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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The data’s clear: The Tories are retaining more of their GE201

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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,729
    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html
    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Discussed at length on the previous thread. According to some, people who don’t get a British passport despite living here for decades, working, paying taxes, raising families etc, even fighting for this country are “guests”, if they’re lucky “honoured guests” and should not think of this as a stigma.
    It that a legal category now .... ?
    In some ways that would be an improvement on the current Tory attitude.
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    Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411
    Hard left champagne socialists on here getting rattled now!

    But a long way to go. No room for complacency!

    However today's headline is LAB election violence
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    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Its increased by 23%
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    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Discussed at length on the previous thread. According to some, people who don’t get a British passport despite living here for decades, working, paying taxes, raising families etc, even fighting for this country are “guests”, if they’re lucky “honoured guests” and should not think of this as a stigma.

    It would be risible were it not exactly the same posters who supposedly get so agitated by anti-Semitism when they see it in Labour ranks. Still, at least we don’t need to take their claims to any kind of integrity seriously in future.
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    wills66wills66 Posts: 103

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    I think the headline is more of a dog whistle than the speech's contents.

    "treat the UK as their own" (the headline) is not the same as "to treat the UK basically as though it’s part of their own country" (the actual quote).

    Those non-Conservative partisans who affect to care about accuracy, now have a chance to demonstrate it.


    WillS.

    PS: Get well soon (I mean from the flu, not intended sarcastically).
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    alb1onalb1on Posts: 698

    alb1on said:

    I am not taking a position on the event, but I fail to see anything odd in the use of WhatsApp. We even use it at my cricket club to sort out teams. It seems to be the default mechanism when anything is organised.
    Nothing. The accusation is that it wasn't just just a ramble who turned up, it was a protest financially supported by the Labour Party which resulted in an adviser getting lamped. At the moment it is all accusations, and I wait to see the proof.

    However, it is a shit show now. Assaulting an adviser is an absolute no no.
    I agree with your conclusion but see no connection between organising a protest and paying for it. Most protests will require some organisation but it carries no implication of payment. Conflating the issues makes me suspicious about the journo (although, tbf, my view of journos generally is similar to Ben Goldacre's).
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Andy_JS said:

    Gove in Chesterfield today after a Tory surge in their canvass returns according to their candidate there.I thought all Labour activists had been relocated from Chesterfield as it was considered safe for Labour?.Needs about a ten per cent swing.

    YouGov MRP, Chesterfield:

    Lab 42%
    Con 36%
    LD 8%
    BRX 9%
    Grn 3%
    Oth 2%

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ry90s0oDXu6_LhDKNiI6fXaSFJsfMBaAXI6cZ8XhqQ8/edit#gid=0
    In 2017 YouGov underestimated the Tories by 8% in Chesterfied

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18rrY4Yj07ne1QlhFYI0JuEl82dEXn5K4EdChKc8MRMo/edit?usp=sharing
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    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    @rcs1000 - I would like to see one of your 5-year spending comparisons for the NHS. I bet investment is far higher than it was in 2010.
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    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Yes it has, but the problem is that with demographic change and an increasing range of treatments available (some of which are very expensive), demand rises even faster than spending.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,216

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Why have you been so quiet on this forum this election?

    You haven’t posted much.
    I’ve been exceptionally busy with work and I’ve now come down with the flu.
    Poor you.

    I hope you haven’t been advising the Labour Party on how to nationalise all our pensions ..... 😏
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    TOPPING said:

    Ave_it said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Does this mean we will get 52% then?

    :lol:

    I’m glad you find demonising people who have lived here for decades hilarious.
    Or saying they don't get English irony.

    You picks your poison. One of them has to win.
    Perhaps. That still doesn’t mean I have to choose either of them. And I reserve the right to spit with contempt in front of anyone who does who then tries to take the moral high ground for their choice.
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    wills66wills66 Posts: 103

    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Its increased by 23%
    Rising spending and underfunding are not contradictory of course. It all depends on what you think spending ought to be and what the rate of inflation is for medical services.

    WillS.
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    llefllef Posts: 298
    Andy_JS said:

    kle4 said:

    And yet LDs might win back Ceredigion? Seems unlikely on that
    PC are slightly down and LDs up a bit, so using uniform swing they would gain Ceredigion.
    yes, and to be fair, the last ITV poll in 2017 did not have Plaid winning Ceredigion - Ceredigion dances to its own tune...
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited December 2019
    alb1on said:

    alb1on said:

    I am not taking a position on the event, but I fail to see anything odd in the use of WhatsApp. We even use it at my cricket club to sort out teams. It seems to be the default mechanism when anything is organised.
    Nothing. The accusation is that it wasn't just just a ramble who turned up, it was a protest financially supported by the Labour Party which resulted in an adviser getting lamped. At the moment it is all accusations, and I wait to see the proof.

