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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer gets his LAB victory with 56% of the votes on the firs

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    ydoethur said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just where does he think the bears would go?

    I can see the case for wolves and lynx, and beavers are already being re-established, but reintroducing bears seems as plausible as my niece, who when young told her parents that she’d like to adopt a gorilla because “we have a big back garden and it would be no trouble”.
    Surely the bears would 'go' in the woods, where, by all accounts they do have toilet facilities.
    Woods, like many public lavatory facilities, can be few and far between however.
    Especially when the HS2 cheerleaders want to chop so many down.
    Can we declare HS2 dead yet?
    i doubt it. Big, profitable infrastructure projects funded by borrowing are likely to be more important in an economic crisis, not less - and HS2 is one of the few that’s ready to go.
    Well it's certainly big, and infrastructure. And I agree that a lot of it has already started and needs some sort of workable resolution. Personally I think I'd take it as far as Aylesbury and build some sort of new garden commuter town, like Milton Keynes if Milton Keynes wasn't a dystopian ****hole. Admittedly that's not an informed conclusion, just an idea.
    What good is linking Manchester, Leeds, Birmingham, Liverpool, Glasgow... to Aylesbury and not continue to London?

    Oh, you meant only building the southern section and f* off the north as is the usual approach no doubt
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012

    Dodds is Scottish, so no doubt will attract the ire and hatred of the Cybernats for being a 'treacherous yoon'.

    You're no doubt fondly remembering the days when folk in Scotland were bothered about what went on in Labour. The overwhelming reaction even amongst those who have a passing interest will be 'who she'.
    Unfortunately, I fear you may be right. Had a look on a few prominent Cybernats' twitter accounts today - who five years ago were constantly slamming Milliband and Murphy - and the only reaction to SKS' elevation was a shrug of the shoulders from the Rev. of Bath. Still, if Labour can eventually attract their ire again once more, that would probably mean they might actually be on the road to some kind of recovery in Scotland. Better to be hated than ignored.
    It will be a long long time if ever before those clowns recover, until they support independence they are dead in the water.
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    OllyTOllyT Posts: 4,913
    Nigelb said:
    Just brings it home to you quite how crazy the American right is.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637
    malcolmg said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    A hospital has asked people not to come to its accident and emergency department until further notice, saying it is running out of oxygen.
    Watford General Hospital has declared a critical incident and said any emergency patients should go to other hospitals with A&E units.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-52151694

    The oxygen question came up last week. (Demand levels are unprecedented, and some hospitals have had to replumb systems to accommodate.)
    Matt Hancock said it ought to be no problem, but I guess demand rose faster than expected.
    Hancock on the ball as ever , bit like their supposedly ever increasing testing. All just bollox as they promise more and more but reality is just not there. Good talk but crap reality.
    Oxygen supply will be limited by the capacity of the ambient vaporisers to vaporise the liquid oxygen, not by the capability of BOC et al to deliver liquid oxygen to the hospital.

    To increase capacity they need more hardware.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Omnium said:

    Could anyone provide a link to Mr Meeks' cartoon with the EU waving goodbye to the south of Europe?

    Can't work out quite when it was that he posted it.


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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,466

    On HS2

    HS2 Northern Ltd has just been registered at Companies House.

    Will deliver HS2 Phase 2 and NPR.

    HS2 is a fascinating issue in terms of the cross section of opinions you get. On PB, you have Manchester Kurt aggressively supporting it because he thinks it will be good for the North, because too much is spent on London, and Alastair Meeks opposing it, presumably for the same reason, because he feels it's London subsidising the inbred yokels of the provinces. On the other side, you have Northerners vigorously opposed to it, because they think it's being done purely to increase London's talent pool at the expense of the provinces, and Londoners, who support it for the same reason. It's like a strange matrix or flow chart.
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    eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,898

    Agreed. Trouble is that Dr Shipman and similar cases make it even less likely patients will be given sufficient pain relief, never mind voluntary euthenasia. A pain-free death ought to be a human right.
    Agree. I think this subject is being discussed in many different countries. I feel strongly that elderly patients with terminal illness should be kept pain free but in many cases allowed to die. The problem always comes back to how can we reliably know that vulnerable elderly are making the choice they want to, and are not being cajoled into death by relatives or doctors. Dr. Shipman was a hopefully never to be repeated case. But there will be more than a few doctors around who care more about their careers, and hence the financial situation of their unit than the patients.
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    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,101
    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451
    malcolmg said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Time they tazered these clowns

    The police were chasing a whole 2 people from a the green patch in a local square. Given that the literal 2 people were at least 50 yards apart....
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012

    Dodds is Scottish, so no doubt will attract the ire and hatred of the Cybernats for being a 'treacherous yoon'.

    You're no doubt fondly remembering the days when folk in Scotland were bothered about what went on in Labour. The overwhelming reaction even amongst those who have a passing interest will be 'who she'.
    Unionists must be desperate when cockroaches like randall are activated
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Words fail me.

