This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
Boris isn't behind what local Councils decide their local Schools provide. Hence why Chartwells are advertising for schools to choose them for their catering - it isn't centrally provided.
Just because some people rush to assumptions, should we all?
I think a more likely solution is that an amateur either in the school or local council has done something on the cheap by themselves cutting corners.
Philip, there are now dozens of these photos from all across the country. Follow @BootstrapCook - or Rashford - to see. And Chartwells have been in trouble for exactly this BEFORE
The money we’re paying for food is not getting to the kids. If it’s a cock up people should be sacked, if it’s blatant profiteering - and it does look quite bad - they should be investigated.
Dozens of photos of people saying they got this.
Not dozens of photos of contracts saying this was provided by Chartwells at £30 per head. There's a difference.
They're not even charging schools £30 for their hamper listed on their website. So how do you know the school chose to pay £30 on this "hamper" in the photo?
She can have a view on it, she cant unilaterally decide her view is the law. It is perfectly legal to exercise by running:
from work to home from support bubble to work from shops to home from education location to any of the above
etc. If I was being petulant I would also point out there are some who need to exercise their eyes by travelling 350 miles.
It is also entirely lawful (and reasonable) to exercise by running:
from somewhere you've driven to that is appropriate to exercise in and back to your car again.
Yes and no. The real world problem police like in Derbyshire are trying to prevent is large numbers of people choosing the same location. The longer the distance allowed and the looser the guidelines, the more likely it is that everyone will congregate on the same small number of beauty spots.
Admittedly we are probably safe in today's miserable weather
Beautiful weather outside now. Looking forward to getting out at lunchtime.
And surely using the gravity model of exercise (?!), the further away a place, the fewer people are likely to congregate there?
Just because it's far away from you, doesn't mean it's far away from other people, outlining the flaw in the gravity model nicely for everyone there.
"The longer the distance allowed".
ie it's far away from everyone. Very few people live in the Peak District vs Rotherham or Manchester.
Birmingham is a pretty long distance travelled for me, won't find many Londoners congregating there either but it doesn't mean it will be empty. That's why the gravity model is so discredited. It's underlying assumption of distance as a factor in anything is extremely outdated.
The Peak District is, other things being equal, empty. If I am in Stoke or Rotherham or London I would likely find other areas before I hit the Peak District. If I live adjacent to the Peak District I would likely go to the Peak District and not Hampstead Heath.
I think "so discredited" as a theory is not quite right although there are likely as many papers suggesting modifications or alternatives as proposing the central premise.
As I said on the previous thread though, the problem with the guidelines as they are being interpreted by the police is that they are encouraging people to exercise within the cities - which are generally crowded and where it is extremely difficult to go for a walk without passing at least a few people - rather than travelling to a rural location where they can exercise without, in all likelihood, meeting anyone at all - except an overzealous copper trying to fine you £200.
As for the Peak district, one of the things I remember about Sheffield is that if you live on the west side of the city then in a few minutes you can be up into the hills The same applies to many industrial towns in west Yorkshire as well.
Retail Price Morrisons £30 box - including delivery - presumably councils could get them cheaper:
Mozza's food box was really good. Our local Italian deli started a £40 per month subscription service including delivery which is incredible. A box that even our own @Cyclefree would want.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Looking at the outcomes to date, the gradient of relative risk by age for both death and hospitalisation looks to be something similar to this:
We keep looking at the black line and saying that when we get low enough on the axis (going from right to left in vaccinations), we can declare victory. But the rec line is closer to where the covid death risk would naturally be - because that's where you get so seriously ill as to need hospital, and dexamethasone, or tocilizumab, or sarilumab, or hooked up to a CPAP machine, or to be regularly proned, or even attached to a ventilator.
And all of that effort pushes that red line all the way down to the black line, where with all the effort we can give, we can't push it further down.
It's an important note that co-morbidities have far less effect on hospitalisation risk than death risk. Quite possibly because they could get in the way of treatment, I guess.
The debate is at what point we can let the black line spring up towards the red one - because that's what happens when the hospitals are overwhelmed and can't do their thing of pushing the red line down to the black one.
What is their effect on hospitalisations? I can't find an official source for that.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
Actually, the government has made detailed specifications. They’re just not being followed.
As others have said, why not just go straight to the supermarkets. They are huge and powerful and expert, they can source the food and deliver it at value, and they do not have a track of fucking this up (unlike Chartwells).
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
What happened to the £15 weekly Online gift card system? After some initial hiccups it was working perfectly well by the end of the Summer. It had the advantage of simplicity. Involving supermarkets delivering food. Something they might be expected to be quite good at.
Quite. Morrison’s do an excellent free meal ‘hamper’ for about £20. Link them with Amazon or Ocado. Sorted.
My taxes are paying for poor kids to go deliberately underfed, during a plague, so someone can make a fat profit. Grrrr
This was the unfortunate first reaction from the Tory MP for Cleveland. Any normal human would say at least ‘gosh, this looks bad’
I'm reminded of the character of, I believe, Moist von Lipwig musing in Discworld that the local Watch would probably prefer if everyone spent all their time indoors with their hands on the table where everyone could see them at all times.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
Boris isn't behind what local Councils decide their local Schools provide. Hence why Chartwells are advertising for schools to choose them for their catering - it isn't centrally provided.
Just because some people rush to assumptions, should we all?
I think a more likely solution is that an amateur either in the school or local council has done something on the cheap by themselves cutting corners.
Philip, there are now dozens of these photos from all across the country. Follow @BootstrapCook - or Rashford - to see. And Chartwells have been in trouble for exactly this BEFORE
The money we’re paying for food is not getting to the kids. If it’s a cock up people should be sacked, if it’s blatant profiteering - and it does look quite bad - they should be investigated.
Agree on that, but that is surely simply in the nature of huge 5-year-plan type schemes run nationally? That's just how it works - or doesn't work.
Several years ago I was looking at External Wall Insulation for a house, biggish government grant administered locally. 4-6k grant available.
Quote via company administering LA scheme - 14k with 5k grant. Quote direct via the company actually doing the work - 9k.
Looking at the outcomes to date, the gradient of relative risk by age for both death and hospitalisation looks to be something similar to this:
We keep looking at the black line and saying that when we get low enough on the axis (going from right to left in vaccinations), we can declare victory. But the rec line is closer to where the covid death risk would naturally be - because that's where you get so seriously ill as to need hospital, and dexamethasone, or tocilizumab, or sarilumab, or hooked up to a CPAP machine, or to be regularly proned, or even attached to a ventilator.
And all of that effort pushes that red line all the way down to the black line, where with all the effort we can give, we can't push it further down.
It's an important note that co-morbidities have far less effect on hospitalisation risk than death risk. Quite possibly because they could get in the way of treatment, I guess.
The debate is at what point we can let the black line spring up towards the red one - because that's what happens when the hospitals are overwhelmed and can't do their thing of pushing the red line down to the black one.
What is their effect on hospitalisations? I can't find an official source for that.
Slightly on topic. I've always been supportive of COVID related restrictions and I don't identify as a libertarian. However the current 'guidance' on what constitutes local exercise and Cressida Dick's latest comments on the subject are absurd. She states in an interview today:
"I would just say that people need to try to stay local. For me, a reasonable interpretation of that is that if you can - I appreciate some people can’t, but if you can - go for your exercise from your front door and come back to your front door. "
The problem is that if your personal interpretation of what staying local is differs from whatever police officer catches your eye then your own reasons don't matter. It's simply wrong to hand out legally enforceable penalties for a difference of opinion over guidance.
I agree with Mike that the outrage over Boris is absurd but at the same time I can't help but think that he's the author of his own misfortune. If what constitutes reasonable exercise had been more thought out or codified in law then there wouldn't be any doubt as to whether Boris' cycle ride was acceptable or not.
