour and the Lib Dems.
Tory tacticians will be burning midnight oil on how to campaign so as to split the centre left anti Tory vote three ways in just the right proportions. The one advantage of being the Millwall of politics is that for your supporters there is nowhere else to go, because they all hate the Tories and the Cons can take massive electoral advantage of it. (Try the election of 1983 for a textbook case).
Upthread, someone was asking why Priti Patel wanted to make these elections FPTP rather than SV...
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
The former WM PCC made the point - that a conviction shouldn’t prevent someone becoming a PO - some time ago. I don’t think he got anywhere with it with Priti, tho.
It’s a reasonable point.
Obviously, the seriousness/length of time/evidence of attempts at redemption have to be considered at the recruitment stage, but shouldn’t be an automatically bar for a police officer, IMO.
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
Same question really though isn’t it.
Particularly given some of the crimes police officers get away with.
I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
Is the nub of it. Bastard bastard Brexit has screwed Labour to the wall.
We are at peak Brexit. Picture the scene, Alicante Airport and all those Hartlepudlians having to queue with the Russians to clear immigration whilst the Germans sail through.
Yep, this is Peak Tory, Peak Brexit, Peak Johnson. Just generally Peak "Bad" as regards our domestic politics. That "Boris" Blimp in Pools was Jeremy at Glasto. Spookily similar. I'm quite good on peaks. I felt it then, I feel it now.
Not convinced - yet - and Boris has stayed on his high wire a long time. Hartlepool was just one more in a long line of moments that may have been the high point for many. Losing Chesham and failing to win Batley (is there still a sympathy with Labour over Jo Cox there?) would be interesting. We should listen out for expectation management.
But Boris's record is that he has never lost a battle that mattered in the climb up the greasy pole despite appearing to be completely careless about it all.
It was that margin in Hartlepool. Almost double the Labour vote. That's plain silly. A GE next week would be a bigger landslide than Dec 19. The Cons have left themselves nowhere to go now. They've eaten all the pies. Big mistake.
Good point, but the results overall give the Tories lots of reasons for, in public anyway, being a bit humble. The anti Tory vote, while spread, is clearly catching on in some of the places where the Tory hegemony has been taken for granted, and Tories get nowhere in the proper urban/BAME Labour heartland.
And a GE now, according to consistent polling, would be a Tory win but by much less - and a campaign would be a more interesting fight. We might see by late 22/early 23.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Can't the PCC-elect tell CCHQ where to get off? Surely he was elected in a personal capacity, even if he did have party backing. It's not a party list position.
I thought having a criminal record disbarred you? Not a question of party politics.
I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
Is the nub of it. Bastard bastard Brexit has screwed Labour to the wall.
We are at peak Brexit. Picture the scene, Alicante Airport and all those Hartlepudlians having to queue with the Russians to clear immigration whilst the Germans sail through.
Yep, this is Peak Tory, Peak Brexit, Peak Johnson. Just generally Peak "Bad" as regards our domestic politics. That "Boris" Blimp in Pools was Jeremy at Glasto. Spookily similar. I'm quite good on peaks. I felt it then, I feel it now.
I feel much the same. An unpopular government in Wales was re elected on a vaccine bounce. The same vaccine bonus applies to Johnson.
The fly in the ointment is you have people like Richard Burgon on manoeuvres (and goodness knows who else). I have news for Richard Burgon on manoeuvres, should you become leader of the Labour Party, you will never become Prime Minister, because people like me will not vote for you.
I don't think you need worry too much about this aspect. The risk is the other way - that Starmer will junk good left as well as bad left. And if he falls before the GE, the party won't choose a Corbynite. That's over.
I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
The coalition that won in 2019 was made up of 75% of the then-LEAVE vote (48%) and 20% of the then-REMAIN vote (52%) - roughly.
The latter, while not supportive of leaving the EU in 2016, either considered the requirement to settle the issue the paramount consideration or were so terrified of Jeremy Corbyn they were always to vote for any party capable of stopping him.
The question for the opposition is how you break apart that coalition. Time will help - as the distance between our membership of the EU and the present increases, so the salience of 2016 should diminish. The second part will depend on whether the latter group is fiscally conservative (in which case there's an opening) or would be willing to support a "centrist" Labour party or whether they are Conservative no matter what (I suspect elements of all three).
I always think of @TOPPING in situations like this.
He clearly hates Brexit, but he dislikes Labour even more. He thinks Brexit is a major policy mistake but it hasn't changed the fundamentals of the Conservative v Labour paradigm.
Unless and until the Labour party offers a centrist, fiscally responsible and efficient tax & spend option I suspect that will remain the case.
I think we're going to have to find a way to win without Topping.
Controversial view maybe, but I don’t understand why a 30 year old drink driving conviction disbars you from an elected position as pcc. What of redemption?
I'm going to guess that you can't be a PCC if you can't be a police officer.
Nope.
Hundreds of UK police officers have convictions for crimes including assault, burglary and animal cruelty
Police employ at least 211 officers and PCSOs with criminal convictions, but most forces refuse to disclose the information.
More than 200 serving police officers in the UK have convictions for criminal offences including assault, burglary, drug possession and animal cruelty, Sky News can reveal.
Forces across the country employ at least 211 police officers and PCSOs who were guilty of crimes, according to data released under the Freedom of Information Act.
