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Deal – politicalbetting.com

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  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,600

    I think we need to stick everybody in the SE and Wales in a lorry forthwith....
    Those 3 will be used by Macron to justify the 6,000 lorries parked in Kent.

    If France could be arsed to do some work on the genomes of its own cases, I suspect 3 would be tip of their own existing Bastard New Covid cases.
  • James Withers, chief executive of Scotland Food and Drink, said in a series of Tweets last night that around 20,000 tonnes of potato seed is sold to the EU by Scotland – a fifth of all UK seed potato exports. The trade value is estimated to be in the region of £4.5-£5 million......

    NFU President Minette Batters said: “Receiving third country listing status from the EU for our animal products is absolutely critical and will allow an export trade worth more than £3 billion to continue at the end of the transition period.


    https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/lifestyle/food-drink/1841017/scottish-potato-seed-misses-out-in-brexit-deal/?utm_source=twitter
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881
    Tres said:

    "It's difficult, sometimes. Being Scottish in the south east of England. Where people genuinely like Boris Fucking Johnson.
    Anyway, peace and goodwill.
    Except for those three. Fuck them."

    So true.

    Indeed. Sounds almost like a quotation from a Trainspotting update, with Renton, Sick Boy et al in their 50s.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,803
    edited December 2020

    kjh said:

    kjh said:

    Tres said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    So what does David Cameron feel now ?

    Does he wonder what would have happened if he had actually negotiated with the EU instead of thinking it was 'too much of a faff' ?

    He should feel ashamed.
    Deep, deep, lifelong embarrassment I should think.

    The EU just never believed he would walk away. Failure of Negotiating 1.01
    And then May, Hammond and Robbins repeated that mistake.

    Some here may belittle Boris as a clown but cometh the hour, cometh the man and he was exactly the kind of unpredictable leader that was needed.
    I think it was @Casino_Royale that made the point on the aggressive fishing waters stance in no deal concentrating minds in the EU.

    Those tough stances have ensured the EU compromised and did a deal realising the UK would force the no deal to mean no deal on both sides of it. They knew with May and Robbins they'd still get preferential access to the UK without needing to give anything in return in the no deal scenario.
    "The EU caved on big points because we made them truly fear No Deal" -

    This will be a key part of the Johnson spin on the deal over the next few days and weeks. Let's see how it holds up.
    It looks as though third country status for agriculture has made it into the deal. That's a massive climbdown, the EU were absolutely adamant that the UK would have to sign up to dynamic alignment for agricultural standards for that, we haven't done the latter but we have the former.

    The EU has in many areas made concessions, and I'm sure in many areas the UK has too. I think this could be the start of a much healthier UK/EU relationship. We don't hold up their integration project and they don't impose stupid laws and regulations on us.
    Keep going you will soon have convinced yourself England is a world power again.
    England/the UK is a world power.

    We will remain so even if just England.
    A world power would not have had to kowtow to the EU's terms. We have managed to secure a trade deal with worse terms than we previously had. Hurray!
    We haven't kowtowed, we have negotiated. We now have better terms than we had before. Hooray! 🎊
    No we haven't. We have made trade and travel more difficult and introduced lots of red tape. How do we have better terms?
    Barring any shocks ...

    Not paying billions in subscription fees? ✅
    Outside of the Single Market ✅
    Outside of the Customs Union ✅
    Outside of the ECJ ✅
    Able to diverge ✅
    Laws set in Westminster ✅
    Control of our waters ✅
    Able to sign trade deals with the rest of the world ✅
    Able to decide how to control migration ✅

    I've probably missed things. What you consider worse red tape is what others wanted us to achieve to make things better.
    You think 2 and 3 are good? Not what leavers used to say.

    There is a cost to 1 which most believe is higher.

    Why would we diverge?

    From personal experience I have benefited from ECJ when Westminster sat on its hands ( can detail if you wish) through incompetence.

    8, deals negotiated on worse terms due to economy of scale.

    Control of waters - big deal

    Immigration - doubt it will have any impact on numbers but has restricted me and my children's freedom of movement.

    Yes 2 and 3 are good and what was voted for in the referendum.

    https://youtu.be/zSZmlGa51W4

    We would diverge because we chose to do so. Democratically.

    Our Parliament subjected to our scrutiny at elections and our Courts subjected to our Parliament's scrutiny should be the ones to decide the law. Not the ECJ.

    Restrictions on your ability to move are more theoretical than real. Most British expats go to non EU nations like Australia and Canada.
    Theoretical rather than real? Really? Loads of people I know have been impacted by this. To give you the worse example a friend of mine sold up bought a mobile home and has been travelling Europe. That was his retirement plan for the next umpteen years. He is now holed up on his sons drive because of the restriction of 90 days in every 180. Loads of people go to France and Spain to retire and they are getting well screwed. How about travelling for work. My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    2 & 3 was what was voted for in the referendum you say. That is not what we were told by so many at the time. On the contrary and contrary to your video many said that would not change.

    But we won't diverge will we. To do so would be economic suicide.

