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The extraordinary range of views of Nicola Sturgeon – politicalbetting.com

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  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865

    On the AZ vaccine: there have been quite a lot of reports of younger people getting more short-term side effects than older people - mostly mild and temporary, of course. Presumably this is because their immune systems react more strongly. There is also speculation that the rare blood clotting might be caused by an immune response attacking blood platelets, if I understand correctly.

    I wonder whether this implies that the dose should be reduced for younger recipients?

    It looks like it's the vector immune response as well since the J&J vaccine has also had some similar issues.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858
    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Good of Keir Starmer to focus on NHS, for which no local authorities in England are responsible for running.

    However, clip of veterans in blazers next to a war memorial will trigger the usual suspects.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,204

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,355
    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    LOL.

    Reminds me of the time I was wondering down Cornmarket Street, Oxford. I'd been out for a riding lesson, and had worn my black boots to the stables and back - less crap to carry. I was also wearing black riding jeans and, as it happened, a black collared shirt.

    I was a metalhead - seemed reasonable....

    It was only then that I realised such an ensemble might be open to interpretation.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,770
    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    "He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke."

    I dunno - that's precisely the way I eat bacon sandwiches, I moment of 'who cares'.

    Lord knows why he didn't say that.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,770

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Other interpretations of his role could be made.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,662
    edited April 2021
    Not such a bad day for some people for the AZN vaccine people.

    Prof Sarah Gilbert, the scientist who lead the team that created the Oxford/AstraZeneca coronavirus vaccine, is set for a payday of more than £20m as the biotech firm she co-founded prepares to float on the stock market in the US.

    Gilbert, who became a household name as a result of her work creating Oxford’s Covid-19 vaccine, owns 5.2% of Vaccitech, a Oxford University spin-out company that owns the biotechnology behind the AstraZeneca vaccine and others for Mers, hepatitis B, the virus that causes shingles, and a range of cancers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/apr/07/astrazeneca-vaccine-scientists-set-for-22m-payday-in-new-york-float
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Other interpretations of his role could be made.
    How so?
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,725
    I note the disparity between men and women's support of NS. Do we know whether The SNP has a bias in terms of male to female support?.

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,234
    edited April 2021

    Not such a bad day for some people for the AZN vaccine people.

    Prof Sarah Gilbert, the scientist who lead the team that created the Oxford/AstraZeneca coronavirus vaccine, is set for a payday of more than £20m as the biotech firm she co-founded prepares to float on the stock market in the US.

    Gilbert, who became a household name as a result of her work creating Oxford’s Covid-19 vaccine, owns 5.2% of Vaccitech, a Oxford University spin-out company that owns the biotechnology behind the AstraZeneca vaccine and others for Mers, hepatitis B, the virus that causes shingles, and a range of cancers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/apr/07/astrazeneca-vaccine-scientists-set-for-22m-payday-in-new-york-float

    It's taken the Guardian all this time to notice that?

    It's been in plenty of articles iirc.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,421
    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    It's not quite the relaxed out-on-the-town vibe they were presumably hoping for.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    edited April 2021
    stodge said:

    isam said:


    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090

    It's eating fish and chips - he seems to be doing it perfectly normally (sorry, boring). What would have been more "interesting" is if a gull had come down and tried to nick his chips as happened to me one evening in St Ives. In the eternal struggle between man and hot food devouring avian, it ended 1-0 to the bird.
    In St Ives they come for the whole pasty, not just the chips.

    https://www.stives-cornwall.co.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/StIvesBid_StIves-Seagulls-Signs-double-1.png
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    stodge said:

    isam said:


    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090

    It's eating fish and chips - he seems to be doing it perfectly normally (sorry, boring). What would have been more "interesting" is if a gull had come down and tried to nick his chips as happened to me one evening in St Ives. In the eternal struggle between man and hot food devouring avian, it ended 1-0 to the bird.
    Yes I agree he is doing it perfectly normally. I just think that it looks a bit like they have had an argument - doesnt matter really in the scheme of things I suppose

    1-0 to the Avian, reminds me of a song I used to sing at Highbury - not so much now
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    The photo seems simply illustrative to me. Yes, it could be better, but at least it's not like David Milliband eating a bacon sandwich or Pete Buttergieg eating pizza where it looks like they're trying to kill it with their teeth before eating it.

    It could all be improved by Keir's social media person stopping trying to do candid 'reportage' style shots and just going for 'smile for the camera' ones instead. They still wouldn't look natural but they wouldn't be meant to. And would look friendlier. Don't forget Boris pays a professional photographer.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,765
    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    Who took the photo though? The link is to the Plymouth Herald. So was it their photo? In which case out of Labour's hands what moment they captured?
  • PapillonPapillon Posts: 5
    DavidL said:

    Papillon said:

    FPT: Thanks for your thoughts @Foxy and @DavidL I have never considered refusing a vaccine and still wouldn't. The risk of death to me is low in either scenario. But I like to know as much as possible (hence the PB lurking).

    Aside from the cold logic of risk/benefit ratios, in terms of human psychology there will be a benefit of being able to say to my elderly relatives/shielding friends 'yes we've all been vaccinated', and see them relax somewhat when eventually we're able to visit them indoors.

