Comparison between flu and Corona are surely unfair because we have a vaccine for flu.
Once we get a vaccine for Corona things will become clearer. and I suggest much calmer.
Only 18 months to wait, then.
There are I understand some teams working on it that think they can have a functioning Vaccine in 6 months, they may be wrong, indeed the 18 month estimate may tern out to be too optimistic, but given the number of teams working on it and the priority that they will be given in there organisations, i suspect it will be closer to 6 months than 18 months.
Comparison between flu and Corona are surely unfair because we have a vaccine for flu.
Once we get a vaccine for Corona things will become clearer. and I suggest much calmer.
Only 18 months to wait, then.
There are I understand some teams working on it that think they can have a functioning Vaccine in 6 months, they may be wrong, indeed the 18 month estimate may tern out to be too optimistic, but given the number of teams working on it and the priority that they will be given in there organisations, i suspect it will be closer to 6 months than 18 months.
Research, identification, testing, approval, production. 18 months minimum, unless we are able to cut some corners (I did see suggestions that some existing anti-viral treatments - aided cure, not prevention - might be available sooner).
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
The cruise ships are very safe for children and I expect the cruises will be heavily discounted
However, the bigger problem might well be the insurance premiums especially if the US is involved.
I spoke to a lady who is going to Florida on a 10 day land based holiday in June and the insurance premium for her jumped from £180 to £240 in 48 hours. The insurer said their quotes are not even valid by the hour in this market, let alone days !!!!
If Model L is right, and it doubles every four days (roughly) then in one month Italy will have 320,000 cases, which means 10,000 dead (on a CFR of 3%) and 30,000 critically ill.
It's that critically ill number which is menacing.
I don't think that cases are increasing that quickly, although confirmed cases are. We're (hopefully) seeing testing catch up to the true scale.
However there is the unpalatable possibility that perhaps cases are growing father than they can test, which leads to a bad conclusion.
And yeah, with numbers 10 times as big the mortality rate will increase significantly.
They are *really* trying to keep the F1 season going ahead:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/51727401 "Bahrain is instigating special measures for Formula 1 personnel working at its grand prix later this month in the wake of the global coronavirus outbreak.
The Gulf state has imposed a 14-day quarantine on travellers from countries where outbreaks are most severe, including Italy, home of Ferrari.
But authorities are planning an expedited process for F1 personnel to limit the effect of the restrictions."
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
Club Med are also giving good deals on skiing trips.
You do not want to go skiing because you do not want to end up in intensive care (or a long queue for intensive care) in a coronavirus ridden hospital, which is the nailed on consequence of a serious skiing accident at least in Italy atm. Same applies to other risk sports.
"The potential first case of coronavirus in Florida is having trouble getting verified thanks to the alleged refusal of health officials to conduct the necessary tests, according to CBS Miami.
"Speaking to CBS Miami, a woman who requested to remain anonymous said she started experiencing symptoms after a trip to Italy, but was unable to get a proper diagnosis.
“The doctor himself told me that, you know, he thinks that the results of my [preliminary] tests mean that I most likely have the COVID-19, but that the Department of Health did not want to pursue it further,” the woman said. “It was either the Department of Health or the CDC that decided not to further pursue the inquiry. But I was basically told that it is most likely that I have this virus and that I should self-quarantine.”
“Obviously, I would have liked to know if, in fact, I have this virus,” she added.
The mortality rate in South Korea is 0.5%. Why the difference?
Mass testing catching less serious cases?
Obviously the deaths side of the equation is going to be pretty accurate. Total cases though is inevitably going to be an underestimate, especially early on.
Sounds like if you're fit and healthy now is an opportunity in the lifetime for a visit to Venice
Yep. We went to Istanbul during a terrorism scare a few years back and it was great. We were popular with the cafe owners. And it's a magnificent city when not thronging.
"The potential first case of coronavirus in Florida is having trouble getting verified thanks to the alleged refusal of health officials to conduct the necessary tests, according to CBS Miami.