    The ECJ does not make the law it decides on cases and has done a cracking job of doing so where the UK parliament has failed to legislate or resolve outstanding matters because it is so slow and cumbersome. I have been involved in 2 campaigns re the abuse of premium lite telephone numbers and on a particular pension issue. Parliament and UK Ombudsman (out of remit) have been hopeless on both. In both cases the ECJ passed judgements that were immediately accepted by the UK Government. They were not controversial. That benefit of the ECJ fall back has gone now. But yeah we have our freedom to do bugger all about injustices now.
  • Phil said:

    Is it too much to hope that a deal will make Ultra Remain/Ultra Leave Twitter SHUT THE HELL UP?

    It is, I know...

    Leave/Remain looks like it’s going to be the Whig/Tory of the 21st Century sadly.
    In the 18th Century isn't, didn't the Whigs routinely spank the Tories, to the extent that "Tories" had to keep changing definition as each generation's ideology went extinct?
  • Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,214
    Quite so, Alastair. We are about to commence Brexit the Lived Experience as opposed to Brexit the Unicorn/Bogeyman. And Phase 1 of BtLE will be Leavers puffing the "achievement" of this minimalist Deal. This will provoke a reaction from Remainers and the fight will be on again. "Good vs Bad Deal" will serve nicely as the new battleground for people to enjoy not "moving on".

    But enough from me, lots on PT for one thing, and it is Christmas. Time for me to commence my usual cutting edge progressive one - mince pies in a minute, then later, small glass of sherry and Carols at Kings, followed by Shepherd's Pie with a slightly more expensive Red than usual, and then of course Alastair Sim.

    I wish all PBers a really good 25/12, pandemic or no pandemic. Important to try and enjoy it, I feel, because the minute it's over I sense we will be swinging straight into a full-scale and rather intense National Emergency on several fronts.
  • Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    £6 billion is chicken feed compared with the hundreds of billions of pounds better off we shall be under Boris's deal, and it probably will not even be needed now that Stuart Rose will have to pay workers properly.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    The worthy and unworthy rich. Sir Philip Green (worthy) Rashford (unworthy)?

    Great header from Mr Meeks. Best if I avoid the Brexit deal hoopla, everyone on here has every right to celebrate Johnson's genius. I on the other hand will quietly lament what I have lost, perhaps with a duty paid port.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Make that fifteen
    https://metro.co.uk/2020/12/19/man-utd-preparing-new-contract-for-marcus-rashford-with-huge-pay-rise-13777255/
    Politics of envy I see.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,803

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,052
    Tres said:

    "It's difficult, sometimes. Being Scottish in the south east of England. Where people genuinely like Boris Fucking Johnson.
    Anyway, peace and goodwill.
    Except for those three. Fuck them."

    So true.

    Much more difficult being English in Scotland, as I know from personal experience.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    And these people are supposed expert commentators on the game? FFS, they are as bad as the media on COVID.

    https://twitter.com/IanDarke/status/1341904890914885641?s=20

    I think xG is interesting, but only for anyone game. For example, Bayern’s win at Tottenham was far in excess of xG, that is their finishing was superb.

    But beyond that it’s not that useful. I would have sacked Arteta on the spot for citing it and suggesting that Arsenal have just been unlucky recently. They haven’t, they are where they deserve to be.
  • Does anyone seriously believe there is a last minute hitch? It is so obviously all planned simply to build up and maximise the tv audience for "Boris".
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Fishing said:

    Tres said:

    "It's difficult, sometimes. Being Scottish in the south east of England. Where people genuinely like Boris Fucking Johnson.
    Anyway, peace and goodwill.
    Except for those three. Fuck them."

    So true.

    Much more difficult being English in Scotland, as I know from personal experience.
    That's nothing, try being A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,092
    edited December 2020
    tlg86 said:

    And these people are supposed expert commentators on the game? FFS, they are as bad as the media on COVID.

    https://twitter.com/IanDarke/status/1341904890914885641?s=20

    I think xG is interesting, but only for anyone game. For example, Bayern’s win at Tottenham was far in excess of xG, that is their finishing was superb.

    But beyond that it’s not that useful. I would have sacked Arteta on the spot for citing it and suggesting that Arsenal have just been unlucky recently. They haven’t, they are where they deserve to be.
    xG is now old hat...it is flawed for a number of reasons.

    The proper analytics have moved way beyond this. My point is that a leading commentator doesn't even know about xG, let alone the metrics the clubs are actually using these days. That's shameful.

    They even bloody explained some of this in the Royal Institution Christmas lectures last year...so there are 10-11 years old that know more than him.