    Completely agree with that and if the government proves brave enough to go against the consensus on PB and introduce vaccination certificates you want one.
    I will get a vaccination certificate if needed...I know I'm in the minority here but I honestly couldn't give a monkeys if I have to scan a QR code to get into an interesting venue. I already store health info on my phone, on Strava, I have a passport and I definitely had to get a vaccine to go abroad (Thailand I think), in the long distant past. What I do find utterly extraordinary, and unprecedented is that it is currently illegal for me to go round the corner to my best friend's house for a cup of tea, and that it has been so for months now. That's the kind of thing that bothers me, and it was inconceivable before last year. Even last spring, I was convinced that the public wouldn't put up with these sort of restrictions beyond June (2020). And yet here we are.
  • ChelyabinskChelyabinsk Posts: 500

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    Because the cornerstone fast food outlet on the Barbican is Cap'n Jaspers, always has been. But the visuals of fish and chips are much better - man of the people without looking vulgar, no risk of dropping fried onions down your designer coat, supporting British fishermen etc. etc....
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    The photo seems simply illustrative to me. Yes, it could be better, but at least it's not like David Milliband eating a bacon sandwich or Pete Buttergieg eating pizza where it looks like they're trying to kill it with their teeth before eating it.

    It could all be improved by Keir's social media person stopping trying to do candid 'reportage' style shots and just going for 'smile for the camera' ones instead. They still wouldn't look natural but they wouldn't be meant to. And would look friendlier. Don't forget Boris pays a professional photographer.

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    Who took the photo though? The link is to the Plymouth Herald. So was it their photo? In which case out of Labour's hands what moment they captured?
    I am not exactly comfortable in front of the lens myself, but if I were his PR team I would have pics of him looking like he is listening to/agreeing with the other bloke. Maybe it was out of their hands though, dont want to turn this into a big deal!
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Yeah thanks David. Because of that we got the rise of ISIS instead!
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    The photo seems simply illustrative to me. Yes, it could be better, but at least it's not like David Milliband eating a bacon sandwich or Pete Buttergieg eating pizza where it looks like they're trying to kill it with their teeth before eating it.

    It could all be improved by Keir's social media person stopping trying to do candid 'reportage' style shots and just going for 'smile for the camera' ones instead. They still wouldn't look natural but they wouldn't be meant to. And would look friendlier. Don't forget Boris pays a professional photographer.
    Poor Ed Miliband - he was so forgettable that even his most memorable moments are now attributed to his brother...
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,234

    "Nice trade agreement you have there. Shame if someone petitioned the German constitutional court with a well-written complaint..."

    https://twitter.com/Mij_Europe/status/1379814326928818177

    Germans are the new Walloons.

    TBF the normal process is that the German Constitutional Court normally backs down after having this sort of fit.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,204
    edited April 2021

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    Yes that seems to be it. He should be eating them like "Boris".

    Standing on one leg, tossing the chips up in the air and trying to catch them in his mouth.

    #charisma
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Yeah thanks David. Because of that we got the rise of ISIS instead!
    I think you'll find the rise of ISIS had many causes, most of which were rooted in Western intervention in the region, not in a lack of it. However, let's just chalk you up as in favour of bombing Syria, myself as not, and leave it there.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Yeah thanks David. Because of that we got the rise of ISIS instead!
    I think you'll find the rise of ISIS had many causes, most of which were rooted in Western intervention in the region, not in a lack of it. However, let's just chalk you up as in favour of bombing Syria, myself as not, and leave it there.
    Us abandoning Syria provided a vacuum that ISIS filled.

    But yes we won't convince each other.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    The photo seems simply illustrative to me. Yes, it could be better, but at least it's not like David Milliband eating a bacon sandwich or Pete Buttergieg eating pizza where it looks like they're trying to kill it with their teeth before eating it.

    It could all be improved by Keir's social media person stopping trying to do candid 'reportage' style shots and just going for 'smile for the camera' ones instead. They still wouldn't look natural but they wouldn't be meant to. And would look friendlier. Don't forget Boris pays a professional photographer.

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    Who took the photo though? The link is to the Plymouth Herald. So was it their photo? In which case out of Labour's hands what moment they captured?
    I am not exactly comfortable in front of the lens myself, but if I were his PR team I would have pics of him looking like he is listening to/agreeing with the other bloke. Maybe it was out of their hands though, dont want to turn this into a big deal!
    So essentially what you're saying is that Starmer's had his chips?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,204

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    I was talking Ed there, Lucky.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    Yes that seems to be it. He should be eating them like "Boris".

    Standing on one leg, tossing the chips up in the air and trying to catch them in his mouth.

    #charisma
    Even if Boris was actually thinking - 'This is disgusting, when do I get to eat something organic and drizzled in truffle oil'. :lol:
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,922
    Leon said:

    "A fifth fundamental force might help explain some of the big puzzles about the Universe that have exercised scientists in recent decades.

    "For example, the observation that the expansion of the Universe was speeding up was attributed to a mysterious phenomenon known as dark energy. But some researchers have previously suggested it could be evidence of a fifth force.

    "Prof Allanach has given the possible fifth force various names in his theoretical models. Among them are the "flavour force", the "third family hyperforce" and - most prosaic of all - "B minus L2"."


    May the B minus L2 be with you?

    Hmm. Prefer Flavour Force

    PB's physics teachers will be sending off for new wallcharts.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,355
    Papillon said:

    DavidL said:

    Papillon said:

    FPT: Thanks for your thoughts @Foxy and @DavidL I have never considered refusing a vaccine and still wouldn't. The risk of death to me is low in either scenario. But I like to know as much as possible (hence the PB lurking).

    Aside from the cold logic of risk/benefit ratios, in terms of human psychology there will be a benefit of being able to say to my elderly relatives/shielding friends 'yes we've all been vaccinated', and see them relax somewhat when eventually we're able to visit them indoors.

    Completely agree with that and if the government proves brave enough to go against the consensus on PB and introduce vaccination certificates you want one.
    I will get a vaccination certificate if needed...I know I'm in the minority here but I honestly couldn't give a monkeys if I have to scan a QR code to get into an interesting venue. I already store health info on my phone, on Strava, I have a passport and I definitely had to get a vaccine to go abroad (Thailand I think), in the long distant past. What I do find utterly extraordinary, and unprecedented is that it is currently illegal for me to go round the corner to my best friend's house for a cup of tea, and that it has been so for months now. That's the kind of thing that bothers me, and it was inconceivable before last year. Even last spring, I was convinced that the public wouldn't put up with these sort of restrictions beyond June (2020). And yet here we are.
    "inconceivable"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9MS2y2YU_o
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    I was talking Ed there, Lucky.
    I got the name wrong sorry - for David please read Ed all. How soon we forget!
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    LOL.

