One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
I think this is the key point, if I was told that tomorrow I could get jabbed with an AZ dose I'd be making my appointment immediately. One of the things I'm worried about is that the EMA has said it is looking into this issue with all of the vaccines so it may need to put the warning label on all of them given that the FDA has noted a similar rate of this side effect from Pfizer and Moderna. What may end up happening is that the EMA undermine all of the three major vaccines available to Europeans by saying there is an infinitesimally small chance of getting a blood clot that also has a tiny chance of being data and that it applies to all of the vaccines.
I was thinking the opposite. If it stops people singling out AZ that might be a positive.
I don't know. Perhaps hearing a senior politician saying "there is cause for concern"?
We’re from the government. We’re here to help.
That one is just plain dumb. I find it hard to believe even small staters buy that, it just comes across as disingenuous given all the things even they like the government doing.
I believe the distinction for small staters (who let’s be honest are as fond of government money as the next person as v.recent history demonstrates) is that the money should come to them direct unimpeded by any government view on how it should be utilised.
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
One interesting thing, which I haven't seen any data on so far (not surprising as these are small numbers with disclosure risks wouldn't expect it to be public) is who these relatively young people getting the vaccination were - in countries that are generally not so far advanced as here in vaccinating the population. Did they have other underlying health conditions, increasing vulnerability to Covid that got them priority. If so, are these conditions relevant to any possible side effects?
And, if so, are these younger people mostly getting AZN due to the lack of use of AZN in older cohorts in some of these countries - i.e. would an apparent lack of such events for Pfizer or example be due to not many of these younger people getting Pfizer?
Well, well, well. Specifically stated on the Beeb that the delay is in Indian produced vaccine.
Nothing, nada, zilch to do with the EU.
But the company itself says there aren't any delays of any type. Very confusing.
I thought they said that they were on track to meet all their contractual commitments/targets. But if these were surplus supply...
Thing is the U.K. vaccine programmes and suggestions of when certain groups would be vaccinated has been speeding up. It has been assumed that this is because the original plans were deliberately cautious to allow for setbacks. It could also be because we have been receiving more vaccine than we were expecting.
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
I think this is the key point, if I was told that tomorrow I could get jabbed with an AZ dose I'd be making my appointment immediately. One of the things I'm worried about is that the EMA has said it is looking into this issue with all of the vaccines so it may need to put the warning label on all of them given that the FDA has noted a similar rate of this side effect from Pfizer and Moderna. What may end up happening is that the EMA undermine all of the three major vaccines available to Europeans by saying there is an infinitesimally small chance of getting a blood clot that also has a tiny chance of being data and that it applies to all of the vaccines.
There's probably a big cultural difference here between Americans and Europeans. In the US, you can see warnings in restaurants that the food is carcinogenic, but no-one cares.
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
I think this is the key point, if I was told that tomorrow I could get jabbed with an AZ dose I'd be making my appointment immediately. One of the things I'm worried about is that the EMA has said it is looking into this issue with all of the vaccines so it may need to put the warning label on all of them given that the FDA has noted a similar rate of this side effect from Pfizer and Moderna. What may end up happening is that the EMA undermine all of the three major vaccines available to Europeans by saying there is an infinitesimally small chance of getting a blood clot that also has a tiny chance of being data and that it applies to all of the vaccines.
I was thinking the opposite. If it stops people singling out AZ that might be a positive.
I think it just ends up as becoming more ammunition for anti-vaxxers. Unfortunately the Europeans aren't taking a balance of risks approach like the MHRA and FDA which ends up in all of these unnecessary pauses and ultimately undermines the whole programme.
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
I think this is the key point, if I was told that tomorrow I could get jabbed with an AZ dose I'd be making my appointment immediately. One of the things I'm worried about is that the EMA has said it is looking into this issue with all of the vaccines so it may need to put the warning label on all of them given that the FDA has noted a similar rate of this side effect from Pfizer and Moderna. What may end up happening is that the EMA undermine all of the three major vaccines available to Europeans by saying there is an infinitesimally small chance of getting a blood clot that also has a tiny chance of being data and that it applies to all of the vaccines.
Agreed. Though actually they haven't, AFAIK, seen this with the other vaccines. They've seen other similar blood disorders: ...A somewhat similar blood disorder, called immune thrombocytopenia (ITP), has been seen in at least 36 people in the United States who had received the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines against COVID-19, The New York Times recently reported. The U.S. Food and Drug Administration said it was investigating these cases, but also said the syndrome did not appear to be more common in vaccinated people, and immunizations in the United States have continued. But Madsen says the cases seen in Europe in recent weeks are distinct from ITP, which lacks the widespread blood clots seen in the European patients...