    However, it is a shit show now. Assaulting an adviser is an absolute no no.
    I agree with your conclusion but see no connection between organising a protest and paying for it. Most protests will require some organisation but it carries no implication of payment. Conflating the issues makes me suspicious about the journo (although, tbf, my view of journos generally is similar to Ben Goldacre's).
    There is are WhatApp messages that specifically says that taxis will be paid for.

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1204085025924362242

    The question is who authorized it. Is Dave actually anybody, or just some random in the Labour Leeds WhatApps group.

    And to be honest, that bit is secondary. An adviser has by the sounds of it being assaulted.
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    Anyway, my eyes are hurting too much from this much screen time.
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    If I'm remembering correctly, didn't the previous Welsh barometer show an unexpected shift towards Labour? That would suggest simply that that was a slight outlier, and the position has returned towards how it has been for some weeks.

    I don't think so. Labour's lead at the time was fairly consistent with the tory lead in the national polls (about 10%). If this result is consistent with national polls I think we can expect a national lead around 12-13%.
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    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Why have you been so quiet on this forum this election?

    You haven’t posted much.
    I’ve been exceptionally busy with work and I’ve now come down with the flu.
    Poor you.

    I hope you haven’t been advising the Labour Party on how to nationalise all our pensions ..... 😏
    Don't - their outriders have floated that as an idea already!!
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    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    GE 2017 actual
    Lab 48.9%
    Con 33.6%
    Lib 4.5%
    PC 10.4%
    ukip 2%
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    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Discussed at length on the previous thread. According to some, people who don’t get a British passport despite living here for decades, working, paying taxes, raising families etc, even fighting for this country are “guests”, if they’re lucky “honoured guests” and should not think of this as a stigma.

    It would be risible were it not exactly the same posters who supposedly get so agitated by anti-Semitism when they see it in Labour ranks. Still, at least we don’t need to take their claims to any kind of integrity seriously in future.
    Sorry you have flu Alastair. I hope you have plenty of rest and recover quickly

    I am sure you would have preferred not to be under the weather just now

    All the best
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,736

    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Its increased by 23%
    So that`s about 2% per year in excess of inflation. So Labour are lying, yes?
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    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Why have you been so quiet on this forum this election?

    You haven’t posted much.
    I’ve been exceptionally busy with work and I’ve now come down with the flu.
    Poor you.

    I hope you haven’t been advising the Labour Party on how to nationalise all our pensions ..... 😏
    Don't - their outriders have floated that as an idea already!!
    Ive touched on that myself:

    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2018/10/09/footing-the-bill-the-challenges-for-freespending-politicians/
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    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115

    alb1on said:

    alb1on said:

    I am not taking a position on the event, but I fail to see anything odd in the use of WhatsApp. We even use it at my cricket club to sort out teams. It seems to be the default mechanism when anything is organised.
    Nothing. The accusation is that it wasn't just just a ramble who turned up, it was a protest financially supported by the Labour Party which resulted in an adviser getting lamped. At the moment it is all accusations, and I wait to see the proof.

    However, it is a shit show now. Assaulting an adviser is an absolute no no.
    I agree with your conclusion but see no connection between organising a protest and paying for it. Most protests will require some organisation but it carries no implication of payment. Conflating the issues makes me suspicious about the journo (although, tbf, my view of journos generally is similar to Ben Goldacre's).
    There is are WhatApp messages that specifically says that taxis will be paid for.

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1204085025924362242

    The question is who authorized it. Is Dave actually anybody, or just some random in the Labour Leeds WhatApps group.

    And to be honest, that bit is secondary. An adviser has by the sounds of it being assaulted.
    Dave Spart.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Ah, when a Labour canvasser got their arm broken it was all a bit of rough and tumble but when a Tory gets punched it's scum of the earth time.
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    alb1onalb1on Posts: 698

    TOPPING said:

    Ave_it said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Does this mean we will get 52% then?

    :lol:

    I’m glad you find demonising people who have lived here for decades hilarious.
    Or saying they don't get English irony.

    You picks your poison. One of them has to win.
    Perhaps. That still doesn’t mean I have to choose either of them. And I reserve the right to spit with contempt in front of anyone who does who then tries to take the moral high ground for their choice.
    You have to look for the silver linings in every cloud. If Boris wins I assume that the societal norm will become polygamy. If Jezza wins at least we will have Michael McIntyre replaced by weekly political lectures from Diane Abbott - which will certainly be a lot funnier.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited December 2019
    Alistair said:

    Ah, when a Labour canvasser got their arm broken it was all a bit of rough and tumble but when a Tory gets punched it's scum of the earth time.