"Speaking to CBS Miami, a woman who requested to remain anonymous said she started experiencing symptoms after a trip to Italy, but was unable to get a proper diagnosis.
“The doctor himself told me that, you know, he thinks that the results of my [preliminary] tests mean that I most likely have the COVID-19, but that the Department of Health did not want to pursue it further,” the woman said. “It was either the Department of Health or the CDC that decided not to further pursue the inquiry. But I was basically told that it is most likely that I have this virus and that I should self-quarantine.”
“Obviously, I would have liked to know if, in fact, I have this virus,” she added.
"The potential first case of coronavirus in Florida is having trouble getting verified thanks to the alleged refusal of health officials to conduct the necessary tests, according to CBS Miami.
"Speaking to CBS Miami, a woman who requested to remain anonymous said she started experiencing symptoms after a trip to Italy, but was unable to get a proper diagnosis.
“The doctor himself told me that, you know, he thinks that the results of my [preliminary] tests mean that I most likely have the COVID-19, but that the Department of Health did not want to pursue it further,” the woman said. “It was either the Department of Health or the CDC that decided not to further pursue the inquiry. But I was basically told that it is most likely that I have this virus and that I should self-quarantine.”
“Obviously, I would have liked to know if, in fact, I have this virus,” she added.
Little probably about it. They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how interconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 400-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days (also generous). You can do the maths on that. The US needs to get a handle on this now.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector.
My concern about the US is rising and if it is out of control as has been suggested the ramifications for all of us and especially the US are incalculable.
In the circumstances that the US becomes subject to FCO and other travel restrictions the economic effects could be huge.
As I have maintained all along the economic hit is going to be far worse than the health one
That 1 in 733 figure is interesting because so far in 10 countries — Germany, Spain, Singapore, Kuwait, UK, Bahrain, Switzerland, Malaysia, Norway, Canada — there have been 749 cases and no fatalities. I know it's very optimistic to hope that all of those cases result in a full recovery.
Indeed. Italy has an average 17,000 deaths from the flu per annum. Currently COVID is running at below 0.5% of that total.
If Italy does average 17,000 deaths from flu per year, that is a lot more than the UK, where it is about 4,000 IIRC, for a similer size population.
It could be for a lot of reasons, highly speculative to say this, but perhaps by extrapolation, the same reasons will kick in and we will also see less deaths for COV19?
Would enplane why Italy has been so much worse than the rest of Europe?
Italy is exceptional compared to other European nations when it comes to flu, so unsurprising they'd be exceptional compared to other nations with COVID too.
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
Club Med are also giving good deals on skiing trips.
You do not want to go skiing because you do not want to end up in intensive care (or a long queue for intensive care) in a coronavirus ridden hospital, which is the nailed on consequence of a serious skiing accident at least in Italy atm. Same applies to other risk sports.
That`s a good point. I was planning another trip in April. Suppose France or Austria would be a bit safer.
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
Club Med are also giving good deals on skiing trips.
You do not want to go skiing because you do not want to end up in intensive care (or a long queue for intensive care) in a coronavirus ridden hospital, which is the nailed on consequence of a serious skiing accident at least in Italy atm. Same applies to other risk sports.
That`s a good point. I was planning another trip in April. Suppose France or Austria would be a bit safer.
Indeed. Italy has an average 17,000 deaths from the flu per annum. Currently COVID is running at below 0.5% of that total.
If Italy does average 17,000 deaths from flu per year, that is a lot more than the UK, where it is about 4,000 IIRC, for a similer size population.
It could be for a lot of reasons, highly speculative to say this, but perhaps by extrapolation, the same reasons will kick in and we will also see less deaths for COV19?
Would enplane why Italy has been so much worse than the rest of Europe?
Italy is exceptional compared to other European nations when it comes to flu, so unsurprising they'd be exceptional compared to other nations with COVID too.
