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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Boris is back but there’ll be no premature move to ease the lo

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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,013
    Mr. Dawning, it's legitimate to criticise that cartoon. There's been a distinction throughout the entire situation between a few who work and the many who don't.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,468
    MattW said:

    Gardening Corner with @Cyclefree. Today's garden question - (13), I think.

    I like hostas, as do slugs. My many clumps and pots of inherited hostas are about to break through. How do I protect them from slugs? Is it as simple as a band of eggshells on the soil (of which I have also inherited a fair quantity)?

    https://twitter.com/mattwardman/status/1254727694832590848

    My mum (who won Redbridge in Bloom several times) uses egg shells.
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    ClippPClippP Posts: 1,703
    RobD said:

    ClippP said:

    "HealthSec Hancock is lumbered by his commitment to 100k tests a day by the end of the month. A fit Boris, surely, would have stopped such an announcement being made."

    Come off it, Mike. Boris Johnson would have committed to 200,000 tests a day, and with the same pathetic prospect of achieving his target.
    But all the PB Tories would have come out, saying "Isn´t Boris wonderful! Such a card! What fun!" etc etc. As usual.

    I see your 200,000 and raise you 250,000
    6 weeks ago tomorrow Boris Johnson said "We're massively increasing the testing to see whether you have it now and ramping up daily testing from 5,000 a day, to 10,000 to 25,000 and then up at 250,000,"
    I think the plan was to have the antibody test in place, which is why they ordered quite a few of them. Turns out they were all crap.
    So the hapless Hancock was doing his master a favour really by reducing the taget and not making him look so ridiculous! Isn`t that right, you diehard loyalist Tories? Hancock, Hancock, ra, ra ,ra!
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,013
    Mr. xP, hard to take Eaton seriously after his treatment of Scruton.
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    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,379
    So whilst the media is criticised for stupid questions p clipp and those of his persuasion make ridiculous comments about testing. It really isn't constructive in any way... but then i guess they know that.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,849

    Reuters has a pretty interesting article on the US prison testing in Ohio.

    In one prison of 2,500, 2,300 were tested.

    just over 2,000 were found to be positive. That's maybe not surprising considering the cramped conditions of prisons once the virus gets going.

    The interesting bit is that 95% of the 2,000 positives had no symptoms. Yikes.

    At the time of testing - what was the followup ?
    As @Foxy 's Korea paper suggests, the majority should develop some symptoms within 14 days.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    I don't agree that the return of Boris makes it less likely there'll be an early relaxation.

    Ultimately while Boris was out his understudy was never going to rock the boat too much. I think the chances of lockdown being lifted early were zero as long as the PM was too sick to work due to the virus.

    Now that Boris is back having undergone the virus and come close to the worst himself he's going to be naturally cautious. The chances of an early lockdown lift now are negligible.

    But as anyone who bets on longshots understands, a negligible chance is more chance than no chance.
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    rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    On a good day, even Trump might find that a bit cringey. On a good day.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,849
    Foxy said:

    kamski said:

    Foxy said:

    Also an interesting piece on the epidemiology of spread in a Korean call centre:

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1254741387595177985?s=19

    Tracing where spread occurs is pretty vital to effective social distancing.

    I'm surprised that with their app-based contact tracing that S Korea does not have more information about where transmission is actually happening.
    Did you see the paper? they traced very carefully. Even to the map of the call centre floor, blue being the infected desks.:


    Anyone else experience the optical illusion where the desks in rows in the room at the bottom of the screen look smaller than the ones at the top ?
    (When in fact they're identical...)
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,842
    Nigelb said:

    Reuters has a pretty interesting article on the US prison testing in Ohio.

    In one prison of 2,500, 2,300 were tested.

    just over 2,000 were found to be positive. That's maybe not surprising considering the cramped conditions of prisons once the virus gets going.

    The interesting bit is that 95% of the 2,000 positives had no symptoms. Yikes.

    At the time of testing - what was the followup ?
    As @Foxy 's Korea paper suggests, the majority should develop some symptoms within 14 days.
    We get very different numbers on tests on asymptomatic people. Some may be lack of follow up to see if they did later develop symptoms, some may be false positives, some may be genuine differences. It is hard to see through the murk exactly what is going on.
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,960
    edited April 2020

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    Deleted.
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    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,379
    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,013
    For some strange reason I suddenly wish Aslan was PM.

    I think we'd all be better off if a magic talking lion who is also Jesus was in charge.
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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,318
    4 million in furlough scheme so far.