Great news on the vaccines, maybe this is what everyone should be talking about.
4th in the world on vaccines per capita, behind two small nations and one tiny one, and well ahead of all the G20 and EU27 nations.
Sadly, good news doesn’t generate clicks or sell papers.
The cycle-wank is BECAUSE of this good news on vaccines. There are some whose minds are so swimming in hatred, they just cannot bear the idea of our PM being seen to do a great job on something, for once. Especially when that something is the biggest challenge facing our nation.
So there must be chaff thrown out, to hide the positive. Even at the cost of being made to look total pillocks. Retaining ther reputation doesn't matter. Trashing the PM's does.
They are going to totally lose their shit when the voters mark his Covid scorecard: "Good start, lousy middle, strong finish."
I think that you will find that voters are infamously ungrateful.
The UK is doing well on vaccines because we do have an NHS that is specifically designed for such purposes.
Government vaccine policy has been far from perfect though, and in particular the single dose gambit could come very unstuck if it fails to suppress the disease.
It's mad that we are not doing a trial comparing the single and double dose approach. Genuinely a decision that could save hundreds of thousands of lives.
We basically are, so long as we're collecting sufficient data.
Again, the issue was raised on the last How to Vaccinate the World podcast.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
Its an Oxford College? Ah ok, the only "St Annes" I could think of was the geriatric retirement village on the Fylde.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
You break people down so you can then build them back up.
Frequently budget cuts mean you only get the first part done, but I tell you, 50% is still a good outcome.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Welcome to food boxes? Have you seen the markup on stuff like Gousto or Hello Fresh? It's a great money making scheme.
Some of the takeaway boxes from restaurants were absolutely ridiculous. My sister gave my brother in law a, err, talking to when he got a £30 box from a restaurant which we then had to make at home for just 3 people. The raw ingredients from Sainsbury's would have come to about £8-10.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I am sure that is not mandatory and that he can still do something useful with his life.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
The argument - and I am sure there will be a tiny smidgen of truth but not enough to justify their decision - is that some parents would not use vouchers/tax credits for buying food for their kids but will instead use not for buying fags, booze etc.
The problems with this argument are many and varied. On a philosophical level you are infantilising the population by claiming that just because they are poor they are not able to behave like adults. More importantly, if you really were that concerned about this then you would make the system such that the vouchers could only be exchanged for food at Supermarkets etc.
But forethought, principle and common sense have never featured highly with governments - either this one or any other.
I know that we have all adopted the mental image of Gordon Brittas as Keir Starmer. With his increasing "it isn't true!" strops I can't help picturing Rick off the Young Ones for Philip.
Which is a complement Philip. Rik Mayall was a genius.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Ah. I get it. And yes - feck ‘em.
This kind of story plays REALLY badly for the Tories. Much worse than Boris taking a not-that-long bike ride. They should be all over it, fast.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
What happened to the £15 weekly Online gift card system? After some initial hiccups it was working perfectly well by the end of the Summer. It had the advantage of simplicity. Involving supermarkets delivering food. Something they might be expected to be quite good at.
Quite. Morrison’s do an excellent free meal ‘hamper’ for about £20. Link them with Amazon or Ocado. Sorted.
My taxes are paying for poor kids to go deliberately underfed, during a plague, so someone can make a fat profit. Grrrr
This was the unfortunate first reaction from the Tory MP for Cleveland. Any normal human would say at least ‘gosh, this looks bad’
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Wonderful! With luck, he'll be able to have a normal experience by then - or, as Max Beerbohm phrased it, having all the nonsense that was knocked out of him at school gently put back at Oxford
Yes, congrats indeed. And as Mr Blue says, it's to be hoped that the student experience is somewhat nearer the norm by then. On a personal note Grandson Two has now collected three offers to read History; Exeter (Uni), Bristol and Manchester. Think he's putting Exeter first, and I'm a little concerned that he was influenced by me telling him it had a reputation for 'posh totty'.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
Actually, the government has made detailed specifications. They’re just not being followed.
As others have said, why not just go straight to the supermarkets. They are huge and powerful and expert, they can source the food and deliver it at value, and they do not have a track of fucking this up (unlike Chartwells).
They have taken (deservedly) shit about this at every stage, reluctantly and belatedly dragged to do the right thing by a Premier League footballer, for goodness sake. This one time they get ahead of the game by announcing that they will ensure that school meals or equivalent will be provided and now they are in the brown stuff again. Whatever the rights and wrongs of this, and with the internet you can never be completely sure, it is politics at its most inept. Pathetic.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
Given the extensive family connections, apparently, did he have a quiet word with the top brass?
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Wonderful! With luck, he'll be able to have a normal experience by then - or, as Max Beerbohm phrased it, having all the nonsense that was knocked out of him at school gently put back at Oxford
Yes, congrats indeed. And as Mr Blue says, it's to be hoped that the student experience is somewhat nearer the norm by then. On a personal note Grandson Two has now collected three offers to read History; Exeter (Uni), Bristol and Manchester. Think he's putting Exeter first, and I'm a little concerned that he was influenced by me telling him it had a reputation for 'posh totty'.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
Following the discussion last night on "why can't we let down all restrictions after the under-70s/under-60s/under-50s/under-40s are vaccinated?"
I took a look at that ONS page with the terrible data visualisation between infections, hospitalisations, and deaths, and translated the hospitalisations into raw numbers.
(Warning: up to date info on the age category numbers was only available for the UK as a whole and the data was for hospitalisations in England; I used it as an approximation as England's population is such a big proportion of the whole (82%) and it is likely that the age breakdown of hospitalisations won't be hugely different over the whole UK).
Conclusion: between the last week in November and the start of January:
The number of under-44 year olds hospitalised in w/e 3rd January was greater than the number of 85+ year olds hospitalised in w/e 29 November
The number of 45-64 year olds hospitalised in w/e 3rd January was larger than the number of 85+ year olds and 75-84-year-olds hospitalised in w/e 29 November put together.
This. Completely uncontrolled, COVID would overwhelm hospitals, even for "lower risk" groups.
I find people dying in the street untidy. Especially if it is me.
You might need to show your working. Remember that thousands of younger people will be vaccinated as part of the priority groups, as part of Group 6. By the time run through the priority vaccinations, the only people who remain are under 50s with no comorbidities – a group for whom the risk from Covid is very low indeed.
What's the IFR for those groups without hospital assistance (the "natural" IFR)? I mean, they're not in hospital for fun.
I make it that the approximate risk of hospitalisation for a 47-year-old (which I do look at, because I'm 47) is around 2.0%, compared to a death rate of under 0.2%. Assuming that hospitalisation occurs because it is needed to protect life (otherwise, why hospitalise them?), the natural IFR for someone in their late forties would be considerably closer to 2% than 0.2%.
We often quote the "about 1%" IFR for the virus as a whole and then say "but that's heavily skewed by the elderly" The hospitalisation rate looks to go past 1% at around age 37. Hospitalisation rates are a lot less subject to co-morbidities. They seem to be more likely to what will push you over the edge into death even when hospitalised.
If hospitals get overwhelmed, we will find out first hand what the natural IFR (without medical intervention) actually is. And it is nowhere near as low as it is with medical intervention, and the difference is overwhelmingly likely to be greatest for the young and those without co-morbidities (age and co-morbidities are what makes medical intervention less likely to help).
Here's a graphic to show the difference in hospitalisation by age and how it changed between the end of November and the start of January.
Your graph isn't a great deal of use for this discussion, because yet again it captures everyone in those age groups, rather than just those without underlying health conditions.
How many people under 40/under 50, nationwide, without comorbidities, have
a) died and b) been hospitalised
by Covid 19?
I have a good idea on a), as the NHS publishes this data (it's a remarkably low number). But we need to know b) – and I'm not sure there is an official source for it?
