politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The latest ads from a campaign to turn Republicans against Trump
This one is particularly important because Senator Lindsay Graham has emerged as the main attack dog for Trump. It very much undermines what he is trying to do now as part of helping the President get re-elected.
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
Robert Clive, outside the FCO.
Yes, good call.
Clive was India. BLM do not care about India.
A more plausible target would surely be Charles Gordon on the Embankment, although there would be a certain irony in that given he at least temporarily disrupted slaving in Sudan and the Horn of Africa.
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
It’s ironic that the two presumed great champions of Parliamentary democracy in England - Simon de Montfort and Cromwell - were also both genocidal nutters.
There’s also something of an irony in that having fought a vicious war to impose Parliament on the king, once getting to power they both sidelined it to arrogate power to themselves.
Who could we have as a Parliamentary champion untainted by slaving? Disraeli perhaps, as the author of the Second Reform Act? But even he made some pretty unpleasant remarks about the Irish.
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
I hope you're right but I think you are wrong. When you feed a mob it is like feeding a fire, the mob just grows and gets hungrier.
The mad iconoclastic Left is on a roll. Why should they stop now?
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
I hope you're right but I think you are wrong. When you feed a mob it is like feeding a fire, the mob just grows and gets hungrier.
The mad iconoclastic Left is on a roll. Why should they stop now?
Didn't you say all this in 2017 When they were taking down racist statues in America post-Charlottesville?
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
I hope you're right but I think you are wrong. When you feed a mob it is like feeding a fire, the mob just grows and gets hungrier.
The mad iconoclastic Left is on a roll. Why should they stop now?
The right may have won the election but the left have long since won the culture war. The floodgates are now open and there is no stopping this.
The starters have only just been consumed, it’s main course next.
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
I hope you're right but I think you are wrong. When you feed a mob it is like feeding a fire, the mob just grows and gets hungrier.
The mad iconoclastic Left is on a roll. Why should they stop now?
The right may have won the election but the left have long since won the culture war. The floodgates are now open and there is no stopping this.
The starters have only just been consumed, it’s main course next.
Have they? They may have done on gay rights, divorce and abortion, they certainly have not on uncontrolled immigration, or erasing patriotism and national sovereignty etc.
If they go too far then the right will respond with rightwing populists in response and Boris and Trump and Salvini, Tony Abbott, Bolsonaro, even Le Pen etc will become the norm for the leadership of the western right if the centre right establishment is seen as too weak to stand up to extreme wokeism
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
It’s ironic that the two presumed great champions of Parliamentary democracy in England - Simon de Montfort and Cromwell - were also both genocidal nutters.
There’s also something of an irony in that having fought a vicious war to impose Parliament on the king, once getting to power they both sidelined it to arrogate power to themselves.
Who could we have as a Parliamentary champion untainted by slaving? Disraeli perhaps, as the author of the Second Reform Act? But even he made some pretty unpleasant remarks about the Irish.
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
I suspect we are more or less done with the statues. I'd be surprised if we ever get to double figures. The point has been made (and the statues were never the point anyway).
I hope you're right but I think you are wrong. When you feed a mob it is like feeding a fire, the mob just grows and gets hungrier.
The mad iconoclastic Left is on a roll. Why should they stop now?
The right may have won the election but the left have long since won the culture war. The floodgates are now open and there is no stopping this.
The starters have only just been consumed, it’s main course next.
Well, it's their college so the Governing Body has the final say, especially as Oxford Council has no objection. But if they really wanted to take it down, they'd do so immediately without waiting for the outcome of the inquiry, so I imagine they're hoping that something will come up that will, on balance, cause the inquiry to recommend retention.
Arse-covering on an epic scale, in other words.
My understanding is that they are taking it down, and the enquiry is into the scholarship.
Am I wrong in that?
That doesn't seem to be what their letter indicates. Although the whole thing is vague and weaselly:
Who can blame them when the Johnson government allows them to twist in the wind, as opposed to providing a firm lead.
Getting views from lots of interested bodies, having an impartial expert evaluate the decision the Governing Body have made... sounds like due process to me.
And the problem with removing statues was a lack of due process, wasn't it?
(Was at the Better Place, myself)
What now happens to all those colleges named after Medieval Robber Barons and Nobles? Let's hope they were all purer than the driven snow by 21st Century currently fashionable values?