    Assume average salary £20k (as it's likely to be well below median salary) - cost to Govt is 80% = £16k = £1,333 per month.

    4 million * £1,333 = £5.333bn per month

    3 month cost = £16bn

    Really not very much at all - though of course it's only a very small part of the total cost.
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    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,379

    Mr. xP, hard to take Eaton seriously after his treatment of Scruton.

    Thank you for pointing this out to.me
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,163

    For some strange reason I suddenly wish Aslan was PM.

    I think we'd all be better off if a magic talking lion who is also Jesus was in charge.

    Agreed.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,177
    I had hoped we'd heard the last of the New Stateman's George Eaton after his disgraceful treatment of Sir Roger Scruton.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,287
    If I were a cynic, which I am not, I might start thinking that the Government/Telegraph ramping of the idea the country is straining at the leash to get back to normal, and the lockdown “fraying”, without any real evidence either is the case, allows them to claim success if the rate of deaths continues to fall and blame the public if it starts to rise. But I am sure no one in HMG is Machiavellian enough to even contemplate such a thing.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,125
    Pulpstar said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Just 1,137 tests performed yesterday in Scotland.

    Wales are also really struggling to expand the number of tests. They have quietly dropped their own target of 5,000 a day.
    1137 tests is piss poor for Scotland, they should be around 8% of the entire UK.
    All the whining about follow UK and so they wait on England sending the teams / processes / kit etc and now you whine that they are behind schedule.
    Why Sturgeon did not lead from start and say she would do what suited Scotland not follow Westminster orders is the issue.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,405

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
    Er, I'm no astrophysicist (no, really) - but if you fail to get to the moon which stars exactly do you reach?
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,791

    Mr. xP, hard to take Eaton seriously after his treatment of Scruton.

    Why is he still employed?

    Up there with Richard "MMR" Horton at the Lancet to be viewed with considerable scepticism!
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    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,921
    Scott_xP said:
    That's quite the blizzard of numbers. Maybe it sounds impressive but I doubt it cuts through as well as stories and a simple message.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    DougSeal said:

    If I were a cynic, which I am not, I might start thinking that the Government/Telegraph ramping of the idea the country is straining at the leash to get back to normal, and the lockdown “fraying”, without any real evidence either is the case, allows them to claim success if the rate of deaths continues to fall and blame the public if it starts to rise. But I am sure no one in HMG is Machiavellian enough to even contemplate such a thing.

    There is evidence. Did you miss the slides about transport usage (which have been getting published at the press conferences for a while now) showing that transport usage has started to go back up again? Considering we're still under lockdown, that's not a good thing and shouldn't be happening.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,106
    rkrkrk said:

    Scott_xP said:
    That's quite the blizzard of numbers. Maybe it sounds impressive but I doubt it cuts through as well as stories and a simple message.
    Maybe not, but it is a reasonable criticism is it not?
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,791
    Scott_xP said:

    And if we'd had Prime Minister Corbyn, what a cavalcade of wit and genius we would have enjoyed!
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,299

    For some strange reason I suddenly wish Aslan was PM.

    I think we'd all be better off if a magic talking lion who is also Jesus was in charge.

    We could also have fascinating discussions on where a centaur's genitalia is located and whether it's horse or human sized.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,125
    rpjs said:

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    On a good day, even Trump might find that a bit cringey. On a good day.
    Vomit inducing
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited April 2020
    TOPPING said:

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
    Er, I'm no astrophysicist (no, really) - but if you fail to get to the moon which stars exactly do you reach?
    What did I just say about being pedantic? ;)
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,405

    TOPPING said:

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
    Er, I'm no astrophysicist (no, really) - but if you fail to get to the moon which stars exactly do you reach?
    What did I just say about being pedantic? ;)
    Don't blame me, Socrates started it.
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    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,921
    MikeL said:

    4 million in furlough scheme so far.

    Assume average salary £20k (as it's likely to be well below median salary) - cost to Govt is 80% = £16k = £1,333 per month.

    4 million * £1,333 = £5.333bn per month

    3 month cost = £16bn

    Really not very much at all - though of course it's only a very small part of the total cost.

    Furloughed still pay income tax and national insurance, so cost is less still.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,407
    edited April 2020
    Chancellor announces 100% loan guarantee by HMG for small businesses upto £50,000
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    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,921

    rkrkrk said:

    Scott_xP said:
    That's quite the blizzard of numbers. Maybe it sounds impressive but I doubt it cuts through as well as stories and a simple message.
    Maybe not, but it is a reasonable criticism is it not?
    Definitely. I just hope it's effective as well.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,631
    rkrkrk said:

    MikeL said:

    4 million in furlough scheme so far.