47% of those in hospital had no comorbidities. Not stratified by age, but of course elderly people are *unlikely* to have no comorbidities at all, so I suspect that a majority of young patients in hospital have none.
I think you are mistaken in believing that patients under 50, and even under 40, with no comorbidities are rarely in hospital. They rarely die, if they receive good treatment, but they need that treatment.
--AS
Supposition.
You might be right, you might well be wrong.
You certainly don't know.
The key question is: What percentage of Under 40s/Under 50s without comorbidities who contract covid end up requiring hospital treatment?
You don't know the answer to that and your statistics don't tell you, because, as you yourself say, they capture ALL people in those age groups.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Ah. I get it. And yes - feck ‘em.
This kind of story plays REALLY badly for the Tories. Much worse than Boris taking a not-that-long bike ride. They should be all over it, fast.
Aha, devious Boris did the bike thing intentionally then, to distract from it. Poor stupid media.
I know that we have all adopted the mental image of Gordon Brittas as Keir Starmer. With his increasing "it isn't true!" strops I can't help picturing Rick off the Young Ones for Philip.
Which is a complement Philip. Rik Mayall was a genius.
Well I've seen no evidence it is true and your only response was one confirming that it is not their specification. I even then offered you a charity bet to the charity of your choice, suggesting a food bank, but there was no response on that. So oh well, what can I say, it smells like suspicious bullshit to me.
I think someone has done something very dodgy but I'm sceptical we will find out (or it will be reported) who that is. I don't for one second believe this has been charged £30 for and if it has then that is extremely dodgy given that a very different alternative is listed without negotiations for £23 by the same company.
I am sceptical by nature. Most Twitter outrage ends up being bullshit.
"He thought that the presidency would enrich him. Instead, it may well lead to his bankruptcy."
"The further that this swindler recedes from the presidency, the clearer it will become that he was running a criminal operation for his own benefit. He didn’t work for the government. The government worked for him."
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Welcome to food boxes? Have you seen the markup on stuff like Gousto or Hello Fresh? It's a great money making scheme.
Some of the takeaway boxes from restaurants were absolutely ridiculous. My sister gave my brother in law a, err, talking to when he got a £30 box from a restaurant which we then had to make at home for just 3 people. The raw ingredients from Sainsbury's would have come to about £8-10.
You do know which industry I work in, lol. Foodservice is notorious for its wild wacky prices on some lines on some contracts. Yes you add value in the form of a brand name (like Gousto) and in the packing operation, the rest is profit.
Contract Catering? A notorious killing ground for the pirates unless you point to the price being offered, show them just how much they are taking the piss, then the price drops to something sensible. Way way back as a junior field sales grunt for Nestle I got in trouble for giving "Asda" as the answer to an enquiry about which local wholesaler was the cheapest source of bulk Easter Eggs.
They were an'all. Enterprising local store manager happy to punt Eggs out the loading bay door into a van by the pallet load. Never touched the shop floor. Even selling them at the full retail price he was still way cheaper than any of the local contractors.
What happened to the £15 weekly Online gift card system? After some initial hiccups it was working perfectly well by the end of the Summer. It had the advantage of simplicity. Involving supermarkets delivering food. Something they might be expected to be quite good at.
Quite. Morrison’s do an excellent free meal ‘hamper’ for about £20. Link them with Amazon or Ocado. Sorted.
My taxes are paying for poor kids to go deliberately underfed, during a plague, so someone can make a fat profit. Grrrr
This was the unfortunate first reaction from the Tory MP for Cleveland. Any normal human would say at least ‘gosh, this looks bad’
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I am sure that is not mandatory and that he can still do something useful with his life.
Make sure he makes friends with all those on the same course though - could be in line for some nice government contracts in due course.
Keir Starmer will have to resign after May’s local elections because he will severely underperform what Ed Miliband achieved on Derbyshire county council in 2013 when Labour when 43 out of 65 then. Labour will be lucky to make gain decent gains in High Peak and Belper and not lose any seats especially in NE Derbyshire which bigjohnowls will attest to.
Why do you think he'll do so badly? The current opinion polls are okay for the party.
I'm sure you're aware but the north of the East Midlands has seen one of the biggest Labour -> Tory swings in the whole of the country. That's at general level, the locals *were* more Labour so it'll be interesting to see if they follow suit. Turnout will be appalling I think.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
You break people down so you can then build them back up.
Frequently budget cuts mean you only get the first part done, but I tell you, 50% is still a good outcome.
Spot on. To build you first have to dig. We have managed that, and that must be a source of pride for the hole country.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Ah. I get it. And yes - feck ‘em.
This kind of story plays REALLY badly for the Tories. Much worse than Boris taking a not-that-long bike ride. They should be all over it, fast.
Yes, it needs an answer pretty soon. If the government had paid £30 for this food then this might be the mud that sticks. The PPE stuff hasn't largely because people recognised an emergency situation. The government has had months to plan this box and had a perfectly working situation before of £15 Asda food vouchers. That it has ended up giving a contract to a company owned by a donor that looks to be providing extremely poor value for money and it involves kids supposedly going hungry and Marcus Rashford it feels like something that wil stick unless they fix it now and either force Chartwells to send a proper box, the government gets a refund and pays Asda or Morrisons to do it or it's pinned on some council deciding to pocket the difference between the cost of this box from Chartwells and the £30 per box funding that is available.
I know that we have all adopted the mental image of Gordon Brittas as Keir Starmer. With his increasing "it isn't true!" strops I can't help picturing Rick off the Young Ones for Philip.
Which is a complement Philip. Rik Mayall was a genius.
Well I've seen no evidence it is true and your only response was one confirming that it is not their specification. I even then offered you a charity bet to the charity of your choice, suggesting a food bank, but there was no response on that. So oh well, what can I say, it smells like suspicious bullshit to me.
I think someone has done something very dodgy but I'm sceptical we will find out (or it will be reported) who that is. I don't for one second believe this has been charged £30 for and if it has then that is extremely dodgy given that a very different alternative is listed without negotiations for £23 by the same company.
I am sceptical by nature. Most Twitter outrage ends up being bullshit.
What makes me laugh is how you are desperately trying to deflect onto <£15 of food for £23 as if that is an acceptable use of public money. The only question here is to what degree are Chartwells ripping us off.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Wonderful! With luck, he'll be able to have a normal experience by then - or, as Max Beerbohm phrased it, having all the nonsense that was knocked out of him at school gently put back at Oxford
Yes, congrats indeed. And as Mr Blue says, it's to be hoped that the student experience is somewhat nearer the norm by then. On a personal note Grandson Two has now collected three offers to read History; Exeter (Uni), Bristol and Manchester. Think he's putting Exeter first, and I'm a little concerned that he was influenced by me telling him it had a reputation for 'posh totty'.
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Certainly no excuse for it to be even worse this time around, that's for certain.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
Why not? Most Tory MPs are. Witness the idiot Simon Clarke voting against handing out actual vouchers to parents and then attacking the people pointing at the bullshit alternative solution his lot have handed to their mates.
With this government we know there is ALWAYS a party donor or donation in the background. Its open corruption.
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Just to clarify please, is this the first time round, or now?
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
I think of this as "Rashford's area" now. When an issue arises relating to underprivileged children I wait for his take, and until I hear it I feel the issue is not being attended to. Quite an odd thing really.
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Just to clarify please, is this the first time round, or now?
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
I think of this as "Rashford's area" now. When an issue arises relating to underprivileged children I wait for his take, and until I hear it I feel the issue is not being attended to. Quite an odd thing really.
Well, he is the most effective member of the Opposition, so why not?
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Just to clarify please, is this the first time round, or now?
At the time the supermarkets couldn't meet the demands of the public delivery slots, let alone every oldie / vulnerable person. So just have morrisons or Tescos deliver there £30 box scheme was out of the questions.