I suppose that Oxford Uni has created a huge majority of recent PMs, so the values are consonant.
Well quite. Having been at a part of the Better Place whose founders had more sense than to name themselves after a single benefactor (and have been, by Oxbridge standards, church mouse frugal throughout their existence), I'd like to offer these observations.
Yes, if you have made a fortune in a bad way, it's right to seek redemption by doing good with your ill-gotten riches. But the classy thing to do is to sink (or slink) into the background.
Name the scholarship after your aunt, your mother's maiden name, or your favourite saint. Otherwise you're still trying to justify yourself, and that's not classy.
Have a portrait in Hall, or better still in a corridor. Have the chapel choir sing prayers for the (hopefully only slightly uncomfortable) repose of your soul. But don't expect people to walk under a statue of you on a regular basis, just because some of your riches are supporting their studies. That's not polite.
American Confederate statues, Edward Colston... the statues generally came long after the death of the people they commemorate. Bluntly, they've always been fairly unpleasant power moves. And smart conservatives in history have always recognised that reform is better than revolution. Wokeism may be embarrassing, and I won't try to justify all of it. But if people can't show the manners or empathy to think that the hurt caused to living people by statues of slave traders might be a problem, they can't be shocked if there's an overreaction.
Slave traders are one thing. But look at their ever-extending list of targets
Captain Cook, Lord Nelson, Oliver Cromwell, King Charles, Robert Peel, James II...
Basically it is all of British history. They want to erase it.
But that's the dumbmness of the "Save All Statues" argument.
If Oriel had said years ago, "We appreciate the hurt, so we are having a long conversation with the intention of moving the statue to a respectful place in the Master's Garden", it would have cut off the issue. It's the attempt to appear strong by not yielding at all that's given the issue legs.
No, far from erasing history the movement has made for more discussion of slavery than any time in my life.
Because you were unable to discuss slavery before its monuments were destroyed?
Not destroyed, merely removed. Never has there been such widespread discussion of our role in the history of the slave trade. Far from burying that history, we are turning on the searchlight.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
Shall we cheer ourselves up with a gentleman's (or gentlewoman's) sweepstake on Which Statue Will Be Next
I'm going for Kitchener. Or maybe Cromwell
I will defend Cromwell's statues.
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
It’s ironic that the two presumed great champions of Parliamentary democracy in England - Simon de Montfort and Cromwell - were also both genocidal nutters.
There’s also something of an irony in that having fought a vicious war to impose Parliament on the king, once getting to power they both sidelined it to arrogate power to themselves.
Who could we have as a Parliamentary champion untainted by slaving? Disraeli perhaps, as the author of the Second Reform Act? But even he made some pretty unpleasant remarks about the Irish.
Funnily enough, I used to live in St Ives, which ended up with a statue of Cromwell after Huntingdon decided it didn't want one.
Thomas Carlyle's comments (grabbed from Wikipedia, but originally in a letter proposing the statue) seem relevant to the whole statue debate:
"My private suspicion I confess is that the present generation of Englishmen—who have filled their towns with such a set of "public statues" as were never before erected by any people, ugly brazen images (to mere commonplace adventurers with titles on them, and even sometimes to mere paltry scoundrels, worthy of immediate oblivion only)..."
No, far from erasing history the movement has made for more discussion of slavery than any time in my life.
Because you were unable to discuss slavery before its monuments were destroyed?
Not destroyed, merely removed. Never has there been such widespread discussion of our role in the history of the slave trade. Far from burying that history, we are turning on the searchlight.
Not a search light that needed turning, really. I am astonished by the amount of ignorance of this country's history laid bare in recent weeks, best highlighted by ludicrous comparisons between slavers and Jimmy Savile, as if the Royal Africa Company operated in secret and illegally.
No, far from erasing history the movement has made for more discussion of slavery than any time in my life.
Because you were unable to discuss slavery before its monuments were destroyed?
Not destroyed, merely removed. Never has there been such widespread discussion of our role in the history of the slave trade. Far from burying that history, we are turning on the searchlight.
Indeed. Whatever the right and wrongs of statues - and quite frankly I don’t care all that much either way; we are not the US - history is not going to be erased.