    So the club are going to get state aid while paying obsecene wages to their players
    Players who aren't actually playing. If anyone should be furloughed it is the playing staff.
    I presume they are just paying the 80% to the furloughed staff?
    I believe that they are topping up the difference.
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    On HS2

    HS2 Northern Ltd has just been registered at Companies House.

    Will deliver HS2 Phase 2 and NPR.

    HS2 is a fascinating issue in terms of the cross section of opinions you get. On PB, you have Manchester Kurt aggressively supporting it because he thinks it will be good for the North, because too much is spent on London, and Alastair Meeks opposing it, presumably for the same reason, because he feels it's London subsidising the inbred yokels of the provinces. On the other side, you have Northerners vigorously opposed to it, because they think it's being done purely to increase London's talent pool at the expense of the provinces, and Londoners, who support it for the same reason. It's like a strange matrix or flow chart.
    and what is the position away from this forum, from the northern business community, the northern politicians etc. ?

    This place is not representative of how there is very great support across the business and politicians of the north. not remotely represetative.
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,014

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Words fail me.

    So the club are going to get state aid while paying obsecene wages to their players
    Players who aren't actually playing. If anyone should be furloughed it is the playing staff.
    I presume they are just paying the 80% to the furloughed staff?
    No, they are paying them in full. Unlike Spurs, apparently.
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    eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,898
    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:
    Just brings it home to you quite how crazy the American right is.
    Er, many of the opinions in that video were also opined in these hallowed pages.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    It wouldn’t cost them all that much so it’s a surprise this hasn’t been sorted out.

    The bigger battle is going to be between the clubs and the players when the TV money and gate receipts stop.
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    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,101

    ydoethur said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just where does he think the bears would go?

    I can see the case for wolves and lynx, and beavers are already being re-established, but reintroducing bears seems as plausible as my niece, who when young told her parents that she’d like to adopt a gorilla because “we have a big back garden and it would be no trouble”.
    Surely the bears would 'go' in the woods, where, by all accounts they do have toilet facilities.
    Woods, like many public lavatory facilities, can be few and far between however.
    Especially when the HS2 cheerleaders want to chop so many down.
    Can we declare HS2 dead yet?
    i doubt it. Big, profitable infrastructure projects funded by borrowing are likely to be more important in an economic crisis, not less - and HS2 is one of the few that’s ready to go.
    Can we call those opposed to HS2 who think it won't happen brain dead yet ?
    Oh it will probably happen. Doesn't mean it should do. It is those supporting this outdated and unnecessary project who are the brain dead.
    The end of world civilisation would have no effect on the choo-choo fanatics demanding their obsession.
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Words fail me.

    So the club are going to get state aid while paying obsecene wages to their players
    Players who aren't actually playing. If anyone should be furloughed it is the playing staff.
    I presume they are just paying the 80% to the furloughed staff?
    I believe that they are topping up the difference.
    Well, that's decent of them - so at least the non-playing staff will get 100% of their normal wages for the near future.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012
    eristdoof said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Well there were a few PB posters who were saying similar things about a month ago, such as the under 40s should carry on as normal to keep the economy going.
    Plenty Tories on here only interested in their own pockets, some will be socialists soon when they are on their uppers and realise they have joined the poor etc that they used to decry as spongers
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,298
    USA reaches 300,000 cases
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,660

    ydoethur said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    Keir making good moves already

    He's on his way to number 10 as far as I can see. And maybe well before 2024.
    Hey Sir Kier - what the hells Got in to you?
    KEIR.

    K E I R.
    You do know you are going to be doing that for the next 4 years at least don't you :)
    He is, after all, a teacher.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637

    malcolmg said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Time they tazered these clowns

    The police were chasing a whole 2 people from a the green patch in a local square. Given that the literal 2 people were at least 50 yards apart....
    The trouble is if you ignore the two the number rises exponentially.
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    Our southern based media, with editors living in the Chilterns, rarely reports on pro HS2 news from the north...

    https://www.business-live.co.uk/economic-development/hs2-northern-leaders-call-next-16464638
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,101

    On HS2

    HS2 Northern Ltd has just been registered at Companies House.

    Will deliver HS2 Phase 2 and NPR.

    HS2 is a fascinating issue in terms of the cross section of opinions you get. On PB, you have Manchester Kurt aggressively supporting it because he thinks it will be good for the North, because too much is spent on London, and Alastair Meeks opposing it, presumably for the same reason, because he feels it's London subsidising the inbred yokels of the provinces. On the other side, you have Northerners vigorously opposed to it, because they think it's being done purely to increase London's talent pool at the expense of the provinces, and Londoners, who support it for the same reason. It's like a strange matrix or flow chart.
    and what is the position away from this forum, from the northern business community, the northern politicians etc. ?

    This place is not representative of how there is very great support across the business and politicians of the north. not remotely represetative.
    FatCats support spending money on FatCats.