    Assume average salary £20k (as it's likely to be well below median salary) - cost to Govt is 80% = £16k = £1,333 per month.

    4 million * £1,333 = £5.333bn per month

    3 month cost = £16bn

    Really not very much at all - though of course it's only a very small part of the total cost.

    Furloughed still pay income tax and national insurance, so cost is less still.
    That's only an offset against the loss of income tax and NI on the real income.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited April 2020
    rkrkrk said:

    MikeL said:

    4 million in furlough scheme so far.

    Assume average salary £20k (as it's likely to be well below median salary) - cost to Govt is 80% = £16k = £1,333 per month.

    4 million * £1,333 = £5.333bn per month

    3 month cost = £16bn

    Really not very much at all - though of course it's only a very small part of the total cost.

    Furloughed still pay income tax and national insurance, so cost is less still.
    And aren't claiming unemployment benefits etc they would have without the scheme, so even less still net versus lockdown without the scheme.
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    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
    The tweet links to a column, with which I heartily concur, that is not written by Eaton.
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    BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
    he's the one who fabricated a load of nonsense in that Scruton interview.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,299
    A bit of light housework before the renovation.

    https://twitter.com/ndrew_lawrence/status/1254775717990002690?s=20
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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,318
    Sunak: "We're all in it together"!!!
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    edited April 2020
    Sweden gazing.

    I had been thinking that the new in Intensive care admissions stat for Sweden would be a better figure to look at rather than daily deaths because it would be less lagged and it had been looking good for Sweden, however from watching it day to day it looks like it still has a fairly significant lag on it, indeed the 22nd of April now has the 3rd highest single day of admissions.

    Diagnosis per day continues to rise (Huge Weekend effect)


    Deaths per day the 8th is still the single highest day but it would be brve to call it the peak

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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,299

    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
    The tweet links to a column, with which I heartily concur, that is not written by Eaton.
    One should never interrupt a PB spasm of sanctimony, it can cause a permanent mischief to the spasmer.
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    isamisam Posts: 41,008
    Piers has some new left wing, Boris hating fans, but...

    https://twitter.com/mediaguido/status/1254727550636625920?s=21
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,025
    There won't be any further waves/peaks in Sweden. That's why their strategy is best.
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    isamisam Posts: 41,008
    Alistair said:

    Sweden gazing.

    I had been thinking that the new in Intensive care admissions stat for Sweden would be a better figure to look at rather than daily deaths because it would be less lagged and it had been looking good for Sweden, however from watching it day to day it looks like it still has a fairly significant lag on it, indeed the 22nd of April now has the 3rd highest single day of admissions.

    Diagnosis per day continues to rise (Huge Weekend effect)


    Deaths per day the 8th is still the single highest day but it would be brve to call it the peak

    Am I misunderstanding it, I thought Sweden WANT a lot of people to test positive for it?
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,805
    Scott_xP said:
    Cynically the announced "micro loan" scheme will massively improve the stats of
    number of loans issued without addressing the root cause of why these loans are needed.

    CBILS is supposed to make the difference between a company surviving and going under due to CV19. That's not a commercial loan and CBILS wouldn't be needed if it were.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,556
    edited April 2020

    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
    he's the one who fabricated a load of nonsense in that Scruton interview.
    No, that was Eaton. The article in question was written by former Times man Martin Fletcher. It is linked from the tweet.

    ETA article link:
    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2020/04/coronavirus-crisis-has-exposed-boris-johnson-s-cabinet-weakest-living-memory
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,298
    The Financial Times has suspended recently hired Mark Di Stefano as media and technology correspondent.

    https://order-order.com/2020/04/27/zoom-boom-ft-reporter-suspended-hacking/

    Naughty naughty.
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    NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,351
    isam said:

    Piers has some new left wing, Boris hating fans, but...

    https://twitter.com/mediaguido/status/1254727550636625920?s=21

    My very gentle 78 year old mum was so incensed by him she wrote a stinker of a letter of complaint to ITV.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,556
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
    Er, I'm no astrophysicist (no, really) - but if you fail to get to the moon which stars exactly do you reach?
    What did I just say about being pedantic? ;)
    Don't blame me, Socrates started it.
    If Patrick Moore taught me anything, it is that when people point at the sky and ask what's that bright star, the answer is the planet Venus.
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    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,809

    isam said:

    Piers has some new left wing, Boris hating fans, but...

    https://twitter.com/mediaguido/status/1254727550636625920?s=21

    My very gentle 78 year old mum was so incensed by him she wrote a stinker of a letter of complaint to ITV.
    Didn't know Paul Staines works for ITV?!