Certain aspects less celebrated, or no longer glossed over, perhaps.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Johnson is gone next year would be my bet. The MPs - where the base has shifted radically from traditional Tory types to favouring Red Wall interests - will want someone to stand up to the mob. That's why I think Priti Patel is the better bet for next Cons leader / PM ahead of Rishi Sunak.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's ephemeral and will be forgotten before long.
Compared to Covid-19 and the economic consequences, it's not even worth being called chip paper.
To be fair, Conservative supporters need every bit of encouragement they can find in the next few months and years. It's going to be a painful, humiliating and tortuous route to their final defeat in 2024 - let's get in the popcorn.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Are they? Boris stood firmly behind keeping the Churchill statue up for instance and Tory members are fully opposed to wokeism and they elect the Tory leader
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
Yup. Tomorrow night would be good.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's ephemeral and will be forgotten before long.
Compared to Covid-19 and the economic consequences, it's not even worth being called chip paper.
To be fair, Conservative supporters need every bit of encouragement they can find in the next few months and years. It's going to be a painful, humiliating and tortuous route to their final defeat in 2024 - let's get in the popcorn.
The Tories 2019 vote remains rock solid, these events just reinforce that, the only movement has been LD to Labour
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
We will find out in November, the 1968 radical left riots at the Democratic convention destroyed the campaign chances of the moderate, decent Vice President Humphrey and gave Nixon a narrow victory on a law and order platform
"Two of the UK's biggest companies have pledged to pay large sums to black, Asian and minority ethnic (BAME) communities after their roles in the slave trade were highlighted in a major academic database.
Greene King, one of the UK's largest pub chains, and Lloyd's of London, one of the world's biggest insurance firms, both said they would make payments.
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
Yup. Tomorrow night would be good.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
Far more than 100s closing I would say unless they sort this out. There are roughly 50K pubs. More than 1% are going to close. Way more I would guess.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
Young Conservative voters are few, but in terms of PC values, closer to young Lab voters. It is an age interest more than a right/left one.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Johnson is gone next year would be my bet. The MPs - where the base has shifted radically from traditional Tory types to favouring Red Wall interests - will want someone to stand up to the mob. That's why I think Priti Patel is the better bet for next Cons leader / PM ahead of Rishi Sunak.
I agree Johnson goes next year. Not sure about Patel. Sunak seems likelier.
I think you're right about Boris; if anything, the risk is on him going earlier. He's not well, he's not doing well and he has always enjoyed the pursuit more than the possession. He's found a way of surviving PMQs; if it hadn't been for that, I could imagine him stomping off in a sulk because everyone is being so mean to him.
As for his successor; the next few years are likely to be a bit of a mess. Government is going to be difficult and Boris and Brexit-in-the-abstract are the only things holding the Conservative party and vote together right now. On top of that, there's the Covid fallout.
So if I were young, smart and ambitious, I might look to hold back for now. Take over after the defeat in 2024, be PM in 2029. It might be a nice job by then. So not Sunak as king, though maybe as kingmaker.
But someone has to take over. They need to be competent enough, ambitious enough and realising that it's now or never. Why doesn't that point to M. Gove?
Jeez. The woman was treated so badly she has decided to use font size 0.0003, meaning this distressing account of her appalling treatment can only be read by ants
This big enough for your weary old peepers, sport?
'Today’s organised demonstration by Glasgow No Evictions Campaign, in support of asylum seekers currently living in temporary accommodation in Glasgow and their demands was attended by at least 80 people, holding placards and peacefully demonstrating in solidarity.
The asylum seekers are demanding to go back to their flats. They are also demanding the immediate reinstatement of their financial support which has been entirely cut by the state, as well as an improvement in the quality of their food for the duration of their stay in temporary accommodation.
In response to this demonstration, neo-nazi group National Defence League (NDL) held a counter demonstration under the premise of defending the statues of George Square. They issued a call out for one hour before the Glasgow No Evictions demonstration. Approximately 250 neo-nazis and loyalists assembled at the square.
It is important to note the Glasgow No Evictions Campaign never mentioned any intent to attack statues or any other structures- the demonstration was entirely peaceful and in solidarity with struggling asylum seekers. The mobilisation of neo-nazis against this event, on the pretext of defending statues, should therefore be seen as an attempt to exploit the situation to spread disinformation and influence more people.'
"Two of the UK's biggest companies have pledged to pay large sums to black, Asian and minority ethnic (BAME) communities after their roles in the slave trade were highlighted in a major academic database.