    None of it ok. I said at the time of the "milkshaking" and Corbyn getting an egg rammed on him head, that some thought was a right of laugh, this is really bad and potentially a slippery slope.

    I am no fan of Corbyn, but smashing an egg on his head is absolutely not on.
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    Matt Hancock is horrified.
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    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,991
    Racists who use intimidation and violence to harass and frighten. Yebbut magic grandpa youthquake innit? Wankers.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,370

    TOPPING said:

    Ave_it said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Does this mean we will get 52% then?

    :lol:

    I’m glad you find demonising people who have lived here for decades hilarious.
    Or saying they don't get English irony.

    You picks your poison. One of them has to win.
    Perhaps. That still doesn’t mean I have to choose either of them. And I reserve the right to spit with contempt in front of anyone who does who then tries to take the moral high ground for their choice.
    It's all relative and few are taking the moral high ground. My position is that I want anyone but Corbyn to be Prime Minister. It is my very bad luck that that means we have an utter, utter tosser as fulfilling that role. But I have made my decision. Not to make a decision I don't think gets us anywhere. Of course there is tactical voting which is perfectly legitimate but apart from a few, of which of course I believe you are one, I think tactical voting is more spoken about and understood than engaged in.
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    speedy2speedy2 Posts: 981
    The change from 2017 in Wales is predicted as:

    LAB -9
    CON +3

    That would imply a national picture of:

    CON 46
    LAB 32

    Not that far off what Survation, Opinium, and Mori say.
    So there is a chance that Boris could beat Ted Heath's 1970 result in terms of vote share.
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    Barnesian said:

    wills66 said:

    In one respect "Oh all the instruments agree". The pollsters are unanimous that Jo Swinson's Liberal Democrats have tanked during the campaign.


    Actually no, depending on your definition of "tanked". All the pollsters show the LD vote share declining but those pollsters showing the smaller Tory leads show that decline as being in the 2-3% range.

    I wouldn't define 2-3% as "tanked".

    WillS.
    Interesting phrasing. All the pollsters show it falling, but if you choose to only look at those its fallen the least and then ignore the fall that shows then the Lib Dems have lost less and you wouldn't view that as tanking? Strange cherrypicking.

    In September the Lib Dems were consistently polling around 20% ± 2%. They're now consistently around 13% ± 2%. They've lost about 35% of the people who were intending to vote for them - I'd call that tanking.
    It's very good news. It means the remain vote is not being split in Con/Lab marginals but going to Labour. It's the reverse in Con/LD marginals but there are far fewer of them, hence the reduction in LD national vote.
    Some of the Remain vote is going to Labour, about half the Remain vote. Not all of it. Not much evidence of the reverse in Con/LD marginals. Especially when the LDs were seeking to call seats with over 10k votes to overhaul .
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,833
    If the result is like that on the day it's going to be a terrrrrrrrrrrrrible night for the Labour Party. ;)
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    A

    isam said:

    BluerBlue said:
    No comment on Boris Johnson’s dog whistling racism?
    You don't still think he said "People of Colour" do you?! ;)
    No, he’s moved on to telling people who’ve lived here for decades that this is not their home.
    He never said that.
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    Foxy said:

    Banterman said:

    Jason said:

    The stunt pulled by that so-called ITV journalist was pretty low IMO, but I expected something like this to happen in the days running up to the election. It's a classic tabloid style sting. Saying that, Boris could have handled it a lot better, but he appeared to panic a little bit. I'm sorry for the young lad who is being used as a political tool to gain points. It smacks of complete desperation IMO.

    The kids parents. What are they playing at? Assume they are corbnistas
    At lunchtime today we had 18 kids with bronchiolitis stuck in A and E with no children's beds to admit them into. All planned children's theatre admissions are cancelled.

    Adult ambulances were taking 4 hours to unload last week as no beds to admit to. This is life on Opel 4.

    I don't think that we had anyone on the floor on a drip though.

    Lat week I did a three hour round trip in very heavy traffic for specialist day surgery & then waited a couple of hours only to be told by the Consultant that he didn't have my notes, so no procedure.
    He did mention that this wasn't the first time it happened!

    Nothing to do with funding just sheer incompetence at a senior level.

    My sisters experience with her Cancer treatment was even worse,again down to gross incompetence by the Consultant.