That the Democrats cancel the remaining primaries and hold an extraordinary (early) national convention by April with all outstanding states delegates being “unbound” but end up declaring their candidate (Biden) and closing the whole process down?
That 1 in 733 figure is interesting because so far in 10 countries — Germany, Spain, Singapore, Kuwait, UK, Bahrain, Switzerland, Malaysia, Norway, Canada — there have been 749 cases and no fatalities. I know it's very optimistic to hope that all of those cases result in a full recovery.
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
Club Med are also giving good deals on skiing trips.
You do not want to go skiing because you do not want to end up in intensive care (or a long queue for intensive care) in a coronavirus ridden hospital, which is the nailed on consequence of a serious skiing accident at least in Italy atm. Same applies to other risk sports.
That`s a good point. I was planning another trip in April. Suppose France or Austria would be a bit safer.
Norway and Finland safer
Caithness even better.
Not much skiing there but the Grampians and Aviemore are a better bet
That 1 in 733 figure is interesting because so far in 10 countries — Germany, Spain, Singapore, Kuwait, UK, Bahrain, Switzerland, Malaysia, Norway, Canada — there have been 749 cases and no fatalities. I know it's very optimistic to hope that all of those cases result in a full recovery.
749 cases, not 749 people fully recovered. So far we have 749 test cases, all of whom will hopefully recover but we don't know yet.
Yes, and the countries have been cherry picked. France has had 4 deaths.
I don't think it counts as cherry picking. It's simply looking at countries which haven't experienced any fatalities yet.
That's by definition cherrypicking.
"I don't think it counts as cherry picking, it's simply looking at all the branches with cherries"
There's nothing wrong with trying to work out why a lot of countries haven't had any fatalities yet despite a fair number of cases. That's what I was doing.
The most bizarre thing about this crisis is how mortal enemies Iran and the USA have both been pushed back to calling upon religion for salvation.
Add in the home of the Catholic church and the South Korean sect and its almost as if prayer isnt as good at dealing with illnesses as science. Who would have thought it?
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
The cruise ships are very safe for children and I expect the cruises will be heavily discounted
However, the bigger problem might well be the insurance premiums especially if the US is involved.
I spoke to a lady who is going to Florida on a 10 day land based holiday in June and the insurance premium for her jumped from £180 to £240 in 48 hours. The insurer said their quotes are not even valid by the hour in this market, let alone days !!!!
Glad I got my insurance for our May trip to NY last year then.
OTH I might have got a big discount on the actual crossing, I guess - although, since it was recently sold out in the cabin class we wanted, maybe not?
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
That the Democrats cancel the remaining primaries and hold an extraordinary (early) national convention by April with all outstanding states delegates being “unbound” but end up declaring their candidate (Biden) and closing the whole process down?
Is that a thing?
Either way I don't think the prognosis looks that good for the democrats. Sanders is a risk for the democrats but may win, but I think Biden is an even bigger risk. Lacking Sanders' agility on his feet, if the Sanders constituency perceive a stitch-up either between Buttigieg and Klobuchar, or through a convention process, the democrats will suffer will suffer more widely from a big drop in turnout.
I think that all adds up to making things look relatively good for Trump, even if there's a major coronavirus outbreak - unless there's an unpredicted upset at one of the debates, and Sanders is the one much more capable of that.
That 1 in 733 figure is interesting because so far in 10 countries — Germany, Spain, Singapore, Kuwait, UK, Bahrain, Switzerland, Malaysia, Norway, Canada — there have been 749 cases and no fatalities. I know it's very optimistic to hope that all of those cases result in a full recovery.
749 cases, not 749 people fully recovered. So far we have 749 test cases, all of whom will hopefully recover but we don't know yet.
Yes, and the countries have been cherry picked. France has had 4 deaths.
I don't think it counts as cherry picking. It's simply looking at countries which haven't experienced any fatalities yet.