    *boom tish*
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,556
    btw wrt the thread header, has any British prime minister ever advocated a premature end to anything? Surely the clue is in the word "premature".
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,468
    edited April 2020


    If Patrick Moore taught me anything, it is that when people point at the sky and ask what's that bright star, the answer is the planet Venus.

    Visible in the west after sunset this month.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,367

    "The spokesman said that government now has the capacity to carry out 53,000 tests per day."

    Even if we go with this spin, where are they going to magic up another 47,000 test capacity in 3-4 days?

    I find this argument pedantic and petulant. Its not bad to aim for the moon, even if you miss you can reach the stars.

    There's been roughly a five-fold increase in testing capabilities in the past few weeks and further capabilities are coming online rapidly. Whether the target is met on Thursday or not is less important than what those increased capabilities that followed that target meant.

    If a student who was currently getting D's were to say they realise they need to buckle down, study and try to strive for an A-grade were to study hard and achieve a B would you mock them saying "You got a B? Hah! That's pathetic you said you were going to get an A!" Or would you say "You've done well, that's much improved."
    Yes absolutely. If Hancock had put it like that - "I know I've been piss poor but I will from now on strive to raise my game with a stretch target of excellence" - he would not (and would not deserve) a roasting for attaining mediocrity. On the contrary. He would merit praise for the direction of travel.
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    BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    Scott_xP said:
    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.
    he's the one who fabricated a load of nonsense in that Scruton interview.
    No, that was Eaton. The article in question was written by former Times man Martin Fletcher. It is linked from the tweet.
    yeah, I know -_-
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,556

    The Financial Times has suspended recently hired Mark Di Stefano as media and technology correspondent.

    https://order-order.com/2020/04/27/zoom-boom-ft-reporter-suspended-hacking/

    Naughty naughty.

    Some would take this as a sign that HMG should not have been holding Cabinet meetings via Zoom. Well, that and its openness to official Chinese government spooks.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,298
    BBC News - NHS rejects Apple-Google coronavirus app plan
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52441428

    Big call, from both a privacy stance and if the technology doesn't work (as Apple will say told you so).
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,061
    eek said:

    MattW said:


    On understanding the English Language.Thermodynamics of Corona transmission ... people with PPE degrees.

    https://twitter.com/soniasodha/status/1254456216174149635

    Forget the language howler, the article she is talking about is very, very interesting indeed - a must-read IMO. It's a bit long, and hedged about with loads of caveats, but it looks quite convincing to me in terms of helping understand the dominant modes of transmission. It's worth reading the whole thing, but look in particular at his conclusion of where the main 'super-spreader events' (SSEs) took place:

    When do COVID-19 SSEs happen? Based on the list I’ve assembled, the short answer is: Wherever and whenever people are up in each other’s faces, laughing, shouting, cheering, sobbing, singing, greeting, and praying. You don’t have to be a 19th-century German bacteriologist or MIT expert in mucosalivary ballistics to understand what this tells us about the most likely mode of transmission.

    It’s worth scanning all the myriad forms of common human activity that aren’t represented among these listed SSEs: watching movies in a theater, being on a train or bus, attending theater, opera, or symphony (these latter activities may seem like rarified examples, but they are important once you take stock of all those wealthy infectees who got sick in March, and consider that New York City is a major COVID-19 hot spot). These are activities where people often find themselves surrounded by strangers in densely packed rooms—as with all those above-described SSEs—but, crucially, where attendees also are expected to sit still and talk in hushed tones.

    The world’s untold thousands of white-collar cubicle farms don’t seem to be generating abundant COVID-19 SSEs—despite the uneven quality of ventilation one finds in global workplaces....


    (He gives a few more examples in similar vein).
    On the white collar farm bit the counter example is

    https://twitter.com/DrDenaGrayson/status/1253781288735199232

    Blimey. Was it the water pump? Send for Dr John Snow.
    I hope they go full Mullah Omar on this.

  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,921

    rkrkrk said:

    MikeL said:

    4 million in furlough scheme so far.

    Assume average salary £20k (as it's likely to be well below median salary) - cost to Govt is 80% = £16k = £1,333 per month.