The actual number is likely to be much higher, however, after just a third of forces revealed how many of their officers have criminal convictions, with many claiming it would cost too much to retrieve the information.
The National Police Chiefs' Council (NPCC) told Sky News that having a criminal record has "never been an automatic bar to joining the police" and insisted officers are vetted "throughout their service".
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Can't the PCC-elect tell CCHQ where to get off? Surely he was elected in a personal capacity, even if he did have party backing. It's not a party list position.
I mean the rules are quite clear. Any conviction for an offence where the maximum sentence is imprisonment disqualifies you from standing.
IIRC this was insisted upon by the Police when PCC were brought in - PCCs had to be held to the same bar as police.
Some wags suggested that in the East Midlands, the minimum qualification for candidacy would be organising at least two armed robberies....
Labour should call the Batley and Spen election a week after Cummings gives his evidence and hope there’s enough dirt to harm Bozo . Although currently it looks like Bozo could blow up a school bus and his fans would still give him a pass!
Look, the school bus was going to blow up anyways and we also had no idea pushing the plunger would actually blow up the bus so I think we can give BoJo a pass there.
He's teflon and Starmer is velcro. This has to change. But will it? I don't know.
BTW, do you have a view on an approx % probability that Sindy2 takes place in 22?
Oh, I know. I've heard it too on the odd occasion I come into contact with a blue collar "cash economy" type. Johnson has great appeal. He was once billed as the Heineken Tory who "reaches the parts other Tories can't reach". It's true.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Can't the PCC-elect tell CCHQ where to get off? Surely he was elected in a personal capacity, even if he did have party backing. It's not a party list position.
I mean the rules are quite clear. Any conviction for an offence where the maximum sentence is imprisonment disqualifies you from standing.
IIRC this was insisted upon by the Police when PCC were brought in - PCCs had to be held to the same bar as police.
Some wags suggested that in the East Midlands, the minimum qualification for candidacy would be organising at least two armed robberies....
Seems to be a higher standard from posts on here. I do question the lack of allowance for redemption/genuine regret or remorse here.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
Was he advised wrongly? The article suggests the offence only recently came to light.
Labour need to find a candidate from Yorkshire, from outside politics, without a Twitter feed to pick through for pro-remain Tweets, amongst other things.
A local business leader like Andy Street would be good.
Geoff Boycott?
A great choice if we're pivoting to "so unwoke we're comatose".
Lives in S Africa
No! Boston Spa in Yorkshire. I saw his house last summer. It has a plaque at the front saying he lives there and the postman confirmed it. Said he sees him around.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
Was he advised wrongly? The article suggests the offence only recently came to light.
I've read other articles on this that quote Mr Seed as saying he disclosed this to the Conservative Party when going for approval. Perhaps he and his Party disagree over this - but that's clearly his position.
The Guardian was told that on one occasion Jim McMahon, the Oldham MP who ran the Hartlepool byelection campaign, told a meeting with the leader’s office that Rayner had been “dressed inappropriately” on a visit to the town on 21 March.
McMahon’s allies strongly denied he had been disparaging about Rayner, whose constituency borders his own in Greater Manchester, and said he was simply expressing displeasure about pictures that had been selected for a leaflet.
The photographs showed Rayner wearing leopard-print trousers, heavy-duty stomper boots and a hoodie during a visit to Hartlepool on a Sunday, when she had travelled there from her home in Tameside.
Rayner’s team “hit the roof” when they heard about the remark, sources said, but chose not to tell the deputy leader for fear of worsening relations in the middle of a difficult byelection campaign.
The Guardian is already collecting material for those fantastic 10,000 words pieces in line by line microdetail on How Labour Had A Million Rows Over Headstones, Trousers And Biscuits Before Losing Again. They are now a regular feature of our cultural life and always compellingly written. Labour provides the script for free, and it is doing it again.
I have to say again what an outstanding newspaper the Guardian is. And of course I disagree fundamentally with most of its political positioning. But that doesn't matter. They have writers and reporters of such consistently great quality that it is no hardship to overlook the political slant and enjoy the articles and stories. To be honest no other paper seems to come close these days in the UK.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
It's not just that, it's just the nature of "labour" has changed. The "middle classes" working 60+ hour weeks in London and other major cities, spending half their salary on rent, see themselves as working class. A plumber living in a Durham pit village is likely to be earning near enough the same as them but with a higher standard of living, also sees themselves as working class.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
No.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
Really? Do you live in one of Casino's woke fantasies?
Labour need to find a candidate from Yorkshire, from outside politics, without a Twitter feed to pick through for pro-remain Tweets, amongst other things.
A local business leader like Andy Street would be good.
Geoff Boycott?
A great choice if we're pivoting to "so unwoke we're comatose".
Lives in S Africa
I walked past Boycott in Leeds a couple of years ago. Caught his eye, smiled and nodded to him as I passed and the miserable old git stared right through me and blanked me totally. Definitely a Tory. (I jest, I jest, sorry Tories, only messing. Some of my best friends are Tories. Boycott’s definitely a Tory supporter though, I know that for sure.)
When I was a little kid, 1960s, I used to collect players' autographs at Headingley. Boycott always refused and was foul and dismissive, quite unpleasant to us little ones. The other foul one I remember was Derek Underwood - another Tory, I reckon. By contrast, Gary Sobers was lovely and always found to give us an autograph - a class act.