That's by definition cherrypicking.
"I don't think it counts as cherry picking, it's simply looking at all the branches with cherries"
There's nothing wrong with trying to work out why a lot of countries haven't had any fatalities yet despite a fair number of cases. That's what I was doing.
Indeed and nothing wrong with that, but its accurate [not critical] to say its cherrypicked data. If 1/733 is average and you select a pool of 749 from groups knowing they have 0 fatalities then your 0 is both very close to the average anyway and hardly surprising given the cherrypicking.
Look at that Turkey stat. 94% wash their hands, and very few Coronavirus cases
It's like the Day of the Triffids, when it turns out they can be killed with sea water, or whatever.
It's the washin' of the 'ands wot will save us!
When you consider what they use their left hand for, it is hardly surprising it gets a good wash....
The sea water"solution" was in the film.. IIRC the book said they were hoping to find something to kill off the triffids but nothing had been found. its a long time since I read it.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
I was at a livery hall event last night where I saw two 75 year olds unironically bump elbows on meeting. I was halfway between being amused and being impressed at their pragmatic adaptability to changing circumstances.
A lovely smile is perfectly fine. Why the need to touch someone at all?
Update from the front line. Am in Paris for meetings.
Of the three, one cancelled because they are trying to cut down on interactions with travellers, one cancelled because the markets are crazy, and one withdrew his hand as I put mine (newly sanitised) out to shake it.
Uber driver most phlegmatic of the lot.
Phlegm-atic might not be want you want from your Uber driver right now
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
What has he done ? It’s only a few days ago it was a Democrat plot.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
It's not just Trump, it is the entire GOP ethos to evidence based policy and effective executive action. The thing that derailed the Bush Jr presidency was the utterly bungle Huricane KATRINA response, brought about by the gutting of actual effective leadership of FEMA.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
You are blind to Trump.
He is a total disaster both on climate change and now this
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
So Trump doesn’t have any duty to lead effectively because “China started it”?
Perhaps American investors (because all that’s Trump seems to care about) might take the view that the worse Trump handles it, the worse for them...
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
You are blind to Trump.
He is a total disaster both on climate change and now this
China also emits more carbon dioxide even than Trump's USA too
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
You are blind to Trump.
He is a total disaster both on climate change and now this
China also emits more carbon dioxide even than Trump's USA too
Once you add in the hot air from the White House it’s less polluting overall though.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Looks like NYSE investors are seeing the interest rate cut as a sign of how bad it is and selling accordingly. Who'd a thunk it, eh?
Yes. The small sell position I had from this morning was several hundred pounds underwater by mid afternoon; when the market jumped I took out another sell position, as I said I would this morning, and together they have just moved into profit. On the basis that there isn’t much more the central banks can offer, and the medical news looks bad in the short term, I think we are back in a sellers market for the short term, at least. It will take clear evidence that the epidemic is weakening - or the million tests in the US don’t find very much - to send the markets back upwards.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
There's been some epic tortured analogies in PB history but this is the winner.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
You cannot be real.
Yes it originated in China but a large part of the world have been proactive in addressing it while the idiotic Trump first calls it a hoax, then says there will be a vaccine in a few months, and now says there will be a million tests when the US are incapable of doing more than a few hundred so far.
The US people, and all of us, deserve someone who cares, is competent, and able to react to events to keep people safe. Trump and his republicans fail on all those counts
And do they take (and is it a practical/good idea to take) a toddler?
Don’t want her falling over the side!
Club Med are also giving good deals on skiing trips.
You do not want to go skiing because you do not want to end up in intensive care (or a long queue for intensive care) in a coronavirus ridden hospital, which is the nailed on consequence of a serious skiing accident at least in Italy atm. Same applies to other risk sports.
That`s a good point. I was planning another trip in April. Suppose France or Austria would be a bit safer.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Which, in turn, endangers the rest of us. America is an idiot
Americans seem to believe that paying no taxes and having a gun are sufficient to guarantee a good life.