    Reminds me of the time I was wondering down Cornmarket Street, Oxford. I'd been out for a riding lesson, and had worn my black boots to the stables and back - less crap to carry. I was also wearing black riding jeans and, as it happened, a black collared shirt.

    I was a metalhead - seemed reasonable....

    It was only then that I realised such an ensemble might be open to interpretation.
    One of my favourite things about Oxford was the variety of dress, often witnessed within the same walk, someone walking to breakfast in pyjamas and someone returning from an all night ball/doing the walk of shame in their white tie.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,770

    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Other interpretations of his role could be made.
    How so?
    He's just very weak. Ed M is too.

    We should have supported the regime from day 1. And from day two offered a bit of help.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477

    isam said:

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    What's your issue here, that he was snapped doing this, or the fact that he isn't consuming his chips with sufficient Joie de Vivre?
    It just looks really stiff; two miserable, socially distanced blokes not looking at each other. I think Boris or Blair would make sure the photo had them tucking in enthusiastically whilst looking like they were engaged with the other person in the photo, rather than l picking at their food and stuck with someone they dont know.
    The photo seems simply illustrative to me. Yes, it could be better, but at least it's not like David Milliband eating a bacon sandwich or Pete Buttergieg eating pizza where it looks like they're trying to kill it with their teeth before eating it.

    It could all be improved by Keir's social media person stopping trying to do candid 'reportage' style shots and just going for 'smile for the camera' ones instead. They still wouldn't look natural but they wouldn't be meant to. And would look friendlier. Don't forget Boris pays a professional photographer.
    Poor Ed Miliband - he was so forgettable that even his most memorable moments are now attributed to his brother...
    Apologies again...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Other interpretations of his role could be made.
    How so?
    He's just very weak. Ed M is too.

    We should have supported the regime from day 1. And from day two offered a bit of help.
    I agree, and I meant Ed M.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
    Person who doesn't like Sturgeon believes polling that says lots of people like Sturgeon is wrong shocker.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,204

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    Yeah thanks David. Because of that we got the rise of ISIS instead!
    I think you'll find the rise of ISIS had many causes, most of which were rooted in Western intervention in the region, not in a lack of it. However, let's just chalk you up as in favour of bombing Syria, myself as not, and leave it there.
    You don't fancy a long and torrid tumble with Philip even though you're indisputably right and he's indisputably wrong?

    Good call.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,893
    Evening all :)

    Did I miss a YouGov showing the Conservative lead "slashed" by two points? And so it begins...

    Perhaps not.

    Not much changes in the Forsa and INSA polls from Germany - CDU/CSU on 27%. Forsa has Greens on 23% and SPD on 15% while INSA has Greens on 21% and SPD on 17%.

    I trust we've all been avidly following the Greenland elections. A very good result for the Inuit Ataqatigiit (IA), a democratic socialist separatist party who emerged the largest party winning 12 seats in the 31 seat Inartsisartut (Parliament). This was a gain of four seats and their best result since 2009.

    The governing social democratic party, Sisimut, gained one to 10 seats but will almost certainly be out of office. The centrist Naleraq party won four seats with the big losers were the Democrats (linked to the Radikale Venstre) losing half their seats to go to 3 leaving the other two seats to Attasut (linked to the Venstre party).

    Still waiting for the seat numbers from Bulgaria but the ruling GERB party down 6.5% and the big winners the populist ITN which came second with 18% and leaving the Socialists third with 15%. Not quite sure how this will develop in terms of the next Government.

    Finally, news from Sweden which is due to vote next year. The governing Social Democrats are on 27% and lead the Swedish Democrats on 22% and the Moderates on 20%.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    Alistair said:

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
    Person who doesn't like Sturgeon believes polling that says lots of people like Sturgeon is wrong shocker.
    I'm not saying it's wrong at all - on the contrary I am saying people do like her. However, I also think they are realising that her high heels are looking very much like clay. However there's nowhere to go because she embodies Scotland. Nationalist politics isn't really politics as we know it. We need different terms for it really.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,204

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    I was talking Ed there, Lucky.
    I got the name wrong sorry - for David please read Ed all. How soon we forget!
    Ok no probs.

    David was the banana not the bacon.

    #peoplearedeep
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,865
    edited April 2021
    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    Did I miss a YouGov showing the Conservative lead "slashed" by two points? And so it begins...

    Perhaps not.

    Not much changes in the Forsa and INSA polls from Germany - CDU/CSU on 27%. Forsa has Greens on 23% and SPD on 15% while INSA has Greens on 21% and SPD on 17%.

    I trust we've all been avidly following the Greenland elections. A very good result for the Inuit Ataqatigiit (IA), a democratic socialist separatist party who emerged the largest party winning 12 seats in the 31 seat Inartsisartut (Parliament). This was a gain of four seats and their best result since 2009.

    The governing social democratic party, Sisimut, gained one to 10 seats but will almost certainly be out of office. The centrist Naleraq party won four seats with the big losers were the Democrats (linked to the Radikale Venstre) losing half their seats to go to 3 leaving the other two seats to Attasut (linked to the Venstre party).

    Still waiting for the seat numbers from Bulgaria but the ruling GERB party down 6.5% and the big winners the populist ITN which came second with 18% and leaving the Socialists third with 15%. Not quite sure how this will develop in terms of the next Government.

    Finally, news from Sweden which is due to vote next year. The governing Social Democrats are on 27% and lead the Swedish Democrats on 22% and the Moderates on 20%.