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    BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    I'm guessing Gower, Delyn, Alyn & Deeside and Bridgend are the 4 extra Tory seats they would take compared to the MRP 2 weeks ago. The latter 3 are outside the Tories top 50 Lab targets on UNS.
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    ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578
    Andrew said:

    I just found out from facebook that I went to the same school as Alexandra Hall Hall. I've made the suggestion on their facebook page of naming a big room after her (the Hall Hall Hall) :smiley:

    Aberystwyth Uni has some student accommodation named …. yep, you guessed it. Should ask for a donation, would be the Alexandra Hall Hall Alexandra Hall.
    Bravo. Made me lol
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,883

    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Its increased by 23%
    Inflation in NHS risen by 37% over same period as measured by the HCSA (the official Health cost measure)
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,216

    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Why have you been so quiet on this forum this election?

    You haven’t posted much.
    I’ve been exceptionally busy with work and I’ve now come down with the flu.
    Poor you.

    I hope you haven’t been advising the Labour Party on how to nationalise all our pensions ..... 😏
    Don't - their outriders have floated that as an idea already!!
    Ive touched on that myself:

    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2018/10/09/footing-the-bill-the-challenges-for-freespending-politicians/
    I remembered. Precisely why I mentioned it. If you are advising I hope you’re charging them squillions.

    (So - are you?)
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    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.
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    speedy2speedy2 Posts: 981
    And the welsh poll explains why Labour think they have lost Bridgend.
    And why Corbyn is campaigning in wales so much in the past few days.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,952

    A

    isam said:

    BluerBlue said:
    No comment on Boris Johnson’s dog whistling racism?
    You don't still think he said "People of Colour" do you?! ;)
    No, he’s moved on to telling people who’ve lived here for decades that this is not their home.
    Reads to me as if he is saying that people are able to move from an EU country to here as if it is their own country, not that people who have been here decades shouldn't think of it that way.

    "He told Sky News that “over the last couple of decades or more... we’ve seen quite a large numbers of people coming in from the whole of the EU […] able to treat the UK basically as though it’s part of their own country."

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,833
    speedy2 said:

    The change from 2017 in Wales is predicted as:

    LAB -9
    CON +3

    That would imply a national picture of:

    CON 46
    LAB 32

    Not that far off what Survation, Opinium, and Mori say.
    So there is a chance that Boris could beat Ted Heath's 1970 result in terms of vote share.

    That would be fairly remarkable...
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,736

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
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    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,216
    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html
    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Discussed at length on the previous thread. According to some, people who don’t get a British passport despite living here for decades, working, paying taxes, raising families etc, even fighting for this country are “guests”, if they’re lucky “honoured guests” and should not think of this as a stigma.
    It that a legal category now .... ?
    In some ways that would be an improvement on the current Tory attitude.
    We’ll probably end up with some ghastly guest-arbeiter category run (if that’s the word) by the Home Office and the return of the “Aliens” channel at Dover.
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    alb1onalb1on Posts: 698
    Fenster said:

    alb1on said:

    alb1on said:

    I am not taking a position on the event, but I fail to see anything odd in the use of WhatsApp. We even use it at my cricket club to sort out teams. It seems to be the default mechanism when anything is organised.
    Nothing. The accusation is that it wasn't just just a ramble who turned up, it was a protest financially supported by the Labour Party which resulted in an adviser getting lamped. At the moment it is all accusations, and I wait to see the proof.

    However, it is a shit show now. Assaulting an adviser is an absolute no no.
    I agree with your conclusion but see no connection between organising a protest and paying for it. Most protests will require some organisation but it carries no implication of payment. Conflating the issues makes me suspicious about the journo (although, tbf, my view of journos generally is similar to Ben Goldacre's).
    There is are WhatApp messages that specifically says that taxis will be paid for.

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1204085025924362242

    The question is who authorized it. Is Dave actually anybody, or just some random in the Labour Leeds WhatApps group.

    And to be honest, that bit is secondary. An adviser has by the sounds of it being assaulted.
    Dave Spart.
    It is odd how the most extreme characters from Private Eye seem to emerge for real. This certainly sounds like a Dave Spart episode and, of course, we know that the Blagdon Amateur Rapist has been active in both main parties. I look forward to the next pronouncements of Dave Snooty and Mr Millibean.
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    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That Welsh poll is pretty awesome, amd reassuring.
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997

    Barnesian said:

    wills66 said:

    In one respect "Oh all the instruments agree". The pollsters are unanimous that Jo Swinson's Liberal Democrats have tanked during the campaign.


    Actually no, depending on your definition of "tanked". All the pollsters show the LD vote share declining but those pollsters showing the smaller Tory leads show that decline as being in the 2-3% range.

    I wouldn't define 2-3% as "tanked".

    WillS.
    Interesting phrasing. All the pollsters show it falling, but if you choose to only look at those its fallen the least and then ignore the fall that shows then the Lib Dems have lost less and you wouldn't view that as tanking? Strange cherrypicking.