I woz there, Headingley 77, Ashes Test, his home ground, hot sun, bloke running on to give him a pint of John Smiths after he'd just knocked up his career 100th 100.
You just could not script it. Pure Yorkshire bliss.
I appreciate this is deeply sexist and ungallant and generally shitty, and I know on paper Dodds seems really impressive, but when I see her she brings to mind a lonely, eccentric old spinster who owns too many cats.
I know that’s awful, but that’s what I think.
When I see her, I think of that line in "In The Loop" where Malcolm Tucker says (IIRC) of a female Minister: "Don't tell me they let her go on television like that - with her hair looking as if she's plugged into the effing mains."
The Guardian was told that on one occasion Jim McMahon, the Oldham MP who ran the Hartlepool byelection campaign, told a meeting with the leader’s office that Rayner had been “dressed inappropriately” on a visit to the town on 21 March.
McMahon’s allies strongly denied he had been disparaging about Rayner, whose constituency borders his own in Greater Manchester, and said he was simply expressing displeasure about pictures that had been selected for a leaflet.
The photographs showed Rayner wearing leopard-print trousers, heavy-duty stomper boots and a hoodie during a visit to Hartlepool on a Sunday, when she had travelled there from her home in Tameside.
Rayner’s team “hit the roof” when they heard about the remark, sources said, but chose not to tell the deputy leader for fear of worsening relations in the middle of a difficult byelection campaign.
The Guardian is already collecting material for those fantastic 10,000 words pieces in line by line microdetail on How Labour Had A Million Rows Over Headstones, Trousers And Biscuits Before Losing Again. They are now a regular feature of our cultural life and always compellingly written. Labour provides the script for free, and it is doing it again.
I have to say again what an outstanding newspaper the Guardian is. And of course I disagree fundamentally with most of its political positioning. But that doesn't matter. They have writers and reporters of such consistently great quality that it is no hardship to overlook the political slant and enjoy the articles and stories. To be honest no other paper seems to come close these days in the UK.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
Really? Do you live in one of Casino's woke fantasies?
No just listening to all the idiots complaining about the wrong kind of voters etc.
The current Labour party seems like a heritage movement that worships a past that didn't really exist, even more than some sections of the Tory party.
There's bags of lefty policies that would be popular, out there. For all the internationalism - try looking at a few other countries perhaps.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
I thought for most crimes there was a statute of limitations after which it is no longer necessary to declare them?
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
In which case, can they get a move on please?
Seconded.
My charge sheet against the Labour Party consists of two accusations:
1. Destruction of the United Kingdom 2. Jeremy Corbyn
It would deserve to burn for either, but for both, well...
We need it to get out of the way so that we can have an appropriate successor to the Liberal Party. The great risk, however, is that Labour turns out to be both too weak to succeed and too strong to collapse, in which case we get either Japanification of the political system in England (decades of unbroken Toryism) or, even worse, we end up at some point with a Labour minority propped up by Scottish nationalism. Hence why it seems to be such a strategic blunder for the (English & Welsh) Tories not to concede Indyref2. I can only assume that Johnson has decided that he doesn't want to go down in history as the leader who lost Scotland, or he's worrying about what to do with the nukes. Nothing else makes sense.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
No.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
Surely it is even simpler, and blaming the voters is an old political insiders' joke that doesn't travel well outside the inner sanctum – and these days your opponents will ensure it does!
Like Liam Byrnes' note which despite the government's faux outrage, they knew was a paraphrase of Maudling a couple of decades earlier. This was surely an homage to the American Dick Tuck's "the people have spoken, the bastards".
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
In which case, can they get a move on please?
Seconded.
My charge sheet against the Labour Party consists of two accusations:
1. Destruction of the United Kingdom 2. Jeremy Corbyn
It would deserve to burn for either, but for both, well...
We need it to get out of the way so that we can have an appropriate successor to the Liberal Party. The great risk, however, is that Labour turns out to be both too weak to succeed and too strong to collapse, in which case we get either Japanification of the political system in England (decades of unbroken Toryism) or, even worse, we end up at some point with a Labour minority propped up by Scottish nationalism. Hence why it seems to be such a strategic blunder for the (English & Welsh) Tories not to concede Indyref2. I can only assume that Johnson has decided that he doesn't want to go down in history as the leader who lost Scotland, or he's worrying about what to do with the nukes. Nothing else makes sense.
I would much prefer a successor to the Liberal Party than the current Labour Party to be honest
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
It's not just that, it's just the nature of "labour" has changed. The "middle classes" working 60+ hour weeks in London and other major cities, spending half their salary on rent, see themselves as working class. A plumber living in a Durham pit village is likely to be earning near enough the same as them but with a higher standard of living, also sees themselves as working class.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
Yes - and the world of "work" has splintered. The middle class jobs - nice offices, punctilious regard to employment law, PAYE etc - have expanded.
Meanwhile just round the corner, sub minimum wage scumbaggery.
The self employed plumber probably got out of the latter.... but still regards the office worker as knowing nothing about the realities of life.
Oxfordshire Tory collapse continues. LibDems have gained a few more and could even become the largest party at a pinch.
There are some very surprising gains in Oxfordshire.
The Labour and Green voteshare jump in Witney North and East is huge, which of course was David Cameron's seat.