    Do you know which of the Greenland parties are pro/anti-mining and which side won a majority? Thanks for the roundup, I really enjoy these btw.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,893
    TimT said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:


    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090

    It's eating fish and chips - he seems to be doing it perfectly normally (sorry, boring). What would have been more "interesting" is if a gull had come down and tried to nick his chips as happened to me one evening in St Ives. In the eternal struggle between man and hot food devouring avian, it ended 1-0 to the bird.
    In St Ives they come for the whole pasty, not just the chips.

    https://www.stives-cornwall.co.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/StIvesBid_StIves-Seagulls-Signs-double-1.png
    I confess I've never seen a gull lift a maxi-size Philp traditional pasty - they might have to team up. Don't get anyone started on power-to-weight ratios or we'll be talking about it all evening.

    It would however make a pleasant change from Scottish independence, Welsh politics and the football.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477
    Something that has been fun during lock down has been rediscovering my childhood by buying a Megadrive Mini - those who are about my age will have played one. It is a great little bit of kit, and for those who were never great at computer games, the save function is great for completing games where you never got past level 3 when you had it originally:
    https://youtu.be/-j34fHro5To

    Highly recommended.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,350
    Scott_xP said:
    Dear God, surely no-one can be so moronic to buy one of these.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,710

    isam said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090
    It's not quite the relaxed out-on-the-town vibe they were presumably hoping for.
    Bloody freezing probably accounts for it!
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,350

    On topic. If anyone in Scotland thinks the British PM will gain support by "playing nice" with Nicola in independence negotiations......"CTA? Nukes on the Clyde" "Customs Union? Nukes on the Clyde" "Currency Union? Foxtrot Oscar"......

    If I was advising Better Together or Boris Johnson I'd tell them to keep on to solely focus on the currency and other things like Sterlingisation.

    It is the one thing that really resonates, the pound in your pocket.

    Plus I suspect any UK government will publicly tell the markets that we will honour our debts if an IScotland won't honour their share of the debt.

    That will shoot a few foxes and causes problems for the Nats in their campaigns.

    But my colleagues and I don't know what we're talking about given looking at currency, debt, and legal related issues forms part of our day jobs.
    Usual crap, we will take the debts if we get the assets to go with it. No assets you can keep your debts.
  • Nice.

    An online casino player has won a High Court fight against Betfred's refusal to pay out his £1.7 million jackpot winnings.

    Andrew Green, 54, from Lincolnshire, said he was devastated and felt as though he had been "robbed" when Betfred told him it would not pay out, following his win in 2018 because of a "defect" in the game.

    He brought legal action against the firm at the High Court in London and, on Wednesday, a judge ruled in his favour.

    Following his victory Mr Green will finally receive his payout, plus interest.

    He said the past three years had felt "like hell on earth" and on hearing the ruling he felt "numb, very numb".

    He added: "I did nothing wrong, I played a game, I was congratulated for five days on being a millionaire, and then it was snatched away from me."

    Mr Green had played the game Frankie Dettori's Magic Seven Blackjack in January 2018 on an online platform hosted by Betfred.

    Having won £1,722,923.54 by the time he stopped playing, he tried to withdraw it - but his withdrawal was declined.

    Betfred's lawyers argued the bookmaker was not liable to pay because the game contained a "defect" which made it more likely to pay out higher sums in winnings than intended.

    But Mrs Justice Foster ruled in Mr Green's favour, finding that one of the terms and conditions set out by Betfred in the game, which was relied on by the firm in its defence to the claim, was "just not apt to cover the circumstances of this case at all".


    https://news.sky.com/story/man-wins-court-battle-over-betfreds-refusal-to-pay-out-16317m-jackpot-12268508
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Omnium said:

    DavidL said:

    A "with" of sexism? Maybe a "whiff"?

    A problem of using voice recognition rather typing. Thanks
    Are you now orbiting the earth and pondering us mere mortals? I can see you as a John Hurt like figure from 'First Contact'.

    PS. If you have Jodie Fosters phone number...
    001 562 765 1134
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    stodge said:

    TimT said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:


    The photo op of him eating fish and chips was Miliband-esque bad for someone trying to shed an image of being boring

    https://twitter.com/LukePollard/status/1379543115334361090

    It's eating fish and chips - he seems to be doing it perfectly normally (sorry, boring). What would have been more "interesting" is if a gull had come down and tried to nick his chips as happened to me one evening in St Ives. In the eternal struggle between man and hot food devouring avian, it ended 1-0 to the bird.
    In St Ives they come for the whole pasty, not just the chips.

    https://www.stives-cornwall.co.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/StIvesBid_StIves-Seagulls-Signs-double-1.png
    I confess I've never seen a gull lift a maxi-size Philp traditional pasty - they might have to team up. Don't get anyone started on power-to-weight ratios or we'll be talking about it all evening.

    It would however make a pleasant change from Scottish independence, Welsh politics and the football.
    I have power to weight ratio discussions with my wife who insists that a hawk can carry off our Jack Russell (who weighs 22lbs)

    I have had a gull take a large chunk of a pasty from me as I was taking a bite - both in Plymouth and in St Ives.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208

    Alistair said:

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
    Person who doesn't like Sturgeon believes polling that says lots of people like Sturgeon is wrong shocker.
    I'm not saying it's wrong at all - on the contrary I am saying people do like her. However, I also think they are realising that her high heels are looking very much like clay. However there's nowhere to go because she embodies Scotland. Nationalist politics isn't really politics as we know it. We need different terms for it really.
    If SNP Central Casting was tasked with finding Mr/Mrs Middle Scotland, they would come up with Nicola Sturgeon. It is quite remarkable and the secret to her success. Politicians are a strange breed but Ms Sturgeon is a prototype. She could be one of thousands of team leaders in a public sector organisation or large bank.