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
A shielding friend of mine (cancer) down in Devon, got hers, and it was truly terrible. She sent me a photo. Some old bread, margarine, a few tins of beans, jelly sweets, crap biscuits, almost zero nutrition. She just gave it away
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
In contrast a shielding old friend of mine in St Ives in Cornwall - well Carbis Bay - was getting magnificent food boxes. They were organised by a local charity but then the local baker was supplementing them with cakes, pies and pastries. He was getting fatter by the week.
I don't know where the food boxes came from up here in Lincolnshire. They were good but I did get a call from one old lady who we were keeping an eye on who was quite upset because this food parcel had arrived on her doorstep with no explanation and she thought it must be a mistake as there were no indications at all of what it was or why it was there. Poor dear was frightened she was going to get into trouble if she used it and it was supposed to be for someone else.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
Good luck to the copper for doing it, and to your Dad for being able to go that fast round Piccadilly!
What makes me laugh is how you are desperately trying to deflect onto less than £15 of food for £23 as if that is an acceptable use of public money. The only question here is to what degree are Chartwells ripping us off.
I'm not desperate. Its up to schools what they do as far as I know.
Food boxes never cost the same as retail, I think everyone expects that. But there is a complete world of difference between what was posted claiming it was £30 - and for £23 providing 30 pieces of fruit and vegetables, a loaf of bread, 2 blocks of cheese, 6 cans and 9 snacks.
If it was up to me as I've said all along people would get cash and spend it as they want to do so and be responsible for themselves and there would be no food boxes. It isn't up to me though.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
Holy cow, 38mph? My bike computer informs me I once hit 51kph. I remember it too, screaming down hill in a 30 zone towards a roundabout. Some tosser still overtook me, despite me being over the speed limit and running out of road before the roundabout. 31mph on a bike is not fun. When you're pushed into the gutter by an idiot trying to squeeze between you and the bollards in the middle of the road, it's downright terrifying. I think I did a Dura Ace and peed myself a little.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
I think of this as "Rashford's area" now. When an issue arises relating to underprivileged children I wait for his take, and until I hear it I feel the issue is not being attended to. Quite an odd thing really.
Well, he is the most effective member of the Opposition, so why not?
Given his ability to get things done he's one of the more effective members of the government as well.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
Welcome to food boxes? Have you seen the markup on stuff like Gousto or Hello Fresh? It's a great money making scheme.
Some of the takeaway boxes from restaurants were absolutely ridiculous. My sister gave my brother in law a, err, talking to when he got a £30 box from a restaurant which we then had to make at home for just 3 people. The raw ingredients from Sainsbury's would have come to about £8-10.
You do know which industry I work in, lol. Foodservice is notorious for its wild wacky prices on some lines on some contracts. Yes you add value in the form of a brand name (like Gousto) and in the packing operation, the rest is profit.
Contract Catering? A notorious killing ground for the pirates unless you point to the price being offered, show them just how much they are taking the piss, then the price drops to something sensible. Way way back as a junior field sales grunt for Nestle I got in trouble for giving "Asda" as the answer to an enquiry about which local wholesaler was the cheapest source of bulk Easter Eggs.
They were an'all. Enterprising local store manager happy to punt Eggs out the loading bay door into a van by the pallet load. Never touched the shop floor. Even selling them at the full retail price he was still way cheaper than any of the local contractors.
My point being that £23 for ~£15 worth of stuff isn't a huge deal given the industry, £30 for ~£5 worth of stuff is a problem, especially given that the owner of said company is a donor and the tender process is probably expedited under the emergency measures.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
Holy cow, 38mph? My bike computer informs me I once hit 51kph. I remember it too, screaming down hill in a 30 zone towards a roundabout. Some tosser still overtook me, despite me being over the speed limit and running out of road before the roundabout. 31mph on a bike is not fun. When you're pushed into the gutter by an idiot trying to squeeze between you and the bollards in the middle of the road, it's downright terrifying. I think I did a Dura Ace and peed myself a little.
Assuming his bragging on here is based in fact, it was probably Dura Ace who overtook you.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
Following the discussion last night on "why can't we let down all restrictions after the under-70s/under-60s/under-50s/under-40s are vaccinated?"
I took a look at that ONS page with the terrible data visualisation between infections, hospitalisations, and deaths, and translated the hospitalisations into raw numbers.
(Warning: up to date info on the age category numbers was only available for the UK as a whole and the data was for hospitalisations in England; I used it as an approximation as England's population is such a big proportion of the whole (82%) and it is likely that the age breakdown of hospitalisations won't be hugely different over the whole UK).
Conclusion: between the last week in November and the start of January:
The number of under-44 year olds hospitalised in w/e 3rd January was greater than the number of 85+ year olds hospitalised in w/e 29 November
The number of 45-64 year olds hospitalised in w/e 3rd January was larger than the number of 85+ year olds and 75-84-year-olds hospitalised in w/e 29 November put together.
This. Completely uncontrolled, COVID would overwhelm hospitals, even for "lower risk" groups.
I find people dying in the street untidy. Especially if it is me.
You might need to show your working. Remember that thousands of younger people will be vaccinated as part of the priority groups, as part of Group 6. By the time run through the priority vaccinations, the only people who remain are under 50s with no comorbidities – a group for whom the risk from Covid is very low indeed.
What's the IFR for those groups without hospital assistance (the "natural" IFR)? I mean, they're not in hospital for fun.
I make it that the approximate risk of hospitalisation for a 47-year-old (which I do look at, because I'm 47) is around 2.0%, compared to a death rate of under 0.2%. Assuming that hospitalisation occurs because it is needed to protect life (otherwise, why hospitalise them?), the natural IFR for someone in their late forties would be considerably closer to 2% than 0.2%.
We often quote the "about 1%" IFR for the virus as a whole and then say "but that's heavily skewed by the elderly" The hospitalisation rate looks to go past 1% at around age 37. Hospitalisation rates are a lot less subject to co-morbidities. They seem to be more likely to what will push you over the edge into death even when hospitalised.
If hospitals get overwhelmed, we will find out first hand what the natural IFR (without medical intervention) actually is. And it is nowhere near as low as it is with medical intervention, and the difference is overwhelmingly likely to be greatest for the young and those without co-morbidities (age and co-morbidities are what makes medical intervention less likely to help).
Here's a graphic to show the difference in hospitalisation by age and how it changed between the end of November and the start of January.
Your graph isn't a great deal of use for this discussion, because yet again it captures everyone in those age groups, rather than just those without underlying health conditions.
How many people under 40/under 50, nationwide, without comorbidities, have
a) died and b) been hospitalised
by Covid 19?
I have a good idea on a), as the NHS publishes this data (it's a remarkably low number). But we need to know b) – and I'm not sure there is an official source for it?
47% of those in hospital had no comorbidities. Not stratified by age, but of course elderly people are *unlikely* to have no comorbidities at all, so I suspect that a majority of young patients in hospital have none.
I think you are mistaken in believing that patients under 50, and even under 40, with no comorbidities are rarely in hospital. They rarely die, if they receive good treatment, but they need that treatment.
--AS
Supposition.
You might be right, you might well be wrong.
You certainly don't know.
The key question is: What percentage of Under 40s/Under 50s without comorbidities who contract covid end up requiring hospital treatment?
You don't know the answer to that and your statistics don't tell you, because, as you yourself say, they capture ALL people in those age groups.
So largely meaningless for this discussion.
My reference debunks your claim that under 40s/50s without comorbidities are at very low risk of hospitalization, up to the small uncertainty of the age stratification of comorbidities in hospital. You can do the Bayes calculation yourself if you want to know rates, but for public policy the important part is this: vaccinating all those with comorbidities (including children) would reduce hospitalization by at most 53% and likely by considerably less in younger patients. In other words, it buys less than one doubling period of a spreading disease.