    I'm astonished.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,229
    ydoethur said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    Keir making good moves already

    He's on his way to number 10 as far as I can see. And maybe well before 2024.
    Hey Sir Kier - what the hells Got in to you?
    KEIR.

    K E I R.
    I before E except after K!
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    ukpaul said:

    RobD said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Do you normally get oldies out sunbathing? The impression you'll get from these photos is that it's only the young, because these are the activities the young typically get up to.
    Oldies go to the park usually to have a walk and that's mostly what they're showing, not sunbathing (makes for a more sensationalist headline, though). It fits the figures we saw that the UK had vastly more people going to the park than France, for example.
    Walking in the park is allowed though, sunbathing is not.
    So basically stopping then? What an utterly ridiculous 'rule'. The nation was already Vitamin D deficient.
    There's a difference between stopping, and throwing down a towel and taking your top off!
    Yes there is, and after we disagreed yesterday, please don't think I'm picking a fight - it wasn't you that made these rules.

    However, in my opinion, being allowed a brisk trot, and not being allowed to stop and display your fleshy limbs to the sun, is a ludicrous distinction. For people who don't have an outside space, it's important to get some outdoor time, and some sun. The only material aim here seems to be to prevent an element of enjoyment from creeping in.
    The issue is time

    London parks gets very overcrowded if people are allowed to sunbathe. You’re only meant to be put for a brief period.
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012
    Cyclefree said:

    eristdoof said:

    ukpaul said:

    alex_ said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Not necessarily. 20-30 year old cramming into pubs might indicate that. People sitting in parks on their own or in family groups is more people interpreting the guidance in their own way and concluding they are following the spirit, if not the letter, of the Govt advice. They’re not doing it in expectation of getting it and being fine.
    The instruction was to stay at home. This is why guidance is not enough, there needs to be something clearer.
    I thought it was clear. You can go out for excercise including going for a walk or walking a dog. Once a day, up to an hour. Sun bathing is not excercise or going for walk.
    There is absolutely no rule saying that exercise can only be once a day or only for an hour. None whatever.
    Still morons going out unless absolutely necessary, nobody needs to exercise for 2 hours. Time to start issuing cattle prods to police and telling them to give these selfish twunts a good charge.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,466

    On HS2

    HS2 Northern Ltd has just been registered at Companies House.

    Will deliver HS2 Phase 2 and NPR.

    HS2 is a fascinating issue in terms of the cross section of opinions you get. On PB, you have Manchester Kurt aggressively supporting it because he thinks it will be good for the North, because too much is spent on London, and Alastair Meeks opposing it, presumably for the same reason, because he feels it's London subsidising the inbred yokels of the provinces. On the other side, you have Northerners vigorously opposed to it, because they think it's being done purely to increase London's talent pool at the expense of the provinces, and Londoners, who support it for the same reason. It's like a strange matrix or flow chart.
    and what is the position away from this forum, from the northern business community, the northern politicians etc. ?

    This place is not representative of how there is very great support across the business and politicians of the north. not remotely represetative.
    I will bow to your greater knowledge of the business community in the North, but I know that plenty of MP's from the North are very opposed (and no doubt some are very pro).
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    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Quincel said:

    MikeL said:

    FPT @Quincel re investment:

    Worth looking at a 100 year chart of the Dow Jones index - see link below.

    Whilst (of course!) the overall trend is very strongly upwards it's worth noting not just the bear markets but more importantly just how long you have had to wait to just get your money back in cash (ie not even real) terms if you invest at the wrong time, ie

    eg Invest in 1929 - wait till late 1950s - ie 30 years - to get back to same level

    Invest in mid 1960s - wait till early 1990s - again almost 30 years - to get back to same level

    The above excludes dividends but US dividend yields are very low.

    OK, the above are the worst two examples and what's the chance of investing at the very peak? But even so there are many examples where you make no cash gain at all over say 10 years.

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=dow+jones+100+year+chart&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM%3A%2CyptiZ_pi2JeLCM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQ5H8P496OR6YZ1XstAyptTMNdGiQ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjx7ZaAnM_oAhWRi1wKHbCfB4wQ9QEwAXoECAoQHA#imgrc=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM:

    Christ, must admit I hadn't realised the DJIA fell steadily for 20-30 years once. That's nuts. How did people make money during that period? This was a time of defined benefit pensions, how did that work when the second half of their career returns were negative?
    Bonds. Interest rates haven't always been sub 1%.

    That was a time period where "investing in the stock market" was seen as the height of irresponsible behaviour and the notion that the market always rises in the end was not the orthodoxy.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    I agree the billionaires are behaving poorly. Why should the millionaires be the ones to atone for the billionaires’ misdeeds?
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451

    malcolmg said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Time they tazered these clowns

    The police were chasing a whole 2 people from a the green patch in a local square. Given that the literal 2 people were at least 50 yards apart....
    The trouble is if you ignore the two the number rises exponentially.
    Yes, I know. Like what you did there. But they must have been very bored if that is the level of custom they are getting in breaking things up.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451

    Omnium said:

    Could anyone provide a link to Mr Meeks' cartoon with the EU waving goodbye to the south of Europe?