    She does have a husband problem however. Mr Sturgeon doesn't fit the prototype.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,477

    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?

    Agree, but I think Keir and his fish supper look fine. Solid 6.5/10. I'd hate to see him trying to look as if he's being transported to culinary heaven by it all, that would look dreadful. Them both turning to the camera and smiling would haved looked better.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858

    Alistair said:

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
    Person who doesn't like Sturgeon believes polling that says lots of people like Sturgeon is wrong shocker.
    I'm not saying it's wrong at all - on the contrary I am saying people do like her. However, I also think they are realising that her high heels are looking very much like clay. However there's nowhere to go because she embodies Scotland. Nationalist politics isn't really politics as we know it. We need different terms for it really.
    Lannisters and Starks?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204

    Nice.

    An online casino player has won a High Court fight against Betfred's refusal to pay out his £1.7 million jackpot winnings.

    Andrew Green, 54, from Lincolnshire, said he was devastated and felt as though he had been "robbed" when Betfred told him it would not pay out, following his win in 2018 because of a "defect" in the game.

    He brought legal action against the firm at the High Court in London and, on Wednesday, a judge ruled in his favour.

    Following his victory Mr Green will finally receive his payout, plus interest.

    He said the past three years had felt "like hell on earth" and on hearing the ruling he felt "numb, very numb".

    He added: "I did nothing wrong, I played a game, I was congratulated for five days on being a millionaire, and then it was snatched away from me."

    Mr Green had played the game Frankie Dettori's Magic Seven Blackjack in January 2018 on an online platform hosted by Betfred.

    Having won £1,722,923.54 by the time he stopped playing, he tried to withdraw it - but his withdrawal was declined.

    Betfred's lawyers argued the bookmaker was not liable to pay because the game contained a "defect" which made it more likely to pay out higher sums in winnings than intended.

    But Mrs Justice Foster ruled in Mr Green's favour, finding that one of the terms and conditions set out by Betfred in the game, which was relied on by the firm in its defence to the claim, was "just not apt to cover the circumstances of this case at all".


    https://news.sky.com/story/man-wins-court-battle-over-betfreds-refusal-to-pay-out-16317m-jackpot-12268508

    The 8% interest will be a nice top up
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    edited April 2021

    Nice.

    An online casino player has won a High Court fight against Betfred's refusal to pay out his £1.7 million jackpot winnings.

    Andrew Green, 54, from Lincolnshire, said he was devastated and felt as though he had been "robbed" when Betfred told him it would not pay out, following his win in 2018 because of a "defect" in the game.

    He brought legal action against the firm at the High Court in London and, on Wednesday, a judge ruled in his favour.

    Following his victory Mr Green will finally receive his payout, plus interest.

    He said the past three years had felt "like hell on earth" and on hearing the ruling he felt "numb, very numb".

    He added: "I did nothing wrong, I played a game, I was congratulated for five days on being a millionaire, and then it was snatched away from me."

    Mr Green had played the game Frankie Dettori's Magic Seven Blackjack in January 2018 on an online platform hosted by Betfred.

    Having won £1,722,923.54 by the time he stopped playing, he tried to withdraw it - but his withdrawal was declined.

    Betfred's lawyers argued the bookmaker was not liable to pay because the game contained a "defect" which made it more likely to pay out higher sums in winnings than intended.

    But Mrs Justice Foster ruled in Mr Green's favour, finding that one of the terms and conditions set out by Betfred in the game, which was relied on by the firm in its defence to the claim, was "just not apt to cover the circumstances of this case at all".


    https://news.sky.com/story/man-wins-court-battle-over-betfreds-refusal-to-pay-out-16317m-jackpot-12268508

    Yet another example of terms and conditions often being bullshit when challenged.

    Something that has been fun during lock down has been rediscovering my childhood by buying a Megadrive Mini - those who are about my age will have played one. It is a great little bit of kit, and for those who were never great at computer games, the save function is great for completing games where you never got past level 3 when you had it originally:
    https://youtu.be/-j34fHro5To

    Highly recommended.

    Great fun, and surprising how much one remembers from games not played for 20 years.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,221
    Papillon said:

    DavidL said:

    Papillon said:

    FPT: Thanks for your thoughts @Foxy and @DavidL I have never considered refusing a vaccine and still wouldn't. The risk of death to me is low in either scenario. But I like to know as much as possible (hence the PB lurking).

    Aside from the cold logic of risk/benefit ratios, in terms of human psychology there will be a benefit of being able to say to my elderly relatives/shielding friends 'yes we've all been vaccinated', and see them relax somewhat when eventually we're able to visit them indoors.

    Completely agree with that and if the government proves brave enough to go against the consensus on PB and introduce vaccination certificates you want one.
    I will get a vaccination certificate if needed...I know I'm in the minority here but I honestly couldn't give a monkeys if I have to scan a QR code to get into an interesting venue. I already store health info on my phone, on Strava, I have a passport and I definitely had to get a vaccine to go abroad (Thailand I think), in the long distant past. What I do find utterly extraordinary, and unprecedented is that it is currently illegal for me to go round the corner to my best friend's house for a cup of tea, and that it has been so for months now. That's the kind of thing that bothers me, and it was inconceivable before last year. Even last spring, I was convinced that the public wouldn't put up with these sort of restrictions beyond June (2020). And yet here we are.
    Yet here we are, basic freedoms gone and the public tolerate it - but why? Does just fear account for this or is obedience to authority the thing or what?
  • Pulpstar said:

    Nice.

    An online casino player has won a High Court fight against Betfred's refusal to pay out his £1.7 million jackpot winnings.

    Andrew Green, 54, from Lincolnshire, said he was devastated and felt as though he had been "robbed" when Betfred told him it would not pay out, following his win in 2018 because of a "defect" in the game.