Given the fashion for Labour types saying northern leave voters are a bunch of rubes who don't understand their own interests, it's amusing to see the same can now be said, with far more justice, for lots of the smug southern voters too.
The Guardian was told that on one occasion Jim McMahon, the Oldham MP who ran the Hartlepool byelection campaign, told a meeting with the leader’s office that Rayner had been “dressed inappropriately” on a visit to the town on 21 March.
McMahon’s allies strongly denied he had been disparaging about Rayner, whose constituency borders his own in Greater Manchester, and said he was simply expressing displeasure about pictures that had been selected for a leaflet.
The photographs showed Rayner wearing leopard-print trousers, heavy-duty stomper boots and a hoodie during a visit to Hartlepool on a Sunday, when she had travelled there from her home in Tameside.
Rayner’s team “hit the roof” when they heard about the remark, sources said, but chose not to tell the deputy leader for fear of worsening relations in the middle of a difficult byelection campaign.
The Guardian is already collecting material for those fantastic 10,000 words pieces in line by line microdetail on How Labour Had A Million Rows Over Headstones, Trousers And Biscuits Before Losing Again. They are now a regular feature of our cultural life and always compellingly written. Labour provides the script for free, and it is doing it again.
I have to say again what an outstanding newspaper the Guardian is. And of course I disagree fundamentally with most of its political positioning. But that doesn't matter. They have writers and reporters of such consistently great quality that it is no hardship to overlook the political slant and enjoy the articles and stories. To be honest no other paper seems to come close these days in the UK.
Hmmm. Seamus Milne was on their books,.
The man credited with turning the Comments Section of the Guardian into the "most thought-provoking opinion section in Britain" - by Dan Hannan who is also diametrically opposed to him politically.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
It's not just that, it's just the nature of "labour" has changed. The "middle classes" working 60+ hour weeks in London and other major cities, spending half their salary on rent, see themselves as working class. A plumber living in a Durham pit village is likely to be earning near enough the same as them but with a higher standard of living, also sees themselves as working class.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
So what unites them?
They're paying taxes, so they don't want to see that money wasted. They want to feel safe. They're probably using state schools and hospitals for their families, so they want them to be decent and accessible. They want the streets to be clean, maybe some nice flower beds.
Until those needs are met, they're probably not impressed with politicians dicking about with flags, whether British, European or Palestinian. They don't want the sense that their rulers are taking the mickey.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
I thought for most crimes there was a statute of limitations after which it is no longer necessary to declare them?
Yes, but not unreasonable for the bar to be a tad higher if you actually want to run the police.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
It's not just that, it's just the nature of "labour" has changed. The "middle classes" working 60+ hour weeks in London and other major cities, spending half their salary on rent, see themselves as working class. A plumber living in a Durham pit village is likely to be earning near enough the same as them but with a higher standard of living, also sees themselves as working class.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
So what unites them?
They're paying taxes, so they don't want to see that money wasted. They want to feel safe. They're probably using state schools and hospitals for their families, so they want them to be decent and accessible. They want the streets to be clean, maybe some nice flower beds.
Until those needs are met, they're probably not impressed with politicians dicking about with flags, whether British, European or Palestinian. They don't want the sense that their rulers are taking the mickey.
This stuff is not difficult.
Brexit is going to enable them to pay less taxes, is going to make them feel safer, and will result in smaller class sizes, etc. Therefore why vote Labour?
The best Labour can do is make themselves appear competent and wait for the splinters to happen. The latter will happen eventually but the former may not.
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
No.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
He said the voters had let Labour down. ‘The voters have let us down.’
No mate, the voters have *not* let you down. That implies you have a God given right to their vote, which is not the case.
It is true that sometimes - often - politicians may feel it’s unfair that somebody hasn’t voted for them, or has voted for somebody they feel won’t do as good a job, but the sense of entitlement in that sentence is truly alarming.
It reminds me of Arthur Balfour’s infamous comment in 1906 that ‘in office or out, we must ensure the Unionist party continue to control the destiny of this great empire.’
They didn’t win another election in their own strength until 1922, the second longest period in their history without forming a majority government. Funny, that.
Edit - his second sentence, whether deliberately or not, also came across as a threat. Which is also shockingly inappropriate.
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
Interesting legal problem in Oxfordshire. Reading out the result of the Banbury Ruscote ward the returning officer read out the results and gave Labour the Conservative vote total and vice-versa. The Labour party are challenging in court. The effect will be to deprive the Conservatives of their one seat advantage over the Lib Dems of the county council.
Andrew Adonis @Andrew_Adonis · 7h For what it’s worth, it is my judgement that the only Labour leader likely to be able to win the next election is Tony Blair
Pass the popcorn, comrade.
While this comment is bizarre, an even stranger thought is that it is perfectly possible that even TB as he now is, with all his Remain and Iraq baggage etc, would be unable to beat Boris is what were Labour heartland seats (including his own!), and may not even be able to win enough Tory Remain seats to form government. Adonis may be both impossiblist and wrong.
Is Lord Adonis of Islington (or wherever) Blair's freaking love child or what?
He appears to be even further up Tony's fat ass than Brendan Bracken was up Winston's.
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
I see that 20-25% of Conservative votes for London Mayor gave Lib Dem or Green for second preference (or it might have been the other way round, I forget) suggesting that quite a few Remainers in London voted Bailey.