Greene King, one of the UK's largest pub chains, and Lloyd's of London, one of the world's biggest insurance firms, both said they would make payments.
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
Yup. Tomorrow night would be good.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
Far more than 100s closing I would say unless they sort this out. There are roughly 50K pubs. More than 1% are going to close. Way more I would guess.
There needs to be something special to help pubs, cafes and restaurants.
Announcing that they can re-open from 4th of July would be a start - further funding if that is not safe to do yet.
Pubs are an intrinsic part of the culture of this country - some medium term structural support would be appropriate. How about the removal of excise duty on alcohol sold in pubs and bars?
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
Yup. Tomorrow night would be good.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
Far more than 100s closing I would say unless they sort this out. There are roughly 50K pubs. More than 1% are going to close. Way more I would guess.
A lot of pubs have been getting quiet for years. It wouldn't surprise me if half never reopen. Apart from a few city centre places, we just don't have much of a pub culture anymore.
Chillaxing with a glass of Sauvignon Blanc and Netflix is the modern way.
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
Yup. Tomorrow night would be good.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
Far more than 100s closing I would say unless they sort this out. There are roughly 50K pubs. More than 1% are going to close. Way more I would guess.
A lot of pubs have been getting quiet for years. It wouldn't surprise me if half never reopen. Apart from a few city centre places, we just don't have much of a pub culture anymore.
Chillaxing with a glass of Sauvignon Blanc and Netflix is the modern way.
I would say most of those within walking distance of my house were already in a pretty bad way, on the edge, before this struck. There are a couple that will make it I reckon, maybe one or two others. The rest gone, sadly.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Johnson is gone next year would be my bet. The MPs - where the base has shifted radically from traditional Tory types to favouring Red Wall interests - will want someone to stand up to the mob. That's why I think Priti Patel is the better bet for next Cons leader / PM ahead of Rishi Sunak.
I agree Johnson goes next year. Not sure about Patel. Sunak seems likelier.
I think you're right about Boris; if anything, the risk is on him going earlier. He's not well, he's not doing well and he has always enjoyed the pursuit more than the possession. He's found a way of surviving PMQs; if it hadn't been for that, I could imagine him stomping off in a sulk because everyone is being so mean to him.
As for his successor; the next few years are likely to be a bit of a mess. Government is going to be difficult and Boris and Brexit-in-the-abstract are the only things holding the Conservative party and vote together right now. On top of that, there's the Covid fallout.
So if I were young, smart and ambitious, I might look to hold back for now. Take over after the defeat in 2024, be PM in 2029. It might be a nice job by then. So not Sunak as king, though maybe as kingmaker.
But someone has to take over. They need to be competent enough, ambitious enough and realising that it's now or never. Why doesn't that point to M. Gove?
If the Tories replace Boris, their most successful election winner since Thatcher and who still leads the polls with Gove, who makes cockroaches look popular, they would be insane
"Two of the UK's biggest companies have pledged to pay large sums to black, Asian and minority ethnic (BAME) communities after their roles in the slave trade were highlighted in a major academic database.
Greene King, one of the UK's largest pub chains, and Lloyd's of London, one of the world's biggest insurance firms, both said they would make payments.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
Well, personal view is that I think it will re BLM. We haven't had the vote yet.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
Young Conservative voters are few, but in terms of PC values, closer to young Lab voters. It is an age interest more than a right/left one.
No, far from erasing history the movement has made for more discussion of slavery than any time in my life.
Yes and this movement has changed attitudes. It's amazing to see the change in US attitudes vs a year or two ago.
I haven't seen much comparable polling from UK, but it does feel now like things like taking down statues of racists now command public support, when it wouldn't have done before.
"Two of the UK's biggest companies have pledged to pay large sums to black, Asian and minority ethnic (BAME) communities after their roles in the slave trade were highlighted in a major academic database.
Greene King, one of the UK's largest pub chains, and Lloyd's of London, one of the world's biggest insurance firms, both said they would make payments.
"My great-great-great-great grand-father was a Quaker banker named Samuel Hoare (1751-1825). As a footnote, he was nothing to do with the well-known 18th and 19th century Hoare’s Bank – that was another family entirely. No, Sam Hoare was a banker, but he was also a Quaker and in those days people were less inclined to trust their money to any old bank, as they do today."
I asked you earlier who you wanted to win the US election.