    The same is evident in the cricket. The BBC TV coverage of a T20 international in the summer was embarrassing. The only person who had any idea about modern T20 theory and tactics, Tymal Mills, got about 5 mins of airtime. Sky have been slowly shifting out some of the dead wood and getting in some people who have some idea. But Sam Billings did an interview recently with a data analytics podcast and the info he was talking about just highlighted how much bollock the commentators talk e.g. The go to strike rate stat that every commentator talks about is basically obsolete in T20.
  • Of course this rather relies on countries doing the genomic sequencing in the first place......

    https://twitter.com/AineToole/status/1342099954140147713?s=20
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Early Xmas greetings to one and all, away from politics take my advice and if you are experiencing a change in your normal bodily functions etc for more than three weeks get down to the doctors, insist on a consultants appointment which is not 3 months away. Some things should not be left until tomorrow. It may just save your life.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,376
    kjh said:

    kjh said:

    kjh said:

    Tres said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    So what does David Cameron feel now ?

    Does he wonder what would have happened if he had actually negotiated with the EU instead of thinking it was 'too much of a faff' ?

    He should feel ashamed.
    Deep, deep, lifelong embarrassment I should think.

    The EU just never believed he would walk away. Failure of Negotiating 1.01
    And then May, Hammond and Robbins repeated that mistake.

    Some here may belittle Boris as a clown but cometh the hour, cometh the man and he was exactly the kind of unpredictable leader that was needed.
    I think it was @Casino_Royale that made the point on the aggressive fishing waters stance in no deal concentrating minds in the EU.

    Those tough stances have ensured the EU compromised and did a deal realising the UK would force the no deal to mean no deal on both sides of it. They knew with May and Robbins they'd still get preferential access to the UK without needing to give anything in return in the no deal scenario.
    "The EU caved on big points because we made them truly fear No Deal" -

    This will be a key part of the Johnson spin on the deal over the next few days and weeks. Let's see how it holds up.
    It looks as though third country status for agriculture has made it into the deal. That's a massive climbdown, the EU were absolutely adamant that the UK would have to sign up to dynamic alignment for agricultural standards for that, we haven't done the latter but we have the former.

    The EU has in many areas made concessions, and I'm sure in many areas the UK has too. I think this could be the start of a much healthier UK/EU relationship. We don't hold up their integration project and they don't impose stupid laws and regulations on us.
    Keep going you will soon have convinced yourself England is a world power again.
    England/the UK is a world power.

    We will remain so even if just England.
    A world power would not have had to kowtow to the EU's terms. We have managed to secure a trade deal with worse terms than we previously had. Hurray!
    We haven't kowtowed, we have negotiated. We now have better terms than we had before. Hooray! 🎊
    No we haven't. We have made trade and travel more difficult and introduced lots of red tape. How do we have better terms?
    Barring any shocks ...

    Not paying billions in subscription fees? ✅
    Outside of the Single Market ✅
    Outside of the Customs Union ✅
    Outside of the ECJ ✅
    Able to diverge ✅
    Laws set in Westminster ✅
    Control of our waters ✅
    Able to sign trade deals with the rest of the world ✅
    Able to decide how to control migration ✅

    I've probably missed things. What you consider worse red tape is what others wanted us to achieve to make things better.
    You think 2 and 3 are good? Not what leavers used to say.

    There is a cost to 1 which most believe is higher.

    Why would we diverge?

    From personal experience I have benefited from ECJ when Westminster sat on its hands ( can detail if you wish) through incompetence.

    8, deals negotiated on worse terms due to economy of scale.

    Control of waters - big deal

    Immigration - doubt it will have any impact on numbers but has restricted me and my children's freedom of movement.

    Yes 2 and 3 are good and what was voted for in the referendum.

    https://youtu.be/zSZmlGa51W4

    We would diverge because we chose to do so. Democratically.

    Our Parliament subjected to our scrutiny at elections and our Courts subjected to our Parliament's scrutiny should be the ones to decide the law. Not the ECJ.

    Restrictions on your ability to move are more theoretical than real. Most British expats go to non EU nations like Australia and Canada.
    Theoretical rather than real? Really? Loads of people I know have been impacted by this. To give you the worse example a friend of mine sold up bought a mobile home and has been travelling Europe. That was his retirement plan for the next umpteen years. He is now holed up on his sons drive because of the restriction of 90 days in every 180. Loads of people go to France and Spain to retire and they are getting well screwed. How about travelling for work. My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    2 & 3 was what was voted for in the referendum you say. That is not what we were told by so many at the time. On the contrary and contrary to your video many said that would not change.

    But we won't diverge will we. To do so would be economic suicide.

    The ECJ does not make the law it decides on cases and has done a cracking job of doing so where the UK parliament has failed to legislate or resolve outstanding matters because it is so slow and cumbersome. I have been involved in 2 campaigns re the abuse of premium lite telephone numbers and on a particular pension issue. Parliament and UK Ombudsman (out of remit) have been hopeless on both. In both cases the ECJ passed judgements that were immediately accepted by the UK Government. They were not controversial. That benefit of the ECJ fall back has gone now. But yeah we have our freedom to do bugger all about injustices now.
    Our own courts offer plenty of redress against injustice.