In this case, the platelet depletion (thrombocytopenia) seems to be a direct consequence of massive systemic clotting.
I think it overstates his decisive role in Brexit, but the subtle appeal of a deliberately shambolic approach is perceptive. Berlusconi, Bolsanaro and Trump have all used similar cut-the-crap-just-listen-to-me styles, but Johnson is more likeable than any of those, without negating the basic point that it's a deliberate technique. The closest left-wing counterpart I can think of is Ken Livingstone, though there must be others. Generally left-wingers are boringly earnest (glances in mirror). Should we learn to be shambolic?
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
We're still taking about tiny numbers per million; perhaps the trials weren't big enough?
If think if you work through the logic, the trials wouldn't pick it up.
The issue seems to be blots occurring if you have Covid (or have had Covid / long Covid?) and then have the vaccine.
At the time the trial was taking place it's very unlikely that that set of circumstances that seem to be the issue would occur - as most people hadn't had Covid or any chance of catching it, it was looking for the opposite and anyone with Covid was ruled out from the trial.
It's only now, a year later with Covid spreading around the general population and millions of people being vaccinated that the circumstances of being vaccinated while suffering from Covid is a real possibility.
Oh, that's interesting. Science is great.
If that's the issue, would there be any mileage in doing a LFT before having the jab?
One point of difference between UK and EU usage of the AZN vaccine is that up until the last week or so, the UK has vaccinated a much older cohort than has been the case in much of Europe, where the vaccine was not approved for use in those over 65.
Whether that is significant or not is a matter of conjecture, but this (from the article I posted above) made me wonder. ...Madsen believes the unusual symptoms may be the result of “a very strong immunological reaction.” Acute infections can trigger clotting and bleeding, sometimes culminating in DIC, Wendtner notes. But abnormal clotting is also a feature of COVID-19. It’s possible, Wendtner says, that the unusual cases had a COVID-19 infection before they got vaccinated; many were health care workers and teachers who may have been exposed at work. Coming on top of the infection, the vaccine might somehow have triggered an overreaction by the immune system, sparking the clotting syndrome. Ganser thinks patients suffering from CVT may be the tip of the iceberg and that more people may suffer similar, but milder, symptoms.
If there really is a link between the vaccine and the blood disorders, Brodsky says a lot of evidence points to a crucial role for the complement system. Dysregulation of that system can lead to diseases that Brodsky terms “complemenopathies.” “What complementopathies have in common is: They all have thrombosis as part of it, they all have thrombocytopenia as part of it, they all have relative resistance to traditional anticoagulants and they all have triggers such as infections, inflammation, pregnancy, cancer, vaccines.”...
We know inflammatory immune responses to the vaccines tend to be stronger in younger individuals, so it might be a possible explanation of why Europe has noticed these small clusters of these peculiar symptoms and we haven't.
Further to which, the reason for alarm in the original cluster in Norway was the relative youth of those affected.
This is interesting because, AIUI, one of the problems with the initial trials was that only relatively few (8%?) people were over 65.
So the younger cohorts were well represented in the trial data.
Good morning, everyone.
There's no certainty about any of this. These are very small numbers indeed - and the symptoms, while extremely rare, are known also to be associated with Covid itself - and while it's not unusual for rare side effects to show up after clinical trials, once a medication goes into general use, there is no conclusive evidence that these are vaccine side effects.
If I were due an AZN jab tomorrow, it wouldn't stop me getting it.
It will be interesting to see what the EMA has to say today.
One interesting thing, which I haven't seen any data on so far (not surprising as these are small numbers with disclosure risks wouldn't expect it to be public) is who these relatively young people getting the vaccination were - in countries that are generally not so far advanced as here in vaccinating the population. Did they have other underlying health conditions, increasing vulnerability to Covid that got them priority. If so, are these conditions relevant to any possible side effects?
And, if so, are these younger people mostly getting AZN due to the lack of use of AZN in older cohorts in some of these countries - i.e. would an apparent lack of such events for Pfizer or example be due to not many of these younger people getting Pfizer?
Impossible to say for sure, I think, though it's a possibility. AFAIK, there were several healthcare workers among the casualties, so increased likelihood of infection, rather than underlying health conditions.
"Pfizer and AstraZeneca deny domestic coronavirus vaccine shortage
Drugs giants Pfizer and AstraZeneca have rejected an NHS claim that the UK is facing a COVID-19 vaccine shortage, insisting there is no threat to supplies. The two leading vaccine manufacturers both said they remain on course to meet their delivery commitments and denied they were facing disruption in supplies. Their defiant statements appeared to contradict a letter to vaccination centres from NHS England warning there will be a "significant reduction" in supplies next month."