    In September the Lib Dems were consistently polling around 20% ± 2%. They're now consistently around 13% ± 2%. They've lost about 35% of the people who were intending to vote for them - I'd call that tanking.
    It's very good news. It means the remain vote is not being split in Con/Lab marginals but going to Labour. It's the reverse in Con/LD marginals but there are far fewer of them, hence the reduction in LD national vote.
    Some of the Remain vote is going to Labour, about half the Remain vote. Not all of it. Not much evidence of the reverse in Con/LD marginals. Especially when the LDs were seeking to call seats with over 10k votes to overhaul .
    Look at the constituency polls in Esher, Finchley, Guildford, Wimbledon.
  • Options
    Cyclefree said:

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Discussed at length on the previous thread. According to some, people who don’t get a British passport despite living here for decades, working, paying taxes, raising families etc, even fighting for this country are “guests”, if they’re lucky “honoured guests” and should not think of this as a stigma.

    What's the stigma about being a guest?

    Yes if you've not a citizen here you are a guest of the country, that's always been the case and isn't new. That's why non-citizens don't get to vote here. Its also why British ex-pats living abroad who don't claim citizenship where they move to don't get to vote in the country they move to after emigrating too.
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    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    Stocky said:

    Labour`s continual focus on the NHS and their insistence that "The Tories have cronically underfunded it for 9 years!" make me wonder: Is this actually true?

    Does anyone know whether NHS spending has risen since 2010? (Inflation adjusted.) I suspect that the claim isn`t true.

    Off topic to your point but I am continually surprised that labour keep banging on about the Torys and the NHS, yet they must know that the largest users of the NHS vote en mass for the Torys. You would have thought that somebody in Labour with half a brain would try a new NHS message, like one that resonated with voters they need to win over.
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    BluerBlue said:

    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That Welsh poll is pretty awesome, amd reassuring.
    I think one that is probably reassuring for the Tories is that postal votes will have been going in when Tories have been doing well.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317
    speedy2 said:

    And the welsh poll explains why Labour think they have lost Bridgend.
    And why Corbyn is campaigning in wales so much in the past few days.

    I am surprised that WPB seem to think Labour will hold Ynys Môn. That’s one I’m expecting to go green even if Labour go above 50% nationally.

    A word of caution about BR too - it would be entirely in keeping for them to return a newly elected MP with a much increased majority.

    Bottom line is, we should remember UNS is of limited use in Wales because it’s both diverse and extremely parochial.
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    brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    edited December 2019
    Comparing subsamples (yes, I know) it suggests Labour is holding steady in Cardiff but dropping elsewhere, North Wales especially.
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited December 2019
    Nobidexx said:

    If I'm remembering correctly, didn't the previous Welsh barometer show an unexpected shift towards Labour? That would suggest simply that that was a slight outlier, and the position has returned towards how it has been for some weeks.

    I don't think so. Labour's lead at the time was fairly consistent with the tory lead in the national polls (about 10%). If this result is consistent with national polls I think we can expect a national lead around 12-13%.
    I was sort-of right. The previous (November) one is here:

    https://blogs.cardiff.ac.uk/electionsinwales/2019/11/25/the-november-welsh-political-barometer-poll-2/

    It had a Labour lead of 6 points, with Lab 9 points since October and the Tories up 4. That means the Labour lead in the last three has been 1, 6, and now 3 points (albeit superimposed on a squeeze of the BXP in particular).
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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,180

    wills66 said:

    In one respect "Oh all the instruments agree". The pollsters are unanimous that Jo Swinson's Liberal Democrats have tanked during the campaign.

    Actually no, depending on your definition of "tanked". All the pollsters show the LD vote share declining but those pollsters showing the smaller Tory leads show that decline as being in the 2-3% range.

    I wouldn't define 2-3% as "tanked".

    WillS.
    Interesting phrasing. All the pollsters show it falling, but if you choose to only look at those its fallen the least and then ignore the fall that shows then the Lib Dems have lost less and you wouldn't view that as tanking? Strange cherrypicking.

    In September the Lib Dems were consistently polling around 20% ± 2%. They're now consistently around 13% ± 2%. They've lost about 35% of the people who were intending to vote for them - I'd call that tanking.
    The LDs may well nearly double their vote share from the last general election. That (if it happens) will near doublethe number of actual, not hypothetical, votes. That’s not bad.

    On the other hand Brexit Party have gone from polling approximately 14% in Sept to around 3% now. Now THAT’S tanking.
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317

    Comparing subsamples (yes, I know) it suggests Labour is holding steady in Cardiff but dropping elsewhere, North Wales in particular.