I don’t think I received an answer.
Sorry Anabobazina, I was away from the computer for hours. It wasn't deliberate.
Trump over Biden. I think Biden is very weak and not suited to dealing with the challenges the US faces. If it was Warren vs Trump, that would be a closer call.
Do I get mobs round my house and calls for my employer to sack me because of that?
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
It's only a couple of weeks ago we were being told how the BLM protests in the US were going to carry Trump back into the White House.
Young Conservative voters are few, but in terms of PC values, closer to young Lab voters. It is an age interest more than a right/left one.
Jeez. The woman was treated so badly she has decided to use font size 0.0003, meaning this distressing account of her appalling treatment can only be read by ants
This big enough for your weary old peepers, sport?
'Today’s organised demonstration by Glasgow No Evictions Campaign, in support of asylum seekers currently living in temporary accommodation in Glasgow and their demands was attended by at least 80 people, holding placards and peacefully demonstrating in solidarity.
The asylum seekers are demanding to go back to their flats. They are also demanding the immediate reinstatement of their financial support which has been entirely cut by the state, as well as an improvement in the quality of their food for the duration of their stay in temporary accommodation.
In response to this demonstration, neo-nazi group National Defence League (NDL) held a counter demonstration under the premise of defending the statues of George Square. They issued a call out for one hour before the Glasgow No Evictions demonstration. Approximately 250 neo-nazis and loyalists assembled at the square.
It is important to note the Glasgow No Evictions Campaign never mentioned any intent to attack statues or any other structures- the demonstration was entirely peaceful and in solidarity with struggling asylum seekers. The mobilisation of neo-nazis against this event, on the pretext of defending statues, should therefore be seen as an attempt to exploit the situation to spread disinformation and influence more people.'
I refuse to read anything by bellacaledonia on principle. Ethnofascist drivel is not my thing, tho it clearly pleases you
Jeez. The woman was treated so badly she has decided to use font size 0.0003, meaning this distressing account of her appalling treatment can only be read by ants
This big enough for your weary old peepers, sport?
'Today’s organised demonstration by Glasgow No Evictions Campaign, in support of asylum seekers currently living in temporary accommodation in Glasgow and their demands was attended by at least 80 people, holding placards and peacefully demonstrating in solidarity.
The asylum seekers are demanding to go back to their flats. They are also demanding the immediate reinstatement of their financial support which has been entirely cut by the state, as well as an improvement in the quality of their food for the duration of their stay in temporary accommodation.
In response to this demonstration, neo-nazi group National Defence League (NDL) held a counter demonstration under the premise of defending the statues of George Square. They issued a call out for one hour before the Glasgow No Evictions demonstration. Approximately 250 neo-nazis and loyalists assembled at the square.
It is important to note the Glasgow No Evictions Campaign never mentioned any intent to attack statues or any other structures- the demonstration was entirely peaceful and in solidarity with struggling asylum seekers. The mobilisation of neo-nazis against this event, on the pretext of defending statues, should therefore be seen as an attempt to exploit the situation to spread disinformation and influence more people.'
I refuse to read anything by bellacaledonia on principle. Ethnofascist drivel is not my thing, tho it clearly pleases you
'Do NOT make me look in a mirror.'
Do you seriously think eadric is visible in mirrors?
No, far from erasing history the movement has made for more discussion of slavery than any time in my life.
Yes and this movement has changed attitudes. It's amazing to see the change in US attitudes vs a year or two ago.
I haven't seen much comparable polling from UK, but it does feel now like things like taking down statues of racists now command public support, when it wouldn't have done before.
I wouldn't put a bet either way on this. My gut feel is that it has hardened a number of attitudes in both directions. I think most people have other more pressing problems to worry about but my feeling is that, if you are culturally conservative, you will become more entrenched and vice versa
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Post 1997, it's been a problem for the right in this country that even when they win, they think their victories are ephemeral. They will have to keep winning and winning before they eventually realise that victory is natural.
And so, as was so wearily predictable, and as was predicted by some - inc me - on here, the mob has moved on from statues to people
The problem for you may be that most people think this is unreasonable, but don't automatically transpose that thought onto the statues stuff, which has yet to find a socially normal champion.