I know you don't like it because it contradicts your tediously-repeated position that all restrictions must end immediately when the most at-risk have been vaccinated. However, I have now given some evidence in favour of my position. You have given none. If you want to argue otherwise then do your own research and show the evidence.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
To be fair to the police, it was the land speed record.....
What makes me laugh is how you are desperately trying to deflect onto less than £15 of food for £23 as if that is an acceptable use of public money. The only question here is to what degree are Chartwells ripping us off.
I'm not desperate. Its up to schools what they do as far as I know.
Food boxes never cost the same as retail, I think everyone expects that. But there is a complete world of difference between what was posted claiming it was £30 - and for £23 providing 30 pieces of fruit and vegetables, a loaf of bread, 2 blocks of cheese, 6 cans and 9 snacks.
If it was up to me as I've said all along people would get cash and spend it as they want to do so and be responsible for themselves and there would be no food boxes. It isn't up to me though.
"As far as you know" being wrong where there is already an external contractor appointed by the LEA/cluster of LEAs.
The point of buying in bulk - a food box - is to bring in convenience of everything in one place. Volume does drive discount though - if I ordered that lot at £14.75 Tesco would employ someone to go round the store, pack it into a green crate and then deliver it to me at a loss. Saying that £23 for the same to a Tory donor is you desperately defending the indefensible.
There are two aims - feed hungry kids, and be prudent with taxpayers money. Food to kids has to be nutritious by law so you can't just hand out any old crap. This whole exercise manages to fail on every part except for the excess profits for Tory donors.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
But you do see a reason why they might want to lie. Well, you should. I think it's probably best to reserve judgement. An anonymous accusation followed by a carefully worded non-denial gives me a sense where I think this will end up, but it would be foolish to go all in in either direction right now.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
Lol - it not meeting their specification is not saying "so this cannot have come from us" you berk. It can be both.
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
Holy cow, 38mph? My bike computer informs me I once hit 51kph. I remember it too, screaming down hill in a 30 zone towards a roundabout. Some tosser still overtook me, despite me being over the speed limit and running out of road before the roundabout. 31mph on a bike is not fun. When you're pushed into the gutter by an idiot trying to squeeze between you and the bollards in the middle of the road, it's downright terrifying. I think I did a Dura Ace and peed myself a little.
When I was a teenager I had a Puch step-through 49cc moped. I could maybe hit 30mph downhill with a following wind.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
I think of this as "Rashford's area" now. When an issue arises relating to underprivileged children I wait for his take, and until I hear it I feel the issue is not being attended to. Quite an odd thing really.
If he and his management team can keep up the tone and approach he has taken on these issues he has a bright future as a campaigner. It feels like a lot of groups could learn something from it - there's many things out there which need addressing but the way it is approached can be counter productive.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
Its an Oxford College? Ah ok, the only "St Annes" I could think of was the geriatric retirement village on the Fylde.
Used to be all women's, I think. But mixed now, like all of them.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
They didn't say their firm didn't provide it. Will be interesting to see what comes out in the wash.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
But you do see a reason why they might want to lie. Well, you should. I think it's probably best to reserve judgement. An anonymous accusation followed by a carefully worded non-denial gives me a sense where I think this will end up, but it would be foolish to go all in in either direction right now.
Whom do I think is more likely lying: A company putting its reputation on the line, that has social media and the regular media out to get to the bottom of it if they are lying - or a random person on Twitter that a cursory glance at their own Tweets shows they're an extremist partisan who shares other bollocks lies and mistruths regularly? 🤔
Of more concern to me is why the government is not insisting on a negative Covid test for travellers from Ireland, given the very high rates of infection there.
Also why are the courts still insisting that lawyers have to attend courts for hearings which are perfectly doable remotely? There have been a number of cases of people catching Covid as a result.
I don't trust the police to understand or enforce the rules fairly. But some people are certainly taking the piss. Common-sense is what is needed. I could easily walk for 3 hours outside my front door well beyond 7 miles without seeing a living soul. In London it is that much harder to go for exercise without being close to people.
The key message must surely be this: when you absolutely have to go out wear a mask and try and stay as far away as possible from other people.
Cycling 7 miles in London is nothing. That was my daily one way commute when I cycled to work regularly. But driving somewhere to cycle seems a bit off when there are plenty of parks nearby where the PM could run, walk or cycle (though some of the Royal Parks can be a bit sniffy about cyclists so that might explain it).
Anyway it is a gorgeous day here so I am off to the hills.
There was a time (no idea if that's still the case) where you could theoretically get fined for biking in the Royal Parks. Of course, most cyclists completely ignore that moronic rule and nothing bad happens to them. However, a mate once somehow manage to get fined – he remains to this day the only person I have ever known to actually be fined. He is the sort of bloke that is forever an outlier!
Has any cyclist ever been fined for breaking the speed limit? It's 20mph in most London Boroughs. Cyclists regularly exceed this but never seen one done for it.
My dad was once arrested for breaking the speed limit on Piccadilly while on a pedal bike
That would be a cockup - speed limits do not apply to pushbikes.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
Holy cow, 38mph? My bike computer informs me I once hit 51kph. I remember it too, screaming down hill in a 30 zone towards a roundabout. Some tosser still overtook me, despite me being over the speed limit and running out of road before the roundabout. 31mph on a bike is not fun. When you're pushed into the gutter by an idiot trying to squeeze between you and the bollards in the middle of the road, it's downright terrifying. I think I did a Dura Ace and peed myself a little.
When I was a teenager I had a Puch step-through 49cc moped. I could maybe hit 30mph downhill with a following wind.
Great news on the vaccines, maybe this is what everyone should be talking about.
4th in the world on vaccines per capita, behind two small nations and one tiny one, and well ahead of all the G20 and EU27 nations.
Sadly, good news doesn’t generate clicks or sell papers.
The cycle-wank is BECAUSE of this good news on vaccines. There are some whose minds are so swimming in hatred, they just cannot bear the idea of our PM being seen to do a great job on something, for once. Especially when that something is the biggest challenge facing our nation.
So there must be chaff thrown out, to hide the positive. Even at the cost of being made to look total pillocks. Retaining ther reputation doesn't matter. Trashing the PM's does.
They are going to totally lose their shit when the voters mark his Covid scorecard: "Good start, lousy middle, strong finish."
I think that you will find that voters are infamously ungrateful.
The UK is doing well on vaccines because we do have an NHS that is specifically designed for such purposes.
Government vaccine policy has been far from perfect though, and in particular the single dose gambit could come very unstuck if it fails to suppress the disease.
It's mad that we are not doing a trial comparing the single and double dose approach. Genuinely a decision that could save hundreds of thousands of lives.
We basically are, so long as we're collecting sufficient data.
Again, the issue was raised on the last How to Vaccinate the World podcast.
We are not. No one is. We should be.
They will have the data for an open label study.
I wonder... Records of who was vaccinated - yes (at least, I certainly hope so). Records of positive Covid tests - are these kept centrally with IDs? I'm not aware that they are, but may be wrong - interested to know, if so. It would a lot of sense epidemiologically. You'd be able to get records of COVID diagnoses from primary care (is Covid in Read* now?) and hospital (is Covid in ICD-10 yet? If so, is it applied by NHS?) and of course on death certificates, but all that misses the many people getting Covid who won't require any medical intervention.
* I assume it is - I once discovered, looking up Batten's disease, that Battenburg cake (choking on) is in Read!
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
They didn't say their firm didn't provide it. Will be interesting to see what comes out in the wash.
How could they say their firm didn't provide it when they don't know which school it was? It isn't their specification is surely as far as they can go without more data.