    Any whisper on Llanelli? That’s one I could just see having an outsize swing if Plaid had the right candidate, but I also seem to remember hearing about some trouble there.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited December 2019
    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Other journalists reported it and that there was an arrest. Perhaps they are all wrong. Could be.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,339
    edited December 2019
    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that

    I have seen the video and agree there was no punch thrown

    However, the labour activists have managed to lose the initiative for labour
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    Re the Welsh poll: Wales has flattered to deceive before. There was much talk of the Tories winning the majority of seats in 2010 after Labour had collapsed in the EU elections the previous year.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317
    nico67 said:

    There was no punch.

    The bastards, failing to provide appropriate seasonal cheer.
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    JasonJason Posts: 1,614

    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That ICM poll is worrying, though, Francis. Aren't they the gold standard?
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,312
    F
    Barnesian said:

    sealo0 said:

    Mods

    O/t

    Why can I not get comments under each header on an Ipad no problem a Win10 PC

    Ipad won't let me login either again no problem on the PC

    TIA
    Mike

    Mods

    I've not been able to get comments under the header for the last 2 months, can only get it via Vanilla Community site instead.
    same here
    I can get them on my phone but not my iPad nor Pc
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    chrisbchrisb Posts: 101
    llef said:

    Andy_JS said:

    kle4 said:

    And yet LDs might win back Ceredigion? Seems unlikely on that
    PC are slightly down and LDs up a bit, so using uniform swing they would gain Ceredigion.
    yes, and to be fair, the last ITV poll in 2017 did not have Plaid winning Ceredigion - Ceredigion dances to its own tune...
    Ladbrokes are offering 5/4 on both LDs and Plaid.
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    Stage 1 is "there was no punch".
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    Jason said:

    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That ICM poll is worrying, though, Francis. Aren't they the gold standard?
    Back in the day they were, not recently. But still.
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    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    As opposed to the twats working for ITV who think pushing a phone in the Prime Minister's face is how to do their job.

    Never seen any reporters do that to Corbyn, have you?
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    llefllef Posts: 298
    The last ITV welsh opinion poll before the 2017 election had UKIP on 5%.
    They actually polled 2%, and it seems that this missing 3% transferred to Labour.

    The ITV welsh opinion poll released today has BREXIT on 5%....I wonder if history will repeat itself...
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,736
    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    wills66 said:

    In one respect "Oh all the instruments agree". The pollsters are unanimous that Jo Swinson's Liberal Democrats have tanked during the campaign.


    Actually no, depending on your definition of "tanked". All the pollsters show the LD vote share declining but those pollsters showing the smaller Tory leads show that decline as being in the 2-3% range.

    I wouldn't define 2-3% as "tanked".

    WillS.
    Interesting phrasing. All the pollsters show it falling, but if you choose to only look at those its fallen the least and then ignore the fall that shows then the Lib Dems have lost less and you wouldn't view that as tanking? Strange cherrypicking.

    In September the Lib Dems were consistently polling around 20% ± 2%. They're now consistently around 13% ± 2%. They've lost about 35% of the people who were intending to vote for them - I'd call that tanking.
    It's very good news. It means the remain vote is not being split in Con/Lab marginals but going to Labour. It's the reverse in Con/LD marginals but there are far fewer of them, hence the reduction in LD national vote.
    Some of the Remain vote is going to Labour, about half the Remain vote. Not all of it. Not much evidence of the reverse in Con/LD marginals. Especially when the LDs were seeking to call seats with over 10k votes to overhaul .
    Look at the constituency polls in Esher, Finchley, Guildford, Wimbledon.
    What is your point Barnesian?
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317

    Re the Welsh poll: Wales has flattered to deceive before. There was much talk of the Tories winning the majority of seats in 2010 after Labour had collapsed in the EU elections the previous year.

    I think when Wales goes, it will go suddenly.

    And as with Scotland, I think it will never go back. Labour increasingly looks and sounds like a party of elderly Londoners and angry metropolitan teenagers. That isn’t something to appeal outside quite specific areas of England.

    But hopefully Labour will elect somebody vaguely sane as their next leader and I will be proved wrong.
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    saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    You know that for a fact? If so, how so?
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317

    Stage 1 is "there was no punch".

    Stage 2: ‘there were no mince pies either.’
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    Johnson won't care but it's pretty ugly out there ...

    https://news.sky.com/story/teenage-burnley-fc-fan-investigated-over-racist-gesture-at-tottenham-hotspur-stadium-11882447

    'Flat Cap Fred' is basically a small step from Alf Garnett.

    We all know it.