There's clearly more to a Conservative vote than just Brexit and I suspect that extends into the home counties too.
Conservatives seem to be better at holding onto Remain voters than Labour are at holding onto Leave voters.
The coalition that won in 2019 was made up of 75% of the then-LEAVE vote (48%) and 20% of the then-REMAIN vote (52%) - roughly.
The latter, while not supportive of leaving the EU in 2016, either considered the requirement to settle the issue the paramount consideration or were so terrified of Jeremy Corbyn they were always to vote for any party capable of stopping him.
The question for the opposition is how you break apart that coalition. Time will help - as the distance between our membership of the EU and the present increases, so the salience of 2016 should diminish. The second part will depend on whether the latter group is fiscally conservative (in which case there's an opening) or would be willing to support a "centrist" Labour party or whether they are Conservative no matter what (I suspect elements of all three).
I always think of @TOPPING in situations like this.
He clearly hates Brexit, but he dislikes Labour even more. He thinks Brexit is a major policy mistake but it hasn't changed the fundamentals of the Conservative v Labour paradigm.
Unless and until the Labour party offers a centrist, fiscally responsible and efficient tax & spend option I suspect that will remain the case.
I think we're going to have to find a way to win without Topping.
That seems a little unfair
Why should the Labour party have to run on a "centrist, fiscally responsible and efficient tax and spend option" when Johnson has gone full Viv Nicholson?
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Was this drivel put forward as news or an opinion piece? Trump really did drive them insane.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
As long as it’s after he leaves office, he won’t care a bit,
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Impressive. This sheer colonic efflux makes the Guardian look unbiased...
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
It's quite logical, really.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
It's not just that, it's just the nature of "labour" has changed. The "middle classes" working 60+ hour weeks in London and other major cities, spending half their salary on rent, see themselves as working class. A plumber living in a Durham pit village is likely to be earning near enough the same as them but with a higher standard of living, also sees themselves as working class.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
So what unites them?
They're paying taxes, so they don't want to see that money wasted. They want to feel safe. They're probably using state schools and hospitals for their families, so they want them to be decent and accessible. They want the streets to be clean, maybe some nice flower beds.
Until those needs are met, they're probably not impressed with politicians dicking about with flags, whether British, European or Palestinian. They don't want the sense that their rulers are taking the mickey.
This stuff is not difficult.
Brexit is going to enable them to pay less taxes, is going to make them feel safer, and will result in smaller class sizes, etc. Therefore why vote Labour?
The best Labour can do is make themselves appear competent and wait for the splinters to happen. The latter will happen eventually but the former may not.
That was the dishonest genius of the VL campaign. The headline pledge was Vote Leave and your hospital will be less crowded and in colour!
There's lots of reasons to think it won't work like that, but 2019 gave BoJo the right to try.
The SNP doesn't actually want a referendum right now. Because a referendum would probably be lost, and after two defeats in a decade, the voters would probably want a break from being asked the same question a third time.
But the SNP also knows that the best way to bolster support for independence is for the Westminster government (either through the Courts or directly) to deny Scotland a referendum.
They therefore, are almost obliged to pass a referendum bill in Hollyrood.
The Conservative & Unionist Party has to then deny Scotland that referendum, even though doing so almost certainly increases the chance of independence. Failure to veto the referendum would be disastrous for the Scottish Conservative Party because they would appear insufficiently Unionist.
So, the Conservative Party will act against the long term interests of the Union by denying a vote in Scotland. But by doing so, they will shore up their position as the most Unionist of the Scottish parties.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Bloody hell, this isn't Texas. It ought to be serious offences only.
I have a certain amount of sympathy for the bloke as it was many years ago and he apparently declared it to the Conservative Party. But the law is clear regarding PCCs - any conviction for an offence for which you CAN be imprisoned disbars you.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
I thought for most crimes there was a statute of limitations after which it is no longer necessary to declare them?
Not really. There's the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act, but it's full of exceptions.
It looks like Witney is reverting to the same politics it had before 2005, where the LD and Labour voteshares combined more or less equalled the Tory share - with some Tory Remain erosion/defection it should be possible for the LDs to take that seat next time.
Kind of explains why Cameron took the approach to modernisation that he did.
My conclusion from this election is that tactical voting, which last happened in 2010, is beginning to happen again. That benefits the Conservatives in the North, the Labour Party and the Greens in major metropolitan areas, and the LibDems in the market towns of the South East.
I doubt it will have a major impact on the 2024 GE, but it may well do by the time of the next.
The SNP doesn't actually want a referendum right now. Because a referendum would probably be lost, and after two defeats in a decade, the voters would probably want a break from being asked the same question a third time.
But the SNP also knows that the best way to bolster support for independence is for the Westminster government (either through the Courts or directly) to deny Scotland a referendum.
They therefore, are almost obliged to pass a referendum bill in Hollyrood.
The Conservative & Unionist Party has to then deny Scotland that referendum, even though doing so almost certainly increases the chance of independence. Failure to veto the referendum would be disastrous for the Scottish Conservative Party because they would appear insufficiently Unionist.
So, the Conservative Party will act against the long term interests of the Union by denying a vote in Scotland. But by doing so, they will shore up their position as the most Unionist of the Scottish parties.
Hmm. How much is their vote in rUK a factor in that equation, do you think? Both immediately (ie while Scotland is in the UK) and after independence?