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. Except for voluntary philanthropy, which is no good in a situation like this.
On a more mundane level, you see this with the state of the roads. The richest country in the world, yet you have to drive hundreds of miles along bumpy potholed roads that would shame some modern day African countries.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
I was at a livery hall event last night where I saw two 75 year olds unironically bump elbows on meeting. I was halfway between being amused and being impressed at their pragmatic adaptability to changing circumstances.
A lovely smile is perfectly fine. Why the need to touch someone at all?
Update from the front line. Am in Paris for meetings.
Of the three, one cancelled because they are trying to cut down on interactions with travellers, one cancelled because the markets are crazy, and one withdrew his hand as I put mine (newly sanitised) out to shake it.
Uber driver most phlegmatic of the lot.
Phlegm-atic might not be want you want from your Uber driver right now
I completely disagree with the concensus over Trump here. What he can actually *do* as President is imo limited. All he can really do is maintain a positive optimistic face, and he seems to be doing that.
By contrast, look at Tony Blair, the twat, donning full protective gear and emoting on the scene of Foot and Mouth disease. Those images went around the world and did untold and unnecessary damage to the tourism industry.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
There's been some epic tortured analogies in PB history but this is the winner.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
You cannot be real.
Yes it originated in China but a large part of the world have been proactive in addressing it while the idiotic Trump first calls it a hoax, then says there will be a vaccine in a few months, and now says there will be a million tests when the US are incapable of doing more than a few hundred so far.
The US people, and all of us, deserve someone who cares, is competent, and able to react to events to keep people safe. Trump and his republicans fail on all those counts
I most certainly am real, the blame for this outbreak lies solely and squarely with the Communist government of China not with Trump and it is they who are to blame and they who must change their behaviour.
How the USA responds to it is up to the USA and who the US elects to be their president is up to the US people
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
You cannot be real.
Yes it originated in China but a large part of the world have been proactive in addressing it while the idiotic Trump first calls it a hoax, then says there will be a vaccine in a few months, and now says there will be a million tests when the US are incapable of doing more than a few hundred so far.
The US people, and all of us, deserve someone who cares, is competent, and able to react to events to keep people safe. Trump and his republicans fail on all those counts
It’s reminding me of the Gordon Brown ‘it started in America‘ defence.
Yes, it did. But that didn’t explain why we had fourteen financial institutions collapse to Australia and Canada’s combined total of zero.
That 1 in 733 figure is interesting because so far in 10 countries — Germany, Spain, Singapore, Kuwait, UK, Bahrain, Switzerland, Malaysia, Norway, Canada — there have been 749 cases and no fatalities. I know it's very optimistic to hope that all of those cases result in a full recovery.
749 cases, not 749 people fully recovered. So far we have 749 test cases, all of whom will hopefully recover but we don't know yet.
Yes, and the countries have been cherry picked. France has had 4 deaths.
I don't think it counts as cherry picking. It's simply looking at countries which haven't experienced any fatalities yet.
That's by definition cherrypicking.
"I don't think it counts as cherry picking, it's simply looking at all the branches with cherries"
There's nothing wrong with trying to work out why a lot of countries haven't had any fatalities yet despite a fair number of cases. That's what I was doing.
There is a problem with it when you include Germany 200 cases no deaths but leave out neighbouring France with 200 cases and 4 deaths. Thats an average accross the two countries of 1%, and count-data around these kind of levels is always going to be blotchy.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Electronic touch screen voting machines.
The. Fucking. Horror.
Yep. I genuinely believe that the US will record substantially more deaths than Europe, despite a far smaller population. Perhaps 2 to 3 times more.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
Turks slosh around cheap perfumed alcohol all the time to clean hands and freshen up. It is sold everywhere by the half litre. Quite an effective antiviral.