    Can't work out quite when it was that he posted it.



    Would humming Ode To Joy twice while washing your hands meet the mark?
  • Options
    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    I agree the billionaires are behaving poorly. Why should the millionaires be the ones to atone for the billionaires’ misdeeds?
    I'm not following your point. Who are the millionaires and billionaires here?
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    edited April 2020

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Quincel said:

    Nigelb said:

    Quincel said:

    Nigelb said:

    Quincel said:

    MikeL said:

    FPT @Quincel re investment:

    Worth looking at a 100 year chart of the Dow Jones index - see link below.

    Whilst (of course!) the overall trend is very strongly upwards it's worth noting not just the bear markets but more importantly just how long you have had to wait to just get your money back in cash (ie not even real) terms if you invest at the wrong time, ie

    eg Invest in 1929 - wait till late 1950s - ie 30 years - to get back to same level

    Invest in mid 1960s - wait till early 1990s - again almost 30 years - to get back to same level

    The above excludes dividends but US dividend yields are very low.

    OK, the above are the worst two examples and what's the chance of investing at the very peak? But even so there are many examples where you make no cash gain at all over say 10 years.

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=dow+jones+100+year+chart&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM%3A%2CyptiZ_pi2JeLCM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQ5H8P496OR6YZ1XstAyptTMNdGiQ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjx7ZaAnM_oAhWRi1wKHbCfB4wQ9QEwAXoECAoQHA#imgrc=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM:

    Christ, must admit I hadn't realised the DJIA fell steadily for 20-30 years once. That's nuts. How did people make money during that period? This was a time of defined benefit pensions, how did that work when the second half of their career returns were negative?
    They didn’t invest in the stock market.
    Did bonds give sufficient returns in those decades to finance pension plans? Genuine question.
    I’m not expert on financial history, but I’m old enough to remember reading about significant reliance on stock market investment being something of an innovation.
    Well I know what I'm going to be trying to read up on tomorrow.
    For an excellent contemporary historical view of investing "The Intelligent Investor" by Benjamin Graham is a great read.

    The man from whom Buffet learnt everything.
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    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,310
    I wonder if we'll see an increase in cases of rickets because of all this.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    I think Alastair raises a good/difficult question as to whether players should do something that the owners could do themselves. I think we can assume that the FSG aren’t worried about perceptions about LFC and any long term brand damage.
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    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    I agree the billionaires are behaving poorly. Why should the millionaires be the ones to atone for the billionaires’ misdeeds?
    I'm not following your point. Who are the millionaires and billionaires here?
    Millionaires = players
    Billionaires = owners
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451
    eristdoof said:

    Agreed. Trouble is that Dr Shipman and similar cases make it even less likely patients will be given sufficient pain relief, never mind voluntary euthenasia. A pain-free death ought to be a human right.
    Agree. I think this subject is being discussed in many different countries. I feel strongly that elderly patients with terminal illness should be kept pain free but in many cases allowed to die. The problem always comes back to how can we reliably know that vulnerable elderly are making the choice they want to, and are not being cajoled into death by relatives or doctors. Dr. Shipman was a hopefully never to be repeated case. But there will be more than a few doctors around who care more about their careers, and hence the financial situation of their unit than the patients.
    I have encountered problematic attitudes towards patient survival twice (personally). The first occasion I expressed my self with my best sense of humour. The second, I had an interestingly philosophical discussion with the person in question.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,792

    Omnium said:

    Could anyone provide a link to Mr Meeks' cartoon with the EU waving goodbye to the south of Europe?

    Can't work out quite when it was that he posted it.


    Thanks Alastair.

  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451
    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    I agree the billionaires are behaving poorly. Why should the millionaires be the ones to atone for the billionaires’ misdeeds?
    I'm not following your point. Who are the millionaires and billionaires here?
    Millionaires = players
    Billionaires = owners
    The appalling running around at the behest of the unspeakable.

    My favourite football moment - when the FA decided that being a wanted war criminal did not breach the "Fit and proper" rule for football club owners...
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Words fail me.

    So the club are going to get state aid while paying obsecene wages to their players
    Same old scousers....always scallies....

  • Options
    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    edited April 2020
    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,229
    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:
    Just brings it home to you quite how crazy the American right is.
    The scariest part is that several of the commentators had their names prefixed with Dr. Doctors of what exactly?
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012

    Quincel said:

    MikeL said:

    FPT @Quincel re investment:

    Worth looking at a 100 year chart of the Dow Jones index - see link below.

    Whilst (of course!) the overall trend is very strongly upwards it's worth noting not just the bear markets but more importantly just how long you have had to wait to just get your money back in cash (ie not even real) terms if you invest at the wrong time, ie

    eg Invest in 1929 - wait till late 1950s - ie 30 years - to get back to same level

    Invest in mid 1960s - wait till early 1990s - again almost 30 years - to get back to same level

    The above excludes dividends but US dividend yields are very low.