    WRT freedom of movement, far more British nationals live and work in North America, Australia and New Zealand than the EU. They seem to be able to flourish, despite the lack of free movement.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,803
    Alistair said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Make that fifteen
    https://metro.co.uk/2020/12/19/man-utd-preparing-new-contract-for-marcus-rashford-with-huge-pay-rise-13777255/
    Politics of envy I see.
    Exactly. At least Marcus Rashford has demonstrated he is one of the best at what he does. He wouldn't get that job because he knows someone in the boardroom or went to the right school. Yet some who seem to believe in capitalism (as I do) seem to begrudge him earning what others are willing to pay for his services.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    tlg86 said:

    And these people are supposed expert commentators on the game? FFS, they are as bad as the media on COVID.

    https://twitter.com/IanDarke/status/1341904890914885641?s=20

    I think xG is interesting, but only for anyone game. For example, Bayern’s win at Tottenham was far in excess of xG, that is their finishing was superb.

    But beyond that it’s not that useful. I would have sacked Arteta on the spot for citing it and suggesting that Arsenal have just been unlucky recently. They haven’t, they are where they deserve to be.
    xG is now old hat...it is flawed for a number of reasons.

    The proper analytics have moved way beyond this. My point is that a leading commentator doesn't even know about xG, let alone the metrics the clubs are actually using these days. That's shameful.

    They even bloody explained some of this in the Royal Institution Christmas lectures last year...so there are 10-11 years old that know more than him.

    The same is evident in the cricket. The BBC TV coverage of a T20 international in the summer was embarrassing. The only person who had any idea about modern T20 theory and tactics, Tymal Mills, got about 5 mins of airtime. Sky have been slowly shifting out some of the dead wood and getting in some people who have some idea. But Sam Billings did an interview recently with a data analytics podcast and the info he was talking about just highlighted how much bollock the commentators talk e.g. The go to strike rate stat that every commentator talks about is basically obsolete in T20.
    I quite like Darke as a commentator - it doesn’t bother me if he knows about such things, his job is to add to the drama with decent commentary. The pundits, on the other hand, are generally useless. I’ve always advocated having non players as pundits. If they could go into this sort of thing that would be a lot more interesting than the usual bollocks spouted by ex-players.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,702
    Fishing said:

    Tres said:

    "It's difficult, sometimes. Being Scottish in the south east of England. Where people genuinely like Boris Fucking Johnson.
    Anyway, peace and goodwill.
    Except for those three. Fuck them."

    So true.

    Much more difficult being English in Scotland, as I know from personal experience.
    And that ladies and gentlemen in a nutshell is the textbook English-know-best attitude that the rest of the world cherishes so fondly.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,080
    kle4 said:

    FPT

    Please note: when ordering sprouts from @Tesco
    online, quantity 1 does not mean 1 bag of sprouts. It means 1 sprout. Thank you and good night

    Flag Quote · Off Topic Like

    Please note: when ordering sprouts from @Tesco
    online, quantity 1 does not mean 1 bag of sprouts. It means 1 sprout. Thank you and good night


    Did you not wonder when you were only charged 3p for your order of sprouts that something might be up?
    If he's anything like me he may not be assiduous at checking the individual costs of things, just the total shop cost, which won't have been that far out. I've accidentally purchased two of something on Amazon many times and had to cancel things.
    It's one of the hazards for internet shopping. Some years ago, I had exactly @malcolmg22's experience of buying 1 sprout. Another of my favourites was buying a gigantic jar of Marmite - just looked at the picture and didn't realise the weight.

    That problem pre-dates the internet, though. Many years ago, just before Easter, I looked at my milkman's catalogue & chose a cheesecake for Easter. It was left on the doorstep long before I got up, and it was so massive I was ashamed. I lived alone and didn't realise it was a catering version.


    Good afternoon, everyone. I shall be very relieved if they do indeed reach a deal, but will just ignore all the shouting about who won. It's a start. We can gently detach over the years & decades to come and the EU can get on with their project without our continual arguments. If in the future, our population likes the look of what they eventually achieve, then an application to join wholeheartedly will probably be possible.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933
    Tres said:

    Fishing said:

    Tres said:

    "It's difficult, sometimes. Being Scottish in the south east of England. Where people genuinely like Boris Fucking Johnson.
    Anyway, peace and goodwill.
    Except for those three. Fuck them."

    So true.

    Much more difficult being English in Scotland, as I know from personal experience.
    And that ladies and gentlemen in a nutshell is the textbook English-know-best attitude that the rest of the world cherishes so fondly.
    Who knows what their personal experiences were like? Might be a lot worse than having people like Boris Johnson. Which, on the scale of terribleness, isn't actually that bad.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Call it the Christmas Agreement, that way it works any day from now to January 7th.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933
    Notice how no one cares what the EU Parliament is saying or not doing. If the deal is agreed, it's agreed.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    edited December 2020
    Midlander said:

    Phil said:

    Is it too much to hope that a deal will make Ultra Remain/Ultra Leave Twitter SHUT THE HELL UP?

    It is, I know...

    Leave/Remain looks like it’s going to be the Whig/Tory of the 21st Century sadly.
    In the 18th Century isn't, didn't the Whigs routinely spank the Tories, to the extent that "Tories" had to keep changing definition as each generation's ideology went extinct?
    The whole point of being a Tory is that you are on the wrong side of history, simply trying to slow it down.