Having said that, I am sure that they are brewing lots of cases, probably via fleeing Iranians.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Which, in turn, endangers the rest of us. America is an idiot
Americans seem to believe that paying no taxes and having a gun are sufficient to guarantee a good life.
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. Except for voluntary philanthropy, which is no good in a situation like this.
On a more mundane level, you see this with the state of the roads. The richest country in the world, yet you have to drive hundreds of miles along bumpy potholed roads that would shame some modern day African countries.
Just on that last point first, the roads around where I live in Surrey are appalling. But we seem to be doing okay with regards to the virus. At the moment.
On the wider point about attitudes in America, it probably won't come to this as the fatality rate isn't that bad, but I could imagine them turning on each other if it got really bad.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Which, in turn, endangers the rest of us. America is an idiot
Americans seem to believe that paying no taxes and having a gun are sufficient to guarantee a good life.
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. [SNIP]
There used to be though... just think of the response to two world wars, also the space race.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How are you. Were you due a medical procedure today
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
The virus could kill you, especially if you are over 80
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
You cannot be real.
Yes it originated in China but a large part of the world have been proactive in addressing it while the idiotic Trump first calls it a hoax, then says there will be a vaccine in a few months, and now says there will be a million tests when the US are incapable of doing more than a few hundred so far.
The US people, and all of us, deserve someone who cares, is competent, and able to react to events to keep people safe. Trump and his republicans fail on all those counts
It’s reminding me of the Gordon Brown ‘it started in America‘ defence.
Yes, it did. But that didn’t explain why we had fourteen financial institutions collapse to Australia and Canada’s combined total of zero.
You cannot say things like that on PB. Jonathan will be upset.
I completely disagree with the concensus over Trump here. What he can actually *do* as President is imo limited. All he can really do is maintain a positive optimistic face, and he seems to be doing that.
By contrast, look at Tony Blair, the twat, donning full protective gear and emoting on the scene of Foot and Mouth disease. Those images went around the world and did untold and unnecessary damage to the tourism industry.
I haven't seen any photo's of Giseppe Conte donning full protective gear but Italy's tourism industry has still nose dived.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
ck exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
Everyone is shit at knowing what to say in these situations but I wish you all the very best and a recovery and I'm sure everyone on PB is willing you to get better.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Which, in turn, endangers the rest of us. America is an idiot
Americans seem to believe that paying no taxes and having a gun are sufficient to guarantee a good life.
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. Except for voluntary philanthropy, which is no good in a situation like this.
On a more mundane level, you see this with the state of the roads. The richest country in the world, yet you have to drive hundreds of miles along bumpy potholed roads that would shame some modern day African countries.
Just on that last point first, the roads around where I live in Surrey are appalling. But we seem to be doing okay with regards to the virus. At the moment.
On the wider point about attitudes in America, it probably won't come to this as the fatality rate isn't that bad, but I could imagine them turning on each other if it got really bad.
I would guess that you haven't tried American roads then? It is quite an experience encountering public highways, allegedly metalled, that really require a high ground clearance 4x4. I'm not talking about gravel tracks in hicksville - highly frequented local roads.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
Oh shit. Not great. Very best wishes and good luck.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
Which, in turn, endangers the rest of us. America is an idiot
Americans seem to believe that paying no taxes and having a gun are sufficient to guarantee a good life.
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. [SNIP]
There used to be though... just think of the response to two world wars, also the space race.
Indeed. America has been changing fast during our lifetimes. There was a time when a Americans had the shortest working hours of any western economy. Nixon came close to introducing a universal basic income during his first term. And it wasn’t until Clinton that the welfare safety net beneath the poorest was finally dismantled.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
Don't be absurd.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
The risks originated in China but China acted to contain it. The USA is not acting to contain it.
It would not surprise me if more Americans than Chinese die from this outbreak before the end which was entirely avoidable.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
ck exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
Everyone is shit at knowing what to say in these situations but I wish you all the very best and a recovery and I'm sure everyone on PB is willing you to get better.