    He brought legal action against the firm at the High Court in London and, on Wednesday, a judge ruled in his favour.

    Following his victory Mr Green will finally receive his payout, plus interest.

    He said the past three years had felt "like hell on earth" and on hearing the ruling he felt "numb, very numb".

    He added: "I did nothing wrong, I played a game, I was congratulated for five days on being a millionaire, and then it was snatched away from me."

    Mr Green had played the game Frankie Dettori's Magic Seven Blackjack in January 2018 on an online platform hosted by Betfred.

    Having won £1,722,923.54 by the time he stopped playing, he tried to withdraw it - but his withdrawal was declined.

    Betfred's lawyers argued the bookmaker was not liable to pay because the game contained a "defect" which made it more likely to pay out higher sums in winnings than intended.

    But Mrs Justice Foster ruled in Mr Green's favour, finding that one of the terms and conditions set out by Betfred in the game, which was relied on by the firm in its defence to the claim, was "just not apt to cover the circumstances of this case at all".


    https://news.sky.com/story/man-wins-court-battle-over-betfreds-refusal-to-pay-out-16317m-jackpot-12268508

    The 8% interest will be a nice top up
    They offered him £60,000 in 2018 in exchange for a NDA, he rejected it.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,350

    The Alba Party’s Alex Salmond is rated lower than Boris Johnson by Scottish voters. Just 9% say they are satisfied with Salmond, while 27% say the same of Johnson. 64% say they are dissatisfied with Salmond, and an identical proportion say the same of Johnson.

    https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/snp-retains-strong-lead-independence-dominates-voters-concerns

    People with shares in Sturgeon don't want that bubble to burst. Their strong disapprobation for people who threaten to do just that is clear. Within that very anger though is an inner-knowledge that it will burst, otherwise Salmond's activities wouldn't cause anything more than indifference. When it does, it will be spectacular, and will cover everyone within a 5 mile radius in acrid puss. The sensible have departed, the majority are still inside talking up their stock.
    They are bricking it Lucky, especially rabid unionists like Carlotta. Will be very interesting to see the results of the election and then the defections to ALBA if Sturgeon continues to ignore independence.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    No doubt some of the attendees will be quite crabby
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,662
    edited April 2021
    Here's the judgment in today's Betfred ruling.

    https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2021/842.html
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited April 2021

    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?

    Who TF cares that a subsample of x thinks y might hypothetically do z, apart from political nerds who like wondering about everything? But we do it all day every day.

    Who TF cares if its 'wild swimming' or just 'swimming'?! ;)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858
    dr_spyn said:
    I must confess I am tempted. You know, just in case the worst happens.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?

    Agree, but I think Keir and his fish supper look fine. Solid 6.5/10. I'd hate to see him trying to look as if he's being transported to culinary heaven by it all, that would look dreadful. Them both turning to the camera and smiling would haved looked better.
    I'm not a fan of Starmer - but there was absolutely nothing wrong with that picture.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Andy_JS said:
    Voting Tory is probably a serious crime to them... I only did it once, I am a first time offender!!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,587
    edited April 2021
    Those figures for Labour supporters being in favour of the death penalty are quite shocking IMO. I'm sure the percentage would have been lower 10 years ago.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,028
    malcolmg said:

    On topic. If anyone in Scotland thinks the British PM will gain support by "playing nice" with Nicola in independence negotiations......"CTA? Nukes on the Clyde" "Customs Union? Nukes on the Clyde" "Currency Union? Foxtrot Oscar"......

    If I was advising Better Together or Boris Johnson I'd tell them to keep on to solely focus on the currency and other things like Sterlingisation.

    It is the one thing that really resonates, the pound in your pocket.

    Plus I suspect any UK government will publicly tell the markets that we will honour our debts if an IScotland won't honour their share of the debt.

    That will shoot a few foxes and causes problems for the Nats in their campaigns.

    But my colleagues and I don't know what we're talking about given looking at currency, debt, and legal related issues forms part of our day jobs.
    Usual crap, we will take the debts if we get the assets to go with it. No assets you can keep your debts.
    What assets are you hoping to get?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    malcolmg said:

    On topic. If anyone in Scotland thinks the British PM will gain support by "playing nice" with Nicola in independence negotiations......"CTA? Nukes on the Clyde" "Customs Union? Nukes on the Clyde" "Currency Union? Foxtrot Oscar"......

    If I was advising Better Together or Boris Johnson I'd tell them to keep on to solely focus on the currency and other things like Sterlingisation.

    It is the one thing that really resonates, the pound in your pocket.

    Plus I suspect any UK government will publicly tell the markets that we will honour our debts if an IScotland won't honour their share of the debt.

    That will shoot a few foxes and causes problems for the Nats in their campaigns.

    But my colleagues and I don't know what we're talking about given looking at currency, debt, and legal related issues forms part of our day jobs.
    Usual crap, we will take the debts if we get the assets to go with it. No assets you can keep your debts.
    It's all going to be so simple isn't it :smiley:
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    I suspect there's a reason why Yes, Minister references dominate on this site.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,893
    MaxPB said:

    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    Did I miss a YouGov showing the Conservative lead "slashed" by two points? And so it begins...

    Perhaps not.

    Not much changes in the Forsa and INSA polls from Germany - CDU/CSU on 27%. Forsa has Greens on 23% and SPD on 15% while INSA has Greens on 21% and SPD on 17%.

    I trust we've all been avidly following the Greenland elections. A very good result for the Inuit Ataqatigiit (IA), a democratic socialist separatist party who emerged the largest party winning 12 seats in the 31 seat Inartsisartut (Parliament). This was a gain of four seats and their best result since 2009.