    4 million * £1,333 = £5.333bn per month

    3 month cost = £16bn

    Really not very much at all - though of course it's only a very small part of the total cost.

    Furloughed still pay income tax and national insurance, so cost is less still.
    And aren't claiming unemployment benefits etc they would have without the scheme, so even less still net versus lockdown without the scheme.
    Good point - yes the scheme looks a bargain.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,298

    The Financial Times has suspended recently hired Mark Di Stefano as media and technology correspondent.

    https://order-order.com/2020/04/27/zoom-boom-ft-reporter-suspended-hacking/

    Naughty naughty.

    Some would take this as a sign that HMG should not have been holding Cabinet meetings via Zoom. Well, that and its openness to official Chinese government spooks.
    My understanding is they switched fairly quickly. But yes, an app that routes all traffic via Chinese servers, if that isnt a massive red flag, not sure what js.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,445

    BBC News - NHS rejects Apple-Google coronavirus app plan
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52441428

    Big call, from both a privacy stance and if the technology doesn't work (as Apple will say told you so).

    NHS to develop own app, that doesn't follow Apple and Google's ideas?

    What could possibly go wrong.

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,061

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    An outstanding effort. Has to earn some points toward a knighthood
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,061

    For some strange reason I suddenly wish Aslan was PM.

    I think we'd all be better off if a magic talking lion who is also Jesus was in charge.

    He also swanned off for most of the work and only showed up at the end. Oh, he had an excuse but even so...
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,367

    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.

    I genuinely don't know how to take this.

    How is it that moving between those two particular organs tells me all I need to know about a journalist?
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,501
    I thought the story was that Boris wanted to promise 250,000 tests daily?
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    BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884
    kle4 said:

    For some strange reason I suddenly wish Aslan was PM.

    I think we'd all be better off if a magic talking lion who is also Jesus was in charge.

    He also swanned off for most of the work and only showed up at the end. Oh, he had an excuse but even so...
    Played by Liam Neeson in the movie. Struggling there.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,299
    kinabalu said:

    So he was at the Times. Now at the New Statesman.. tells you all you need to.know.

    I genuinely don't know how to take this.

    How is it that moving between those two particular organs tells me all I need to know about a journalist?
    Is it anything like moving from the Times to the Telegraph?
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    Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 2,771

    BBC News - NHS rejects Apple-Google coronavirus app plan
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52441428

    Big call, from both a privacy stance and if the technology doesn't work (as Apple will say told you so).

    NHS to develop own app, that doesn't follow Apple and Google's ideas?

    What could possibly go wrong.

    For a start they'd know if you hadn't been out there clapping every Thursday.
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,367
    isam said:

    Alistair said:

    Sweden gazing.

    I had been thinking that the new in Intensive care admissions stat for Sweden would be a better figure to look at rather than daily deaths because it would be less lagged and it had been looking good for Sweden, however from watching it day to day it looks like it still has a fairly significant lag on it, indeed the 22nd of April now has the 3rd highest single day of admissions.

    Diagnosis per day continues to rise (Huge Weekend effect)


    Deaths per day the 8th is still the single highest day but it would be brve to call it the peak

    Am I misunderstanding it, I thought Sweden WANT a lot of people to test positive for it?
    Huge numbers of test positive but not sick or test immune is what they want - and indeed what almost everyone wants.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    edited April 2020
    Puts the death rate for Covid around 0.8%.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,013
    Mr. kle4, Aslan's commitment to fighting evil and refusing to remain dead form a strong policy platform.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,061

    Mr. kle4, Aslan's commitment to fighting evil and refusing to remain dead form a strong policy platform.

    Perhaps, but he doesnt strike me as a details man and delegation arrangements were suspect.
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    AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    Looks like the US numbers are even more awful than so far reported:

    https://twitter.com/_cingraham/status/1254792999080349697
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,842
    Scott_xP said:
    Presumably it is all being done by minions, but Jo Bidens social media presence is pretty well drafted, anti Trump but flag wavingly patriotic.

    I do hope that Trump loses in November. His tantrum will boost the popcorn economy tenfold.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    NY Deaths per 1 million pop, 1153.

    14.9% infection rate. At 100% = 7738 / 1 million.

    Our deaths/1 million = 305. Indicates just under 4% infection rate.
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,367
    kle4 said:

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    An outstanding effort. Has to earn some points toward a knighthood
    I'm almost speechless. I hope he's taking the piss but he almost certainly isn't. Extraordinary. I know there was some of this pass-the-sick-bucket idolatry with Jez but it tended to come from exuberant activists not from senior MPs.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,904
    IanB2 said:

    I thought the story was that Boris wanted to promise 250,000 tests daily?