    (Not that Corbyn's much better. The antisemitism is disgraceful.)
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    A

    isam said:

    BluerBlue said:
    No comment on Boris Johnson’s dog whistling racism?
    You don't still think he said "People of Colour" do you?! ;)
    No, he’s moved on to telling people who’ve lived here for decades that this is not their home.

    Why don't you report what he said & context instead of what you & the Independent would like him to have said.
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    JasonJason Posts: 1,614

    Jason said:

    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That ICM poll is worrying, though, Francis. Aren't they the gold standard?
    Back in the day they were, not recently. But still.
    Lol reversal going on here, you're trying to reassure ME. :smile:
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    speedy2speedy2 Posts: 981
    edited December 2019
    GIN1138 said:

    speedy2 said:

    The change from 2017 in Wales is predicted as:

    LAB -9
    CON +3

    That would imply a national picture of:

    CON 46
    LAB 32

    Not that far off what Survation, Opinium, and Mori say.
    So there is a chance that Boris could beat Ted Heath's 1970 result in terms of vote share.

    That would be fairly remarkable...
    Well it would have happened that one of the big two would have a chance to make a new record since the third parties are historically low since the selfdestruction of the LD.

    1970 was the last election until 2017 that the big two got more than 80% of the vote, so a return to the pre-liberal revival era would result in massive vote shares.

    45-50% vote share for a major party was normal in the 1950's and 60's.
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    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    wills66 said:

    In one respect "Oh all the instruments agree". The pollsters are unanimous that Jo Swinson's Liberal Democrats have tanked during the campaign.


    Actually no, depending on your definition of "tanked". All the pollsters show the LD vote share declining but those pollsters showing the smaller Tory leads show that decline as being in the 2-3% range.

    I wouldn't define 2-3% as "tanked".

    WillS.
    Interesting phrasing. All the pollsters show it falling, but if you choose to only look at those its fallen the least and then ignore the fall that shows then the Lib Dems have lost less and you wouldn't view that as tanking? Strange cherrypicking.

    In September the Lib Dems were consistently polling around 20% ± 2%. They're now consistently around 13% ± 2%. They've lost about 35% of the people who were intending to vote for them - I'd call that tanking.
    It's very good news. It means the remain vote is not being split in Con/Lab marginals but going to Labour. It's the reverse in Con/LD marginals but there are far fewer of them, hence the reduction in LD national vote.
    Some of the Remain vote is going to Labour, about half the Remain vote. Not all of it. Not much evidence of the reverse in Con/LD marginals. Especially when the LDs were seeking to call seats with over 10k votes to overhaul .
    Look at the constituency polls in Esher, Finchley, Guildford, Wimbledon.
    Indeed, they don't match your model at all. We see the LDs going up as forecast but not by enough to take the seats.
  • Options
    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997
    Jason said:

    Stocky said:

    Betfair not convinced by the Welsh poll, still well out from earlier today.

    Just punters having a mini-wobble
    Where as me, I never have a wobble....
    That ICM poll is worrying, though, Francis. Aren't they the gold standard?
    For context, here are the five sources I use for Wales. The latest YouGov is in line with others (except Baxter which is out of date).

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    saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.
    Interesting. Post a link.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,440
    edited December 2019

    The Conservative campaign ends as Vote Leave’s campaign ended: with dogwhistling racism:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/boris-johnson-eu-migrants-immigration-britain-general-election-a9238941.html

    It will no doubt be effective. Those Conservative partisans who affect to care about racism when they perceive it elsewhere, take note. If you have any principles, this is your chance to demonstrate them.

    Why have you been so quiet on this forum this election?

    You haven’t posted much.
    I’ve been exceptionally busy with work and I’ve now come down with the flu.
    Sorry to hear that Alastair.

    Take care of yourself.
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    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.
    Good video for the Tories to put out there though, showing a bunch of emotional job-shy socialists making a tit of themselves.
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    funkhauserfunkhauser Posts: 325
    edited December 2019

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that


    You are optimistic, just smear & then move on to the next smear.

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    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.

    The 100 protestors turned out to be three or four. The punch turned out to be a small collission because the adviser was not looking where he was going. Someone on the Tory side has spun that into a braying mob committing a full-scale assault - and the broadcast media bought it lock, stock and barrel!!
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1204091610843226112

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    camelcamel Posts: 815
    So the clown's crashed the clown car, and sends in another clown to throw a bucket of glitter on the clown-car-crash, and the second clown's assistant clown gets thumped in his big red clown nose.

    Thank god the coalition of chaos never got in.
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    Laura K is now doing a u turn but won’t apologize for her misinformation.

    Clearly she realized her puppet masters at no 10 needed a deflection so gave them one .
  • Options
    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/09/matt-hancock-adviser-assaulted-during-leeds-hospital-campaign-visit

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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,883

    Stage 1 is "there was no punch".