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
Sounds like you have a good plan there - wishing you a super speedy recovery.
By the way, have no idea if you are interested in alternative therapies, but my friend who has leukemia basically lives due to cannabis oil. She also supplies it - recently started supplying an 80 year old woman with lung cancer who doctors had no hope for - they are now astonished that her tumours are shrinking. She refuses to tell them. Or stop smoking.
The way he is handling covid 19 he should be thrown out of office now
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
I don't think he is handling it that badly and let us not forget it was the Chinese government's failure to ban live meat markets and experiments on bats that launched coronavirus on the world, not Trump
ck exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
The main blame for this virus lies with China and the Chinese government for allowing unsafe meat markets and animal experiments which allowed the virus to fester and emerge.
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Does it matter where the blame lies? It doesn’t help anybody we can worry about that when it’s over
Yes it does, when people are killed law enforcement look for the murderer or who is responsible for their manslaughter not which ambulance service provided the weakest response to them
Well it’s a view! The virus won’t kill me but the impact that it has could do. At the moment I don’t give a shit who caused it but I do give a shit how governments react to it. The UK is doing well at the moment but personally I would can all sport involving large gatherings as should spain. It’s a bit like blame Eve for original sin
How you doing? In hospital?
No I have a second tumor on the liver and it will be chemo and radio treatment. The private hospital has recommended I now move on to the state system because our local hospital is a world leader in cancer treatment. The insurance company are pulling strings to accelerate me through the system. They tell me if you have to get cancer they are some of the most curable. Staying calm and looking for alternatives to keep my mind moving.
Everyone is shit at knowing what to say in these situations but I wish you all the very best and a recovery and I'm sure we are all willing you to get better.
It’s fine, trying not to be a drama queen, the fact that we are just virtually connected helps. Great support life goes on
One of the few upsides to this ghastly virus is the way it puts everything else in perspective. That article might have "worked" a few weeks ago, now, as we confront a real emergency, which - at its worst - might just break aspects of Britain, it looks like a wankfest of lefty hysteria. Which it is.
One thing that this government has achieved - in conversation with the regressive* types, apparently (a) EvulTories have put lots of people of the scrap heap (b) there will be no-one to do the all jobs when the immigrants are rounded up and sent home.
Gently pushing a) and b) together (as it were) looks good for creating some heading exploding moments.
*I find it hard to think of pseudo tankies as progressing towards anything
Comments
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9YirNgAzXI
However, the bigger problem might well be the insurance premiums especially if the US is involved.
I spoke to a lady who is going to Florida on a 10 day land based holiday in June and the insurance premium for her jumped from £180 to £240 in 48 hours. The insurer said their quotes are not even valid by the hour in this market, let alone days !!!!
However there is the unpalatable possibility that perhaps cases are growing father than they can test, which leads to a bad conclusion.
And yeah, with numbers 10 times as big the mortality rate will increase significantly.
Different finger greetings for less favoured people.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/51727401
"Bahrain is instigating special measures for Formula 1 personnel working at its grand prix later this month in the wake of the global coronavirus outbreak.
The Gulf state has imposed a 14-day quarantine on travellers from countries where outbreaks are most severe, including Italy, home of Ferrari.
But authorities are planning an expedited process for F1 personnel to limit the effect of the restrictions."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croydon_typhoid_outbreak_of_1937
Obviously the deaths side of the equation is going to be pretty accurate. Total cases though is inevitably going to be an underestimate, especially early on.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 400-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days (also generous). You can do the maths on that. The US needs to get a handle on this now.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector.
In the circumstances that the US becomes subject to FCO and other travel restrictions the economic effects could be huge.
As I have maintained all along the economic hit is going to be far worse than the health one
Italy is exceptional compared to other European nations when it comes to flu, so unsurprising they'd be exceptional compared to other nations with COVID too.