    OK, the above are the worst two examples and what's the chance of investing at the very peak? But even so there are many examples where you make no cash gain at all over say 10 years.

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=dow+jones+100+year+chart&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM%3A%2CyptiZ_pi2JeLCM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQ5H8P496OR6YZ1XstAyptTMNdGiQ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjx7ZaAnM_oAhWRi1wKHbCfB4wQ9QEwAXoECAoQHA#imgrc=ijc28Sf4ti0sEM:

    Christ, must admit I hadn't realised the DJIA fell steadily for 20-30 years once. That's nuts. How did people make money during that period? This was a time of defined benefit pensions, how did that work when the second half of their career returns were negative?
    Did they conveniently die at 70?
    Most never reached 70
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    Would Boris have won the Tory leadership without newbies, (Kipper entrists) voting for him?
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    Football clubs making use of government provision could be seen as quite socialist.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297

    ydoethur said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just where does he think the bears would go?

    I can see the case for wolves and lynx, and beavers are already being re-established, but reintroducing bears seems as plausible as my niece, who when young told her parents that she’d like to adopt a gorilla because “we have a big back garden and it would be no trouble”.
    Surely the bears would 'go' in the woods, where, by all accounts they do have toilet facilities.
    Woods, like many public lavatory facilities, can be few and far between however.
    Especially when the HS2 cheerleaders want to chop so many down.
    Can we declare HS2 dead yet?
    i doubt it. Big, profitable infrastructure projects funded by borrowing are likely to be more important in an economic crisis, not less - and HS2 is one of the few that’s ready to go.
    Well it's certainly big, and infrastructure. And I agree that a lot of it has already started and needs some sort of workable resolution. Personally I think I'd take it as far as Aylesbury and build some sort of new garden commuter town, like Milton Keynes if Milton Keynes wasn't a dystopian ****hole. Admittedly that's not an informed conclusion, just an idea.
    I think you’re hard on yourself there. Calling Milton Keynes a ‘dystopian shithole’ sounds like a well-informed conclusion to me.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,012

    malcolmg said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    A hospital has asked people not to come to its accident and emergency department until further notice, saying it is running out of oxygen.
    Watford General Hospital has declared a critical incident and said any emergency patients should go to other hospitals with A&E units.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-52151694

    The oxygen question came up last week. (Demand levels are unprecedented, and some hospitals have had to replumb systems to accommodate.)
    Matt Hancock said it ought to be no problem, but I guess demand rose faster than expected.
    Hancock on the ball as ever , bit like their supposedly ever increasing testing. All just bollox as they promise more and more but reality is just not there. Good talk but crap reality.
    Oxygen supply will be limited by the capacity of the ambient vaporisers to vaporise the liquid oxygen, not by the capability of BOC et al to deliver liquid oxygen to the hospital.

    To increase capacity they need more hardware.
    I was talking in general, they talk well but perform absolute crap.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    edited April 2020
    IanB2 said:

    USA reaches 300,000 cases


    The Iranian figures are a hoot.....
    There must be two old boys in a shed... "Hashem mate....what did you put down yesterday?"
    "163 my old mucker Ayab..."
    "OK...lets give it 139 today...seems about right Hashem..."

    And meanwhile in the real Iranian world there are bargain black bin bags handed out and skips everywhere for people to dispose of their relatives.....
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    Furlough, sweet chariot, coming for to give me a loan....
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,017
    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297
    tyson said:

    IanB2 said:

    USA reaches 300,000 cases


    The Iranian figures are a hoot.....
    There must be two old boys in a shed... "Hashem mate....what did you put down yesterday?"
    "163 my old mucker Ayab..."
    "OK...lets give it 139 today...seems about right Hashem..."

    And meanwhile in the real Iranian world there are bargain black bin bags handed out and skips everywhere for people to dispose of their relatives.....
    Is there any reliable data, at all, for the situation in Iran?
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    It's not intuitive....it should be Kier.....

  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    ydoethur said:

    tyson said:

    IanB2 said:

    USA reaches 300,000 cases


    The Iranian figures are a hoot.....
    There must be two old boys in a shed... "Hashem mate....what did you put down yesterday?"
    "163 my old mucker Ayab..."
    "OK...lets give it 139 today...seems about right Hashem..."

    And meanwhile in the real Iranian world there are bargain black bin bags handed out and skips everywhere for people to dispose of their relatives.....
    Is there any reliable data, at all, for the situation in Iran?
    No...CNN occasionally shows another aerial photograph of Tehran with another huge burial mound that is added to the many others...

    It must be absolute carnage on a scale that makes New York seem like Wyoming....
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297
    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    Well, I think we can safely say the first ain’t happening.