    6 weeks tomorrow since he said

    "We're massively increasing the testing to see whether you have it now and ramping up daily testing from 5,000 a day, to 10,000 to 25,000 and then up at 250,000,"
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    isam said:

    Alistair said:

    Sweden gazing.

    I had been thinking that the new in Intensive care admissions stat for Sweden would be a better figure to look at rather than daily deaths because it would be less lagged and it had been looking good for Sweden, however from watching it day to day it looks like it still has a fairly significant lag on it, indeed the 22nd of April now has the 3rd highest single day of admissions.

    Diagnosis per day continues to rise (Huge Weekend effect)


    Deaths per day the 8th is still the single highest day but it would be brve to call it the peak

    Am I misunderstanding it, I thought Sweden WANT a lot of people to test positive for it?
    Sweden doesn't do wide spread testing. Sweden's testing strategy is to test only key workers and those most at risk. So a large rise shows that the most vulnerable are getting Covid-19, exactly what they don't want to happen.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,025
    edited April 2020
    Captain Tom Moore is on £29,150,260 in donations. Let's hope he reaches £30 million by his 100th birthday on Thursday.

    https://www.justgiving.com/fundraising/tomswalkforthenhs
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    Pulpstar said:

    Puts the death rate for Covid around 0.8%.
    Sounds consistent. On that basis about 7% of the UK population would test positive.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,013
    Mr. kle4, I feel the ambiguity in details is compensated for by his track record of being a giant magic lion that cannot be killed.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,154
    Andy_JS said:

    Captain Tom Moore is on £29,150,260 in donations. Let's hope he reaches £30 million by his 100th birthday on Thursday.

    https://www.justgiving.com/fundraising/tomswalkforthenhs

    I reckon he will raise an awesome amount on his birthday itself, from around the globe.
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    An outstanding effort. Has to earn some points toward a knighthood
    I'm almost speechless. I hope he's taking the piss but he almost certainly isn't. Extraordinary. I know there was some of this pass-the-sick-bucket idolatry with Jez but it tended to come from exuberant activists not from senior MPs.
    What wuz 'e thunking?
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,501
    Andrew said:

    Looks like the US numbers are even more awful than so far reported:

    https://twitter.com/_cingraham/status/1254792999080349697

    Globally the world has now passed 3 million, and by the end of the day the US will surely pass 1 million.

    Still, according to the ‘model’ being touted on this site by Henrietta and Eadric not so long ago, we should be at 200 million confirmed cases by now.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    So about 1/6th with anti bodies for 17,000 deaths.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Pulpstar said:

    Puts the death rate for Covid around 0.8%.
    Sounds consistent. On that basis about 7% of the UK population would test positive.
    I got to 4% working backwards. The serology results should be interesting to see.
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    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,819
    That means 149,000 per million have been infected.

    With 1,153 per million already dead (and those who are going to die from existing infections are going to increase that number), that implies the true IFR (including asymptomatic individuals) is somewhere in excess of 0.77%. If the death toll continues linearly, that'd put the IFR on deaths from infections to this date at approximately 1.0%.

    That's a touch higher than most estimates so far.
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,367

    btw wrt the thread header, has any British prime minister ever advocated a premature end to anything? Surely the clue is in the word "premature".

    Yes, a big "tell" - about the author's mindset - in the headline there.
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    Hancock up at 5..
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,078
    kle4 said:

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    An outstanding effort. Has to earn some points toward a knighthood
    Boris dumped him from Govt, of course.
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,032
    Trump presser cancelled again. Maybe someone realised....
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    NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,351
    They have been doing this at Southampton Hospital for weeks, my friend was admitted with an irregular heart beat and he was tested despite showing no symptoms.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,556

    kle4 said:

    Fckn hell, there's glassy eyed sycophancy, then there's offering to take on toilet paper duties for someone.

    https://twitter.com/halfon4harlowMP/status/1254763225314361347?s=20

    An outstanding effort. Has to earn some points toward a knighthood
    Boris dumped him from Govt, of course.
    Halfon also recently accused the Board of Deputies of British Jews of shilling for Labour, which would have been news to Jeremy Corbyn. I blame lockdown.
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,620
    edited April 2020
    So testing lots of people is a trick, to reach a target to test lots of people.

    Given what Foxy was saying about issues on non-COVID specific wards, this sounds like a good idea.
This discussion has been closed.