That the Democrats cancel the remaining primaries and hold an extraordinary (early) national convention by April with all outstanding states delegates being “unbound” but end up declaring their candidate (Biden) and closing the whole process down?
Is that a thing?
"I don't think it counts as cherry picking, it's simply looking at all the branches with cherries"
He is a real and ever present danger to his people and the Rest of the World
OTH I might have got a big discount on the actual crossing, I guess - although, since it was recently sold out in the cabin class we wanted, maybe not?
I think that all adds up to making things look relatively good for Trump, even if there's a major coronavirus outbreak - unless there's an unpredicted upset at one of the debates, and Sanders is the one much more capable of that.
There may be a reason of course.
America hasn't even tested 500 people since this began while we've tested nearly 20,000 and are testing hundreds or thousands per day.
Rest of the world's response to this virus is thinking how to contain it. Trump's response is how to look after the stock exchange.
Viruses can evolve, it happens, but how we react to it is how we should be measured and Trump has failed awfully.
They have at the very least 5 community transmission areas (Seattle, NY/Florida, Oregon, CA*2). Given how extremely hard it is to get a test over there it's extremely likely that there will be many more clusters going from 5 to 10 to 20 etc. Given how intraconnected the US is the longer they leave it the more clusters there will be.
A case missed in mid January in Seattle is estimated to be about 750-1000 cases now, multiply that by 10-25 for 10-25 other missed cases (extremely generous estimate for the US), and add in a doubling rate of 5ish days. You can do the maths on that.
Super Tuesday looks to be an amazing transmission vector. By the time they realise what they're dealing with they'll be past the point of controlling it.
He is a total disaster both on climate change and now this
Yes, the US could try and increase its testing rate to ours but that is a matter for them, however the risk we face originated from China and that is where the blame lies and the most lessons need to be learnt
Perhaps American investors (because all that’s Trump seems to care about) might take the view that the worse Trump handles it, the worse for them...
The. Fucking. Horror.
Yes it originated in China but a large part of the world have been proactive in addressing it while the idiotic Trump first calls it a hoax, then says there will be a vaccine in a few months, and now says there will be a million tests when the US are incapable of doing more than a few hundred so far.
The US people, and all of us, deserve someone who cares, is competent, and able to react to events to keep people safe. Trump and his republicans fail on all those counts
It takes an incident like this to demonstrate the value of collective action. Yet there is no collective action in America. Except for voluntary philanthropy, which is no good in a situation like this.
On a more mundane level, you see this with the state of the roads. The richest country in the world, yet you have to drive hundreds of miles along bumpy potholed roads that would shame some modern day African countries.
Trump just blinds you
By contrast, look at Tony Blair, the twat, donning full protective gear and emoting on the scene of Foot and Mouth disease. Those images went around the world and did untold and unnecessary damage to the tourism industry.
How the USA responds to it is up to the USA and who the US elects to be their president is up to the US people
Yes, it did. But that didn’t explain why we had fourteen financial institutions collapse to Australia and Canada’s combined total of zero.
Having said that, I am sure that they are brewing lots of cases, probably via fleeing Iranians.
On the wider point about attitudes in America, it probably won't come to this as the fatality rate isn't that bad, but I could imagine them turning on each other if it got really bad.
https://twitter.com/Seattle2019nCov/status/1234914123546103808?s=19
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/mar/03/lost-decade-hidden-story-how-austerity-broke-britain
It would not surprise me if more Americans than Chinese die from this outbreak before the end which was entirely avoidable.
All best wishes @nichomar.
By the way, have no idea if you are interested in alternative therapies, but my friend who has leukemia basically lives due to cannabis oil. She also supplies it - recently started supplying an 80 year old woman with lung cancer who doctors had no hope for - they are now astonished that her tumours are shrinking. She refuses to tell them. Or stop smoking.
Gently pushing a) and b) together (as it were) looks good for creating some heading exploding moments.
*I find it hard to think of pseudo tankies as progressing towards anything