Won't stop partisan hacks on Twitter and their echo chamber multipliers running away with it though in the meantime. I agree it will be very interesting to see what come out in the wash.
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Congratulations, David, or to Jnr rather, but PPE at Oxford carries the very grave risk of ending up in the cabinet. So you do need to keep an eye on him.
I have a working hypothesis that attending Oxford ruins your mind. But I'm not 100% sure about it.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
I think you've just got to make sure you don't fall in with a bad lot.
Easy to spot - that sheen on the cheeks, the insistent voice, the unlampoonable hair.
Off to the nearest beach with the dog. It's about 5 miles away. I shall not be taking hot drinks (and certainly not a Scotch egg) - but if you haven't heard from me by late afternoon, send lawyers, guns and money....
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
Lol - it not meeting their specification is not saying "so this cannot have come from us" you berk. It can be both.
Of course it can. Unlikely I expect but we will see.
You though seem to want to run away with the idea it must be them, and I'm crazy for being sceptical about Tweets from someone who clearly regularly shares Twitter mistruths. But are ignoring my multiple suggestions for a charity bet if we do get to the bottom of this. But I'm the crazy one?
In a rather happier O/T my son has got an offer to study PPE at St Anne's next year. I am chuffed to bits for him.
Wonderful! With luck, he'll be able to have a normal experience by then - or, as Max Beerbohm phrased it, having all the nonsense that was knocked out of him at school gently put back at Oxford
Yes, congrats indeed. And as Mr Blue says, it's to be hoped that the student experience is somewhat nearer the norm by then. On a personal note Grandson Two has now collected three offers to read History; Exeter (Uni), Bristol and Manchester. Think he's putting Exeter first, and I'm a little concerned that he was influenced by me telling him it had a reputation for 'posh totty'.
That sounds like the sort of thing Charles' grandfather would have said. He of "skirt length" fame.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
But you do see a reason why they might want to lie. Well, you should. I think it's probably best to reserve judgement. An anonymous accusation followed by a carefully worded non-denial gives me a sense where I think this will end up, but it would be foolish to go all in in either direction right now.
Whom do I think is more likely lying: A company putting its reputation on the line, that has social media and the regular media out to get to the bottom of it if they are lying - or a random person on Twitter that a cursory glance at their own Tweets shows they're an extremist partisan who shares other bollocks lies and mistruths regularly? 🤔
Easy one to answer.
Someone who's got nothing to lose by lying could easily be lying. Someone who's got a lot to lose by telling the truth could be dissembling.
This looks like a case for a proper journalist to help us all out.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
Lol - it not meeting their specification is not saying "so this cannot have come from us" you berk. It can be both.
Not meeting their specification is their way of saying oh fu*k someone (probably at a local or regional level) has screwed up.
However Philip (being a brilliant bellweather for not understanding things) doesn't see a problem that even Chartwell saw after hours yesterday.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
Lol - it not meeting their specification is not saying "so this cannot have come from us" you berk. It can be both.
Of course it can. Unlikely I expect but we will see.
You though seem to want to run away with the idea it must be them, and I'm crazy for being sceptical about Tweets from someone who clearly regularly shares Twitter mistruths. But are ignoring my multiple suggestions for a charity bet if we do get to the bottom of this. But I'm the crazy one?
I seemed to remember in the recent past somebody got taken in by a tweet about Spectator rewriting the headline for an article...I can't remember where I saw it though....
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
No, the food box on the right is definitely real, the £30 has been wasted and Chartwells are profiteering from a government contract.
How do you know it cost £30?
How do you know it came from Chartwells?
Why wasn't the £23 hamper ordered instead?
Too many questions for me. If there's an answer I'd love to know it. Someone looks like they've done something dodgy, I'm just not sure who it is.
I hope you're not putting your loyalty to Johnson above feeding hungry kids.
I'm not. I have said repeatedly my guess (and it is just a guess) is that someone in the school or elsewhere has done this by themselves on the cheap. Bought up a load of stuff, divided it into bags and distributed it. That looks like something an amateur has done.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
The person has said she's been repeatedly told that Chartwells provided it.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
So because an anonymous person on Twitter said it based on just hearsay, it must be true? 🤔
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
They didn't say their firm didn't provide it. Will be interesting to see what comes out in the wash.
How could they say their firm didn't provide it when they don't know which school it was? It isn't their specification is surely as far as they can go without more data.
Won't stop partisan hacks on Twitter and their echo chamber multipliers running away with it though in the meantime. I agree it will be very interesting to see what come out in the wash.
One thing is certain, it is now a total PR catastrophe for Chartwells. I wonder if they can survive. Feels a bit like a Ratners moment. Still, the CEO of Compass (owners of Chartwells), earned £4.6m last year, so maybe he’ll get over it
Very damning piece in the Times today about Australian cheating and now appalling behaviour in the Test against India. Sadly you can't read it unless you are a subscriber.
Looking at the outcomes to date, the gradient of relative risk by age for both death and hospitalisation looks to be something similar to this:
We keep looking at the black line and saying that when we get low enough on the axis (going from right to left in vaccinations), we can declare victory. But the rec line is closer to where the covid death risk would naturally be - because that's where you get so seriously ill as to need hospital, and dexamethasone, or tocilizumab, or sarilumab, or hooked up to a CPAP machine, or to be regularly proned, or even attached to a ventilator.
And all of that effort pushes that red line all the way down to the black line, where with all the effort we can give, we can't push it further down.
It's an important note that co-morbidities have far less effect on hospitalisation risk than death risk. Quite possibly because they could get in the way of treatment, I guess.
The debate is at what point we can let the black line spring up towards the red one - because that's what happens when the hospitals are overwhelmed and can't do their thing of pushing the red line down to the black one.
What is their effect on hospitalisations? I can't find an official source for that.
ICNARC has sources on the rate for severe comorbidities for admissions to ICU:
The analysis of children in hospital with covid noted that those with comorbidities (including far lesser ones) were noticeably more likely to need ICU treatment (although the majority in ICU had none of even those far less comorbidities)
There is also a simple question to put against the null hypothesis that "maybe comorbidities have zero or negligible effect on hospitalisation rates":
- Do comorbidities appreciably worsen the patient's chances of survival in hospital when they are hospitalised?
If the answer is "no", then the rate of hospitalisations would indeed be similar to the rate of deaths across those with no comorbidities.
If it is "yes," then the only question is the degree at which those with no co-morbidities are at increased relative risk for hospitalisation against that of death.
This story about the Chartwell’s free food ‘hamper’, going out to poor kids, could turn me into a communist overnight. Someone, somewhere, thinks this is acceptable. To make a profit. Sweet weeping Jesus.
It also seems to be total and utter fake news, Twitter style.
If you go to Chartswell's own website then at list price (no negotiations) this is what they provide: https://www.chartwellscanhelp.com/
2 Week Food Hamper - costing £23 (not £30)
2 x 200g Block of cheese 14 x Portions of fresh fruit: 6 x apples, 4 x easy peel oranges and 4 x bananas 16 x Portions of vegetables: cucumber, carrots, baking potatoes, sweet potatoes, lettuce, tomato 1kg x Wholemeal penne pasta 4 x Chopped tomato tins 2 x Tuna chunks in brine 1 x Loaf of bread 9 x Healthy snacks
Rather different to the shabby bollocks Twitter image. Someone isn't saying the truth.
It`s a disgrace if it is not fake news. Not sure.
But how the hell did the government get roped into providing food in this way? If more cash were needed why not increase tax credits/UB, or provide vouchers to parents to buy food?
I think Rashford's campaign is part of the answer. He wanted a continuation of free school meals during lockdown. As the kitchens are, err, locked down, the government is supplying "hampers" instead. This was such an obvious elephant trap that you might have thought that the relevant ministers would want a very detailed specification as to the contents but thinking and the Ministerial team in the Education Department are alien to each other.