    I think nine chances in ten the second won’t be either given the travel industry will still be in chaos. However, it may depend on where you’re going and how you’re getting there.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
  • Options
    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,317
    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    Which year? Surely not this one.
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    isam said:

    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
    No...the trick to winning an election is to get called by your first name...as Tony, Maggie, Boris can testify......

    There is a science to it....those named by their surname (Cameron being the exception) are defined to failure....
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    edited April 2020

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    You haven’t answered the question the employees wages are guaranteed so what’s so appalling unless you believe they should not take tax payers money.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,297
    tyson said:

    isam said:

    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
    No...the trick to winning an election is to get called by your first name...as Tony, Maggie, Boris can testify......

    There is a science to it....those named by their surname (Cameron being the exception) are defined to failure....
    ‘Call me Dave’ was not known by his surname.

    Meanwhile, Miliband was always Ed Miliband, admittedly mostly because of his brother.
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    For the first time since 2016 I carefully planned all my travel for the year in anticipation of retiring. You’d think the boy would learn.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,792
    isam said:

    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
    The best thing about Starmer is that he isn't Corbyn.

    Driving the bus into the brick-wall isn't actually likely now.

    The second best thing about Starmer is that he's worth listening to.

    Let's see how he gets on.
  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,886
    tyson said:

    isam said:

    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
    No...the trick to winning an election is to get called by your first name...as Tony, Maggie, Boris can testify......

    There is a science to it....those named by their surname (Cameron being the exception) are defined to failure....
    As opposed to Trump & Biden vs Hillary & Bernie?
  • Options
    paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,461
    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    We've got train tickets to london end of april. What we were going for is cancelled. And if no pubs etc open probs no point. Might be interesting sightseeing without crowds but might not be allowed.
  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,886

    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    For the first time since 2016 I carefully planned all my travel for the year in anticipation of retiring. You’d think the boy would learn.
    I hadn't been abroad (bar a last minute weekend away) in over a year. Had a trip to Rome for the final 6N game, Portugal in late March, then the Italian lakes in mid April all planned and payed for...
  • Options
    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    Does anyone really keir?

    :D:D
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th


    Hmmm.....I would say doubtful sadly......

    I was supposed to be in Italy today.....I'd treated myself to a really nice car too....
    Oh well.....instead I've cooked a lentil curry at home..we are rapidly running out of supplies and didn't have milk this morning...the supermarket just seems a bridge too far...

  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,660

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    Does anyone really keir?

    :D:D
    I rek.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,608

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    I'm in the same boat with Spurs.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,930
    We've got an internal UK trip organised for May. It's with the horse down to the beach, we can pay a week before now but need to arrange transport for the horse; and the riding centre/cattery are probably closed too. It'll be a bit shit if all the restaurants are closed too.
    Most likely delayed tbh.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,660

    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    For the first time since 2016 I carefully planned all my travel for the year in anticipation of retiring. You’d think the boy would learn.
    Have you learned nothing from Mike’s example ?
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,792

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    Does anyone really keir?

    :D:D
    I guess they do - people have been known to re-invent themselves in some weird spelling.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Today’s main event has been the frankly epic amount of weeding I’ve done. I trust no one with a badge is going to complain that I have enjoyed my time outdoors too much.

    Can you beat this?

    https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1246440386912030721
    To be honest, the before picture looks better - a bit more green and inviting.

    Lying down in parks. I noticed yesterday the gate to our local park has a new sign limiting our freedom to sell sex in the park. Or possibly to buy sex; I forget which. I imagine this is a side effect of killjoy Boris closing massage parlours.

    Sex al fresco sounds like a marvellous way to get your daily exercise. If it is with a member of your household and well away from prying eyes it complies with all the rules. And indeed with the guidance.

    Though in a Lake District summer you’d have to be so wrapped up to stay warm and alive that unbuttoning all the layers would probably provide quite enough exercise for the day.
    The Austin Powers solution:

    Local slapper is plying her trade in the park. Officer approaches.

    ‘What are the two of you doing?’

    ‘Taking our daily exercise officer.’

    ‘I don’t think this is covered by regulations sir.’

    ‘Boris said we could cycle. I’m just having my ride on the village bike.’
    But one hopes not a family unit
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Today’s main event has been the frankly epic amount of weeding I’ve done. I trust no one with a badge is going to complain that I have enjoyed my time outdoors too much.

    Can you beat this?

    https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1246440386912030721
    To be honest, the before picture looks better - a bit more green and inviting.

    Lying down in parks. I noticed yesterday the gate to our local park has a new sign limiting our freedom to sell sex in the park. Or possibly to buy sex; I forget which. I imagine this is a side effect of killjoy Boris closing massage parlours.

    Sex al fresco sounds like a marvellous way to get your daily exercise. If it is with a member of your household and well away from prying eyes it complies with all the rules. And indeed with the guidance.

    Though in a Lake District summer you’d have to be so wrapped up to stay warm and alive that unbuttoning all the layers would probably provide quite enough exercise for the day.
    The Austin Powers solution:

    Local slapper is plying her trade in the park. Officer approaches.