This statues stuff is brilliant for the Conservatives. It fires up the base who thinks the left are about to seize control, reaffirms in the Red Wall voters what they hate about woke-ist middle class right on students and puts Starmer in a skewer because he can't condemn without p1ssing off his base [but also knows every day this goes on, the lower the chances he wins back these seats in 2024
That would be true if the Tories had a backbone, but they do not. They are terrified of the Woke Gestapo.
Nigel Farage is probably grinning with delight right now, somewhere in darkest Surrey, as he dreams up a name for his new party
Johnson is gone next year would be my bet. The MPs - where the base has shifted radically from traditional Tory types to favouring Red Wall interests - will want someone to stand up to the mob. That's why I think Priti Patel is the better bet for next Cons leader / PM ahead of Rishi Sunak.
I agree Johnson goes next year. Not sure about Patel. Sunak seems likelier.
I think you're right about Boris; if anything, the risk is on him going earlier. He's not well, he's not doing well and he has always enjoyed the pursuit more than the possession. He's found a way of surviving PMQs; if it hadn't been for that, I could imagine him stomping off in a sulk because everyone is being so mean to him.
As for his successor; the next few years are likely to be a bit of a mess. Government is going to be difficult and Boris and Brexit-in-the-abstract are the only things holding the Conservative party and vote together right now. On top of that, there's the Covid fallout.
So if I were young, smart and ambitious, I might look to hold back for now. Take over after the defeat in 2024, be PM in 2029. It might be a nice job by then. So not Sunak as king, though maybe as kingmaker.
But someone has to take over. They need to be competent enough, ambitious enough and realising that it's now or never. Why doesn't that point to M. Gove?
If the Tories replace Boris, their most successful election winner since Thatcher and who still leads the polls with Gove, who makes cockroaches look popular, they would be insane
I don't think the Tories will force him out, I think he will step down of his own accord. I don't think a culture war suits him in the same way as flying the flag on Brexit. Plus there is the question of his health.
Comments
He put those arrogant monarchs in their place and gave us parliamentary supremacy.
All democrats should be positively tumescent about Cromwell.
A more plausible target would surely be Charles Gordon on the Embankment, although there would be a certain irony in that given he at least temporarily disrupted slaving in Sudan and the Horn of Africa.
There’s also something of an irony in that having fought a vicious war to impose Parliament on the king, once getting to power they both sidelined it to arrogate power to themselves.
Who could we have as a Parliamentary champion untainted by slaving? Disraeli perhaps, as the author of the Second Reform Act? But even he made some pretty unpleasant remarks about the Irish.
There are an almost infinite amount of attack lines. Attacking someone on health grounds sets a very dangerous, unethical precedent I think
And on that note, I’m off to bed.
Good night.
The starters have only just been consumed, it’s main course next.
If they go too far then the right will respond with rightwing populists in response and Boris and Trump and Salvini, Tony Abbott, Bolsonaro, even Le Pen etc will become the norm for the leadership of the western right if the centre right establishment is seen as too weak to stand up to extreme wokeism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX9reO3QnUA#t=12s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1b8Hpgkw4A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJgTX-QNtjM#t=15s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX9reO3QnUA#t=12s
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jun/17/lockdown-beer-firms-warn-boris-johnson-sales-confusion-reopening-uk-jobs
... Hundreds of pubs could shut for ever unless Boris Johnson decides in the next 48 hours when they can reopen, the UK’s largest beer companies have warned.
In an open letter to the prime minister, more than 50 companies said plummeting beer sales and prolonged uncertainty had brought the pub and brewing industry to “a moment of maximum jeopardy” that could cost hundreds of thousands of jobs.
The signatories – from global giants such as the Guinness owner Diageo to family brewers such as Adnam’s – urged Johnson to say by Friday whether the government would allow pubs to reopen from 4 July....
No-one appears to have anything positive to say at all, we have five months more of this to come.
I don’t think I received an answer.
Thomas Carlyle's comments (grabbed from Wikipedia, but originally in a letter proposing the statue) seem relevant to the whole statue debate:
"My private suspicion I confess is that the present generation of Englishmen—who have filled their towns with such a set of "public statues" as were never before erected by any people, ugly brazen images (to mere commonplace adventurers with titles on them, and even sometimes to mere paltry scoundrels, worthy of immediate oblivion only)..."
Health is off limits.
https://twitter.com/GrayInGlasgow/status/1273237832488890368?s=20
Whatever the right and wrongs of statues - and quite frankly I don’t care all that much either way; we are not the US - history is not going to be erased.