    The mistake people have made this time is in allowing them to try and run it backwards.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881
    kle4 said:

    Call it the Christmas Agreement, that way it works any day from now to January 7th.
    Uh ... unhappy resonances with an earlier European affair, no?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    On topic, I agree that the Deal should be read in full before commenting. I have assiduously avoided doing so, except to welcome the news that one has been done.

    On services whilst I have no doubt there will be a minor GDP growth hit in the short-medium term from not having these included I think this can also be overblown.

    With equivalence for financial services, recognition of professional qualifications and short business visit visas we will be achieve the vast majority of what we want to do.

    I wouldn't want to go any further. The political costs are too high and there are better markets elsewhere.

    I caught up with the guys at Hiscox a while ago (2017). Despite the complexities of state level regulation and the "single market" they had found it far easier to obtain licenses and expand into the US than the EU.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,720
    Where's Noel Edmonds when we need him?
  • kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I didn't say he is. I said I hope he isn't. If he were, I'd doubt it would be his fault either but a 'clever' accountant's, but he would be responsible and would get a load of shit from parts of the media. I like the guy, and the fact he is fighting for something worthwhile. He's a massively better role model than most of his fellow pro ball kickers.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    Does anyone seriously believe there is a last minute hitch? It is so obviously all planned simply to build up and maximise the tv audience for "Boris".

    Minimise the chance of any intelligent criticism, before people open the Sherry and focus on the holidays, more like.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    RobD said:
    More likely a moveable feast. Been here repeatedly in the past trying to reconcile forecast A against numbers B when the reality is now C. The number was correct at the time it was taken as a snapshot but no longer is. So they need to set aside what the number now is and go back to what it was...
    Are you suggesting that fish might be a moveable feast?
  • kle4 said:

    Call it the Christmas Agreement, that way it works any day from now to January 7th.
    Winter's Tale Agreement.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881

    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I didn't say he is. I said I hope he isn't. If he were, I'd doubt it would be his fault either but a 'clever' accountant's, but he would be responsible and would get a load of shit from parts of the media. I like the guy, and the fact he is fighting for something worthwhile. He's a massively better role model than most of his fellow pro ball kickers.
    I'd be very, very surprised if the tabloids hadn't long ago given Mr Rashford the sniff-over, not to mention a general rummage in his bins, listen to his mobile and hack of his bank accounts and tax return. It's not as if he was a male politician to be defended at all costs under the code of omerta.
  • Raises the question "should immunocompromised people be bumped up the vaccination queue to reduce virus mutations?"

    https://www.wired.com/story/heres-a-plan-to-stop-the-coronavirus-from-mutating/
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204

    Magnificent opening to this piece.

    The best since that Turkish conscript one.

    Mustafa
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881
    Charles said:

    RobD said:
    More likely a moveable feast. Been here repeatedly in the past trying to reconcile forecast A against numbers B when the reality is now C. The number was correct at the time it was taken as a snapshot but no longer is. So they need to set aside what the number now is and go back to what it was...
    Are you suggesting that fish might be a moveable feast?
    I daresay he is, except when they get stuck in the lorry outside Dover.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Ok, admit it - which one of you was the author of this hilarious thread?

    https://twitter.com/estellecostanza/status/1342044259743096832

    He strikes me as a bit of a jerk
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172
    edited December 2020
    kjh said:


    My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    Cambridge is interesting. Why do you think all the (mainly LibDem voting) wards in the North and West of Cambridge voted Remain ?

    And all the (mainly Labour voting) wards in the East of Cambridge voted Leave ?

    Suppose you were born and bought up in Cambridge. What do you think happened to rents in Cambridge as the EU poured money into Cambridge, and so created many temporary positions for many more graduate students or postdocs? All these extra people needed to be housed somewhere.

    Consequently, people of modest income (& yes probably modest ability) found themselves completely priced out of rents in affluent Cambridge because of this. They had to live with their parents in cramped houses or leave the city.

    More generally, the impact of the EU was usually to aid the affluent middle-classes (or soon to be middle-classes).

    Such people proved unwilling or unable to share their good fortune with those who ended up worse off because of EU policies (such as apprentices or the children of low-skilled manual workers in the city of Cambridge who found themselves priced out of the rental market in the town in which they grew up.).

    I think it is somewhat more nuanced than your picture.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,803
    geoffw said:

    Where's Noel Edmonds when we need him?