    ‘What are the two of you doing?’

    ‘Taking our daily exercise officer.’

    ‘I don’t think this is covered by regulations sir.’

    ‘Boris said we could cycle. I’m just having my ride on the village bike.’
    But one hopes not a family unit
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,930
    MaxPB said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    I'm in the same boat with Spurs.
    Spurs aren't even making up the non playing staff's wages to their normal amount ?!
    That's horrendous if true.
  • Options
    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,957
    malcolmg said:

    eristdoof said:

    ukpaul said:

    From the looks of it, the vast majority in their 20s/30s. The wrong message took hold, that the old die from it, when it should have been that all except those under ten will suffer from it.
    Well there were a few PB posters who were saying similar things about a month ago, such as the under 40s should carry on as normal to keep the economy going.
    Plenty Tories on here only interested in their own pockets, some will be socialists soon when they are on their uppers and realise they have joined the poor etc that they used to decry as spongers
    Except of course, that the top story on the Times today is one of the government's top scientific bods saying precisely that.

    "A prolonged lockdown risks causing more suffering than the virus itself, Graham Medley, the government’s chief pandemic modeller, has warned. He said that the country needed to face the trade-off between harming the young versus the old."

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/boris-johnsons-coronavirus-adviser-calls-for-a-way-out-of-lockdown-rd58g6tc9

  • Options
    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    edited April 2020
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    You haven’t answered the question the employees wages are guaranteed so what’s so appalling unless you believe they should not take tax payers money.
    Why are you struggling to understand the simple point that LFC pretends to be a community or an extended family and yet does not dip into its own hefty pockets in order to look after its own staff during a storm? It's very simple.

    Whether you are personally neutral between the government paying those salaries or LFC paying them doesn't matter, it will matter to many LFC fans. Moreover it will be a stick that will be used to demean and to humiliate those same LFC fans and any hard-fought achievement, that is undeniable. So it is a mistake on multiple levels. A very cheap but very expensive mistake.

    Let's see how it plays out like I said.
  • Options
    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981
    edited April 2020
    Omnium said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    Does anyone really keir?

    :D:D
    I guess they do - people have been known to re-invent themselves in some weird spelling.
    You need to "up" your Gaelic game :D
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,332
    tyson said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    It's not intuitive....it should be Kier.....

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keir_Hardie
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keir_Dullea
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keir_Gilchrist
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,701
    "The Dinou case raises serious questions about the rule of law during a pandemic. Dinou was arrested, charged and then prosecuted in a court of law for an offence that does not exist. The case was heard in court by a district judge rather than a bench of magistrates. It was reported that the judge convicted Dinou in a single hearing, even though she reportedly refused to leave her cell throughout the proceedings."

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/04/03/the-dangerous-breakdown-of-the-rule-of-law/
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,466

    ydoethur said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Just where does he think the bears would go?

    I can see the case for wolves and lynx, and beavers are already being re-established, but reintroducing bears seems as plausible as my niece, who when young told her parents that she’d like to adopt a gorilla because “we have a big back garden and it would be no trouble”.
    Surely the bears would 'go' in the woods, where, by all accounts they do have toilet facilities.
    Woods, like many public lavatory facilities, can be few and far between however.
    Especially when the HS2 cheerleaders want to chop so many down.
    Can we declare HS2 dead yet?
    i doubt it. Big, profitable infrastructure projects funded by borrowing are likely to be more important in an economic crisis, not less - and HS2 is one of the few that’s ready to go.
    Well it's certainly big, and infrastructure. And I agree that a lot of it has already started and needs some sort of workable resolution. Personally I think I'd take it as far as Aylesbury and build some sort of new garden commuter town, like Milton Keynes if Milton Keynes wasn't a dystopian ****hole. Admittedly that's not an informed conclusion, just an idea.
    What good is linking Manchester, Leeds, Birmingham, Liverpool, Glasgow... to Aylesbury and not continue to London?

    Oh, you meant only building the southern section and f* off the north as is the usual approach no doubt
    Yes I did, but only because as I understand it that's the bit that's already been built. If the whole thing had been started in the North, I'd have a lot more faith in it being a genuine boost for that area.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,451
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    You haven’t answered the question the employees wages are guaranteed so what’s so appalling unless you believe they should not take tax payers money.
    Ban football.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,792

    Omnium said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    Does anyone really keir?

    :D:D
    I guess they do - people have been known to re-invent themselves in some weird spelling.
    You need to "up" your Gaelic game :D
    If the broadness of your smile reflects the daftness of your spelling then you win.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,466
    By the way, Starmer should be known as KStarmer - please note the lack of spacing or punctuation between first initial and surname. It is time-honoured PB tradition.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    I don't have a clue what you're banging on about. The staff are being paid 100% of their wages not 80% as most other businesses are doing. Seems to me they are treating their staff better than almost any other business under the circumstances. What's the big deal?
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    You haven’t answered the question the employees wages are guaranteed so what’s so appalling unless you believe they should not take tax payers money.
    Why are you struggling to understand the simple point that LFC pretends to be a community or an extended family and yet does not dip into its own hefty pockets in order to look after its own staff during a storm? It's very simple.

