He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Be careful what you wish for - look how the 1920s ended.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Yeah but you've been locked up inside with your laptop on PB every day. I have been out working in the real world and it looks grim. Really, really grim. Unless of course you are just talking about the weather?
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
That’s polite. Go off and... something.
Are you cunningly repositioning yourself as a centrist HY?
I voted Remain, I respected the Leave vote but have never been a No Dealer
When the last remaining remainers in a Tory cabinet, gauke, Hammond, about 30 gents and ladies were trussed up in dimly lit corridor, their shirts ripped to expose their nipples, and Cummings allowed to work on them with his portable soldering iron, I’m sure you said it was all perfectly necessary. Was it not you? Apologies if you didn’t support their expulsion for just the one rebellion of their careers.
It was a confidence vote.
They knew before they voted they'd be expelled if they voted it down.
According to wikipedia after millenials/general Y comes Zoomers/General Z, and they have been succeeded by Generation Alpha, those born in the early 2010s onwards.
I hope they get a different name. As I age I presume I will increasingly see young people are uppity and superior, and I don't see why we should foster that feeling by calling them Generation Alpha. It's the mutants in X-men being Homo Superior all over again.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Be careful what you wish for - look how the 1920s ended.
For a decade of growth I'm ok with that right now. Especially given we know how to deal with economic shocks better.
Rather that than having a decade end how the thirties did.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Yeah but you've been locked up inside with your laptop on PB every day. I have been out working in the real world and it looks grim. Really, really grim. Unless of course you are just talking about the weather?
Is it a bit like the Fall Out game out there? I am hoping by the summer I can unlock the vault door and go and find out.
Playing the tier prediction game, here's my guess as to what things will look like when announced.
Let's hope the bolstered tier 2 does a job of work now.
T3: Greater Manchester (still), East Lancashire (as defined before), West Yorkshire, Teesside, ex-Humberside, Lincolnshire (except S.Kesteven & S.Holland), Leicester, Oadby & Blaby, Stoke & Staffordshire (all), S. Derbyshire, W. Mids Metro (except Coventry), Kent (all) T1: Cornwall only T2: Everywhere else
Liverpool T2?
Quite possible. The combination of T3 plus mass testing seems like it works so the idea of having mass testing available with T3 areas should help squish this.
Warrington and other parts of the NW might still be T3.
Liverpool Tier 2 v likely. Justified by improvement and it will allow Hancock to say 'look you CAN get out of Tier 3'.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
The Roaring Twenties, like from the 29th October 1929?
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Yeah but you've been locked up inside with your laptop on PB every day. I have been out working in the real world and it looks grim. Really, really grim. Unless of course you are just talking about the weather?
Is it a bit like the Fall Out game out there? I am hoping by the summer I can unlock the vault door and go and find out.
Don't, it's like "Mad Max, Beyond Thunderdome" outside!
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
Re Marta, that's not true. The point is that the EU's accounts were audited, but the EU did not take on board all the recommendations of the auditors.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
Actually, that's one of the best expressed, most heartfelt explanations of a Leave voter's thinking I have read, so credit to you @DeClare.
Of course, I do not agree with it at all, in fact I think it is deeply wrong on a number of fronts, but I think it probably summarises why many Leave voters voted as they did.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
That’s polite. Go off and... something.
Are you cunningly repositioning yourself as a centrist HY?
I voted Remain, I respected the Leave vote but have never been a No Dealer
When the last remaining remainers in a Tory cabinet, gauke, Hammond, about 30 gents and ladies were trussed up in dimly lit corridor, their shirts ripped to expose their nipples, and Cummings allowed to work on them with his portable soldering iron, I’m sure you said it was all perfectly necessary. Was it not you? Apologies if you didn’t support their expulsion for just the one rebellion of their careers.
They consistently voted to take parliamentary business away from the Government by voting for the Letwin Bill, that is what they were expelled for.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Yeah but you've been locked up inside with your laptop on PB every day. I have been out working in the real world and it looks grim. Really, really grim. Unless of course you are just talking about the weather?
Is it a bit like the Fall Out game out there? I am hoping by the summer I can unlock the vault door and go and find out.
Don't, it's like "Mad Max, Beyond Thunderdome" outside!
I really haven't been out much since March, certainly not to anywhere with significant people, just for driving and walks in fairly remote countryside. I think I will be in for a bit of sensory overload as and when things start to open up and venture out to population centres.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Be careful what you wish for - look how the 1920s ended.
For a decade of growth I'm ok with that right now. Especially given we know how to deal with economic shocks better.
Rather that than having a decade end how the thirties did.
Well fair point but... the Thirties only ended as they did because they followed 1929.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
Re Marta, that's not true. The point is that the EU's accounts were audited, but the EU did not take on board all the recommendations of the auditors.
When she pointed that out and refused to sign off the accounts she was sacked for ''failure to show sufficient loyalty and respect"
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
"I was angry that someone was telling me I couldn't work overtime just after I signed a thing saying I could,"
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
Labour shouldn't support it. It needs to be seen as fully and utterly a Tory mess.
Starmer has folded at the prospect of no deal chaos.
The Tories on here have been very persuasive that rejecting Mrs May's WA deal, and allowing the prospect of no deal Brexit was entirely the fault of Labour.
2016 should have been a vote to leave the EU or not, 2020 should have been accept the governments negotiation or not. Direct democracy does not work unless the people asked also get say on alternative. Otherwise, the sound policy of putting pre 2016 major changes to our membership to the people is now being slain. Otherwise giving governments a blank check to get a deal through the commons, is a complete mockery of the 2016 vote. No? It could be a Labour government putting their interpretation of the 2016 vote through the commons between now and Christmas.
As in industrial relations, you vote to send your representatives to negotiate with the bosses, only those with straw for brains vote up front to accept whatever shit they come back with.