Interesting legal problem in Oxfordshire. Reading out the result of the Banbury Ruscote ward the returning officer read out the results and gave Labour the Conservative vote total and vice-versa. The Labour party are challenging in court. The effect will be to deprive the Conservatives of their one seat advantage over the Lib Dems of the county council.
You've just rumbled Nicola's plan to use her minion to read out the wrong referendum numbers......
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
No.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
He said the voters had let Labour down. ‘The voters have let us down.’
No mate, the voters have *not* let you down. That implies you have a God given right to their vote, which is not the case.
It is true that sometimes - often - politicians may feel it’s unfair that somebody hasn’t voted for them, or has voted for somebody they feel won’t do as good a job, but the sense of entitlement in that sentence is truly alarming.
It reminds me of Arthur Balfour’s infamous comment in 1906 that ‘in office or out, we must ensure the Unionist party continue to control the destiny of this great empire.’
They didn’t win another election in their own strength until 1922, the second longest period in their history without forming a majority government. Funny, that.
Edit - his second sentence, whether deliberately or not, also came across as a threat. Which is also shockingly inappropriate.
He is also wrong in assuming the Red Wall voters will return. I don't believe they will, certainly not under Johnson.
The punters see Johnson's new clothes whereas I ( and presumably the disgruntled councillor) see a bare arsed clown. Maybe we are the ones who are mistaken.
The Conservative likely to be Wiltshire’s Police & Crime Commissioner has been told by Tory HQ that he can't take the job if he wins Monday's election count. Jonathon Seed is "disbarred" over an old conviction for drink driving. More soon
Interesting legal problem in Oxfordshire. Reading out the result of the Banbury Ruscote ward the returning officer read out the results and gave Labour the Conservative vote total and vice-versa. The Labour party are challenging in court. The effect will be to deprive the Conservatives of their one seat advantage over the Lib Dems of the county council.
That's the best blueprint for a Labour recovery I've heard yet.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Anyone looking for wedge drivers would be better advised to look north.....
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the Labour Party is actually trying to self immolate.
No.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
I wonder if you would have said the same if it had been a tory
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
It's not the Will of the People, but there's a clear democratic mandate for it. Both these things are true at the same time.
The number of MSPs is irrelevant - you don’t elect a representative to represent you in something that is outwith their powers
But they just did
No, they didn’t. The SNP candidates promised* to hold a referendum on independence. But it is not in their power to grant a legal referendum. They can only try to put pressure on the Westminster parliament to grant one.** It would like a Mayor of London promising to declare war on France - it might win votes but doesn’t change the scope of their power
* I haven’t read their manifesto so don’t know precisely what they promised
** the share of the vote is a better argument - although only for putting pressure on Westminster - but I understand (saw some debate between @DavidL & @RochdalePioneers this afternoon) that was pretty close up 50/50 so not an overwhelming demand
This, however, does not necessarily mean that, as the first minister claims, holding another referendum is now clearly the "will of the people" in Scotland.
Rather, the outcome of the election confirms that Scotland is evenly divided on the constitutional question.
The three main pro-union parties won 50.4 per cent of the constituency vote, but the three main list parties secured 50.1 per cent of the list vote. The pro-independence majority is a consequence of the limitations of Holyrood’s supposedly proportional electoral system (devised over twenty years ago by Labour and the Liberal Democrats) rather than evidence of a clear majority in favour of another referendum.
It's not the Will of the People, but there's a clear democratic mandate for it. Both these things are true at the same time.
The number of MSPs is irrelevant - you don’t elect a representative to represent you in something that is outwith their powers
But they just did
No, they didn’t. The SNP candidates promised* to hold a referendum on independence. But it is not in their power to grant a legal referendum. They can only try to put pressure on the Westminster parliament to grant one.** It would like a Mayor of London promising to declare war on France - it might win votes but doesn’t change the scope of their power
* I haven’t read their manifesto so don’t know precisely what they promised
** the share of the vote is a better argument - although only for putting pressure on Westminster - but I understand (saw some debate between @DavidL & @RochdalePioneers this afternoon) that was pretty close up 50/50 so not an overwhelming demand
DAvidL and RP were both in agreement that it was over the 50% mark. It's HYUFD who was using the psephological equivalent of creative bistromathics.
The SNP doesn't actually want a referendum right now. Because a referendum would probably be lost, and after two defeats in a decade, the voters would probably want a break from being asked the same question a third time.
But the SNP also knows that the best way to bolster support for independence is for the Westminster government (either through the Courts or directly) to deny Scotland a referendum.
They therefore, are almost obliged to pass a referendum bill in Hollyrood.
The Conservative & Unionist Party has to then deny Scotland that referendum, even though doing so almost certainly increases the chance of independence. Failure to veto the referendum would be disastrous for the Scottish Conservative Party because they would appear insufficiently Unionist.
So, the Conservative Party will act against the long term interests of the Union by denying a vote in Scotland. But by doing so, they will shore up their position as the most Unionist of the Scottish parties.
I don't think they do have to deny them the referendum. In fact the Westminster Government don't have to do anything at all. It only takes one challenge by a private individual to get the Supreme Court to rule on the legality of the case. The Government at Westminster can sit back and say 'nothing to with us folks'.