    I have no idea what that means, but it made me laugh.
  • Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I didn't say he is. I said I hope he isn't. If he were, I'd doubt it would be his fault either but a 'clever' accountant's, but he would be responsible and would get a load of shit from parts of the media. I like the guy, and the fact he is fighting for something worthwhile. He's a massively better role model than most of his fellow pro ball kickers.
    I'd be very, very surprised if the tabloids hadn't long ago given Mr Rashford the sniff-over, not to mention a general rummage in his bins, listen to his mobile and hack of his bank accounts and tax return. It's not as if he was a male politician to be defended at all costs under the code of omerta.
    You're probably right. But his (hypothetical) new finance adviser might have improved his tax efficiency yesterday to coincide with his massive new contract, for all we know.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,244
    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    It's a reasonable question to ask of footballers. A history of 'tax efficiency' (ahem) as long as your arm.

    eg There was no shortage of footballers doing the Ingenious film tax scam.
    https://metro.co.uk/2017/06/03/list-of-100-celebrities-caught-in-700-million-tax-relief-scheme-revealed-6681782/
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I didn't say he is. I said I hope he isn't. If he were, I'd doubt it would be his fault either but a 'clever' accountant's, but he would be responsible and would get a load of shit from parts of the media. I like the guy, and the fact he is fighting for something worthwhile. He's a massively better role model than most of his fellow pro ball kickers.
    I'd be very, very surprised if the tabloids hadn't long ago given Mr Rashford the sniff-over, not to mention a general rummage in his bins, listen to his mobile and hack of his bank accounts and tax return. It's not as if he was a male politician to be defended at all costs under the code of omerta.
    You're probably right. But his (hypothetical) new finance adviser might have improved his tax efficiency yesterday to coincide with his massive new contract, for all we know.
    Mr R (or whoever is advising him - much the same thing if he is taking advice, someone on PB noted) strikes me as too canny to give such a hostage to fortune.
  • tlg86 said:

    And these people are supposed expert commentators on the game? FFS, they are as bad as the media on COVID.

    https://twitter.com/IanDarke/status/1341904890914885641?s=20

    I think xG is interesting, but only for anyone game. For example, Bayern’s win at Tottenham was far in excess of xG, that is their finishing was superb.

    But beyond that it’s not that useful. I would have sacked Arteta on the spot for citing it and suggesting that Arsenal have just been unlucky recently. They haven’t, they are where they deserve to be.
    wrong way around - its only use is in the longer term, and for unraveling trends in how a team might be playing.

  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,677

    Raises the question "should immunocompromised people be bumped up the vaccination queue to reduce virus mutations?"

    https://www.wired.com/story/heres-a-plan-to-stop-the-coronavirus-from-mutating/

    Does vaccinating immunocompromised people actually work?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    So - I have heard of a pub where an entire shift has caught the virus - they are self isolating but the pub remains open......

    Re track and trace - my son met someone yesterday who is potentially infected - track and trace have contacted him and all others who were with him within 12 hours - impressive.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    Happy xmas to Mike & all pbers!

    This site is something special.

    Lots of love, Pong
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881

    kjh said:


    My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    Cambridge is interesting. Why do you think all the (mainly LibDem voting) wards in the North and West of Cambridge voted Remain ?

    And all the (mainly Labour voting) wards in the East of Cambridge voted Leave ?

    Suppose you were born and bought up in Cambridge. What do you think happened to rents in Cambridge as the EU poured money into Cambridge, and so created many temporary positions for many more graduate students or postdocs? All these extra people needed to be housed somewhere.

    Consequently, people of modest income (& yes probably modest ability) found themselves completely priced out of rents in affluent Cambridge because of this. They had to live with their parents in cramped houses or leave the city.

    More generally, the impact of the EU was usually to aid the affluent middle-classes (or soon to be middle-classes).

    Such people proved unwilling or unable to share their good fortune with those who ended up worse off because of EU policies (such as apprentices or the children of low-skilled manual workers in the city of Cambridge who found themselves priced out of the rental market in the town in which they grew up.).

    I think it is somewhat more nuanced than your picture.
    I don't know why this is marked off topic, because it is an interesting argument. (Though one might adduce the effect of London commuting as well.) And raises the question of St Andrews, say, and Oxford, as well as towns of sizes in between.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036
    Just when they think the deal is done, up will pop The Truss and ask 'What about cheese?'.
  • Raises the question "should immunocompromised people be bumped up the vaccination queue to reduce virus mutations?"

    https://www.wired.com/story/heres-a-plan-to-stop-the-coronavirus-from-mutating/

    Does vaccinating immunocompromised people actually work?
    Good point - they're trialling monoclonal antibodies:

    https://www.itv.com/news/2020-12-03/covid-can-pregnant-and-immunocompromised-people-get-the-pfizer-vaccine-who-cant-get-the-jab-and-why
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036
    geoffw said:

    Where's Noel Edmonds when we need him?

    Not sure about Noel, but Mr Blobby is in Downing Street.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,696

    kjh said:


    My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    Cambridge is interesting. Why do you think all the (mainly LibDem voting) wards in the North and West of Cambridge voted Remain ?

    And all the (mainly Labour voting) wards in the East of Cambridge voted Leave ?

    Suppose you were born and bought up in Cambridge. What do you think happened to rents in Cambridge as the EU poured money into Cambridge, and so created many temporary positions for many more graduate students or postdocs? All these extra people needed to be housed somewhere.

    Consequently, people of modest income (& yes probably modest ability) found themselves completely priced out of rents in affluent Cambridge because of this. They had to live with their parents in cramped houses or leave the city.