Taking direct democracy out the box without any experience how to properly use it was the most dumbest thing UK has ever done.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
People voted leave for different reasons but not that many were worried about trade:
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours. How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
"I was angry that someone was telling me I couldn't work overtime just after I signed a thing saying I could,"
Thick as wet sand.
And I signed the thing because somebody told me to.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Be careful what you wish for - look how the 1920s ended.
For a decade of growth I'm ok with that right now. Especially given we know how to deal with economic shocks better.
Rather that than having a decade end how the thirties did.
Well fair point but... the Thirties only ended as they did because they followed 1929.
Yes but then some people seem to think this year and what is coming is 1929.
If the next decade is a decade of growth instead of a decade of misery then that is an unqualified good thing.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
I'd be surprised. It just reminds people how barking the whole project is and who the loonies behind it were.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being a member of the EU.
Why is that? I don't see intractible remainers holding up their hands and thinking it ok to return to the Tories as a deal was had after all, perhaps they'd gain a few points back from those who had feared incompetence would mean no deal, but against that you have the Faragist element. Will there really be that much of a change?
I do take Benpointer's, er, point, that in conjunction with a positive plan for vaccine rollout perhaps there will be a larger movement, though I'd also agree with him about longer term prospects in terms of Labour leads - though if it will be enough, I am uncertain of.
I don't think the lead will be long lasting. Relief at a vaccine and a trade deal should boost Johnson, however it will soon subside at the realisation that we are well and truly up the creek.
I'm quite optimistic for next summer onwards.
I think we could have a Roaring Twenties coming up.
Yeah but you've been locked up inside with your laptop on PB every day. I have been out working in the real world and it looks grim. Really, really grim. Unless of course you are just talking about the weather?
Is it a bit like the Fall Out game out there? I am hoping by the summer I can unlock the vault door and go and find out.
Don't, it's like "Mad Max, Beyond Thunderdome" outside!
I really haven't been out much since March, certainly not to anywhere with significant people, just for driving and walks in fairly remote countryside. I think I will be in for a bit of sensory overload as and when things start to open up and venture out to population centres.
Other than people wearing masks, not much looks to have changed. More shops boarded up in High Streets, hardly any '20 and '70 plate cars, but on the face of it much as before.
The economic picture looks horrendous. I am in a business which is shielded by a statutory requirement for the service I provide. I have been busy, but the penny dropped a few weeks ago that almost all the work I am currently engaged in, was generated before lockdown.
Philip's assumption that it will all be fine and dandy by next summer is for the birds. We might see a "v" shaped recovery in the spring, although I suspect that will be simply indicate a swallow rather than a summer. The economy, across the developed world has been structurally devastated. I am not sure we have noticed that yet.
He has a majority of 80 and can get it through regardless, the diehards can go off and join Farage
The blue collar Tories I rub shoulders with will see the trade deal as Johnson's second Falklands moment in a week (after the vaccine).
I wonder if I can get a refund for all that "no deal" bog roll?
The whole of Brexit is a Falklands moment for Britain. As in, Argentina's Falklands moment.
The Conservatives will see a double digit poll lead on a deal with the EU, irrespective of how inferior it is to our still being members.
We won't be members, we would be an outside country that has a trade deal with the EU and the deal could be amended in the future if both parties agree.
I think you have missed my point. The relief at getting any deal, rather than no trade deal chaos will bolster Johnson's poll rating in the short term, even if that deal makes the nation significantly poorer than had we voted "remain" in 2016.
I'd be surprised. It just reminds people how barking the whole project is and who the loonies behind it were.
You and I may think that, but the people I meet working in "Red Wall" Port Talbot remain excited at the prospect of a trade deal. They think it will keep their steel works open. I, on the other hand believe that ship has sailed.
Comments
They knew before they voted they'd be expelled if they voted it down.
I hope they get a different name. As I age I presume I will increasingly see young people are uppity and superior, and I don't see why we should foster that feeling by calling them Generation Alpha. It's the mutants in X-men being Homo Superior all over again.
The cost of the EU, the general inefficiency and waste, when their chief accountant Marta Andreasen pointed out that EU accounts were never audited properly, they sacked her.
Free movement of people, the Labour government interpreted this as meaning that anyone from the EU could decide to move here, without criminal record checks, credit checks or health checks.
EU courts being able to boss British people around, I was incensed when I used to do a lot overtime and my boss came to me and said I had to sign some sort of waiver because the EU had issued some 'directive' limiting a persons working hours.
How could any British government agree that foreigners can tell a British citizen how many hours he can work?
These are three reasons for voting to leave and when David Cameron tried to make changes in the Winter before the referendum, changes that didn't even go anywhere near far enough, they more or less told him to F-off.
Rather that than having a decade end how the thirties did.
Of course, I do not agree with it at all, in fact I think it is deeply wrong on a number of fronts, but I think it probably summarises why many Leave voters voted as they did.
Thick as wet sand.
As in industrial relations, you vote to send your representatives to negotiate with the bosses, only those with straw for brains vote up front to accept whatever shit they come back with.
Taking direct democracy out the box without any experience how to properly use it was the most dumbest thing UK has ever done.
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1331362186543964160?s=20
If the next decade is a decade of growth instead of a decade of misery then that is an unqualified good thing.
The economic picture looks horrendous. I am in a business which is shielded by a statutory requirement for the service I provide. I have been busy, but the penny dropped a few weeks ago that almost all the work I am currently engaged in, was generated before lockdown.
Philip's assumption that it will all be fine and dandy by next summer is for the birds. We might see a "v" shaped recovery in the spring, although I suspect that will be simply indicate a swallow rather than a summer. The economy, across the developed world has been structurally devastated. I am not sure we have noticed that yet.