    The governing social democratic party, Sisimut, gained one to 10 seats but will almost certainly be out of office. The centrist Naleraq party won four seats with the big losers were the Democrats (linked to the Radikale Venstre) losing half their seats to go to 3 leaving the other two seats to Attasut (linked to the Venstre party).

    Still waiting for the seat numbers from Bulgaria but the ruling GERB party down 6.5% and the big winners the populist ITN which came second with 18% and leaving the Socialists third with 15%. Not quite sure how this will develop in terms of the next Government.

    Finally, news from Sweden which is due to vote next year. The governing Social Democrats are on 27% and lead the Swedish Democrats on 22% and the Moderates on 20%.

    Do you know which of the Greenland parties are pro/anti-mining and which side won a majority? Thanks for the roundup, I really enjoy these btw.
    Thank you for the kind word, my friend.

    No overall majority in the Inartsisartut (chance for us all to brush up on our Kalaallisut).

    The mining question relates presumably to the Kuannersuit site and the uranium and other rare earths discovered there. Kuannersuit is, as we know, near the settlement at Narsaq which in Kalaallisut means "Plain".

    The IA wanted a moratorium on uranium mining and that stance seems to have gone down well with the locals as they gained four seats. To be fair, the Sisimut Party, which supported mining, also made a gain of one seat.

    It seems possible IA and Naleraq will form a coalition but there could still be a pro-mining majority in the Inartsisartut as liberal and centre-right parties still have five seats and will likely back Sisimut so it's all finely balanced.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858
    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Mortimer said:

    DavidL said:

    I was slightly concerned before but now Starmer says its safe: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-56659036🤦‍♂️

    And he only wears white shirts when going to Plymouth, apparently.

    LOL.

    Reminds me of the time I was wondering down Cornmarket Street, Oxford. I'd been out for a riding lesson, and had worn my black boots to the stables and back - less crap to carry. I was also wearing black riding jeans and, as it happened, a black collared shirt.

    I was a metalhead - seemed reasonable....

    It was only then that I realised such an ensemble might be open to interpretation.
    One of my favourite things about Oxford was the variety of dress, often witnessed within the same walk, someone walking to breakfast in pyjamas and someone returning from an all night ball/doing the walk of shame in their white tie.
    In my final year, my room had a direct view on the Clarendon. Matriculation day was like watching waves after waves of human penguins
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    edited April 2021
    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    In fairness I did crop out the bit about which one you're 'most' obsessed with. So pick a favourite.

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    I suspect there's a reason why Yes, Minister references dominate on this site.
    Indeed.

    Though for me it is my favourite of the bunch because while the satire of The Thick of It was more biting (if hardly subtle), Yes Minister was more human. Hacker being flawed but generally trying to do the right thing, Humphrey being devious but ruthlessly competent, and Bernard trying to find the middle way, made them more sympathetic and real as people, as opposed to the cariactures of The Thick of It, who to me seemed to exist only to make a particular point. West Wing suffers from the inevitable result of 20+ episodes a season, Borgen was ok but could be dull, and House of Cards etc are just enjoyable trash.

    Yes Minister sticks with me more not only because it is so quotable and because of Nigel Hawthorne (though that helps), but because the characters worked (and they got rid of or used sparingly the ones who didn't, like Wiesel), making the points it made more powerful.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208

    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?

    Agree, but I think Keir and his fish supper look fine. Solid 6.5/10. I'd hate to see him trying to look as if he's being transported to culinary heaven by it all, that would look dreadful. Them both turning to the camera and smiling would haved looked better.
    I like the photo because it looks unstaged (whether it is or not). In normal times they would go to a restaurant unless they wanted a specific photo op, but with lockdown, propping yourself up on a railing while you eat your chips is kind of what you have to do.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858
    stodge said:

    MaxPB said:

    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    Did I miss a YouGov showing the Conservative lead "slashed" by two points? And so it begins...

    Perhaps not.

    Not much changes in the Forsa and INSA polls from Germany - CDU/CSU on 27%. Forsa has Greens on 23% and SPD on 15% while INSA has Greens on 21% and SPD on 17%.

    I trust we've all been avidly following the Greenland elections. A very good result for the Inuit Ataqatigiit (IA), a democratic socialist separatist party who emerged the largest party winning 12 seats in the 31 seat Inartsisartut (Parliament). This was a gain of four seats and their best result since 2009.

    The governing social democratic party, Sisimut, gained one to 10 seats but will almost certainly be out of office. The centrist Naleraq party won four seats with the big losers were the Democrats (linked to the Radikale Venstre) losing half their seats to go to 3 leaving the other two seats to Attasut (linked to the Venstre party).

    Still waiting for the seat numbers from Bulgaria but the ruling GERB party down 6.5% and the big winners the populist ITN which came second with 18% and leaving the Socialists third with 15%. Not quite sure how this will develop in terms of the next Government.

    Finally, news from Sweden which is due to vote next year. The governing Social Democrats are on 27% and lead the Swedish Democrats on 22% and the Moderates on 20%.

    Do you know which of the Greenland parties are pro/anti-mining and which side won a majority? Thanks for the roundup, I really enjoy these btw.
    Thank you for the kind word, my friend.

    No overall majority in the Inartsisartut (chance for us all to brush up on our Kalaallisut).

    The mining question relates presumably to the Kuannersuit site and the uranium and other rare earths discovered there. Kuannersuit is, as we know, near the settlement at Narsaq which in Kalaallisut means "Plain".

    The IA wanted a moratorium on uranium mining and that stance seems to have gone down well with the locals as they gained four seats. To be fair, the Sisimut Party, which supported mining, also made a gain of one seat.

    It seems possible IA and Naleraq will form a coalition but there could still be a pro-mining majority in the Inartsisartut as liberal and centre-right parties still have five seats and will likely back Sisimut so it's all finely balanced.
    Who did the Panserbjorn vote for?
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,725

    I must the only one who finds “politician eats food” stories utterly trite.