Instinct is that both can be true. NHS could have been hoping for a scaling up in supplies to outpace the need for second jabs. “Shortfall” is being misrepresented as “reduction”.
Or it could just all be expectations management. Or simply somebody somewhere along the line made a miscalculation on supply versus need (most likely explanation...)
The uncertainty over this is awful. The government has to tell us what's going on.
I feel compelled to repeat something i wrote yesterday (vanity about quality of my contributions)
"Here's the thing though. This is hugely irresponsible reporting as usual by journalists (no surprise to see LauraK at the forefront) desperate to break a story before being in control of the facts.
So you get a leaked letter about a slow down in supply and/or the vaccine programme (it's not clear). How about doing some proper journalism and getting a complete picture before splashing the story as "breaking news" on the BBC? And then putting the Health Secretary on the spot to come out with instant comments that will clearly not be complete and can be packaged however you want them.
As it is she's "broken" the story, and is now left coming out with random tweets trying to fill in the gaps to try and establish whether this actually is or isn't a big deal."
Or insist that the Government is fully transparent, despite there be many potentially good reasons for them not wanting to be so.
Today's Times headline disingenuously portrays correlation as causation...
"Setback for Britain’s vaccine rollout. Under-50s have programme paused as EU calls for ‘fair share’"
Curiously, The Times have now amended that headline to read...
"Setback for Britain’s vaccine rollout. Programme paused for under-50s as manufacturer hints at future delays"
Against that someone’s address is often public record. And he didn’t “threaten” he turned up and said “please take down the piece calling me anti-Semitic and islamsphobic”.
So rather than reach straight for lawyers he tried to resolve the problem amicably.
Why is that a bad thing?
Politicians get copies of the full electoral register - including details of people who have asked to keep their names off the public register - and the rules on what they can and can't use it for are very strict.
Yes. But you don’t know that’s where he got the address.
The guy's two complaints appear to be that he doesn't know how the MP's aide got his address, and that he felt intimidated. The latter suggests the exchange may have been less than amicable. The former, you're right that we don't know, but using the electoral register software is by far the easiest way for an MP's office to locate someone in their patch.
The clip on social media - which is all I have seen - comes across the other way round.
I don't know. Perhaps hearing a senior politician saying "there is cause for concern"?
We’re from the government. We’re here to help.
That one is just plain dumb. I find it hard to believe even small staters buy that, it just comes across as disingenuous given all the things even they like the government doing.
To those angry with the government’s opaque communication:
The situation is in some ways not dissimilar to a government refusing to discuss battle minutiae in a war.
When the uk vax programme was trickling along in early Jan, I remember coming here pretty frustrated and saying a competent government would be trying to buy some of India’s production, despite India’s assurances to their own people that they wouldn’t export any. Looks like pretty quietly, this is exactly what the Uk government did. They can’t now loudly disclose that we won’t hit our stretch-on-stretch targets because of a problem in India.
Further the timing of the announcement / leak suspiciously coincides with UvdL’s manic statement yesterday. There may be an element of domestic expectations management that we will be stockpiling Pfizer second doses in anticipation of a potential export ban, but also it’s messaging to the Commission that we’re now struggling with supply just as much as you, with the aim of delaying any blockade.
Finally there’s unspecified talk of a large batch needing to be retested, which I imagine is perfectly normal. You don’t want to talk too loudly about that either so as not to give credibility to the anti vaxxers. Read the comments on the Daily Mail and you’ll see what I mean, they already feel the wind in their sails and need no extra encouragement.
In short, I know it’s hard but cut the government some slack and trust that they’re playing the cards they have as well as they can, in all our interests.
Import from India to the EU of course isn’t allowed, as per the EU-AZ contract...
Isn't it?
But the EU have been inspecting SII vaccine production facilities with a view to importing vaccine.
I recall a clause allowing AZ to use other facilities apart from the 4 identified, with EU agreement, but not one the other way.
That's my understanding too. And the EU (and us) currently uses lots of vaccines imported from the SII.
I was wondering who was behind Covid-19 Bereaved Families for Justice pressure group. From a quick look at some of the organizers, its looks like another (non) Independent SAGE type group.
Its a great idea,. we can then find out why the the NHS packed all those people back off to nursing homes and why and what the failings of NHS were in helping us to a very large number of deaths. But we wont because no one wants to lift that rock.
We will blame the politicians 100%, not the wonks, or the doctors who advise and devise nor point out that we are a fat nation
With respect. That wouldn't be a "full" one. All those things would be good to know for next time. I know, I know.