    More generally, the impact of the EU was usually to aid the affluent middle-classes (or soon to be middle-classes).

    Such people proved unwilling or unable to share their good fortune with those who ended up worse off because of EU policies (such as apprentices or the children of low-skilled manual workers in the city of Cambridge who found themselves priced out of the rental market in the town in which they grew up.).

    I think it is somewhat more nuanced than your picture.
    So without the EU you don't think there would be town and gown divisions, and no high-value economic activity would spring up around Cambridge driving up rents?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,244

    Just when they think the deal is done, up will pop The Truss and ask 'What about cheese?'.

    Wasn't it pork bellies?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    Alistair said:
    Lol, what in the actual fuck is a Bloomberg correspondent doing tweeting out pretty much GOP propaganda. Most people reading that will assume it's failed due to Democrat actions as the House is Dem controlled...
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,052
    RobD said:

    Notice how no one cares what the EU Parliament is saying or not doing. If the deal is agreed, it's agreed.
    The EU has a problem with democracy? Surely not!
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036
    Deal!
  • Andrew Bridgen on Sky News, hasn't had a call from Boris, in case you were wondering who isn't 'key'.
  • The Christmas Carols on R4 is at 3pm, so they better get a bloody move on.
  • Deal announced
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Deal done according to Sky News. Press conferences shortly.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I didn't say he is. I said I hope he isn't. If he were, I'd doubt it would be his fault either but a 'clever' accountant's, but he would be responsible and would get a load of shit from parts of the media. I like the guy, and the fact he is fighting for something worthwhile. He's a massively better role model than most of his fellow pro ball kickers.
    I'd be very, very surprised if the tabloids hadn't long ago given Mr Rashford the sniff-over, not to mention a general rummage in his bins, listen to his mobile and hack of his bank accounts and tax return. It's not as if he was a male politician to be defended at all costs under the code of omerta.
    You're probably right. But his (hypothetical) new finance adviser might have improved his tax efficiency yesterday to coincide with his massive new contract, for all we know.
    Mr R (or whoever is advising him - much the same thing if he is taking advice, someone on PB noted) strikes me as too canny to give such a hostage to fortune.
    It's like when on some programme Ed Balls was asked if he had ever paid anyone in cash and he said yes and he was then asked whether he had kept a record of it and he replied (wearily) of course I did I was shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933
    Boom!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    Of course an effing deal is done who on earth thought otherwise?
  • FenmanFenman Posts: 1,047
    kjh said:

    Roger said:

    Marcus Rashford to fight for permanent rise in universal credit

    The footballer and food poverty campaigner Marcus Rashford is to turn his focus to the social security safety net and will hold talks with the welfare secretary to discuss a £6bn-a-year boost to universal credit payments, the Guardian has learned.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/24/marcus-rashford-to-fight-for-permanent-rise-in-universal-credit

    Only £6bn......

    How much of his ten million a year does he need?
    Should he not be able to campaign?
    Of course. But I hope he's paying full income tax on all of his income, and not shielding any through dodgy image rights companies, or such accounting tricks. I imagine his income is somewhat higher than his £15m pa salary and effectively telling middle income earners that they have to pay more tax from that position is brave.
    This bollocks again. Do you know he is avoiding tax? If not I suggest you shouldn't make such allegations. And as discussed here before, by those of us who know something of the tax system, limited companies is not a good way to avoid tax.
    I've discovered that the only way to avoid tax is not to earn anything.
  • I hold my hand up. I was wrong. I really didn't think Johnson would do a deal in the end.

    I think ditching Cummings was absolutely key to getting a deal.

    A massive massive historical intervention by Johnson's girlfriend.
  • 🎊🎊🎊

    🍾🍾🍾

    🏅🏅🏅

    At last.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    Andrew Bridgen on Sky News, hasn't had a call from Boris, in case you were wondering who isn't 'key'.

    Ah bless!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,881

    I hold my hand up. I was wrong. I really didn't think Johnson would do a deal in the end.

    I think ditching Cummings was absolutely key to getting a deal.

    A massive massive historical intervention by Johnson's girlfriend.

    So why do the Brexiters keep on going on and on and on about respecting democracy?
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172

    kjh said:


    My sons girlfriend is Romanian. They are both doing their Ph.Ds at Cambridge. Try telling them it only has a theoretical impact.

    Cambridge is interesting. Why do you think all the (mainly LibDem voting) wards in the North and West of Cambridge voted Remain ?

    And all the (mainly Labour voting) wards in the East of Cambridge voted Leave ?

    Suppose you were born and bought up in Cambridge. What do you think happened to rents in Cambridge as the EU poured money into Cambridge, and so created many temporary positions for many more graduate students or postdocs? All these extra people needed to be housed somewhere.

    Consequently, people of modest income (& yes probably modest ability) found themselves completely priced out of rents in affluent Cambridge because of this. They had to live with their parents in cramped houses or leave the city.

    More generally, the impact of the EU was usually to aid the affluent middle-classes (or soon to be middle-classes).