    I’m thinking of Sir Keir’s fish and chips, Ed’s bacon sarnie and Ozzy’s burger.

    Who TF cares?

    The point is that it was obviously a photo opportunity where the press won a famous victory. Ed looked a prat. He stabbed his brother in the back..purported to be the better leader, but in reality he looked a prat. Blame him and his PR team..

    The same sort of shite that Corbyn tried via not getting a seat on a train. The trouble was that most people thought that Corbyn was best suited to the guards van....
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    While not remotely a fan of UvdL, nether man comes well out of this.....

    https://twitter.com/MatinaStevis/status/1379810141126676488?s=20

    I don't think this is Erdogan's fault. Its surely on the EU to determine who their President is and they get the chair. If VDL is President then Michel had no business sitting there.
    It’s probably not his fault directly but he has some responsibility. Protocol departments exist for the purpose of this mix up not happening
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,355
    edited April 2021
    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    I dislike the reboot House of Cards because it piles stupidity up - a Machiavellian Democratic President who tries to set fire to the Democratic Party platform for... lols?

    It would have been much more interesting to see him use the policies supported by his party to his own advantage.

    The rest are all interesting in the their own ways.
  • I would not vote Labour if they supported the death penalty. Likewise any other party.

    Such an idea is a total abomination and must never be reintroduced.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Latest update - worst UK day so far (Germany multiple days, but Italy/Spain single days):

    https://www.politico.eu/coronavirus-in-europe/


  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,355

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    I suspect there's a reason why Yes, Minister references dominate on this site.
    Quotability - Yes Minister was full of punchlines, quite deliberately.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    kinabalu said:

    I remember participating in the 2015 general election in a borders town. The mention of her name and having influence on labour in Westminster had people in a rage. The perception of a weak Labour government pushed around by Nicola and the SNP was far more damaging to Ed Miliband than his capacity to eat a bacon sandwich.

    Unless the one perception fed the other. He did not eat a bacon sandwich like a proper bloke. The way he faffed around, he looked like the sort of pussy who could be bossed around by a woman. And the voters of Middle England didn't like that.
    David Milliband stopped us going to war in Syria, for which we should all be hugely grateful.
    How about Assad’s victims? Should they be grateful too?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858

    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    I dislike the reboot House of Cards because it piles stupidity up - a Machiavellian Democratic President who tries to set fire to the Democratic Party platform for... lols?

    It would have been much more interesting to see him use the policies supported by his party to his own advantage.

    The rest are all interesting in the their own ways.
    Does reboot mean the American version. I really liked the series with he who must not be named in them but kinda lost interest once he was booted out of the reboot.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    In fairness I did crop out the bit about which one you're 'most' obsessed with. So pick a favourite.

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    I suspect there's a reason why Yes, Minister references dominate on this site.
    Indeed.

    Though for me it is my favourite of the bunch because while the satire of The Thick of It was more biting (if hardly subtle), Yes Minister was more human. Hacker being flawed but generally trying to do the right thing, Humphrey being devious but ruthlessly competent, and Bernard trying to find the middle way, made them more sympathetic and real as people, as opposed to the cariactures of The Thick of It, who to me seemed to exist only to make a particular point. West Wing suffers from the inevitable result of 20+ episodes a season, Borgen was ok but could be dull, and House of Cards etc are just enjoyable trash.

    Yes Minister sticks with me more not only because it is so quotable and because of Nigel Hawthorne (though that helps), but because the characters worked (and they got rid of or used sparingly the ones who didn't, like Wiesel), making the points it made more powerful.
    The only ones I ever watched were The New Statesman and Spitting Image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,355
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    I dislike the reboot House of Cards because it piles stupidity up - a Machiavellian Democratic President who tries to set fire to the Democratic Party platform for... lols?

    It would have been much more interesting to see him use the policies supported by his party to his own advantage.

    The rest are all interesting in the their own ways.
    Does reboot mean the American version. I really liked the series with he who must not be named in them but kinda lost interest once he was booted out of the reboot.
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    kle4 said:

    I don't know about the principle argument, but I did like the idea of judging people based on which political show they like best.

    If you love Yes Minister, you’re sceptical about the motivations of the civil service, and expect a benign level of good natured bumbling from political leaders. You’re probably over 50 and you have no expectation that the government ever accomplishes much but you don’t mind.

    If you still love The Thick of It, then you think politicians, voters and the media are the problem. If you love Borgen, then you’re probably a Lib Dem: you want the small party to be in charge just because they’re centrists.

    I think the latest crop of special advisers are different. They’re more likely to be fans of the Netflix reboot of House of Cards, Scandal or Designated Survivor. They consider politics a ruthless game played by brilliant backstabbers. Government policy is largely subordinate to playing and winning the game.

    Those remaining die-hard West Wing addicts circulating in Westminster think they’re the good guys. They love the show, as Blair’s people did, because it shows good people trying to do the right thing, and mostly succeeding. They have fallen for what I call the Sorkin Delusion: that being clever, articulate and brave is the pathway to success


    https://unherd.com/thepost/westminster-has-a-west-wing-problem/

    And if you like all of them, like me, I take it your just confused?
    I dislike the reboot House of Cards because it piles stupidity up - a Machiavellian Democratic President who tries to set fire to the Democratic Party platform for... lols?

    It would have been much more interesting to see him use the policies supported by his party to his own advantage.

    The rest are all interesting in the their own ways.
    Does reboot mean the American version. I really liked the series with he who must not be named in them but kinda lost interest once he was booted out of the reboot.
    I presumed the American series.

    The writing just more and more stupid.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    DavidL said:

    dr_spyn said:
    I must confess I am tempted. You know, just in case the worst happens.
    In case they become compulsory.....
This discussion has been closed.