    No - Stage 1 is Momentum Thugs punches the Health Secretaries Asst.

    @bbclaurak is a disgrace Oborne spot on about her being the minister for Tory Propaganda

    When is Boris apologising to the 4 year old and his parents Stage 6.

    Votes for 4 yr olds I reckon!!
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    Andy_JS said:

    Lab 40%
    Con 37%
    PC 10%
    LD 6%
    BRX 5%
    Grn 1%
    Oth 1%

    https://www.itv.com/news/wales/2019-12-09/new-poll-shows-conservatives-set-to-gain-welsh-seats-as-labour-s-lead-is-cut/

    "According to the results, Labour lose Wrexham, Vale of Clwyd, Gower, Cardiff North, Delyn, Bridgend, Clwyd South, and Alyn & Deeside to the Conservatives, who would also win back Brecon & Radnorshire, which they lost to the Liberal Democrats in a by-election earlier this year.

    Plaid Cymru would lose Ceredigion to the Liberal Democrats."

    Need Ynys Mon as well. I’m on for a number of those (small bets sadly) at the start of the campaign.

    Great poll for the Blue.

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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited December 2019

    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.

    The 100 protestors turned out to be three or four. The punch turned out to be a small collission because the adviser was not looking where he was going. Someone on the Tory side has spun that into a braying mob committing a full-scale assault - and the broadcast media bought it lock, stock and barrel!!
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1204091610843226112

    Media not having a good election. We had people of talent, now this.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317

    Stage 1 is "there was no punch".

    No - Stage 1 is Momentum Thugs punches the Health Secretaries Asst.

    @bbclaurak is a disgrace Oborne spot on about her being the minister for Tory Propaganda

    When is Boris apologising to the 4 year old and his parents Stage 6.

    Votes for 4 yr olds I reckon!!
    Mark Francois’ already got the vote.

    Oh, sorry, you meant an actual age of four?
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    melcfmelcf Posts: 166
    Electoral calculus has Labour holding Wrexham, Vale of Clywd but losing Bridgend... does not seem right
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    Betfair drifting out again. Is there more polling coming today?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,769
    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Do you really believe in all these conspiracy theories?
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    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115

    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.

    The 100 protestors turned out to be three or four. The punch turned out to be a small collission because the adviser was not looking where he was going. Someone on the Tory side has spun that into a braying mob committing a full-scale assault - and the broadcast media bought it lock, stock and barrel!!
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1204091610843226112

    Media not having a good election. We had people of talent, now this.
    The world would be a better place if political reporting, memes and comment was banned from social media.
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    BluerBlue said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    As opposed to the twats working for ITV who think pushing a phone in the Prime Minister's face is how to do their job.

    Never seen any reporters do that to Corbyn, have you?
    I've seen interviewers ask Corbyn questions for which he is not prepared, if that is what you mean.

    Reverse-ferreting the punch might explain why the Mail report someone linked to below seemed a bit garbled, if it was being rewritten as they tried to make sense of what happened.
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    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,796

    Johnson won't care but it's pretty ugly out there ...

    https://news.sky.com/story/teenage-burnley-fc-fan-investigated-over-racist-gesture-at-tottenham-hotspur-stadium-11882447

    'Flat Cap Fred' is basically a small step from Alf Garnett.

    We all know it.

    (Not that Corbyn's much better. The antisemitism is disgraceful.)

    The antisemitism is disgraceful, and clear cut. Much worse is the economic programme. There's not the slightest support for it from economists. You really can't wing it when it comes to economic planning. McDonnell has no credibility whatsoever.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,317
    edited December 2019

    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.

    The 100 protestors turned out to be three or four. The punch turned out to be a small collission because the adviser was not looking where he was going. Someone on the Tory side has spun that into a braying mob committing a full-scale assault - and the broadcast media bought it lock, stock and barrel!!
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1204091610843226112

    Media not having a good election. We had people of talent, now this.
    Was the wonderful double meaning of that post deliberate?
  • Options

    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    There was no punch and Laura K is now just a mouthpiece for no 10 .

    She now just repeats anything she’s told before confirming the story is true .

    Can you provide evidence of that
    It’s on video . There was no punch , the Tories put out a lie which they fed to Laura K and she did her duty as a Tory shill.

    The 100 protestors turned out to be three or four. The punch turned out to be a small collission because the adviser was not looking where he was going. Someone on the Tory side has spun that into a braying mob committing a full-scale assault - and the broadcast media bought it lock, stock and barrel!!
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1204091610843226112

    Media not having a good election. We had people of talent, now this.
    That can in no way be described as a punch. What was Laura thinking of describing it as such?
This discussion has been closed.