    Whether you are personally neutral between the government paying those salaries or LFC paying them doesn't matter, it will matter to many LFC fans. Moreover it will be a stick that will be used to demean and to humiliate those same LFC fans and any hard-fought achievement, that is undeniable. So it is a mistake on multiple levels. A very cheap but very expensive mistake.

    Let's see how it plays out like I said.
    I doubt this will bother too many fans, though your points about Liverpool proclaiming to be a special club is a fair one.

    I think in the long term, Liverpool are in a better position than most given that the players have more than just money to lose. They are the best team in the league and the players won’t want to risk crippling the club by playing hardball over wages.

    Other clubs, such as Arsenal, are in a worse position in my opinion.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,608
    edited April 2020
    Pulpstar said:

    MaxPB said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    I'm in the same boat with Spurs.
    Spurs aren't even making up the non playing staff's wages to their normal amount ?!
    That's horrendous if true.
    No, it's frankly disgusting behaviour from the club and it's superstar footballers.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    edited April 2020
    Omnium said:

    isam said:

    ydoethur said:

    When will PBers, who claim to be - in the main - well educated, learn to spell the Loto’s name? It really is pathetic.

    K - E - I - R

    Just call him Starmer.

    Apart from anything else, it’s much easier to pun on ‘Starmer’ than on ‘Keir.’
    ‘There’s a Starmer, waiting in the sky
    He’d like to come and meet us...”
    The best thing about Starmer is that he isn't Corbyn.

    Driving the bus into the brick-wall isn't actually likely now.

    The second best thing about Starmer is that he's worth listening to.

    Let's see how he gets on.
    I’m willing to bet at odds on that he never gets a bigger share of the vote at a GE than Old Jezza
  • Options
    GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    I don't have a clue what you're banging on about. The staff are being paid 100% of their wages not 80% as most other businesses are doing. Seems to me they are treating their staff better than almost any other business under the circumstances. What's the big deal?
    I've explained my point as much as I possibly can. You don't agree, fair enough.

    Let's see how it plays out.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    DavidL said:

    isam said:

    When do we think foreign holidays will be possible? We have two booked - May 30th and Jul 17th

    Which year? Surely not this one.
    Yeah South of France for my girlfriends 40th and Portugal with a few couples. Damn shame.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    tlg86 said:

    Disgraceful of LFC to furlough its non-playing staff. That's me done with that football club.

    Football clubs and the players pay a lot of tax, but it is poor that they aren’t covering staff pay themselves.
    The players could donate the necessary money by taking a pay cut.

    How many do you will think will offer ?
    Is there any reason why millionaires should subsidise billionaires? And is there any reason why footballers should be singled out ahead of bankers, actors, lawyers and pop stars?
    Because football clubs pretend to be something more than mere businesses. LFC certainly has.

    It will be laughed out of town now every time it tries to sing its anthem.
    The staff are fine they get 100% and don’t lose out the debate should be about wether it is right for a business, however profitable, to take advantage of the scheme. Apart from the overall tax payer who are LFC treating badly? Not the staff so the contempt is misguided, they have not sold the staff down the river unless I’m missing something?
    I think you don't really understand the point about LFC. It has just lost its soul.

    Liverpool CEO Peter Moore Oct '19: "We had this historical figure, Bill Shankly, a Scottish socialist. Today when we speak about business questions, we ask ourselves: 'what would Shankly do?'

    Football is about rivalry. LFC fans will be ashamed of this, they will be mocked merclessly. Their achievements traduced.

    I understand it completely, was born and brought up a red, what are you upset about? if it’s because they are taking government money then I assume you feel the same about every other business owner who could afford to pay but has gone down the furlough, there are plenty of examples.
    No because they are not like every other business, that's the whole point. They pretend to be something more and that's the whole brand. Let's see how this plays out to see who has called it correctly.
    You haven’t answered the question the employees wages are guaranteed so what’s so appalling unless you believe they should not take tax payers money.
    Why are you struggling to understand the simple point that LFC pretends to be a community or an extended family and yet does not dip into its own hefty pockets in order to look after its own staff during a storm? It's very simple.

    Whether you are personally neutral between the government paying those salaries or LFC paying them doesn't matter, it will matter to many LFC fans. Moreover it will be a stick that will be used to demean and to humiliate those same LFC fans and any hard-fought achievement, that is undeniable. So it is a mistake on multiple levels. A very cheap but very expensive mistake.

    Let's see how it plays out like I said.
    The club is dipping into its own pockets. That's why the staff are getting 100% not 80% because the club is dipping into its own pockets and paying the difference. Unlike other clubs and businesses.
This discussion has been closed.