Certain aspects less celebrated, or no longer glossed over, perhaps.
I certainly wouldn’t want to see ads of that ilk in the UK.
Compared to Covid-19 and the economic consequences, it's not even worth being called chip paper.
To be fair, Conservative supporters need every bit of encouragement they can find in the next few months and years. It's going to be a painful, humiliating and tortuous route to their final defeat in 2024 - let's get in the popcorn.
Someone told me that the hospitality sector is expecting an announcement tomorrow; let’s hope this letter is timed to align with that.
Funny old world.
Greene King, one of the UK's largest pub chains, and Lloyd's of London, one of the world's biggest insurance firms, both said they would make payments.
The payments mark the first time the controversy over the UK's past involvement with slavery, which has led to statues being torn down, has impacted the corporate sector."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/17/companies-britain-linked-slave-trade-say-today/
https://twitter.com/ClarkeMicah/status/1273315147004641280?s=20
https://twitter.com/ArchRose90/status/1272984874195050498
What a leader...
https://twitter.com/sophgaston/status/1272525523583934466?s=09
As for his successor; the next few years are likely to be a bit of a mess. Government is going to be difficult and Boris and Brexit-in-the-abstract are the only things holding the Conservative party and vote together right now. On top of that, there's the Covid fallout.
So if I were young, smart and ambitious, I might look to hold back for now. Take over after the defeat in 2024, be PM in 2029. It might be a nice job by then. So not Sunak as king, though maybe as kingmaker.
But someone has to take over. They need to be competent enough, ambitious enough and realising that it's now or never. Why doesn't that point to M. Gove?
This is going to be the most brutal we have ever seen I reckon.
That's pretty shit, and hardly embodies the spirit of country we're trying to promote.
https://twitter.com/bellacaledonia/status/1273357759090765830?s=20
'Today’s organised demonstration by Glasgow No Evictions Campaign, in support of asylum seekers currently living in temporary accommodation in Glasgow and their demands was attended by at least 80 people, holding placards and peacefully demonstrating in solidarity.
The asylum seekers are demanding to go back to their flats. They are also demanding the immediate reinstatement of their financial support which has been entirely cut by the state, as well as an improvement in the quality of their food for the duration of their stay in temporary accommodation.
In response to this demonstration, neo-nazi group National Defence League (NDL) held a counter demonstration under the premise of defending the statues of George Square. They issued a call out for one hour before the Glasgow No Evictions demonstration. Approximately 250 neo-nazis and loyalists assembled at the square.
It is important to note the Glasgow No Evictions Campaign never mentioned any intent to attack statues or any other structures- the demonstration was entirely peaceful and in solidarity with struggling asylum seekers. The mobilisation of neo-nazis against this event, on the pretext of defending statues, should therefore be seen as an attempt to exploit the situation to spread disinformation and influence more people.'
I wonder whether any of the London banking houses with old enough roots are considering their position.
Announcing that they can re-open from 4th of July would be a start - further funding if that is not safe to do yet.
Pubs are an intrinsic part of the culture of this country - some medium term structural support would be appropriate. How about the removal of excise duty on alcohol sold in pubs and bars?
Meanwhile in Germany...
App up and running. Apple/Google os based.
What a shower our lot are. Pathetically predictable.
Chillaxing with a glass of Sauvignon Blanc and Netflix is the modern way.
I feel sorry for him though. He fathered 4 little Dukes of Cambridge and none of them made it past 3.
I have done my best over the years
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Hoare_Jr
I haven't seen much comparable polling from UK, but it does feel now like things like taking down statues of racists now command public support, when it wouldn't have done before.
https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1273364932722130945
"My great-great-great-great grand-father was a Quaker banker named Samuel Hoare (1751-1825). As a footnote, he was nothing to do with the well-known 18th and 19th century Hoare’s Bank – that was another family entirely. No, Sam Hoare was a banker, but he was also a Quaker and in those days people were less inclined to trust their money to any old bank, as they do today."
https://pryorfrancis.wordpress.com/2012/02/23/the-slave-trade-beginning-the-end/
Trump over Biden. I think Biden is very weak and not suited to dealing with the challenges the US faces. If it was Warren vs Trump, that would be a closer call.
Do I get mobs round my house and calls for my employer to sack me because of that?
Zefram Cock-up!