And again for the record I am in favour of Independence. But I have to be realistic and see the potholes in the road on the way to the vote.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
It looks like Witney is reverting to the same politics it had before 2005, where the LD and Labour voteshares combined more or less equalled the Tory share - with some Tory Remain erosion/defection it should be possible for the LDs to take that seat next time.
Kind of explains why Cameron took the approach to modernisation that he did.
My conclusion from this election is that tactical voting, which last happened in 2010, is beginning to happen again. That benefits the Conservatives in the North, the Labour Party and the Greens in major metropolitan areas, and the LibDems in the market towns of the South East.
I doubt it will have a major impact on the 2024 GE, but it may well do by the time of the next.
Yes, though the nature of the Conservative TV is a bit different to the others. The Conservatives have feasted on the corpse of UKIP/BXP. Good, especially in certain places, but finite.
The other parties seem to have forgiven each other; Lib Dems have been forgiven for their part in the coalition and Labour for putting forward a loony antisemite as potential PM. That process has started later, is smaller, but has more room to grow.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Why are CNN obsessed with Brexit Britain?
You do know we report foreign news as well, especially from America?
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Anyone looking for wedge drivers would be better advised to look north.....
Na, I doubt CNN have anything but praise for Sturgeon.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Why are CNN obsessed with Brexit Britain?
You do know we report foreign news as well, especially from America?
Comments
a guide.
???
PPE @ Oxford
MA then PhD
Lecturer for a few years while she lost elections in 2005, 2006 and 2010
MEP without distinction from 2014.
Only entered parliament in 2017.
It's almost a caricature of the sort of student-union-activist that's packing out Labour's thin ranks at the moment.
It’s a reasonable point.
Obviously, the seriousness/length of time/evidence of attempts at redemption have to be considered at the recruitment stage, but shouldn’t be an automatically bar for a police officer, IMO.
And a GE now, according to consistent polling, would be a Tory win but by much less - and a campaign would be a more interesting fight. We might see by late 22/early 23.
Hundreds of UK police officers have convictions for crimes including assault, burglary and animal cruelty
Police employ at least 211 officers and PCSOs with criminal convictions, but most forces refuse to disclose the information.
More than 200 serving police officers in the UK have convictions for criminal offences including assault, burglary, drug possession and animal cruelty, Sky News can reveal.
Forces across the country employ at least 211 police officers and PCSOs who were guilty of crimes, according to data released under the Freedom of Information Act.
The actual number is likely to be much higher, however, after just a third of forces revealed how many of their officers have criminal convictions, with many claiming it would cost too much to retrieve the information.
The National Police Chiefs' Council (NPCC) told Sky News that having a criminal record has "never been an automatic bar to joining the police" and insisted officers are vetted "throughout their service".
https://news.sky.com/story/assault-burglary-and-animal-cruelty-police-officers-convicted-of-crimes-working-for-uk-forces-12024264
Some wags suggested that in the East Midlands, the minimum qualification for candidacy would be organising at least two armed robberies....
I think he was a passenger in a stolen car.
Ditto Steven Woolfe of UKIP.
I know there have been other examples.
It's very bad the Conservative Party advised Mr Seed wrongly on this as it's going to be very expensive to re-run it across the whole of Wiltshire (if he wins) plus a ball-ache for the four people diligent enough to vote in a PCC by-election.
Perhaps there's a wealthy Conservative donor who might want to pay the bill to avoid the cost of this f*** up falling on the taxpayer? It would be a lovely gesture.
Back in the days of Attlee et al - they *lived* the Labour culture. They had no problem reconciling love of country and Socialism (with a great big S). They BELIEVED. Not through conscious effort, or study. They just did.
Now they are a an ancient church, going through the motions of worshipping Om. While angrily accusing everyone of being a heretic.
Watch out for falling tortoises.
They can both validly see themselves as working class but obviously they have very different perspectives on life and different needs and priorities.
I simply don't understand the faux outrage about this on here. First, @Casino_Royale has somewhat overstated what was actually said to make a cheap political point.
I've no problem with what the former Labour Councillor said - I've heard a lot worse. For some councillors, defeat is a blessed relief - a chance to return to a more normal life but for others it's a serious business, it's their contribution to public life and their attempt to better the lives of their residents (perhaps in a small way).
Politics has no gratitude - Churchill was thanked for leading us through the war with a landslide defeat, Margaret Thatcher was thanked for three GE victories by being turfed out by her own MPs. If there's no gratitude, there's no requirement for magnanimity.
We all react to rejection (for that's what it is) differently. As to whether their voters of Amber Valley will come to regret their decision, it's one of those councils which often changes political control. In a couple of years, perhaps, the Conservatives will be out and Labour will be back.
That's politics - it's a rough trade as someone once said, oddly enough after he'd been on the end of a bad result.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Strange-Death-Tory-England/dp/0141018674/ref=nodl_
You just could not script it. Pure Yorkshire bliss.
The current Labour party seems like a heritage movement that worships a past that didn't really exist, even more than some sections of the Tory party.
There's bags of lefty policies that would be popular, out there. For all the internationalism - try looking at a few other countries perhaps.
Even now I think it looks more like Laurence Fox than Boris Becker.
My charge sheet against the Labour Party consists of two accusations:
1. Destruction of the United Kingdom
2. Jeremy Corbyn
It would deserve to burn for either, but for both, well...