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
I think of this as "Rashford's area" now. When an issue arises relating to underprivileged children I wait for his take, and until I hear it I feel the issue is not being attended to. Quite an odd thing really.
Well, he is the most effective member of the Opposition, so why not?
Given his ability to get things done he's one of the more effective members of the government as well.
I am more interested in whether he scores tonight to be honest. But his heart is very much in the right place and, advised or not, he can be devastatingly blunt using real life experience.
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/01/11/isolated-self-absorbed-donald-trump-impeachment-defense-457983 ...Even more than usual, Trump has not been engaged in work of the presidency, leaving much of the official business to others, including Vice President Mike Pence, who presided over a White House coronavirus task force meeting Monday as the pandemic’s toll surges with more than 3,000 deaths a day in the United States.
“Things requiring a presidential signature slowed down for sure, and he was just supremely self-absorbed,” said a former senior administration official. The official said that many conversations with Trump, even those about policy issues, have devolved into the president complaining about an election that he still won’t publicly admit he lost... ...Since Dec. 23, the schedule has included 15 variations of the language: “President Trump will work from early in the morning until late in the evening. He will make many calls and have many meetings.” A former White House official said the language was inserted at Trump’s directive in order to give off the appearance of him being busy.
Great news on the vaccines, maybe this is what everyone should be talking about.
4th in the world on vaccines per capita, behind two small nations and one tiny one, and well ahead of all the G20 and EU27 nations.
Sadly, good news doesn’t generate clicks or sell papers.
The cycle-wank is BECAUSE of this good news on vaccines. There are some whose minds are so swimming in hatred, they just cannot bear the idea of our PM being seen to do a great job on something, for once. Especially when that something is the biggest challenge facing our nation.
So there must be chaff thrown out, to hide the positive. Even at the cost of being made to look total pillocks. Retaining ther reputation doesn't matter. Trashing the PM's does.
They are going to totally lose their shit when the voters mark his Covid scorecard: "Good start, lousy middle, strong finish."
I think that you will find that voters are infamously ungrateful.
The UK is doing well on vaccines because we do have an NHS that is specifically designed for such purposes.
Government vaccine policy has been far from perfect though, and in particular the single dose gambit could come very unstuck if it fails to suppress the disease.
It's mad that we are not doing a trial comparing the single and double dose approach. Genuinely a decision that could save hundreds of thousands of lives.
We basically are, so long as we're collecting sufficient data.
Again, the issue was raised on the last How to Vaccinate the World podcast.
We are not. No one is. We should be.
They will have the data for an open label study.
I wonder... Records of who was vaccinated - yes (at least, I certainly hope so). Records of positive Covid tests - are these kept centrally with IDs? I'm not aware that they are, but may be wrong - interested to know, if so. It would a lot of sense epidemiologically. You'd be able to get records of COVID diagnoses from primary care (is Covid in Read* now?) and hospital (is Covid in ICD-10 yet? If so, is it applied by NHS?) and of course on death certificates, but all that misses the many people getting Covid who won't require any medical intervention.
* I assume it is - I once discovered, looking up Batten's disease, that Battenburg cake (choking on) is in Read!
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/01/11/isolated-self-absorbed-donald-trump-impeachment-defense-457983 ...Even more than usual, Trump has not been engaged in work of the presidency, leaving much of the official business to others, including Vice President Mike Pence, who presided over a White House coronavirus task force meeting Monday as the pandemic’s toll surges with more than 3,000 deaths a day in the United States.
“Things requiring a presidential signature slowed down for sure, and he was just supremely self-absorbed,” said a former senior administration official. The official said that many conversations with Trump, even those about policy issues, have devolved into the president complaining about an election that he still won’t publicly admit he lost... ...Since Dec. 23, the schedule has included 15 variations of the language: “President Trump will work from early in the morning until late in the evening. He will make many calls and have many meetings.” A former White House official said the language was inserted at Trump’s directive in order to give off the appearance of him being busy.
Interesting that Philip's devotional defence of Boris and all he does leads him to defend a £23 food package that looks to have about £15-worth of food in it.
Their boss supporting the Tories does wonders for basic ethics with this openly corrupt government.
£15??? Where do you shop, Selfridges food hall?
Someone has costed the ‘hamper’, it’s about £5 in value. So £25 of taxpayer’s money has disappeared *somewhere*
That was for something different. Chartwells offer 2 weeks of food for £23.
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75: 2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10 Apples £1.60 Oranges 69p Bananas 69p Baking Potatoes 41p Cucumber 41p Carrots 41p Sweet Potato 39p Lettuce 43p Tomatoes 75p Pasta £1.06 Chopped Tomatoes £1.06 Tuna £1.18 Bread 59p Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
If you price it up at Lidl it costs 47p + a free owl and a performing bear. BTW do we want to live in a country where millions rely more or less permanently on free food?
Comments
What the government should have been able to say today is that they specified that each hamper would contain A, B, C. They clearly can't.
Not dozens of photos of contracts saying this was provided by Chartwells at £30 per head. There's a difference.
They're not even charging schools £30 for their hamper listed on their website. So how do you know the school chose to pay £30 on this "hamper" in the photo?
As for the Peak district, one of the things I remember about Sheffield is that if you live on the west side of the city then in a few minutes you can be up into the hills The same applies to many industrial towns in west Yorkshire as well.
Lockdown exercise should ‘start and finish at your front door’, says Met chief as minister says 70-mile cycle ride is ok"
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/politics/13717243/lockdown-exercise-met-police-boris-cycle/
Pricing it up with Tesco its £14.75:
2 x 200g cheese blocks - £3.10
Apples £1.60
Oranges 69p
Bananas 69p
Baking Potatoes 41p
Cucumber 41p
Carrots 41p
Sweet Potato 39p
Lettuce 43p
Tomatoes 75p
Pasta £1.06
Chopped Tomatoes £1.06
Tuna £1.18
Bread 59p
Snacks £1.98
So Chartwells - who will be splitting cheaper bulk packs - are making a comfortable 36-40% markup on top of the profit they make on the items included in the pack.
Nice work if you can get it.
As others have said, why not just go straight to the supermarkets. They are huge and powerful and expert, they can source the food and deliver it at value, and they do not have a track of fucking this up (unlike Chartwells).
Several anecdotal claims in there, with some ludicrous criticisms....driver didn't ring the bell or the person didn't hear it, so the food sat outside. Delivering millions of food packages and a driver forgot / oldie didn't hear nor bothered to check, its going to happen once in a while.
My parents got it for 10 weeks and it was absolutely fine. Samey yes, but perfectly reasonable to live off. They got rice, pasta, soups, fruit and veg. The toiletries were I think valid criticism of being a bit shit.
It could be that those people are ruined before they even arrive.
Several years ago I was looking at External Wall Insulation for a house, biggish government grant administered locally. 4-6k grant available.
Quote via company administering LA scheme - 14k with 5k grant. Quote direct via the company actually doing the work - 9k.
--AS
"I would just say that people need to try to stay local. For me, a reasonable interpretation of that is that if you can - I appreciate some people can’t, but if you can - go for your exercise from your front door and come back to your front door. "
The problem is that if your personal interpretation of what staying local is differs from whatever police officer catches your eye then your own reasons don't matter. It's simply wrong to hand out legally enforceable penalties for a difference of opinion over guidance.
I agree with Mike that the outrage over Boris is absurd but at the same time I can't help but think that he's the author of his own misfortune. If what constitutes reasonable exercise had been more thought out or codified in law then there wouldn't be any doubt as to whether Boris' cycle ride was acceptable or not.
Frequently budget cuts mean you only get the first part done, but I tell you, 50% is still a good outcome.