    Such people proved unwilling or unable to share their good fortune with those who ended up worse off because of EU policies (such as apprentices or the children of low-skilled manual workers in the city of Cambridge who found themselves priced out of the rental market in the town in which they grew up.).

    I think it is somewhat more nuanced than your picture.
    So without the EU you don't think there would be town and gown divisions, and no high-value economic activity would spring up around Cambridge driving up rents?
    Don't be silly. I am not saying rental costs in Cambridge are driven *solely* by policies of the EU. Of course not.

    I am pointing out that there are losers as well as winners from the EU. I gave a specific example, and used it to explain why the poorer Labour voting wards in the East of the city voted Leave.

    There are winners from the EU policies (here, the University of Cambridge itself). Did the winners share their good fortune with the losers (here, the people who grew up in Cambridge) ? No.

    E.g., in this instance, the University of Cambridge could have built housing for the extra grad students and postdocs .

    (They are belatedly now doing this).
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Let's not get over-excited everybody. 2020 may not be done with us yet. There's still a week left to go: will one of the member states torpedo the thing?

    Then, even if they don't, what about the European Parliament?

    Hopefully this is one less thing to worry about. That's probably true. But it's not in the bag.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,441
    kinabalu said:

    Quite so, Alastair. We are about to commence Brexit the Lived Experience as opposed to Brexit the Unicorn/Bogeyman. And Phase 1 of BtLE will be Leavers puffing the "achievement" of this minimalist Deal. This will provoke a reaction from Remainers and the fight will be on again. "Good vs Bad Deal" will serve nicely as the new battleground for people to enjoy not "moving on".

    But enough from me, lots on PT for one thing, and it is Christmas. Time for me to commence my usual cutting edge progressive one - mince pies in a minute, then later, small glass of sherry and Carols at Kings, followed by Shepherd's Pie with a slightly more expensive Red than usual, and then of course Alastair Sim.

    I wish all PBers a really good 25/12, pandemic or no pandemic. Important to try and enjoy it, I feel, because the minute it's over I sense we will be swinging straight into a full-scale and rather intense National Emergency on several fronts.

    Yes.

    One of the reasons we have a deal - and a reasonable compromise at that, as far as I can tell - is because Covid. Without the tremendous, near-existential, fast-mutating threat of a pandemic, No Deal might have happened. But everyone is now terrified, and all European governments are facing angry hostility from frightened citizens, as thousands die, and more fall sick, amidst collapsing economies.

    In that ghastly light, the compromises necessary to achieve a decent Brexit for all - retaining vital trade, intel and security links, with close allies - suddenly seem much easier. Voters will hardly care. Get it done, we have bigger pelagic fish to fry. I imagine even Macron, coughing away in Versailles, has felt this emotional and global pressure. No veto.

    On January 1 we will be plunged back into the worst winter any of us can remember. Enjoy your brandy butter, my friends, enjoy.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    I hope the PB bed wetters and PB drama queens laid No Deal as advised.
  • TOPPING said:

    Of course an effing deal is done who on earth thought otherwise?

    Andrea Jenkins
  • Cue must celebrating. Then as the impacts of what the deal is kick in expect much "hang on, why is this happening? We WON didn't we? With a deal?"
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933

    I hope the PB bed wetters and PB drama queens laid No Deal as advised.

    There's still a chance. Macron could still veto it. ;)
  • TOPPING said:

    Of course an effing deal is done who on earth thought otherwise?

    Andrea Jenkins
    Me.
  • TOPPING said:

    Of course an effing deal is done who on earth thought otherwise?

    In 2020 anything was possible. I am pleasantly surprised and relieved. Not doing a deal would have been a strategic blunder of the first order for both parties.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    RobD said:

    I hope the PB bed wetters and PB drama queens laid No Deal as advised.

    There's still a chance. Macron could still veto it. ;)
    I could consider heading off to IBAS for a grand total of 11 pence if he does.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    TOPPING said:

    Of course an effing deal is done who on earth thought otherwise?

    You must have missed the millions of metric tonnes of wasted pixels on here, claiming “No Deal It Is Then”.

    A high crossover with those PBers and the group that thought Trump would come back from the dead via court order or military coup.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,001

    Cue must celebrating. Then as the impacts of what the deal is kick in expect much "hang on, why is this happening? We WON didn't we? With a deal?"

    https://twitter.com/movement46/status/1342122412352135168
  • Presumably the deal could, theoretically, still be rejected by either the UK or EU parliaments?
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Let's not get over-excited everybody. 2020 may not be done with us yet. There's still a week left to go: will one of the member states torpedo the thing?

    Then, even if they don't, what about the European Parliament?

    Hopefully this is one less thing to worry about. That's probably true. But it's not in the bag.

    Yawn.

    Get over yourself.

    And you Sean.
  • Great piece, Alastair. Happy Christmas everybody.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    Smart and on time from the EU side.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933

    Presumably the deal could, theoretically, still be rejected by either the UK or EU parliaments?

    They'd be utterly insane to do so. It is agreed by both sides.
This discussion has been closed.