We need it to get out of the way so that we can have an appropriate successor to the Liberal Party. The great risk, however, is that Labour turns out to be both too weak to succeed and too strong to collapse, in which case we get either Japanification of the political system in England (decades of unbroken Toryism) or, even worse, we end up at some point with a Labour minority propped up by Scottish nationalism. Hence why it seems to be such a strategic blunder for the (English & Welsh) Tories not to concede Indyref2. I can only assume that Johnson has decided that he doesn't want to go down in history as the leader who lost Scotland, or he's worrying about what to do with the nukes. Nothing else makes sense.
Like Liam Byrnes' note which despite the government's faux outrage, they knew was a paraphrase of Maudling a couple of decades earlier. This was surely an homage to the American Dick Tuck's "the people have spoken, the bastards".
Meanwhile just round the corner, sub minimum wage scumbaggery.
The self employed plumber probably got out of the latter.... but still regards the office worker as knowing nothing about the realities of life.
They're paying taxes, so they don't want to see that money wasted.
They want to feel safe. They're probably using state schools and hospitals for their families, so they want them to be decent and accessible. They want the streets to be clean, maybe some nice flower beds.
Until those needs are met, they're probably not impressed with politicians dicking about with flags, whether British, European or Palestinian. They don't want the sense that their rulers are taking the mickey.
This stuff is not difficult.
The best Labour can do is make themselves appear competent and wait for the splinters to happen. The latter will happen eventually but the former may not.
No mate, the voters have *not* let you down. That implies you have a God given right to their vote, which is not the case.
It is true that sometimes - often - politicians may feel it’s unfair that somebody hasn’t voted for them, or has voted for somebody they feel won’t do as good a job, but the sense of entitlement in that sentence is truly alarming.
It reminds me of Arthur Balfour’s infamous comment in 1906 that ‘in office or out, we must ensure the Unionist party continue to control the destiny of this great empire.’
They didn’t win another election in their own strength until 1922, the second longest period in their history without forming a majority government. Funny, that.
Edit - his second sentence, whether deliberately or not, also came across as a threat. Which is also shockingly inappropriate.
He appears to be even further up Tony's fat ass than Brendan Bracken was up Winston's.
The list of Johnson's Covid-19 mishaps is long. Early in the crisis, he was criticized for going into lockdown too late, not taking the virus seriously enough (famously saying he was still shaking hands with people at the same time Covid-19 was ripping through the country) and dropping the ball on crucial matters like testing and providing PPE for medical workers.
His government has been accused of sleaze and cronyism, handing lucrative contracts to people with links to his party. Most recently, Johnson was accused of saying he'd rather "let the bodies pile high in their thousands" than impose another lockdown, a comment he denied making.
His Brexit deal has been criticized for being sloppy and poorly implemented, leaving exporters in serious trouble. He is also being formally investigated by the electoral commission for allegedly letting Conservative donors pay for a very expensive refurbishment of his flat in Downing Street. And his judgment has come under serious scrutiny following a huge fallout in his inner circle.
How, then, has Johnson so resoundingly won this referendum on his leadership?
The first point to note is that Johnson has been bailed out by his government's vaccine rollout. More importantly, Johnson has managed to shift the center ground in England, a difficult feat in modern politics. Finally, the UK is very divided, which works in the Prime Minister's favor, at least for now.
And while Johnson appears to have gamed British politics perfectly for now, he's done so by driving a wedge between the four nations and by reaping the benefits of grievance politics. One day, it's entirely possible Johnson may come to regret unleashing these demons for the sake of victory.
Why should the Labour party have to run on a "centrist, fiscally responsible and efficient tax and spend option" when Johnson has gone full Viv Nicholson?
There's lots of reasons to think it won't work like that, but 2019 gave BoJo the right to try.
It's a curious case of theory right now.
The SNP doesn't actually want a referendum right now. Because a referendum would probably be lost, and after two defeats in a decade, the voters would probably want a break from being asked the same question a third time.
But the SNP also knows that the best way to bolster support for independence is for the Westminster government (either through the Courts or directly) to deny Scotland a referendum.
They therefore, are almost obliged to pass a referendum bill in Hollyrood.
The Conservative & Unionist Party has to then deny Scotland that referendum, even though doing so almost certainly increases the chance of independence. Failure to veto the referendum would be disastrous for the Scottish Conservative Party because they would appear insufficiently Unionist.
So, the Conservative Party will act against the long term interests of the Union by denying a vote in Scotland. But by doing so, they will shore up their position as the most Unionist of the Scottish parties.
I doubt it will have a major impact on the 2024 GE, but it may well do by the time of the next.
The punters see Johnson's new clothes whereas I ( and presumably the disgruntled councillor) see a bare arsed clown. Maybe we are the ones who are mistaken.
* I haven’t read their manifesto so don’t know precisely what they promised
** the share of the vote is a better argument - although only for putting pressure on Westminster - but I understand (saw some debate between @DavidL & @RochdalePioneers this afternoon) that was pretty close up 50/50 so not an overwhelming demand
And again for the record I am in favour of Independence. But I have to be realistic and see the potholes in the road on the way to the vote.
The Conservatives have feasted on the corpse of UKIP/BXP. Good, especially in certain places, but finite.
The other parties seem to have forgiven each other; Lib Dems have been forgiven for their part in the coalition and Labour for putting forward a loony antisemite as potential PM. That process has started later, is smaller, but has more room to grow.