Some of the takeaway boxes from restaurants were absolutely ridiculous. My sister gave my brother in law a, err, talking to when he got a £30 box from a restaurant which we then had to make at home for just 3 people. The raw ingredients from Sainsbury's would have come to about £8-10.
The problems with this argument are many and varied. On a philosophical level you are infantilising the population by claiming that just because they are poor they are not able to behave like adults. More importantly, if you really were that concerned about this then you would make the system such that the vouchers could only be exchanged for food at Supermarkets etc.
But forethought, principle and common sense have never featured highly with governments - either this one or any other.
Which is a complement Philip. Rik Mayall was a genius.
This kind of story plays REALLY badly for the Tories. Much worse than Boris taking a not-that-long bike ride. They should be all over it, fast.
Media and politicos have to do their stirring using other things.
On a personal note Grandson Two has now collected three offers to read History; Exeter (Uni), Bristol and Manchester. Think he's putting Exeter first, and I'm a little concerned that he was influenced by me telling him it had a reputation for 'posh totty'.
Unless there is something local in force eg Royal Parks, or it was another offence - probably "Furious Riding" at that time.
You might be right, you might well be wrong.
You certainly don't know.
The key question is: What percentage of Under 40s/Under 50s without comorbidities who contract covid end up requiring hospital treatment?
You don't know the answer to that and your statistics don't tell you, because, as you yourself say, they capture ALL people in those age groups.
So largely meaningless for this discussion.
Good thing Rashford on the case to keep focus.
I think someone has done something very dodgy but I'm sceptical we will find out (or it will be reported) who that is. I don't for one second believe this has been charged £30 for and if it has then that is extremely dodgy given that a very different alternative is listed without negotiations for £23 by the same company.
I am sceptical by nature. Most Twitter outrage ends up being bullshit.
"The further that this swindler recedes from the presidency, the clearer it will become that he was running a criminal operation for his own benefit. He didn’t work for the government. The government worked for him."
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/could-trump-go-bankrupt-
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-cyclist-fined-for-speeding-in-richmond-park-after-he-is-clocked-at-38mph-a3102191.html
I can appreciate this is a hard thing to do - give out millions of food parcels during a pandemic - but HMG has now had ten months to get it right and it is arguably, in some cases, worse than ever
Contract Catering? A notorious killing ground for the pirates unless you point to the price being offered, show them just how much they are taking the piss, then the price drops to something sensible. Way way back as a junior field sales grunt for Nestle I got in trouble for giving "Asda" as the answer to an enquiry about which local wholesaler was the cheapest source of bulk Easter Eggs.
They were an'all. Enterprising local store manager happy to punt Eggs out the loading bay door into a van by the pallet load. Never touched the shop floor. Even selling them at the full retail price he was still way cheaper than any of the local contractors.
"So no vouchers. Instead we are looking at a more targeted, local and effective mechanism of delivering support, working through local councils."
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/teesside-tory-mps-who-voted-19243510
To build you first have to dig. We have managed that, and that must be a source of pride for the hole country.
There hasn't been a single official citation that this did come from a company. The only response quoted is one saying that it is not specification and asking which school it was from so it can be investigated - but no public response to that question.
Pickled herring goes well as a starter with a salad and potatoes or chunky home made bread.
With this government we know there is ALWAYS a party donor or donation in the background. Its open corruption.
And she woiuldn't want to publish the school's name. Media scrum and all that.
And thanks.
I don't know where the food boxes came from up here in Lincolnshire. They were good but I did get a call from one old lady who we were keeping an eye on who was quite upset because this food parcel had arrived on her doorstep with no explanation and she thought it must be a mistake as there were no indications at all of what it was or why it was there. Poor dear was frightened she was going to get into trouble if she used it and it was supposed to be for someone else.
Food boxes never cost the same as retail, I think everyone expects that. But there is a complete world of difference between what was posted claiming it was £30 - and for £23 providing 30 pieces of fruit and vegetables, a loaf of bread, 2 blocks of cheese, 6 cans and 9 snacks.
If it was up to me as I've said all along people would get cash and spend it as they want to do so and be responsible for themselves and there would be no food boxes. It isn't up to me though.
My bike computer informs me I once hit 51kph. I remember it too, screaming down hill in a 30 zone towards a roundabout. Some tosser still overtook me, despite me being over the speed limit and running out of road before the roundabout. 31mph on a bike is not fun. When you're pushed into the gutter by an idiot trying to squeeze between you and the bollards in the middle of the road, it's downright terrifying. I think I did a Dura Ace and peed myself a little.
Chartwells have replied to say that doesn't meet their specification. I see no reason to assume they're lying.
I know you don't like it because it contradicts your tediously-repeated position that all restrictions must end immediately when the most at-risk have been vaccinated. However, I have now given some evidence in favour of my position. You have given none. If you want to argue otherwise then do your own research and show the evidence.
--AS
The point of buying in bulk - a food box - is to bring in convenience of everything in one place. Volume does drive discount though - if I ordered that lot at £14.75 Tesco would employ someone to go round the store, pack it into a green crate and then deliver it to me at a loss. Saying that £23 for the same to a Tory donor is you desperately defending the indefensible.
There are two aims - feed hungry kids, and be prudent with taxpayers money. Food to kids has to be nutritious by law so you can't just hand out any old crap. This whole exercise manages to fail on every part except for the excess profits for Tory donors.
I think it's probably best to reserve judgement. An anonymous accusation followed by a carefully worded non-denial gives me a sense where I think this will end up, but it would be foolish to go all in in either direction right now.
I could maybe hit 30mph downhill with a following wind.
Easy one to answer.
* I assume it is - I once discovered, looking up Batten's disease, that Battenburg cake (choking on) is in Read!
Won't stop partisan hacks on Twitter and their echo chamber multipliers running away with it though in the meantime. I agree it will be very interesting to see what come out in the wash.
Easy to spot - that sheen on the cheeks, the insistent voice, the unlampoonable hair.
You though seem to want to run away with the idea it must be them, and I'm crazy for being sceptical about Tweets from someone who clearly regularly shares Twitter mistruths. But are ignoring my multiple suggestions for a charity bet if we do get to the bottom of this. But I'm the crazy one?
Someone who's got a lot to lose by telling the truth could be dissembling.
This looks like a case for a proper journalist to help us all out.
https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/status/1348917929132367872
However Philip (being a brilliant bellweather for not understanding things) doesn't see a problem that even Chartwell saw after hours yesterday.
The analysis of children in hospital with covid noted that those with comorbidities (including far lesser ones) were noticeably more likely to need ICU treatment (although the majority in ICU had none of even those far less comorbidities)
There is also a simple question to put against the null hypothesis that "maybe comorbidities have zero or negligible effect on hospitalisation rates":
- Do comorbidities appreciably worsen the patient's chances of survival in hospital when they are hospitalised?
If the answer is "no", then the rate of hospitalisations would indeed be similar to the rate of deaths across those with no comorbidities.
If it is "yes," then the only question is the degree at which those with no co-morbidities are at increased relative risk for hospitalisation against that of death.
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/01/11/isolated-self-absorbed-donald-trump-impeachment-defense-457983
...Even more than usual, Trump has not been engaged in work of the presidency, leaving much of the official business to others, including Vice President Mike Pence, who presided over a White House coronavirus task force meeting Monday as the pandemic’s toll surges with more than 3,000 deaths a day in the United States.
“Things requiring a presidential signature slowed down for sure, and he was just supremely self-absorbed,” said a former senior administration official. The official said that many conversations with Trump, even those about policy issues, have devolved into the president complaining about an election that he still won’t publicly admit he lost...
...Since Dec. 23, the schedule has included 15 variations of the language: “President Trump will work from early in the morning until late in the evening. He will make many calls and have many meetings.” A former White House official said the language was inserted at Trump’s directive in order to give off the appearance of him being busy.
--AS