“The next time” sending the elderly off to nursing homes could be the right decision. That’s the whole problem. It was (highly probably - hospitals were/are very dangerous places for non infected people) the wrong decision this time because of the particular features of Covid 19. Features which were clearly poorly understood at the time, and indeed still don’t be, given there is still a high focus on clean hands and surfaces which at best seems to be a minor effect on virus spread (and not nearly enough on fresh air and ventilation). A different virus, with different characteristics and maximum hospital capacity could be THE defining need.
People talk about the nursing home decisions as officials acting like callous murderers deliberately seeking to kill tens of thousands of people. A balanced enquiry has to look at why those decisions were made, and whether without the benefit of hindsight such decisions might, could or should have been different. There is an enormous risk that the battle against a future pandemic will be lost because eg. We use fighting COVID as the template and discover that we’re fighting some completely different.
Judgements were made, some proved to be wrong, and it would be worth understanding why.
My instinct is that the reaction to the Italian crisis with its overflowing hospitals triggered an over-reaction here, with everything subordinated to the objective of avoiding hospitals collapsing, even where it had the effect of pushing up overall infections and mortality. Hence all the early focus on creating extra pop up hospitals out of nowhere, which in the event were hardly used, while other more critical priorities like proper PPE and test and trace were neglected.
Indeed - but inquiries (which have to happen) are very emotive things, because of the two, largely incompatible drivers behind them. One being to learn lessons (and the right ones), and the other being “people must be held accountable”.
Indeed. The initial enquiries need to be run along the lines of a transport accident enquiry, looking at how decisions were made, what led to the holes in the Swiss cheese lining up on this occasion, and - most importantly - what can we learn in both the short term and long term, to prevent the problems that occurred from happening in the future.
A proper inquiry, of course, should also look at what went right as well as what went wrong.
I always ask my people for bad news. By and large you learn 100x more from your mistakes than your successes.
Off topic (and possibly only of interest to rcs100). Though our car has barely been used for a year the insurance renewal was up significantly from last year. But I found an insurance that's based on a fixed cost for a parked car with added marginal cost per mile driven. It involves a device plugged into the ODB2 port (news to me) which is tucked away in the recesses near the pedals, which tells how far the car has been driven. I have a suspicion that the greatly reduced use of cars in the pandemic will stimulate this kind of insurance going forward (which our car hasn't been for a while!).
Comments
And, if so, are these younger people mostly getting AZN due to the lack of use of AZN in older cohorts in some of these countries - i.e. would an apparent lack of such events for Pfizer or example be due to not many of these younger people getting Pfizer?
F1: first look at Jeddah:
https://twitter.com/adamcooperF1/status/1372474146102345729
Thing is the U.K. vaccine programmes and suggestions of when certain groups would be vaccinated has been speeding up. It has been assumed that this is because the original plans were deliberately cautious to allow for setbacks. It could also be because we have been receiving more vaccine than we were expecting.
Though actually they haven't, AFAIK, seen this with the other vaccines. They've seen other similar blood disorders:
...A somewhat similar blood disorder, called immune thrombocytopenia (ITP), has been seen in at least 36 people in the United States who had received the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines against COVID-19, The New York Times recently reported. The U.S. Food and Drug Administration said it was investigating these cases, but also said the syndrome did not appear to be more common in vaccinated people, and immunizations in the United States have continued. But Madsen says the cases seen in Europe in recent weeks are distinct from ITP, which lacks the widespread blood clots seen in the European patients...
In this case, the platelet depletion (thrombocytopenia) seems to be a direct consequence of massive systemic clotting.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2021/mar/18/all-hail-the-clown-king-how-boris-johnson-made-it-by-playing-the-fool
I think it overstates his decisive role in Brexit, but the subtle appeal of a deliberately shambolic approach is perceptive. Berlusconi, Bolsanaro and Trump have all used similar cut-the-crap-just-listen-to-me styles, but Johnson is more likeable than any of those, without negating the basic point that it's a deliberate technique. The closest left-wing counterpart I can think of is Ken Livingstone, though there must be others. Generally left-wingers are boringly earnest (glances in mirror). Should we learn to be shambolic?
If that's the issue, would there be any mileage in doing a LFT before having the jab?
AFAIK, there were several healthcare workers among the casualties, so increased likelihood of infection, rather than underlying health conditions.
"Setback for Britain’s vaccine rollout. Programme paused for under-50s as manufacturer hints at future delays"
“Please take down your blog”
“F*** off. Sue me”
“I’m just trying to resolve this”
“Send me a letter before action”